Open 708: Pick Your Poison - Game Over


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Post Post #1825 (ISO) » Sat Feb 10, 2018 6:53 pm

Post by TesXX »

[
b]
Official Vote Count 3.2
[/b]

CultOfAthena
(3): Flubbernugget, mozamis, Beefster
Maxous
(2): Thor665, Klick
Errantparabola
(1): CultOfAthena

Not Voting
(2): Errantparabola, Maxous

With 8 alive, it takes 5 to lynch.

Deadline
: (expired on 2018-02-22 18:44:22)
Last edited by TesXX on Mon Feb 12, 2018 4:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post Post #1826 (ISO) » Sat Feb 10, 2018 6:59 pm

Post by Beefster »

More votes on Max/COA please.

I think I'm leaning more toward COA atm.
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Post Post #1827 (ISO) » Sat Feb 10, 2018 9:26 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 1774, Thor665 wrote:
Vote Count 1.5


Transcend
(4): CultOfAthena, Klick, mozamis, Maxous
Flubbernugget
(2):
texcat
,
Thor665

Beefster
(1):
RadiantCowbells

mozamis
(1): Beefster
texcat
(1):
Flubbernugget


Not Voting
(4):
Moneybags, Transcend
,
HeWhoSwims
, Errantparabola
/quote]
@CoA - if EP is scum and you and Max are town than it means we got Transcend to 5 votes (RC was on there as well but unvoted shortly before this votecount) with zero scum support for a town wagon.

How likely do you think that is?
Because I find it very unlikely, and want to flip you and Max in either order, and kick myself if it's Klick or Moz.
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Post Post #1828 (ISO) » Sun Feb 11, 2018 9:31 am

Post by Errantparabola »

lynching order is CoA -> Klick -> Max for me but I want to go back and read again on moz wagon shift to tex wagon because that's prob crucial to look at
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Post Post #1829 (ISO) » Sun Feb 11, 2018 4:38 pm

Post by Klick »

I'm avoiding a prod and waiting to see how EP's line of questioning unfolds.
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Post Post #1830 (ISO) » Sun Feb 11, 2018 6:17 pm

Post by CultOfAthena »

In post 1811, mozamis wrote:@ Klick - look at how ready Max is to give out his opinions - even to the extent of saying "i was right", which is very town lol
whereas Cult is so vague and theoretical. It's not Max.
cult plays in a similar way to Hewho - quire reasonable, but DOING and even SAYING very little.
Can you point specifically to where you think I'm being vague or theoretical?
In post 1812, mozamis wrote:and you'll note how Cult is THE ONLY player in the whole game that has always called me town. Does that seem toen to you? Most people find my "erratic" playstyle scummy at some point. She never has, like she, ya know, KNOWS something...lol
Yes, I do know something – what your towngame looks like and what your scumgame looks like. I found your playstyle scummy in the first game we played together, but now I know that that's just how you play as town.
In post 1813, mozamis wrote:also lol at CUlt for attacking EP for not mentioning Tex day 1 and then attacking EP for voting Tex day 2.
clearly just attacking EP for whatevr he does.
I think there's a bit more nuance to it than that.
In post 1814, mozamis wrote: yeah, but look at how much more active you are now, now that you are under pressure?
where have you been all game when town needed you? Nowhere, you have done NOTHING to lynch scum.
you never pushed beef, you never pushed klick. only now, under pressure, do present a case on EP.
My activity hasn't changed at all, and even if it
had
– weren't you calling me scum earlier for
not
being active?

Sure, I'll admit that I haven't been a part of either of the scum wagons – does being off in my reads make me scum? I would expect the opposite.

I have indisputably pushed Beefster and Klick this game
and
presented a case against EP before I was under pressure. If you'd like, I can quote these for you.
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Post Post #1831 (ISO) » Sun Feb 11, 2018 6:23 pm

Post by CultOfAthena »

In post 1818, Errantparabola wrote:
In post 1801, CultOfAthena wrote:Reasonably so, and more than the other potential candidates.
Would you be willing to get lynched today if, hypothetically, it guaranteed my lynch tomorrow?
No, I would never accept my own lynch. There's no reason to.
In post 1827, Thor665 wrote:@CoA - if EP is scum and you and Max are town than it means we got Transcend to 5 votes (RC was on there as well but unvoted shortly before this votecount) with zero scum support for a town wagon.

