Project ARCH - Intermission 3

Large Theme Games (based on source material and/or changes to mechanics/rules) (14+ players). Signup Threads In Queue Forum
Oversoul
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Post Post #3625  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:05 pm

In post 3618, Gamma Emerald wrote:
In post 3572, Oversoul wrote:So PP or other scum spent their hard earned serum to ascetize you, then spent their serum or other factional ability to kill you/target you. That’s gonna be a no from me dawg.

Why the hell woild scum Target you with an ascetize ability first of all
Why would they then TARGET YOU AGAIN with a NONKILL MOVE KNOWING THEY ASCETIZED YOU

He's odd night though
I'm seeing the fake stupidity now.


If he’s telling the truth, which he isn’t. Like people. Stretch your fucking thinking caps just a little bit because it’s apparently depriving all of your brains of much needed blood

Rautherdir
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Post Post #3626  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:06 pm

Because that means they can outnumber the rebels through conversion instead of kills.

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Post Post #3627  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:07 pm

In post 3622, Rautherdir wrote:cults ... don't usually have restrictions on who they can target

Actually iirc they're supposed to die if they target groupscum are at least, fail, outside of games where the mod doesn't give a shit about the fact a groupscum being culted can just leak their team.
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Post Post #3628  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:08 pm

In post 3626, Rautherdir wrote:Because that means they can outnumber the rebels through conversion instead of kills.

You know with the "turn into robots" thing this might make sense, but unless being turned into a robot doesn't change your alignment that would be equivalent to a cult.
You know what I might be onto something here.
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Post Post #3629  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:09 pm

I'm also going to guess that if that is the case, Simotech would probably be aware of it as that would probably be a loss mechanism for them.

p-edit:
... yep. Forgot about that.
Wait... is it Aeon the alignment or Aeon the Corporation then?

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Post Post #3630  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:13 pm

In post 3626, Rautherdir wrote:Because that means they can outnumber the rebels through conversion instead of kills.
The rebels are the town?

The main problem I have with the turn into robots theory is that A50 isn't a robot right now. If he is PGO, whatever PP did should have actually worked. And it doesn't seem to have done anything we know of. I just think it's really speculative, and we already have oversoul having claimed to have been vanillised by an ability that doesn't seem to work the way you're describing.

I'm also going to guess that if that is the case, Simotech would probably be aware of it as that would probably be a loss mechanism for them.

p-edit:
... yep. Forgot about that.
Wait... is it Aeon the alignment or Aeon the Corporation then?
Aeon is an alignment and a company and PP was both.

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Post Post #3631  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:15 pm

In post 3622, Rautherdir wrote:Oh... I just realized something.
If Aeon is town aligned and has an ability to convert town players to their alignment, that might not count as a cult. (Since cults aren't town aligned and don't usually have restrictions on who they can target)


What makes you think they're town aligned? Are you saying they turn the townies into killing machines and if they outnumber the non-killing machines townies they win? What of those townies that have not been converted then? If they lose then Aeon is still anti-town.
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Post Post #3632  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:19 pm

I was talking about Penguin's win condition, I checked and it's Aeon as alignment. If it is a two-night thing to convert that would actually be decently balanced.
We really should figure out why the win condition is specifically out-numbering Rebels though, that doesn't leave room for other 3rd parties or another scum faction, specifically with that win condition Simotech can lose the moment there's more Aeon then Rebels, even if Aeon wouldn't be able to control the lynch

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Post Post #3633  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:21 pm

If Aeon isn't a 'threat' to the rebellion and they win by outnumbering Rebels, then Simotech gets endgamed and no threats to the rebels remain. Thus, the rebels also win.

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Post Post #3634  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:22 pm

Huh.

If only I knew where lustitia connected into this.

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Post Post #3635  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:26 pm

In post 3633, Rautherdir wrote:If Aeon isn't a 'threat' to the rebellion and they win by outnumbering Rebels, then Simotech gets endgamed and no threats to the rebels remain. Thus, the rebels also win.


This looks... bastard! :lol:

I like it though.
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Post Post #3636  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:28 pm

Wait...

@Mod: Is the alignment Aeon Technologies classified as a threat to the Rebels?

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Post Post #3637  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:31 pm

If they're changing alignments to theirs by any method and don't win with the town that's a cult imho. Arguably even if they can win with the town under some circumstances.

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Post Post #3638  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:34 pm

The most simple answer to 'how can Aeon win by only outnumbering the Rebels' is that there is no other group-scum. But I'm not sure how likely that is.

