Open 800 - Donner Party | Game Over
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DoubtingThomas Mafia Scum
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your entire thesis around me seems like it revolves around the idea that i am a newb!scum and things i do is newb!scum. can you describe your scum read on me without using the word newb!scum? how about hypothetically speaking i told you that i am a decent scum. what have i done that makes you think i am a scum?-
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like you were literally scraping posts where i was cussing and started laughing. that doesn't feel genuine scum read? do you really believe that all of the things you've done is in good faith?
you said that me focusing on one person and jumping around while buddying anyone who town reads me is scum 101? that's what you've done too? you don't think? you started pushing pob long, anad when i came into the thread, i was 80% of the things you've talked about. the only other scum read you ever had is on guillotina? but to a limited extent? hmm? like that's not a real scum read if it's a behavior that towns can easily do and it's something that could be used to describe your exact play?-
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please stop ignoring post #1075. i definitely had a lot of inclination towards solving your slot. i stopped pushing your slot after you substituted in. then i saw your posts and i still don't know how your progression panned out from pub long to me.In post 1081, Battle Mage wrote:
Why would I care what your believe? You're either just scum, or town who has no inclination towards solving my slot. I think newb-town you would be...well, as I think you described it earlier, more enthusiastic and zealous and trying to read people. No evidence of that here.In post 1077, DoubtingThomas wrote:if you can succinctly explain why you scum read me from when you were voting pob long instead of making accusations that my strategy this game was scum 101, it would make me more likely believe that your push on me is genuine, tbh. a lot of your 'scum reads' on me have been in reaction to what i've done to you. like 'oh you are emotive, you said 'very noted' ' it doesn't feel real. can you please explain your reads in details intead of keep saying i am newb scum? like
and to pick just one thing above, I believe I was scumreading you before you'd said anything to me?-
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DoubtingThomas Mafia Scum
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you have ignored this, again, unfortunatelyIn post 1071, DoubtingThomas wrote:
maybe i missed it as i've posted and we were talking over each other and others were joining in the conversation if you can explain again it would be good if you don't want to for some reason okIn post 1068, Battle Mage wrote:
haha well i actually answered that question earlier in the game i think - i guess you just forgot/didn't read?In post 1065, DoubtingThomas wrote:Spoiler:
so i am assuming this progression just means you think i was trying to protect scum!pob long or something? what a stretch of a progression if you can explain better so i can see if your thought progression actually makes sense i will appreciate it-
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DoubtingThomas Mafia Scum
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i don't understand this statement, but i note that you aren't trying to engage me in live, even though i requested in a civil manner. i guess i gotta go for the night byeIn post 1085, Battle Mage wrote:i'll respond to other stuff later, if Gamma gives me permission.-
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quite wrong, again. i engaged with you as soon as i came back once you subbed in, and after our engagement, i thought that your read and treatment of my slot along with the push for pub long who is a low efforting slot was not town indicative at all. it is this very push that made you vote me.In post 1089, Battle Mage wrote:
that's different to me responding to things you've done to ME though - you're moving the goalposts here.In post 1086, DoubtingThomas wrote:i don't see a transparency in your thought. and no, i scum read you before you joined. i was scum reading your slot from way before you joined the game
you can't take credit that you scum read me first when you substituted in into a slot and started reading stuff back before i joined the thread again to even see you substituted in. needlessto say you never 'explained' why you were 'scum reading' me only that you thought 2 others plus myself were your 'hypothetical team' and you weren't voting any of us :/-
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if you somehow get time to explain why you initially thought i was scummy and how that thought progressed while talking to me, i think that'd help me understand you a little more.
