Mini Normal 2276: Around the World - Game Over!

[Ausuka]

johnny - posted pretty much nothing content kind of sucks

corwinoid - in the hood hasn't done much yet

datisi - i think the push on marci could be scum trying to mislim a town

freedom - in the hood, for the sins of shoshin

this is the closest thing he has to hunting and like maybe I can write an actual post on it tomorrow but it's 3am right now, this just feels wolfy af

I mean STD has a fairly similar playstyle as town but I feel like in our last game together he was significantly better than this?

Does no one else see it

[Ausuka]

Also since people didn't respond to my datisi posts iirc I'm deciding that I don't scumread him because I have too many scumreads if I do

[Freedom]

johnny - posted pretty much nothing content kind of sucks

corwinoid - in the hood hasn't done much yet

datisi - i think the push on marci could be scum trying to mislim a town

freedom - in the hood, for the sins of shoshin

this is the closest thing he has to hunting and like maybe I can write an actual post on it tomorrow but it's 3am right now, this just feels wolfy af

I mean STD has a fairly similar playstyle as town but I feel like in our last game together he was significantly better than this?

Does no one else see it

From a quick skimthrough of Micro 1056 (which I believe is the latest game that he was Town in), I think that he is acting relatively similarly. Though, he wrote more in the quoted post than in his posts in Micro 1056.
Maybe his towngame changed.
IDK
His other posts in this game are fine.

[scamper]

johnny - posted pretty much nothing content kind of sucks

corwinoid - in the hood hasn't done much yet

datisi - i think the push on marci could be scum trying to mislim a town

freedom - in the hood, for the sins of shoshin

this is the closest thing he has to hunting and like maybe I can write an actual post on it tomorrow but it's 3am right now, this just feels wolfy af

I mean STD has a fairly similar playstyle as town but I feel like in our last game together he was significantly better than this?

Does no one else see it

im not whelmed by it but im assuming hell have more to say when hes not on v/la

[Ausuka]

johnny - posted pretty much nothing content kind of sucks

corwinoid - in the hood hasn't done much yet

datisi - i think the push on marci could be scum trying to mislim a town

freedom - in the hood, for the sins of shoshin

this is the closest thing he has to hunting and like maybe I can write an actual post on it tomorrow but it's 3am right now, this just feels wolfy af

I mean STD has a fairly similar playstyle as town but I feel like in our last game together he was significantly better than this?

Does no one else see it

From a quick skimthrough of Micro 1056 (which I believe is the latest game that he was Town in), I think that he is acting relatively similarly. Though, he wrote more in the quoted post than in his posts in Micro 1056.
Maybe his towngame changed.
IDK
His other posts in this game are fine.

It's not about the playstyle, I think his pushes suck. Like literally all four of them

[Crescent]

johnny - posted pretty much nothing content kind of sucks

corwinoid - in the hood hasn't done much yet

datisi - i think the push on marci could be scum trying to mislim a town

freedom - in the hood, for the sins of shoshin

this is the closest thing he has to hunting and like maybe I can write an actual post on it tomorrow but it's 3am right now, this just feels wolfy af

I mean STD has a fairly similar playstyle as town but I feel like in our last game together he was significantly better than this?

Does no one else see it

I've been thinking that the last line in that STD post is particularly bad, and it very much resembles a "Rule of 3" kind of post that scum so often like to employ, but I was waiting for a followup from STD before I said anything about it.

The problem I have with reading Datisi is I was also being negatively affected by they who shall not be named and their blatant lack of respect for the game (disgust included), so I'm finding it hard to see most of his responses in that time frame to be AI. The weird "pocketing" of me could just as easily have been making a show out of picking sides out of frustration rather than a deliberate scum action.

[Freedom]

I think his pushes suck. Like literally all four of them

I agree somewhat.
I think that of his proposed pushes, only the one on JF can be justified (based on how you interpret).
The one on Corniwoid could be justified but his justification seems to be mainly because Corniwoid hasn't posted much in the hood.

