Mini 1939 - Organization XIII (Game Over)


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Post Post #200 (ISO) » Thu Aug 17, 2017 12:44 am

Post by IX Demyx »

Spoiler: Page 1
In post 5, II Xigbar wrote:VOTE: Xaldin

:cop:
Town.
In post 6, IV Vexen wrote:VOTE: marluxia

its a shame this character is relegated to only being in handhelds...
Scum?
In post 7, V Lexaeus wrote:
In post 6, IV Vexen wrote:VOTE: marluxia

its a shame this character is relegated to only being in handhelds...
There's Re: Chain of Memories! And absent silouhettes if you count those.

VOTE: Larxene
Likely not partners with Vexen.
In post 9, XII Larxene wrote:
In post 7, V Lexaeus wrote:
In post 6, IV Vexen wrote:VOTE: marluxia

its a shame this character is relegated to only being in handhelds...
There's Re: Chain of Memories! And absent silouhettes if you count those.

VOTE: Larxene
We're in the same boat, Vexen. At least they remembered me for my winning personality~

VOTE: Lexaeus

I'm Investigative-Immune, losers.
Town.
In post 18, X Luxord wrote:VOTE: Xigbar
Also, I really should have found out whether or not the game would reveal all alts at the end. Oh well.
SAME. Although I figure I'll be obvious enough to anyone that knows me anyway.
Sadly, this post says nothing about your alignment.
In post 24, V Lexaeus wrote:
In post 21, II Xigbar wrote:
In post 20, V Lexaeus wrote:
In post 17, XII Larxene wrote:
In post 13, V Lexaeus wrote:Investigative-immune, eh?
Sounds like a GF if ya ask me
Sounds like someone doesn't know what I'm claiming! If I was a Godfather a cop would get a town result on me~

And sure, if you want to say it in a totally confusing way. Immune to investigations, that's it. They just fail.
Yes, I understand what you mean.
My point is, semantics aside, Cops are useless on you, just like on a GF, albeit somewhat less powerful.
How does that help a loyal member of the Organization? It doesn't.

Therefore, you're a traitor.
Wait why are they a traitor as opposed to a full fledged scum member?
Sorry, my bad. They are full fledged scum, I just meant traitor as in the flavor.
Should have said treacherous or just scum like I did the first time.
Really doubt this push as a whole comes from scum.
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Post Post #201 (ISO) » Thu Aug 17, 2017 1:14 am

Post by IX Demyx »

Spoiler: Page 2
In post 25, XII Larxene wrote:
In post 21, II Xigbar wrote:Wait why are they a traitor as opposed to a full fledged scum member?
Because we betrayed the Organization, duh! Vexen and my boy Marluxia know what's up.
In the off chance Larxene is scum; doubt this is the full scum team, but also doubt this is all town.
Bet would be on Vexen as scum with Marluxia the town.
Noting this for later but will only bother expanding if I start thinking there's a chance of Larxene being scum.
Just really believe it to be a non issue right now and unlikely.
In post 29, V Lexaeus wrote:
In post 23, XII Larxene wrote:
In post 20, V Lexaeus wrote:Yes, I understand what you mean.
My point is, semantics aside, Cops are useless on you, just like on a GF, albeit somewhat less powerful.
How does that help a loyal member of the Organization? It doesn't.

Therefore, you're a traitor.
Have you, like, heard of Millers, or...
A valid point.

Though I feel this is actually worse than a Miller, I suppose you probably wouldn't have claimed it if you wanted to ruin a cop's night...
Very well
UNVOTE:
Also think this backing off is town indicative.
This isn't a hardline stance but I believe scum would have more of an idea what they want to do with that push and town is just trying to produce content at that stage of the game; Lexaeus backing off when proven to be pushing a non issue feels more like the latter in that there was no real scumread but a push for something tangible. When you can't get that it's hard to maintain a fake read just for content's sake, where I think scum would be more inclined to try for a level of consistency that this push just...lacks.
In post 30, XIII Roxas wrote:Hmm. I have a very tricky role to successfully utilize and I am not quite sure what the optimal strategy for this would be. However, I think that this may be a good start.

