I'll stand by (most) the games I've made, and will definitely own up to the flaws in ones like SaGa and Bloodborne, but quality of the mafia game setup isn't quite what I want to discuss here--it just bums me out that themes are often not too heavily integrated into theme games. This doesn't mean it doesn't ever happen: mastin and fakegod make some really great setups and I've often pointed newer players to Borkjerfkin and Fakegod's large themes as great examples of making an enjoyable game of mafia that also does an effective job at rendering the theme. That said, the kind of game that I want to play is always even more off-kilter, though Fakegod's games are a great example of what a 'grounded' variant of what I want to do would look like.
One criticism that I often do see is that there's not enough clarity in mechanics, though I think an issue that I struggle with is that while mechanics of the game should make clear sense, what seems to make more sense to players are fairly standard roles/setups rather than a non-standard role written in clear-cut language. I've caught way less flak for just saying "You are a Doctor" than writing roles that say "Once per night, you may protect a player of your choice from being killed."
But, yeah, as much as I do get caught up in mechanics, I, ironically, want them to be less important than the rhetoric of the game and only exist as a means of rendering theme, if that makes sense? I think that's the main difference with me--I try to design my mechanics as a rendering of theme, then try to balance them from there, whereas I find most mods try to build a balanced game of Mafia and then apply theming as they go/after the fact.
I tend to get very wrapped up in the games I make, where I put tons and tons of effort into public mechanics and unique private roles and theming that it comes as bit of a slap in the face when I realize my design sensibilities are not reflective of what mostly gets run even in the same 'genre' of game on this site. It's not that this kind of theme game is bad--in fact, it's probably far closer to the sort of mafia game that most people are traditionally used to playing and want to play, but still. Is a theme just a coat of paint to slap onto your regular ole closed setup? I don't want it to be. Again, designing a fairly normal game and then theming it is not a bad thing, just not
my thing
, which can surprise me, because after running my things for the last few months, it's easy to go "Oh, this is what a theme game is, it's my thing!" but that's not true at all and in a way that kinda makes me feel bummed out. Like, I know people enjoy my games and like to play my games but I kinda wanna play my games too, y'know? And when push comes to shove, it's like, people don't really want to make my games or even conceptualize of theme games the way I do and while, at first, maybe I should feel shiny and novel and unique and smugly contrarian for doing something different, it's really that difference that I crave, and having to realize the world isn't like that and theme games aren't like that--it makes me feel really 'other' and small and as though what I do is dumb and contrary. It's as if I'm in a bubble and what I'm doing is isolated and, upon realizing that, I feel a bit isolated. I don't know. It bums me out, though.TL;DR:
I tend to approach theme games with a mentality of identifying what's central to the theme and then rendering those aspects as mafia mechanics and then attempting to balance what comes out of that.
I find that most mods that design theme games (with some notable exceptions) prefer to design a closed setup first and foremost, then apply light theming secondarily.
I worry that my design sensibilities aren't reflected in the mafia community and often find myself disappointed with other theme games not just because they aren't designed in a similar way, but also because they make my efforts and time invested feel contrary to what most people envision as a theme game.
Thoughts? Discussion? Ideas?
Again, not really looking for constructive criticism here, as I like what I do and I want to continue to make Varsoon™ games. I just wanted to get a bit o this off my chest and offer a space where people can discuss their thoughts on theming and games.
) And I introduced an addendum to the core idea--nobody knowing who to trust, who they were allied with and who they were enemies with. I wanted players to figure out on their own who their enemies were and who their allies were, so I was deliberately vague on wincons. Each purely-town faction (human1, human2, human3, individual human/human 4, individual undead, individual vampire) had the same wording, but a different faction name; "You win when all threats to [their faction name] are eliminated".
