Mini 2331 - Touhou UPick: Anonymous Edition (Game Over)

[Yuuka Kazami]

I've been pretty clear that I don't want to die because the chances of town winning with my death is pretty dismal.
I don't really do the rollover and die thing.

[Yuuka Kazami]

It's an opportunity/rare outcome/serendipity/use the tools you have been given to make the best of a complex situation kind of thing. I'd think you'd be pretty good at that, though I'm not sure you'd have the courage.
There's a reason I'm saying it's a conspiracy theory rather than a full-throated accusation.

I dunno what you mean about Dai trying to die.

[Yuuka Kazami]

*sigh*
Going to to go find the role cards page helpfully constructed by you so I can remember what their ability even does.

[Yuuka Kazami]

...Why is Dai on the outside for you?

They just aren’t as strong as my other townreads. I’d at least like to think my townreads are right.

Why are you even wishfully thinking about these things.
We can be wrong, most of the time we are, holding on to that isn't advantageous when each day brings new information about someone's alignment that should conceivably lead to greater accuracy an opportunity to see the game more clearly etc etc.
Albeit you can also be lead astray, this day phase is especially vulnerable to that sort of maneuvering i think.

[Yuuka Kazami]

and unless you think both Marisa and Dai are scum then their active is confirmed since Marisa targeted Dai with her passive disable n1 which Dai redirected to Kagerou

Missed this, thank you for that information.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Do you need me to full claim today?

I’m making dinner atm but after I can work on that.

Ask koushi/Aya.
They're in charge.
I'd like you to because I suck and cannot figure out who is scum this game with much confidence. Anything that helps me go further in that regard is something that I want. But that's a personal want, not a need.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Putting it together.
I find it unlikely that Dai is able to redirect but they lied about that they will die if their target dies leading to a set up of fake drowning. When there's a risk that all this information could have been conveyed to another neighborhood.

Dai, did you crumb any parts of your abilities early?

[Yuuka Kazami]

the only people to observe having their reads change is me and Dai, so they are technically correct that you went from rock bottom this day phase to approaching a town read for me and regaining a town read from Dai.

[Yuuka Kazami]

@Reisen, I think it's a WIM thing.
I think Kaguya and I just have high WIM so when we're in trouble (in my case because I am vulnerable and don't have a decent solve heading into probable melo) and them because clown piece died putting them in a very awkward position when Dai came back, they began posting more.

I'm still trying to interpret it.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Reisen - Kaguya and I are not scum partners.
I don't have the patience to go back and forth with my scum partners in a vacuum for hours even at my absolute best.

[Yuuka Kazami]

I think the premise that the two scum players should increase their activity is true, but if it were true it would have been true day 2 and, for the most part my and Kaguya's activity stayed stable.

Today, on the otherhand both increased significantly. So

[Yuuka Kazami]

It's observable what our post rate was last day phase, so if either of us were panicking that Larvae died and tried to post more, we hid it well.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Yeah, but like.
Your premise is wrong.

[Yuuka Kazami]

>>Is literally voting Reisen
>>Time is running out and have mentioned it several times
>>Reisen still "asks" if they need to claim...

If you want to kill Reisen just say so explicitly and I’ll sheep you mindlessly and hope for the best.
If you don’t want me to change my vote I won’t.

[Yuuka Kazami]

And some more activity.

Yuuka, as an "active player" TM it is your job to hammer should Reisen not reshow before deadline, claim or not.

Sure, if I can't, I'll let you know.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Not why are you scumreading Kagerou, but why are you voting someone that's not one of Kaguya/Reisen (or me, if you agree with Kaguya)

Aya said not to and I don't have the context Kaguya has.
I'm fine just interpreting what you results are tomorrow and then trying my best to see if it's bullshit or not.

Not to do what? Which context?

Vote you.

[Yuuka Kazami]

All I got from the last two pages from Marisa is that they feel vulnerable now and are taking steps to correct that.

But none of it is AI.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Kaguya’s context where they’re town and know that the clown piece kill didn’t come from them and probably didn’t come from Dai.

I don’t know if they’re town so it’s much less clear to me that you’re scum.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Actually I wanna say that Larva's ISO also spews dai as town. It's a relatively short ISO (for a 5000+ post game) so can someone else skim it and tell me if they agree?

I didn’t skim it, I read all their posts and they were very careful to avoid associatives, you can see this in how they say the same things about different players such as their shade posts that double back into self-recrimination/self-doubt or their softball questions to multiple town.

No, I am not cheeky scum. I just fucked up.

[Yuuka Kazami]

You’re affirming Dai and town reading Dai.
So your end game is relatively clear to see.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Spewing multiple people as town and you only got to it just before melo.

Really.

[Yuuka Kazami]

I also said the same thing to Koishi, it’s just a turn of phrase I use to say I think someone is outwardly playing like town. I.e., they’re playing well.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Ugh

[Yuuka Kazami]

It probably doesn't matter but it annoys me to no end.

Empathy: but I’ve realized it’s just because it might be a non-AI puzzle they made intentionally to obscure and I hate those because they distract me from hunting.

[Yuuka Kazami]

This is going to do such weird things to the game state.
Oh well, it’s life.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Just in case it gets lost:

REISEN: Koushi WANTS YOU TO FULL CLAIM

[Yuuka Kazami]

Dai, I know you said you're largely not going to change your mind, but I am starting to realize that, barring intricate or exceptionally lucky circumstances you're town.

Maybe.

Since we have a pause, I can go through the associations, though I don't want to, to explain why, in particular I'm not scum with Larvae.

The argument is not going to be very persuasive. Rather it's not going to be sufficiently clear cut, it's just the nature of associations that, unless there are unique interactions and mine with them were anything but and even if I fully explained the dynamic it still won't be sufficient to be a solid argument.

There are other reasons that I'm, town but you have already stated that in general you don't go for players that case themselves as town. I don't think that's good play, simply because a lot of this game is about whether you believe what someone says and it's your job to identify who is telling the truth and who is not and ignoring or discounting true/false statements is a handicap you're placing on yourself and the town.

Though, I don't know what your experiences are with self-town casers.

[Yuuka Kazami]

So to be clear here.

Kaguya is slightly town reading me.
Koushi is town reading me but has doubts.

I forgot what kagerou's position on me is, I will guess they're town reading me based on older positioning. Or at the least I'm not a priority for them.

Aya is conflicted but thinks there is overlap in my role. Thinks Sanae and I had at least one scum in it based on an interaction we had.

Reisen is scum reading me.
Dai is scum reading me.
Marisa is scum reading me.

Why am I not dead?
Or at least being voted.

I'm still going to get at that review, just probably after work. There are too many interruptions that make it hard for me to really dive into all these interactions.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Oh yeah, I've been spamming all day.
plus the scum team is in the pool.
Plus omgus, instant defenses/responses.
Never mind.

Well let's put it differently. We have players that are setting up for my elimination tomorrow.
With Larvae through associations: Dai, <- Marisa.
I don't think Kaguya scum is angling to get me miseliminated through associations post scum them flip. It's more realistic they've worked to survive and change their position the next day phase if they need to.
Reisen is kind of making a general rule. Then applying it broadly and admit to lacking engagement. Their angle is Kaguya/Yuuka. Has one scum in it. It's not a persuasive argument, but it doesn't feel like, when I look at it that it's going for a miselim post-flip if they flip scum either. It's maybe more conventional scum. It is a small greenish-yellow flag that they're making a generality and applying it to players though.