If we have investigatives in the game they should target me.


I have good reason to ask for this, as it would be an incredible boon to our odds of winning if I become confirmed town.

I can fullclaim if players deem the details necessary.
I hate this post with a fiery passion.
Unfortunately, I hate this post in a way that I think it's a town post.
In post 32, XIII Roxas wrote:VOTE: Luxord.
Larxene is obviously town.
Vexen's entrance makes me believe he is town, but we shall see.
Lexaeus and Xixbar I'll need more to make a firm judgment call on.

However, Luxord is just scum.
This is awful all around in that I feel every read is made up on the spot.
That said, I still think this is more likely town than not. I don't think scum makes this post at this point in the game.
In post 33, X Luxord wrote:Why's that?
Also, is it just me or is the whole secret alt thing making a disproportionate amount of people use good grammar?
Not at all.
Only people with good grammar signed up for the game. :good:
In post 37, II Xigbar wrote:VOTE: Roxas

Both posts felt played up. Larxene is definitely not obvtown, Luxord is definitely not obvscum.
Xigbar is seeing what I hate about the Roxas posts and I think is more likely town for it.
Disagree with the conclusion but could easily see how anyone would come to that conclusion, especially if you were inclined to read off a mixture of feels/gut and whether reads make sense on a personal level.
I do feel more could have been made to reach out to Roxas to see what he was thinking but I believe that Xigbar's intentions are pure here and I certainly don't fault him for the vote.
In post 47, VI Zexion wrote:It's not the stance without context that I find scummy, it's how you went about reaching those stances and how you're arguing them. Trying to justify your positions from an abstract standpoint is irrelevant to your content in this game.

You immediately jumped on the invest-immune claim as if it were a scumclaim when there is nothing at this point to indicate that being the case, yes? No attempts to sort the claim, no attempts sort Larxene by play, no reasonable direction to your push. (Then drop it immediately when Larxene reminds you that nu is a thing that exists.) I think that's scummy.

Immediately following this you accept Roxas's claim at face value, no sign of paranoia, and declare that he shouldn't be lynched today. Again, no attempt to sort Roxas by play. You've essentially surrendered all right to sort him until day two. There is no reasonable way you can take this stance as town. Any of us (except Larxene) could presumably be investigated. Should we lynch no one because there's an investigative that could prove their innocence?

Your treatment of the two claims is meaningfully different. What I see from you right now is kicking up dust, making wild assumptions and taking stances that have no clear benefit to town. If you are town you need to start thinking through what you're doing quite a bit more than what you are. You aren't helping people sort you this way and you don't seem to be sorting other slots either.
I do believe this is a good post with good points.
That said, I also believe it's jumping the gun on the early posts. I believe there to be a lot more ambiguity than you're painting this as, but I do feel as though you believe in your push here at least to some extent.
I also think taking the moral high ground here is more likely to come from town than scum most of the time. The last paragraph in particular.
In post 48, III Xaldin wrote:
In post 45, VI Zexion wrote:
In post 40, V Lexaeus wrote:While I don't necessarily disagree with that Roxas post, Larxene's role tells us there is almost definitely an investigative who can check him.
And since he asked so kindly........ I say we probably shouldn't lynch him today.
Pretty bizarre thing to say considering we're on page 2. Lexaeus's whole approach to the invest-immune claim is scummy noise-making and this kind of stance on Roxas has equally as little town motivation and plenty of scum motivation. Roxas's entrance feels super canned. Scumreading both slots pretty comfortably right now.

Vote: Roxas

VIII Axel wrote:
In post 37, II Xigbar wrote:Both posts felt played up.
I don't see the motivation here.
Care to finish that thought?
You seem to be talking more about Laxeus yet voting Roxas, Pray tell me young one, why do you supposed a traitor would ask to be investigated ? What is the scum motivation you are seeing ?

