Mini 1955: Perpetual MYLO III - Game Over!

[kunkstar7]

We are talking about Dunn, I've even voted Dunn. No comments on anything I've said about it though? Also, honestly I can't tell from your ISO who your prime picks for scum are. I see you mention you want to talk about Dunn, but not this second part.

[Maki Harukawa]

Lycanfire you Dunn Shuichi is my pool~

[Maki Harukawa]

I have to go re read dimond but unless all mafia bussed like morons (maybe considering how they're doing things) I feel ok with lycanfire you and dunn shuichi is if I run out of choices.

[Kaede Akamatsu]

Is Maki scum gambiting!?

She is!>>>>

<<<<She isn't!

take your side!

I feel tempted to reply to this Debate Scrum style...

*rocket noise*

Kaede!

I want to

believe

in Maki, and for that, I cannot unvote.

Spoiler:

Sorry took me a while to figure out how to summarize my entire thoughts into a sentence with a keyword (and to make the image).

Longer version:

And then I just keep spinning around in my head, part of me wants to just townread her for as long as she wants to lynch herself, part of me just want to flat out townread her regardless of whether she's lynched today or not. Until I realized that I just cant flat out ignore it no matter how hard I try, and now im unsure on how to proceed from here, because if she's town lynching her would be VERY bad.

[Chara]

time to do that thing where i drop all of my reads like hot potatoes and get new ones, i guess.

[Kaede Akamatsu]

Huh?, wait, why are you scumreading Shuichi Maki?

[DiamondSentinel]

Dear lord, this Maki fiasco is awful. I'm starting to wonder if scum's trying to get town apathy to rise so that they can control the wagons.

'Cause I'm feeling the apathy right now.

Purely because of this fiasco, I am 100% fine with a Maki lynch today. Absolutely horrific.

[Maki Harukawa]

Huh?, wait, why are you scumreading Shuichi Maki?

If there is a deep wolf I would mostly bet on it being him but that option should only be considered after the first 3 are out of the pool

[kunkstar7]

Lycanfire you Dunn Shuichi is my pool~

Ok lets step through this then, starting with Lycan. Anything specific why he's scum? What do you think of his placement on the Wicked wagons D1 and D2?

[Maki Harukawa]

Kaede is in my blind spot that I feel if I'm ever wrong on it's them but I'm not gonna act like that anyway
I will go look at the wagons but a lot of my scum pool is poe from interactions with flipped scum I don't think Lycan has done much this game at all and I have no reason to tr him.
I suggest looking at my big wall for my reads they still stand here but if you have any questions I'll answer

[Maki Harukawa]

Vote Count 1-14

Wickedestjr

(5): Wisdom, Lycanfire, DiamondSentinel, Miu Iruma, Viomi

Viomi

(3): Chara, Kaede Akamatsu, Shuichi Saihara

DiamondSentinel

(2): Dunnstral, Wickedestjr

kunkstar7

(1): Maki Harukawa

Not Voting

(1): kunkstar7

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch.

Deadline: November 2, Midnight US Eastern Time.

Countdown: (expired on 2017-11-01 21:00:00)

Mod Notes:

-

Vote Count 1-15

Viomi

(6): Chara, Kaede Akamatsu, Shuichi Saihara, Wickedestjr, Maki Harukawa, Dunnstral

Wickedestjr

(5): Wisdom, Lycanfire, DiamondSentinel, Miu Iruma, Viomi

Not Voting

(1): kunkstar7

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch.

Deadline: November 2, Midnight US Eastern Time.

Countdown: (expired on 2017-11-01 21:00:00)

Mod Notes:

-

Vote Count 1-16

Viomi

(7): Chara, Kaede Akamatsu, Shuichi Saihara, Wickedestjr, Maki Harukawa, kunkstar7, Miu Iruma

Wickedestjr

(4): Wisdom, Lycanfire, DiamondSentinel, Viomi

Not Voting

(1): Dunnstral

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch.

Deadline: November 2, Midnight US Eastern Time.

Countdown: (expired on 2017-11-01 21:00:00)

Mod Notes:

-

A Lynch Has Been Achieved!