Kagerou is like, a blankish slate. I don't really see anything that specifically points at a plan to get others eliminated if they get eliminated, beyond just a void of interaction.

Koushi asked for opinions about me. Marisa and Dai have come at it from the angle of associations. Pretty much anyone in the game expressing an opinion is influencing Koushi whether they mean to or not. I don't think it's inappropriate to share even if the conclusion is wrong/scum sided.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Did someone request a blank page? Well give me a few hours and you'll get some indecipherable reads.

Howdy!

cool, thank you.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Yuuka wanna help me flip Marisa today so I don't have to spend the rest of the game paranoid that she suddenly decided to townread me as soon as I started townreading you?

My stance hasn't changed.

And I'm not partner's with Marisa.

[Yuuka Kazami]

If Aya felt good about the chances that i'm scum, I'd be dead.

[Yuuka Kazami]

For the record, my slot killed Tenshi. Aya has no hood.

That last one is unexpected. I've seen them logged in without posting.
Albeit, I know that sort of observation.
1. Annoys people.
2. Isn't a valid way to read people.
3. Better left unsaid.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Aya claimed redirection on Koishi unto to Larvae, who is scum.

Aya did claim a neighborhood with Clownpiece that should have closed at the end of day 2.
When was the neighborhood check?

[Yuuka Kazami]

They said they wanted to confirm that Reisen was ascetic.
Which they did.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Because we're about to enter melo if we miss here.
And then claims lose significant value.

Now, scum have a role blocker of some variety. So knowing who should and should not be targeted helps them.

On the other hand - eh. Pretty desperate for anything to latch onto.

@Aya, I directly asked the mod if unannounced neighbors could be a thing this game. They said it would be bastard.
So 100% not the case.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Did the mod specify if it would reopen neighborhoods that had been closed?

[Yuuka Kazami]

Could you ask them?

[Yuuka Kazami]

I kinda want to vote Sanae.

Sigh. They're dead and they're town and I'm ignoring that because it's the kind of slip I'd make if I were scum replacing into a game and going for low cunning absolvement.

That said, funnily enough, it's kind of rare for that to actually be the case from personal experience.
But still, no.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Eh, it was relatable comparatively, so it gets into an empathy read, where you can't empathize with a pratfall but you can underestimate someone that does one.. Albeit there are some players that it's specifically scummy when they make general relatable observations mid-game.

[Yuuka Kazami]

I received a Dango from Larva. Pretty sure that means I'm confirmed town!

UwU

I mean, it's still well within WIFOM land as a relatively simple ability that can build rep between scum buds, but it's a large point in your favor. Especially given I doubt larva expected to flip here.

Vig death can easily have been the Dango target.

The dango gave role results tho.
Oh right.
If you're town they wouldn't know who was going to die.
Thanks for calling attention to that.
sigh.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Did you inherit your notes PT or were you given a new one?

[Yuuka Kazami]

Clownpiece appears almost everytime Eterntity mentions three or more players.

Plz.
Clown piece is also dead.

[Yuuka Kazami]

You’re affirming Dai and town reading Dai.
So your end game is relatively clear to see.

I'm confused what this means.

Kill Kaguya -> Be friends with Dai -> Vote me together. You're affirming them by using the same sort of reasoning, essentially validating their associative reads (which are wrong).

It probably doesn't matter but it annoys me to no end.

Empathy: but I’ve realized it’s just because it might be a non-AI puzzle they made intentionally to obscure and I hate those because they distract me from hunting.

I'm also unsure by what you mean here. How can someone intentionally obscure their alignment as town? Or what would a town-Kaguya be obscuring here, exactly?

For example, a player that doesn't want to be identified or meta guessed at may play how Kaguya is playing to obfuscate who they are. They're both town and interested in not being meta'd. Anonymous games are an opportunity to try new things or experience the game without prior existing relationships.

Why am I not dead?
Or at least being voted.

I'm still in the middle of re-adjusting my reads. The bit I posted about you looking partnered is just a small bit. There is a lot more to consider.

The Kagerou replacement is definitely giving me more time to think though.

Sure.

[Yuuka Kazami]

They're voting each other.

[Yuuka Kazami]

And they've been sniping at each other, but it has been a relatively recent development.
The funniest is still Aya/Koushi or Dai/Kaguya.

[Yuuka Kazami]

I'm already waiting on the mod for that one.

[Yuuka Kazami]

I need a vote count I guess lmao. What is it well closely

Yukka, which are you preferring?

Kaguya, thoughts on me?

Neither. Marisa is off the table because they've claimed an ability to clear others if we leave them be and Aya endorsed them.

Kaguya because I've been talking to them for hours and my suspicions are eroding gradually. It may just be an affect of all the talking though.

If Aya was not in the way and I only had one to choose this day phase, I'd probably vote Marisa. Nothing annoys me more than having to deal with someone that is either setting themselves up to fight me next day phase as scum or having to solve the game while being incorrectly pushed by town.

If they claim a cop guilty/role block and no deaths occur though, I will take it and forgive them for sinning because I quite enjoy 1v1 when the answer is handed to me.

My position on Dai is different because I just don't think their play makes sense as scum on the whole. This isn't as solid as it would be with a dead Kaguya, but their reach out was effective in this regard. I don't want to lose the advantage of hitting scum today by slapping their hand away...out of hand. Ba dum psh'.

[Yuuka Kazami]

I'm referring to Kaguya's hand, not Dai's.
Dai's hand has a knife in it.

[Yuuka Kazami]

I had access, but old-brain hadn't posted or used it, so it didn't show up in egosearch and I had to manually scroll the list of private topics to find it. (it was buried under a bunch of finished game PTs)

Oh

Are you certain they weren't just deleted by the mod?

[Yuuka Kazami]

The posts, I mean.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Where is that claim by Marisa?

Also, what exactly is your scumpool Yuuka?

Kagerou - Reisen - Marisa - Kaguya

Dai made it into being a town read. But not a clear like Aya and Koishi are.

[Yuuka Kazami]

I had access, but old-brain hadn't posted or used it, so it didn't show up in egosearch and I had to manually scroll the list of private topics to find it. (it was buried under a bunch of finished game PTs)

Oh

Are you certain they weren't just deleted by the mod?

Why is this rabbit hole relevant?

Town post notes. Because no masons. So neighbors are ambiguous.
Scum post in the hood. Maybe if one of the scum buddies piss them off they post in the notes. But not much.

[Yuuka Kazami]

There is a very famous very old player quote from the baker here that applies...

The only innocents are bodies.

You are allowed to be ominous because of mechanics. But don't abuse this privilege. It's bad for my heart.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Changing to Dai, Yuuka

VOTE: Dai

Lol.
Novel.

[Yuuka Kazami]

I'm going to always angle shoot notes PTs because real scum would write a fake memoir to win. *_*)/ and it's a part of being able to lie where you were at 3:00 PM on a weekend. Kidding.
But mostly, it's always a reaction test since it's a sensitive area to poke someone.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Where is your read of Reisen?

