How do you develop charisma?

[mhsmith0]

Mafia is easy just ask yourself

Who would RadiantCowbells be voting in this situation

Then you vote

that person

RadiantCowbells

I fixed your typos

[mhsmith0]

More seriously, I think the list of people who fit “sheep player x just because they state their reads” is insanely low, and I don’t think any of them have ever asked for that treatment, and they’re all basically “you should lynch them d3 if they’re still alive without wolf pelts” people anyway

[mastina]

Mastina basically said what I wanted to say but a lot better than the mess I posted instead

And Firebringer one-upped me and said what I said only in much, much better detail, basically. Go listen to what he said!

[mastina]

What about what I said was complicated?

Assessing what's likely to persuade each person you need on the wagon, and then tailoring an individual pitch to each one of them. That's pretty complicated, and it's not necessary.

It doesn't need to be tailored to each and every single player; one pitch can work for 3-4 players, and then a separate pitch for a different 3-4 players. Obviously, the more specific the pitch, the more it will convince the player it is specific to, but it need not be "one pitch, one person".

It just

can't

be "one pitch,

every

person", because there is no universal pitch which will get you followers regardless of posting style. It takes 2-3 different ones, minimum, barring playerlist conformity. (Obviously, if the playerlist is filled to the brim with likeminded players, then one pitch tailored to them will work for them all, but in most playerlists lacking said conformity...)

[mastina]

What about what I said was complicated?

Assessing what's likely to persuade each person you need on the wagon, and then tailoring an individual pitch to each one of them. That's pretty complicated, and it's not necessary.

It doesn't need to be tailored to each and every single player; one pitch can work for 3-4 players, and then a separate pitch for a different 3-4 players. Obviously, the more specific the pitch, the more it will convince the player it is specific to, but it need not be "one pitch, one person".

It just

can't

be "one pitch,

every

person", because there is no universal pitch which will get you followers regardless of posting style. It takes 2-3 different ones, minimum, barring playerlist conformity. (Obviously, if the playerlist is filled to the brim with likeminded players, then one pitch tailored to them will work for them all, but in most playerlists lacking said conformity...)

This is honestly something not so surprising when you think about it. Likeminded players tend to intuitively understand likeminded players--they can not only work with said likeminded players, but in my experience, are also more likely to get accurate reads on said likeminded players. (My go-to example, Ginngie's playstyle has diverged from mine somewhat but still is similar enough to mine where I have soulread her.)

Which makes sense--if someone thinks similarly to you, then you can tell when something is "off" on their thought process, and you can also tell when they are onto something with their points, because their points will resonate with you.

So to be charismatic, what you need is not only to gather likeminded individuals, but also people who have that foreign thought process--and to do that, you need to put yourself in their shoes and become likeminded to them, even when you normally wouldn't be.

[Ankamius]

tl;dr

work on listening skills since that helps you understand people

and understanding people is how you figure out how you can convince them

:P

[u r a person 2]

Because the actual key to charisma, is to know your audience and write things as close to their perspective as is possible. Use THEIR reasoning, THEIR process, even if it is alien to you, even if it is foreign and seems wildly off-base to you, and turn it around. Find the weaknesses in their opposing viewpoint, not from YOUR view, but from THEIR view, point out THEIR narrative's contradictions: "Okay, so you think that X means Y for Z. Why not for A?" Get them to flesh out why point A applies for person B, but not C, and then make your argument for why point A is better applied for person C, rather than person B.

This is scary accurate. There is a tone aspect as well that I'm sure mastina has mastered - and it's not always right to be charming - that can augment this really well. In my business we call this sort of manipulation "meeting people at their values"

[Nancy Drew 39]

your criticism of my reads accuracy rate is inaccurate.

You don't know what your reads accuracy rate is. If you actually study it honestly, you'll probably find it's not as good as you think. It's not an easy game.