without that, based on my pov and how we interacted, it feels like the only reason you ended up voting me is because i said whawt you are doing is anti-town and because i don't think pob long is a good yeet, which you disagreed. this alone, i don't think really warrants a scum read, and that's why i think your scum read on me is unbelievable. maybe if you can explain things in your perspective, this thought can change.-
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i am not reading every single words of every single posts you write. especially if i don't scum read you and have greater focuses elsewhereIn post 1155, Guillotina wrote:2) When I posted the big spoiler wall about how i pocketed Gamma and mentioned a possible DT-Gamma relation, he ignored it and pushed me bote with him against superb because he wanted to policy lim us. DT is not a newbie, he should know that policy lim suggested so openly cant come from wolf, but I am the noob and i fell for it and that was enough to make ignore my suspicion on DT-Gamma.-
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why are they scum?In post 1161, Gamma Emerald wrote:VOTE: Aristophanes
I don't like how much of a gnarl the situation is with the more active players, but it seems like no good agreement is probably gonna be reached there, so I think it's best we defer that issue.-
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also not true proven by experience both personal and witnessing someone elseIn post 1153, Guillotina wrote:But here is the thing. No wolf is gonna openly talk about policy eliminations.-
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DoubtingThomas Mafia Scum
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In post 1165, DoubtingThomas wrote:asking for policy lim while saying 'i didn't actuallyscumread them' is a weak stance, a very anti-town stance. killing people you are annoyed at = when they flip town you just say, 'haha but i never actually scum read them' hot garbage move regardless of alignment-
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DoubtingThomas Mafia Scum
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in terms of how my experience was when i did that? yes there was no consequence in me calling for policy lim and as scum i knew once the town flipped ttown, i wouldn't get heat for anything besides 'why would you try to policy lim??'In post 1174, Guillotina wrote:
Can that experience be corroborated?In post 1164, DoubtingThomas wrote:
also not true proven by experience both personal and witnessing someone elseIn post 1153, Guillotina wrote:But here is the thing. No wolf is gonna openly talk about policy eliminations.
calling for policy lim also gives more confusion and negative feeling in the thread that is beneficial for scums, along with another positive (for scum) side effect of making people become more emotional, away from logic and truth-
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DoubtingThomas Mafia Scum
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Spoiler:
hmm yeah. it feels like throughout the game he was staying away from being attacked by me and even town reading me at one point to state it boldly. and then when things cooled down, all his previous interactions and buddy-buddy ness aand town read is gone just because i said vig should prob kill here? mmmmmmmmm lol-
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DoubtingThomas Mafia Scum
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all this vig talk. you MUST be scum reading chaos and yourself? yes?In post 551, JohnnyFarrar wrote:
Is it that calling for the death of a player regardless of alignment kind of sucks?In post 503, DoubtingThomas wrote:
anyone know what is odd about this postIn post 500, Chaos Triforce wrote:
Plus is generally extremely hard to read. I have never ever not SRed him in a game before. Like thats how scummy I perceive him as and its so scummy that I can never stop myself. My conclusion is plus is scummy af. Just hope there is a vig in the game that vigs him. If there isn't, then you have to concentrate and make things right your own way :/In post 385, DoubtingThomas wrote:plusjoyed is giving town reads on his friends like government is giving out food stamps to the poor, wtf?
-nornor
Is it that Noraa prolly isn't the vig because the vig usually isn't like "gosh I hope a vig kills this person if they exist"
Is it that players that don't know the setup are generally town, doubly so in a three headed hydra because people on teams usually talk setup at some point?
Why are you being coy?-
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DoubtingThomas Mafia Scum
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From my interactions with Johnny, their stance on the game was that of a very friendly one. When I had a showdown with superb and PlusJOYED, Johnny was the first one to sort of calm the situation down, and treating me as a slot worth listening to. It did not feel like a simple, "ok, so what are your thoughts?" It felt like "I understand your point. What do you think about this?" It's difficult to put into words, but the difference between the latter and former is that there's an implication of town reading the other slot, or at least being in a world where Johnny believes that the slot they are talking to is capable of pointing out important facts that could potentially guide town to the right course of things. This happened all throughout the game, and there's literally a post where he states that he thinks I am town.In post 1206, Aristophanes wrote:DT every post on this page from you seems bad, misguided, or incoherent, with the exception of 1200 which is a valid point. Are you in a Tunnel on Johnny and why?
