Open 821 | Fall With Your Friends | Endgame

[Something_Smart]

Why did I join a game full of people I can't read?

That's the price I pay for an awesome playerlist, I guess.

[Something_Smart]

Hectic, did you read the Trust Fall game that just ended?

[Something_Smart]

Scum-T3 did a very similar thing to me to what you just did to Ydrasse.

[Something_Smart]

No, but if you had read it I would have said you were very likely town.

[Something_Smart]

shouldn't mafia always insta-accept?

Yes but also no. No because yes. Something like that.

[Something_Smart]

lol this is actually so true

I've played this setup (ish) twice before and been each alignment once. When I was scum, my partner didn't auto accept an offer.

[Something_Smart]

I feel like Ydrasse wouldn't troll here as scum.

[Something_Smart]

Anyway, the good news about this playerlist is a lot of you have played with me when I was scum. It would be pretty easy for you to spot that I'm town this time. This means if you say you don't want to trust me, I don't want to trust you either.

Based on my extensive experience with you, I'm pretty confident in my read that you aren't the mod this time.

[Something_Smart]

what leads you to believe that?

My perception of her is that she's fairly unconfident in her scumgame, and given the choice between staying to try to help her team more (but also possibly giving away more information) and taking the free ticket out, she'd probably take the latter.

Also she was in a similar situation in this game (as Briar), and she chose to leave immediately there as well (even though she was playing a great game up to that point).

[Something_Smart]

It is incredibly tempting to say "If I can't beat them, join them" and propose to Ydrasse but I will restrain myself.

I don't think there's any advantage to it. You can always reciprocate if she trusts you.

[Something_Smart]

Fair.

[Something_Smart]

Yeah I was wondering about that lmao

[Something_Smart]

I thought Murder openly admitting 79 right after I explain why doing so works as scum was a bit bold.

I don't think that what he said is really the same as what you said. His strategy was obviously put forth from a town perspective; whether he would actually follow that if given the chance to leave as scum is another matter.

[Something_Smart]

If I were scum I would take the first offer I got based on the logic SS laid out.

Didn't quite get my response to this in before the lock. I didn't really lay out clear logic for why insta trusting is better. In fact I laid out benefits and drawbacks of each, so I don't think what I said clearly points to this at all.

[Something_Smart]

Also Dann I'm more than a bit curious why you townlean me, given that you were trepidatious to townread me last time we played and you still did it and it ended up being a mistake.

[Something_Smart]

I really don't know how to interact with you because both this and the prior added nothing. I am well aware of the difference in perspective given; the point of my post is the utilization of that perspective to accomplish the same proposed result.

Sorry, sometimes I don't make my point very clear. I disagree that it was bold; if anything, it's slightly scummy LAMIST, though I don't really think it's that scummy.

[Something_Smart]

I was referring to the "doesn't feel comfortable as scum" logic

I suppose. I wasn't talking about you though; I don't know firsthand what your scumgame is like. (I don't think?)

[Something_Smart]

I've been deliberately trying to lay "paranoia" as having a strong effect on my reads aside, because it annoys me to no end when applied to me

This makes a lot of sense.

I kinda take the opposite approach, where I frame "paranoia" as "I actually just can't read this person as well as I would like". But I'm not exactly the model of self-confidence.

[Something_Smart]

my prediction is murdercat is scum and i'd gladly stay with him.

Elaborate?

[Something_Smart]

For what it's worth, I townread Prism pretty solidly now.

[Something_Smart]

So if you really are confident in HEM being town, then I'm in support of that pairing.

[Something_Smart]

If Prism/HEM fall next (and I think they should) and they are both town then I would want to see the next fall be two out of {S_S, Infinity, Murdercat}, I think.

I don't townread HEM's play on its own, but I'm not experienced with him so I'll defer to the people who are.

[Something_Smart]

you and SS will always live in the could be scum range

Why us specifically?

[Something_Smart]

If I were to pick out people at this table with scary scumgames I would

not

be pointing to myself.

[Something_Smart]

I dont think either would do it even though they said they would

Because they're buddies, or because one or both of them are town and scared?

