Open 781: JK9++ Game Over!

[MariaR]

I didn't roll sk and now my entertainment value has gone down.
Also the setup page looked complicated can someone explain how it works thx

[MariaR]

When this game starts to get serious so will I

[MariaR]

Btw none of the past six pages have anything strongly alignment worthy. Take that as you will.

[MariaR]

Oh wait sorry, this one thing is
VOTE: Bingle
Pedit: Nice

[MariaR]

Btw none of the past six pages have anything strongly alignment worthy. Take that as you will.

Wrong. I'm hard townreading you from the past six pages

The moment anyone genuinely hard townreads me as town that isn't Dunnstral I'll be happy. But thanks Pink Ball <3 Btw, all the mech talk isn't needed and comes from scum 7/10 times to try and be productive. I understand it's Bingle, but there's a time and place. This isn't the time

[MariaR]

Besides laughing for a good 2 minutes on how uselessness has turned into a tell I shall UNVOTE: for now.

Considering all the content around Fires slot and the people in this playerlist I think he's a fine lynch. He's sneaky if scum and I don't consider him a strong town power player.

VOTE: Firebringer

Besides, this should call some attention.

[MariaR]

I want gobble to explain like, anything. His reads feel entirely made up on the spot/meaning to take advantage of the game state. It's a light read that will probably change when he gives me the sit down, but until then I will call him scum. This game had a lot more filler than I was expecting, making it a bit harder to get into it.

[MariaR]

I will say you surprised me in nightless. If you posted less filler and played like that game I wouldn't mind keeping you around and going to a real scumread.

[MariaR]

I'm not telling you to impress me, I'm asking you to post more content instead of filler. Ya know, like what we're here for.

[MariaR]

I've read all of this games posts actually. Although I do wish this was my casual game at this point, I've made a commitment.
pedit: Why's that?

[MariaR]

I feel like Firebringers alignment is pretty obvious given how he handled a very simple reaction test, but I'd love to hear your reasoning.

[MariaR]

I've read all of this games posts actually. Although I do wish this was my casual game at this point, I've made a commitment.
pedit: Why's that?

My intuition is telling me that this is not how Firebringer approaches this game as mafia.

This is a low confidence read.

How do you expect scum Fire to approach this playerlist?

[MariaR]

If you genuinely consider your iso as not filler than maybe my expectations for you coming into this game are too high. Because it most definitely rings as filler to me.

[MariaR]

But the main point is if I read it or not, and yes I did. We can go back and forth on if your iso is filler or not but that's a mute point.
pedit: Interesting. I'll take that into consideration. My read on fire is mostly meta at the moment as well.

[MariaR]

My expectation level for each player I have a history with is different, it's not a general scale. I saw you do a not filler game for once and my expectations were placed higher than normal. I can move it back to my normal opinion of you if you wish.
pedit: I haven't taken a single pot shot at you?

[MariaR]

The closest to an insult I've said is that your town game is weaker than your scum game which I don't think is incorrect? I haven't been trying to insult you at all. Maybe you just don't like what you're hearing. I'll drop it though. I got what I wanted from this anyway

VOTE: Penguin Power

[MariaR]

The closest to an insult I've said is that your town game is weaker than your scum game which I don't think is incorrect? I haven't been trying to insult you at all. Maybe you just don't like what you're hearing. I'll drop it though. I got what I wanted from this anyway

VOTE: Penguin Power

<3

You ignored me for too long and my feelings are hurt
pedit: O-oh...

[MariaR]

I want gobble to explain like, anything. His reads feel entirely made up on the spot/meaning to take advantage of the game state. It's a light read that will probably change when he gives me the sit down, but until then I will call him scum. This game had a lot more filler than I was expecting, making it a bit harder to get into it.

I'm tired of carrying, I get to be carried now

I am the backpack now

Aka you're not gonna do it because they are made up. Got it~

[MariaR]

The first 2 posts were mostly the test in mind. I wanted to see if you were going to be dismissive or curt with me if I made my first 2 posts a bit sassy. It felt pretty telling to me.

[MariaR]

We need to work on your sassyness

You can't make it obvious! But please teach me your sassy ways mentor

[MariaR]

Lowkey sass>obvious sass.
pedit: Thank you mentor I will use the ways of sass to my advantage in my next casual game. Sadly, I'm not allowed to have emotions this game sorry.

[MariaR]

You thought I didn't like you because of how sassy I was PB! Also how do you feel about scum gobble?

[MariaR]

If I didn't like people based on their stupidity I wouldn't be able to play with this playerlist.

I mean uh...

[MariaR]

Skitter that would require my push on firebringer to be an actual push when that wasn't the case at all.

[MariaR]

it kinda read like a serious push to me ...

I was testing his reaction as I stated before. I got my answer and then unvoted because he went from null to townie. If I thought his reaction was scummy than I would've kept my vote. So I don't know if you can call that 'serious.' I felt like this was obvious and I can't tell if you unawareness is scummy or not
pedit: Scummy, would lynch atm.

[MariaR]

Penguin vote was mostly to see if anyone would react to me joining such a big wagon, plus I wanted to get his attention. I like it when people pay attention to me. Turkey is really my only scumread at the moment.

[MariaR]

Am I not voting the turkey?
My mistake
VOTE: Gobble

[MariaR]

I've been dragged into a league game I'll answer you in 30 minutes Mena.

[MariaR]

@Mena I think Bingle and Datsi aren't SvS so I'm inclined to tr Datsi. Now if that was bingle hard defending Datsi as town or scum isn't obvious in my eyes. I think the more opinions we get out of Bingle will make it more obvious.

[MariaR]

page 21 is mariar scum

dang girl why you always scum

VOTE: MariaR

You're just using buzz and filler words. This also isn't a post you make if you strongly consider me scum. Even if you caught me for the wrong reasons last time you were very passionate about your read on me. This? Not even close.

