Mini 1939 - Organization XIII (Game Over)

[I Xemnas]

This is why

Saix will never answer that question

Big post coming tonight

Oh?

I can make him.

Saix will answer the question because to not answer it is an admission that he's attempting to obfuscate his skill level. There is almost no information gained other than that from that post, and it doesn't meaningfully narrow down his identity.

Honestly I'm surprised no one started this game with RQS given the fact that it WOULD actually be useful in this game, as opposed to most games.

You can make me?! Try.

Is there a reason not to answer?

Yes, there is. 2 reasons. First, I find that he is ordering me rather than asking. Second, I fail to see his point and what he is gonna get out of it.

First:
I would have gladly answered it. But challenging me like that - ordering me to comply instead of asking - I will not answer the question on principle.

Second:
I don't understand his premise for these two reasons:
1. If I have been projecting myself as inexperienced, there was no reason for me to crack the facade. Especially over a conversation with Xaldin where I was not at all under the pressure. If you go back to that convo, you will see that Vex/Axel/someone had in fact slotted me as someone who didn't even read that the night was skipped. So, if I really wanted to maintain my facade, I would have let them believe that.
2. The whole premise is built on me behaving in an inexperiened manner on D1. I said scums are less likely to be logical. Contentious as that may sound, where is an attempt to solicit my fucking response to that and understand what I think? Instead, they made up their mind by the end of D1 that I am a VI. I have no prblem if someone thinks of me as a moron, but now if they suddenly start thinking of me as a genius, it's their confusion and problem to sort out, not mine. And since it's their problem, the least they can do is ask nicely. If they can't even do that, and instead are thumping their chest how not responding to their question is a further indication of my scumminess, they will be ignored just as their slot was ignored a few pages ago.

I think it's really dumb and fascist to think that there's one simple rulebook to play mafia. You may think of my style as amateurish, but have the maturity to understand that everyone finds their own rules and tools. I had the exact same response as what Marlux posted, but I didn't type it coz it read damn defensive coming from me. I have learnt to keep my defensive attitude in check coz each of my defensive replies are taken out of context and made to look as if these defensive replies are now the reason why I am scum. I have largely succeeded in not yielding to provocation, and I would like to keep it like that. Not only that it leads to my slot's impending lynch, it also spoils the whole fun. So it's best to ignore people like Vex.

That's the window into your mindset that I needed. Thanks. It's also a townpost IMO.

[II Xigbar]

For the first time on Day 2 I have the night properly free to spend on this.

Case tonight.

[V Lexaeus]

Can you explain why you think that's a townpost?

To me, it just reads like him being obstinate, which is a personality/playstyle thing rather than an alignment thing.

[I Xemnas]

The whole post comes off town to me but this part in particular:

I have learnt to keep my defensive attitude in check coz each of my defensive replies are taken out of context and made to look as if these defensive replies are now the reason why I am scum. I have largely succeeded in not yielding to provocation, and I would like to keep it like that. Not only that it leads to my slot's impending lynch, it also spoils the whole fun. So it's best to ignore people like Vex.

Is coming from someone who expects to be misunderstood and expects scum to take advantage of town reactions to their playstyle. It's almost the opposite of how I'd expect a player as scum to use reactions to their playstyle as a reason for being erroneously scumread.

I have no idea who Saix is, but this part of the post reminded me of another player I've met who is self-aware about how their style strikes others, isn't apologetic about being who they are, but attempts to nip it in the bud when they see someone hewing to one of the common reactions to how they play. In my mind it snapped together several of my reactions to other posts they made. There's a consistency and coherence to their play in this game. It took this post for me to bring that into focus.

[VIII Axel]

I know I owe a longer post but I wholy disagree but respect Xemnas' opinion. Reeks of scum fustration.

[I Xemnas]

It reeks of some of the same frustration you've expressed in this game, IMO.

[I Xemnas]

This game. So slow.

[II Xigbar]

Nope no case coming. No energy for mafia I guess.

