Mini Normal 2275: Roguelikes - Day 3: Endgame!

[Confidently Wrong]

@cw that just isn’t right. “Good” players tend to survive regardless of alignment, it’s the reason I go on feel and atmospherics more than by who can craft the most thoughtful case. Cats panicked when he thought he was caught for a dumb reason, and has spent the next 20 pages lurking or sniping at low hanging fruit. That’s more meaningful to me than “oh this idiot has bad opinions”

I have played with Cats and know how Cats plays as scum. They did not panic here either. So no, thats wrong.

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Why is CW town, Cat?

I feel like they were trying to genuinely solve for Eira's alignment - the questions on page 19 reads like they're still willing to reconsider.

Spoiler:

Whats your lowell read


please explain your read progression from the first moment you mentioned my slot - that would be the point where you unvoted Lowell.

sorry I made that unclear that's 2 seperate requests:

how are you reading lowell now?

and how has your read on my slot evolved since you mentioned my name? what reasoning was there?

I think they're town that started tunneling onto town after Eiralox refused to engage.

Spoiler: based on this post

And to ellaborate more on Eira - when reading their posts it comes off as someone trying to seem confident about their push on me while trying to hide any evidence of how they reached that read - the confidence comes off as completely fraudulent and the reasoning comes off as amended after the fact.

Eira likely decided they need to push me for wincon probably because I am correct in my reads to some degree IMO and this is why we see this mad dash to try to case me in such a way after OMGUSing me.

Frankly it is shocking that no one else sees what I see in that Eira is basically howling in the way they have been caught in a very poorly spun web of lies.

I implore people to begin at Eira's posts about lowell and see how they progressed into pushing me - I think you can find there is a strong agenda feel to it.

I think this next post brings up a salient point - it's a bit weird for Eira to suss someone who has the same two scumreads as himself. Although I think Eira just has problems communicating their reads (as evidenced by the confusing use of null in place of what most people would call a townlean or scumlean), and this conversation reads like two people kind of talking past each other.

Spoiler:

i mean i've affirmed my willingnes to vote mala and ive said lowell is in the bottom of my pile so this entire reasoning here(along with mala inactive total null) for a team is... what? just the three u find most scummy?



game solved well played bravo

You say that but you did not vote Mala with me when I was voting there for pressure nor did you maintain your vote on lowell. you jumped to this uncharitable assumption that I must be scum *merely for including you alongside 2 other people you claim to also find not town*

[Irrelephant11]

Hi Shoshin I'm around for like 45 minutes

[Irrelephant11]

mala seems town

[Irrelephant11]

Shoshin is probably town again

[Irrelephant11]

CW and Shoshin both having me right at the bottom of their townread piles feels like a good reason why they should townread each other tbh

[Irrelephant11]

Like a low effort townie thinks I'm town for posting a lot and asking questions
Low effort scum says I'm town because nobody's coming for me so what's the point of coming for me
These two high effort townies think I'm Definitely Town But The Most Likely Of That Group To Be A Deepwolf because they're thinking through my motivations enough to come to a strong townread while also having the exact amount of paranoia that scum would forget to fake

[Irrelephant11]

I jive with CSF and Shoshin and CW a lot right now (like playstyle-wise, but also kind readswise I guess) and really would like there to be 0 scum in that group because I'd enjoy riding that out. I strongly doubt there's 2

[Irrelephant11]

Nothing escapes me, I notice all.

When's the last time you got a shoulder rub or drank a yummy warm drink, you seem a little tense

[Irrelephant11]

VOTE: loftwing

[Irrelephant11]

I feel like there's ~5 slots whose posting makes little sense to me and are regularly using bad reasons to scumread other slots
And I doubt all three scum are in there, just based on how mafia games usually go
But at least 1, probably 2?

I guess I should figure out who I'm talking about, in full:

loftwing
lowell
kenny
eiralox
~frederick, sorta

I think I also mixed up a couple fred and malcolm posts at one point so those reads feel a little muddled. Only noticing how different they are when ISOing them

[Irrelephant11]

These two high effort townies think I'm Definitely Town But The Most Likely Of That Group To Be A Deepwolf because they're thinking through my motivations enough to come to a strong townread while also having the exact amount of paranoia that scum would forget to fake

I can also think of even higher-level reasons I won't name to put me exactly in that spot in your readslists and that would also be something that both of you should townread the other for, too. Either way, Shoshin, I think you should probably townread CW and even if you don't want to, flip a different scum today.

[Loftwing]

I feel like there's ~5 slots whose posting makes little sense to me and are regularly using bad reasons to scumread other slots
And I doubt all three scum are in there, just based on how mafia games usually go
But at least 1, probably 2?

I guess I should figure out who I'm talking about, in full:

loftwing
lowell
kenny
eiralox
~frederick, sorta

I think I also mixed up a couple fred and malcolm posts at one point so those reads feel a little muddled. Only noticing how different they are when ISOing them

Are there any points in particular that you are confused about?

