If you die you lose

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If you die you lose

Post Post #0 (ISO) » Thu Oct 13, 2016 3:29 pm

Post by Flubbernugget »

I remember vaguely reading somewhere there is a mafia community that plays where you can only win if you reach your faction's wincon and you are alive at endgame. Has anyone ever played mafia like that? What did you think of it? How well do you think that would work on this site? I think it would make for an interesting blitz or micro.
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Post Post #1 (ISO) » Thu Oct 13, 2016 3:40 pm

Post by Majiffy »

Oh yes lets give all the players a survivor wincon that won't turn into chaos and toxicity.
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Post Post #2 (ISO) » Thu Oct 13, 2016 3:45 pm

Post by Gamma Emerald »

This is the dumbest thing I have ever heard, hands down.
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Post Post #3 (ISO) » Thu Oct 13, 2016 4:19 pm

Post by Vampirate »

This would drastically alter how town players play the game making them far more selfish than usual.
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Post Post #4 (ISO) » Thu Oct 13, 2016 5:28 pm

Post by SpyreX »

There is no town. It's popularity survivor contest
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I always lynch scum... sometimes they're just not mafia. :P

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Post Post #5 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2016 1:20 am

Post by Thersesom »

In post 0, Flubbernugget wrote:that? What did you think of it? How well do you think that would work on this sit
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Post Post #6 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2016 2:51 am

Post by Bins »

This is normally the mentality I play with whether I mean to or not.
is this where I tell you to swipe right

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Post Post #7 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2016 3:09 am

Post by mykonian »

you aren't alone, it's common.
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Post Post #8 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2016 3:43 am

Post by Vi »

I had the opposite mentality. After dying N1 I could spend the rest of the game heckling the people who harassed me D1.
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Post Post #9 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2016 3:52 am

Post by The MM »

I tend to want to live far too much, but my favourite (wait, not my favourite, my ONLY) success story so far was my death Night 1, which was a boon to the town. And I loved it.

I don't care if I die anymore. It's just a game, and people are far nicer to me out of it anyway.
Waiting for the day I can come back and mod games.
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Post Post #10 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2016 3:56 am

Post by MagnaofIllusion »

In post 3, Vampirate wrote:This would drastically alter how town players play the game making them far more selfish than usual.
Not for a subset of the population of the MafiaScum community ...
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Post Post #11 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2016 4:42 am

Post by kuribo »

i think i wanna run this setup

One scum team

The rest are Suvivor Dayvigs.

Dayvigs can't shoot two days in a row.

Mafia Goons can night kill, but they can't dayvig. They have a godfather who can dayvig with the same rules as the town.


It's Bad Idea + Survivor, this could either suck worse than anything or be the best thing ever.

edit: ooh and a name: "Survival of the Fittest Mafia"
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Post Post #12 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2016 7:34 am

Post by GreyICE »

It's literally just survivor. The stupid game where they "strand" morons on a desert island. Because the only incentive to help someone else is stupidity.

Watch. I'm run up to L-1 day 1 and forced to claim. "I'm scum. And not only that, whoever hammers? We're going to shoot them."

Where is your win condition now, maggots?
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Post Post #13 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2016 11:21 am

Post by RadiantCowbells »

I actually had the opposite idea for a game.

As town:
If you're involved in a certain # of town lynches or didn't end enough days with your vote on scum you lose. Else, win.
If you are nightkilled (read: Bribed for flavour) you win. period.

As scum:
If you are lynched you lose. Probably with some invokable bus mechanic whereby you can win if your team wins but with some conditions to fulfill.
If you live to a certain point in the game you win.
2019 stats: Town WR 76.7%, overall WR 81.667%, 1 scum defeat involving a major mod error in lylo vs 8 scum wins.
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Post Post #14 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2016 11:24 am

Post by Firebringer »

In post 13, RadiantCowbells wrote:I actually had the opposite idea for a game.

As town:
If you're involved in a certain # of town lynches or didn't end enough days with your vote on scum you lose. Else, win.
If you are nightkilled (read: Bribed for flavour) you win. period.

As scum:
If you are lynched you lose.
If you live to endgame you win.
What if you are lynched but you were voting/pushing scum?

I think in that case scum being lynched is kind of bad because planned bussing then ends.
Sometimes scum planning to throw someone under buss is now not available.
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"last time I was scum with Firebringer
his first post in the scum PT was "yes I rolled scum!"
I decided to post "haha just don't post that in the main thread", but to get up to date on the main thread first.

