Open 415: Bird 7P (Game Over)

[Venmar]

/confirm

[Venmar]

Vote SnakePlissken

Because his image is cool.

1) Town
2) 6th on Mafiascum
3) If i feel like it, maybe more than twice. I live in Canada, so idk what timezone that is.

[Venmar]

Mala is town.

Kind of early to tell, don't you think? What makes you think Mala is town?

[Venmar]

I would like to note how all seven of us confirmed in a span of maybe 30-45 minutes, and now only 5 out of the 7 of us have posted game related content. What happened guys? Quick on the trigger to confirm but not come here and have a discussion with us? Cmon don't be shy.
Could just be that they are busy or its night there, but Snake and Trollie, please post or be suspected.

[Venmar]

That's easy to solve.

@Mod: Are scum getting to talk right now, considering the short confirmation time?

Not sure if Burke can answer that, as it can give scum away. This is a SEVEN player setup, so confirmation time is relatively fast and days are faster, as less people and more conversation. Less people also means less lurkers, as lurking is hard in a small player setup. Willing to believe that Snake and Trollie are just away for now, but until they post i will be suspicioso of them.

[Venmar]

Also, Kondi when shall you answer those questions? You seemed quick to respond to my post(s), so clearly you got time.

[Venmar]

Forgot about those

1: Scum. More satisfaction in deceiving people than stopping them.

2: A lot. Somewhere around 40 on-site.

3: CDT, depends on how interesting the conversation is

Also, the question couldn't really give scum away. It's just asking when scum can talk.

PEdit: In that case, Ven's #21 suspicion of the non-posters is borderline townslip.

I meant it in the sense that if they were given time to scum chat right now, Trollie and Snake would be put under the spotlight because they could be deemed as scum discussing plans right now and not posting until they have decided on a game plan. Since that is not the case, i think they are either lurking or just unable to post at the moment.

[Venmar]

Vote: TheTrollie

Post. Now.

[Venmar]

Lol.

Always weary of Kondi to be honest, he is a good scum player, and i have yet to actually see his play as scum. For that reason, Kondi, could you please link, or at least tell me the games where you have played as scum. Not ongoing, but completed games where your flip was evident. Kondi isn't scummy, but he seemed quick on the trigger to make friends with Mala and me, and then attacked Thomith who was questioning my logic, and continues to defend me from Thomith while i am unavailable. I want to see his scummeta. Then again, this could be how he plays and the coincidence of this setup, but i am not seeing him buddy in our other games, or he is doing this in this game because of strong town reads. This is exactly why i want some meta.

I did some REALLY simple math, and the time it took for the confirmation stage to end was a total of 39 minutes. Everyone confirmed at like 5 minutes after the person before them, but now 2 of us ( coincidentally, a 2 person mafia game. ) aren't posting in the game. Snake has posted, but only with a RVS and RQS answers. Weird how two people are missing out, but yet they had the time to eager confirm. Trollie has yet to talk, and Snake has yet to post some constructive, game ralated content.

[Venmar]

Smaller games are much easier to PoE in, which is why I get into them more easily. I'm on my iPhone, so you might have to look through my meta yourself.

Understandable, this is what i assumed. I'll take a look shortly.

Would like to note though that Thomith is playing his old self i feel, so i don't think he is necessarily scum right now, but it is early to judge for him. Curious on the votes on MrBump, i will have to read page 2 a bit more, as i am not willing to just jump on votes blindly.

[Venmar]

I'm not sure if Kondi is making friends with me due to the fact it's scum wanting to become close with town or if it's a town with a role that wants to become close with another townie. >.> Also what makes me wonder is saying claiming someone is town just because of something someone posted really early on the thread. That's sort of a really early read and it makes me think like he knows something that everyone else does. -__- Though I think that would be too obvious for a scum to do that, but then again if they TALKED prior to the start of the Day makes me wonder if its part of a plan after all.

Sigh, sadly my posting might be a bit not as much as I planned. I had to emergency replace someone off another site and they don't like super short posts like here and they have to be huge and long and actually concrete or else it's considered scum. Though the deadlines are much shorter there then here so during the silence nights there I can actually focus here during that time period. They had me replace on the Starting of D6 and I have to go read through almost 1,600 posts to figure out who I think may be scum and why. >.>

I don't see why you made the giant fluff paragraph about your off-site game. Nobody was saying you are not posting enough, at ease. Premature defenses like these don't flow smoothly with me, but honestly this is hardly a reason to be suspicious.

