TM 2021: A normal roguelike

Isis
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Post Post #2400  (ISO)  » Mon Feb 22, 2021 8:03 am

Votecount 3.4
  • Augustus Caesar (He/Him) (0)
  • Aristophanes (He/Him)(2) xRECKONERx, Ydrasse
  • Ydrasse (She/Her)(0)
  • Creature (He/Him)(2) Adorable, DeasVail
  • xofelf (They/Them)(1) Creature
  • DeasVail (He/Him)(0)
  • The Bulge (Any/Any) (0)
  • Adorable (She/Her)(0)
  • xRECKONERx (He/Him)(0)
Not Voting (3): Aristophanes, The Bulge, Augustus Caesar, xofelf
With nine alive, it takes five votes to make a decision.
(expired on 2021-03-02 05:00:00)




What an easy mission!
Can you not walk straight?

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Post Post #2401  (ISO)  » Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:03 am

VOTE: Creature

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Post Post #2402  (ISO)  » Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:05 am

Thoughts later, but for now, I think you should be claiming, Creature. You've been a universal nullread/scumread for a while now.

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Post Post #2403  (ISO)  » Mon Feb 22, 2021 10:42 am

In post 2392, xofelf wrote:I feel a lot better about Ydrasse and Hectic. Like, it'll mean very little to most people, but just, having an idea of what it looks like when people are pressured or lying and just their general sort of vibe kinda helps me a lot and is something I look at and is a bit universal between LSGs and mafia.

It messes with your head, man. The concept is fun, but the idea that people only want to get to know you and talk to you because they're buddying you for the sake of a game is a weird thought. That'll probably be my last one even if it I do enjoy it, just too stressful for me.

What kind of vibes did you get from us there btw?

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Post Post #2404  (ISO)  » Mon Feb 22, 2021 10:49 am

In post 2374, Aristophanes wrote:Something about being in Masters in TFT as well, whatever that means, which was what he was working on instead of reading here lol

Damnflor

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Post Post #2405  (ISO)  » Mon Feb 22, 2021 12:34 pm

In post 2392, xofelf wrote:VOTE: Unvote

That's a really good Ari post. Like, acknowledging that maybe going would help people to solve better will always register well for me. Also after watching the Marathon Survivor tonight, I feel a lot better about Ydrasse and Hectic. Like, it'll mean very little to most people, but just, having an idea of what it looks like when people are pressured or lying and just their general sort of vibe kinda helps me a lot and is something I look at and is a bit universal between LSGs and mafia.

So that leaves me with Creature and Adorable and question marks. Adorable I've never known what to do with and I still don't. Creature's iso is very sparse, and there's this defeated feel to it all that I can't quite pinpoint why it exists, but it doesn't quite feel like the same sort of lethargy the game is having. Reck, talk me through both of these slots, would you? We've been pretty on par thinkingwise a lot, so I'm curious where you would put them.

If I'm being completely transparent, I have no fucking idea how to read Creature. His posts are obfuscated and feel like I'm reading someone's made up shorthand for thoughts and opinions and not anything concrete or readable. The biggest thing with Creature is that I don't like his play at the end of yesterday bouncing around wagons. I don't really like his play today of trying to derail the Aristophanes momentum at the last minute. But I don't think I can point to a specific set of reasons as to why he's scum or whatever. I've asked my team for Creature reads too and what I get in response is a lot of shrugging and head-scratching.

On Adorable, I'm being lazy on this read. Adorable is playing like a complete newbie and I always have trouble telling newbTown apart from newbScum. The early stuff D1 with the weird contradictions got written off mostly as TSTBS, even by me, and the responses felt sorta genuine. I also felt like enough people were weirdly stretching to defend Adorable that I was reading it as white knighting which would make Adorable town. However we haven't flipped any of the knights to see if that holds up.
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Post Post #2406  (ISO)  » Mon Feb 22, 2021 12:34 pm

In post 2401, Augustus Caesar wrote:VOTE: Creature

for the love of fucking god
get to know a reckoner
meta is trash

FUCK CANCER. #greenshirtthursdays

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Post Post #2407  (ISO)  » Mon Feb 22, 2021 12:49 pm

In post 2002, Creature wrote:Also Adorable's vote on RCE D1 looks the most likely a bus considering it was done after the selfvote and never unvoted.

