open 841: concgratulations to the winners and losers

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I'm not very caught up, no, especially now that two of my three townreads are dead

[Alyssa The Lamb]

VOTE: SirCakez

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I am caught up enough to know that my slot was mostly ran up due to not really being read at all more than scumread, and some other events around when these two wagons popped up

I've noticed that it was mostly the same 5 or so names talking around that time, so I have less of a grasp on things than I probably should with reading around that time.

It kinda makes me suspicious that it's just been that for most of the day if a spot got ran up for being essentially unreadable though, especially with how lazy some of the votes were

[Alyssa The Lamb]

It was

Whichever slots were most content with the stagnation are probably scum

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I'm voting cakez because the reason he listed for being on my slot yesterday is by far the scummiest thing I saw in what I read

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Considering that the most compelling reason people were running up my slot was because they couldn't read flow trap... it's very similar

[Alyssa The Lamb]

If you can't find any good reason to believe that scum were on one wagon over another, what does that tell you about the game?

[Alyssa The Lamb]

What do you think scum were doing if a known town player was getting that resistance to a wagon?

[Alyssa The Lamb]

That depends on you

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I feel like what I'm reading about the game and the way it's progressing atm is really incongruent

[Alyssa The Lamb]

in what way

I guess I said it a bit wrong

It feels really odd how posturey some people are being without really committing to anything immediately

It kinda hit me that it might be why those two were killed specifically so maybe it's scum indicative

[Alyssa The Lamb]

But it's really funny how my slot is being postured as the leading wagon as an aside

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Unless I missed something, there were only really weak or just compromise reasons to vote my slot

Andante seemed not very interested to engage with me about her thoughts
Cakez pretty much dismissed my vote and immediately moved on

Other than you, pretty much everyone else has been treating the slot like I'm not here and slotting me into scumteams because... reasons, I guess

Idk the whole thing makes me feel like it's not natural

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I don't think it's a good idea to reveal that yet

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Might just be watching for a bit to see what happens

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Gun to my head, Mare is town

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I see you're feeling spicy skitter

Very spicy

[Alyssa The Lamb]

That's disappointing

This game needs more spice

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Wagoning somebody no one would expect a wagon on at this stage
Pushing controversial reads

Really anyone to force people to take a stance on something

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I haven't read more than 20 pages of this game so I don't have a whole lot for you on that front

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I wouldn't even say my third townread is that controversial, but I still think it's not advantageous to disclose it still

[Alyssa The Lamb]

You just said you weren't feeling spicy

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Shrug

VOTE: catboi

[Alyssa The Lamb]

if you want to try to convince me, you can

I'll at least listen

[Alyssa The Lamb]

meh

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Spoiler:

I return to the land of the temporarily dead

I'll be watching, don't burn down the place while I'm gone

ty

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Wait Datisi is in the game?

[Alyssa The Lamb]

You barely talked in the part of the game I looked at so I have no real opinion of you

Real question though, do you think I'd be able to recognize you aren't town if I saw your scumgame?

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Bookmarking here

[Alyssa The Lamb]

is it bad I kinda TRed flow, but I SR Alyssa? Alyssa seems to be leaning too much into the "you all have no reason to SR flow!! yet you sr them!!" and it's like, ehhh

what

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Alyssa was a strong town in that holiday dance party, and here she just pushed me, I forget why, and talked a lot about how no one actually SRs flow... flow as town/scum... is honestly just tricky to read, I don't sr the replacement part, but I could definitely see flow being scum based on the drop in activity, like flow's content I TRed is from the very beginning, basically wher eI asked them for stuff

I specifically mentioned I was engaging into your thoughts

what part of it gave you the impression I was pushing a scumread?

[Alyssa The Lamb]

is it bad I kinda TRed flow, but I SR Alyssa? Alyssa seems to be leaning too much into the "you all have no reason to SR flow!! yet you sr them!!" and it's like, ehhh

what

I guess I'll clarify this

my point is that the wagon was not really about scumreading my predecessor nearly at all

yet it gets replaced and people are posturing like they want to wagon me anyways for reasons I either can't see or can't understand while not even acknowledging my existence

do you see how that chain of events looks a bit strange

[Alyssa The Lamb]

hey S_S what's important in day one of this game

[Alyssa The Lamb]

do you remember which still living players were key focal points in that exchange?