[Save The Dragons]

Don't say my pushes suck they're sensetive

[Crescent]

Actually I have no idea if "Rule of 3" even exists here, but it generally refers to posts that effectively list 3 (but sometimes 4) people in order and gives "reads" on all of them that are so easy to fake you don't even need to read the game to fake them. The poster then makes one or two useless comments after and leaves. It's a very common method of appearing to be hunting for scum when you're really just blowing air, and it's one of the most accurate metas I've seen in a 48/24 format.

I wanted to see if he'd like, do anything to followup that post before I drew attention to it, but I guess that's already happened.

And I see he posted while I was writing this up, and that post does nothing for me.

More comprehensive reasons for trains, please.

[Ausuka]

i dont think having some slightly unusual roles is an indicator of a "troll setup". even if we assume its randomized alignments its more likely than not theres scum in the hood, and i think "oh it's a troll setup so the hood is all town" is a weird logical leap and not good thinking, b/c if it were that obvious the game just solves itself on day 1

I mean it's not a logical leap, did you read my second paragraph? I'm saying making conclusions about the amount of scum in the hood feels silly to me because anything is possible in a setup with Ascetic Millers lmao

sorry, my bad on misunderstanding what you meant there. i still dont like the idea of just going "setup is a troll so all basic assumptions about balance go out the window"

Basic assumptions about balance like you shouldn't put 2 vigs in a 12 player game, or you shouldn't make ICs bulletproof, or you shouldn't put three mafia doctors in a gunsmith game? Normal mods can and do mess with players in this way. Maybe it's pointless to talk in circles about it though.

@shoshin, we don't use the l-word on this site anymore, and i haven't gotten to this game yet. i don't lurk to "avoid posting content" or whatever else because i am more than good enough at scum to know what to post.

This is one if the reasons I town read Datisi. Not because of the self-meta here but because I've seen scum!Datisi a couple times now and this isn't it. If you don't have much of an opinion on him then he's very likely town; he's generally high activity as scum and working hard to make people want to keep him around and empathize with him.

I mean I don't disagree that Datisi is capable of being much townier than this as scum but I also think he's capable of doing more as town? And probably just hasn't gotten into the game regardless of alignment.

- i think alex reading into crescent acting in defense of bella in 412 is towny, that kind of trying to draw out unseen connections comes more often from a townie mindset of trying to fit puzzle pieces together

I mean maybe I'm biased/tunneled at this point but don't you think it kind of sounds like a BS read? There was no indication at all that Crescent was worried about Bella being eliminated by calling out Alex's post as overly hedgy and it kind of just didn't feel like a genuine thought. Idk

eh not really, i see plenty of times where townies pull out these crazy sounding reads because they get too deep in their own worldbuilding and start imagining things that arent there. i think "i am scumreading this person and now someone else is attacking me for my read of them, i wonder if they are teamed" is a thought that easily crosses most peoples minds even if its rarely accurate. it struck me as kind of an outlandish thought but not really an implausible one at all, if that makes sense.

I mean that's definitely a possibility; I just think Alex comes off as an experienced player and I don't think the connection he's drawing has any logic beyond "crescent attacks Alex who is currently attacking Bella" so I think it's more likely to come from mafia on balance.

[Save The Dragons]

Actually I have no idea if "Rule of 3" even exists here, but it generally refers to posts that effectively list 3 (but sometimes 4) people in order and gives "reads" on all of them that are so easy to fake you don't even need to read the game to fake them. The poster then makes one or two useless comments after and leaves. It's a very common method of appearing to be hunting for scum when you're really just blowing air, and it's one of the most accurate metas I've seen in a 48/24 format.

I wanted to see if he'd like, do anything to followup that post before I drew attention to it, but I guess that's already happened.

And I see he posted while I was writing this up, and that post does nothing for me.

More comprehensive reasons for trains, please.

