Charisma and Mafia

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Post Post #100 (ISO) » Sun May 28, 2017 11:30 pm

Post by Firebringer »

In post 97, Grendel wrote:Many players don't post with the intention of making an easier reading experience, they mainly communicate info in a way they'd like to hear it. Which often makes otherwise great players, difficult to play with. You know?

Are you going to talk more about contrasting posting styles and how they affect the game state?

I'm interested in your perception of joke posting, and how that helps you develop reads vs serous posting.
Yeah, many people post in a way they want others to post which can be difficult if the styles of posting are different.

I don't know about making topic for contrasting posting styles, i think that might be more of "how to deal with other styles appropriately?" I do expect to cover word choice as a topic.

I think joke posting is a good thing overall, especially to alleviate any tension exists in a game, because trust me tension will build in a game. Just like it can build in any interaction you have in real life, and making a joke post can alleviate and call to attention that tension and make it so that its dealt with without a "blow up", I often find myself joke posting a great deal of the time, and half of it is to continue making the game fun for myself to alleviate any tension building in me and other half is for players to enjoy the game besides myself. Of course some think I do it too much but thats another thing.
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"last time I was scum with Firebringer
his first post in the scum PT was "yes I rolled scum!"
I decided to post "haha just don't post that in the main thread", but to get up to date on the main thread first.

His first post in the main thread was "yes I rolled scum!" -popsofctown
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Post Post #101 (ISO) » Sun May 28, 2017 11:47 pm

Post by Firebringer »

I think my next topic will be on specifically building a rapport with someone.
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"You are the Joker of mafia players" - Oversoul
"last time I was scum with Firebringer
his first post in the scum PT was "yes I rolled scum!"
I decided to post "haha just don't post that in the main thread", but to get up to date on the main thread first.

His first post in the main thread was "yes I rolled scum!" -popsofctown
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Post Post #102 (ISO) » Mon May 29, 2017 1:40 am

Post by Lycanfire »

I think doing that is difficult. If you build a proper rapport like what you would do with a colleague in mafia you would be a scumfuck. I've read that in live mafia, towns almost always win unless scum forced the town to love them.

It is my belief that the REAL way to build a rapport is to shit test someone-whatever poking and prodding you think will gain a response that should satisfy you if they are town. I've been too busy to continue my post mortem for Newbie 1791, but I did this type of test with GuiltyLion, and he failed it. My meta was brought into question and GL referenced the scumgame of mine he experienced marking the differences in play. I was still trying to feel him out, and didn't feel like I had a good case on him to mark as my primary scumread. I did the EXACT same thing I did in my scumgame on purpose to test his response. His response was the same.

This test? Asking him about a specific intricacy in his play. It didn't matter
what
. In Micro 677, I questioned his motives in trying to build a townbloc and asked him for examples of him doing so previously. In Newbie 1791 I went out of my way to mimic that to spite his townread of me and after he stated that he would 'red and bold' quotes often (which I accused him of being manipulative) I responded with nothing besides 'call', and he supported his statement like he had in the past. That earned him an investigation that night, mainly because I was going to autolynch scum the next day had I lived and I wanted to find their partner, and GL was the most likely.

My way may not be perfect, but I think if you are to do this, it should be in a way similar to this.
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Post Post #103 (ISO) » Mon May 29, 2017 7:08 am

Post by Grendel »

I think to build a rapport with town one has to understand what that particular roster would see as a "Trustworthy town interaction." I don't think there are many truly flexible methods that can be used in any given situation to build a good relationship with others.

I guess the goal is to be really self aware, and to think on ones feet.

So like, really tactical players, and play styles.
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Post Post #104 (ISO) » Mon May 29, 2017 11:59 am

Post by camn »

/me makes eyes at FireBringer
"if you weren't trying to be so unnecessarily mysterious all the time we wouldn't have these misunderstandings" - Yosarian2
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Post Post #105 (ISO) » Mon May 29, 2017 12:08 pm

Post by Firebringer »

hi camn, you are looking stunning today! Is that fresh blood in your hair?
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"You are the Joker of mafia players" - Oversoul
"last time I was scum with Firebringer
his first post in the scum PT was "yes I rolled scum!"
I decided to post "haha just don't post that in the main thread", but to get up to date on the main thread first.

His first post in the main thread was "yes I rolled scum!" -popsofctown
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Post Post #106 (ISO) » Mon May 29, 2017 12:10 pm

Post by camn »

yes. But its my own, sadly.
"if you weren't trying to be so unnecessarily mysterious all the time we wouldn't have these misunderstandings" - Yosarian2
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Post Post #107 (ISO) » Mon May 29, 2017 12:14 pm

Post by Firebringer »

In post 102, Lycanfire wrote:I think doing that is difficult. If you build a proper rapport like what you would do with a colleague in mafia you would be a scumfuck. I've read that in live mafia, towns almost always win unless scum forced the town to love them.
So yeah, thats something about building a rapport and trying to get understanding of someone. In a game of mafia, people will see that as deceptive behavior and think your scummy, but "Buddying" isn't and shouldn't be a scum tell. It is a charisma tell. You can think of the person doing it as manipulative or at least hold one eye open to them at all times but i think going at them with "you buddying me makes you scum" is bad in general, and i have been burned by that before too.

