Newbie Setup Discussion: 2d3

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Newbie Setup Discussion: 2d3

Post Post #0 (ISO) » Tue Jan 02, 2018 5:45 am

Post by Mathdino »

Didn't see a discussion for it, so discuss the newbie setup here. Lifted from the Newbie Queue:



Setup Info

Newbie Setup
Newbie Setup

2d3 (as designed by Cabd):

ABC
Mafia
Mafia Roleblocker
Mafia Rolecop
Mafia Goon
Row 1
Town Cop and Town Neapolitan
Town Cop and Town Tracker
Town Cop and Vanilla Townie
Row 2
Town Jailkeeper and Town Doctor
Town Jailkeeper and Town Tracker
Town Jailkeeper and Vanilla Townie
Row 3
Town Cop and Town Doctor
Town Neapolitan and Town Doctor
Town Tracker and Town Doctor

Each Newbie Game will be given a setup that incorporates one mafia role from the top of a column, and then two town roles from a row below the selected mafia role. The remaining six roles will be filled in by
one mafia goons
and
five vanilla townies
appropriately, to create a
2-mafia
and
7-town
setup.

All Newbie games use the Natural Action Resolution system for determining Night action effects.
Mafia Roleblocker
action takes precedence over a
Town Jailkeeper
action should that apply.

Mafia have access to their Private Topic at all times.


Spoiler: Full Setups
Column A & Row 1:
Mafia Roleblocker, Mafia Goon, Town Cop, Town Neapolitan, Vanilla Townie x 5
Column A & Row 2:
Mafia Roleblocker, Mafia Goon, Town Jailkeeper, Town Doctor, Vanilla Townie x 5
Column A & Row 3:
Mafia Roleblocker, Mafia Goon, Town Cop, Town Doctor, Vanilla Townie x 5
Column B & Row 1:
Mafia Rolecop, Mafia Goon, Town Cop, Town Tracker, Vanilla Townie x 5
Column B & Row 2:
Mafia Rolecop, Mafia Goon, Town Jailkeeper, Town Tracker, Vanilla Townie x 5
Column B & Row 3:
Mafia Rolecop, Mafia Goon, Town Neapolitan, Town Doctor, Vanilla Townie x 5
Column C & Row 1:
Mafia Goon x 2, Town Cop, Vanilla Townie x 6
Column C & Row 2:
Mafia Goon x 2, Town Jailkeeper, Vanilla Townie x 6
Column C & Row 3:
Mafia Goon x 2, Town Doctor, Town Tracker, Vanilla Townie x 5


Sample Role PM's (click on the spoiler button to reveal)

Spoiler:
Vanilla TownieWelcome!

You are a
Vanilla Townie
.

You have no special abilities.

You win when all threats to the Town have been eliminated.


The game thread is here.

Confirm by replying with your role name and alignment.

Town JailkeeperWelcome!

You are a
Town Jailkeeper
.

You may target one player per night phase. This player will be protected from kills and be prevented from using their own action, if they have one, during that night phase. You cannot target yourself.

You win when all threats to the Town have been eliminated.


The game thread is here.

Confirm by replying with your role name and alignment.

Town CopWelcome!

You are a
Town Cop
.

You may target one player per night phase. At the end of the night phase, you will be informed if they are
Town
or
Mafia
. If you are roleblocked, you will receive no result.

You win when all threats to the Town have been eliminated.


The game thread is here.

Confirm by replying with your role name and alignment.

Town NeapolitanWelcome!

You are a
Town Neapolitan
.

You may target one player per night phase. At the end of the night phase, you will be informed if they are
Vanilla Townie
or
Not Vanilla Townie
. If you are roleblocked, you will receive no result.

You win when all threats to the Town have been eliminated.


The game thread is here.

Confirm by replying with your role name and alignment.

Town TrackerWelcome!

You are a
Town Tracker
.

You may target one player per night phase. At the end of the night phase, you will be informed what player or players they targeted with their action, if any. If you are roleblocked, you will receive no result.

You win when all threats to the Town have been eliminated.


The game thread is here.

Confirm by replying with your role name and alignment.

Town DoctorWelcome!

You are a
Town Doctor
.

You may target one player per night phase. This player will be protected from kills during that night phase. You cannot target yourself.

You win when all threats to the Town have been eliminated.


The game thread is here.

Confirm by replying with your role name and alignment.


Mafia GoonWelcome!

You are a
Mafia Goon
.

You and your partner share a factional kill each night. You must choose which of you will commit the kill. You also share a factional PT, located here, where you may talk at any time.

You win when the Town has been eliminated, or nothing can stop this from occurring.


The game thread is here.

Confirm by replying with your role name and alignment or by posting in your PT.

Mafia RolecopWelcome!

You are a
Mafia Rolecop
.

You may target one player per night phase. At the end of the night phase, you will be informed of their role but not their alignment.
Vanilla Townies
and
Mafia Goons
will both return "Vanilla". If you are roleblocked, you will receive no result.