Vote Count 2-8

Wickedestjr

(6): Wisdom, Lycanfire, Shuichi Saihara, Kaede Akamatsu, kunkstar7, Chara

Wisdom

(2): Maki Harukawa, Dunnstral

DiamondSentinel

(1): Wickedestjr

Not Voting

(1): DiamondSentinel

With 10 alive, it takes 6 to lynch.

Deadline: November 19, Midnight US Eastern Time.

Countdown: (expired on 2017-11-18 21:00:00)

Mod Notes:

-

A Lynch Has Been Achieved!

[Maki Harukawa]

Wow Dunn looks fucking awful in these vote counts

[Dunnstral]

VOTE: Maki Harukawa

[Maki Harukawa]

VOTE: Dunn

[Maki Harukawa]

Will explain later but this is a scum fuck.

[Kaede Akamatsu]

I'm confused by both votes

Spoiler:

[Dunnstral]

omgus

[Kaede Akamatsu]

You're OMGUSing her?

Spoiler:

[Maki Harukawa]

I believe in no way would town dunn sr me here and right when I bring up his voting pattern he places a vote on me I think I got some active talk going and we got places where we need. I ask you vote in me and Dunn today it seems we are both the srs of the day and not voting in us is awful if you think I was pulling a gambit feel free to vote me if you tr mr I ask you vote Dunn if you do not understand Why Dunn is scum look at the VCS and how he was off both scum wagons plus his vote on me is just him trying to get me lynched so he can sui he also sheeped me on wisdom for no reason and turned his read around on me for no reason.

[Maki Harukawa]

Kaede Chara Dimond Shuichi lets end this killing game

Spoiler:

once and for all

[Dunnstral]

VOTE: Maki Harukawa

VOTE: Dunn

hmm

[Shuichi Saihara]

But the self-vote is literally suicide to do as scum, since literally she getting lynched today as scum = scum lose, which led me to think she was possibly town, but there's also truth in what she said earlier about she being able to pull a stunt like this as scum.

And then I just keep spinning around in my head, part of me wants to just townread her for as long as she wants to lynch herself, part of me just want to flat out townread her regardless of whether she's lynched today or not. Until I realized that I just cant flat out ignore it no matter how hard I try, and now im unsure on how to proceed from here, because if she's town lynching her would be VERY bad.

I am here as well. It's unfortunate.

Why is it very bad for scum to get 1 point.
I think we should talk on Dunn because if he's scum he'll prob leave do you think he's scum?

Because each point we miss gives scum the chance to adjust the gamestate to their liking.

The points that make me want to tr dunn is him sring me is NAI but I think he really believes in that sr plus I think his struggle on the end of day wagons given both are scum could be real and he was really debating on it. He could've just unvoted to not vote a buddy but it was clear they were getting lynched (1 of the 2) so why wait.

I kind of want to know where this went and how it meshes with some later post I didn't quote apparently that seems contradictory.

1) We have two mislynches
2) All scum are confirmed to have bussed
3) Complexity of the game state
4) The necessity of PoE

1) This is true, but each one we use makes our chances of getting the following one right worse.
2) Day 1, sure. Not everyone bussed Day 2, or if they did we can find them by their not having tried very hard to accomplish it. That should be key, as Day 2 is a much less attractive bussing opportunity.
3) It's a mess.
4) It depends on how you work. If you have scumreads great. If you don't, lynch your nontownreads, that's fine. I feel that having strong townreads is made more possible by the structure of this game. Also, I want to POE the fuck out of Diamond because nearly everyone else keeps giving town glimmers.

Dear lord, this Maki fiasco is awful. I'm starting to wonder if scum's trying to get town apathy to rise so that they can control the wagons.

'Cause I'm feeling the apathy right now.

Purely because of this fiasco, I am 100% fine with a Maki lynch today. Absolutely horrific.

Dat non-town perspective. WHy am I not yelling to get this lynched? Ugh.

Huh?, wait, why are you scumreading Shuichi Maki?

If there is a deep wolf I would mostly bet on it being him but that option should only be considered after the first 3 are out of the pool

Again, there's little sense in doing this in this game.