[Yuuka Kazami]

Why are you voting before you're caught up and have a solid sense of the game?

[Yuuka Kazami]

Why are you voting before you're caught up and have a solid sense of the game?

Because reading chronologically is not how I get reads. Discussing reads is how I get them. Hint.

You make reads by discussing reads? Context would be incredibly important in that regard, because if you don't know the story behind how each read developed you're not going to be able to identify false reads from real ones.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Koishi how do you feel about time travel?

All these squares make a circle.

[Yuuka Kazami]

That's like hundreds of pages ago, though?

But if you're trying to make a point, please just make it.

Same scumteam. Same kills. Stagnant game. Kill the smart ones.

Clown was force replaced. Alt slip.
Unless the scum team is exactly Kaguya, they have not capitalized on this idea except by choosing to lurk out. With the remaining town. It has made it difficult to sift through though and this is only one approach to night kills.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Well, I’m not going to interfere. Might as well let you get it out of your system.

You should probably check the chain of events though. Kaguya helpfully linked them while I just stood around.

[Yuuka Kazami]

They’re saying that scum are killing all the active players to create a stagnant game state.

[Yuuka Kazami]

I think.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Group think doesn’t happen if you do independent analysis of that context, other’s reads may influence you but that’s less group think and more band wagon. I guess you could compartmentalize but I’m getting outside of the parameters. Of a mafia conversation. Play style isn’t something I want to discuss mid game, only post game.

You can pretend not to have a grasp on other player’s reads and positions while still holding a good grasp of the context to see if they readily construct a similar narrative or if there’s problems.

I’m not familiar with that though.

[Yuuka Kazami]

lol @Dai, Yuuka theory.

[Yuuka Kazami]

What's yours?

I have 900 posts.
I keep repeating and repeating and slowly changing my reads from post to post and reread to reread.

The reasoning for Dai and I to be scum though doesn’t make sense on any level. It’s a *really* bad team proposal.

[Yuuka Kazami]

The again, in general team proposals are almost always wrong anyway.

Why even make one

[Yuuka Kazami]

I need to go look at Reisen’s claim brb. Just saying it out loud to redirect my focus after a nap.

[Yuuka Kazami]

But it’s silly.
That would require me to be in a neighborhood or show any level of coordination with them. It would require me to be familiar with the mechanics something I have made multiple mentions of professing ignorance to. I have been behind on almost every role reveal and always been catching up.

I didn’t even realize Clown commuted until yesterday and apparently I set this up days in advance on the off chance Dai got neighborized and then outright told that clown piece was a cop.

Not only that I decided to fake claim a self watch for no reason.

[Yuuka Kazami]

It boggles the mind that I could coach Dai through something like that.
Or that he commuted. Also note I have been the only player today who has pushed Dai.

Like, *at all*
And all I’ve gotten for it is a scum read. That, yes, they are not voting me for inexplicably. But it’s not because I’m scum with them.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Did Dai, die on purpose was that part of the plan or did they just lie about what their role did and just hoped that Kaguya wouldn’t immediately claim in the thread what happened at night?

Did it look like I was waiting around on a guilty? Or on Dai to come back?

Why would I assume in thread that I thought they had commuted, not died, when I would know what they claimed in the thread? Was it just some brilliant subterfuge?
How did I use the fact that clown piece visited me?
But just jumping at the first chance to let everyone know so they had more pieces left?

[Yuuka Kazami]

Because you know what vibe I have? I have the vibe of "Wolf lass replacement is a proud scumhunter who replaced into this game because they wanted decent odds of getting to solve a super complex game for thirst for more recognition." (Which isn't a bad thing!)


The thread has been wallowing in a sense of defeat for multiple phases, and the energy burst here was not really needed as scum-replacein. Why derail a good thing?

I get the sense that Marisa is troll-town, reminds me of an older anon game.

I get the sense that Kaguya is town who really wants to have the easy flavor angleshoot and is desperate to prove it.

Which leaves... Aya is confirmed town. I'm confirmed town.

That's {Dai, Reisen, Yuuka} that I don't feel ANY energy or momentum from. And as such you see the problem. Youve dithered tons, but not made any real movement or memorable moments lately. And that's kind of a problem when I weight the rest of your posting.

Reisen I'm ambivalent on the claim. And dai is... I dunno what I think of Dai on my own anymore, that's my homework to read the case with Aya.

This day has been really revealing. I feel like earlier reads are less relevant than actions in this specific phase.

What?

[Yuuka Kazami]

What does anything about that have to do with my case? How does that find scum?

You’ll have to forgive me, I know the case is wrong so I dismissed it out of hand. Does it seem like I does it seem like I feel threatened and you solved the puzzle? Am I just flailing here?

[Yuuka Kazami]

As a reminder Dai claimed what their role did to Kaguya *day 1*

There is literally no room for them to manuever with that pairing.

I would have lost my goddamn mind if they claimed that early.

Er, assuming they did. I only half remember. Kabul’s mentioning it. But the time line is fuzzy. Probably because I don’t actually know what they were doing because we’re not scum together!

[Yuuka Kazami]

What does anything about that have to do with my case? How does that find scum?

You’ll have to forgive me, I know the case is wrong so I dismissed it out of hand. Does it seem like I does it seem like I feel threatened and you solved the puzzle? Am I just flailing here?

I'd like to see you do something other than wallow and cry.

Well, that’s blatantly untrue and I don’t see what saying it accomplishes except to piss me off.

[Yuuka Kazami]

@koichi

I am Reisen udongein inaba

I have

Lunatic Gaze "Illusion Seeker"
Like Tenshi I’ll push actions on my target back to the next phase

And

"Lunatic Red Eyes"
I make someone go insane and their actions will self target that night

My active is mega phone shaped handgun and it will shut down a pt until the following day after its use

My passives are lunar refugee (ascetic) and esp waves. I send out waves and if they get picked up a hood gets made with anyone else that has moon ties. Which ended up just being other bunnies.

This is largely what I thought.
I wonder if gif just made all the OP and scummy roles town and made all the middling roles scum. Eh it’s too broad a generalization.

[Yuuka Kazami]

If pissing you off enables you to say someone's scum and why, then I guess it should help. Like I'm practically telling you what I need to hear to reconsider.

This is scum positioning, it’s taking the position of somehow who is reasonable and only asking for a little and it becomes their fault if they don’t comply.

Thing is though, I’ve been posting my thoughts and opinions all game.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Anyway, no. I’m not scum with Dai.
At least some of the other pairings make sense.
This one is extraordinarily wrong though.
Dai as scum very likely did not full claim their role to town Kaguya and their follow through, throughout the game does not line up with someone doing something other than what they said they were going to do. Every action by them is traceable. Their actions this day phase don’t make sense from a scum perspective.

They’re literally the only player I’ve made significant progress on today.

It still is nuts that Kaguya, Dai and clown all true claimed to each other.

