Scummies Nomination Thread 2017

[schadd_]

Hi guys.
Thanks for the support.

On phone now but this is my only other completed town game since coming back: viewtopic.php?f=56&t=73385.

Unfortunately rolled scum in the other two...

THE SITE CHAT GAME MY DUDE

[Leonshade]

Okay speaking seriously for a moment. I think it's a little silly to nom someone for Paragon when what you're actually nomming them for is Best Town Performance (which doesn't exist anymore) and then relegate responsibility to the judges. It's not your fault obviously that Best Town doesn't exist anymore (probably for good reason?) so it makes sense that you'd want to use Paragon as a substitute but Paragon is a body of work award so if the body of work isn't there then it shouldn't be the nomination if you want the awards to have a real sense of integrity. Obviously the whole idea of awards as a thing in itself is a little silly and worth a bit of fun more than anything but that's not an excuse imo to make them even more silly by casually throwing nominations around.

I agree that from what I read Ellibereth had some tops dayplay there, and he deserves props for that tops for sure. If he plays more games at the same level I'd be the first on board to nom him for Paragon. I don't agree that someone playing one or two great games qualifies them for a body of work award and I can think of a bunch of people who have played one or two great towngames lately who haven't even been considered as a Paragon nom. Saying that you'll amend your nom when he plays more great games kind of makes your nom shallow because it looks like you're either invested in a way that doesn't make sense for an awards process (which I think should be a mostly rational process) or just not really vetting your nom very thoroughly. Maybe I'm just being Doctor Stiff O'clock and overly legalistic but I think nomming people for things that don't really fit the nom cheapens it and expecting the judges on top of that to sort through the noise isn't a super great approach overall.

I don't really disagree with your point. I realize that Paragon is a body of work award, which is why I asked Ellibereth how many other town games he's finished in the game thread. But I got wrapped up in the flood of people verbalizing Elli for paragon, and when Zoraster came in to say that nobody actually nominated him, I figured I might as well do it.

The lack of a Best Town doesn't mean that we just use Paragon as a replacement. Though there is the problem mhsmith mentioned, where there aren't even that many candidates for Paragon, and it's already November. Besides Ellibereth, there are only two candidates, one of whom might not even be eligible come awards day. So I don't think this is a situation where the category is being flooded with unqualifying candidates, so much as in the absence of candidates, the category is being relaxed.

But you're right that if we're just awarding noms based on one or two games, a lot more people could deserve nominations. I won't withdraw my nomination, but I'll understand if Elli isn't determined to qualify by the end of the year.

(One last note I'd like to make is that I was nominated based on two finished games, so it's not like it's unusual to make a nomination based on a couple games, with the expectation that there will be more games to support the nomination).

[Ellibereth]

Hi guys.
Thanks for the support.

On phone now but this is my only other completed town game since coming back: viewtopic.php?f=56&t=73385.

Unfortunately rolled scum in the other two...

besides RVS Bulba

Elli literally only voted scum players

nah, got jebaited by desperado

[RadiantCowbells]

-

[Alisae]

isn't she also new?

[RadiantCowbells]

-

[Alisae]

ok i trust you

[RadiantCowbells]

-

[skirt skirt]

i would support her for rising star, better than the other noms i've seen for it

think you're overblowing with paragon, having been in a couple of her games, think she's definitely a good addition to the site and a good new player but i personally wouldn't ever say her play in my games with her was "outstanding" but hey, good luck if you do stick to that over rising star. no reason she can't be nommed for both either.

[Alisae]

I have people I want to nom for rising star but they haven't rolled scum yet.

[RadiantCowbells]

-

[Alisae]

to be fair
I don't think those are the most impressive playerlists
yet again I trust cowbells so...

[RadiantCowbells]

-

[skirt skirt]

i would support her for rising star, better than the other noms i've seen for it

think you're overblowing with paragon, having been in a couple of her games, think she's definitely a good addition to the site and a good new player but i personally wouldn't ever say her play in my games with her was "outstanding" but hey, good luck if you do stick to that over rising star. no reason she can't be nommed for both either.

Her completed game history of the year as town includes four games of which two of them were absolutely spectacular, one was better than great, and one was a loss but she was still one of town's best players.

I would understand why people would be slow to nom her for paragon because her play doesn't look like what one would imagine the paragon as but she's extremely near the top in terms of reads and night actions and generally gets her scumreads lynched while avoiding being lynched herself and that's what a paragon is supposed to be. I think going off of an admittedly small four game body of work she deserves the win more than anyone currently nominated so I will absolutely nominate her off of that regardless of the fact that she doesn't play like Eliberetta, or Spiffeh, or most of the other paragon winners who try to be town leader directly do.

Newbie 1813 where she successfully predicted several scum nightkills, caught scum and won the game for town despite a no lynch.

Ari's Game where she helped lynch scum day 1 and successfully PRed scum N1 for the win.

Just Mafia where she hard led on scum D1 and got a perfect town win in the process.

Vanilluxe Mafia where she lost but generally played well and helped catch one scum.