No, it’s actually better.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Mafia is easy just ask yourself

Who would RadiantCowbells be voting in this situation

Then you vote that person

How would I know that, unless you’re in the same game.?

[Nancy Drew 39]

Mastina basically said what I wanted to say but a lot better than the mess I posted instead

And Firebringer one-upped me and said what I said only in much, much better detail, basically. Go listen to what he said!

Yeah, it’s a great post. I rely on both tone and logic in my reads and therefore, make both analytical and emotion-based arguments.

[Wisdom]

cases are actually detrimental in a lot of ways because you allow scum to match their play to be consistent with what you are arguing against while muddying the case at the same time

this.

[Wisdom]

Nancy you tend to misunderstand or not comprehend what is being said a lot of the time; you even did it at least twice in this thread. That is annoying and decreases the likelihood people will sheep your reads: if you misunderstand my points, what tells me it wasnt misunderstandings that shaped your reads?

Try not to be hasty with what people say.

[mhsmith0]

cases are actually detrimental in a lot of ways because you allow scum to match their play to be consistent with what you are arguing against while muddying the case at the same time

this.

fwiw i disagree with this point, particularly when it comes to discussing actions a player has already taken

This player did x, y, z and they looked like scum actions/posts because ""
This player's interactions with a flipped wolf looked like they were teammates
This player's treatment of the wagon on a now dead wolf was suspicious because ""
This player's actions around the wagon of a now dead villager was suspicious because ""
This player has consistently played like their scum meta as seen with "", "", "", or they have consistently done "" that is substantially different than what they'd do as town
etc

I find those to all be productive uses of time. Just my $0.02 tho.

[Ankamius]

My experience with the direct approach with scum is that they just pull me into a useless 1v1 that by design will never be resolved directly, which makes everyone else lose interest in paying attention to the case. And if you don't humor them, they press the issue and you look like you don't have an answer to their rebuttals.

[Wisdom]

Agreed once again. Once I invest into an 1v1 with scum its basically a given people will come and call it a TvT. And yet despite knowing this I will often do it, because I get triggered by posts I feel are manipulative and I feel obligated to answer to.

[mhsmith0]

I dunno, I feel like the key is to present the case and then do more with engaging other people about your case than engaging your target directly. If all you're doing is sniping at someone back and forth, then yah you can get into that sort of situation pretty easily i'd bet. But if you're engaging more broadly, I think it can be productive. But that's at least somewhat a playstyle and what works best for waht player sort of thing *shrugs*

[RadiantCowbells]

Mafia is easy just ask yourself

Who would RadiantCowbells be voting in this situation

Then you vote that person

How would I know that, unless you’re in the same game.?

Why would you want to play a mafia game without me

[Nancy Drew 39]

Mafia is easy just ask yourself

Who would RadiantCowbells be voting in this situation

Then you vote that person

How would I know that, unless you’re in the same game.?

Why would you want to play a mafia game without me

I prefer to hydra with you because you greatly complement my weaknesses, re: YGM. We mindmeld on reads and you help push them through.

[Krazy]

Having studied this issue at length I believe that the most important things in developing charisma are having a cute avatar and occasionally using catchphrases.

[Firebringer]

Having studied this issue at length I believe that the most important things in developing charisma are having a cute avatar and occasionally using catchphrases.

no u

[Irrelephant11]

Having studied this issue at length I believe that the most important things in developing charisma are having a cute avatar and occasionally using catchphrases.

wow tru imo

[mhsmith0]

Having studied this issue at length I believe that the most important things in developing charisma are having a cute avatar and occasionally using catchphrases.

[Flavor Leaf]

Having studied this issue at length I believe that the most important things in developing charisma are having a cute avatar and occasionally using catchphrases.

This is essentially what I set out to prove when I made the Flavor Leaf account.

[BNL]

Is the argument against cases “you give something the scum can argue against”?

Because that’s total BS

[Wisdom]

Is it though
I enjoy them being unable to defend themselves because I've given them no reasoning