Mini Normal 1931 | Endgame

[wavemode]

Meh, I'd vote Thor if it came down to it.

Ausuka's the better lynch.

[skitter30]

So you don't think it could be a TvT situation?

I doubt it is. doesn't matter because thor is scum anywyas.

Assume I've only skimmed the last eight pages (I'm planning on finishing tonight). But since the hot topic right now is Thor, tell me why I should vote him.

[Eddie Cane]

do you have a reason to not vote him? guilty until proven innocent after all

[rb]

ausuka probably is a better lynch tbh

VOTE: Ausuka

[rb]

wait no

there's a world where ausuka is town and thor is still scum, that's the problem and why i went to thor in the first place -_____________________________-

eddie why would me being wrong about thor make me scum? i don't think i am but it's not like i can't be wrong (even tho i'm usually good)

[rb]

i find this disjoint in your perspective to be concerning, because it's not something i'd expect you to be thinking or expressing (as either alignment)

[rb]

like let's assume you're town and you think thor is scum

i think thor is scum

but i have to be scum if he ends up town, whereas you don't because:_________

[skitter30]

Eddie, you asked me for my vote earlier, so I'm trying to find out why.

And I play more from the perspective of 'null until I have a reason to townread or scumread' someone.

K, let me read the last eight pages when I get home and I'll see what I think.

[Eddie Cane]

like let's assume you're town and you think thor is scum

i think thor is scum

but i have to be scum if he ends up town, whereas you don't because:_________

I could be scum. o.o

[skitter30]

K, I just read through the Thor/Eddie thing. Thor is obvtown (albeit a tad abrasive) and I have no idea why people are scumreading him or voting him.

I think their whole spat was Eddie misreading Thor's posts, which stemmed from not realizing Thor was linking to his profile, and not to a wiki page about a scumtell as Eddie seems to believe.

Spoiler:

"thor is getting scumread for following the wiki"
Y'know, HOW IS IT POSSIBLE MY PERFECT PLAN TO GET TOWN READ FAILED

Thor legit wrote the articles he quoted. He's playing the town strategy that he espoused years ago. He wasn't complaining that he was getting scumread for following the wiki. He was complaining that he was getting scumread for playing the way he believes town should play, as seen by the fact that he actually took the time to write a wiki article on the subject.

my first claim is that only wiki tells matter according to thor. as you see in 445, I bring up the very reasonable point; I said that the wiki is not the only way to scum hunt. then, in 447, we see thors reply; "by that logic every post is scummy". aka, I said that things can be scummy that aren't wiki tells, and his reply is that everything can be scummy in thst case. aka, omgus, use wiki tells newb.

Again, you're not actually listening to what he said. Your first claim is that 'wiki tells matter according to Thor'. This claim is unfounded; Thor never said that. Yes, I agree that wiki tells are not the only way to scumhunt, but Thor was linking articles that he wrote describing what he believes to be pro-town and anti-town behavior. He wasn't advocating that we should be following linked wiki tells or anything.

stop scumreading me. this is fun! earlier in this thread, thor said, paraphrased, "I cannot fathom how anyone could scumread me". lol. moving on, tho, 409 and 446 both basically just omgus and call myself and rb bad for scumreading thor. he attacks the users, as opposed to the premise.

There is no OMGUS in 409, and he doesn't call anyone bad in that post. And while he does get rudely frustrated with you two in 446, he doesn't actually scumread you anywhere as far as I can tell. In fact, in 464, he indicates that he

doesn't

think you're scum.

the cool one. vote on the wagon I want you to. this is along with the top of 409 saying he is voting the largest wagon. and, in 405, he tells us to consolidate on a wagon. he basically just used a work around to convince us to sheep him. calling it a "secondary scum read" is utter bullshit, considering it's who you're voting and those words are meaningless. this isn't even subtle, he's just telling us to sheep him.

??? He's doing exactly what he said he's doing - he's voting for his scumread, and said that instead of voting for their main read, people should try to consolidate on a secondary read so that we can use the time we have productively. Like, he doesn't want a lynch at deadline, which I totally get because those tend to be panic-fueled and often lead to people making hasty decisions under pressure. He wants us to try to consolidate a wagon *now* instead. As far as I can tell, he isn't actually even pushing anyone to vote *his* wagon. So I dunno why you're accusing him of asking people to sheep him.