[MariaR]

MariaR is scum for her page 21 shenanigans. She’s not acting as a proactive town. Everything on that page was reactive and not scumhunting imo

That said, I don’t want her to die day 1 as scum. I’m tired of that

Page 21 was me answering questions, what exactly was I supposed to be scumhunting/what would town Maria do in that case? Also lets ignore the fact I am a reactive player and you tell me why playing reactive is bad. I am literally starting to doubt my gobble scumread for the sole purpose his arguments have more holes than swiss cheese. Is he normally this obvious if he flips scum or?

VOTE: Skitter

Oh I'm scumreading the 2 people scumreading me, guess that's omgus on my part. Or at least, someone will say it is

[MariaR]

My reads are pretty funny if I way them out in a list. Does anyone have a strong opinion on Blake?

[MariaR]

Dw Mena if it makes you feel better there's about a list of 5 players that scare me/know how to read me. Just do your best and don't have your 'want me to be town' blind ya. As for Blake, I think I can read her if she plays the game more actively but I haven't played with half hearted Blake before so its hard.

[MariaR]

The 5 are Brian Skies Alisae Eli mhsmith0 and Shiro

I don't remember Lilith displaying her emotions this much before as scum. I have her as a town lean. I don't exactly see her pushing an agenda at the moment.

[MariaR]

The 5 are Brian Skies Alisae Eli mhsmith0 and Shiro

I don't remember Lilith displaying her emotions this much before as scum. I have her as a town lean. I don't exactly see her pushing an agenda at the moment.

What do you make of her inconsistency in her take on Bingle vs. herself?

Considering her reaction was anger (at least I assumed that's why she left) I don't think she even noticed it was an inconsistency. Plus I don't really find inconsistency a scumtell. It was a strong reason why I started to townread her.

[MariaR]

The more SS posts the more I feel ok lynching him

[MariaR]

VOTE: Gobble

L-1

[MariaR]

Think the only 3 I'm voting in today is Skitter/Gobble/SS

[MariaR]

VOTE: Gobble

L-1

actually what is this
VOTE: maria

Me voting my scumread?

[MariaR]

Is skitter normally this clueless or is she pretending? I see a lot of point A but none going to point B

[MariaR]

ok, what am i clueless about

I see a lot of questions like you're unaware of what the game state is or you're trying to develop reads but I don't see good or any follow up at times. I think you're just trying to stay busy on the sidelines. You don't get a wagon? Then explain your read on the slot and defend it. If you're really this clueless as you're portraying than I can help, but I don't think you are.

[MariaR]

You agree SS is scummy right? What's the bases of your SS scumread?

[MariaR]

basis
fucking phone

[MariaR]

Weird because you don't understand the wagon or weird because it was scum driven in your eyes?

[MariaR]

Blake I'm finally getting Skitter to make some solid stances just wait a moment.

[MariaR]

You saying you're aware of the gamestate is even more concerning than if you told me 'yeah I'm a bit confused right now.' Because you haven't explained why I'm scum. Well, you quoted a post and said 'that's why I'm voting her' but anyone can do that. You say you don't get the gobble wagon after responding to a quote where me and Bingle both cased him. So I know you didn't miss it. To me it feels like you're just making up being clueless to not get on the gobble wagon.

[MariaR]

Weird because you don't understand the wagon or weird because it was scum driven in your eyes?

weird because i don't udnerstand the wagon so it makes me question if it's scum driven
but then ss started shading the people opposing the wagon which i thought was strange

People often fear what they don't understand. Just because you don't understand something doesn't mean it's scum driven. Although I find it hard that you don't understand it in the first place considering anytime gobble has been asked to explain something he says you'll carry him. If I, one of your main scumreads are pushing it you should be saying 'hey guys Maria is scum pushing gobble because of xyz' not sitting here going 'what is this wagon?'

[MariaR]

You saying you're aware of the gamestate is even more concerning than if you told me 'yeah I'm a bit confused right now.' Because you haven't explained why I'm scum. Well, you quoted a post and said 'that's why I'm voting her' but anyone can do that. You say you don't get the gobble wagon after responding to a quote where me and Bingle both cased him. So I know you didn't miss it. To me it feels like you're just making up being clueless to not get on the gobble wagon.

i'm pretty sure i said why i'm voting you - your initial gobble case / push was bad and looked fake

i can see the cases and still not get where the flashwagon came from

And why is it bad/fake? You need to use more words that aren't just buzz.

[MariaR]

mariar what do you think my push on you is

Is this where I'm supposed to say 'bad/fake.' Your push on me seems really convenient considering you have no context behind the main base of my push?

And why is it bad/fake? You need to use more words that aren't just buzz.

i don't know. it didn't feel like something you actually believed. i don't have more words to articulate it but i can read it again and try to see if i can

Why wouldn't I believe it? You haven't played a lot with me. You weren't in the game in question. I just don't get how town you can reach the answer you have because you don't have the information to reach it.

Alright Blake feel free to revote although SS is looking juicy.

[MariaR]

Alright Blake feel free to revote although SS is looking juicy.

Your skill at reading me is impeccable, as always.

I bet you don't even remember the last time I played in a game with you when I was town.

[MariaR]

I want gobble to explain like, anything. His reads feel entirely made up on the spot/meaning to take advantage of the game state. It's a light read that will probably change when he gives me the sit down, but until then I will call him scum. This game had a lot more filler than I was expecting, making it a bit harder to get into it.

it was still a relatively early point of the game and this feels like a baseless accusation ^

Aka you're not gonna do it because they are made up. Got it~

like why do you think they're made up?

and then you shade gobble for a while without voting him

See this is better ^

1) Gobble thought I was scum in a pervious game and went after me hard for it. Here he basically feels like a doormat. He's lacking any energy at all. It's not normal.
2) It's made up because the main reason he scumread me doesn't exist. He said I wasn't scumhunting on a page that was me answering questions.
3) Does the timing of my vote matter?

[MariaR]

Link the game SS

[MariaR]

5. Something_Smart: Pretty blatantly obvious town. If he’s scum he extended his range hard. He’s clearly solving and going at this game in the SS style.

??
Pedit: I legit pushed on you in that game as a reaction test. I even made a post about it.

[MariaR]

Your hostility towards me is super off-putting.

[MariaR]

I can't really disprove your claims, I do think I have read you right before in games, maybe not as good as I'm remembering but I don't think it's wrong to say It's baseless. I might be wrong on you here, but I still want gobble dead.