I feel like you are underestimating them as a player, for one, and saying things about their posts that the quoted posts are not supporting.
After all that, though, I read his last batch of posts like 2-3 times. Maybe I should sit down and really try to savor on what he was trying to say, but his initial rather firm town read on me (a read that at least FELT like it came from more than just a few posts he saw me write) dissolved - like evaporated. It doesn't really have to about whether or not he's a good scum player or not. It felt like a very different person, and while he MAY have some own progression of thoughts in his mind, based on the posts I've ISO'ed him, I could not read and it looks like he has flip flopped greatly on his treatment of my slot. My understanding of him voting me from town reading me was that because 'scums are the only ones conscious of vigs. and that i was conscious of vigs'
All of these you can really see only if you read all of his posts and interactions with me, which I don't expect you to do. But if you can at least read his last batch of posts yourself and tell me what you think about his progression on me after posting that he town reads me, I guess it could help me see him better?-
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DoubtingThomas Mafia Scum
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interesting - even though you've defended me when others were town reading me and now I am lead wagonIn post 1211, Gamma Emerald wrote:You know what, I’m gonna call this out rn. I really don’t think Chaos hydra is scum atp. Get off of them.-
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he's not taking any strong stance and still hasn't explained his thought progession from stating i am town to voting me. his explanation on me also is not indicative of scum, so i even get that less. especially because he's taken the role of 'calming people down' so i don't expect him to try to kill me for being unpleasant. and also his description of me trying to scum read everyone who scum reads me is wrong (e.g. guillotina) and also i town read you heavily too. dont think its greatIn post 1217, Gamma Emerald wrote:
Ok Johnny is town, send itIn post 1215, JohnnyFarrar wrote:
Lol yeah this mostly. It got tense and insulty for a minute.In post 1199, Aristophanes wrote:Have I actually missed anything?
SuperB wants to policy Tommie or guil or both because they're used to different ways of play (and to be fair they are a little too quick to argue ANYTHING). This is after starting a scumread on Gamma.
Gamma, it's weird, but I read the MS rulebook, and it said he is off limits today.
Tommie bites the head off the head of anyone looking at him sideways, which is everyone, so everyone's scum to him.
Guil is a certified clever boy¿ with gambits
Okay maybe not THAT confident but I like how he went about summing up the thread
Like it’s fair and balanced takes with no evident prejudice that seems like trying to bias the feel of anyone-
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DoubtingThomas Mafia Scum
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all the "scum reads" I got this game
-Too go-with-the-flowy to be town (Chaos)
-Shitting everyone (battle mage)
-Policy lim because he's bad for game health (superb)
-He's biting everyone's head off (Johnny)
-Used AtE (Chk)
-He's irrational when wolf (Guillotina.. although I don't think I ever wolfed against you besides a game that I subbed in for a day which I don't think really counts but w/e)-
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it's a legit read, if I wasn't getting scum read by others for 'hurting game thread' and 'shitting on everyone' and 'not allowing others to talk'In post 1232, Gamma Emerald wrote:
That is a legit reason though, maybe it’s not good but it’s not policy or w/eIn post 1228, DoubtingThomas wrote:Too go-with-the-flowy to be town
Who out of those do you think is most likely to be scum? Do you think the team is on you, if so who would it be?