Ah yikes, is this a townslip

@Isis: There's an error in your VC in . beeboy's shown as self-voting when he never did.

Creature is assuming beeboy's self-voting rather than realising there's an error in the VC... I think scum would be more conscious of what their buddy is doing. Then again, beeboy only had two posts at the time. Creature, were you not ISOing him and seeing his content given he was the majority wagon for most of the day? You didn't notice the lack of a self-vote, but let it influence your reads? I mean that in this post, you're clearly looking back over votes, like Puff's to make sense of the wagon/who was bussing, but didn't notice beeboy never voted for anyone in the two posts he made... hm

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Post Post #2408  (ISO)  » Mon Feb 22, 2021 12:50 pm

Creature, I want you to explain when you thought beeboy self-voted and how that's been affecting your reads this game.

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Post Post #2409  (ISO)  » Mon Feb 22, 2021 12:52 pm

In post 2374, Aristophanes wrote:Jingle:
Townreads - Bulge, DV, Reck, xof
Townleans - Ydrasse
Scumreads - Creature
No read on Adorable as they are incomprehensible :P

Why aren't I in this Jingle readslist, Ari?

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Post Post #2410  (ISO)  » Mon Feb 22, 2021 1:02 pm

In post 2374, Aristophanes wrote:Starting off, Jingle had some setup spec for me. Basically it boils down to the scum knowing the setup being op at neutering town, especially the masons, and lets them craft exactly the right fakeclaim for any situation and have it ready from even pregame. Beeboy-slot having that role let him do nothing since his job was complete. It probably also means a mostly vanilla scumteam otherwise, which flips and Isis mod-meta support. It also means setup spec is probably useless and the mechanic might be unbalanced but who is to say.

Treating Bulge as conftown and as just a Doc which I guess makes sense. Then there's some setup spec I can present but meh and a note that we should massclaim the day prior to XLo because of scum knowing the setup and being prepared for it.

DV is locktown for Jingle and he notes that scum probably bussed beeboy-slot because of the aforementioned fulfillment of their duty. I'll mention that the theory that scum bussed beeboy should probably clear me as well as DV or at least be a hard town point but I mean, of course Jingle will say that so take it as you will.

= This baffles me. Like sure, beeboy's slot had already given scum the info they needed from being Informed, but a scum member going down means scum need 2 extra mislaunches to win. It's as bad as a regular mafia goon going down. Fulfilling your duty as scum is sticking around and achieving parity with your team, not just dying simply because you're informed lol

= Further from this point, this also confuses me. Deas did not push on beeboy much explicitly, but he really did push on RCE and scumcased him up until his claim. How closely has Jingle been reading? I also think it's a little extreme to say Deas would be "locktown" simply because he didn't bus beeboy - there's other slots too who were reluctant to vote him.

Can you get Jingle to expand on what he means here?

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Post Post #2411  (ISO)  » Mon Feb 22, 2021 1:04 pm

I like Dann's comments for the most part

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Post Post #2412  (ISO)  » Mon Feb 22, 2021 1:43 pm

In post 2395, DeasVail wrote:
In post 747, Creature wrote:DGB just gave me the green light on lynching RCE

In post 749, Creature wrote:
In post 734, DeasVail wrote:VOTE: RCEnigma

I’m fine if people want to wait and see more, but I think I’ve seen enough to be comfortable with an elimination here

Me too, but I don't want to end up being pressured all day tomorrow and feel unable to scumhunt due to that wagon

In reading through Creature these posts (made after I say RCE is scum and vote him) feel significant. Particularly because despite saying this, Creature then proceeds to suggest an Ari wagon and start attacking me because of my suspicion on RCE.

It's the sort of thing that I find to be strange from both scum and town and so it could be worth talking about.

I still can't convince myself away from Creature today (and am especially unmotivated re: wagoning Ari) but I have enough uncertainty to be keen to discuss things.

I'd feel so much better about Creature being scum if he actually voted RCE at any point, it's so weird he said he was down to kill him but never voted. I'd think scum would just bus regularly there and get on the wagon.

Oh wait, I'm dumb lol:

In post 941, Creature wrote:VOTE: RCEnigma

atp this slot is a liability

In post 960, Creature wrote:
In post 959, petapan wrote:
In post 932, Creature wrote:tbh I kinda had Summer Nights as scum, but I'm kinda iffy considering she is the counterwagon to a very scummy claim.

the 'counterwagon' is being pushed by two of the peole who were voting RCE, though, so what do you make of that?