[MariaR]

Then I'll give ya a day or 2 then. You can go into the Blake/Bingle tier.
pedit: You don't need to play exactly like you did in another game. But if you really thought I was scum you would not be pushing me in the manner you're doing. Besides, I've only been lynched as scum day 1 once in life. My poor pride...

[MariaR]

Then I'll give ya a day or 2 then. You can go into the Blake/Bingle tier.
pedit: You don't need to play exactly like you did in another game. But if you really thought I was scum you would not be pushing me in the manner you're doing. Besides, I've only been lynched as scum day 1 once in life. My poor pride...

You and Dunn were lynched Day 1 as your hydra in Alisae v Titus.

A hydra that Dunn mainly posted in and got us scumread for is not something I count in my record books.
pedit: You better have toast

[MariaR]

But if you really thought I was scum you would not be pushing me in the manner you're doing.

What is your basis for saying this? Are you an ornithologist?

You push me one game with such a level of confidence 1v1 me doing your best even if you're in the wrong. We go to this game where you won't even explain anything until you're prompted, twice and you have no energy.
In what world should I not find this scummy and weird?

[MariaR]

I still don't see why people got off the gobble wagon other than the fact of 'oh no we got them to L-1' and if that is the case why vote in the first place?

[MariaR]

Sorry I say 'L-1' because people thought it was L-1 when it was L-2.

[MariaR]

MariaR did you know what the real VC was there?

No. Not that it would've mattered if he was at l-5 or l-1 I would've voted regardless.

[MariaR]

I hope Mena gets wagoned for self reasons.

[MariaR]

Menaaaa I hope you get vigged thanks. Penguins reaction is the most interesting thing I got out of this though.

[MariaR]

I would swap probably one of his reads and then our reads list is exactly the same. If he's town I know I'm in the right spot. If he's scum I know I need to rethink.

[MariaR]

Menaaaa I hope you get vigged thanks. Penguins reaction is the most interesting thing I got out of this though.

Interesting like "PP looks really townie out of it", right?

Mhm.

[MariaR]

Wait you guys agree that gobbles doesn't have the wim he usually has??

I've been voting him all game for that exact reason.

[MariaR]

That's legit L-1 time to claim gobble.

[MariaR]

If posting screenshots was allowed I would post one where I had a draft ready saying Gobble is gonna be cheeky and not claim. Anyway, please hammer thanks friends

[MariaR]

The only role I would ever unvote for is vig and that's assuming we can leash it. Otherwise, I don't think there's a single role in this setup I'd unvote for.

[MariaR]

All gobble is doing is flailing at this point. Crumbs a role and won't even claim it yet for some reason states that he crumbed it defeating the entire purpose. People have given valid reasons to scumread him and he's just not doing anything about it. This scum rage is fake in my eyes. He's not even saying who the scum on his wagon are. Just calling everyone stupid. I don't see any reads just...it's really bad.

[MariaR]

VOTE: MariaR

This dies today.

She tried to get me hammered on day 3 of a two week long Day 1, before Bingle could catch up, before Liliith could catchup, before Chemist posted really anything of substance. AFTER I claimed I was a PR.
Her vote has the weakest substance and her self defense for not scumhunting earlier is that she is a reactive player so it is "NAI" for her to be reactive and not proactive. Yet she's being super proactive now after I heavily crumbed.

You're just bringing up random points for the sake of making a case than genuinely believing them. You never brought up Lilith before this or Chemist. You're just adding this to try and make me look bad. Also, anyone can fake a PR me wanting to lynch you after claiming you're a pr isn't important. Should I just drop my scumread on you because you claimed something you can fake? My 'self denfese' was the page you called me scummy on was me answering questions. There was nothing to scumhunt. I've said this multiple times and you choose to ignore it.

[MariaR]

You not liking peoples reasons to scumread you doesn't take away from the fact they exist.

[MariaR]

I just find it amusing that multiple people have told you you're acting off and have questioned you on it. Where you directly give a cheeky answer that you're not gonna say anything. You get wagoned for this and then have the audacity to flip out when you reach L-1 and call peoples reasoning trash. Did you just not expect to be wagoned for this? Did you think you'd coast by? Do you think any of your posting has been remotely towny?

[MariaR]

How does this make any sense? Why would I bring them up on a case against you that involves you trying get me lynched at L-1 when you did not try to get me lynched at L-1 until just a few hours ago?? Are you even thinking when you write your posts or does your red pm make you nonsensical?

I am also questioning why you're bringing them up! They're not involved in this what so ever and there's no way you had the genuine thought of. 'Oh Maria wanted me lynched at L-1 so these players couldn't catch up.' You're making this up on the spot.

Yes, you should drop your scumread on me because I claimed PR and hinted at it heavily enough that at least one person figured it out.

^ Not a reason to unvote someone or a reason to townread you.

You did nothing with those questions or really try to interact with the people asking those questions

You're moving the field goal. That wasn't the reason you were calling me scum. You were calling me scum because i wasn't scumhunting on a page that didn't need it. I was answering questions. You're just adding along until you go.

I called you out for being reactive and you said that was your playstyle, yet now you're being very active in trying to get a claimed PR lynched, so were you lying then or are you lying now?

I'm being quite reactive. Anyone who quotes me I answer. If I have scumreads I push them and ask questions. There's no lie in my statement nor would I need a reason to make up a lie in the first place.

Ephemeral "feelings" are not valid reasons to lynch someone who is a claimed PR on day 3/14 on Day 1 of a game where PRs are very important to dealing with scum given how powerful scum PRs are.

This isn't the only reason you're getting votes, but say even if it was. Yes, yes it can be. It is a reason you just don't like or want to admit to it being one.

[MariaR]

I just find it amusing that multiple people have told you you're acting off and have questioned you on it. Where you directly give a cheeky answer that you're not gonna say anything. You get wagoned for this and then have the audacity to flip out when you reach L-1 and call peoples reasoning trash. Did you just not expect to be wagoned for this? Did you think you'd coast by? Do you think any of your posting has been remotely towny?

migraine alert

What answer did I give that was cheeky? And if you thought it was cheeky, does that not defeat Pink Ball and your points about the level of whim that I am playing with?
The audacity to call people's baseless reasoning for voting me trash... wow, I'm so audacious!
Yes, I think it has. I pushed someone. I pushed another person. I've been asking people questions.

what is it that you've been doing...? Oh yeah... tunneling me.