I don't actually think you're intentionally misrepping him. I think you just didn't understand what he was trying to say and that you two were having two different conversations.

So, no, I am not voting Thor with you.

[wavemode]

Do you still townread Ausuka

[skitter30]

I'm not sure yet. I'm catching up by topic, and the next thing I'm tackling is the you/SD/Ausuka debate.

[rb]

Skitter seems town

[wavemode]

Well she's certainly not scum with Ausuka.

[Dunkerdoodles]

Daily catchup post.
Still going to sheep Rb for now

[Eddie Cane]

K, I just read through the Thor/Eddie thing. Thor is obvtown (albeit a tad abrasive) and I have no idea why people are scumreading him or voting him.

I think their whole spat was Eddie misreading Thor's posts, which stemmed from not realizing Thor was linking to his profile, and not to a wiki page about a scumtell as Eddie seems to believe.

Spoiler:

"thor is getting scumread for following the wiki"
Y'know, HOW IS IT POSSIBLE MY PERFECT PLAN TO GET TOWN READ FAILED

Thor legit wrote the articles he quoted. He's playing the town strategy that he espoused years ago. He wasn't complaining that he was getting scumread for following the wiki. He was complaining that he was getting scumread for playing the way he believes town should play, as seen by the fact that he actually took the time to write a wiki article on the subject.

my first claim is that only wiki tells matter according to thor. as you see in 445, I bring up the very reasonable point; I said that the wiki is not the only way to scum hunt. then, in 447, we see thors reply; "by that logic every post is scummy". aka, I said that things can be scummy that aren't wiki tells, and his reply is that everything can be scummy in thst case. aka, omgus, use wiki tells newb.

Again, you're not actually listening to what he said. Your first claim is that 'wiki tells matter according to Thor'. This claim is unfounded; Thor never said that. Yes, I agree that wiki tells are not the only way to scumhunt, but Thor was linking articles that he wrote describing what he believes to be pro-town and anti-town behavior. He wasn't advocating that we should be following linked wiki tells or anything.

stop scumreading me. this is fun! earlier in this thread, thor said, paraphrased, "I cannot fathom how anyone could scumread me". lol. moving on, tho, 409 and 446 both basically just omgus and call myself and rb bad for scumreading thor. he attacks the users, as opposed to the premise.

There is no OMGUS in 409, and he doesn't call anyone bad in that post. And while he does get rudely frustrated with you two in 446, he doesn't actually scumread you anywhere as far as I can tell. In fact, in 464, he indicates that he

doesn't

think you're scum.

the cool one. vote on the wagon I want you to. this is along with the top of 409 saying he is voting the largest wagon. and, in 405, he tells us to consolidate on a wagon. he basically just used a work around to convince us to sheep him. calling it a "secondary scum read" is utter bullshit, considering it's who you're voting and those words are meaningless. this isn't even subtle, he's just telling us to sheep him.

??? He's doing exactly what he said he's doing - he's voting for his scumread, and said that instead of voting for their main read, people should try to consolidate on a secondary read so that we can use the time we have productively. Like, he doesn't want a lynch at deadline, which I totally get because those tend to be panic-fueled and often lead to people making hasty decisions under pressure. He wants us to try to consolidate a wagon *now* instead. As far as I can tell, he isn't actually even pushing anyone to vote *his* wagon. So I dunno why you're accusing him of asking people to sheep him.

I don't actually think you're intentionally misrepping him. I think you just didn't understand what he was trying to say and that you two were having two different conversations.

So, no, I am not voting Thor with you.

what if I am intentionally misrepping him?

[Eddie Cane]

ausuka is gonna be today's lynch btw

[wavemode]

Music to my ears.

[skitter30]

K, I just read through the Thor/Eddie thing. Thor is obvtown (albeit a tad abrasive) and I have no idea why people are scumreading him or voting him.

I think their whole spat was Eddie misreading Thor's posts, which stemmed from not realizing Thor was linking to his profile, and not to a wiki page about a scumtell as Eddie seems to believe.