[Alyssa The Lamb]

kinda sounds like midwaybear is the most important slot to get a solid read on

it's a good thing they're the type of player I struggle the most to read effectively

yay

[Alyssa The Lamb]

just skimming through makes me kinda feel town too tbh

do you remember what caused the scramble to happen?

[Alyssa The Lamb]

that's an impressive amount of posts by slots that I don't have to try to get reads on

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I guess my main takeaway from reading through that shit again is that I'm not townreading Andante and SirCakez

[Alyssa The Lamb]

this game doesn't make any sense

[Alyssa The Lamb]

that's an impressive amount of posts by slots that I don't have to try to get reads on

Hmmmm?

faker + sleepless + iv

[Alyssa The Lamb]

what exactly happened before that big mess in day one

[Alyssa The Lamb]

oh

yeah that explains why this game makes no sense

[Alyssa The Lamb]

how much should I care that Menalque basically hopped onto the same wagon on me despite my slot being his apparently third strongest scumread?

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I think Cakez EoD is actually townie

why

[Alyssa The Lamb]

it also doesn't match his progression before that

[Alyssa The Lamb]

VOTE: SirCakez

tbh I like where this is going

[Alyssa The Lamb]

how far back do you have to go to get that impression?

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I think Mare is town

[Alyssa The Lamb]

There's less value in what she's doing now than just neighborizing

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Wagoning somebody no one would expect a wagon on at this stage
Pushing controversial reads

Really anyone to force people to take a stance on something

I hate posts like this
Like do something about it yourself don't just yell into the void and then sit there

Have I really been just sitting here

Because it really feels like I've been trying to run through quicksand this whole time

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Wagoning somebody no one would expect a wagon on at this stage
Pushing controversial reads

Really anyone to force people to take a stance on something

I hate posts like this
Like do something about it yourself don't just yell into the void and then sit there

Have I really been just sitting here

Because it really feels like I've been trying to run through quicksand this whole time

maybe not just sitting there but it feels like you are complaining about many things and then just going with already existing opinions and wagons

What did I complain about

[Alyssa The Lamb]

is it bad I kinda TRed flow, but I SR Alyssa? Alyssa seems to be leaning too much into the "you all have no reason to SR flow!! yet you sr them!!" and it's like, ehhh

what

I guess I'll clarify this

my point is that the wagon was not really about scumreading my predecessor nearly at all

yet it gets replaced and people are posturing like they want to wagon me anyways for reasons I either can't see or can't understand while not even acknowledging my existence

do you see how that chain of events looks a bit strange

You have more posts like this than actual "these are my reads"

That's not complaining

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Interesting...

[Alyssa The Lamb]

This game is starting to feel like it should be easy

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I'll double check later

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Something_Smart
Datisi
skitter30
SirCakez
Sleepless Assassin
Andante
innocentvillager
catboi
Alyssa The Lamb flow trap
northsidegal
Mare
Menalque PookyTheMagicalBear
midwaybear
Faker

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Something_Smart

Datisi
skitter30

SirCakez

Sleepless Assassin
Andante
innocentvillager

catboi

Alyssa The Lamb flow trap
northsidegal
Mare

Menalque PookyTheMagicalBear
midwaybear

Faker

This feels like a comfy solve

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I've generally liked her contributions when I saw them

It's not entirely locked until I've had a chance to interact with her directly though

[Alyssa The Lamb]

You seem natural enough when you do talk

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Not really, I have a lot less to work with than other games

[Alyssa The Lamb]

And as I stated before, finding a confident gamestate read is hard without a midway read

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Sleepless is trying right now and I don't see any scum motivation in shooting down alternate wagon suggestions; meanwhile flow has done jack shit so I think the choice for me is pretty clear

the scum motivation in being against people currently on your counterwagon exiting your counterwagon to split votes and leave you as the largest wagon seems clear.

i think that it may be a bit of a stretch (or at least i would need some kind of evidence) to say that flow trap's complete absence is indicative one way or the other.

i feel like scum don't have to try very hard to manipulate the votes such that it ends on town given how clueless some of us are with how little time there is left.

hm, wouldn't you think that scum would have either already done that if they easily had the capability to, or we were never going to hit scum at all and so they don't need to?

in other words, i don't think that a town elimination is inevitable unless the major wagons {flow, sleepless, midway} are all town. does that make sense and is it clear how i'm disagreeing with what you said? maybe it's not super important

Northsidegal did you have any thoughts on this?