The irony here is just, I love it.

[MariaR]

I'll be quite sad if you are town gobble because the way you're acting if you're town is just...yikes

[MariaR]

I'll be quite sad if you are town gobble because the way you're acting if you're town is just...yikes

How is it yikes?

The way your reacting to pressure on you isn't a way I would expect you to react. Let us say, for argument sake your town for a moment. Regardless of your feelings on the matter of peoples reasoning being 'trash' not everyone voting you is scum. At most 3 people are scum voting you. That means people have genuine reasons to vote you. No matter how bad you think they are. Just calling them trash and flipping out is not going to do any favors. It wasn't like you weren't aware of the reasons people were voting you. It's been brought up before.

[MariaR]

This isn't the only reason you're getting votes, but say even if it was. Yes, yes it can be. It is a reason you just don't like or want to admit to it being one.

You think... that a wagon that flashed this fast... is gonna be on scum...

I think your vote should be on this
VOTE: Skitter

[MariaR]

Cool, I'll be keeping my vote on Skitter.

[MariaR]

How many did you crumb?

[MariaR]

I'm saying skitter said she saw the crumbs because it was convenient for her to say that, 'cause it's something you can wash off easily too ("Oh I guess what I saw wasn't a crumb then")

^
Tldr: She used it as an excuse to stay off a town wagon to look better on the flip. (At least Scum would've considered it one)

[MariaR]

Tired Maria post of the day:

Game feels too easy. Either my trs are wrong/scum is in 'you get a day pass' or I have the scum team exactly (haha no)

me post...later...maybe me tired

[MariaR]

Ok I'm...awake kinda. Is skitter or turkey at L-2 yet

[MariaR]

VOTE: Gobble

[MariaR]

Both of them are solved via other people's flips atm.

[MariaR]

With the way Blake is playing if she's scum there's no way she makes end game. Pink ball? Don't know.

[MariaR]

I mean I already had Chem in my poe list and now since A50 has joined it really is helping turn that poe into a scumread.

To answer previous questions: Blake has promised some kind of content the next day or at least getting into the game. I don't think anyone has any real reason to say 'no' to lynching Blake besides the fact you may have stronger scumreads. So at one point she's gonna need to deliver on some reads, if they're wrong well... you know where that leads.

PB depends on Mena/Gobble.

[MariaR]

I seriously question how anyone is voting not gobble considering his claim. But I won't badger on it anymore.

[MariaR]

Let me put this in a very simple way for you A50: I have no energy to want to deal with this game rn. I pushed Gobble and got my reads. If you think I haven't pushed gobble I don't think there's a single thing I could say to convince you otherwise. I also think you're the only person in this playerlist who would say I haven't pushed gobble.

[MariaR]

Pretty stressed. Looking for places to move and working on college stuff. My attention has been elsewhere but hey, we're working on it. How's you?

[MariaR]

Pretty stressed. Looking for places to move and working on college stuff. My attention has been elsewhere but hey, we're working on it. How's you?

just got done exercising about to crash. need to work on some work stuff but probably shirking it for tomorrow.

Smh you're so lazy fire wtf

[MariaR]

A50 I can not stress this enough.

I have wanted gobble dead all game. I unvoted when he claimed sk and went to my other scumread that I've had all game. Skitter. He tried to take it back and I pushed him again. You are the only person in this playerlist who would say I haven't made a strong push on gobbles. You're the one who needs to rethink your stances here not me. You trying to meta me won't work either no one here knows my meta, but if it makes you feel better you can try it. This is probably gonna come across a bit snippy but I am very tired and don't feel like dealing with your insane paranoia theories that are just blatantly wrong.
pedit: I'm liking your sister.

[MariaR]

oh fk off page top

[MariaR]

Looking for places to move

You too? Is everybody reallocating of late? I mean, I seem to recall FL was, and then skitter, and now you.

Anyway, good luck finding a new place, and good luck also with college stuff. Now when can we expect you to have some time and energy for this game?

I honestly had energy this whole game until you replaced in and I already knew the direction this was gonna go when you came in. Probably day 2. But the rest of this day I am checked out because gobble thankfully is probably getting lynched so my work is done for now. I'll help with skitter tomorrow.

[MariaR]

Oh S_S is a ML btw.

[MariaR]

Thanks for the good wishes btw. Now if only I could find a place that wasn't on the third floor cause I'm not dealing with that day to day work out.
pedit: I have no reason to say she is scum but I'm not townreading her so I can see it. I don't really have a confident third scumread that isn't Skitter/Gobble.

[MariaR]

I have townreads on everyone that isn't Blake/Lilith atm and even that combo seems problematic. (Obv not townreading Skitter/Gobble)

[MariaR]

Last post before bed. A50 I don't think you're scum or sk, but if you are and pushing me knowing I am town. I am srsly gonna DDT you through a table for giving me a headache. That is all B)

[MariaR]

The one time me and PB tr each other yall kill him n1? How harsh~

[MariaR]

Talking about where the mafia nk went is useless
Lynching Skitter today is useless.
Whew I just was able to avoid reading the whole start of this day~

[MariaR]

also does anybody know if mariar usually has good reads?

Strongly depends on the amount of effort I'm putting into a game.

[MariaR]

I think it's best I take a step back and just listen for a lot of this phase since I'm 0/2 atm (even though I can make a strong argument for how both played very anti town in an awful manner but regardless) Idm voting in Lilith/Blake since I still had them in 'poe' but it's clear some of my townreads are incorrect. I just need to figure out where.

[MariaR]

You think SS is gonna flip scum even after the fact basically everyone was okay with his lynch? That just gives me pause.

[MariaR]

@Skitter Weren't we about to lynch SS when he was at L-2 or?