Spoiler:

"thor is getting scumread for following the wiki"
Y'know, HOW IS IT POSSIBLE MY PERFECT PLAN TO GET TOWN READ FAILED

Thor legit wrote the articles he quoted. He's playing the town strategy that he espoused years ago. He wasn't complaining that he was getting scumread for following the wiki. He was complaining that he was getting scumread for playing the way he believes town should play, as seen by the fact that he actually took the time to write a wiki article on the subject.

my first claim is that only wiki tells matter according to thor. as you see in 445, I bring up the very reasonable point; I said that the wiki is not the only way to scum hunt. then, in 447, we see thors reply; "by that logic every post is scummy". aka, I said that things can be scummy that aren't wiki tells, and his reply is that everything can be scummy in thst case. aka, omgus, use wiki tells newb.

Again, you're not actually listening to what he said. Your first claim is that 'wiki tells matter according to Thor'. This claim is unfounded; Thor never said that. Yes, I agree that wiki tells are not the only way to scumhunt, but Thor was linking articles that he wrote describing what he believes to be pro-town and anti-town behavior. He wasn't advocating that we should be following linked wiki tells or anything.

stop scumreading me. this is fun! earlier in this thread, thor said, paraphrased, "I cannot fathom how anyone could scumread me". lol. moving on, tho, 409 and 446 both basically just omgus and call myself and rb bad for scumreading thor. he attacks the users, as opposed to the premise.

There is no OMGUS in 409, and he doesn't call anyone bad in that post. And while he does get rudely frustrated with you two in 446, he doesn't actually scumread you anywhere as far as I can tell. In fact, in 464, he indicates that he

doesn't

think you're scum.

the cool one. vote on the wagon I want you to. this is along with the top of 409 saying he is voting the largest wagon. and, in 405, he tells us to consolidate on a wagon. he basically just used a work around to convince us to sheep him. calling it a "secondary scum read" is utter bullshit, considering it's who you're voting and those words are meaningless. this isn't even subtle, he's just telling us to sheep him.

??? He's doing exactly what he said he's doing - he's voting for his scumread, and said that instead of voting for their main read, people should try to consolidate on a secondary read so that we can use the time we have productively. Like, he doesn't want a lynch at deadline, which I totally get because those tend to be panic-fueled and often lead to people making hasty decisions under pressure. He wants us to try to consolidate a wagon *now* instead. As far as I can tell, he isn't actually even pushing anyone to vote *his* wagon. So I dunno why you're accusing him of asking people to sheep him.

I don't actually think you're intentionally misrepping him. I think you just didn't understand what he was trying to say and that you two were having two different conversations.

So, no, I am not voting Thor with you.

what if I am intentionally misrepping him?

Then I'm more likely to think that you're scum trying to drive a mislynch. I'm pretty sure that isn't what I'm seeing here though. It looks like the two of you were talking past each other instead of with each other.

ausuka is gonna be today's lynch btw

Why are you voting Thor then?

[Eddie Cane]

because thor is scum

[skitter30]

because thor is scum

Why though? Your entire case on him seems to be based on you misreading/misunderstanding his posts. I don't get it.

Do you think a Thor lynch is happening today?

[Eddie Cane]

I haven't made a thor case. I've played with him. picture me as a big, powerful tiger. he is a donkey. donkeys are awesome but they have short tempers, I'm just playing with my food. if my food proves it's worthy of joining my pack it can live. otherwise, hammers for dinner.

I haven't tried to serve donkey today. I might. we'll see. as of now, the answer is no.

[skitter30]

Firstly, I just want to say that is one of the strangest posts I've ever read in a forum mafia game, and I'm including the time a guy on my homesite wrote a post inspired by Book of Mormon's 'Hello' inviting us to join the Cult of Cthulhu.

I was under the impression that 476 was your case against him. So, do you think he's scum, or are you still trying to sort him? Cuz if I'm understanding your metaphor correctly, you're still trying to sort him. (From the 'if my food proves it's worthy of joining my pack it can live' bit)

I also find it strange that you're still sitting on the Thor wagon if you think it's unlikely to take off. Like, if you think Ausuka is scum too, why are you not voting for her when there seems to be a lot of traction there? And if you think he's scum, why aren't you trying to get him lynched? (I think that's what you mean by 'I haven't tried to serve donkey today', that you haven't made a steadfast effort to get him lynched.)