Same question goes to you as well xigbar.
In post 49, III Xaldin wrote:Unless you supposed traitors have some sort of godfather which would be most unifitting for Roxas in all honesty.
This could VERY easily be scum either with Roxas or without.
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Post Post #202 (ISO) » Thu Aug 17, 2017 1:17 am

Post by IX Demyx »

In post 51, X Luxord wrote:VOTE: 6 Zex
As someone who has no flavor knowledge, all of the names are frustratingly similar.
I
really
want to townread this.
I really really do.
Yet as with all prior posts of yours.
It's frustratingly null.

What's worse is that I realize I want to townread you as some kind of damsel-in-distress with regards to flavor.
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Post Post #203 (ISO) » Thu Aug 17, 2017 1:19 am

Post by IX Demyx »

Spoiler:
In post 52, VI Zexion wrote:
In post 48, III Xaldin wrote:You seem to be talking more about Laxeus yet voting Roxas, Pray tell me young one, why do you supposed a traitor would ask to be investigated ? What is the scum motivation you are seeing ?

Same question goes to you as well xigbar.
I'm not really interested in the claim, it's null as far as I'm concerned. If he's scum then scum presumably have some way to manipulate investigative actions which would be supported by there already being an invest-immune claim on the board. My scumreads on the two slots are more or less equal, there's already a vote on Roxas so my vote there is more useful.

Going to explain that vote Luxord? What's your Roxas read?
In post 53, V Lexaeus wrote:I am sorting people by play.

It isn't the existence of negative utility Town roles that made me drop that push on Larxene. Hell, I had a whole two paragraphs written up about how this wasn't equivalent to a Miller, and she could still be scum.
I deleted that and unvoted because while writing that post I realized: Scum with a role that screws with investigation wants to actually use it. By claiming, she now does Not get to use it. I expressed this before my unvote.

As for Roxas... He's a special case. In flavor, he's the key (literally) to the Organization's entire scheme until the Oblivion Squad screws it up vying for power, and he runs away.

Alignments do not necessarily match flavor (except for Xemnas I suppose), but it does seem like the role assignments are based on it. So when Roxas claims a super powerful role that benefits immensely from being cop cleared? I believe him, and don't want to waste the effort pushing him with a cop result incoming, and especially don't want to risk a mislynch without getting that sorted.


Believe both of these to be extremely likely to come from town over scum.
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Post Post #204 (ISO) » Thu Aug 17, 2017 1:32 am

Post by VI Zexion »

@Xaldin
I basically disagree that Larxene's tone in response to being challenged on the claim is null - I think there's some pretty clear scum motivation in attacking people who don't just accept the claim at face value; you could argue that it's just personality indicative or part of the roleplay that Larxene seems to be doing or whatever and I don't think it's a strong point for that reason but I don't think you can just discard it out of hand. Think you've also basically just dismissed the other points without engaging with them on an intellectual level at all; the crux of it is that Larxene's reads are badly formed and badly held and none of it feels very town - you can disagree with the way that's expressed but I don't think it's very reasonable to just say "those points are bad there's nothing wrong with Larxene" and not engage with the read beyond that. What is your read on Larxene?

Part two of this is... what are you doing with your vote? What are any of your reads besides Xigbar? Why is Xigbar even a scumread? Don't think you've explained anything at all and I'm starting to wonder which of my scumreads might be wrong if you're scum here because is frankly pretty awful from you - I'm presuming you're scumreading Luxord here? Literally zero nuance in your stances here that might help me see that you've put thought into your reads or the gamestate overall at this point.


@Larxene
why does my Saïx read alone make you want to call me town? Not sure that makes a lot of sense to me since it was the one read I explained the *least* comparative to how strongly I feel about it. Not sure what you mean by "not enough" with regard to the scumreads on you; if there's something you think we're missing in your read on you then I think you should probably address that and talk to us about it rather than just saying what feels like essentially "can't touch this". I assure you my scumread on your slot is very real and I think the reasoning for it is pretty decent right now; don't at all like the implication that it's going to take a big case and a big push to take you down.