[MariaR]

I'm quite surprised I haven't been pushed today when I was coming back expecting votes. I'll try to get some energy for this game soon. Mafia rn is just a drag for me

[MariaR]

Maybe I can just ask to be vigged since I don't think I make end game here and it's best to get my flip while we can. Or maybe that's just me being tired.
VOTE: Lilith

[MariaR]

(Btw All you have to do is take a look at how me and S_S interacted to see how we're never scum together.)

[MariaR]

(Btw All you have to do is take a look at how me and S_S interacted to see how we're never scum together.)

But like... you barely interacted at all?

Why do you prefer lilith anyway

Bingo. You think a team that has me as scum on it wouldn't have good interactions with my partners? Come on now. Plus S_S yelled at me and I would never let him do that to me as scum. I prefer Lilith because I've at points townread S_S more than I have her

[MariaR]

Was that the hydra game? Because that game was more Dunnstral than it was me. It's not a good game to reference for my scum game considering me and Dunnstral do in fact have a hydra meta compared to me solo.
pedit: Look at how the way the interaction worked. That just wasn't pleasant for either party. Do you think S_S fakes that anger as scum? If I wanted to get good interactions with my scumbuddy it certainly wouldn't be like

that.

I think you underestimate my scum game.

[MariaR]

Ohh that game! Honestly, I can't give you a valid answer because I don't remember much of it more the fact I was trying to beat a cold. If you're asking how I would do it well, that depends on my partners but I certainly wouldn't go for fake anger since people think as scum I can fake everything in the book. I can't let you in on my little secrets for scum but I can most certainly tell you S_S is legit the last person you should think I'm partners with in this playerlist. Hell, I expected people to call me partners with Skitter if she flipped scum. Just because you like to fake anger in your scum games Mena doesn't mean you're me.

[MariaR]

I certainly wouldn't go for fake anger since people think as scum I can fake everything in the book

I’m not sure I understand this bit but maybe I’m being dumb. Why does people thinking you can fake everything in the book mean you wouldn’t use fake anger?

One of the things that's stuck with scum me is people think I have this insane range meaning I can fake every interaction in the book. When you have an outline like that, fake anger is one of the classics that would never get scum me townread. I wouldn't go for something that obvious. That would only work with a very select few people. S_S isn't one of them. Combine that with the fact anger is one of the most NAI factors in mafia can be easily dismissed, yeah it's bad.
If we flip Lilith Idm the vig pool being (Me/S_S) but I think you're wrong~

[MariaR]

They do both need to die just so if either are town people can commit to different stances.

[MariaR]

I should really pay attention to these VCs because one day I'll hammer by mistake.

[MariaR]

I'd vote S_S if Lilith was promised to be vigged if he flipped town.

[MariaR]

Oh yeah I forgot that existed uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

[MariaR]

How come I get slapped on the wrist for trying to drive a wagon but now suddenly it's 2 days in and it's a okay? W/e I lost my right to call reads atm since I'm 0/2 and I need to flip a scum for people to listen to me so I'd do it. Have people explained why S_S that doesn't boil down to (Poe read)

[MariaR]

So am I and I'm not being wagoned.

[MariaR]

400 page iso dive... I'll let skitter quote a few posts for me instead. This game is too long it's 100 pages day 2 why me.
pedit: My plan is working

[MariaR]

oh there's the wagon on me. Neat. Back to afk I go

[MariaR]

When I see reasons for why I'm scum I'll responded to them.

[MariaR]

- your reads were utterly wrong yesterday.
- that all by itself is not a major issue, but you're not really using the flips/my claim to reasses the game state and figure out who you should be pushing
- you seem very complacent with the current gamestate

First point isn't a reason to scumread someone
Second one is wrong. If I really didn't care or want to relook at the game I would be hard pushing Blake right now.
I'm using today to look at flips and see where I need to look at. So I'm taking a back seat. If you think that's scummy then oh well.

[MariaR]

- your reads were utterly wrong yesterday.
- that all by itself is not a major issue, but you're not really using the flips/my claim to reasses the game state and figure out who you should be pushing
- you seem very complacent with the current gamestate

First point isn't a reason to scumread someone
Second one is wrong. If I really didn't care or want to relook at the game I would be hard pushing Blake right now.
I'm using today to look at flips and see where I need to look at. So I'm taking a back seat. If you think that's scummy then oh well.

i mean the qualifier on the second point indicated that by itself i didn't think that the first point was a reason to scumread you
and this is the first that i've heard about you wanting to push blake? like if you're not showing where you're reassesing in thread it's kinda hard for me to see it ... ?

I've openly said I want to push Blake before so I don't see a reason to talk about that.

[MariaR]

Let me kill the one and only player in the game townreading me after hard tunneling a VT flip. Yeah, that's not how it works. Honestly people are voting me just for the sake of it. The only one who put some effort into it is Skitter. Let me go look into something before I sleep

[MariaR]

PB also did townread S_S and go for Blake/Lilith. I think only 1 of those ladies are probably scum. Feels very weird to bus when I doubt either of them make end game. Hm, surely Mena/Datsi don't have scum in it right? Unless Skitter is just scum who is fake claiming the mafia shot mafia probably shot at Pink too.
pedit: We have no reason to believe mafia didn't shoot him.

[MariaR]

Oh Bingle is in this game. I guess they can die. PP/SS/A50 will remain as townreads.

[MariaR]

I think you're missing the more important point of the post.

[MariaR]

Both of our town flips have called me town. Has anyone posted reasons on why I'm scum that aren't skitter? Nope. Almost said something about gobble but that was already proven false. Datsi and you? Not a word. Wanna know the number of players expressing townreads on me? It's 1 or 0. Scum me having no townreads on her? Not a thing.
pedit: Calling PB a weird nk in the first place is odd. But anyway, the skitter talk is proven by her shooting another night so no need to go in on it more. That also wasn't the point. That gets proven tonight or not.

[MariaR]

If you can't give a confident reason on why you're voting me that isn't just 'poe' you shouldn't be voting me Mena and considering the amount of time in the day phase it's very easy to go back and rethink your stances. (Like me!)

[MariaR]

Anyway, I'll be going to bed now. I hope to find some reasons in the morning! Rest well friends.