The reason it doesn’t make sense to full claim to each other early is because it made them both accountable to each other throughout the entire game and circumstances will not permit that sort of constant without problems coming up hence why I thought a Kaguya/Dai team made sense in part because it gives them a lot more wiggle room and makes them accountable only to each other.
Kaguya has a strength to their mechanical understanding that could permit that sort of gameplay but I certainly don’t and I certainly haven’t exposited that sort of competence in thread.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Pick a theory and stick with it. I think that's the issue here, Yuuka, is that you've laid out basically every possible case for stuff, but haven't come to any decisions other than stating them aloud for effect.

Like, post an actual reads list for me. How do all your micro-theories stack up?

Didn’t I just do this. ._.
I’ve been theorying this entire game day. Every stray thought is in a thread somewhere. I can’t commit because I don’t *know* who the scum are. The best I can do is guess and hope one of the explanations is right.

Not to mention I haven’t done anything even close to comprehensive, I have narratives yes, but a correct one for the scum team?

Doubtful.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Pick a theory and stick with it. I think that's the issue here, Yuuka, is that you've laid out basically every possible case for stuff, but haven't come to any decisions other than stating them aloud for effect.

Like, post an actual reads list for me. How do all your micro-theories stack up?

Whatever. Theory is that Reisen’s theory of Kaguya/Yuuka activity and scum kill along with their general inactivity is a hitigarashi scum tell. their flavor fits the theme of a role blocker that we’ve been looking for that blocked Sanae.

It’s a terrible explanation and they’ve been coming off as honest. I also think their schedule simply doesn’t allow for this pace of the game so their excuses check out in that regard. And if scum reading me was a scum tell, more than half the game would be scum.

I guess of those they’re the only player that could conceivably have gone the “Make it seem like I could still be partners with Yuuka for a Miselim if I die.

I hate it.

Hate it.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Okay so do you think new-wolf is town or nah?

That's the question I need to have answered.

Commit to that read.

1. Pratfalls.
2. Tonal whiplash.
3. Defensive.
4. Tenshi shot, not great. But not clear.
5. Mod got back to me. Notes Pt is not meant to be part of the game so it was an actual angle shoot. My mistake.
6. Productive.
7. Quick to release results in general.
8. Unclear how much they read beforehand. Might be intentional.
9. Limited themselves and decided to tell us how they play. Posturing. Replacement, kind of have to as either alignment.
10. General logic around group think and independent reasoning is…really flawed. Maybe they’re just not articulate but it’s outside the bounds of the game in some ways but the self presentation makes some sense for either alignment.
11. Mega posts after replacing in are not unusual. Splash. But a decidedly scum sided one. But they may not know that.
12. Don’t actually think I buy their vote makes sense given mid catch up. It just doesn’t in a. General kind of why, they argued theory and tried to present it that way, but it’s more likely a spade is a spade and they just don’t care that much what each player’s alignment is. It’s an assumption though.

[Yuuka Kazami]

They just got here and the previous didn’t do much in recent memory. Expecting me to have an honest to god accurate opinion about them isn’t realistic.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Oh, and their general oinitial opinion about scum slowly killing off active people is the kind of general theory that people are just going to nod their heads to. But’s kind of air and the confidence doesn’t make sense especially given they just got here and didn’t even really know who died except less than an hour ago.

They know the general *vulnerabilities* of the game and the stagnancy that you’re worried about but what they’re using it for, how they’re turning the game by presenting it that way. I don’t know.

It implies the scum team does not care or don’t think you two are a threat but we’ve had one flip since Aya and Koushi got empirically cleared. With multiple mechanical and narrative possibilities. It was, in effect, a side brush at you.

How you find the truth in that mess is beyond me.

[Yuuka Kazami]

To be clear they had a general broad theory about how scum were killing meaning they had probably read your complaints about activity and decided that poking at that was a worthwhile use of their time.

But why, I just don’t know.

[Yuuka Kazami]

*sigh* let me read it. again. My brain turned off when you called kagerou a strapping young lad eager to save the world and make stuff up like it’s Tuesday and what’s the truth matter anyway?

[Yuuka Kazami]

…You don’t feel any energy or momentum from me when I went from confused at what was going on this day phase spending hours figuring it out with Kaguya, scum binning Kaguya. Only to slowly change my mind again over more hours of conversation.

Scum reading Dai only to flip around there.

Get the paranoia out of my system about aya/Koishi.

Come up with and then scrap
And then not scrap but sort of scrap a Kaguya/Dai team.

Then developed a read on Reisen that went back and forth depending on what post they were making.

Complained about Kagerou not doing much and being one of the few that at least *tried* to get something from them.

Like, yes, I’m not a rock in space that never slows down and only seems to gather speed like some kind of human conclusion maker that slowly lets cognitive bias just generate greater and greater mass, but it’s getting denser.

I imagine if I end up in elo I’ll be more forced to make or break it there and try to force the issue of irresolution.

But really I just get more and more complex with my interpretations of each player. My reads of each player is more intricate or reached some kind of conclusion, whether that be “empirically town” to “I don’t know because there are a lot of outstanding issues I’m working through”

It’s still a decision.
I could make a list of town scum but it would just have in complete binary but it would just have probably, and I could be fucking myself here,

Marisa, Reisen, Kagerou having the scum team.

I’ve spent a lot of time trying to figure out which
Actions may have been gambits. If Kaguya/Dai are trying to slip the net. I can’t come to a definitive conclusion but I am, I think if not closer at least getting there.

[Yuuka Kazami]

I could’ve just latched into Kaguya being the only player with the most pieces available to them that didn’t or hadn’t made a meaningful move toward the town win condition

Or kept harping on how Dai’s resurrection appears to be consequenceless, but instead I just believed them.

Oh, and I guess the Kaguya check ins have been bothering me, but pokes are only fair, but I don’t know those kind of paranoia checks are performative, might be reassurance seeking but they didn’t really have that need earlier, and their read of me isn’t really so high that you’d think they’d want the reassurance.

Than again. I’m only behind Dai last I checked so, I guess I’d expect that to wobble, even though I’ve only been posting more since then.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Tldr; I may have done nothing with what I learned about the world from the New York Times, but damnit, I have an informed opinion now!

[Yuuka Kazami]

I mean, I kind of said this on the tin I came into this day phase vulnerable and have been trying to show that I’m town through doing my best to solve out loud. My general opinion is that if I fight my way through all the people I don’t know are scum, I’ll have a decent shot at winning. I am trying to survive here.

If I was scum trying to survive I’d just give you what you want instead of being sincere with my thoughts.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Like, I think Kaguya’s WIM is high which makes me very nervous. But I just want to reach out take their hand and murder Kaveri, Reissn and Marisa.

And hope that town talked it out and it was just a happy coincidence that the two players with the higher WIM happened to be town and found each other.

It is *so* tempting to do that.

And there have been players that have pushed back against that sort of narrowing of the pool.

The game state from the more inactive remaining players only has much like new information coming from my and Kaguya’s slot so they know that their room is narrowing, while they just stood to the side and said their piece once.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Anyway, it’s fanciful. If you want me to just to believe Kaguya make it simple and then see where the dominoes fall I can do that. It’s not my preference, but I’m okay with it.

Well, no I’m not.

I guess that’s where I’m at from a forced decision stand point.

Kaguya, DAI town.

Murder Reisen, Kagerou, Marisa scum.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Kaveri

?