Basically dislike your lack of critical engagement with any of your reads; your reaction to Luxord's post in particular is basically a big nothing, you say you want more than a catchup but you haven't engaged with him on anything in a way that might encourage that; you've not basically anything to encourage content from any slot except arguably voting Roxas - a vote that comes from you with basically no progression; you went from being basically sure that Roxas was town for no reasoning at all to now scumreading them and wagoning them without going into why beyond calling up pretty shallow reasoning that you'd ignored up until that time. Really really struggling to see your slot as town right now in any universe.


@Luxord
if you're unhappy with people calling you out for waffling then... maybe do a little less waffling? Would really like a response to and just some clarity on what your stances / reads actually are at this stage in the game and how you arrived at them; the "stream of consciousness" stuff really doesn't work when we actually just can't follow your thoughts at all. You really need to take some hard stances and explain things in a cogent way if you're town here because what you're doing right now isn't working at all.


@Xemnas
talk to me about your Roxas read please? Don't think that townreading the slot because scum wouldn't want to hard stances early is particularly good reasoning; think it's probably ultimately just playstyle; this is my weakest scumread but it's definitely the one that I'm most worried about endgaming if it's scum so I'm pretty concerned with not letting any lazy reasoning by on townreads there; if you think there's something lacking in the reasoning I expressed in then I'd definitely like to hear why you think that; somewhat struggle to see the kind of aggressive hard defending that's come out of that slot coming from town at the moment.

Definitely disagree that outing the invest-immune is something to townread even a little bit; I think that if Larxene is the type of player to out that kind of thing then she's the type of player to do it as either alignment and don't think there's strong reasoning to argue otherwise.

What's your read on Xaldin?


@Lexaeus
you're really going to have to provide good reasoning for townreading Axel here because at this point it feels like they're not even playing the same game as anyone else; all their content is completely irrelevant, there's literally not a shred of town in any of their posts and I am absolutely baffled as to how you can't see that. Please show me how you are not scumreading that slot because that just makes zero sense to me. Saying they're conf!biased does nothing for me; your reasoning for all your reads has been categorically vacant and I think you need to do a lot more to show the work behind them than what you've been doing because it's getting a little bit ridiciulous by now.


@Xigbar
is / addressed to me? Don't understand what you mean by picking someone who you're scumreading to declare obvtown there.


--

Okay half my altguesses just went out the window with Demyx's entry and now I'm confused on that front lmao. Had something else to say but now it's gone.
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Post Post #205 (ISO) » Thu Aug 17, 2017 1:39 am

Post by IX Demyx »

In post 54, X Luxord wrote:There's not too much to explain. I'm not coming in with any real scumreads so I'm just poking and prodding at people I consider voteable. Crux of it is really that I just don't agree with your reads. If ever I earnestly push you, I'd explain it.

As for 13 Roxas, the less conviction you actually have in your scumread, the more favorably I see you. I don't actually think there's any real urgency in sorting him nor is there any real reason to scumread him. With the claim, I'm unwilling to consider 13 as a D1 lynch. (Of course, if he doesn't produce results that are unambiguously favorable we look more critically.)
I actually really like this for the honesty in the post so there's that.
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Post Post #206 (ISO) » Thu Aug 17, 2017 1:40 am

Post by IX Demyx »

In post 204, VI Zexion wrote:Okay half my altguesses just went out the window with Demyx's entry and now I'm confused on that front lmao. Had something else to say but now it's gone.
Awww did I really ping you for that many people so far? <3 Thanks, boo.
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Post Post #207 (ISO) » Thu Aug 17, 2017 1:48 am

Post by VI Zexion »

Just one, actually.
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Post Post #208 (ISO) » Thu Aug 17, 2017 1:49 am

Post by IX Demyx »