[VII Saix]

If someone targets me at night, they will be killed automatically.
I can kill someone at night, but if I choose to do so, I will forfeit the first ability.
So, in effect, I have only one functional power but been given the option to choose out of the two.

Lynching is the only likely way I will be shown the door, unless the scum can afford to reduce by 1. I can go to the endgame if people believe me.

[VII Saix]

*If someone targets me at night for a nightkill

[I Xemnas]

Interesting.

Using your ability as a vig would basically conftown you, and it might be the best thing, really. It's the kind of role that makes town paranoid as fuck and makes scum quite hungry to lynch you.

I don't think a scum player would claim this.

[I Xemnas]

Nope no case coming. No energy for mafia I guess.

This is what I stayed up late for.

[II Xigbar]

I am actually really sorry. I understand that people have high expectations of me. I just can't be who I want to be right now.

[I Xemnas]

Thoughts about the claim?

[I Xemnas]

I get not being able to do mafia like you wish to.

We have about 4 days left and two players in prod range. My participation may be spotty for the next couple days but I'll do my best to stay caught up.

[II Xigbar]

Saix has been one of my top townreads for most of the game. The claim only matters in the sense that I want to persuade him to shoot Axel or Zexion after we lynch Vexen.

I expect that he'll attempt to shoot me though so *shrug*

[VIII Axel]

Saix's lynch boner for me is too big to shoot you.

vote: Zexion

[XIII Roxas]

Bleh I honestly lack the energy to do something tonight but I'm obligated to try.

Maybe they aren't in an explainy mood.

While this is a fair burn, the thing is that other players have no reason to lack an explainy mood whereas I have one.

Bonus points if you actually engage me! I've made posts with content in them about Lex. You could engage them.

I don't recall.

You could explain why 1058 is town!

I normally would but right now I just...literally don't have the energy/ability to do so. Like, you're actually doing exactly the thing I need in exactly the way I'd need to be in a mood to answer it. I don't feel like brushing it off. I don't feel like dismissing it. I feel like answering it. But right now I can't which is why I feel so shitty because you just did something I've been waiting ages for someone to do and yet now that it's actually been done I currently can't actually engage you in it.

Looking forward to Roxas grabbing one sentence from this post and calling it a scumclaim.

Actually...the opposite.

I also think because of what Roxas said I am less inclined to think Saix is now scum. But meh. Keeping my vote there still.

[XIII Roxas]

(Basically I'm losing confidence in most of my reads but none more so than the Luxord scumread I had. I'm not sure how to vocalize this right now. I'm also not really sure I want to. I mean I can be stubborn but I'm more than willing to back down from a push and more than willing to admit I'm wrong but it's not just that. It's just that. Gah. Words aren't there. The implications of being wrong I guess? That seems like a shitty way of putting it though.)

[XIII Roxas]

Can't tell if Roxas is actually just open wolfing or if RL is making it seem that way

?????
I mean yeah I've been having lots of things happen in real life buuuuuuut...there's literally no realm where I look like scum? Yet alone "openly scum". Yes as scum I will be cheeky but this game the only cheekiness I've had is stuff I have good reason to be cheeky about (e.g. my claim).

I feel like half of your posts directed at me have just been a thinly veiled attempt to fuck with me

For better or for worse that's an inherent part of Zexion's (town?)game. (I don't actually know if Zexion does it as scum but I know Zexion does it as town, so.)

It would go a long way if people were to start trying to fight things on some kind of substantive level instead of just fanciful gut feels. Lol.

The problem is. That's all I've got right now. Normally. Normally I would augment the "fanciful gut feels" with substantive stuff. Not logic proper because I'm allergic to good explanations but more nuanced than just feeling. But right now. I don't have anything coherent.

Every scumteam that I've made has made sense at the time, where I could see the narrative where all of them were scum.
Yet every time, I am then given bit by bit reason to significantly question that conclusion, until it utterly falls apart and my fanciful gut feels tell me that it was wrong, it was very very VERY wrong and that I need to find something else. And for the most part I've been doing so, yet. I'm stuck, if that makes sense.