The way you try to build a rapport is actually damaging to you in long run, in the short run it can produce the results you want with getting a good and solid read on them, but in the long run you kind of salt the fields for making a good relationship with that player by either being overly hostile or just trying to push their buttons, which they will recognize.

Like the method you use probably can give you good read results, the problem is it can make the game toxic and unplayable and ruin possibly good relationships with people who don't like that behavior and hate you for "going there".
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"You are the Joker of mafia players" - Oversoul
"last time I was scum with Firebringer
his first post in the scum PT was "yes I rolled scum!"
I decided to post "haha just don't post that in the main thread", but to get up to date on the main thread first.

His first post in the main thread was "yes I rolled scum!" -popsofctown
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Post Post #108 (ISO) » Mon May 29, 2017 12:16 pm

Post by camn »

In post 107, Firebringer wrote:but "Buddying" isn't and shouldn't be a scum tell.
SO TRUE
In post 359, camn wrote:
In post 329, WhyMafia wrote:I was also waiting for Camn to post more to see if she would continue to buddy me (which she is)
Not to bring in a meta defense- But I love buddying. The problem with using it as a scumtell is this: it is equally valuable to town as it is to scum. So there is scum-motivation.. but not exclusive scum-motivation. I have won plenty of games as town because everyone was on my side and willing to listen! And I have LOST plenty of games
as town
because I was too oppositional and nobody would take me seriously.
"if you weren't trying to be so unnecessarily mysterious all the time we wouldn't have these misunderstandings" - Yosarian2
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Post Post #109 (ISO) » Mon May 29, 2017 12:18 pm

Post by Firebringer »

In post 103, Grendel wrote:I think to build a rapport with town one has to understand what that particular roster would see as a "Trustworthy town interaction." I don't think there are many truly flexible methods that can be used in any given situation to build a good relationship with others.

I guess the goal is to be really self aware, and to think on ones feet.

So like, really tactical players, and play styles.
Yeah a bit like this, but you don't need a starting knowledge of how any player roster plays to build up a rapport, its more about like being flexible in your approach to try understand other person and then use that understanding to try and inform them of what you think/believe and show them how you kind of operate under that might be different than the way they see things.

Related: I will try getting that topic written down sometime this week, i am just lazy right now.
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"You are the Joker of mafia players" - Oversoul
"last time I was scum with Firebringer
his first post in the scum PT was "yes I rolled scum!"
I decided to post "haha just don't post that in the main thread", but to get up to date on the main thread first.

His first post in the main thread was "yes I rolled scum!" -popsofctown
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Post Post #110 (ISO) » Mon May 29, 2017 12:24 pm

Post by Firebringer »

In post 106, camn wrote:yes. But its my own, sadly.
well it still looks great, you have to tell me your secret.
Show
"You are the Joker of mafia players" - Oversoul
"last time I was scum with Firebringer
his first post in the scum PT was "yes I rolled scum!"
I decided to post "haha just don't post that in the main thread", but to get up to date on the main thread first.

His first post in the main thread was "yes I rolled scum!" -popsofctown
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Post Post #111 (ISO) » Mon May 29, 2017 12:27 pm

Post by nancy »

Weeeell.... really nothing is inherently a scum tell because everything kinda depends on context.
:2017-2018:
hi meet my mafiascum gravestone, the flowers were probably left by camn or schadd or Prism, blow them kisses for me would you?
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Post Post #112 (ISO) » Mon May 29, 2017 12:27 pm

Post by nancy »

In post 106, camn wrote:yes. But its my own, sadly.
:(
:2017-2018:
hi meet my mafiascum gravestone, the flowers were probably left by camn or schadd or Prism, blow them kisses for me would you?
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Post Post #113 (ISO) » Mon May 29, 2017 12:29 pm

Post by Firebringer »

In post 111, nancy wrote:Weeeell.... really nothing is inherently a scum tell because everything kinda depends on context.
notice how nancy is over extending her words here? That is HER SCUM TELL!!! GET HER EVERYONE!
VOTE: nancy


yeah, everything is mostly dependent on person to person and situation your in. I don't really want to make this about how to scumhunt though, thats not the purpose of this discussion thread so.....
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"You are the Joker of mafia players" - Oversoul
"last time I was scum with Firebringer
his first post in the scum PT was "yes I rolled scum!"
I decided to post "haha just don't post that in the main thread", but to get up to date on the main thread first.