In post 57, VI Zexion wrote:I think his entrance lacked thought.
Let's have a heart to heart here.
Do you believe that when someone knows they're a treacherous fuck they throw out any post without thought?
Do you believe they do so with an entrance post 'specially?
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Post Post #209 (ISO) » Thu Aug 17, 2017 1:50 am

Post by IX Demyx »

In post 207, VI Zexion wrote:Just one, actually.
So you only had two guesses for alts in the game? :P You said half your alt guesses got thrown out.
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Post Post #210 (ISO) » Thu Aug 17, 2017 1:52 am

Post by IX Demyx »

By the Gods... I still REALLY love my avatar.
Mayhaps a little too much. :shifty:
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Post Post #211 (ISO) » Thu Aug 17, 2017 1:53 am

Post by IX Demyx »

In post 59, VI Zexion wrote:Nothing else you want to talk about?
Was there anything in particular you wanted to talk about at this stage?
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Post Post #212 (ISO) » Thu Aug 17, 2017 2:02 am

Post by IX Demyx »

Spoiler:
In post 64, X Luxord wrote:You're right, my ISO has been basically all ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.
I can copy all of my thoughts on everyone here, but my heart really isn't into anything regarding scumhunting yet. Like, I won't be proactive now but I think it can be assumed that I will be eventually? I really don't think there are any motivations to be found by my lack of productivity.

Here's a direct (reformatted from Excel) copy of my notes, with one omission. (Only noting this so if I want to bring it up later, people know.)

2 Xigbar:
Reaction to a relatively calm voteswitch by me in RVS. Weird "if you were scum" Q to 12 in P26. Other than this, gut strongly says town mindset-- but based on not much concrete.

4 Vexen:
Flavor entrance, very standard, empty ISO, voteable.

5 Lexaeus:
Pushes 12 for inv-immune. Probably just in a frivolous/reac-test way. I tend towards townreading. (Okay, nvm. It seemed genuine.) P53 seems pretty town at first glance, feeling strongly as towniest post in the game.

6 Zexion:
Lots of content. Pushes 5 for noisemaking which at face value makes no real sense but is a believable push for town to make. Votes 13 for bad reasons. Overall P47 makes me feel just a little bit weird, entertaining possible narrative of scum with strong presence? Unsure how much conviction he actually has (the less the better, honestly). P56 is towny.

12 Larxene:
Claiming inv-immune. Not impressive but claim tends towards town.

13 Roxas:
Asks to be checked, says will claim if needed. Opens with scumread me and townread 12.


Alright I actually think you're town.
We seem to have relatively different posting styles/sharing styles but in that it doesn't seem to matter because it seems as though your contributions are solid enough when you do contribute in a manner that I can read and follow.
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Post Post #213 (ISO) » Thu Aug 17, 2017 2:07 am

Post by IX Demyx »

In post 65, XI Marluxia wrote:I'm pretty skeptical in general about people who ask to be cop cleared via role and typically find that there's some misguided thought leading there. Not really interested in spending an investigation on Roxas.
In post 66, XI Marluxia wrote:
In post 53, V Lexaeus wrote:As for Roxas... He's a special case. In flavor, he's the key (literally) to the Organization's entire scheme until the Oblivion Squad screws it up vying for power, and he runs away.
Roles might have flavor justification but that doesn't mean that it will be good flavor justification and it doesn't mean that there will be a correlation between how town someone looks and how powerful their role is.
In post 67, XI Marluxia wrote:Luxord, if you didn't have anything that you wanted to say yet, why didn't you just say you didn't have anything to say?
Don't especially love this sequence but it's probably town?
Not sure.
This is a "hitting the ground running" kind of entrance and I feel it only makes sense in a niche group.
Since I know the questions will come, I'm not particularly inclined to elaborate more on that at this point in time, and I do apologize for that but it is what it is, basically.