Anyway Faker I'm not seeing whatever you're seeing in regard to the northside interactions from sleepless sorry to disappoint yet again

tl;dr: IMO noticeably more worried about northsidegal reading him correctly than utilizing her reads, has mostly thrown in towel on swaying her and iirc had virtually given up on that front. Doesn't leverage her read on flow trap at all and completely ignores it. Pair w/ Sleepless thinking she had knowledge of main at start, likely targeted interactions+selective ignorance.

Very rushed outline, no longer have time to read and will not before deadline. Absolute comedy of errors atm requiring borrowing items from 5 different people/entities, community effort interview, still have to do a bunch of research/prep and it is shortly after deadline.

yeah so i mean i pretty much entirely ignored / didn't respond to his whole section directed towards me in his big post and he seems to mostly have just not brought it up at all, which i think sort of plays into what you're getting at here. i think that our only real interactions since then have been when he's responded to my disagreeing with people townreading him, but that's all been responsive rather than any sort of affirmative argument from him to me as to why i should be townreading him. i don't think that's super scummy, to be clear, but it does play into a broader narrative – like i mentioned, i think the more salient point is how much i (unintentionally really, but still) ignored what he said to me in his big post and how it never really got brought up again.

arguably this is a factor of him never being caught up but in that big post the first thing he says to me is "we're gonna have to do some real time interaction" which is possible without being caught up. arguably he just decided that it wasn't worth it when i came back and immediately voted him, but still.

why? ill be around to hammer if needed

i don't trust that you'll hammer sleepless, i consider it a quite likely possibility that you hold out for more votes on flow and then the ball is in the sleepless voter's court (so to speak) for them to switch and get a hammer on flow

if i were truly committed to one wagon going through over the other (or if i were scum) i might do something like that

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I think i'm townreading scum

What's the thought process that got you here

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I mean

We should just consolidate then I guess

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Like just from what I heard about how day one went, that's a very bad sign for how the game realistically is going to play out from here

Whenever day ones are lethargic and just go down to the wire as the only real content, that generally gives town not enough info to properly PoE the game down late

It's kinda tricky to solve this without somehow fixing the lethargy itself and idk how to do that here atm

[Alyssa The Lamb]

this entire day 2 has been like me dats ss and you talking, others poke their head in probably just to avoid prod timer, then dissapear

oh

ok

[Alyssa The Lamb]

As i write this out it really is kinda curious how all that momentum happened day1 when i voted flow but the game was dead when sleepless/midway had wagons that size, does make me wonder if ur scum alyssa. And also it would be kinda weird if all of sleepless/flow/midway are town

Is this the only possible reason for it though

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Idk like the answer is for me to power town but that's kinda difficult to do

And I don't know if it would convince anyone anyways so

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Were people even around?

If it's the middle of the day for one of them and the middle of the night for another, that's just a simpler answer

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Shows me for hitting post and then doing other things

[Alyssa The Lamb]

...and you think that the simplest answer is that flow is scum?

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Deadline looming + status quo shifting = fight or flight oh shit we need to get a wagon through

That's way simpler and more likely than scum got ran up and their partners all swooped in

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I doubt it

I'd have to look back at his posts there again but it was probably tone

[Alyssa The Lamb]

My other open alts are Ankamius and Blake Belladonna if it helps

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I guess if you feel like wagoning me will do something, you can I guess

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Mare who do you want a wagon on

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Guys can we start actually voting please

[Alyssa The Lamb]

VOTE: Northsidegal

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I'm going to be very disappointed if NSG gets hammered and flips town without me having any opportunity to talk to her

[Alyssa The Lamb]

you at least had day one

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I just want a playable game

[Alyssa The Lamb]

this is like holiday dance except with borderline no activity too

[Alyssa The Lamb]

That's e-1

[Alyssa The Lamb]

You say that like the game wasn't a standstill before

But at least now we have an actual fucking wagon

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I've stepped back because I wanted to see how the wagon changed things

[Alyssa The Lamb]

oh now you're breaking my heart

[Alyssa The Lamb]

because I know the alignment of the other three wagonees from day one

so knowing that he's town or scum drastically changes how day one looks depending on which it is

[Alyssa The Lamb]

the other two wagonees*

[Alyssa The Lamb]

if midwaybear is scum, then it means the slots pushing for them are more likely town while the slots that aggressively pushed away from it are more likely scum
if midwaybear is town, then it's a lot messier, but scum are far more likely to be among the slots that were just kind of floating around than anything else

it's kinda interesting that the part of my ISO that stood out the most was that part but sure

