UNI MUM Mafia (Upick, FULL, Setup underway)

[zMuffinMan]

/in

[zMuffinMan]

i had already asked dram to just concede the game before that shitfest played out instead of dealing out any punishments

drixx is honestly the most fucking toxic player i've ever had this displeasure of being stuck in a game with; greyice (and i) may throw out unsavoury comments, but that's leaps and bounds better (imo) than someone who throws out "civilised" piles of shit and pretends it doesn't stink just as bad, if not worse

[zMuffinMan]

you were going to die that night anyway, if the game somehow continued

[zMuffinMan]

indeed but in any situation where my team hadn't misplayed it terribly to that point, that would have been extremely favourable for the scum team. tis a pity

fyi i could day vig anyone if i targeted them twice (the nightmares thing was me, i could have day killed sir berus at any point)

the ideal play for my team would have been bussing the fuck out of me, and letting me blatantly act like scum while daykilling multiple people who couldn't do anything about it

but things didnt play out that way

o well

[zMuffinMan]

i truly did have one of the most overpowered roles of all time, but it wasn't a solo winning role, it was a role where i needed my team to win the game for me while capitalising on the fact they know im scum

*shrug*

[zMuffinMan]

yeah, and that was the one big misplay i did in the game; i should have shut the fuck up when everyone was in favour of vig killing sharky, rofl

[zMuffinMan]

i would just count it as a town win. i literally just told dram to concede the game before it became what it did

I'd rather you just end the game than dish out any sort of punishments here if Floppy and I are the last anti-town players.

Floppy is getting lynched today.

I sincerely doubt I can carry the torch alone. I don't have the role for it. I haven't been playing in a pro-town way because I didn't expect to be in this for the long haul because of my role. It would take amazing play from me and really awful play from town for me to even stand a chance.

I'm fine with just conceding now if it means putting an end to the shit going on here.

PMed that to him right after reading drixx's awful whine about roleplay in #4191

PMed him post game to count it as a town win (i honestly could not care less about win/loss anyway)

still stand by drixx being a cancer that i hope they find a cure for one day

[zMuffinMan]

@sir berus

i intended to be blatant about it, but i also had a backup plan (i target people at night and give them the "nightmares" message then act like a day vig in the day because "kill" is a song title)

[zMuffinMan]

(i don't know that people would have picked up on the connection between nightmares and me day killing people unless it just blatantly happened every time someone got nightmares... which wasn't going to happen because my initial plan was to give people nightmares til d4 then start exploding them)

[zMuffinMan]

tn wasn't luck, per se - the entire town was either scum reading him or not town reading him

itlepip was more luck than tn (i went over this a bit in the scum PT)

EAP and floppy were kind of luck (and your reasoning for investigating him was pretty questionable but eh) but not really since they were within a small POE pool anyway

honestly, scum shouldn't have been in that position when i was the one who should have been looking the worst - i was literally trying to not get townread for most of D1, what happened with varsoon was unfortunate

[zMuffinMan]

i thought at some point you said you investigated him because he was part of a 3-person neighbourhood and 3-person neighbourhoods are unlikely to be town

i loled at that

[zMuffinMan]

that is the case in general with role madness games, and particularly so in very power-heavy role madness games

snowballing is the name of the game 95% of the time

[zMuffinMan]

i didn't pitch anything

dram told me he was the guy who shook his head and then i think i was the only one who got "you don't get flavour" as their flavour in game

[zMuffinMan]

oh, and for the record, that giant wall of quotes at the end before the game was called did nothing to prove the point. making claims about roleplay "instigating" without looking at what was actually happening in the game is just flat-out crippled - the only part of that that he himself instigated was the the itlepip stuff (and even that is understandable if he thought a player was literally trying to get another player mod-killed)

the whole "here's an attack on titus for literally no reason" bullshit is hilarious imo... almost like a kid who goes to their parent and says "jack kicked me" while acting innocent like they jack just goes around kicking people for no reason... not to mention quoting stuff from prior to dram saying no more and ignoring that roleplay wasn't the one instigating after that is also hilarious

[zMuffinMan]

um, I don't think ignoring the issue is a good thing. It should be talked about, though there are probably better avenues than the signup thread for it. That said, I don't really care since I can't be bothered making a MD thread or something to discuss this.

The idea that there is some imaginary "line" that is not OK to cross is fucking absurd to me. In the first place, mafia is a game where you tell other people they're wrong all the time and, while it could be argued that there is a good/nice way to do that, there is no good/nice way to do that where you're also going to convince the other person your argument is better than theirs, because at the end of the day, if two people think they're right about something which isn't objective, they're not going to come to an agreement by exchanging civilities (and exchanging civilities is probably the least charismatic thing person can do, which is not a good thing in mafia games anyway).

But even outside of mafia games, suggesting that there is a line that should not be crossed is just plain dumb for two reasons: (a) it suggests that there is a point to which it is OK to insult a person - and really, you should either be taking a hard stance on whether it is or isn't OK to put a person down, not some murky stance where it's OK but only if it happens in a certain way, and (b) where that line happens to be is COMPLETELY subjective - some people draw it at certain words, others don't even have a "line"... Also, I should clarify that I don't care if you think using "curse words" is not OK and using "civil" language is OK because there really is no difference in the message being conveyed just because you think you're taking the high ground by not using naughty language.

For example, there really is no objective difference between saying "that thought is completely absurd and i, for one, find your argument lacking" and "that's stupid" - they are both meant to convey the same thing, except that one is perceived by some to be less rude than the other. In reality, you should either not be putting someone down at all (i.e. not saying ANYTHING negative towards other people) or you should learn to fucking deal with it when it escalates. Likewise, it's not OK to call someone "dumb" or "stupid" and suggest that a line should be drawn at the word "retard" because you, personally, think it's a worse word to call someone and that's where your personal line is. And, for the record, you're still putting someone down when you call someone a "child" and shit like that and don't pretend that's OK either, just because you're not being explicitly rude about it (though I'd argue you are).

I think if you don't have a thick enough skin to either ignore insults or deal with them, then you probably shouldn't be playing a game of mafia. And I think that if you're OK with any form of insult, then you should be OK with any form of insult back. And, quite frankly. I think if you call someone a jerk or something like that and get knocked the fuck out, you deserved it.

[zMuffinMan]

i actually think desperado isn't that good a role to dream up, compared to any others

i would not have killed a desperado. i find a vig a far bigger threat because it guarantees a second lynch

[zMuffinMan]

Pedit : a vig and a desperado both guarantee a second lynch.....

indeed, but a vig isn't going to backfire and kill the person who shot (effectively getting rid of the vig for scum) - in the long run, a day vig is better

[zMuffinMan]

like the end result of a desperado that doesn't hit scum is a dead desperado and 1 conftown that can be killed

the end result of a day vig who isn't nightkilled is multiple second lynches until the day vig is dealt with

that's far better imo especially when there are other ways to confirm someone as town

[zMuffinMan]

what was sharky's D1 submission

[zMuffinMan]

what was sharky's D1 submission

[zMuffinMan]

also can you release the PTs?

[zMuffinMan]

i think after d1, town prob woulda won with all VTs unless floppy started looking amazingly town

[zMuffinMan]

yeah realistically after i targeted you it didn't matter what happened, you weren't winning the game. i was probably the worst person to have targeted you rofl, there was a very VERY slim chance i was ever making it to endgame alive