In one corner, I could see treacherous spinning a tale here.
Yet in the other... Who really does that as mafia, seriously? And Marluxia isn't taking enough of a limelight approach to this to be able to influence thoughts that heavily, sooo....
Slightly more likely to be town.
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Post Post #214 (ISO) » Thu Aug 17, 2017 2:08 am

Post by IX Demyx »

I feel like I'm going to hit the end of my catchup and be townreading all but one person and end up in a derptunnel because of it.
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Post Post #215 (ISO) » Thu Aug 17, 2017 2:13 am

Post by VI Zexion »

4 guesses that I feel good about, 1 that I think I feel okay about, then you, you made me doubt 2 others because you being one of them would throw others up in the air too - shuffling everything around in my brain but I think I figured it out now. :P

Re 208 if you're saying that scum wouldn't do that because it's too obvious I disagree; I think the entrance was bad precisely because having those reads was unreasonable. I don't think it's particularly strong or intricate reasoning but I don't think it's bad reasoning; giving hard reads with no basis isn't something I'm ever going to townread and is something I'm going to scumread more often than not.

59 I just wanted conversation.
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Post Post #216 (ISO) » Thu Aug 17, 2017 2:49 am

Post by IX Demyx »

In post 215, VI Zexion wrote:Re 208 if you're saying that scum wouldn't do that because it's too obvious I disagree; I think the entrance was bad precisely because having those reads was unreasonable. I don't think it's particularly strong or intricate reasoning but I don't think it's bad reasoning; giving hard reads with no basis isn't something I'm ever going to townread and is something I'm going to scumread more often than not.

59 I just wanted conversation.
Not necessarily because scum wouldn't do that. I'm arguing that scum like to posture moar.
The entrance was bad because having those reads was unreasonable. I agree. I do not believe that the entrance being bad for that reason is equivalent to the entrance being scum.
My belief is that scum at least in their early posts aren't so far removed outside of a newbie game that they seriously make that kind of post. Roxas rolled with the flow regarding it so I doubt it was a "I didn't know that I fucked up by letting on too much knowledge" kind of deal.
Think that if Roxas were scum there would be more thought put into the opening post/sequence and there just wasn't. It doesn't come across as stiff, either.

I'm not saying it's too obvious, because scum can and will do the obvious while banking on that argument. Especially if they have day talk which can generally be expected in a 1) theme, and 2) role madness game. I'm saying that a post that has not a lot of thought in it generally tends to come from town if it appears to be made on the fly, and I believe this one was. It's not "too scummy to be scum" nor is it "too genuine to be scum" (both of which I take issue with). It's a deeper level than that which is essentially just "I highly doubt scum look at how reads are developing right now and how players are interacting and just throw out this post, because it is on all levels not fitting for a player that has to manipulate and/or avoid a lynch this day phase".
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Post Post #217 (ISO) » Thu Aug 17, 2017 2:56 am

Post by IX Demyx »

Spoiler:
In post 69, XIII Roxas wrote:
In post 53, V Lexaeus wrote:As for Roxas... He's a special case. In flavor, he's the key (literally) to the Organization's entire scheme until the Oblivion Squad screws it up vying for power, and he runs away.

Alignments do not necessarily match flavor (except for Xemnas I suppose), but it does seem like the role assignments are based on it. So when Roxas claims a super powerful role that benefits immensely from being cop cleared? I believe him, and don't want to waste the effort pushing him with a cop result incoming, and especially don't want to risk a mislynch without getting that sorted.
I must admit a lack of flavor knowledge aside from generally being aware of Roxas being Sora's opposite and I believe him going from Zero to Hero. I did get the impression my role was one of the stronger ones in the game, however, it requires specific circumstances in order to work.
In post 57, VI Zexion wrote:all I have right now is a pretty baseless post calling someone "obviously town" and someone else "just scum" (quote marks for precision not for mockery) on page 2 which are ridiculous positions to hold this early.
How so? Larxene is in fact obviously town. Luxord is just scum. Those were the most apt descriptions to use. The terms were accurate. And, counter-question.
In post 57, VI Zexion wrote:There are no interactions with other slots.
Why didn't you interact with my slot? You didn't bother to ask me why I held those stances. I am perfectly capable of explaining them (and in the case of Luxord I am actively doing so), yet you went in and did the very thing you were accusing me of.
In post 51, X Luxord wrote:VOTE: 6 Zex
As someone who has no flavor knowledge, all of the names are frustratingly similar.
This is a continued instance of not actually providing game content.

