''Little Girl'' role in Werewolves of Millers Hollow?

[kravhen]

Hey all

I dunno if some of you have played Werewolves of Millers Hollow, it's basically Mafia. Except its nicely commercialized with pretty cards and whatnot.

One of the town roles is ''Little girl''. What Little Girl does is, at night time, she secretly peeks at who the werewolves are targeting, not only knowing the target, but knowing who all werewolves are at the same time.

For you better mafia uberpros out there, is it just me or is that role kind of too powerful? I've never been in an actual game with that role, but I might soon enough and I have no idea how I should deal with that as mafia.

The group of players I might play with are all casual noobs who had never heard of this game before buying werewolves and they said theyll play a game with Little Girl to show me that it's ''way too overpowered and stuupid cuz it knows all mafia from the start its like cheating'' to the point that they tweaked and changed the role to something else or less powerful, not sure what.

What do you think bout the role? How should it be played and dealt with as mafia? I'm thinking if it comes to worse I can counterclaim little girl... I mean the group seems like they auto-trust whoever says is the little girl and start lynching. Maybe thats why the games have ended fast in favor of town, mafia never counterclaimed.

[ortolan]

yes, assuming the dynamics of that game are anything close to what is played here, it is totally imbalanced and unfair.

If mafia counter-claim then they might get one day's worth of a mislynch but after that they're still screwed. If multiple mafia players counter-claim then town can just lynch all of the claimants until they get to the real little girl's flip and lynch whoever they claimed were the werewolves. So yes, the role as you've stated here is simply broken, assuming that game is played similarly to mafia.

[Elmo]

Yea, broken.

[nhammen]

So does the Little Girl only get this information once the mafia performs a kill? If so, don't kill anyone until the little girl is dead.

Another possibility: As soon as the game starts, claim Little Girl. The real one might counterclaim. If so, kill that person.

[Battousai]

I thought there was a catch or something with that role... like a 60% chance of being caught or something.

[Budja]

^ Even if so, the outcome of the game is based around that chance. Still badly broken.

[Battousai]

Ya, the game would be based around luck over skill too.

[kravhen]

well the game is played in real life... what happens is an night time when the mod says ''Werewolves wake up'' and when villagers have their head down, the little girl can peek

[Xdaamno]

Yeah, I know about this role. We don't have a page on the wiki about it, though, because it dosen't work on the 'net, and, as they said, it's broken anyway.

[SensFan]

well the game is played in real life... what happens is an night time when the mod says ''Werewolves wake up'' and when villagers have their head down, the little girl can peek

Oh.
Then its not that bad at all.

[imaginality]

Do all the werewolves have to agree together on the kill, or is it enough for just one of them to indicate it? If so, then if you know the little girl is in the game, best play might be for just one of you to open your eyes in the night stage. That way if the little girl claims, she only gets one of you lynched, and the others can kill her the next night.

[Xylthixlm]

The best play is to look around and see who's peeking, then kill them. Duh.

[skitzer]

I think another point of this role is that there are more possible roles than players, so claiming little girl doesn't necessarily mean there's one in there. This means that the scum can claim little girl and get one free mislynch (then the fake little girl gets killed the next day.)

Also, yeah, the risk is that little girl gets caught and then doesn't get anything, so I can see it somewhat balanced.

[Mr. Flay]

It would also seem to lead to Scum worrying about people peeking, which means they're either the Little Girl, they're cheating, or the scum is going to jump at shadows. Usually not optimal to NK based on facial tics...

[My Milked Eek]

I'm a regular ftf player (about one session a week (during the regular bar visits)) and the last time we included that role was December 5th.

The last time we included the "peeking girl" the guy who played the role had his one eye shut and his other wide open. Like this: 0_-
Needless to say we killed him while trying to hold ourselves from laughing out loud.

But the role in itself is a pretty imbalanced role and leaves for little wiggle room for scum. The girl has to fuck it up pretty badly to be useless.
It's also pretty much impossible to implement on a board as the information the girl would get are facts of "movements" instead of "interpretations of possible movements".

[nadroj15]

. . . no one has mentioned that in the Werewolves of Miller's Hollow, if the wolves catch the Little Girl peeking, they can point at her, and she dies on the spot.

Not sure if that would change anyone's opinions.

[Mirth]

I say make the little girl some variant of insane (and don't tell her which) and the werewolves a kill or recruit cult incapable of communicating amongst themselves, and thrown in a busdriver or three and a switch for the werewolf kills, and you've

fairly broken it for everyone

fixed the problem.

[Lawrencelot]

In the real game, if you know there is a little girl as werewolves, you could just look for that role and not kill anyone besides the little girl. On a forum that role does not exist, it would have to be a variation.

[dramonic]

For once I'll be the enlightening one!

The little girl role can peek during the werewolf turn. HOWEVER, the werewolves are shown who their partners are (so the little girl can't pretend to be a werewolf)

Also, if they see her peeking, they can kill her and it does NOT count as their nightkill. so they kill the girl and someone else.

[alexhans]

dramonic... No.

The girl basically sucks... That's it.

[ExoticQueen]

I have a slight idea of how that can work online. IK that IRL, the player of the little girl role has to peek without getting caught. They would either pose as werewolves and wake when they wake and pretend they're on their team. I can imagine someone new to the role peek their and then getting caught then be like "NO! MY EYES WERE SHUT! " To have a little girl role here, you would have to put them in the werewolf/mafia private thread or message and tell them as the host, to be careful who they trust because one of them is the little girl. I don't think they're that OP because like any other role in Mafia/Werewolf, one simply can't trust what role another player claims they are. The little girl can say they're the little girl, but who's to believe? That's the role's disadvantage. A werewolf can lie and say their the little girl and lead the wrong people to believe players on the village team are werewolves.

[MarioManiac4]

d1: lynch little girl
boom
game solved/10

[BBmolla]

I have a slight idea of how that can work online. IK that IRL, the player of the little girl role has to peek without getting caught. They would either pose as werewolves and wake when they wake and pretend they're on their team. I can imagine someone new to the role peek their and then getting caught then be like "NO! MY EYES WERE SHUT! " To have a little girl role here, you would have to put them in the werewolf/mafia private thread or message and tell them as the host, to be careful who they trust because one of them is the little girl. I don't think they're that OP because like any other role in Mafia/Werewolf, one simply can't trust what role another player claims they are. The little girl can say they're the little girl, but who's to believe? That's the role's disadvantage. A werewolf can lie and say their the little girl and lead the wrong people to believe players on the village team are werewolves.

"Hi guys I'm the little girl. X, Y, and Z are the mafia. Good game all!"

[Lycanfire]

it's really disappointing to see people porting the role as is as a joke

there's ways to make it work. like providing alt accounts to the scumteam for use in the PT.

to interact with the other mechanic, scum can double kill if they kill the little girl on a night she is peaking.

the role has more promise than people are making it out to have... it's like a reverse encryptor. a nerf to scum communication.

[Creature]

Strategy for Little Girl: Wait until the mod orders werewolves to close their eyes and take a quick peek.