Kagerou

[Yuuka Kazami]

Won’t lie though, I only really make the best of it when it’s do or die time. It’s not do or die time yet. ~.~

[Yuuka Kazami]

Was the whole scum team voting Sanae.
At dead end.

Eh. Town led. Can’t use it.
It’s amusing that Kagerou, Reisen and Marisa didn’t vote them though. Then again, that lines up with general activity.

Meh

[Yuuka Kazami]

I read your post Koishi.
No. Kagerou if scum has plenty of reason to post content after replacing in. The supposition is ignoring where my and Kaguya’s reads were turning.

And, as a reminder they were largely the only dynamic reads besides Dai’s on Kaguya that happened. The reach out by Kaguya demands a response. As mentioned, if Kaguya is not scum the scum team was on the margins the entire day phase.

Replacements also take pride. It’s an assumption and an opinion that doesn’t work.

Well I mean it works as an opinion, but everyone’s gottem’

[Yuuka Kazami]

I mean, this was a player that started explaining their methodology unprompted. Ego is involved. It’s not bad to have one, but at minimum, no. No I disagree that Kagerou has little reason to post much as scum.

Yay I can make decisions.
On clear cut topics like this one.
/:

[Yuuka Kazami]

Mafia break time.

Please don’t make me read and respond directly to the Dai, Yuuka case.
I just saw that they unironically used the rule of three like someone filling out a square on a bingo board.
I don’t want to feel those feelings.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Presumably, a tryhard entry from scum means town was finally on the right path on their partner. So that would be reisen+Wolf as your call?

Is that presumable? I’m saying that town and scum wolf have some level of pride. Or else they wouldn’t even make large posts like that.

[Yuuka Kazami]

I’m still at those three. What they’ve, Kagerou, has specifically done since they replaced in bothers me, but not on the activity side of things, they’re a replacement. There is going to be significant variance.

Their “I gave them a chance, but alas, they dodged, sure they’ve made a duck load of posts with a bunch of positions, but they just wouldn’t directly talk to me about it. And as I hopefully pointed out, my style is to interact with people, therefore I am consistent because I said I wouldn’t really generate reads based off of history”

Then they proceeded to, I think make a history/context heavy case on Dai and I as the team. I really haven’t read it. But it sounds like it got into the weeds. So,
That’s weird and not consistent, but I mean, they were just giving me a primer on how they operate and I don’t think I’d really expect all their quirks, contradictions and behaviors to be nearly summarized like that.

But they gave themselves cover with it. ~.~

[Yuuka Kazami]

Neatly summarized like that*

[Yuuka Kazami]

It also depends if I buy that their independent read
Resulted in one town and one unknown that I’m leaning town on.
I’d much rather they had focused on finding just one scum or one or two town they’re convinced of.

But their existence isn’t dictated by my preferences.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Then they also proceeded to active lurk while I posted a bunch. Which contradicts their style, but I mean.
They probably were aware of how that would look and let it happen.

On the other hand I don’t know what other people notice.

[Yuuka Kazami]

1. There are long chains of posts this day phase where all I do is ask the first question that comes to mind. I spent a lot of time wrapping my head around the day’s events and figuring out roles
2. I’m not sure what I’m supposed to say to the evil comment. I guess the word choice, ‘evil’ is interesting in the sense that it’s kind of blatantly trying to make me sound unreasonable, even though I did not call them evil or that they were evil for doing so, or that in multiple posts I said “well, they replaced in so they kind of have to be this way” it’s just that I’ve been scum before and I’ve taken that sort of blameless position before where I asked them questions: “tried to read them they just darned dang wouldn’t cooperate so I killed them you all saw it!” So I recognize that position.
3. *turns down snark volume per gif request*
Ahem. No. No I do not expect you to do so in a vacuum. What I expect, is that you don’t go looking for excuses to vote people based off of some misguided sense of fairness or manners. I have 900 posts. Dumped everywhere. Asking me for reads when every post is a take or a read or a joke or a question or me trying to figure something out is invalidating.

[Yuuka Kazami]

I see a lot, hence all the posts. I just can’t make good sense of it all.

[Yuuka Kazami]

I neither think you’re virtue signaling nor do I think you’re a saint.

I’m saying the guide posts are there. They have already been given. Want a look into my mindset? Grab a post. I brain dump everywhere and most of my posts this game have been sincere and earnest.
Sometimes dismissive or snarky or discounting, but they’re there.

[Yuuka Kazami]

In the context of this game I just find a scum team with me and Dai in it, unlikely. Dismissive? Well, I know my alignment I’m going to dismiss it and then look at it again to see if the suspicion is sincere or not.

I need to sleep.

[Yuuka Kazami]

For clarity purposes I would like to know when you two, Kagiya and Dai, full claimed to each other.

Date please.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Whatever. Theory is that Reisen’s theory of Kaguya/Yuuka activity and scum kill along with their general inactivity is a hitigarashi scum tell.

What's a hitagarashi scumtell

Someone that applies a general principle e. g., “all scum vote 3rd on the wagon” to a specific player rather than using the context of the player’s actions. To read them.

[Yuuka Kazami]

For clarity purposes I would like to know when you two, Kagiya and Dai, full claimed to each other.

Date please.

I fullclaimed in the Misty Lake ~4 hours after the Sanae flip N2, Dai claims her active after that
Dai claimed a day ability that let her check Koishi/Reisen/Yuuka around two days into D1

Rest of Dai's claims would be in thread

Oh. This weakens my point somewhat and makes them slightly less accountable. But still more accountable than refusing to share.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Things go wrong yes. It’s optimistic and there’s no guarantee that scum don’t have powerful abilities that charge.

Impossible to really know tho.

[Yuuka Kazami]

We know scum have a role blocker. remaining.

But the other one hasn’t come up on anyone’s radar have they?
In terms of an objective trail.

[Yuuka Kazami]

@koichi

I am Reisen udongein inaba

I have

Lunatic Gaze "Illusion Seeker"
Like Tenshi I’ll push actions on my target back to the next phase

And

"Lunatic Red Eyes"
I make someone go insane and their actions will self target that night

My active is mega phone shaped handgun and it will shut down a pt until the following day after its use

My passives are lunar refugee (ascetic) and esp waves. I send out waves and if they get picked up a hood gets made with anyone else that has moon ties. Which ended up just being other bunnies.

Who were your targets?

[Yuuka Kazami]

Does that include scum Pts?

[Yuuka Kazami]

I guess I am indeed in kill one of Reisen/Kagerou and try to extract the truth from what Marisa claims. Or they make it easy by claiming a guilty equivalent on me like I asked if they're scum.

[Yuuka Kazami]

If Kagerou dies I get more information than if Reisen dies,
but I don't like the idea of leaving Reisen as the designated miselim. If I'm wrong there in a melo situation.
This is not me trying to obscure my positioning. I'm just considering.

Reisen's tone feels so wrong for scum. But tone reads are terrible. Especially at this stage of the game.
They basically only make sense as newbie scum. To me.

I do agree that Kaguya's Reisen take is weird.
They've had multiple takes where they seem to take things at face value that I'm not sure they should if they aren't forcing themselves to present themselves in a certain light or because the beliefs suit them. I'm not sure what's missing there.