When I said Luxord was "just scum", I meant it. Because this is not town.


For what it's worth.
I
strongly
believe this post to be one from town.
This is entirely gut-based as far as ability to explain reads go, but I believe the struggle from Roxas to explain the scumread here is town.
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Post Post #218 (ISO) » Thu Aug 17, 2017 3:17 am

Post by VI Zexion »

Frankly, it feels as though you've come into the game determined to townread Roxas and make them look town and I really don't like it. I don't think the way that you're townreading their entrance is good at all; I think that it's a scummy entrance and I think that it's pretty exaggerated and wrong to townread that in the way that you are townreading it - I could find a nullread there believeable with the kind of logic you're espousing but a townread is just ridiculous. I don't think that the inability to articulate the Luxord scumread is town at all; I think that inarticulacy is something that would be trivial to fake for Roxas and it absolutely bothers me that you're finding elaborate ways to townread the slot off pretty much nothing.
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Post Post #219 (ISO) » Thu Aug 17, 2017 3:22 am

Post by III Xaldin »

In post 204, VI Zexion wrote:@Xaldin I basically disagree that Larxene's tone in response to being challenged on the claim is null - I think there's some pretty clear scum motivation in attacking people who don't just accept the claim at face value; you could argue that it's just personality indicative or part of the roleplay that Larxene seems to be doing or whatever and I don't think it's a strong point for that reason but I don't think you can just discard it out of hand. Think you've also basically just dismissed the other points without engaging with them on an intellectual level at all; the crux of it is that Larxene's reads are badly formed and badly held and none of it feels very town - you can disagree with the way that's expressed but I don't think it's very reasonable to just say "those points are bad there's nothing wrong with Larxene" and not engage with the read beyond that. What is your read on Larxene?

Part two of this is... what are you doing with your vote? What are any of your reads besides Xigbar? Why is Xigbar even a scumread? Don't think you've explained anything at all and I'm starting to wonder which of my scumreads might be wrong if you're scum here because 182 is frankly pretty awful from you - I'm presuming you're scumreading Luxord here? Literally zero nuance in your stances here that might help me see that you've put thought into your reads or the gamestate overall at this point.
It was snarky and I do not see how snarky responses can be seen as attacking, I do believe she is playing the character and it is AI (In all honesty I would too but I dunno how to roleplay Xaldin :( )
I think Larxene is town yes.

I did engage all points mind you.

I said how the first was pretty bad because it tried to make snarky/roleplayish into looking like an attack.
The second point was about a read being lazy which not only is it not an alignment thing most of the time but it was way to early to have solid reads anyway
His last point was the one he self contradicted. He said she didn't care about his content when in the same post she said would await for more.

Then xigbar goes to vote me which is in on itself a read he hasn't explained and just stated. Which is in his own words lazy, something he was scumreading Larx for.

As for my vote, I don't vote much in general. That something I always did and probably always do.

Casting 1 vote is nothing, do you really need to see a vote in order to get the feeling someone expresses a scumread?

As for others reads I can tell you that Laxeus seems pretty iffy, his vote on me was pretty horrible and opportunistic there. He followed a read from xigbar that he had not explained without explainign anything himself.
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Post Post #220 (ISO) » Thu Aug 17, 2017 3:25 am

Post by Heartless »

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Vote Count 1.4


Marluxia [1] - Vexen
Vexen [1] - Demyx
Xigbar [1] - Roxas
Saïx [1] - Axel
Xaldin [4] - Xigbar, Larxene, Zexion, Lexaeus
Axel [1] - Xemnas

Not Voting: Xaldin, Saïx, Marluxia, Luxord

7 to lynch
Deadline: (expired on 2017-08-31 18:46:21).[/color]
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Post Post #221 (ISO) » Thu Aug 17, 2017 3:32 am

Post by VI Zexion »

I'm not too interested in hearing you defend Larxene from Xigbar or whomever; I'm interested in hearing your own read there and where it's coming from.