[Alyssa The Lamb]

atm I'm reading him as town

and if he is legitimately town, then there was probably a scramble because town was pulled in different directions while scum didn't really need to; in this particular scenario, there's no real reason for scum to push things in different directions as much as town trying to push their own scumreads since that's more likely to give town info they otherwise wouldn't have

the other way that can go is scum was pushing to get specific kills through because it would be incongruent to compromise otherwise, but I don't really have the patience to check for that atm, and I don't think it's entirely productive anyways

I like to not look at all of the possible scenarios, I'd rather rule things out and analyze what's left

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I'd have to look again

[Alyssa The Lamb]

VOTE: Alyssa The Lamb

Lowkey thinking this is just the best option for forwarding the game

I'll explain later if I have to

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Uh...why?

1. It gives everybody the ability to know that flow was town, which already gives more insight into day one than most other kills; with how useless most of today was (DL is in like 4 days isn't it?), that's at least something
2. If Menalque and NSG are town, this is already a losing position for town since they both give very little information upon a flip and then I'm the obvious kill after that, which will be past game at that point
3. I'm borderline unreadable in this type of game, so there is little reason for anyone to believe I'm town later on in the game, so it will be easy for me to be set up to be the game winning kill on day 4 or whatever it is
4. Something very odd happening might be the jumpstart that the inactive town need to start giving a shit about the game.

[Alyssa The Lamb]

oh boy oh boy

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Scum vigged

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Both slots were transparently town so any town vig shooting either of them is borderline a mandatory loss of respect for the vig as a player

[Alyssa The Lamb]

do I care who kaiji's main is or do I just not

[Alyssa The Lamb]

nice

I'll go back to lurking then

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Real question

What would you say to look at to actually engage into the game

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I'm not engaged enough to do a whole lot more than I have

And I'm not all that convinced I'll get much of anything from reading back

[Alyssa The Lamb]

That said if people want something specific from me or thoughts on specific points in the game, that would probably go a long way to at least getting more new info out there

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Actually, how much would it help if everybody gave 3 points in the game that they consider the most significant?

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I should've done it for memes

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Hm

I think my PoE from before is still fine

[Alyssa The Lamb]

VOTE: SirCakez

I think midwaybear is the most likely scum out of the more "active" players

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Idk how to feel about SS

Idk how to feel about catboi

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I don't think the way skitter is playing is out of her scumrange but I don't feel it would look like this if she was

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I'm mostly looking for slots that are trying to put content out there but without risking progressing the game

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Games are never boring with you in it

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I'm mostly looking for slots that are trying to put content out there but without risking progressing the game

I feel like that's half the game, no? >.>

What players are most likely to do this in a dead gamestate as scum though

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I feel like cakez is one

[Alyssa The Lamb]

From how midwaybear is playing, I suspect he's another one

[Alyssa The Lamb]

SS I think would just occasionally pop in with just enough to not get prodded and mostly just defend himself or do the minimum

[Alyssa The Lamb]

If my guess that catboi would try to take over the game if the rest of his team is among the least productive slots is right, that makes him more likely town than not I think

I have no read of his scum game beyond that

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Okay but I'm also trying to figure out players that wouldn't just play like this as town too

MWB I think would be directly doing more to engage with people as an example

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I half considered making a bunch of extra VCs

I still might

[Alyssa The Lamb]

VOTE: midwaybear

[Alyssa The Lamb]

if that is the case then does town even have a wincon

[Alyssa The Lamb]

it means if town is this lethargic and scum are among the slots that are impossible to wagon up

then how does town win

[Alyssa The Lamb]

and which slots are NKed in the meantime?

[Alyssa The Lamb]

also I hate relying on PRs to win a game

all that does is allow towns to win games where they just play bad and don't deserve it

[Alyssa The Lamb]

on the bright side

whoever dies night 2 should be a lot more interesting than two transparently town players dying

[Alyssa The Lamb]

nah it was a town vig and i know exactly who the town vig is lmfao

i read some more on a hunch in someone's iso and its so blatant and the draft lines up LMFAO

now that I look back at this, I don't like it

[Alyssa The Lamb]

oh right ->

catboi + skitter + datisi + alyssa + Andante is my current core of town I have progressed to thus far.

