How strong could a SK be?

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Post Post #50  (ISO)  » Thu Feb 05, 2009 4:25 pm

NK immune is too strong for SK! Stealing our win...

But seriously, a SK just won another game I was in too, where him being able to commute every other night (all night actions targetting him failed) ended up winning it for him because he was immune to a crosskill on the last night.

I say a NK immune SK is too strong.

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Post Post #51  (ISO)  » Thu Feb 05, 2009 4:29 pm

lol...BITTER!

But, charter, you were NK immune too, being the GF. If the Mafia gets a NK immune player, it seems fair to give that to the other scum team (SK). If you weren't NK immune, then I could see how it would be unfair for me to be. But you were NK immune also.
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Post Post #52  (ISO)  » Thu Feb 05, 2009 4:30 pm

Well, if I tried to kill, I lost my NK immune and investigation immune. Perhaps something similar for SKs?

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Post Post #53  (ISO)  » Thu Feb 05, 2009 4:33 pm

charter wrote:Well, if I tried to kill, I lost my NK immune and investigation immune. Perhaps something similar for SKs?


lol...

But your buddies could make the kill and I couldn't have someone else do my killing.

But maybe some condition on the NK immunity would be good. 1-shot. Or something else.
Talk nerdy to me.

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Post Post #54  (ISO)  » Thu Feb 05, 2009 4:36 pm

One shot or something might work. Or you get a one shot NK immunity, but you have to choose which night to use it.

(and had I made it through that night I would have NOT killed as long as you were still there to kill people until the game got down to two people and we would have won)

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Post Post #55  (ISO)  » Thu Feb 05, 2009 10:36 pm

Hmm...reading this thread gave me an idea...

Compulsive SK that kills more and more every night, no other buffs. Flavor would be something like he has to kill more to get a killing high or whatever. But, mechanically, it'd be like

N1: 1 kill
N2: 2 kills
N3: 3 kills
And so on and so forth. This is probably overpowered but in a large game with a few killing roles it might be stopped before it starts rolling.
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Post Post #56  (ISO)  » Thu Feb 05, 2009 10:56 pm

forbiddanlight wrote:Hmm...reading this thread gave me an idea...

Compulsive SK that kills more and more every night, no other buffs. Flavor would be something like he has to kill more to get a killing high or whatever. But, mechanically, it'd be like

N1: 1 kill
N2: 2 kills
N3: 3 kills
And so on and so forth. This is probably overpowered but in a large game with a few killing roles it might be stopped before it starts rolling.


That sounds highly overpowered to me.

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Post Post #57  (ISO)  » Thu Feb 05, 2009 11:04 pm

Goatrevolt wrote:
forbiddanlight wrote:Hmm...reading this thread gave me an idea...

Compulsive SK that kills more and more every night, no other buffs. Flavor would be something like he has to kill more to get a killing high or whatever. But, mechanically, it'd be like

N1: 1 kill
N2: 2 kills
N3: 3 kills
And so on and so forth. This is probably overpowered but in a large game with a few killing roles it might be stopped before it starts rolling.


That sounds highly overpowered to me.


Hmm...there's probably a way to balance it though. Maybe lots of protective roles :S.
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Post Post #58  (ISO)  » Thu Feb 05, 2009 11:05 pm

forbiddanlight wrote:
Goatrevolt wrote:
forbiddanlight wrote:Hmm...reading this thread gave me an idea...

Compulsive SK that kills more and more every night, no other buffs. Flavor would be something like he has to kill more to get a killing high or whatever. But, mechanically, it'd be like

N1: 1 kill
N2: 2 kills
N3: 3 kills
And so on and so forth. This is probably overpowered but in a large game with a few killing roles it might be stopped before it starts rolling.


That sounds highly overpowered to me.


Hmm...there's probably a way to balance it though. Maybe lots of protective roles :S.


Make everyone night kill immune :).

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Post Post #59  (ISO)  » Thu Feb 05, 2009 11:07 pm

Goatrevolt wrote:
forbiddanlight wrote:
Goatrevolt wrote:
forbiddanlight wrote:Hmm...reading this thread gave me an idea...

Compulsive SK that kills more and more every night, no other buffs. Flavor would be something like he has to kill more to get a killing high or whatever. But, mechanically, it'd be like

N1: 1 kill
N2: 2 kills
N3: 3 kills
And so on and so forth. This is probably overpowered but in a large game with a few killing roles it might be stopped before it starts rolling.


That sounds highly overpowered to me.


Hmm...there's probably a way to balance it though. Maybe lots of protective roles :S.


Make everyone night kill immune :).


That's bastard moddery at it's finest (and hoses the mafia). But it would be funny.

Actually...maybe a different table

N1: 1 kill
N2: 1 kill
N3: 2 kills
N4: 2 kills
N5: 3 kills
...
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Post Post #60  (ISO)  » Thu Feb 05, 2009 11:24 pm

An SK should have always have NK immunity if the game is large (+12) or if the game has multiple killing factions (two families/vig). I dont think SK should just get a kill, given that everyone wants them dead they need something to supplement it in the end, either NK immune, or some other little quirk.
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Post Post #61  (ISO)  » Fri Feb 06, 2009 3:34 am

My serial killer was within one turn of winning in my last game that I ran, the only reason it's hard to win with is that you have no teammates, and you can also use this to your advantage if you are smart. Dumb sk's don't last very long, true.

