Let's Discuss the Hyperpost Meta

[Something_Smart]

As a player, the idea of a posting cap makes me nervous. I'm not a hyperposter, but I'm generally very comfortable in hyperpost-y games. It is very hard for me to point to any particular posts or sections in a game and go "that should not have happened"; that is to say, the game is long because a lot of things happened, not because people are pointlessly flooding it.

I personally don't know that I really could change my behavior to adapt to a posting cap. All it would do, I think, is make me paranoid and frustrated that I have to do some impossible calculation of whether any individual post is "worth it". My intuition is that it would be the same for true hyperposters, but maybe that's off; definitely, the most relevant viewpoints here would be those of hyperposters. Specifically, how would you respond to a posting cap? Would you be able to prioritize your posts to accomplish what you want without flooding the game?

MathBlade seems to agree with me that there's no easy way to cut down on posting; Bell and Koba disagree, although I'm skeptical of whether Koba's proposed restrictions are really stringent enough to make much of a difference. I would like to hear more people weigh in, but I worry that trying to limit posting directly is treating a symptom rather than the cause. The cause being... that people want the game to move faster/change more rapidly?

Maybe the real value of a posting cap is in deterrent; if you know you can't limit yourself to fewer than 100 posts per game day (e.g.), then you won't join the game, and there won't be a problem. If we're looking for a deterrent, maybe we could go the other way as well-- have games with a posting minimum, like 15 posts per RL day (or maybe you must average that over an entire day phase). That's a scary thought, and it sounds like it would lead to people spamming to meet the requirement, but if my deterrent theory is correct then anyone who joins the game should be able to meet the requirement easily.

[Something_Smart]

However whatever we decide, %, hard cap, std Deviation, should be clear.

Having something subjective is prone to perception biases. Yes sure someone could try to skirt the line so to speak but maybe that is them trying to be better or maybe that’s alignment indicative,

Oh yeah, I definitely agree with that. I wasn't even thinking about subjective measures, that's bound to be mod influence and also likely unfair.

And my worry when I say "it's not easy" is not that it will take effort, it's that people won't do a good job of it and it will make the game unpleasant for them and/or just wreck it completely.

[Something_Smart]

I may be one of the few who hates hypoposting far more. If barely anyone is posting, the game is in danger of becoming stagnant. Generally, a lot of game posts mean people are enjoying the game and are invested.

I wouldn't say I "hate" it, but I am definitely in the same boat where I prefer high-activity games. I would assume that a lot of the people who qualify as hyperposters have a similar preference, which is what gives me the idea to have designated high-activity games as well as designated low-activity ones.

I'm pretty sure this distinction already exists informally; the game Koba linked is a good example of one where pretty much everyone could tell, just based on the playerlist, that it would be a hyperpost-y game. And there's an argument to be made that it was already likely to be this even before anyone signed up, just because of the mod and the setup. In that case, the mod instituting a stringent minimum activity requirement (as long as it was well-designed, of course) might have been a good thing in that it would deter people who clearly would not have been able to keep up.

[Something_Smart]

I just don't like the "well some people can't keep up so we have to do something!!" like no.. you see who you're signing up to play with, worst case you can replace out I guess, like it's very clear early on how the game will be.

That seems pretty unfair, no? As game mods we should be trying to optimize for player enjoyment.

Nobody is suggesting that post caps be instituted on every game; the goal is to create some games that lower-activity people can join without constantly being afraid of not being able to keep up. And my theory is kinda that most hyperposters won't really be able to scale back their posting, so they should just be excluded from these games.

I would love to come up with a solution that would make hyperposters not

want

to post as much (rather than a posting cap, under which they still want to post, but aren't always able to), but I'm just not sure it exists.

[Something_Smart]

like, people seem to be skipping over the idea of like that player asking people to calm down or just "hey all yall post too much, I can't keep up" like, I know in games when people are struggling to keep up that's where I'll try and help them like "hey tell me your reads, lets go from there" but like I think I've only been ask once to post less.

You may be right; it's possible that the problem lies in part with the people who just assume they won't be able to follow everything and then don't even try. But then again, I'm sure there are people who want to actually be able to read all the posts in the game, and these strategies won't help. I guess that's another group that we'd want to hear input from-- the supposed people who have trouble keeping up. I guess those are less likely to be the kinds of people who frequent MD, so that might be trickier.

idk, maybe I just shouldn't have posted here. oops. I mean if non hyperposters ever want to give me tips, I'm always down to listen!!

No, you're absolutely fine This is MD, we are brainstorming, I appreciate hearing your viewpoint even though I disagree with some things.

Hearing about how this has gone on MU is pretty valuable. It sounds like the posting caps aren't really an effective deterrent there. Is it because they are used in all games? Or is it because people want to play games badly enough that they will endure (and/or try to find a way around) the caps?

[Something_Smart]

Why don't they join games without a post cap? Is it because there aren't any/aren't enough?

[Something_Smart]

The problem is you haven’t defined hyperposter and the subjectivity happens.

I appreciate your insistence on objective rather than subjective measure, but I don't think you need to shoot down everyone who proposes a method without giving a strict definition of hyperposting. I doubt that RH9 was planning to just handwave and let game mods make the call; I think most people would agree that's a bad idea. He just hadn't gotten to that part yet because the other part is more important (and more fundamental).

[Something_Smart]

We just had a geriatric game finish and it seemed like it was received pretty well. I'm sure there would be an audience for a geriatric-like game with more lenient restrictions.

[Something_Smart]

The best way to figure that out has got to be to experiment. I might want to start with something like 80-100. Ideally, people are not deliberately coming super close to the post limit; if they are, that's a sign that it needs to be reduced, so those people can get the message that they shouldn't be joining these kinds of games.

Pedit: agree 100%.