This feels a lot "scum decided to give their partner one extra day"

In post 965, Creature wrote:
In post 962, xRECKONERx wrote:but...n1 vig seems like a VERY wild claim to fake bc it's very easily disproven and if there aren't two kills tomorrow then byebye RCE?

Scum doesn't need to claim something they can fake, just something that makes them live at least one more night. Scum has little to lose claiming something that will get them caught the next day but a lot to lose getting lynched the day before and townclearing a bunch of players the next day.

In post 970, Creature wrote:
In post 968, xRECKONERx wrote:but my question is why not just... claim something that won't get caught the next day then?

Claiming something iffy won't help you not get lynched. Sometimes it is a lot better to just claim something that will get you caught the next day but guarantee surviving today than risk getting lynched today anyway.

In post 971, Creature wrote:It's also not even that much provable because RCE can easily claim to be roleblocked or something and then we're back to day 1 with likely two less town players.

In post 978, Creature wrote:
In post 977, petapan wrote:fwiw the hivemind leans on the claim being fake

The hivemind being exactly only Hectic, Datisi (previously) and me

In post 979, Creature wrote:and there are now four votes on the counterwagon (Summer Nights)

In post 1019, Creature wrote:
In post 995, petapan wrote:i do think this moment has been more useful than 90% of the day in terms of drawing out AI content

staypositivefriend has weighed in on summer at my request and thinks she's town. i respect her a lot, i'm not a very analytical thinker and i like to lean on players who are, so i'm switching back

VOTE: RCEnigma

Yeah man, so far I have strongly leaned town on Summer and scum on RCEnigma based on the latest events. Very likely RCE is just caught here.


Huh, this sequence of posts actually makes me feel better about Creature being scum. I feel like there has to be at least 1 scum buddy bussing on the RCE wagon, and these posts feel weirdly confident and certain for Creature's play this game

In post 1060, Isis wrote:RCEnigma (He/Him)(7) Augustus Caesar, Summer Nights, Adorable, Creature, petapan, xRECKONERx, xofelf

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Post Post #2413  (ISO)  » Mon Feb 22, 2021 2:00 pm

Puff,

In post 2165, Adorable wrote:Creature had some weird interactions around beeboy. I also had a feeling scum said in the thread they town read petapan on day 1 and Creature was one of the players who town read petapan on day 1.

VOTE: Creature

Can you point out and explain some of the other interactions you found weird that Creature had with beeboy/RCE?

Also, has your team been reading the game? Any updates?

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Post Post #2414  (ISO)  » Mon Feb 22, 2021 3:09 pm

In post 334, Creature wrote:Sirius9121 (0)
Augautus Caesar (0)
Aristophanes (0)

Datisi (0)
Summer Nights (0)
Creature (0)
xofelf (0)
DeasVail (0)
The Bulge (0)
Adorable (0)
petapan (0)

xRECKONERx (0)
beeboy (0)

In post 397, Creature wrote:beeboy is probably someone I wouldn't bother with rn. So the only significant viable scumread I have is Reckoner. Though, Ydrasse and Bulge also should be looked at.

In post 400, Creature wrote:Sirius9121 (0)
Augautus Caesar (0)
Aristophanes (0)
Datisi (0)

Summer Nights (0)
Creature (0)
xofelf (0)
DeasVail (0)
The Bulge (0)
Adorable (0)
petapan (0)

xRECKONERx (0)
beeboy (0)

In post 507, Creature wrote:If beeboy is indeed this frozen as scum then I won't oppose a lynch there but the wagon still looks scummy as hell

In post 512, Creature wrote:I wouldn't oppose lynching them at the end of the day, but so far wagoning beeboy or chauffer look improductive.

In post 941, Creature wrote:VOTE: RCEnigma

atp this slot is a liability


These were the interactions that were weird. Creature put beeboy on red, next he says beeboy is probably someone he wouldn't bother with rn, removes beeboy from red, says if beeboy is frozen as scum then he won't oppose a lynch, repeats and says wagoning beeboy looks improductive, later on he votes RCE. Creature saying if beeboy is frozen as scum not wanting to wagon him saying the wagon looks improductive and then he votes RCE saying the slot is a liability was the part that was weird for me.