How likely do you think that is?
How likely is it? Unless you're talking about pure statistical likelihood, is there some specific reason to disbelieve it? All-town wagons happen all the time. My reads independent of the votecount lead me to the conclusion that EP is scum, so I don't see why that conclusion also leading to the conclusion of something being an all-town wagon is cause to reconsider.
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Post Post #1832 (ISO) » Sun Feb 11, 2018 6:27 pm

Post by CultOfAthena »

I mean, I'm willing to consider scum!Maxous given that my EP case doesn't appear to be going anywhere. I'm not really confident in it but I don't think town loses this game either way.
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Post Post #1833 (ISO) » Sun Feb 11, 2018 7:51 pm

Post by Beefster »

@COA: Is there any reason to be afraid of being lynched as town when we literally have room for 2 mislynches before scum wins?
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Post Post #1834 (ISO) » Sun Feb 11, 2018 7:52 pm

Post by Beefster »

At a 3:1, the best option for town is to No Lynch. I think.
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Post Post #1835 (ISO) » Sun Feb 11, 2018 8:09 pm

Post by Errantparabola »

VOTE: CultOfAthena
hammer if you want/have nothing else for this day. i dont find it particularly appealing to draw it out
did another ms user do something lovely? recognize their achievements here!

Today's modern mafia consumer demands dozens, nay, hundreds of roles that are vanilla cops.
--implosion
provided
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Post Post #1836 (ISO) » Sun Feb 11, 2018 8:13 pm

Post by Errantparabola »

UNVOTE:
Athena is digging in pretty hard on her EP read. It's her easiest shot at staying engaged and active in a gamestate that is very hostile to her currently. So that is a very plausible floundering scum.

Last question before I vote again, Athena: what do you think the intent behind my line of questioning was?
did another ms user do something lovely? recognize their achievements here!

Today's modern mafia consumer demands dozens, nay, hundreds of roles that are vanilla cops.
--implosion
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Post Post #1837 (ISO) » Sun Feb 11, 2018 9:58 pm

Post by mozamis »

@ Cult - your last few posts sum it up: no scum hunitng, you're not trying to get EP lynched (remember him? your supposed "suspect"?). Just defensive survival mode form you.
"Town you" may have made some of those points, but you would have also said "c'mon, lets lynch EP" or something like that.
Cult's scum. Hammer her.
You've reached that age, Listy. 24, 25...Your muscles give up, they wave a little white flag of surrender and without any warning at all, you're suddenly a fat bastard...
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Post Post #1838 (ISO) » Sun Feb 11, 2018 9:59 pm

Post by mozamis »

christ i really thought i had previewed that one as well lol
You've reached that age, Listy. 24, 25...Your muscles give up, they wave a little white flag of surrender and without any warning at all, you're suddenly a fat bastard...
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Post Post #1839 (ISO) » Sun Feb 11, 2018 11:42 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 1831, CultOfAthena wrote:How likely is it? Unless you're talking about pure statistical likelihood, is there some specific reason to disbelieve it? All-town wagons happen all the time. My reads independent of the votecount lead me to the conclusion that EP is scum, so I don't see why that conclusion also leading to the conclusion of something being an all-town wagon is cause to reconsider.
Well, first off, you're kind of playing word-snarl there; yes, I'm asking about the statistical liklihood, which you appear to understand but then don't address by tossing out the (unsupported) idea that 'all town wagons happen all the time'.

I will counter with this; no they don't, unless you're talking very small wagons.

All town lynch or near lynch wagons in early game are actually rather rare and uncommon. Therefore, when you have 5 votes on a confirmed town early game it is *very* valid to question whether scum would or would not be on the wagon - especially when all other evidence we have shows scum in this game were very willing (indeed eager) to be on wagons on town.

