Mini Normal 1908 - In The Web (Game Over)

[Kelvin Smith]

Perhaps the real Cop or other investigative role is holding back to gather more info?

We have massclaimed. Why would they hold back when they could get a scum lynched and we have asked all to claim?

Because a counterclaim is a 1-for-1 trade that arguably gives scum more information than town. If I was scum, a real Cop would potentially be better off not counterclaiming, since he could spend several more Nights getting results. And if he ever got NKed, it would confirm me as scum anyway, so tha wouldn't be a concern.

A 1 for 1 trade benefits town immensely. And it is only 2 mislynches before LYLO. There are 9 players left in the game. If there is any unclaimed PR and they don't claim now, they get lynched later.

Meh. I think they are kind of weak. I'd rather get a better trade, if possible. But maybe I'm just greedy.

Anyway, I'm going to bed.

[RayFrost]

Perhaps the real Cop or other investigative role is holding back to gather more info?

We have massclaimed. Why would they hold back when they could get a scum lynched and we have asked all to claim?

Because a counterclaim is a 1-for-1 trade that arguably gives scum more information than town. If I was scum, a real Cop would potentially be better off not counterclaiming, since he could spend several more Nights getting results. And if he ever got NKed, it would confirm me as scum anyway, so tha wouldn't be a concern.

While this isn't a correct assessment, there's other reasons that your claim is believable.

Let's assume you are scum for a moment and think about what you did:
You claimed cop in a game where you wouldn't know for sure if there was a cop, to claim a guilty on your scumbuddy who had "gotten away" with a watcher claim (meaning no counterclaim) and was about to be lynched in all likelihood due to the scumminess of their play.

So you prematurely fakeclaimed, with minimal information, in order to... do what? You were already townread. This just increased your risk for no actual gain.

[Kelvin Smith]

The person who called for mass-claim was priscilla.

I had no intentions to mass-claim when I claimed.

Okay, that's fair enough. Like I said, I couldn't remember who initiated it. Not that it matters. I don't necessarily think it was that bad anymore. Though that might just be hindsight. At the time, I thought it was really bad to call for a massclaim when we had an all-but-confirmed Cop, no Roleblocker, and a potential Doctor lurking about. Honestly, thinking about it more, it kinda still bothers me. I might want to look at Priscilla a little more.

[RayFrost]

For my clarification, you will be able to investigate tomorrow night. Yes?

[MMM]

Has anybody at all considered that my claim may be fake? Granted, I don't think my scum game is that strong that I could've faked that level of breadcrumb. But still, my claim seems to be universally unquestioned.

I have considered that, actually, but I never said anything about it since having thought for it for a bit hard bussing the roleblocker would have honestly been pretty fucking stupid.

That's what makes it so goddamn diabolical. You might not know this about me, but I have no problems bussing my teammates whatsoever. The only real risk I'd run is a counterclaim.

1. So basically you're saying that from Ray's point of view, you should be confirmed scum, and vice versa?
2. As scum, how would you explain to town having survived another, say, 2 nights?
3. Assuming the lack of your death doesn't give you away, what results would you give after the scum roleblocker is a goner and you can't reasonably claim to not get results?

[RayFrost]

By tomorrow, I mean this game night, words are hard

[Kelvin Smith]

Man, I hate you guys. Stop pointing out why my claim is so damn believable. I was trying for a long-shot gambit to get scum to counterclaim me. It wasn't going to happen, of course, but it was worth a shot. I just wanted to try some wacky stuff for my last game and you guys had to come and be all reasonable.

[RayFrost]

Don't do silly things.

[MarioManiac4]

VOTE: Kelvin Smith

[RayFrost]

1. So basically you're saying that from Ray's point of view, you should be confirmed scum, and vice versa?
2. As scum, how would you explain to town having survived another, say, 2 nights?
3. Assuming the lack of your death doesn't give you away, what results would you give after the scum roleblocker is a goner and you can't reasonably claim to not get results?

How does 1 follow from what he said?

[RayFrost]

VOTE: Kelvin Smith

You've lost me.

[MarioManiac4]

Well it'd just be rude to not vote him after he asked so politely!

[MarioManiac4]

VOTE: Yoshi

[Kelvin Smith]

For my clarification, you will be able to investigate tomorrow night. Yes?

Yeah, but that's why I'm pretty confident I'm dead tonight.

Has anybody at all considered that my claim may be fake? Granted, I don't think my scum game is that strong that I could've faked that level of breadcrumb. But still, my claim seems to be universally unquestioned.

I have considered that, actually, but I never said anything about it since having thought for it for a bit hard bussing the roleblocker would have honestly been pretty fucking stupid.

That's what makes it so goddamn diabolical. You might not know this about me, but I have no problems bussing my teammates whatsoever. The only real risk I'd run is a counterclaim.

1. So basically you're saying that from Ray's point of view, you should be confirmed scum, and vice versa?
2. As scum, how would you explain to town having survived another, say, 2 nights?
3. Assuming the lack of your death doesn't give you away, what results would you give after the scum roleblocker is a goner and you can't reasonably claim to not get results?