VOTE: Maki Harukawa

VOTE: Dunn

hmm

This post is ass. You've already posted since her vote.

I've had the impression you were usually an active player. But apparently I was wrong? Or do you just hate scum?

[Shuichi Saihara]

Again, there's little sense in doing this in this game.

(Specifically, as scum I don't run out a Viomi wagon with Wisdom in the game, town, and yelling about Wicked, call the interaction scum theater and then leave Wisdom alive. I lynch Wicked, try to look good doing it and hope Viomi can recover.)

[Lycanfire]

VOTE: Maki

Maki's self vote implicitly harms the town. It defines that it's okay to lynch townies. I don't have a problem with this mechanically (town lynch=scum death);

however

it is ethically wrong, and if it's ethically wrong and Maki is not ignorant of this, she is being malicious in suggesting it.

Her interactions with Wicked do her no favors: in particular how she evolved her read on Wicked at a critical juncture, only to be ignored while Wicked decided to shade Kunk/Acid and later vote Kunk 20 posts later. I'm quite sure Wicked was feeling set up to go later than he did at this point- all he had was Diamond and myself attacking him, so I wouldn't count deliberately making a bad (non-existent) interaction as likely over "Maki as scum"-purposely refusing to evolve his read on Maki, because no matter what he would say in that scenario wouldn't help the scumteam in the

B

case.

I don't discount the

A

case where Maki is town and Wicked purposely made this look bad: but what is the point in observing that as likely? A town!Maki here wasn't being townread, wasn't being in the game, and was being adversarial to Wicked (something something useless gambit, a post which prompted a reply from Wicked early game).

That's plenty time to have your own read and at least state it. Klunk Wicked and Acid one of those are getting lynched most likely I'd suggest looking in that direction for now I am off to lunch

This is a post I disliked because Maki wasn't playing by my "rules" I set out in my "soft reset" post. She didn't push anyone, and gave meek consent to lynch three people. Never mind how Kunk or Wicked wasn't much of a package deal here: Kunk was a defined counterwagon to Wicked previously. This post doesn't push anything or express her views on the wagons that were on the board. Maki's post could best be described as "here's the current wagons look into them".

However these reads are expanded later on:

snip

Wickedestjr

- Counter wagon to scum plus I haven't seen a lot of valid reasons that make this scum vs scum wagons I'm a bit puzzled because of the "why does klunk not switch" but this guys silly gambits kinda make more sense coming from town then they do scum I don't see him trying to reap a ton of cred from it but I do need to glance at his later posts since my eyes kinda glaze over sometimes.

snip

kunkstar7-

If I have a read wrong it'll be this one I was just skimming his iso again and I was getting somewhat cold feet but I don't wanna just release my sr on klunk when it was so strong before I didn't like the stances he was doing early on in the game his only redeeming points for me are a few interactions along with the L-1 vote but I don't think a few reasons should outweigh the overall feel I get from this guy

BAD EVOLUTION

VOTE: Wisdom

One of the only people I don't tr from the wicked wagon

DiamondSentinel Chara Wickedestjr
Kaede Akamatsu
Lycanfire Dunnstral
Shuichi Saihara
kunkstar7 Wisdom

Where I'm at atm.

(I did not post from post 1001 to 1057)

Bad interactions

I mean it felt like to me Viomi was really trying to get me to switch to Wicked at the end of the day

VOTE: Maki Harukawa

Do you think Wicked is scum?

compare to

Really wanna know dimonds reads atm

snip

DiamondSentinel-

Read acid iso and that's a lot of the reason I townread diamond it doesn't look like scum v scum to me and I feel like a lot of his emotions were genuine this point isn't as strong given a lot of it is anger and you can have anger and still be scum I also think people are trying to mislynch this slot given a few sr's I see are (Me Dimond Wicked) but I see no reasoning for such a team like this to exist it feels like trying to push someone because you're limited on your options

snip

Dunnstral-

Ah Dunn my friend who I think could be town I've been rethinking this read a lot but I don't feel ready to put him as town yet given I had his slot at lock scum I want to know why he sr's me and why he's so eager to talk to me I get we're friends but this sense of eagerness is kinda scary the people in his other slots didn't really do much justice but hey we'll talk and that may help me get a read on him the interesting part is dunn has a lot of tells and he's done

both

his town and scum tells so more to come.