I would think the question of why scum would avoid the Transcend wagon would at least get you to assess EP's reads in relation to that wagon to discuss why you think he'd avoid it.
In post 1832, CultOfAthena wrote:I mean, I'm willing to consider scum!Maxous given that my EP case doesn't appear to be going anywhere. I'm not really confident in it but I don't think town loses this game either way.
:neutral:

Okay, so why don't you do that?
Let's discuss your EP and Max read right now.
That's what I'm trying to do with you.
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Post Post #1840 (ISO) » Sun Feb 11, 2018 11:45 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 1837, mozamis wrote:@ Cult - your last few posts sum it up: no scum hunitng, you're not trying to get EP lynched (remember him? your supposed "suspect"?). Just defensive survival mode form you.
"Town you" may have made some of those points, but you would have also said "c'mon, lets lynch EP" or something like that.
Cult's scum. Hammer her.
I will offer the counter thought that; she is under reasonably heavy attack, and the only person trying to discuss reads with her is me - so she's actually only avoiding discussing reads with one person, not in general.

Remember when I was on you (and was the only one on you) your entire world was discussing me and my actions towards you.
That is a normal reaction and happens to scum and town players.
If she's scum I rather doubt it's for this reason.

Also, if that bugs you, what's your take away on Max's recent posting?
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Post Post #1841 (ISO) » Mon Feb 12, 2018 2:44 am

Post by mozamis »

That's my point really - she' snot discussing reads. She's not pushing EP. I get what you are saying, she is being attacked, so some defensiveness is understandable. (As I said). But, it's the lack of reads AS WELL as the defensiveness which is the "scumtell". When i was under attack from you, yeah i was defensive. But there was a lot of me giving out reads as well.
She shows interest in getting anyone lynched, and that's the oldest scumtell in the book.
Max's recent (by which I mean this Day) posting i think has been the most town in the game.
You've reached that age, Listy. 24, 25...Your muscles give up, they wave a little white flag of surrender and without any warning at all, you're suddenly a fat bastard...
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Post Post #1842 (ISO) » Mon Feb 12, 2018 2:45 am

Post by mozamis »

*NO INTEREST in getting anyone lynched.
sigh...
You've reached that age, Listy. 24, 25...Your muscles give up, they wave a little white flag of surrender and without any warning at all, you're suddenly a fat bastard...
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Post Post #1843 (ISO) » Mon Feb 12, 2018 3:00 am

Post by Thor665 »

I don't see what you're talking about there exactly.
Like, two days ago she voted EP and made a big wall explaining why she thought he was scum.
Isn't that wanting to get someone lynched?
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Post Post #1844 (ISO) » Mon Feb 12, 2018 6:50 am

Post by mozamis »

no follow up questions to Ep. Not engaging with Ep. Shes never really around when it counts.
Her case on EP seemed really contrived to me.
I feel i've done my bit tbh. i think she's scum. i really dont want to get into an argument with you about it. You gotta go with who you think i guess.
Max, EP, Klick -need you guys! :)
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Post Post #1845 (ISO) » Mon Feb 12, 2018 10:01 am

Post by Maxous »

here.
reading up
"
And before anyone bitches about me highlighting PoD's 437 when I replaced in and called everyone on my wagon communists, I remind you that communism is not alignment-indicative
" - Belisarius

wiki (actually) updated
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Post Post #1846 (ISO) » Mon Feb 12, 2018 10:12 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 1844, mozamis wrote:no follow up questions to Ep. Not engaging with Ep. Shes never really around when it counts.
Her case on EP seemed really contrived to me.
I feel i've done my bit tbh. i think she's scum. i really dont want to get into an argument with you about it. You gotta go with who you think i guess.
Max, EP, Klick -need you guys! :)
What follow up questions should she be asking?
I agree that she's not engaging with her scum read - I know for a fact that lots of people consider that appropriate town play - are you aware that it's not how CoA plays town? Because if she normally engages - then, yeah, let's speed lynch her. But if she doesn't then it's null.
Flubber's never around when it counts and also isn't engaging anything - he's confirmed town, so...

