Open 745: 9:12 [Game Over]

[Eragon]

Sorry I haven’t been around I have a big paper due Monday and exam Tuesday and I don’t really have time for FM until it’s over

I might be around if I have time for casual questions and stuff but ye.

[rooroo]

idk I just lolhammered town penguinpower for an obviously fake reaction to a fakehammer that turned out to be real

town do a lot of ridiculous things and they do them more often than scum

^This could be scum who knew Eyes was town. Also don't like the "lol" reaction to Eyes power role hunting and telling scum to shoot her power role read. That move by Eyes was blatantly playing against her win condition. It could have fucked us over. I can't imagine why town would find that funny.

lol

[Invisibility]

kitcat where are you seeing the lining up lynches i didnt find it

If Eyes is town it’s probably SA

SA wasn’t around for the lulz L-1 gambit either

So SA works with both flips

I’m saying kitcat looks more Townie if Eyes flips green. Even though that means my scumpool is smaller. Because like you said they weren’t being opportunistic.

If Eyes flips red then some of their posts could be I terpeted as giving Eyes an out or trying to discount the wagon.

Does that make sense?

And a bunch more. He did it for whatever alignment Eyes maybe flipped, so maybe this isn't as bad as I thought it was

yeah it really isnt

[kitcat]

My vote was the first one there and only sat there until page 5.

Oh, I was talking about your Eyes vote; I think you're talking about your RVS vote here, my bad

[kitcat]

Still not a funny situation.

I mean yeah, but so?

Can you explain again why you think rooroo's posts during twilight were anti-town? I'm not entirely following

[kitcat]

This game has become oddly stalled, and I'm not sure why, or what to do about it here

[Invisibility]

Not really.

My ego wants to say that scum wants to scumread me but there really just isn't much there for them to try to case off of. Probably not the case, but eh. Perhaps more realistically—and less egotistically—is that people feel antsy having too many townreads and so the possibility of me being scum is a comforting one, even before people

really

have reasons for it. That might be a bit too much armchair psychology, though.

So, again. Not really.

uh well i like this post
so the scumteam would be [sleepless, rooroo] right now by poe
not sure how it shapes up without that (rooroo is null)

[Sleepless Assassin]

Kitcat:

My vote on eyes was bandwagony? The only vote there was yours which was RVS if I'm not mistaken.

On roo, it just looks like a scum mindset. To see a town player implode and hurt the game in that way, I can see scum loving it. As I've said already, town should be nothing short of pissed off. Like, ok you died. You didn't play well. Fine. Move on. But for eyes to tell us she had a power role read on someone, suggest scum kill that person, and say "I got what I wanted" after being lynched, yeah it's upsetting to know you're in a game where that person is on your team.

Ok I'm gonna go read up now

[kitcat]

You're right, sorry. I htought you were the third vote and that it had come after slaxx's, but I just checked the final vote count and I was mistaken about the timing. I need to check if slaxx had already started pushing it when you had voted though.

OK, why would scum be so blatant about being happy to see town imploding there? Why does that end up in the thread? I think she's decent enough as scum to know that would be horribly tone-deaf and that she'd get pushed for it

[ChibiBear]

VOTE COUNT 2.02

Sleepless Assassin

(2): Slaxx, Invisibility

Slaxx

(2): kitcat, CultOfAthena

Not Voting

(3): Eragon, rooroo, Sleepless Assassin

With

7

alive, it takes

4

to lynch.

Day 2 ends in

(expired on 2019-01-20 17:00:00)

No changes in votes, but have a VC anyway since it's been a while

[Sleepless Assassin]

Hey kitcat, this is what a town reaction to Eyes looks like:

VOTE: Sleepless Assassin

I can go on a rant about Eyes but I'll save it for post game.

_____________

On the slaxx/kit back and forth:
Basically I get where slaxx is coming from. Being wrong sucks but it happens. I know what it's like to lose confidence in reads after being so sure and being wrong. Kits point about overconfidence does nothing for me. Eyes going from no reads to a reads list so soon did look like appeasement. Also considering a town flip is fine because slaxx is experienced enough to know he doesn't always have perfect reads.

_________

Cult,

if slaxx was baiting as scum why wouldn't he just deny that he was baiting?

(ok, I see later you said you don't think he'd bait as town. I disagree but ok.) Slaxx's 515 is also a good point. Voting a 50/50 read over an always scum read makes no sense. And I'd love to know why I'm always scum.

It was part thinking that you're the higher value scum lynch as compared to a higher likelihood lynch and part just not wanting to change my vote after a single post, just on the principle of it.

This feels like someone who is too concerned with their own appearance.

__________

Since everyone is talking about the NK:
I have no idea. I thought it was a weird kill. I was starting to think pink ball was probably town but he was hard to read. I can't come up with much as far as who it might implicate. I don't think any two players are here who are inexperienced enough to not know what a good kill is so... Maybe just people who saw him as townier than I did?

____________

I've played with SA before. He was good – really good. He was a big part of the resaon town won, and I might've even called him "powertown".

Now, that game was a while ago now—maybe even a year, now that I think about it—and I get that it's not necessarily fair to expect someone to play the same in every single game. Even still, he's just not here this game. Hasn't really asked any good questions, hasn't had any good presence. Those things are enough that I'd take them as scum-indicative on their own, but for SA especially it's noticeable.