You and your partner share a factional kill each night. You must choose which of you will commit the kill. You may commit the kill and perform a role cop in the same night phase. You also share a factional PT, located here, where you may talk at any time.

You win when the Town has been eliminated, or nothing can stop this from occurring.


The game thread is here.

Confirm by replying with your role name and alignment or by posting in your PT.
Mafia RoleblockerWelcome!

You are a
Mafia Roleblocker
.

You may target one player per night. This player will be prevented from performing their own action, if any.

You and your partner share a factional kill each night. You must choose which of you will commit the kill. You may commit the kill and perform a roleblock in the same night phase. You also share a factional PT, located here, where you may talk at any time.

You win when the Town has been eliminated, or nothing can stop this from occurring.


The game thread is here.

Confirm by replying with your role name and alignment or by posting in your PT.
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Post Post #1 (ISO) » Tue Jan 02, 2018 5:51 am

Post by Mathdino »

A major problem I see is that, as Tracker, I think optimal play is to claim and publicly ask for protection.

As tracker, you know that you're paired with one of:
B. Cop or Jailkeeper
C. Doctor

In the case of Doctor, just play Follow The Cop with the Tracker.

In the case of Cop/JK, ask for protection. From scum's perspective, they don't know if Tracker is paired with Cop or Jailkeeper. As such, they have no incentive to kill the Tracker for fear of wasting their kill. This means either Tracker gets to be a confirmed protected named townie (assuming no counterclaims) or gets to be 1 of 2 investigatives, which is a fantastic buff for town.
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Post Post #2 (ISO) » Tue Jan 02, 2018 5:57 am

Post by Creature »

This was the discussion topic: viewtopic.php?f=5&t=73423

Though, actually I prefer to stick with this topic than necro that one.
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Post Post #3 (ISO) » Tue Jan 02, 2018 5:57 am

Post by Creature »

Also, I thought JK + Doc vs RB was very townsided.
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Post Post #4 (ISO) » Tue Jan 02, 2018 6:08 am

Post by Mathdino »

That discussion is on 3d3. This is 2d3. This is a significant change from that setup so I made a new thread.
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Post Post #5 (ISO) » Thu Jan 11, 2018 4:40 pm

Post by Toomai »

My first thought is that column C will be scumsided. C1 and C3's Matrix6 equivalents (B and C) already have high scum winrates, and now we're adding daytalk. In addition, the two-goon team can claim Doctor for free in 2/3 games (claiming C1 to be A3 and C2 to be A2) and credit the assumed Roleblocker for being alive. Of course in the other 1/3 games, you 1v1 the real Doctor and the Tracker becomes a Cop, but if you can get to LyLo first that's a pretty beefy 50/50.

(I will be keeping the stats, once there's enough games)
This should be required reading for...everyone for anything, really.
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Post Post #6 (ISO) » Thu Jan 11, 2018 4:46 pm

Post by Mathdino »

In post 5, Toomai wrote:My first thought is that column C will be scumsided. C1 and C3's Matrix6 equivalents (B and C) already have high scum winrates, and now we're adding daytalk. In addition, the two-goon team can claim Doctor for free in 2/3 games (claiming C1 to be A3 and C2 to be A2) and credit the assumed Roleblocker for being alive. Of course in the other 1/3 games, you 1v1 the real Doctor and the Tracker becomes a Cop, but if you can get to LyLo first that's a pretty beefy 50/50.
This of course also nerfs the Doctor because SE's and IC's and people familiar with claiming strategies won't believe the claims.
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Post Post #7 (ISO) » Sat Jan 13, 2018 7:57 am

Post by Toomai »

Thoughts on the other columns:
  • Column A: Town will have two PRs with good chemistry. Successfully killing/roleblocking them will be critical. There's very little room to fakeclaim; someone will be able to call you out in most subsetups (though whether they should is another matter), especially once a PR (of either faction) is flipped. I think this will be the towniest column.
  • Column B: Town PR chemistry in this column is a little lower; there's more chance for tracks and no-kills to confuse assumptions. There's even fewer fakeclaim opportunities than column A, but the Rolecop means scum can know 4/7 town roles by day 3 (assuming the two kills go through). I think this column will have the most volatile winrate.
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Post Post #8 (ISO) » Sat Jan 13, 2018 10:08 am

Post by Mulch »

Mafia rolecop versus town cop AND town tracker in 9 people :facepalm: GG scum lose
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Post Post #9 (ISO) » Sat Jan 13, 2018 3:42 pm

Post by mhsmith0 »

I think the column B setups are generically the hardest for scum teams and will probably have the highest town win rate collectively longterm. Column C likely the hardest on town, but I'd guess C3 will probably be outsize effective for town because fake claiming doc in column C will likely be popular scum strategy, and that's the one where they pay for it. All column A setups will be super dependent on scum teams targeting at least one and preferably both PRs on n1.
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Post Post #10 (ISO) » Sat Jan 13, 2018 6:51 pm

Post by Mulch »

All of B are townsided af, all of c except c3 are scumsided af, and all of A are balance f
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