His first post in the main thread was "yes I rolled scum!" -popsofctown
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Post Post #15 (ISO) » Sat Oct 15, 2016 2:08 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 8, Vi wrote:I had the opposite mentality. After dying N1 I could spend the rest of the game heckling the people who harassed me D1.
Getting killed N1 is amazing because it implicitly means that you're considered the best town player/closest to catch mafia, AND you don't have to take responsibility if town loses
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

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Post Post #16 (ISO) » Sat Oct 15, 2016 6:30 am

Post by RadiantCowbells »

In post 15, Accountant wrote:
In post 8, Vi wrote:I had the opposite mentality. After dying N1 I could spend the rest of the game heckling the people who harassed me D1.
Getting killed N1 is amazing because it implicitly means that you're considered the best town player/closest to catch mafia, AND you don't have to take responsibility if town loses
You still lose and don't get half the fun of playing the game that others do. It's not a walk in the park, not even remotely.
2019 stats: Town WR 76.7%, overall WR 81.667%, 1 scum defeat involving a major mod error in lylo vs 8 scum wins.
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Post Post #17 (ISO) » Sat Oct 15, 2016 6:32 am

Post by Firebringer »

I don't know, just knowing you played well enough kind of feels like all the validation i need. Winning after that just feels like a bonus.
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"last time I was scum with Firebringer
his first post in the scum PT was "yes I rolled scum!"
I decided to post "haha just don't post that in the main thread", but to get up to date on the main thread first.

His first post in the main thread was "yes I rolled scum!" -popsofctown
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Post Post #18 (ISO) » Sat Oct 15, 2016 6:34 am

Post by callforjudgement »

In post 1, Majiffy wrote:Oh yes lets give all the players a survivor wincon that won't turn into chaos and toxicity.
It's actually a Town Survivor wincon, which is not quite the same. In particular, it doesn't screw with endgame maths nearly as badly as Neutral Survivor. Thus, it's a less terrible role. Nonetheless, it's still terrible.

There are two main things that distinguish scum from town in a normal game: scum have more of an incentive to survive and to keep their buddies alive; and scum have low investment in scumhunting. If you're going to make deaths into, effectively, modkills, then both of these distinguishing factors get smaller; town now have an incentive to survive too (so they aren't going to look as different from the scum); and town also benefit from appearing to be uninvested in scumhunting, because it reduces the chance that they're nightkilled (which would also make them lose).

About the most I can see going in this direction is for townies to lose if they're mislynched, and scum to lose if they die (but townies to not lose if nightkilled). That fixes one of the problems above, in that scumhunting doesn't become any less effective for town. However, the other problem still remains, and seems mostly unfixable in this sort of setup.
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Post Post #19 (ISO) » Sat Oct 15, 2016 7:09 am

Post by kuribo »

DGB and I are working on a dayvig survival setup to run
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Post Post #20 (ISO) » Sat Oct 15, 2016 7:24 am

Post by McMenno »

pre in
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Post Post #21 (ISO) » Tue Oct 18, 2016 2:21 am

Post by Papa Zito »

In post 12, GreyICE wrote:It's literally just survivor. The stupid game where they "strand" morons on a desert island. Because the only incentive to help someone else is stupidity.
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Post Post #22 (ISO) » Tue Oct 18, 2016 2:40 am

Post by Vi »

In post 16, RadiantCowbells wrote:
In post 15, Accountant wrote:
In post 8, Vi wrote:I had the opposite mentality. After dying N1 I could spend the rest of the game heckling the people who harassed me D1.
Getting killed N1 is amazing because it implicitly means that you're considered the best town player/closest to catch mafia, AND you don't have to take responsibility if town loses
You still lose and don't get half the fun of playing the game that others do. It's not a walk in the park, not even remotely.
Not playing Mafia is the most fun part of playing Mafia though.

Also if I lose after dying N1, whatever? Mafia is a team game and I don't usually wind up with a power role, so etc.
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Post Post #23 (ISO) » Tue Oct 18, 2016 3:15 am

Post by kuribo »

In post 12, GreyICE wrote:The stupid game where they "strand" morons on a desert island.
You should try Naked and Afraid.

They take a man and a woman, put them in god-awful conditions like a jungle or the savannah, leave them there naked with only a bag and one item. Then they film them, but they leave at night so the two people have to fend for themselves. There's no prize money. You can tap out at any time, but you'll leave your partner to fend for it alone. Production apparently only intervenes in the event of serious problems, in which case they send a medic team.

The production crew has literally watched people drink contaminated water and get parasites without intervening. (Those people tap out and get medical attention) Sometimes the people accidentally burn their camps down too.

It's pretty intense but after awhile you find yourself shouting DON'T DRINK THAT YOU FUCKING MORON.
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Post Post #24 (ISO) » Thu Oct 20, 2016 5:27 am

Post by vonflare »

In post 12, GreyICE wrote: I'm run up to L-1 day 1 and forced to claim. "I'm scum. And not only that, whoever hammers? We're going to shoot them."
yep, this is the reason why it doesn't work.
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