I think this post is +town though, assuming I'm not wildly off atm

so idk

[Alyssa The Lamb]

how relevant is it that he was scum that game

[Alyssa The Lamb]

also I hate relying on PRs to win a game

all that does is allow towns to win games where they just play bad and don't deserve it

I'm glad you're blessed with far-above-average town play but it's a bit rude to call anyone not playing at that level bad and undeserving of a win

I think there's a misunderstanding on what bad town play is to me

the spectrum of town play to me is how well the scumteam have to play in order to beat them; individual player strength has little to nothing to do with it

[Alyssa The Lamb]

also I hate relying on PRs to win a game

all that does is allow towns to win games where they just play bad and don't deserve it

I'm glad you're blessed with far-above-average town play but it's a bit rude to call anyone not playing at that level bad and undeserving of a win

I think there's a misunderstanding on what bad town play is to me

the spectrum of town play to me is how well the scumteam have to play in order to beat them; individual player strength has little to nothing to do with it

that is a good definition and im glad to have u locktowned until further notice

what

how do the two thoughts correlate at all

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I think there's a misunderstanding on what bad town play is to me

I don't think so. PR's are part of town's tools they are given, just as the NK is part of scum's tools. You're saying that town should be able to ignore a major tool and still win, or else they don't really deserve it.

the nightkill is a tool to help the mafia fool the town during the day, it's not their primary tool to win the game

if town can do essentially nothing during the day to find the mafia and still win just through clearing too many people with PRs and forcing all of scum's kills, then I don't think town really deserved a win, no

I'm a pretty firm believer that the day play is the cornerstone of the game and the PRs should facilitate winning through that avenue; if the game can be played just by directing PRs, then that's just subverting the game imo

at the very least it just feels awful to me as either alignment when town wins through power roles when the scumteam blatantly played the day phase better

[Alyssa The Lamb]

alyssa can you sanity check my current push onto a midway/SS team here - I think I'm onto something with this pairing. 3rd atm I'm looking at cakez.

I don't have any opinion on them being scum together atm

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Datisi

skitter30

Andante

Kaiji northsidegal

Something_Smart
SirCakez
catboi
Mare
Menalque PookyTheMagicalBear
midwaybear

Midwaybear gives the most info on the game itself if flipped
SirCakez is a slot I think will have to be flipped at some point, so is a safe option for future sanity reasons
catboi is the single slot most likely to be turned on for paranoia reasons, so is a safe option even though I don't think it's very productive atm
S_S mostly is just a slot I struggle to read, nowadays I'm a little more confident I will be able to read him correctly over time since I think the game won't be stagnant like it was early in the day forever, so I'm not really into it
Mare/Menalque are the lazy way out kills that will have to be sorted somehow eventually but it gives us borderline nothing to kill today

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I guess that's roughly my preferences in order

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I guess that's roughly my preferences in order

[Alyssa The Lamb]

how

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Mare/Menalque are the lazy way out kills that will have to be sorted somehow eventually but it gives us borderline nothing to kill today

just realized this looks weird

we get basically nothing from flipping either of them

[Alyssa The Lamb]

depends on the player I think

[Alyssa The Lamb]

andante claimed tracker

[Alyssa The Lamb]

yay a scavenger hunt

[Alyssa The Lamb]

oh

I already suspected you were them lmao

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I directly saw (and caught) scum Andante recently and this game is exactly what I would expect a town version of her to play like

[Alyssa The Lamb]

pick somebody who you don't think will be killed

[Alyssa The Lamb]

if it helps

my slot is not a vig

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Datisi

skitter30

Andante

Kaiji northsidegal

Something_Smart
SirCakez
catboi
Mare
Menalque PookyTheMagicalBear
midwaybear

Midwaybear gives the most info on the game itself if flipped
SirCakez is a slot I think will have to be flipped at some point, so is a safe option for future sanity reasons
catboi is the single slot most likely to be turned on for paranoia reasons, so is a safe option even though I don't think it's very productive atm
S_S mostly is just a slot I struggle to read, nowadays I'm a little more confident I will be able to read him correctly over time since I think the game won't be stagnant like it was early in the day forever, so I'm not really into it
Mare/Menalque are the lazy way out kills that will have to be sorted somehow eventually but it gives us borderline nothing to kill today

my preference in order

I might, might not be around at deadline

[Alyssa The Lamb]

hi

[Alyssa The Lamb]

midway/cakez appears to be the most viable wagons at this point

[Alyssa The Lamb]

afaik he has like no votes on him and we're not far from deadline

[Alyssa The Lamb]

oh I guess he is

not a slot I'm enthused about killing though as mentioned earlier

[Alyssa The Lamb]