PEdit: I don’t recall Johnny saying you were scummy with that
? uhm
and ok - what do you think Johnny's scum read on me was about then? that's what I got from him. he's also ignored me so-
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also why is guillotina like pretending to know my meta? he's saw my scum game once when it was my first game ever since my 1.5 years long hiatus and I subbed into a bastard mash that was already in a shitty place. would be playing differently no matter what. also I only randed towns in the games he's hosted, and yet that would still read differently reading from a host perspective? hmm maybe that will be my tinfoil slot out of my town core-
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no. mafiauniverse. phases are faster like 1-3 days per day and 12hrs - 24 hrs for nights. for 98% of the games you always eliminate no need to reach maj and cannot sleep unless specifiedIn post 1247, Gamma Emerald wrote:That’s XHF right
I might, I have ventured into the homesites of other players before, to limited gain (one was alright until I realized the site culture and the players were kinda shitbags, and another I kinda got alienated from after one game. All other attempts drew dead due to the culture just not being active)-
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I actually agree with this take. But I think phases here are too longIn post 1255, Gamma Emerald wrote:I have played there before and I don’t entirely like it
I feel like the site moderation is a little unfair, they rip on MS open setups for no reason, and the gameplay loop isn’t a speed I handle very well. Though I had my absolute favorite role probably there.-
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we shouldn't talk about out of game too much on here, but I am interested PM me post game I guess?In post 1262, Gamma Emerald wrote:
Outside of the fact games tend to have sparse activity from probably a good portion of players I think you might like games onIn post 1257, DoubtingThomas wrote:
I actually agree with this take. But I think phases here are too longIn post 1255, Gamma Emerald wrote:I have played there before and I don’t entirely like it
I feel like the site moderation is a little unfair, they rip on MS open setups for no reason, and the gameplay loop isn’t a speed I handle very well. Though I had my absolute favorite role probably there.myhomesite (it’s a special themed board but people have made the jump without necessarily being interested in the actual subject of the board itself)
Deadlines there tend to be a decent middle ground between here and on MU
The biggest issue there is games there aren’t too common these days-
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why would a scum lean person melding with you and viewing the game in a similar way scare you? you like WANT to scum read more people on purpose?In post 1251, superbowl9 wrote:
Also it's scaring me that he's inching closer and closer to my view on the game as we go onIn post 1248, superbowl9 wrote:
scumlean ftrIn post 1215, JohnnyFarrar wrote:This is after starting a scumread on Gamma.-
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In post 1304, superbowl9 wrote:If you think I’m an elitist preaching down to you idrc
the irony-
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no I misplaced your name with someone else's. that can't be 'unable to make up mind' because it's literally just facts and not really a readIn post 1297, Guillotina wrote:In post 1228, DoubtingThomas wrote:all the "scum reads" I got this game
-Too go-with-the-flowy to be town (Chaos)
-Shitting everyone (battle mage)
-Policy lim because he's bad for game health (superb)
-He's biting everyone's head off (Guillotina)
-Used AtE (Chk)
What happened here? Couldn't make up your mind?In post 1231, DoubtingThomas wrote:all the "scum reads" I got this game
-Too go-with-the-flowy to be town (Chaos)
-Shitting everyone (battle mage)
-Policy lim because he's bad for game health (superb)
-He's biting everyone's head off (Johnny)
-Used AtE (Chk)
-He's irrational when wolf (Guillotina.. although I don't think I ever wolfed against you besides a game that I subbed in for a day which I don't think really counts but w/e)-
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I think one way to determine if people are 'buddy-buddying' or making pure interactions is looking at the whole thread. are there reasons for them to be buddy-buddying or vice versa?In post 1299, Guillotina wrote:What i've been trying to figure out here is the gamma/dt relation.
Are they really buddying up?
Or
Is it a pocketing case and if so, who pocketed who?
a lot of people have been scum reading me whether or not if that's a correct read is a different matter. so there are some pointers to think about. In the case that DT was being scum read by not everyone but a few people arelier on in the game, what motive did Gamma Emerald have to 'buddy buddy' DT as a partner? I personally think a scum partner would be less inclined to purely defend his only partner when a lot of the thread is pushing them.
You also should think about how others treated my slot and have progressed from it. E.g. Johnny town read me but now scum reads me. Catboi has (as far as I can tell, although they haven't been in the thread quite often) have been town reading me. Chaos also town read me initially but now I am likely scum (this progression is a bit better than what others shown me and I have less problem with) Battle Mage substituted in and scum reads me.