[Yuuka Kazami]

I don't understand their reversal on reisen even after reading their reasoning.
It's pretty much "I'd expect a role blocker - like abilities to mess with people' but I wouldn't expect that to extend specifically to spell cards because that doesn't fit thematically"

It's close enough *psyduck* it doesn't need to reach that level of specification to be thematically appropriate I wouldn't expect such a close adherence either.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Ask the mod, not the thread.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Ask the mod, not the thread.

The wording is deliberately vague

Yes, this was true for a pretty much everyone, in fact the mod asked us to ask questions about our role as a means of confirming that we were here.
For the most part, they will answer specifics, or close enough. They wouldn't answer if Dai was dead when I asked them, but they did explain how my abilities worked when I asked.
For example, on the self-watch they did not specify if my result was for all visits for all days or just the one day,
it didn't hurt to ask, so I asked and they said just the day it was used.

Likewise, when I asked how the contagion watch worked or when my spell card failed (i did not know that spell cards were one shots, while actives were not because reading is tech), they made clear only after I asked that my ability had not worked, not that no one visited them.

It does not hurt to ask and I think trying the horses mouth first is better than asking players that barely understand their own roles. let alone yours.

[Yuuka Kazami]

I was about to say sorry, but I can't follow you into that assumption Kaguya.
But let me change that, because I wasn't aware that they were pulling from spell cards specifically from the game instead of just making up spell cards that fit the theme.

you've gone into the format breaks before and used it to push Marisa.
Let's see, without getting mod killed, how close we can determine the thematic elements fit the abilities in terms of a spell card and how rigid these rules are across each player's role pm.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Let me just ask GIF where the line is before I start sharing my names of my abilities and spell cards.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Oh, I can just use the flips, I dumb.
Lmk, if you want me to go into more detail. About mine though, it wouldn't be pertinent in my view or rather it shouldn't help progress the game any, but it can't hurt either

[Yuuka Kazami]

I was about to say sorry, but I can't follow you into that assumption Kaguya.
But let me change that, because I wasn't aware that they were pulling from spell cards specifically from the game instead of just making up spell cards that fit the theme.

you've gone into the format breaks before and used it to push Marisa.
Let's see, without getting mod killed, how close we can determine the thematic elements fit the abilities in terms of a spell card and how rigid these rules are across each player's role pm.

This doesn't feel right. This feels like you're searching for a way to break the guilty.

I'm not following what you mean? because I'm not thinking along the lines you're accusing me of thinking along the lines of.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Anyway, it just sounds like you're in politics mode and trying to undercut me for no other reason than

1. You think I'm scum.
2. You're scum trying to shade me.

I also, have been quite welcoming and would not fear a 1v1 with a guilty result from Marisa.
Fighting off fake guilties from scum is a personal strength.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Oh, I can just use the flips, I dumb.

Lmk, if you want me to go into more detail. About mine though, it wouldn't be pertinent in my view or rather it shouldn't help progress the game any, but it can't hurt either

[Yuuka Kazami]

So world creation press. It appears to be a large stone with

https://touhou.fandom.com/wiki/Keystone

Keystone "World Creation Press"
Cost

画面上空へ大きく高度を取り 巨大化させた要石を抱えて一気に落下して相手を押しつぶすかなり滅茶苦茶な技
Translation
Taking the great heights above the screen, Tenshi descends onto the opponent with an enlarged keystone in her arms. A wanton technique.

I would consider this thematically very close to the spell card and how the ability translate into the game.

Next.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Then why do you need information at all? Why don't you just lay yours on the table?

I already full claimed.

Let me back up.

1. Kaguya is speculating that Reisen is not the role blocker that blocked Sanae because there is not a spell card that would relate to it, in their available spell cards. Sanae was the designated miselim for the day, they intentionally blocked her from killing herself with an ability that blocked their spell card activation but not their active ability. Meaning the scum team used a block that only targeted the player's spell card.
2. I was doubtful that the mod would adhere so closely to this sort of rigid internal logic/rule and I doubly doubted that you can gauge the intent of a spell card and doubly doubted that sort of nuance wouldn't be lost in transcription to mafia. To me, at least, Reisen was likely to have a role that interferes with others given their theme. The nuance is between active abilities and spell card disruption.
3. I'm saying let's look at the existing evidence and see whether that sort of adherence to the roles and spell cards is consistent between spell cards, if it is, it may be more likely that Kaguya's conjecture is true, and less likely if there is inconsistency.

[Yuuka Kazami]

...I wonder what would have happened if I was targeted by lunar eyes while self watching.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Are you the topic police?

[Yuuka Kazami]

If I wanted to criticize how inefficient people are, I could make a full time job out of it.

[Yuuka Kazami]

If I wanted to criticize how inefficient people are, I could make a full time job out of it.

That's essentially what I do. We're at 5k posts. Anything that doesn't find scum is a problem.

I don't see how going through every role for links in flavor when most of us haven't seen the show helps. You have a notes PT.

My door is relevant for actual hunting.

That's near useless, bound to get on people's nerves and just looks like posturing or lamast.
I explained why I'm examining it. Because Kaguya is using the reasoning, not good enough for you?
Tough.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Agree, on Seiran, it's almost like the idea for the ability was a pun, because obviously "the eagle hits it target" means they don't miss.
I know Gif likes to play the touhou Iphone game, but there it causes attack down and references "the moon landing" As its origin or that first big step.

I suppose it could also be an astronomical reference. But yeah. That one doesn't cohere. - points toward rigid system.

[Yuuka Kazami]

The level of positional danger I'm talking about is e.g. Sanae d1 where the only reason she survived is cause she claimed she could treestump herself at night

Have you considered that you're too scared of repeating the past you're letting scum go?

What are the odds of two similar abilities both being town?

This game? High.

[Yuuka Kazami]

*snarkless*
I don't agree with the reasoning that overlapping roles increases the chance of one of the players being scum. This is based on personal experience and observation.

Why do you think overlapping roles are more likely to have one of the players being scum?

[Yuuka Kazami]

I'm a watcher.
Aya said she's a watcher.
I haven't a clue if it's true, but they're empirically town. So, more likely than not, I read my role pm wrong than that they're scum.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Is that fair? I asked you to do the same and you rebuffed me and said I dodged. Because you generate reads based on interactions. So it's not preferred based on my understanding of your world view.

[Yuuka Kazami]

*snarkless*
I don't agree with the reasoning that overlapping roles increases the chance of one of the players being scum. This is based on personal experience and observation.

Why do you think overlapping roles are more likely to have one of the players being scum?

respond to this please.

[Yuuka Kazami]

We don't have protection roles.

[Yuuka Kazami]

...............
>_>

[Yuuka Kazami]

Reisen, who did you target with your active each night and does it work on scum PT's or only neighborhoods?

[Yuuka Kazami]

Except for mine. Because I'm scum amirite.
So clearly at least one scum has a down side.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Pretty sure I noted that they had to jump out, when I questioned Kaguya about why they were clearing Dai for jumping out.
I just didn't think they *could* jump out. Dai does not need to jump out because I was shading them if we are partners. They could've just stayed in their shell to avoid it. It's not like I wasn't gunna try and carry from a Dai/Yuuka scum team perspective.