1. Nah. I'm saying that was my mindset when I first saw the claim. But looking at the full claim list, the setup honestly doesn't feel that stacked. Quite tame, honestly.

2. Scum are leaving me alive to make me look suspicious or some such bullshit.

3. Well, Odd-Night is pretty infrequent. I'd only have to give one or two more innocents or guilties. And I could always just lie to fuck with you guys.

[MMM]

1. So basically you're saying that from Ray's point of view, you should be confirmed scum, and vice versa?
2. As scum, how would you explain to town having survived another, say, 2 nights?
3. Assuming the lack of your death doesn't give you away, what results would you give after the scum roleblocker is a goner and you can't reasonably claim to not get results?

How does 1 follow from what he said?

I have deliberately taken it out of context.

[Kelvin Smith]

Don't do silly things.

Eh. Low risk, high reward. It could've worked if it wasn't for you meddling kids.

Well it'd just be rude to not vote him after he asked so politely!

I don't recall asking for that in the slightest.

1. So basically you're saying that from Ray's point of view, you should be confirmed scum, and vice versa?
2. As scum, how would you explain to town having survived another, say, 2 nights?
3. Assuming the lack of your death doesn't give you away, what results would you give after the scum roleblocker is a goner and you can't reasonably claim to not get results?

How does 1 follow from what he said?

I have deliberately taken it out of context.

To what end?

[MMM]

Has anybody at all considered that my claim may be fake? Granted, I don't think my scum game is that strong that I could've faked that level of breadcrumb. But still, my claim seems to be universally unquestioned.

I have considered that, actually, but I never said anything about it since having thought for it for a bit hard bussing the roleblocker would have honestly been pretty fucking stupid.

That's what makes it so goddamn diabolical. You might not know this about me, but I have no problems bussing my teammates whatsoever. The only real risk I'd run is a counterclaim.

1. So basically you're saying that from Ray's point of view, you should be confirmed scum, and vice versa?
2. As scum, how would you explain to town having survived another, say, 2 nights?
3. Assuming the lack of your death doesn't give you away, what results would you give after the scum roleblocker is a goner and you can't reasonably claim to not get results?

1. Nah. I'm saying that was my mindset when I first saw the claim. But looking at the full claim list, the setup honestly doesn't feel that stacked. Quite tame, honestly.

2. Scum are leaving me alive to make me look suspicious or some such bullshit.

3. Well, Odd-Night is pretty infrequent. I'd only have to give one or two more innocents or guilties. And I could always just lie to fuck with you guys.

1. Fair nuff. Also regarding your above, the end was to get this answer/stance from you (obviously (?))
2.5. (because it's in between 2 and 3... ok that wasn't very funny) You'd pretty much have to lock your entire play for the next bunch of days though. As in, lynch a VT today, kill Ircher, get a guilty on your other partner, kill Ray/PP/MM4, mislynch another VT, kill another inno, get a guilty on the last VT. And it would be HIGHLY unlikely that scum doesn't just outright kill you under the assumption that you're town so you'd be had sooner or later.

[Kelvin Smith]

1. What would you hope to gain from purposely taking me out of context? I understood you wanted my stance or answer, but what kind of answer were you looking for? What would have been indicative of alignment?

2.5. I could envision a world where a scum team would try a stupid gambit like keeping a Cop alive as a mislynch target. Though the point is kind of moot, since my ploy has been exposed. Unless you think this whole sequence of events has been me as scum pulling some really bizarre gambit.

I'm going to bed for real now.

[MMM]

1. What would you hope to gain from purposely taking me out of context? I understood you wanted my stance or answer, but what kind of answer were you looking for? What would have been indicative of alignment?

2.5. I could envision a world where a scum team would try a stupid gambit like keeping a Cop alive as a mislynch target. Though the point is kind of moot, since my ploy has been exposed. Unless you think this whole sequence of events has been me as scum pulling some really bizarre gambit.

I'm going to bed for real now.

1. I usually don't actually know what answer I'm looking for - just that I want some sort of answer that I can elaborate on later. I'm not meticulous, and I really tend to do things as I go along, which I think this is a good example of. There was also the slim chance that my deliberately inflated interpretation was correct, which it temporarily actually appeared to have been, and I'm a bit surprised at how it wasn't as unreasonable as I had thought.

2.5. I could see scum keeping a PR alive for some dumb reason, but quite frankly, not if it's a Cop that can get hard guilties and innocents especially in the current game state. And given how town read you were, and still are, I really doubt you'd need to pull such a gambit as scum.

[MMM]

Went as far as page 24. Too much Transcend/Twoface/Titus/me drama and not much that's actually helpful.

[MarioManiac4]

The priority for players in the lynchpool is determining whether PP/Ray/me are scum.
I really don't see BYF/Gamma. And I think Priscila is far more town than MMM. I'm finding it harder and harder to see MMM as town honestly.
VOTE: MMM
Let's see where this vote goes.

[RayFrost]

MMM's posting today, while it does seem suspect to me, is not suspicious enough for me to vote him over bigyoshifan at this time

[ThinkBig]

.

[MarioManiac4]

I feel like if BYF was scum MMM/Priscila would be resisting his lynch more.

[Gamma Emerald]

Um read on me?