Rule of 3 seems odd

[Alexcellent]

@StD can you explain more on your freedom scum read/sins of Shoshin comment?

[Crescent]

Actually I have no idea if "Rule of 3" even exists here, but it generally refers to posts that effectively list 3 (but sometimes 4) people in order and gives "reads" on all of them that are so easy to fake you don't even need to read the game to fake them. The poster then makes one or two useless comments after and leaves. It's a very common method of appearing to be hunting for scum when you're really just blowing air, and it's one of the most accurate metas I've seen in a 48/24 format.

I wanted to see if he'd like, do anything to followup that post before I drew attention to it, but I guess that's already happened.

And I see he posted while I was writing this up, and that post does nothing for me.

More comprehensive reasons for trains, please.

Rule of 3 seems odd

The last time I saw a blatant rule of 3 in a 48/24 game the scum rb who did it got dayvigged for it. The only other meta that tends to be close in accuracy is "If someone mentions SK for no reason, murder them."

[Crescent]

And it's neat that I ask you to actually give

good

reasons to actually push on people and you just completely avoided it.

[Crescent]

Oh and "Rule of 3" is exactly why Ausuka said it was "Wolfy AF", so..... Yeah. I'd like to see a good argument from you that actually resembles scumhunting and game solving.

[Save The Dragons]

Sins of shoshin = shoshins scummy behavior. The chaos still seems a bit much to me. For that reason I'd vote freedom.

[Alexcellent]

i dont think having some slightly unusual roles is an indicator of a "troll setup". even if we assume its randomized alignments its more likely than not theres scum in the hood, and i think "oh it's a troll setup so the hood is all town" is a weird logical leap and not good thinking, b/c if it were that obvious the game just solves itself on day 1

I mean it's not a logical leap, did you read my second paragraph? I'm saying making conclusions about the amount of scum in the hood feels silly to me because anything is possible in a setup with Ascetic Millers lmao

sorry, my bad on misunderstanding what you meant there. i still dont like the idea of just going "setup is a troll so all basic assumptions about balance go out the window"

Basic assumptions about balance like you shouldn't put 2 vigs in a 12 player game, or you shouldn't make ICs bulletproof, or you shouldn't put three mafia doctors in a gunsmith game? Normal mods can and do mess with players in this way. Maybe it's pointless to talk in circles about it though.

@shoshin, we don't use the l-word on this site anymore, and i haven't gotten to this game yet. i don't lurk to "avoid posting content" or whatever else because i am more than good enough at scum to know what to post.

This is one if the reasons I town read Datisi. Not because of the self-meta here but because I've seen scum!Datisi a couple times now and this isn't it. If you don't have much of an opinion on him then he's very likely town; he's generally high activity as scum and working hard to make people want to keep him around and empathize with him.

I mean I don't disagree that Datisi is capable of being much townier than this as scum but I also think he's capable of doing more as town? And probably just hasn't gotten into the game regardless of alignment.

- i think alex reading into crescent acting in defense of bella in 412 is towny, that kind of trying to draw out unseen connections comes more often from a townie mindset of trying to fit puzzle pieces together

I mean maybe I'm biased/tunneled at this point but don't you think it kind of sounds like a BS read? There was no indication at all that Crescent was worried about Bella being eliminated by calling out Alex's post as overly hedgy and it kind of just didn't feel like a genuine thought. Idk

eh not really, i see plenty of times where townies pull out these crazy sounding reads because they get too deep in their own worldbuilding and start imagining things that arent there. i think "i am scumreading this person and now someone else is attacking me for my read of them, i wonder if they are teamed" is a thought that easily crosses most peoples minds even if its rarely accurate. it struck me as kind of an outlandish thought but not really an implausible one at all, if that makes sense.

I mean that's definitely a possibility; I just think Alex comes off as an experienced player and I don't think the connection he's drawing has any logic beyond "crescent attacks Alex who is currently attacking Bella" so I think it's more likely to come from mafia on balance.