His first post in the main thread was "yes I rolled scum!" -popsofctown
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Post Post #114 (ISO) » Mon May 29, 2017 12:29 pm

Post by camn »

Buddying shouldn't even be a NOMINAL scumtell.

I will start a game day 1 and be like "Oh! FireBringer! I love tigers!" And everyone will be like "camnscum"... until people that know me show up and say "duh camn loves everyone" and I freak out and say "THIS IS HOW EVERYONE SHOULD BE ALL THE TIME"
"if you weren't trying to be so unnecessarily mysterious all the time we wouldn't have these misunderstandings" - Yosarian2
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Post Post #115 (ISO) » Mon May 29, 2017 12:34 pm

Post by Firebringer »

In post 114, camn wrote:Buddying shouldn't even be a NOMINAL scumtell.

I will start a game day 1 and be like "Oh! FireBringer! I love tigers!" And everyone will be like "camnscum"... until people that know me show up and say "duh camn loves everyone" and I freak out and say "THIS IS HOW EVERYONE SHOULD BE ALL THE TIME"
Exactly!

If you want to be more charismatic, which helps you for both alignments, you should buddy players.
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"You are the Joker of mafia players" - Oversoul
"last time I was scum with Firebringer
his first post in the scum PT was "yes I rolled scum!"
I decided to post "haha just don't post that in the main thread", but to get up to date on the main thread first.

His first post in the main thread was "yes I rolled scum!" -popsofctown
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Post Post #116 (ISO) » Mon May 29, 2017 12:37 pm

Post by nancy »

In post 113, Firebringer wrote:
In post 111, nancy wrote:Weeeell.... really nothing is inherently a scum tell because everything kinda depends on context.
notice how nancy is over extending her words here? That is HER SCUM TELL!!! GET HER EVERYONE!
VOTE: nancy


yeah, everything is mostly dependent on person to person and situation your in. I don't really want to make this about how to scumhunt though, thats not the purpose of this discussion thread so.....
You've never seen scum!nancy bae ^_^
:2017-2018:
hi meet my mafiascum gravestone, the flowers were probably left by camn or schadd or Prism, blow them kisses for me would you?
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Post Post #117 (ISO) » Mon May 29, 2017 12:41 pm

Post by Ranmaru »

I love buddying too.
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Post Post #118 (ISO) » Mon May 29, 2017 12:43 pm

Post by camn »

You know what I love ESPECIALLY?

As town, buddying my scumreads.. then they don't kill me.. then i betray them in endgame.

ITS THE BEST
"if you weren't trying to be so unnecessarily mysterious all the time we wouldn't have these misunderstandings" - Yosarian2
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Post Post #119 (ISO) » Mon May 29, 2017 12:47 pm

Post by Firebringer »

In post 118, camn wrote:You know what I love ESPECIALLY?

As town, buddying my scumreads.. then they don't kill me.. then i betray them in endgame.

ITS THE BEST
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Last edited by Firebringer on Mon May 29, 2017 12:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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"You are the Joker of mafia players" - Oversoul
"last time I was scum with Firebringer
his first post in the scum PT was "yes I rolled scum!"
I decided to post "haha just don't post that in the main thread", but to get up to date on the main thread first.

His first post in the main thread was "yes I rolled scum!" -popsofctown
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Post Post #120 (ISO) » Mon May 29, 2017 12:47 pm

Post by nancy »

In post 118, camn wrote:You know what I love ESPECIALLY?

As town, buddying my scumreads.. then they don't kill me.. then i betray them in endgame.

ITS THE BEST
LITERALLY ME

OMG
:2017-2018:
hi meet my mafiascum gravestone, the flowers were probably left by camn or schadd or Prism, blow them kisses for me would you?
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Post Post #121 (ISO) » Mon May 29, 2017 12:51 pm

Post by gigabyteTroubadour »

the few times i tried to do that it backfired really badly :(
i no longer strictly go by they/them and honestly prefer she/her but they/them's fine if you're used to it i guess

☭ I'm coming for that toothbrush ☭
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Post Post #122 (ISO) » Mon May 29, 2017 12:51 pm

Post by Ranmaru »

I only like to buddy with my town reads. Usually I just vote one of my suspects on D1. (Unless it's a good player I doubt and need flips before having an idea of their alignment)
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Post Post #123 (ISO) » Mon May 29, 2017 12:53 pm

Post by Firebringer »

theres a reason why i put in my sig "be nice to your scumreads"
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"You are the Joker of mafia players" - Oversoul
"last time I was scum with Firebringer
his first post in the scum PT was "yes I rolled scum!"
I decided to post "haha just don't post that in the main thread", but to get up to date on the main thread first.

His first post in the main thread was "yes I rolled scum!" -popsofctown
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Post Post #124 (ISO) » Mon May 29, 2017 12:56 pm

Post by Ranmaru »

Nice how? I think I'm a bit cold to my scumreads. :giggle:
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