I mean, I've specced a couple of her games and it looked reasonably good, but Vanilluxe (the one I was in) I wasn't overly impressed which is why I don't really feel paragon. I had her pretty pocketed (Frogger and I were the two most townread players by a significant margin going into d2) and we leveraged that along with our personality differences into bussing me and letting Frogger literally coast to a win. viewtopic.php?p=8926331#p8926331 didn't change until we wanted it to. GL was the only chance town really had, not Sobolev who was just another one of the hard pocketed townies. She didn't play any worse than the other players (all of which had far more experience than her) but she didn't play better either. Like, at no point did we think "ugh, sobolev is gonna be an issue", moreso in the mislynch pile. I remember most of my completed games almost perfectly because I study them to see where I could have improved. She was no worse than those other more experienced players, and she did better in the other games you linked, but as Alisae said the players there were mostly meh and that's why I see her more as rising star than paragon.


Are we actually supposed to be discussing/debating the noms or do people just do it? lol

[Alisae]

Sure let's discuss and debate noms we got nothing else better to do.

Also lets Nom RC for paragon

[RadiantCowbells]

-

[Alisae]

Oh yeah btw
how come no one nominated this for best setup yet?
I mean sure its a Varsoon game, but I mean FUCKING LOOK AT IT
IT LOOKS AMAZING

Or this for best flavour which was handwritten, original, and fucking inspiring.

Like fuck players man, we honestly need to celebrate more mods. Our modding community is WAY better then our playbase, and it fucking shows.
It is shocking that no one is celebrating it.

[Alisae]

Actually I'ma nom Gay Mafia III for Best Flavour as well that shit was also inspiring.

[skirt skirt]

You both had extremely strong games there in general. Should everyone who has been crushed by me as town be automatically excluded from consideration because they weren't a threat to me?

She was no worse than those other more experienced players, and she did better in the other games you linked, but as Alisae said the players there were mostly meh and that's why I see her more as rising star than paragon.

I think this works the opposite way that you think it does.

I mean, yeah, no points against her when 6 far more experienced players didn't catch us either. As a rising star, she has a good record and is consistently good. The town players being meh would be points in her favour for sure, but the scum being even meh-er takes that away.

Dunno, when I envision paragon one of my completely subjective requirements is a person I, as scum, consider a threat from pregame purely as a player. Eli/you/alisae are good examples. Sobolev isn't. That clearly means nothing, but its why I don't see it. I'll probably nom her for rising star later if nobody does though.

[RadiantCowbells]

-

[Alisae]

Dunno, when I envision paragon one of my completely subjective requirements is a person I, as scum, consider a threat from pregame purely as a player. Eli/you/alisae are good examples. Sobolev isn't. That clearly means nothing, but its why I don't see it. I'll probably nom her for rising star later if nobody does though.

I think a lot of players you would see and feel threatened by in pregame actually do poorly in general and a lot of people you don't know enough to be threatened by are very successful in general.

Yeah this is true.
Like for example, GuiltyLion is one of those players I don't feel threatened by, but he is very sucessful in general.
Atleast from what I remember.

[Alisae]

Best Performance Third Party: Also known as the “Hannibal Lecter” Award. Awarded to the player or players that performed the most impressively in winning their game as a third party.

> checks the sheet
> Sees no third party noms

LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL

[RadiantCowbells]

Dunno, when I envision paragon one of my completely subjective requirements is a person I, as scum, consider a threat from pregame purely as a player. Eli/you/alisae are good examples. Sobolev isn't. That clearly means nothing, but its why I don't see it. I'll probably nom her for rising star later if nobody does though.

I think a lot of players you would see and feel threatened by in pregame actually do poorly in general and a lot of people you don't know enough to be threatened by are very successful in general.

Yeah this is true.
Like for example, GuiltyLion is one of those players I don't feel threatened by, but he is very sucessful in general.
Atleast from what I remember.

Statistically GL isn't actually that threatening in general as town

[Alisae]

Dunno, when I envision paragon one of my completely subjective requirements is a person I, as scum, consider a threat from pregame purely as a player. Eli/you/alisae are good examples. Sobolev isn't. That clearly means nothing, but its why I don't see it. I'll probably nom her for rising star later if nobody does though.

I think a lot of players you would see and feel threatened by in pregame actually do poorly in general and a lot of people you don't know enough to be threatened by are very successful in general.

Yeah this is true.
Like for example, GuiltyLion is one of those players I don't feel threatened by, but he is very sucessful in general.
Atleast from what I remember.

Statistically GL isn't actually that threatening in general as town

ATLEAST FROM WHAT I REMEMBER OKAY RC
seesh

[Varsoon]

Oh yeah btw
how come no one nominated this for best setup yet?
I mean sure its a Varsoon game, but I mean FUCKING LOOK AT IT
IT LOOKS AMAZING

Thanks,
putting that game together was such a labor of love. The amount of effort that I put into that setup was crazy. I had to dredge up a ton of game assets to make all the classes and rolecards work.
I also, apparently, love running setups that can only be done once. The whole hidden-player recruiting a scumteam in pregame fit the flavor so damn well but it's really something that I couldn't run again without it being obvious to anyone who knows my mod meta--sort of how I can't pull off the shenanigans that I did in Space Dandy 2 (multiple game threads, everyone given the main character's flavor secretly) and Bloodborne (multiple secret PTs that scum could drag players into).
Just wish that the anonymous mechanics worked out a little better. It'll likely be the last anonymous game I run on-site just because of how poorly it turned out in regards to players slipping/finding replacements.