[Irrelephant11]

Why did Kenny saying “actually I wasn’t trying to offer you any reads in that early game longpost” satisfy you that he is town? The fact remained that he had written a bunch of words without advancing the game at all

Why does Eiralox’s confusing use of the word “null” still make him the scummiest player in your eyes? It seems like you’re choosing to be obtuse there as an excuse to keep a scumread, he’s obviously got reads and just doesn’t like to call them reads for some weird reason

[Loftwing]

Why did Kenny saying “actually I wasn’t trying to offer you any reads in that early game longpost” satisfy you that he is town? The fact remained that he had written a bunch of words without advancing the game at all

Why does Eiralox’s confusing use of the word “null” still make him the scummiest player in your eyes? It seems like you’re choosing to be obtuse there as an excuse to keep a scumread, he’s obviously got reads and just doesn’t like to call them reads for some weird reason

Kenny clarified what his earlier post actually meant, becsuse we the people misinterpreted it. In light of his clarification, the post made more sense, so my objection was addressed.

Eiralox does have players outside of his nullbin, or at least I assume that's what they meant. So why not then seperate either kenny or cw from the nullbin then, is my current objection.

[KittyTacky]

Flavor 1.3

Moria

The Dungeons of Moria (usually just called Moria) is a roguelike inspired by J.R.R. Tolkien's The Lord of the Rings, with the game world is being the Mines of Moria, where the player has to venture deep into the mines to defeat the Balrog. Although inspired by Tolkien, there is little else that the game shares with the books.

Created by Robert Alan Koeneke in 1983, Moria is one of the earliest clones of Rogue and was the first roguelike to have a "Town" level where you buy weapons, armor, spellbooks, potions, and various other items to help you on your difficult quest to defeat the Balrog.

Moria was also the first open-source roguelike, which made it possible for it to be ported to many different computer platforms in a time when that was generally hard to achieve.

Although the game is not as popular as it once was, it is still considered as one of the major roguelikes.

Source: RogueBasin

Votecount 1.3

Loftwing

(4): FancyPants, Lowell, MalcolmTucker, Irrelephant11

[E-3]

Eiralox

(3): Confidently Wrong, Loftwing, kennyk

Lowell

(2): Cat Scratch Fever, Eiralox

Malakittens

(1): Fredrick A Campbell

kennyk

(1): BlueBloodedToffee

BlueBloodedTofee

(1): Malakittens

Confidently Wrong

(1): Shoshin

Not Voting

(0):

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to eliminate.

Day 1 ends in (expired on 2022-07-04 11:14:00).

I'm sorry for the delay. VCs will be more regular fom now on.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

VOTE: Lowell

[Loftwing]

Frederation Campbell, what made you jump off of Eiralox and, critically, not jump back onto them after time had passed?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Frederation Campbell, what made you jump off of Eiralox and, critically, not jump back onto them after time had passed?

I didn't think they were as likely to be mafia compared to another player and still think that there is at least another player more likely to be mafia.

[MalcolmTucker]

Struggling for reads a bit at the moment. Feel like the CW/Eiralox stuff is choking the game and probably letting other scum players hide.

CW is almost certainly still town given their play but has gotten a bit fixated on this push and is way too confident in their reads for D1.

Shoshin's posting is more townie than before. Mala strikes me as disinterested town but I'm wary of the slot because they've pretty much said openly they don't plan to engage which could allow them to try and coast by as scum as a legitimate strategy.

Don't feel any better re Loftwing. Feel like the slot is playing a bit more carefully but hasn't reversed my earlier reasons for suspecting scum.

[MalcolmTucker]

I feel like there's ~5 slots whose posting makes little sense to me and are regularly using bad reasons to scumread other slots
And I doubt all three scum are in there, just based on how mafia games usually go
But at least 1, probably 2?

I guess I should figure out who I'm talking about, in full:

loftwing
lowell
kenny
eiralox
~frederick, sorta

I think I also mixed up a couple fred and malcolm posts at one point so those reads feel a little muddled. Only noticing how different they are when ISOing them

What's got you interested in Fredrick? It's a slot I've largely TR'd but he's gotten minimal attention so far and could be scum playing well early doors.

[Eiralox]

@KittyTacky my vote is on lowell not loftwing.

[Eiralox]

@loftwing your play right now is really making me consider switching the vote back. Im not done studying ur dynamic so I got no hard reason for it but by feels alone youre not seeming groovy. If explained how I form townreads so if ur still voting me only on that factor, well it looks bad.

[Eiralox]

@lowell u've surfaced and I can frame you as low effort town, but what you have said so far has given me no reason to shift my vote. Get engaged.

My view of CW is simple: earlier they said lets class by votecount and I think thats partly what theyve been doing with the exception of shoshin. They still seem certain theyve pretty much solved this. Toffee and lowell I havent felt too hot about this entire game so im giving cw the benefit of the doubt at this point regarding that pairing. Mala greeen... no. Dont see that latest input does that, malcolm saying they are posstown tho stayed my vote from that slot.

[FancyPants]

I have quite a busy social calendar until Sunday and my country is going through a disruptive energy crisis at the moment.

I'm still following on my phone when I can but my ability to participate in a meaningfully is impaired. Everything should resolve within a week.

For now I still like Loftwing the most so I'm parking.
CW may very well have a point about Eira but I've played enough mafia to know that (and I wish this wasn't true) shakey logic, poor reasoning and erratic behavior is not enough to make someone scum. Her tone is still angry Town. I'm very torn on that slot.

Im OK with a Lowell wagon (mostly for PoE reasons), and there is quite possibly a scum in Fred/BBT. In other words my thoughts are more or less in line with the town leaders at the moment.

I'll make sure to give final thoughts and vote if I need to before deadline.