VOTE: SirCakez

alright let's just do this then

[Alyssa The Lamb]

if midway is doc, why are we still voting doc?

a mafia roleblocker would claim doc

[Alyssa The Lamb]

if I was a mafia roleblocker, I would've been blocking skitter 99% of the time

[Alyssa The Lamb]

what

[Alyssa The Lamb]

what

[Alyssa The Lamb]

majorly dislike the minimal effort given to this game by most people

I was whating this part

a lot got done in the past couple or so days

[Alyssa The Lamb]

if I was a mafia roleblocker, I would've been blocking skitter 99% of the time

?

it pays to sit in somebody's shoes

[Alyssa The Lamb]

alright well

whatever I guess

VOTE: Menalque

[Alyssa The Lamb]

just stating for the record that I still don't think this gets us anywhere regardless of the flip though

[Alyssa The Lamb]

VOTE: SirCakez

[Alyssa The Lamb]

We have 6 hours

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Andante you're tracking midwaybear

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Why dont we just leash midway to andante, and have andante track midway

If andante is rb'd midway is scum, if andante dies midway is scum, if andante survives she should get a result on midway and be able to verify him (or not)

That should give us info on both slots, and we can use the flip today to try to figure out the cakez/catboi/dats/mena group (my preference being cake)

[Alyssa The Lamb]

If either of those scenarios happens, it'll get caught out eventually

I'm not that worried about it

[Alyssa The Lamb]

why are yall so worried about me? midway is gonna go "what? I was supposed to save andante?"

Because you were here

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Is Faker the type of person that would just do that regardless

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I'd be surprised if any known VTs die tonight

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Aka I'm pretty sure you're still here tomorrow

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Oh god i even forgot the neighborizer is also outed

How many pairings aren't revealed yet?

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Andante is town as hell from that action claim and I'm very disappointed that people are suspicious of that

[Alyssa The Lamb]

S_S is also town

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I think I need to organize my thoughts a bit more before I answer that for sure

but legit just knowing that Midway and Cakez were both town realistically should simplify this game greatly, I just need to think about it a bit

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I think massclaim is 100% the play here, actually

we need to figure out who can possibly be the one-shot vig, and see if there's anything that doesn't quite make sense with the draft order

we should do it in a pre-set order though

[Alyssa The Lamb]

reasons:

1. I thought Skitter was ascetic cop with a cop check on Andante yesterday, and her responses here clearly show that to not be the case. My townread on her goes down drastically from this
2. I want to be certain that mechanically, Mare

has

to be the slot that got the Neighborizer/Voyeur role

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I actually don't care if we designate roles or rows for massclaim

[Alyssa The Lamb]

datisi claimed to be neighborized

[Alyssa The Lamb]

btw I think the panic at day start was really fucking suspicious

[Alyssa The Lamb]

ok then thats all the mech we need claimed today

W H Y

[Alyssa The Lamb]

if Andante is actually eliminated here, I'm giving up on this town

[Alyssa The Lamb]

in no fucking universe does scum say "hey I'm leashed to somebody, LET ME TARGET SOMEBODY ELSE AND GIVE INFORMATION I DON'T NEED TO"

[Alyssa The Lamb]

it's pretty dissonant for someone who's pretty widely townread to not do what she's leashed to do when the scumteam helpfully give her an opportunity to indicate that she and midwaybear are TvT

[Alyssa The Lamb]

it's pretty dissonant for someone who's pretty widely townread to not do what she's leashed to do when the scumteam helpfully give her an opportunity to indicate that she and midwaybear are TvT

like what exactly is the plan here

I don't get it

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I feel like I'm reading a very different game than everyone else

[Alyssa The Lamb]

1. Something_Smart
   
   Datisi
   skitter30
   
   Andante
   
   catboi
   
   Alyssa The Lamb
   
   Kaiji
   
   Mare
   
   Menalque

Menalque really needs to do something

[Alyssa The Lamb]

yeah this game feels like it should be really simple

[Alyssa The Lamb]

VOTE: Kaiji

[Alyssa The Lamb]

gun to my head, Datisi is probably town too, I'm least convinced that slot is scum compared to the rest