[MariaR]

@Mena

You're scumreading me the known mood based player for changing her mood? Do you think I was, planning this or I'm faking it? Etc.

[MariaR]

Bingle saying me and S_S look good as scum together while giving no context on how they think scum me would do such a thing or examples is really bad btw.
VOTE: Bingle

[MariaR]

@maria I kind of feel like you’re saying that I would never be justified in scumreading you lol

No, I like when people scumread me for what I think are logical and reasonable arguments. I have no problem with Skitters issues with me and I will happily resolve them. I just think the points you brought up aren't alignment based for me. Also I believe mood is the only thing you have brought up as a reason to scumread me and that just, the most NAI thing of all. Are you saying me trying to defend myself from the lynch is scummy? Yes, I was more relaxed early in the phase and I openly said I was going to take a step back this phase. But that doesn't mean I will roll over and let myself get lynched.

[MariaR]

Do you disagree with that take maria? If so then what were scum doing not pushing S_S while lilith was in contention for the lynch and who/why is there scum in (datisi, skitt, A50)?

You know how you solve this take of yours? Not voting me. If that take is one you believe in you should be joining on the Lilith wagon to get information out of said lynch. I don't understand how you can say one thing yet your actions lead you to here.

[MariaR]

Being scumread is something I'm used to so it's easy for me to tell the logical pushes that make some amount of sense in my mind vs ones I know aren't AI when people think they are. Why do you think I react so calmly under pressure? Because regardless if I'm town or scum it's simple to defend myself. If the game state is so hung up on S_S/Lilith shouldn't that be where most of you are going? Not this Maria flip that if I flip town will just be wasting a lynch and if I'm scum what doors do that open?

No one in this game has expressed a townread on me just others they would lynch first. So if I am scum I'm getting bussed. I would like to believe or at least have enough confidence in my scum ability that I wouldn't be put in that spot in the first place if I was scum. However wifom aside, everyone should really think on how valuable my flip is and how strong that scumread is. Bingle to me is pretty much outted scum because they're smart enough to reach the point I'm bringing to you all right now without having to type it. He's just trying to line up lynches.
pedit: And how is that?
pedit2: I'm not focused on you I'm more focused on trying to survive and prove my points. I have liked your posting a bit more but then that means I need to break into the random townblock that has been made and quite frankly that isn't going to happen with how people see me at the moment.

[MariaR]

Like I am waiting for some points against me along the lines of: 'You pushed gobbles as scum' and that is a very valid reason I can think to scumread me.

Things like 'This player is scum so you are as well' is a pre flip and considering the other wagon got to a much higher count is just, wrong in the basic sense of mafia and thought process. Sure if someone said they're more confident in me flipping scum then that's better. But that hasn't been said. It's just strange overall.

[MariaR]

I don't know if you player differently on this account or something but you've seen very just lackluster and laid back like you don't really care too much about the game and that's very different from what I've come to expect from you.

[MariaR]

Anytime I see someone try to use Titus vs Alisae as a point on me when I had maybe 15 posts in that game makes me want to hit my head off a chair (Not to mention I do have a very obvious meta when it comes to hydraing with Dunnstral)

[MariaR]

Your personality still does shine through in that game.

Interesting.

[MariaR]

@mari what is this new avi from.

Do you like it? It's from free ^_^

[MariaR]

Yes it's an anime. I really like this art

[MariaR]

VOTE: Lilith

[MariaR]

That's how you expect scum me to defend a scum buddy? Interesting.

[MariaR]

That's probably the worst way you

could

defend a scum buddy. The best case in that theory is that someone thinks the interactions are too bad for you to be scum with that person. But that should never be your goal in the first place. If you're gonna defend a buddy go all in or at least make it seem believable. Going for a 'shitty defense' as you call it is not the way.
pedit: I agree with this random voice in my head

[MariaR]

That's probably the worst way you

could

defend a scum buddy. The best case in that theory is that someone thinks the interactions are too bad for you to be scum with that person. But that should never be your goal in the first place. If you're gonna defend a buddy go all in or at least make it seem believable. Going for a 'shitty defense' as you call it is not the way.
pedit: I agree with this random voice in my head

I think you didn't give enough of a shit about the game to put in a lot of effort but still wanted to try to shift things away from your partner. It fits my gamestate read of small scumteam, low town power. It fits my townreads. It fits my impression of your recent scumgames, like that one where you got lynched D1. And let's be honest, I don't have the leverage or the wim to deal with a deepwolf in this game.

This is just an assumption at the end of the day. It’s also one with no merit. If I was able to be caught or meta read off one or two scum games my win rate wouldn’t be as high as it is. Because I would lose more often than not. Clearly that isn’t the case. Yes I got lynched day 1 in a ‘recent’ game but that is the first time it’s ever happened. Your entire argument is just doesn’t work here.

Now you voting me because you don’t think SS is partners with Lilith would be fine if you made any type of progress. But I fail to see that.

[MariaR]

Menaaaa why you gotta respond when I’m reading my romance novel.

Ugh I’ll answer later

[MariaR]

Stuff will be tomorrow. I did a light skim but I will say in advance I won't be claiming.

[MariaR]

Tonights games sucked so Ima just go curl under a blanket with a book gn friends.

[MariaR]

After work prepare yourself

[MariaR]

Okay, let's get this started:

I don’t think the gamestate is hung up on S_S/lilith and i don’t think it has been for a couple of days

Let me stop you right here because this is wrong. We’re gonna run through 2 scenarios here 1 where it is TvtT and one where it is SvT. Regardless of the result it’s nearly impossible for me to be scum.

In the case where Lilith/S_S are TvT the wagon never turns onto me. Ever. Wagons like that are a gold mine of information that scum can use to their advantage. Even if you assume that S_S towned it up then scum would push the Lilith wagon through and then S_S would go right under the light again. The only option here where you can refer to me maybe being scum is if it’s an all town wagon and considering how easily my wagon has made it to this stage and people want to put me at L-1 I’m not so sure about that. However unless you want to assume scum was already on the Lilith wagon (Me/PP/Blake) then that’s just...wrong.