[Something_Smart]

It wasn't an answer, lol. I'm not sure what you're saying.

[Something_Smart]

Yeah, I mean there's a difference between trusting someone because you're confident they're town and doing what Hectic did.

I think there's something to be said for having more scumread people trust their townreads first. But I think I probably would be willing to throw out a trust to Prism, if people feel like it's time to start trusting townreads.

[Something_Smart]

I still just doubt S_S encourages me/HEM quickly yesterday if HEM is town, so pairing them off is likely safe as well.

For what it's worth, I also wouldn't do that if I were scum with HEM, because if you actually fell with him after I said that it would look so bad for me.

Kinda like Ich trying to bait me into falling with his buddy T3 in the last run, which didn't work, but wouldn't have worked out well for them if it had.

[Something_Smart]

I'm pretty close to trusting Prism. Would you want me to do it first?

[Something_Smart]

I guess really catboi should do it first, though I can't imagine scum-Prism ever takes that.

[Something_Smart]

Am I sure about what? Prism being town?

[Something_Smart]

I mean, no, I'm not

sure

, but they're my strongest townread by a large margin, and at some point you just have to put your paranoia aside.

I recall a very strong scum-Prism game from the distant past, and I don't think it was strong in this way. Pretty much everything they've done has resonated with a real desire to advance solving.

That said I'm content to let some other people trust them first, but I highly doubt it will matter much, as even if scum they are probably only leaving with me or you.

[Something_Smart]

Also btw Prism, how town is "definitely town" for HEM? Because it seems like you do still have some paranoia of him (specifically of me/him, despite us being your strongest townreads).

[Something_Smart]

Well scum-Prism would rather leave with a universal townread than a universal scumread, because it makes our job harder; e.g. if they leave with catboi then you and I can just go together, but if they leave with you then I don't have an easy partner and catboi is still alive and a problem.

[Something_Smart]

I don't follow, isn't it bad if scum HEM leaves with town you?

Not as bad as if he leaves with someone like me or Prism, I think is the point.

[Something_Smart]

In what way? You don't townread me and Prism?

[Something_Smart]

See, I like this setup, because I never have strong scumreads, and I don't have to be annoyed about that this time

[Something_Smart]

Murder's solviness dropped off so I townread him less now but I still think he's much more likely to be town.

Is this an absolute decrease (failing to solve is scummy) or a relative one (everyone else has gotten townier, and he hasn't)?

[Something_Smart]

Hm. I'm usually skeptical of absolute read deteriorations, because if his early posts were unlikely to come from scum then they were unlikely to come from scum, period, no matter what happens after.

(Of course it's different if what they did after was actively SCUMMY, but I don't think not being as solve-y is that?)

[Something_Smart]

I guess that makes sense. I would have framed it more as "I reevaluated my read and the reasons weren't as good as I initially thought." than what you said.

[Something_Smart]

I think you can pretty safely trust Prism. If they're scum they're probably going down with a bigger ship than you.

[Something_Smart]

I trust Prism

[Something_Smart]

Not expecting you to accept, at least not right away, but I was just waiting for catboi.

[Something_Smart]

Playing my own game?

[Something_Smart]

Because Prism is my top townread by a large margin and I would have trusted them sooner but we decided that catboi should do it first.

[Something_Smart]

There's no point in doing that, beyond the initial test which was a long shot anyway. I doubt Prism accepts anyone other than me or you today, regardless of alignment.

[Something_Smart]

No redactions.

I feel like hero trusting on your own reads instead of following consensus should in theory be a good idea, and it certainly makes the setup more interesting. But this game was pretty damning evidence against that (as was the last one, where town planned out and agreed on all the falls and won).

It may just be that this setup ends up like a slight variant of Reverse Mafia but with no voting, which would be sad. But it's worth testing more, I think.

[Something_Smart]

Also Dann is never going to townread me again

I don't know what it is but you really see something in my scumgame, lmao.

[Something_Smart]

I enjoyed modding this and I hope everyone enjoyed playing!

I did! Thanks for modding

[Something_Smart]

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