So fucking tempted to vote for Vex. Two different people in the same slot finding me suspicious? That's a big, big coincidence. I mean, either I am generally very scummy such that two independent people filling the same slot find me scummy, or that slot is scum as fuck.

But it's Xigbar today. Needs to go for his D1 push. This is exactly how that idiot plays, if I have got them right.

[XIII Roxas]

her paranoia on me in particular seemed fake.

You were an early scumread.
You also prefer playing as scum and have a very very very strong scumgame.
These are what I meant by reservations.

You are otherwise town.
I don't see how you can even really call that paranoia.
It's more like slow to trust. You're quite aware I'll often write your slot off as town and not bother sorting it...but both because this is an alt game and because this is a mini, instead I am giving a more honest read. And I'm not going to lie about my read on you and call you infallible town when you're simply not that strong of a townread. You

are

a townread. But it is a townread with reservations and damn right I have them because I have every fucking reason to have reservations.

[XIII Roxas]

Okay so I don't have the words to vocalize the why but at this point I absolutely do need to vocalize: 1428 is town. This is not the only post of Luxord's which is town in that area mind you. Most of them area, really. But while a fair number of Luxord's posts are town, they've mostly been "passively override my mental file on reads" town, in that they are things I processed as being town but didn't feel a particularly strong need/desire to vocalize as town because it just didn't feel like it was appropriate. (I can't word well.)

But that post. I can't just walk on by it. I need to draw attention to it. Because it is town. The tone. The nuance in the expression of ideas. The thought process there. It's a post which I fully know people will wonder why the fuck I think is town because people on a glance might think it's not alignment indicative. But they couldn't be more wrong. That post bleeds town, and the most frustrating thing is I can't really find the right words to properly explain it.

It's just. The kind of thing that I guess is. "Takes one to know one"? Luxord displays a high level of self-awareness and self-reflection and is just going off in a way which is giving a direct insight into Luxord's mind during the game and it's not an agenda I see. It's town.

[XIII Roxas]

Roxas' self-assurance and ability to form reads quickly seems to be a cyclic thing. My impression of her recent play in other games is that she's been in uncertainty mode. In this game, she's projecting a lot of certainty about her reads. This transition seems relatively fast.

You got it literally backwards?
I mean. You're right that I am an incredibly cyclic player. But I haven't been in uncertainty mode in months. The opposite, I've been spewing confidence strongly in every single game I can recall...

except

for this one. You're saying I'm confident in this game but what the fuck gave you that impression it's literally the opposite. (Yes I know I'm making your point for you anyway just the other way around because this game being uncertainty when other games are certainty does stick out but. I can't let this stand.)

Not being explainy seems odd, mostly because she's not explaining the lack of explainyness in more detail, and the lack of explaining reads is usually hand-in-hand with having unsure reads not strong ones. Not always, but often.

This is an alt game.

I am still trying to maintain some semblance of anonymity. Being explainy in more detail is something which would give away my identity unambiguously. In particular, there's one comment I'd love to make about a lot of my lack of explaining (and it's actually frustrating that I can't make that comment because it'd explain so much yet reveal too much), yet I can't because if I did then there would be absolutely zero ambiguity of who I am whatsoever.

And yes, people can have and are still getting it wrong so I'm not about to help them out by giving them that lead. This is an alt game. I didn't really bother to try and hide my identity (I am quite skilled at doing so when I try), but I'm also not going to blatantly advertise it (at least not intentionally), either. So while I'd love to explain my lack of explainyness more, I literally can't.

[XIII Roxas]

We share 2/3 of our scumreads. Why don't you get past the fact that you feel the urge to policy lynch me and instead direct your energy at lynching Vexscum?

Vex, not yet. Lynch Axel with me. At best he is a VT now that he has used his power (so he says).

[XIII Roxas]

Case tonight.

Xigbar, for someone who has one of (if not the) best scumgames on the entire site you sure are a bad liar.