(If I"m misinterpreting your metaphor, let me know, cuz I'm not entirely sure I translated it into mafia correctly).

[Sunlit Diamond]

*drops out of the sky*

UNVOTE:

I retract my scumread on wavemode. I will freely admit it was pushed by a touch of omgus. With a clear head and a reread, that was a stupid move. Especially since now I've read through I understand why he was on me, and why he SRs Ausuka.

First, though:

rb could just be really, really confident scum, but right now he feels town to me. He's generated a lot of reactions and commentary that is completely outside his control, which seems counterproductive to scum goals. I'm also seeing it in how he's going in circles with his Thor/Ausuka/TB reads. (It is circles- I wrote down all his reads and he keeps looping back to those three with a side dish of Una.) When the game first started I really didn't get what he was doing (said as much), but I like it now.

I disagree with his current scumread on Thor (or at least with how set he is on it), because Thor leans town to me. He's angry, frustrated at game state, and I'm actively afraid of having him level cannons at me (due to tone), but under the salt it seems like he's trying to show people how to play, he's trying to get us to cooperate, and he's trying to get us to a place where we have something real to work with. Whlie his phrasing is unpleasant, I'm having trouble seeing scum in what he's doing.

The one thought I have that shakes my read and keeps me from just parking him in the town zone is this: Why are you engaging with Eddie at all, Thor? do you think he's scum, or are you just blowing off steam? Or are you tanking for your team because eddie and rb could rip them apart?

All that said, I agree with skitter that eddie is hounding Thor over a misunderstanding or a misrepresentation, and that his last post was weird. Based on this, I do not think they are on the same team.

Skitter is also on my solid town reads, especially after this last page of conversation and the thought put into her post 498.

-

Why isn't Dunk getting more/consistent attention? If I'm getting fried for lack of content, he should be on fire. At least I actually stood my ground and voted according to what I thought (even if I was wrong)...all he's done is sheep and spam? I get he gets scumread every game, but that doesn't mean it isn't deserved. Someone tell me what, if anything, I'm missing here.

Similar arguments, though slightly less extreme, apply to NTRP.

-

And finally...Ausuka.

Some of the views expressed here will be different than previously expressed. Whee.

First serious vote: Sheeps
Second serious vote: Votes for Dunk for sheeping?
90 You don't have anything better than to vote for someone for doing the same thing you did? Also, I had given you nothing to work with at that point (I was in, in fact, being kind of jerkishly vague). What exactly were you coming on to?

174[/post This is where my opinion changes from before, and that's largely because I wasn't paying enough attention to what was going on. On reread, this entire post feels disingenuous in its phrasing, from your "that's interesting" right down to ""I have no idea why my votes are so similar to rb's"). It feels like an attempt to be fake-friendly/empathetic/towny. I still don't know what to think of flavor's self-vote, but I have to say that the one "busy work" post you linked to was a legitimate question with a legitimate, clarifying response, so that logic is void. Anyway, there was also another attempt to align yourself with me....why? What exactly was so important about what I was saying that you wanted to be associated with it? Townreads are not great when they feel like a clammy handshake.

[post]184 Oh hey there's a handy wagon. Ausuka just jumped on it, amazing!
188 and 198 Not really feeling these excuses.
306 To be fair, I thought wavemode's scumread of me based on that exchange was pretty weak as well until I reviewed it just now. I stand by the first two lines of my post, but agreeing about Flavor and Ciara was dumb.

310 I outlined above why rb is likely town, which is relevant to this post. I think if an actual newish person can pick up on how rb is helpful to town, then it should be a glaring billboard for someone who is loudly not-a-newb. So why are you presenting his activity in such simplistic terms? Your note to wavemode seems to be an outright lie, given prior observations.

313 You are way overthinking the wagon scenario. There's a thing about overcomplicated explanations that I can't remember off the top of my head, but I'm pretty sure it applies here. Also, you gutread skitter (probably because she's given nothing scum could hope to pick at) which becomes relevant...

316 ...here. From one post to the next you gutread, and then you scumread wavemode for gutreading. This looks a lot like earlier when you sheeped and then voted for sheeping. What exactly is going on here?

And from this point on you launch into full on angry defensiveness and your credibility drops with every post after.

So yeah.