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Post Post #3639  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:35 pm

In post 3637, Primate wrote:If they're changing alignments to theirs by any method and don't win with the town that's a cult imho. Arguably even if they can win with the town under some circumstances.


It's less changing their alignment and more... Like an arsonist dousing people. Except the flavor turns them into robots.

Actually in Town of Salem, it could be like a Plaguebearer that wins when everyone alive is "infected". The majority, in this case.

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Post Post #3640  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:37 pm

The point I'm trying to make is that if there is another faction then Aeon isn't trying to get the majority. It's just outnumbering Rebels, regardless of how many other players there are.

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Post Post #3641  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:42 pm

Let's say we get to 3 Simo - 2 Aeon - 2 Rebels at a day start. If a Rebel is lynched Aeon wins immediately.

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Post Post #3642  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:44 pm

@Bambi: Consult with Elsa, and she might remember in OK1 the SKs could have been endgamed and lost while they were still alive. This is why I am following Rauth's theory with much interest here. I know I am not the only person on MS who could/would think of that.
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Post Post #3643  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:45 pm

Yeah, ok, I get what you're saying. Which would explain why a50 doesn't know he's potentially converted, sure. Seems possible and would explain why PP might have wanted to defend him.

In post 3638, Rautherdir wrote:The most simple answer to 'how can Aeon win by only outnumbering the Rebels' is that there is no other group-scum. But I'm not sure how likely that is.
Aeon designed the pods that we know were used to gather the serum data, and designed Simotechs medical equipment. And we know that simotech went bankrupt and don't really exist anymore. I think there's flavour justification for it. (But I'm playing devils advocate a bit, seems weird flavourwise too).

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Post Post #3644  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:45 pm

In post 3641, Rautherdir wrote:Let's say we get to 3 Simo - 2 Aeon - 2 Rebels at a day start. If a Rebel is lynched Aeon wins immediately.


Yeah, but that makes it a 3-way race, so Aeon are not "town-aligned" still.
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Post Post #3645  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:48 pm

I'm kind of just waiting for the mod's response to my question at this point. I'm not sure if I actually expect a clear answer to it, but in the event we actually do get a clear answer that will tell us what to do.

p-edit:
Yes, but Aeon doesn't control the game in that situation, that would normally be a Simo victory in traditional multiball.

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Post Post #3646  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:49 pm

In post 3643, Primate wrote:Which would explain why a50 doesn't know he's potentially converted, sure.


If I killed PP then I sure as hell was not converted. Also according to my most recent communication with the mod (after today had started) I strongly believe I am still a rebel and my role is still the same (the role part is the mod-confirmed part. The alignment is me speculating based on available knowledge)
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Post Post #3647  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:52 pm

Normally PGO's don't block too. If it's like an arsonist you could be roboticised and not know.
Arsonist (sk; common; 4+ players): You can prime a player at night by dousing them in gasoline. During the day, you may set a fire which kills all primed players. Actions: prime (day)ignite

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Post Post #3648  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:55 pm

So PP didn't want you lynched not because you're actually the same alignment, but because you're for their purposes a player on their side/dead player.

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Post Post #3649  (ISO)  » Tue Aug 13, 2019 5:06 pm

In post 3647, Primate wrote:Normally PGO's don't block too. If it's like an arsonist you could be roboticised and not know.
Arsonist (sk; common; 4+ players): You can prime a player at night by dousing them in gasoline. During the day, you may set a fire which kills all primed players. Actions: prime (day)ignite


I don't get the "block" bit? To my knowledge I didn't "block" anything. My theory is either he manages to successfully turn me into a robot or he dies because he failed.

P.S. Let me clarify this now since it appears to have drifted your thoughts a bit. I am not a "PGO". Again, I didn't care to correct the assumption since it benefited me in more than one way, not the least of which is the fact scum would have been afraid to target me anymore. But since it appears to have lead many of you astray I can accept being NK'd and having you on the right course over me being virtually immune and lead you astray.

I dunno if it wise to full claim my role here. I'd rather not, but if the towniest slots demand it I will.

Towniest slots imho: the 2 Masons + (3P) Bambi + Rainn + Sakura = 5 players, and 3 are required to ask for my claim.

This is NOT to say I have no other TRs, but I'm trying not to give scum or whomever scum may be able to convince to have a say on it, so these 5 are my "council" for now

P-edit: I really want to ass you (primate) to the list, but that would be unfair to CK & Gamma. Do you agree on the above-mentioned 5 to be "independently thinking town players"?
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