Not really I think it was just a style clash and I was reading more into crescents tone than meaning. I disliked the way she phrased some stuff and it made me get defensive and slightly paranoid of her

[Alexcellent]

Sins of shoshin = shoshins scummy behavior. The chaos still seems a bit much to me. For that reason I'd vote freedom.

I think Shoshin’s chaotic play and hopping around reads is pretty bonkers for scum IMO, just feels very much like a town slot

[Crescent]

Oh and Ausuka why did you vote Marci when you've been pushing on Datisi for a while now, when Datisi is the one leading her train?

Can you walk me through your thought process?

[Crescent]

Sins of shoshin = shoshins scummy behavior. The chaos still seems a bit much to me. For that reason I'd vote freedom.

I think Shoshin’s chaotic play and hopping around reads is pretty bonkers for scum IMO, just feels very much like a town slot

My personal experience says players who do that are often scum.

Regardless, I'm more interested in reading the player that actually occupies the spot now. We can't go in circles over a player who's not in the game forever.

[Ausuka]

Because my suspicion of Datisi has been lighter than my suspicion of Marci and then Marci started openwolfing

I mean the post I quoted alone has to be the scummiest thing in this game so far? Marci gets pushed, seems to completely crumble under pressure, insists she's sure Dats is scum, and then turns around and says 'oh Dats you're so silly tunneling me here! btw I'm going to go lurk now for Better Reads or whatever'

[Crescent]

Because my suspicion of Datisi has been lighter than my suspicion of Marci and then Marci started openwolfing

I mean the post I quoted alone has to be the scummiest thing in this game so far? Marci gets pushed, seems to completely crumble under pressure, insists she's sure Dats is scum, and then turns around and says 'oh Dats you're so silly tunneling me here! btw I'm going to go lurk now for Better Reads or whatever'

Almost every post from her since and including #683 feel so fraudulent to me it's breaking my sensors and I find myself questioning how scum could let themselves act in such a manner. She's making the game way more about her than it is, and faking all sorts of emotion in the meantime. Meanwhile she's calling Datisi scum for no reason but also mocking Datisi for tunneling her which would be a fine play for scum Datisi in this situation given the way she's playing.

Like she just flat out does not make any sense to me at all. I agree with Datisi that her posts aren't being made in good faith, but it's so obviously not in good faith I don't understand it. Like, she's been super obviously "openwolfing" for over 100 posts now.

[Ausuka]

I mean I understand why you're concerned, I am too to some extent but like

Idk I don't want to keep this slot alive

Sometimes the person howling

is

just a wolf you know?

I tried backing off from Marci because I didn't want to tunnel, I thought I might be biased since her whole deal had been pushing me from the start and some of her posts lightly pinged me as towny. But she was scummy at the start and she's really scummy now.

[Freedom]

Basic assumptions about balance like you shouldn't put 2 vigs in a 12 player game, or you shouldn't make ICs bulletproof, or you shouldn't put three mafia doctors in a gunsmith game? Normal mods can and do mess with players in this way. Maybe it's pointless to talk in circles about it though.

This sounds like one of Datisi's games.

Because my suspicion of Datisi has been lighter than my suspicion of Marci and then Marci started openwolfing

I mean the post I quoted alone has to be the scummiest thing in this game so far? Marci gets pushed, seems to completely crumble under pressure, insists she's sure Dats is scum, and then turns around and says 'oh Dats you're so silly tunneling me here! btw I'm going to go lurk now for Better Reads or whatever'

I agree.
That sounds very like scum!marci, at least per Micro 1056 which Datisi mentioned. I'm pretty sure that when Faker called her scum, she started saying things like:

PLEASE you're scum

Though, she didn't switch back.
So, maybe this could be town!marci?

[Crescent]

Datisi votes Marci in #41, which Marci doesn't even register until #383 when she susses him. He is then the focus of almost every post she makes afterwards.

She only counters him in #450 because Shoshin asks her to vote there. This is the actual reason the vote was placed to begin with.