I also just outright assumed that they were a loud, um, I don't know what the role is. A player that just exits the game for an entire day phase.


Feel better Koushi, sorry you're having health issues.

[Yuuka Kazami]

I guess I could have coordinated with them.
But then I spent hours faking ignorance when apparently, I knew the whole time what they were discussing and what their roles were.
That would be hard to fake and come off as unnatural.
If you think how I was posting was unnatural there, I'd be pretty surprised.

[Yuuka Kazami]

I've made note of this idiosyncrasy of Kaguya's like, 5 times. Once I think last page.
But Kaguya/Yuuka
excludes
Dai/Yuuka.

[Yuuka Kazami]

I guess I could have coordinated with them.
But then I spent hours faking ignorance when apparently, I knew the whole time what they were discussing and what their roles were.
That would be hard to fake and come off as unnatural.
If you think how I was posting was unnatural there, I'd be pretty surprised.

That’s fair.

So this is the crossroads I’m at. Dai is still on the outside of my townreads.

I’m not too invested in yuuka/dai

I think kaguyas behavior comes off scummy, but a S/S hood with dai also doesn’t make sense to me. Not to mention they could just not mention the hood at all if so.

Aw, it's like seeing me 2 days ago.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Deadline:

(expired on 2024-04-07 14:43:23)

We should be deciding now if we're no limming or if we're gonna try to kill someone here

Koushi/Aya probably should make that call.
I probably just prefer killing Kagerou. Even though it will be difficult and annoying to push that one through.
And the push back if I'm wrong will be terrible and miserable. Esp. If Marisa claims a guilty on me right after.

On the otherhand. it makes the world easier. Because of Kagerou's pacing.
But this is politics, not scum hunting.

I simply don't know what to make of their constant failures when it comes to having read the flips both when they just replaced in and later throughout the day to the point of just not knowing what people's roles are and were.
I know they gave the excuse that they prefer to hunt in real time(short hand, I know it's more nuanced than that), but it didn't stop them from checking on Larvae associations. It also didn't stop them from engaging with mechanics and for someone that hates mechanics they seem to have a better grasp on some of the nuances on more recent topics than I do and you don't become proficient by disliking it. Not to mention, it seems they interpreted my talk with Kaguya as trying to undermine a game plan which is mistakes, not read based. They're strictly adhering to what they've said they'd do in some ways and not in others.

So they're a human being Yuuka, get to your point.

Yeah, I guess their opinion about role overlap sucks and I think that's scummy.

I guess the political arena is more their comfort zone so they try to corral people that try to solve through other means and methods. It's advantageous for them to pull me out of whatever current thoughts I'm having at the time and argue in their more familiar territory.
It's such a weird playstyle/blind spot.

[Yuuka Kazami]

I guess I just plain don't believe that someone that says they care about solving so much that they want to control what topics people discuss would also not read who flipped before engaging in it.

I know, they don't play temporally or whatever.
But, they're the one that said they don't play in a vacuum, not me.

[Yuuka Kazami]

I'll leave Kaguya, but I fully intend to use this account after this game to show you and everyone else that I can and do solve on a social level. Furthermore, that my social solves stand with the best of them if I get engagement and feedback.

My opinions are known so the ball is in conftowns court.

1. Your reads did not rely on engagement or feedback.
2. Your reads did not change with engagement or feedback.
3. Your level of confidence, given the foundation of your reads was not your specialty, was incongruent.

This whole thing can easily be replacement strangeness. But you never leaned on that. I’m not sure if you had, would’ve been good or not.

I can kind of hear Lukewarm whispering in my ear that look, they aren’t here to please people! They’re town you idiot! That’s the piece of the puzzle!

And to that I say.
Shush, you, you’re clumsy and careless and I wouldn’t have had to deal with half this shit if you hadn’t tripped up. Since you were correctly town reading me.

Also whole debacle with Kaguya, Dai, clown wouldn’t have happened. ~.~ though maybe that worked out okay somehow. I dunno I guess I’m town reading both of them but my brain keeps breaking every time I do it. Massive head ache. Probably fucking up so, so bad there. I know this is performative, but I’m trying to cope.

Also, no matter the play style, there are the basics underneath it. Facts that are necessary. You can start from anywhere but, is it really, *really?* townie not to look at the flips beforehand?
It’s the bare minimum. I hate lamist as a hunting tool because it’s silly but this is a rare example where it kind of makes sense to use it given their attitude not lining up.

[Yuuka Kazami]

VOTE: No lim

K.

@Kagerou, I’ve been engaging with you, shifting the goal posts to ‘you’re not engaging with me in the right way’
Is bleh.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Sure, they can be the low key gambit pair. To the loud gambit Kaguya/Dai and Aya/koishi scum pairings.

They take minor risks (Marisa with the fruit), (Dai with claiming one of their abilities to Kaguya early) and then I guess lying to them about what their visits or abilities actually do. Dai sees an opportunity to hop back into the game and does so pretending that they died, lie about the time limit to give themselves flexibility in why they didn’t jump in earlier. Etc etc.

I do think that the mod saying they were pulled out from a lake, drowning, implies they died though. But that’s mod speculation/not intended. Plus their disclaimer kind of neatly covers for that.
And I can see them just enjoying the mental image of a fairy being pulled out of the water.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Marisa’s kind of fallen to the wayside.
But yeah. Marisa just lies here about what their ability does to get a pass here etc.

it’s possible. I just find Dai’s play to be pretty convoluted for scum. They also sound pretty sincere.

[Yuuka Kazami]

It allows for the clown shot since they learn they can be shot through Kaguya.

Instead of hypothetical scum me. Which would be redundant, but doesn’t make it less likely.

[Yuuka Kazami]

1. I have solicited engagement, especially from you. You've said my request is political.
2. Transparently false, as shown by the debacle where I forgot Clownpiece was dead. I looked at Eternity's posts with fresh eyes.
3. My confidence increased over time with more data.

You're perfectly welcome to look at Eternity's posts and the VCs for a different conclusion but making walls that are nothing

but discredits repeatedly are going to have the opposite effect.

I will check back in a few hours to see if there's anything you'd like to talk about that's game related.

Now, I'll go back to leaving the thread for a few hours. Maybe more if I sleep.

Why?

[Yuuka Kazami]

I’ve been pretty willing to compromise.
Decision is made though.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Hey you forced me to make a decision on my reads but you didn’t force yourself to do that.
:<

You could have just said fuck it and murdered someone and everyone else would’ve fallen in line.

Dad blaming the mech speculation for the slow down is:

1. Old kagerou had job trouble.
2. Aya’s thing doesn’t seem related to mech spec.
3. koishi’s sick.
4. Reisen’s activity has neither increased nor decreased.
5. Marisa(????) dunno.
6. Dai’s activity has neither increased or decreased.
The mech spec is not the source of all evils.
Here.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Dad = Dai

[Yuuka Kazami]

Actually I’m okay with flash wagoning with an Aya sign off. Unless it’s Kagerou, I kind of just have to take responsibility if I’m wrong there.

To be clear here, no eliminating here, barring two deaths still leaves us In The same position and we’re still not in melo right? Just one away from melo.