She's talking to townreads here, and I don't feel like she has to sort Dunnstral. Dunnstral responded in kind asking for to talk with her personally about reads, and instead Maki made a readspost.

Maki says herself earlier on when she tells Dunnstral to get bent that she doesn't want to talk to scumreads:

Talking to you isn't going to help as much as it would talking to others.

If there was an evolution here, she didn't show it.

The point I am trying to make is the difference in how she treats Diamond and Dunnstral.

Evolution, revisited

I think I want to vote in klunk and Lycan today.

Dunnstral doesn't bother you at all? You seemed familiar with him. He's doing jack shit, popping in to be wishy-washy and leaving. He also voted wrong yesterday. Is that what you expect from him?

I'd vote Dunn today mostly because if I lynch elsewhere and I'm wrong and he is scum I 100% expect him to ditch right away where if he's town it'd be interesting to see where other scum ru-
You know what now that I say it it sounds even better
VOTE: Dunn

Doesn't read the thread

Lycanfire-

I really want to know more about where this guy stands on his reads I see a few walls but from mostly what I can tell is he agrees a lot with wisdom? (lol) He also had this magic "I can read Maki off one game" that makes me roll my eyes for now he's null I don't really see him pushing much or showing a lot of desire for a lynch I kinda just want him to pick something and try to push it or show interest

(pretty much all of this is false)

However it takes a superior mind to not read the thread and define the game as very very complicated:

My confidence in a bit shaken and I don't think I've been so wrong on a few reads that I felt good in a long time I didn't think scum would bus that much because to me that's fucking stupid but I shouldn't have been looking at my logic but what others would do. I want to vote klunk now that it doesn't matter and both wagons were scum and I feel like people would bus here and try to be a deep wolf considering it'd make a few town people look bad. I'm going to re read but Wisdoms play felt so dif then the other game I played with him.

Hm

What points to scum me killing Miu since you think it's dumb if anyone doesn't kill Wisdom.

You should take all my statements as town because if I am scum you can just ignore them when I flip.

Now I think scum are most likely people who hard bussed both slots even if bussing is stupid in this set up. I will come back with reads in a bit.
Anyone who votes before then is scum claiming.

This is how the game will be going today and you're going to deal with it
Pedit: Shut up

Conclusions: I feel like Diamond and Maki have been working in tandem today in trying to complicate the game state, take townies off the table, and insert the suggestion that a town lynch is not a bad idea. Meanwhile, Maki has been highly townreading Diamond all game, while showing no evolution of that read which she bases on meta. Furthermore I've felt since the Acid lynch that it was forced over Wicked: and yesterday we confirmed it.

Vote Count 1-16

Viomi

(7): Chara, Kaede Akamatsu, Shuichi Saihara,

Wickedestjr, Maki Harukawa

, kunkstar7, Miu Iruma

Wickedestjr

(4): Wisdom, Lycanfire, DiamondSentinel,

Viomi

Not Voting

(1): Dunnstral

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch.

Deadline: November 2, Midnight US Eastern Time.

Countdown: (expired on 2017-11-01 21:00:00)

Mod Notes:

-

A Lynch Has Been Achieved!

I talk sometimes about "push votes". I would call Shuichi's vote here the push vote. A push vote is one that accelerates the wagon. I would say, at that point Wicked saw the writing on the wall-assuming Chara isn't scum- and decided that Viomi wasn't going to make it out alive over Kunkstar. These two votes in a row made the wagon far too easy. Where else could Maki vote? Maki townread Wicked, and wanted Kunkstar. Meanwhile the Kunkstar wagon collapsed.
The moment that happened the lynch was decided. Scum picked the wagon that made it through.

[Shuichi Saihara]

Really making extra effort to understand that post actually did help me see where you're coming from. There are some parts that elude me, but I think there were some solid points as well.

I'm trying to figure out whether they are better than my concerns about Dunnstral.