VOTE: Ausuka

[Sunlit Diamond]

EBWOP to fix the stupid broken code and make links easier to access.

--

*drops out of the sky*

UNVOTE:

I retract my scumread on wavemode. I will freely admit it was pushed by a touch of omgus. With a clear head and a reread, that was a stupid move. Especially since now I've read through I understand why he was on me, and why he SRs Ausuka.

First, though:

rb could just be really, really confident scum, but right now he feels town to me. He's generated a lot of reactions and commentary that is completely outside his control, which seems counterproductive to scum goals. I'm also seeing it in how he's going in circles with his Thor/Ausuka/TB reads. (It is circles- I wrote down all his reads and he keeps looping back to those three with a side dish of Una.) When the game first started I really didn't get what he was doing (said as much), but I like it now.

I disagree with his current scumread on Thor (or at least with how set he is on it), because Thor leans town to me. He's angry, frustrated at game state, and I'm actively afraid of having him level cannons at me (due to tone), but under the salt it seems like he's trying to show people how to play, he's trying to get us to cooperate, and he's trying to get us to a place where we have something real to work with. Whlie his phrasing is unpleasant, I'm having trouble seeing scum in what he's doing.

The one thought I have that shakes my read and keeps me from just parking him in the town zone is this: Why are you engaging with Eddie at all, Thor? do you think he's scum, or are you just blowing off steam? Or are you tanking for your team because eddie and rb could rip them apart?

All that said, I agree with skitter that eddie is hounding Thor over a misunderstanding or a misrepresentation, and that his last post was weird. Based on this, I do not think they are on the same team.

Skitter is also on my solid town reads, especially after this last page of conversation and the thought put into her post 498.

-

Why isn't Dunk getting more/consistent attention? If I'm getting fried for lack of content, he should be on fire. At least I actually stood my ground and voted according to what I thought (even if I was wrong)...all he's done is sheep and spam? I get he gets scumread every game, but that doesn't mean it isn't deserved. Someone tell me what, if anything, I'm missing here.

Similar arguments, though slightly less extreme, apply to NTRP.

-

And finally...Ausuka.

Some of the views expressed here will be different than previously expressed. Whee.

First serious vote: Sheeps
Second serious vote: Votes for Dunk for sheeping?
90 You don't have anything better than to vote for someone for doing the same thing you did? Also, I had given you nothing to work with at that point (I was in, in fact, being kind of jerkishly vague). What exactly were you coming on to?

174 This is where my opinion changes from before, and that's largely because I wasn't paying enough attention to what was going on. On reread, this entire post feels disingenuous in its phrasing, from your "that's interesting" right down to ""I have no idea why my votes are so similar to rb's"). It feels like an attempt to be fake-friendly/empathetic/towny. I still don't know what to think of flavor's self-vote, but I have to say that the one "busy work" post you linked to was a legitimate question with a legitimate, clarifying response, so that logic is void. Anyway, there was also another attempt to align yourself with me....why? What exactly was so important about what I was saying that you wanted to be associated with it? Townreads are not great when they feel like a clammy handshake.

184 Oh hey there's a handy wagon. Ausuka just jumped on it, amazing!
188 and 198 Not really feeling these excuses.
306 To be fair, I thought wavemode's scumread of me based on that exchange was pretty weak as well until I reviewed it just now. I stand by the first two lines of my post, but agreeing about Flavor and Ciara was dumb.

310 I outlined above why rb is likely town, which is relevant to this post. I think if an actual newish person can pick up on how rb is helpful to town, then it should be a glaring billboard for someone who is loudly not-a-newb. So why are you presenting his activity in such simplistic terms? Your note to wavemode seems to be an outright lie, given prior observations.

313 You are way overthinking the wagon scenario. There's a thing about overcomplicated explanations that I can't remember off the top of my head, but I'm pretty sure it applies here. Also, you gutread skitter (probably because she's given nothing scum could hope to pick at) which becomes relevant...

316 ...here. From one post to the next you gutread, and then you scumread wavemode for gutreading. This looks a lot like earlier when you sheeped and then voted for sheeping. What exactly is going on here?

And from this point on you launch into full on angry defensiveness and your credibility drops with every post after.

So yeah.

VOTE: Ausuka[/quote]