[Alyssa The Lamb]

okay guys, I'll just say this again

why does scum

1. Kill midwaybear, a slot that was widely enough scumread to specifically be looked to clear through another known PR
2. Have the slot designated to clear them not claim to have tracked them doing exactly what they were supposed to do, and instead claim to track someone completely different and give information that we otherwise wouldn't have
3. Not use tonight, with the doctor leashed onto another target, to kill somebody else that is more likely to have a TPR and/or is more widely townread and/or is a higher threat to scum directly

this entire chain of events assumes the scumteam is stupid

and this playerlist has too many players that are objectively way better at scum than that

[Alyssa The Lamb]

that's why Andante is town

the rest of my townreads are independent

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I will give you one thing though

I don't buy for a second that Mare doesn't neighborize night one as scum unless she isn't a neighborizer

and considering that we have outside confirmation that neighborizer is taken, that means another neighborizer is out there somewhere

[Alyssa The Lamb]

and considering that we have outside confirmation that neighborizer is taken, that means another neighborizer is out there somewhere

ftr, Flow Trap also tried to pick up neighborizer

So unless you think all three of us claiming neighborizer pick are scum, then Mare is neighborizer

[Alyssa The Lamb]

oops

unless all three of us are scum, then there is a neighborizer out there

[Alyssa The Lamb]

okay

feel free to tell me why scum would kill the person she's meant to track and then have her draw attention to herself by not confirming the information she was specifically told to confirm

[Alyssa The Lamb]

and considering that we have outside confirmation that neighborizer is taken, that means another neighborizer is out there somewhere

ftr, Flow Trap also tried to pick up neighborizer

So unless you think all three of us claiming neighborizer pick are scum, then Mare is neighborizer

i think mare is neighborizer because she neighborized me last night, and this whole neighborizer discussion is going way over my head

then you should know better than anyone that Mare should be straight up town because of that

because do you really think she doesn't neighborize night one as scum

[Alyssa The Lamb]

because it makes people think "why would scum do that?"

like, if midway is dead, it essentially makes no difference whether andante claims to have tracked him or tracked s_s, neither give town any useful info. the only thing that changes is the people's reaction to it. and if she/her teammates thought that this town was likely to say "well if she was scum, she would've just claimed that she tracked midway!!" then she suddenly has a lot of incentive to claim it.

i could be projecting here, but i sometimes do attention-grabbing nonsense as scum PURELY because i know towns often go "but why would scum do that???" so that's not exactly an angle you're going to convince me with unless you show me why andante specifically wouldn't do it

is that really the strongest option scum have right now

I'm very hesitant to ever call this a strong option when town pretty clearly is not nailing scum to the wall

[Alyssa The Lamb]

P sure someone on the scumteam would have pointed that out to her tho, no?

Well it seems to not be accurate, so maybe not.

?

Pedit same - literally all of the eod1 candisates have flipped town now, except for her

@alyssa what was happeneing eod1 from ur pov

Plz when u have a chance

idk, which slots were the most active during the scramble again

[Alyssa The Lamb]

well obviously not if they're also killing him

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I don't see a scumteam drawing attention to themselves when they're winning as it is

that's just asking for town to randomly obvtown themselves and potentially swing the game away from the direction it was going in

[Alyssa The Lamb]

then look at the slots that did nothing

[Alyssa The Lamb]

ngl I think that borderline confscums Menalque

[Alyssa The Lamb]

eh Kaiji can wait actually

VOTE: Menalque

[Alyssa The Lamb]

if the majority of the game agrees then just flip me

you're going to waste your time otherwise if you aren't going to mass claim anything

[Alyssa The Lamb]

because I want to pin down where the vig is

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Andante: 2 -

Claimed Tracker

skitter30: 3
midwaybear: 5 -

Flipped Lime Doctor

Mare: 6 -

Claimed Neighborizer

innocentvillager: 10 -

Flipped Universal Backup

SirCakez: 12 -

Flipped Draft Cop

Faker: 14 -

Flipped Vanilla (1-Shot Watcher)

catboi: 21
PookyTheMagicalBear: 1 + coin flip victory
Datisi: 1
northsidegal: 8 + coin flip victory -

Claimed Vanilla (Neighborizer)

Sleepless Assassin: 8 -

Flipped Vanilla (Roleblocker)

flow trap: 9 + coin flip victory -

Claimed Vanilla (Neighborizer)

Something_Smart: 9.