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Post Post #62  (ISO)  » Fri Feb 06, 2009 3:38 am

I've heard optimal SK play is to claim in your first post, but sincerely suggest that you will use your abilities for the betterment of the town only, and not for personal gain.

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Post Post #63  (ISO)  » Fri Feb 06, 2009 3:43 am

Goatrevolt wrote:I've heard optimal SK play is to claim in your first post, but sincerely suggest that you will use your abilities for the betterment of the town only, and not for personal gain.


This does not really work well in practice
A child believes a lie because they know no better
A grown adult sees the lie because it fails to line up with experience
In this way a child's story can be so many different experiences
With enough subtext, a thing made for a child becomes an entirely different world to an adult.

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Post Post #64  (ISO)  » Fri Feb 06, 2009 3:52 am

LlamaFluff wrote:
Goatrevolt wrote:I've heard optimal SK play is to claim in your first post, but sincerely suggest that you will use your abilities for the betterment of the town only, and not for personal gain.


This does not really work well in practice


Hahaha. That's excellent. And people say the random phase is meaningless...

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Post Post #65  (ISO)  » Fri Feb 06, 2009 11:45 am

What about if you put the SK in a game full of survivors and nothing else?
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Post Post #66  (ISO)  » Fri Feb 06, 2009 11:49 am

Apll3ez wrote:What about if you put the SK in a game full of survivors and nothing else?


Then it is not mafia.

(and by some stock win conditions is an immediate win for every player.)
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Post Post #67  (ISO)  » Fri Feb 06, 2009 12:02 pm

Goatrevolt wrote:I've heard optimal SK play is to claim in your first post, but sincerely suggest that you will use your abilities for the betterment of the town only, and not for personal gain.

There is zero chance you will win this way.

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Post Post #68  (ISO)  » Fri Feb 06, 2009 12:06 pm

Goatrevolt wrote:
forbiddanlight wrote:
Goatrevolt wrote:
forbiddanlight wrote:Hmm...reading this thread gave me an idea...

Compulsive SK that kills more and more every night, no other buffs. Flavor would be something like he has to kill more to get a killing high or whatever. But, mechanically, it'd be like

N1: 1 kill
N2: 2 kills
N3: 3 kills
And so on and so forth. This is probably overpowered but in a large game with a few killing roles it might be stopped before it starts rolling.


That sounds highly overpowered to me.


Hmm...there's probably a way to balance it though. Maybe lots of protective roles :S.


Make everyone night kill immune :).


And a vig. And a cop. And a miller.
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Post Post #69  (ISO)  » Sat Feb 07, 2009 7:20 am

charter wrote:
Goatrevolt wrote:I've heard optimal SK play is to claim in your first post, but sincerely suggest that you will use your abilities for the betterment of the town only, and not for personal gain.

There is zero chance you will win this way.


Don't knock it till you've tried it :).

I know it's an awful strategy. The link LlamaFluff posted was pretty funny though. Poor Xtoxm...

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Post Post #70  (ISO)  » Sat Feb 07, 2009 10:37 am

charter wrote:Well, if I tried to kill, I lost my NK immune and investigation immune. Perhaps something similar for SKs?
I actually love this modification on the traditional NK-immune power. It's a little like holing up in your Safe Room, vs. walking around in a Bulletproof Vest that magically covers your head, neck, feet, and elbows as well.
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Post Post #71  (ISO)  » Sat Feb 07, 2009 2:25 pm

Mr. Flay wrote:
charter wrote:Well, if I tried to kill, I lost my NK immune and investigation immune. Perhaps something similar for SKs?
I actually love this modification on the traditional NK-immune power. It's a little like holing up in your Safe Room, vs. walking around in a Bulletproof Vest that magically covers your head, neck, feet, and elbows as well.
I would never kill if those were the benefits to not killing.
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Post Post #72  (ISO)  » Sun Feb 08, 2009 7:00 am

NK Immune means the player has to not get lynched, whilst the possibility of him getting investigated remains. I don't think it's overpowered per se. The benefit of it is that prisoner's dilemmas auto-resolve in the SK's favour. Obviously the larger the game is, the less useful the ability.

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Post Post #73  (ISO)  » Sun Feb 08, 2009 11:01 am

You can always limit the number of NK imunity an SK has to once in minis and twice to thrice in larges. I also thought of sk like this that I have used in an open face to face setup

Ultra Seriel Killer - Wins if he is the only player left alive at the end or nothing can prevent this. Can kill any player at night even if they are doc protected. If no one was lynched during the previous day he gets to perform an extra kill at night.

I'm debating on adding some night protections or investigation imunity to balance out other roles or perhaps this is already enough.
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Post Post #74  (ISO)  » Sun Feb 08, 2009 1:21 pm

Alduskkel wrote:
Mr. Flay wrote:
charter wrote:Well, if I tried to kill, I lost my NK immune and investigation immune. Perhaps something similar for SKs?
I actually love this modification on the traditional NK-immune power. It's a little like holing up in your Safe Room, vs. walking around in a Bulletproof Vest that magically covers your head, neck, feet, and elbows as well.
I would never kill if those were the benefits to not killing.


Really? I would almost never hide just to make myself nightkill immune, unless I had reason to think the scum or the vig was about to kill me that night; the kill is just way too important to the SK's chances of winning.
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