TvS makes a lot more sense considering after S_S did town it up the wagon can disband and go onto me or just sit back and watch from the sidelines as another townie is lynched and then S_S goes back under fire. You can make a bunch of pre flip ideas but without a flip that’s just baseless nonsense.

think you make a lot of sense as scum especially given my earlier point on you suddenly being very invested in the game and not being lynched (possibly a mood thing, sure, and if it is that and I mislynch you for it I apologise but I can also very easily see it as scum you being happy to let the gamestate proceed as it was while town (skitter and I) we’re both pushing town, only to realise you needed to start playing harder once that stopped happening.

So you think I’m lying? Besides the fact that it is outright silly for me to lose interest as scum when I’m losing. (This has never happened before and you can try to prove me wrong but you won’t find anything) I’m a lot more subtle than that. I have no reason to fake a mood to get townread. Even if it is ‘easy’ for me to do so that doesn’t mean it is the correct play. If scum me were in such a losing spot (and it is very hard to get scum me in that spot to begin with) this isn’t the way I would be going on about it. Look at Team Mafia for example.

And idk if you are being bussed? If you are I think only bingle makes sense and it’s actually proving pretty hard to get a lynch on you with people pushing towards lil and S_S and bingle as other possibilities for today.

Who are these magical people you keep talking about besides PP? Also you don’t know if I’m getting bussed as in you can’t think it all the way through?

I think scum is probably avoiding taking a hard stance on you but I’m not at all sold that you’re being bussed based on the resistance I’m feeling.

Scum bus me more often than not because I am never a deep wolf given my rep as scum. You say scum are avoiding a stance on me etc etc but none of this makes sense with your own poe or logic if you think about it for a moment. If scum aren’t voting me at the moment then that makes even more sense considering when I flip town that’s going to make people go ‘oh shoot we need to reset’


Finally, let us talk about this theory/poe that most people seem to agree on:

Finally, if you flip scum I think my theory of the scumteam in (you, PP, Blake, bingle, fb) is more likely to be correct, and that lilith is very likely town. Specifically, if you’re scum I think Blake is quite likely to be scum here, and would proceed on that basis tomorrow. Admittedly, if lilith is scum it would be big and idk what it would mean,

This gamestate? Would not be like this if your poe had 3/3 in it. It is far too calm and scum are just letting themselves get run over at that point. If you think it’s Me/Blake what are we trying to accomplish? If we ML Lilith then we’re both under fire next. If scum were really all in your poe they would be trying to bus and give good interactions. The reason why the gamestate is so normal is because someone outside that poe is a deep wolf and scum. Am I going to push that angle today? No, I don’t have the advantage or sway to do that. Do I think I’m correct? Yup.

you got wagoned and then the other votes spread out and the game went quiet

You said it yourself here. This doesn’t make sense if I am scum with your poe being correct.

You're wrong, and you really need to take a step back and think about this because I am not scum.

[MariaR]

You might wonder why I was so relaxed and now here I am responding to walls and it's simple. I knew if I opened my mouth and said I doubted the townblock with my spot in the game scum can easily turn that against me and town will believe it. I'm not in a spot in the game where I can have an open talk or opinion about certain things while in the threat of being lynched. Taking this dayphase to see if the poe was 'right' or I was correct in theory was the best thing I could do and clearly how this phase is playing out I'm right.

Now then, back to my book.

[MariaR]

Oh if you still think I'm scum after all that feel free to vote me I doubt anything else I can say would convince you otherwise. I wouldn't want to waste even more effort trying to work on people I don't think are willing to consider the harder outcomes. Regardless, this has certainly been a journey.

pedit: I haven't put in the effort to go through isos and consider it given it's not my top priority. If I live today or I'm no longer at threat of being lynched? I'll probably go over it.

[MariaR]

You misinterpret my words once again. Not knowing what is wrong with it requires me to read through it and then come to the answer there all town. I haven’t done such a thing. I’m saying scum in the town block makes the most sense with the current way the game is played.

[MariaR]

I’ll be back in a few hours. Hopefully to questions or a hammer. This game is truly draining and I regret tryharding this one, but I am stubborn

[MariaR]

I'm going to skip all the math talk since it is A) 100% useless and B) Not helpful. We lynch the vengeful claim. There's no world where that is bad for us since Lilith is a strong scumread and you can take out someone in the 'poe' without the bus driver being a threat. Like me and Bingle

[MariaR]

what if Maria is scum tho?

[MariaR]

Fire and Lilith were scum? I feel very smug right now.
I think Datsi/Bingle win us the game. Blake is clear from setup I think?

[MariaR]

It's not A50/Blake/S_S/Mena. Peng gets a pass cause they're great
leaves us with the rest

[MariaR]

This is some next level Sherlock Holmes shit

[MariaR]

Fire and Lilith were scum? I feel very smug right now.
I think Datsi/Bingle win us the game. Blake is clear from setup I think?

Good reads Maria

Maybe a little bit

Too good

you got me I bussed my partners

[MariaR]

PP isn’t scum period Mena

[MariaR]

This is a 4 or 3 T game so 3 or 4 town power roles if I get that correctly. We already have 1 flipped we shouldn't vote Mena or Blake because they're basically clear

[MariaR]

If no one else claims PR they're clear. If 1 more person claims PR one could be lying, but if scum want to lock themselves into a PR claim Idm that
pedit: Your crumb was super obvious Mena. Do you really think I would've let you push me that hard if I didn't see it?

[MariaR]

[MariaR]

Mena is the new FL

Mena wouldn't throw a game for his rep though

[MariaR]

I forgot if I've done this yet but anyway:
VOTE: Datisi
pedit: It's an inside joke, harmless I assure you

[MariaR]

I don't think it's a stretch to say your reads haven't been on top of the world Mena. Bad? I don't know if I'd go that far. To be fair I don't think a lot of people in this playerlist had both Fire/Lilith nailed to the ground.

[MariaR]

Best advantage we have is 2 scum are dead so no one can be dishonest anymore in how they read a player. As in, we can take harder townreads to heart than we normally could.