Since your case on her is that she's not engaging shouldn't you also want to engage with her, me, and everyone?
I think your case is pretty meh and I actually have CoA as one of my top two scumreads right now - so that should say something.
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Post Post #1847 (ISO) » Mon Feb 12, 2018 10:24 am

Post by Maxous »

mozamis
Thor665
Klick
Beefster
CultOfAthena
Errantparabola

so i'm just looking here.

so unlikely Moz or Beefster imo. I think the end of day 1 wagons makes them look really town if nothing else. Beefster is just town in general though.
Klick i think has had great town-posting to the point i would take my hat off to him if he is scum. Both of his votes on the scum looked organic to me.
Thor...I do have issues, but he's just probably not scum. I think he is scum it was a huge risk move to bus Texcat like he did. There wasn't a real need for it.

so yeah, thinking about it again more, i just have 2 choices here or else my reads are way off
EP or Athena.
"
And before anyone bitches about me highlighting PoD's 437 when I replaced in and called everyone on my wagon communists, I remind you that communism is not alignment-indicative
" - Belisarius

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Post Post #1848 (ISO) » Mon Feb 12, 2018 10:43 am

Post by Maxous »

just looking over Texcat's ISO here.

first of all - really reinforces beef!town. Why the hell would tex bus beefster so hard and then *not* throw HWS to the wolves. nonsensical. Beef is town.
In post 1082, texcat wrote:
In post 1075, Transcend wrote:Pretty sure one of these forefront votes on Tex is scum

Hey tex can you be a doll and vote hws

HWS has been in my null pile. I doubt if he's scum. Although since I'm sure I'm town, I might do it for self preservation. Of your 3 (or 4 if you include Klick) I'd be more inclined to vote CofA. I still think Money is town. And I was suspicious of Klick for a while, but that seems to have dissipated recently.
In post 1083, texcat wrote:Have you noticed that CofA was posting a lot before you subbed in, and then it's practically come to a standstill?
not sure what to think here. Handwaves the confirmed town on HWS but brings attention to Athena? would actually suggest they're not buddies.

#1204 kinda reads like a chainsaw of Errant actually

Thor calls out Tex early on Day 2 over the wagon analysis. Would suggest Thor!town because i just don't think it's a good idea to bus your buddy like that so soon after a scum flip. It's not like they're weren't other options.

on the other hand Texcat sure talked a lot about voting Athena but never actually did

#1454 is a complete scum white-knighting of Mozamis. Heavily suggest Moz!town imo

Not much else to read into it other than the Thor argument which is covered
"
And before anyone bitches about me highlighting PoD's 437 when I replaced in and called everyone on my wagon communists, I remind you that communism is not alignment-indicative
" - Belisarius

wiki (actually) updated
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Post Post #1849 (ISO) » Mon Feb 12, 2018 10:49 am

Post by Maxous »

In post 1625, TesXX wrote:
Official Vote Count 2.8


mozamis
(4): Klick, Beefster, RadiantCowbells, Flubbernugget
Errantparabola
(3): Maxous, mozamis, CultOfAthena
Klick
(1): Errantparabola
Beefster
(1): texcat
texcat
(1): Thor665

Not Voting
(0):
None.


With 10 alive, it takes 6 to lynch.

Deadline
: (expired on 2018-02-08 18:26:35)
In post 1626, RadiantCowbells wrote:I've already been clear I think it's moz beef
In post 1627, Errantparabola wrote:RC's gonna hate me if he ends up being right, but I'll go here for now, I think I vastly prefer it.
VOTE: texcat
i think Errant!scum could of so easily jumped onto Moz here but didn't
"
And before anyone bitches about me highlighting PoD's 437 when I replaced in and called everyone on my wagon communists, I remind you that communism is not alignment-indicative
" - Belisarius

wiki (actually) updated
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