Sure, he's had big effort posts like 297, but that seems to me like scum forcing themselves to put a lot into a game rather than town naturally having investment into a game.

What makes you think my alignment is the difference between the two games rather than simply real life being busy?

SA's vote was quite awful actually - he actually voted him in the same post he called him town, iirc. It felt kinda opportunistic to me

Scum do things that look town and town does things that look like scum. In that post I was still trying to read eyes. I wasn't ready for a lunch yet. I was trying to get a read on eyes.

_______________

Cult's stuff about scum needing her lynched feels like an attempt to scare people away from voting there. Like, she gave gamestate as a reason so I assume she means the fact that everyone has too many town reads, so why doesn't the same thing apply to slaxx or myself?

___________

Slaxx, when i said elaborate, I was looking for specific posts and what specifically makes you feel that way.

___________

Vote

:

Cult

My best guess is a cult/roo team.

_____________

Kit, it was probably a knee jerk reaction. I don't expect a post that just says lol to be well thought out.

Mod Edit: Changed 'Vote Cult' to 'Vote: Cult' as the votecounter will not register votes without a ':'

[kitcat]

I'm having a really hard time wrapping my head around a rooroo/CoA team

[Sleepless Assassin]

Why?

[kitcat]

Because I'm pretty sure rooroo is town
I don't particularly have a read on CoA but I'm not really scumreading her (or townreading her for that matter)

I don't see any associatives between them either really

Do you seem them as partners or do you just scumread them individually?

[Sleepless Assassin]

Individually but I don't see any reason they can't be scum together.

[CultOfAthena]

Ping Slaxx.

[CultOfAthena]

Cult's stuff about scum needing her lynched feels like an attempt to scare people away from voting there. Like, she gave gamestate as a reason so I assume she means the fact that everyone has too many town reads, so why doesn't the same thing apply to slaxx or myself?

I'm not exactly sure what you're asking here. Why don't I think it's the case that scum needs you and Slaxx lynched? Well, because I think you're scum in the first place – my saying what I said comes from the perspective of knowing for a fact that I'm town and comes within the context of my existing reads. Of course it wouldn't apply to you.

[Sleepless Assassin]

I could say the same thing though because I know for a fact that I am town and think you are scum. From anyone else's outside view, not knowing our alignments, it doesn't apply any more to you than it does to me. And if slaxx is town, scum would also need him lynched from your narrative. So why didn't you consider the current wagons and who is on them when this logic crossed your mind? It makes me think you aren't using it to scumhunt. It's more like you are trying to keep people from voting you by saying anyone who does must be scum.

[Invisibility]

hey kitcat can you pull some quotes about what you didnt like about slaxx's eyes push?

[Slaxx]

Ping Slaxx.

Wat

[Slaxx]

@SA it was only one post you voted Eyes in so I can’t really quote a series of posts. I don’t think you were around after that push (you were v/la)

Sorry this game is on the back burner for me I’m not enjoying it to be frank. Activity level is weird and I feel like I’m talking in circles with the people who suspect me and feel like I’m maybe being pocketed by the people who don’t. I probably need to take a fresh look at the game.

[Slaxx]

You're right, sorry. I htought you were the third vote and that it had come after slaxx's, but I just checked the final vote count and I was mistaken about the timing. I need to check if slaxx had already started pushing it when you had voted though.

OK, why would scum be so blatant about being happy to see town imploding there? Why does that end up in the thread? I think she's decent enough as scum to know that would be horribly tone-deaf and that she'd get pushed for it

I was pushing but not voting if I recall

[kitcat]

hey kitcat can you pull some quotes about what you didnt like about slaxx's eyes push?

I feel like I did this already?

[kitcat]

I don't know why this game is like stalled really, and we're slowly twiddling our thumbs on our way to deadline.

My ideal lynches today are slaxx, and SA, in that order.
I would probably compromise on CoA if I had to but I don't really want to
I would not vote rooroo, Vizzy, or Eragon today, but I'm losing the townreads on vizzy and on Eragon to a certain extent.

[Invisibility]

So even then, you went from having no reads to having reads in 20 posts? Still makes no sense.

Your reads list was incredibly opaque and came 19 minutes after you said there wasn’t much content for you to get reads from.

It's hard for me to put into words but this part of the push feels off.

Like it feels like you found something contradictory or strange that you're pushing him for, but not something that's like actually scummy? Like you're pushing him for not making sense, and for suddenly forming reads, which aren't inherently scummy traits really.

I did that on purpose. It gave you a nice excuse to not answer the game/related question, which I figured might be the case. Just like when you slinked off when we were in discussion and tried to reintegrate like nothing happened after other people started talking:

This almost feels like you were baiting him to answer something badly and make himself look bad. It's pretty apparent you're a lot better at arguing and explaining yourself than he is, and this feels a little like you're taking advantage of that.

And like your whole tone in twilight feels bad, almost cocky? Not sure the right words to describe it. Like 388. Overconfident almost that he was flipping scum?

Also you switched really fast to the notion that he might green and what might happen after which doesn't really match how confident you were that he was flipping scum just posts before

You were also setting up a SA push in the event of greenflip

Ok I think that's most of what was bothering me

ok cool i found it
i just wanted to know if this was all or there were multiple baity posts
also i dont really agree that its scummy
yeah scum might want to trick a townie into doing something scummy but i equally see a chance for town to see if someone would do something scummy instead of taking the route that a town should take
like an experiment, i guess