[MariaR]

Ladies please you're both pretty stop voting each other

[MariaR]

Ladies please you're both pretty stop voting each other

Who should we lynch then? Not really interested in datisi either as I think I have a softer clear on her from N1

I think I know what you're implying and atm I don't know how I feel about it I'll have to think about it.

[MariaR]

Okay let me put it this way for both of you:

Penguin: At the moment Mena is basically clear, we won't be lynching him today until new events show up and even then I don't know if he's scum.

Mena: PP voted Lilith basically the entire game and the way he's reacting right now strongly represents a town game of his before.

You're both town, let us figure out the last scum

[MariaR]

Okay let me put it this way for both of you:

Penguin: At the moment Mena is basically clear, we won't be lynching him today until new events show up and even then I don't know if he's scum.

Mena: PP voted Lilith basically the entire game and the way he's reacting right now strongly represents a town game of his before.

You're both town, let us figure out the last scum

I’m tunneled. I need a target to move out of it.

Tunnel me I'm used to it at this point.

[MariaR]

If Datsi/Bingle doesn't end the game I am booboo the fool at this point and I know Mena is basically softing no visit results on both of them but I'm like 'that doesn't clear' (Mena don't connect me if I'm wrong this is just what I'm thinking)
pedit: But Peng I'm MafiaR I can fake anything in any game so clearly if I am not cleared I can still be scum!!!

[MariaR]

We’re not doing datisi or bingle when there are mechanical reasons to think that they’re both more likely to be town than scum

If a no visit track result n1 or n2 is your reasoning than that isn't gonna stop me when they have the worst ISOs in the game

[MariaR]

Are we auto then?

Not even close.

[MariaR]

I'll legit get a full face of clown makeup if PP is scum this game

[MariaR]

I'll legit get a full face of clown makeup if PP is scum this game

Cool, and I’ll get one if he’s town, so how about we split the difference you vote him and we both wear half the makeup?

....Half a face is more challenging but I could probably do it if I was given 2 hours.

But no PP is town

Oh this is wifom and if you need any other reason to clear me: Lilith looked to me for advice when we were scum together and she probably would've done it here too if we were partners. If you think I let her claim vengeful

I'ma make some shortcake and be back soon

[MariaR]

Stop using good logic against my points S_S?!?!?! You're supposed to let me just be correct?!

[MariaR]

You wanna say how I can be scum with that team Blake? Because my fire interactions and how I wanted Lilith dead and proved it in my case should be pretty clearing.

[MariaR]

I find it virtually impossible for everybody that isn't Datisi to be scum with lillith2013 and Firebringer.

I find it a bit less virtually impossible for you.

So you have no argument?

[MariaR]

Pretty sure everyone has said PR/Not PR by now Pengu

[MariaR]

I'll sit here and wait for any magical reasons on why I can be scum to pop up because I know they don't exist at this point and it's disappointing.

[MariaR]

You’re scum because you are MARIAr

This is starting to feel like the only answer people have atm ;-;

[MariaR]

You’re scum because you are MARIAr

This is starting to feel like the only answer people have atm ;-;

I mean - I’m guilty of it too. I’m just happy I actually townread you in a game.

Penguin says not knowing how wrong he is

Same friend

[MariaR]

I'll sit here and wait for any magical reasons on why I can be scum to pop up because I know they don't exist at this point and it's disappointing.

Everytime I try to SMUGLY force myself on you with a CHEAP FLIRT LINE you just shrug it off and ignore me. Isn't that reason enough for me to SR you??

You will scumread me even if I have an IC role pm A50 we both know this by now!

[MariaR]

If Datisi really isn't scum and I need to convince people to not lynch me and Peng...sigh more effort for me

[MariaR]

Mena if Datisi flips town you're going to go back to pushing me and we're gonna have the same tango again. I'm not looking forward to it.

[MariaR]

Hey PP while we have time who do you think scum is in A50/S_S or do you think Bingle really did nothing with his JOAT?

[MariaR]

I’m genuinely so annoyed I had to be cleared this game. Although I’m not surprised just disappointed.

[MariaR]

I’ll come back when I don’t want to just slump my head into my desk but atm I’m prob voting SS

[MariaR]

If PP is scum Mena I'll take the L.

[MariaR]

I kinda just wanna lynch S_S/A50 and call it a day but I'll only do it if me and Mena can come to an agreement.

[MariaR]

You think it's more likely Bingle just didn't use his PR n2 then A50 being scum?

[MariaR]

Penguin said laughing at his fellow list mod with an evil smirk

[MariaR]

I can be convinceed on Bingle from Mena/Peng

[MariaR]

Mena do you want me to go over why I think Peng is so town for you

[MariaR]

I don't put in effort for just

anyone

you know. Give me a minute

[MariaR]

Let us start with the basics:

FB is town...seriously?

Lilith is scum.

If Peng was scum he most certainly was setting up for a fire deep wolf and that makes..almost no sense to me. He would've had to be bussing Lilith from the start and not even very well. Since the most he did was just vote Lilith and say 1 word. We've seen Peng play the game before. If Peng is scum and trying to bus he would've been a lot more convincing than this.

i still think penguin might be scum since he literally comes to this thread just to badmouth me but i know i’m gonna be an asshole if i post my response so i deleted my post.

Yes. The fact that you are scumreading me for joke posts yet attacking Bingle for doing the same thing to Mena and me pointing out the irony is me badmouthing you.

I also don't think Lilith/Peng is fake here. Like I don't see why they just go into the thread and pretend to be mad at each other. Neither of them seem like the type to fake that for no reason.

[MariaR]

Plus, we've seen how he reacts in pure anger when he went at you and even apologized after the fact. That leads me to believe that also wasn't faked. Yes, scum can get angry. But Peng doesn't strike me as the type to get mad for being scumread in a game of mafia. Now if he's getting misrepped as town? I can see it.

Get where I'm going?

[MariaR]

If Mena hard tells me to lynch PP because he's that confident in it I will not selfishly hold up the game to my own reads. But A50 agrees he's town as well. What's your and S_S thoughts on him?

[MariaR]

I'm still at S_S/A50 and if I'm wrong I want people to present me why I should lynch Bingle/Peng with that said...a new chapter in my romance book came out online today. Byeeee~