Keeping all these things in your mind, think about whether or not Gamma still trying to defend me is a 'buddy buddy' attempt. I think the course of how Gamma defended me - not to death (e.g. prefers to not kill chaos over me) but still voicing their town read when it matters, even though it was much easier for her to "re evaluate" and rescind her town read on me and express 'meh, dt can die also' to receive possible bus cred as a partner means it's unlikely that we are partners.
Remember also that there's a 3p serial killer in play that scums do not know about that are likely to kill another townie for scum faction. I think it's difficult for any scum partner to defend a fellow partner like gamma has done. Maybe gamma can be trying to pocket me as a scum and trying to receive credit of "I told you so" when I flip town, but not really as a partner. I could be biased because I already know my alignment in this interaction though-
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odd poem? I think I said I town read you in multiple posts and do not exactly recall which one you are talking about. which one?In post 1301, Guillotina wrote:UNVOTE: DoubtingThomas
DT, it seems like you legit town read me, at least you didn't lash off at me when i casted my vote on you. You behaved like someone who really town reads the other.
But i need more.
The moment you told me that you town read me with that odd poem. Why? Why do you town read me.-
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Johnny's change of read on my slot is different than Guillo's or Gamma's even though they are doing the same thing.
Johnny was always in a position to tranquil me and others fighting with each other and always treated me as such. I find that hard to come from someone to another player that they scum read. It was like beyond surface-level friendliness. and I thought he was serving a pro-town agenda by keeping the thread under control.
But then he came back to the thread and still hasn't explained why he switched from town reading me to scum reading me. It was so hidden that Gamma didn't even realize he was legitimately scum reading me. and when asked by both myself and gamma, he has refrained from answering. That's not really townie.-
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Guillo, if you are legitimately asking for a game where I did ask for policy lim, well. I've played a lot of games and those specific ones were over 1.5 years ago in varying websites that I played on, so I probably cannot give you a link at ready. I will say though, regardless of my alignment, I wouldn't lie about whether or not I have policy lim is easily pushable from scum perspective. I mean the logic is very simple there. that being said, towns do push for policy lim as well. but that is not my main concern with superb's slot as I've said repeatedly-
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Spoiler:
these posts. keep in mind when i did make that read, i mean i didn't think 'you change your meta as you pleased as either alignment' like you expressed in this game. saying that itself also is often times >rand townie, because you are being super open about your scum range which wolves are often scared to do so.
anyways, these posts read very differently than how you played in pantheon mash. i think i skimmed one of your posts where you greatly complimented your play in pantheon mash, but as a pretty loud townie that survived for many days in that mash, i thought you weren't really present in the thread unless you made posts. that may read weirdly, but it sounded like you only came into thread to SHOW that you were posting and that you were pushing people/doing work. real towns leave an impact in the game that resonates within thread even when they aren't in the thread. whenever you came in, sure, you pushed one or two people, but then you left, and then quite frankly i didnt really think about you after you left.
it is a 55+ person mash, so yes it's a bigger game, but there i think you very much stayed away from getting needless attraction. whereas here, you were openly talking about how you are new to the site, how newbies get killed, and etc against some of the louder players. that's something i didn't see from my one sample size game of yours.-
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DoubtingThomas, Gamma Emerald, Aristophanes, Tayl0r Swift + Guillotina
feeling good about the wagon here. with the exception of Tayl0r all people i highly town read and tayl0r's lack of votes/activity, although could go either way for town/scum, felt like it lacked a scummy agenda. I am also assuming Johnny saying that being lackadaisical is a town tell for her is going to be true regardless of johnny's alignment. so this is fine-
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DoubtingThomas Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Posts: 2886
- Joined: July 13, 2018
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DoubtingThomas Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Posts: 2886
- Joined: July 13, 2018
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DoubtingThomas Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Posts: 2886
- Joined: July 13, 2018
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DoubtingThomas Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Posts: 2886
- Joined: July 13, 2018