[Yuuka Kazami]

I think some clutch stuff could happen here if one of Marisa/Reisen is town.

*prayer*

[Yuuka Kazami]

It feels to me like the slowdown is due to the domination of mechulation. Maybe I'm just projecting, though, because it has definitely discouraged me from trying to find time to post.

Regarding the game Day 4 game position, I imagine that we'll get some sort of note about how it is technically possible for the game to end with a Day 4 miselimination, because I can be a second Night 4 death.

I've found time to mech spec (which I've found fun, because I'm really bad with mech an almost never get an opportunity to even try to engage, it's one of the things I've appreciated about Kaguya's play even though it's hard to read). While also finding time for non mech spec. I've done both.

I really wouldn't have had a problem if you just didn't come along on the mech spec ride and just engaged with the other half of the game, though I understand the limited amount of time you have.

Unrelated, do you like being town or scum more Dai?

[Yuuka Kazami]

Not my preference. Be clear here, dai.
Do you want me to kill Dai. at the last minute.

Even though to me, Kagerou is probably scum?

[Yuuka Kazami]

Rather, be clear here Koushi*

[Yuuka Kazami]

Why can't I spell your name right.

[Yuuka Kazami]

K.
Then I'm not voting them.
I think they're town.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Good luck all.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Well that’s pretty helpful.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Did you ever say they were obvious town Marisa? Dai I mean.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Also, I couldn't check in earlier but I read the Kagerou replacement during the night and I townread them. So I am kinda hoping that killing Reisen and Yuuka wins.

Btw Yuuka you might want to claim your night results that pertain to me.

None, I full claimed already, I’m a non sequential self watcher and I had a spell card to watch contagion everyone.

Plus if I’m visited, they get told that I’m scum.
That’s it. No other abilities.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Where’s your clear?

[Yuuka Kazami]

Wow.
That is not a fucking clear.

[Yuuka Kazami]

I wasn’t informed of being role blocked.

[Yuuka Kazami]

So 1v1 sounds good to me. :3

[Yuuka Kazami]

Asked. I’m at work so I’ll be popping in and out.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Still in outbox.
No reply yet.

Marisa why would you activate your multiple vote ability now?

[Yuuka Kazami]

Oh, that’s kind of sad. Still that does not explain why they didn’t say something before activating it.
It makes them look bad.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Mod got back to me.
I did not receive anything.

[Yuuka Kazami]

VOTE: Marisa

Thanks for listening to my request Marisa. Very big of you.

[Yuuka Kazami]

….

That was easy.

[Yuuka Kazami]

I’m scum.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Easiest 1v1 I ever had.

[Yuuka Kazami]

No, I’m town lol.

Claiming a shot or hinting that victory is near as actual mafia isn’t my thing. No prides before the falls.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Kagerou visited me.
Melo.

That previous phase was.
Yeah. >.>
Yeah.

Kaguya has good cover with their reasoning.
Kagerou’s wait and see approach was not wrong, but it’s hard to know whether it was informed or merely experienced.
The only thing unusual about Reissn beside the fingers crossed comment, is that they were present.

Anyway, scum team saw an opportunity and took it, errors like that happen. But I am sorry it happened.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Since it’s melo I have an obligation to try my best.
First: no one vote. You all know this. So. It’s just the motions.
Second: claim your actions.

I self watched. So I know Kagerou visited me.
Pokes another hole in the PGO theory.

[Yuuka Kazami]

If you guys wanna popcorn, popcorn.

In general, rule of thumb here is to have Aya dictate the process, there was no real empirical doubt, but Koishi’s flip does settle the matter.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Hahahaha

[Yuuka Kazami]

Well, I’m happy to wait to see if the team is Kaguya, Reisen and leave this out of my hands.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Why do you think you received a message saying I was scum? You seemed careful of unexplained information yesterday. Today you’re less cautious, why?

[Yuuka Kazami]

This is melo you know, you’re supposed to be more cautious. Not less.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Moving on, I’m pretty much 50/50 on Kage/Kaguya.

Kaguya and Kagerou’s reactions yesterday are difficult for me to interpret.
Kaguya did not stop to consider why Marisa made the error of not speed eliminating. They were a very real option of who Marisa would dictate the elimination to if they wanted. It was goal directed behavior.

Kagerou’s play is an issue in that, in the context of the setting Marisa had just popped a consequence free elimination and they chose to wait, when Marisa if in error, had just given town an opportunity that could not be missed and they just seemed non-plussed. Which came off as informed.

Their play right now doesn’t make sense compared to their play yesterday. Also, a lot of criticism their way and they still haven’t read back.

Then again, I’m not sure why anyone would actually listen to criticism. It just doesn’t seem to be a human strength. But they did say “fair” to kaguya and then did nothing with that so.

Instinctually I don’t think they’re partners. But that needs a serious review

[Yuuka Kazami]

The more I think about it the less sense Kagerou makes with their vote here. This is easily the kind of thing someone who was cautious yesterday would have found suspicious today.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Then again they just posted and then I immediately replied and they haven’t responded which means either massive case income or one of those lovely reaction tests that won’t really affect my perception of them.

[Yuuka Kazami]

But I *am* much more conflicted on them than I was yesterday.
Simply because of Kaguya’s goal directed behavior yesterday.

It was, very much, a clean opportunity they took and largely blameless. The position is just too clean for me not to take it seriously

[Yuuka Kazami]

*blink* they’re either anon or they logged out.

Curse melo and people’s proactivity and distracting distractions during the make or break solving portion of the game.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Gunna check back in, in 5 hours I suppose.
And then find out if Kagerou is scum or not.

[Yuuka Kazami]

*spins*

Fuck this is game is out of my hands now.
Hate it.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Really.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Hello everybody

I have an ability that, when I’m visited by anyone they’re notified that I’m part of the scum team. Even non-investigative roles.

I have an additional power that appears insidious but is not.

I’m neither scum nor 3p.

Thanks.

This was my first post this game.

Not only that, but I just plain don’t believe you think that.

[Yuuka Kazami]

Anyone, literally anyone, would know that if your ability does not have an investigative than someone else is either responsible for the result or the player themselves has something that caused it.

Except no one claimed an ability that would provide you a result.

Waiting for someone to come in and confirm that without voting, then saying “oh hey by the way if anyone has a result that was me, it’s real please kill them”

And then you know, considering whether in melo you can believe them. Is a normal consideration.

…probably(?)

[Yuuka Kazami]

I’m not sure what to say to that. I just wanna get a solve out this day phase and hit scum. Or get owned. But losing can also be fun. Painful. But fun.

[Yuuka Kazami]

I’m not sure how to interpret Reisen’s am I dead? Post. I see that Marisa voted them then popped their ability so I get where they’re coming from. From that angle

I’m not sure if that’s the natural town response to that, since a town’s person usually would throw suspicion somewhere if they weren’t sure or struggle in some manner, perhaps with a read’s list or something. I think there may be an angle of possible relief and vague amusement in their fingers crossed post. But that’s reading into them, when it’s just not really there.

[Yuuka Kazami]

UNVOTE: Yuuka

I forgot

Legit struggling with you this game.
Let’s try it your way.
Kaguya had their turn.
What would you like to talk about?
And how would you like me to talk about it?