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Post Post #2415  (ISO)  » Mon Feb 22, 2021 3:13 pm

This is the only update I have from my team on day 3. When I saw Ari paraphrasing what Jingle and Dannflor said I asked my team what do they think of the post Ari made when he paraphrased on what Jingle and Dannflor said. The reason why I asked my team what did they think about Ari's paraphrasing of Jingle and Dannflor was because I was really offended by what they said about me and it looked atrocious.

Dunnstral did not read my game and he only had a look at Ari's paraphrasing when I asked my team to have a look at it. Dunnstral said it was high effort for sure and asked me what did I think of Ari before. I said to him on day 1 Ari defended me which made me lean town on him since I don't believe in scum defending me. Dunnstral said the post Ari paraphrased could be high efforting as scum.

midwaybear had a look afterwards and he said Jingle not having a read on me is somewhat reasonable and it was nai for him. About Dannflor, midwaybear asked me what associatives looked bad and then he said to look into the motivations behind on why did Ari decide to post a massive wall like that.

Dunnstral said the motive for Ari to post that is to avoid an elim whether it is towny or scummy is up to debate and he said he didn't have a read there. midwaybear asked me why do I not believe in scum defending me and I said to him that I am an easy push for scum to eliminate since I get scum read alot and midwaybear thinks scum might be scared to push me and would defend me for the towncred. I find it so hard to believe scum would defend me.

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Post Post #2416  (ISO)  » Mon Feb 22, 2021 3:17 pm

Thank you!

Did you write up straight after sending ?

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Post Post #2417  (ISO)  » Mon Feb 22, 2021 3:25 pm

In post 2416, Augustus Caesar wrote:Thank you!

Did you write up straight after sending ?


I originally wrote the Creature and Ari's paraphrase together in one post together and I copied it in case I get automatically get signed out and I didn't want to have to lose everything I wrote and then I decided to post the Creature and Ari paraphrase in separate posts.

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Post Post #2418  (ISO)  » Mon Feb 22, 2021 3:25 pm

Cool, that makes a lot more sense

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Post Post #2419  (ISO)  » Mon Feb 22, 2021 3:53 pm

In post 2406, xRECKONERx wrote:
In post 2401, Augustus Caesar wrote:VOTE: Creature

for the love of fucking god

I'm trying to understand your issue here

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Post Post #2420  (ISO)  » Mon Feb 22, 2021 4:08 pm

In post 2419, DeasVail wrote:
In post 2406, xRECKONERx wrote:
In post 2401, Augustus Caesar wrote:VOTE: Creature

for the love of fucking god

I'm trying to understand your issue here

One town-looking post from Ari with the help of his team while on death's door does not erase the entire game's worth of scummy play.
get to know a reckoner
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Post Post #2421  (ISO)  » Mon Feb 22, 2021 4:45 pm

Who else do you think is scum?

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Post Post #2422  (ISO)  » Mon Feb 22, 2021 6:14 pm

I do not correct VCs that are not the most recent VC.
Can you not walk straight?

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Post Post #2423  (ISO)  » Mon Feb 22, 2021 7:26 pm

In post 2421, DeasVail wrote:Who else do you think is scum?

I am not sure. I had my scum pool as Ari/Hectic/Creature, and it's probably still there. Hectic and I kinda briefly engaged over my scumread of him and then just left it. I just feel and have felt so fucking strongly about Ari for so much of this game that if we go somewhere else and Ari squeaks by again I'm going to lose my mind.
get to know a reckoner
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FUCK CANCER. #greenshirtthursdays

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Post Post #2424  (ISO)  » Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:18 pm

In post 2423, xRECKONERx wrote:
In post 2421, DeasVail wrote:Who else do you think is scum?

I am not sure. I had my scum pool as Ari/Hectic/Creature, and it's probably still there. Hectic and I kinda briefly engaged over my scumread of him and then just left it. I just feel and have felt so fucking strongly about Ari for so much of this game that if we go somewhere else and Ari squeaks by again I'm going to lose my mind.


have any of hectic's recent posts had an impact on your read on him? the other two in the pool line up with what i think but i feel like he sticks out like a sore thumb

you probably think i'm pocketed by him but ya know :dead:
・:*:・゚★,。:*:・゚

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