And, why do you think Xigbar's read on you is fake? Just because he didn't explain it?
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Post Post #222 (ISO) » Thu Aug 17, 2017 3:43 am

Post by IX Demyx »

In post 218, VI Zexion wrote:Frankly, it feels as though you've come into the game determined to townread Roxas and make them look town and I really don't like it.
Actually when I first thought about this game I was thinking about how to make up reads to lynch Roxas because he was a traitor to the Organization in the end in KH2. Don't know the other source material aside from that.

So the opposite from your hypothesis is correct.
That said, I am fairly certain of a trait of the player behind Roxas given the posting so far and can tell you that were I to be correct on that (and I highly suspect I am), Roxas is just town here.
It's not a trait that I feel at liberty to out, though.
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Post Post #223 (ISO) » Thu Aug 17, 2017 3:49 am

Post by IX Demyx »

In post 218, VI Zexion wrote:I don't think the way that you're townreading their entrance is good at all; I think that it's a scummy entrance and I think that it's pretty exaggerated and wrong to townread that in the way that you are townreading it - I could find a nullread there believeable with the kind of logic you're espousing but a townread is just ridiculous. I don't think that the inability to articulate the Luxord scumread is town at all; I think that inarticulacy is something that would be trivial to fake for Roxas and it absolutely bothers me that you're finding elaborate ways to townread the slot off pretty much nothing.
For what it's worth; this is all noise.
If you find me scummy for it you should be talking to other players about it, not to me.
If you don't particularly find me scummy, then it appears like you're trying to convince me my read is bad purely because that's not how you think I should be reading Roxas. That's not how this game is really played. We find who we think is town/mafia and work with who we think is town to lynch who we think is mafia.
What matters is less the method of reading and more the motivations behind each push and read.
If my motivation for townreading Roxas is impure then how do you propose I'm trying to use that to my advantage as a traitor currently?
If Roxas' motivation for not being able to articulate the Luxord scumread is impure then how do you propose they're trying to use that to their advantage currently?
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Post Post #224 (ISO) » Thu Aug 17, 2017 4:00 am

Post by VI Zexion »

Trying to discredit my take on your content thus far as just noise doesn't invalidate the reasoning that I've stated; you're welcome to state my reasoning as noise but I think it pretty apparently is not. I don't find the reasons for your townread on Roxas to be genuine; I find the manner in which you are engaging me here to be furthermore scummy; I think that your attitude insinuates that you "know better" about "how the game is played" and that's a position from which you inherently have the advantage, it's a position from which you're poised to start an argument and win it in order to prove a point, not to scumhunt; I think if you were interested in scumhunting you wouldn't discount my critique of your read as just noise, the lack of receptivity from you when you've just started your catchup is scummy because the strength of your read as you're defending it right now doesn't match with where it should be if you were town just at this point in your understanding of the game and your development of your reads.

I'm talking to you because my concerns are with you; just because I think you're scummy doesn't mean I'm dead-set that you're scum end of story and never talk to you again; even if I were sure you were scum I would still talk to you because I treat my scumreads like they're town and that's playstyle.

The motivation for you townread Roxas depends on his alignment - if he's town then you're trying to pocket him because he's an easy pocket when he's town and all you need to do is agree with his reads and you're town to him; if he's scum then you're scum with him and you're trying to improve the position your team is in because your scumbuds are being scumread and you don't want to have to endgame town without Roxas. Roxas' motivation for not articulating the Luxord scumread is so obvious I'm baffled that you're asking me - if Roxas is scum then he doesn't have to provide reasoning that he'll have to justify and be held accountable for.
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