@Kondi

- Can you explain to me why would we want to lynch MrBump? Right now all i see is assumptions and accusations that MrBump is making accusations but not actually directing them / addressing them. Also something about scummeta and townmeta. Would you be so kind and clear this up to me?

[Venmar]

Venmar have you ever considered the reason that people confirmed so close together is because it's when ey got an email that the role PM had arrived and like myself at that point logged on and confirmed? For my part I should point out that I am pretty much V/LA at weekends and my wife was recently diagnosed with cancer so we are in and out of hospital fairly frequently so I post when I can get 5 minutes to myself.

That said there's nothing going on currently which peaks my interest in the way of scummy reads thus far. I've only people on here I've been in a game with is Kondi and I recently modded a game with Thomith in, so Im taking In how I see everyone posting first. Then I'll make my judgement. Although your constant pressure for everybody to post every 30 seconds or something is a tad disconcerting. It almost falls into looking to eager and you are actually scum trying to look town by being Mr Scumhunter superstar.

Weird how you all responded in the span of 39 minutes, but then didn't bother to participate in the game for a while despite what looked like your eager confirmation into the game. Also, i don't like lurkers, and especially in a 7 player game. Theres very little of as of compared to 13 player games, because of that i believe we should all chip in and work together, lurking will not help anyone.

I am very sorry to hear about your wife though, i wish you the best of luck for both of you.

[Venmar]

- Okay i couldn't find many scum games from Kondi, its hard browsing through his entire post history, but i found one game and he doesn't buddy at all at the beginning of the game, neither did he in any other games i have played with him. Regardless, i am willing to accept that the reasons for this are justified in slips and analysations, and not someone trying to get close to people. However, i will still be weary of Kondi because naturally i think he could be good scum trying to persuade the majority of the people to side with him. Reason is i haven't seen him buddy or get close to people this early on in the game in any other games, and i think on that note i will be keeping an eye on him, however given the circumstances of the playerbase of this game i think i can accept that.

No FoS on Kondi, by the way.

[Venmar]

I should add that I currently believe that the scum team is Mr. bump and Venmar, before anyone thinks I'm just throwing votes around.

Are you going to back anything up? You're not showing any reasons for your vote. That said, what do you not like about MrBump?
You also seem to be role phishing. Someone being at L-1 does not warrant an immediate claim, claim should be made when the intent to hammer is clear from someone else.
Why am i Scum? Seems like you're bashing me for being suspicious of you early on.

Unvote

[Venmar]

Why did you unvote, Venmar?

My vote was on TheTrollie?

[Venmar]

Because he posted, and i am focusing on different players now. If you look back i think i did state that vote was mainly just pressure.

[Venmar]

@Kondi: What do you think of Snake right now?

[Venmar]

Sceptical right now if MrBump is scum, i am really null here.

Anyone has intent to hammer?

[Venmar]

Alright. I've went through possible teams, eliminated people who are town, and determined that the scum is in one of these:

MrBump-Trollie
MrBump-Thomith
Snake-Trollie
Snake-Thomith
Trollie-Thomith

Notice that all possible teams have either Trollie or Thomith in them.

What happened to MrBump? Why go for him if you think Thomith and Trollie have a much higher chance of being scum?
What is so scummy about Trollie?

[Venmar]

Town / Leaning Town:
1)

Venmar

-Me
2)

Kondi

- Not 100%, but he hasn't given me any bad vibes as of yet and has good feedback. However, i am naturally suspicious of him, but really that is just a small fraction that isn't effecting my view of him all that much.
3)

MalaKitten

- Mostly leaning, but is giving good vibes for me.

Null:
4)

TheTrollie

- Hasn't posted much or anything of much relevance. Null to the max.
5)

MrBump

- He hasn't necessarily given me really bad vibes but at the same time he hasn't really given me much town vibes. Some of his posts are edgy though and some reactions as well. I will need to reread the thread for Bump, but for now i feel null about him.

Leaning Scum:
6)

Snake

- Comes in with a unexplained vote on MrBump. Given he hasn't really contributed much at all yet, it looks like he is bandwagoning on MrBump right now. He also thinks that if someone is on L-1 they should claim, i really disagree with this. Claims should only be made after someone expresses intent to hammer. Snake, for the time being, is the scummiest player in the game right now.
7)

Thomith

- Mostly null, but i naturally find how Thomith plays and how he responds to people and how he questions, i find all those scummy. This might just be how Thomith plays though. Mostly scummy vibes and little to no town vibes from him make me very suspicious.

- I will reread the thread and ISO Thomith and MrBump, i don't know if my reads on them are as accurate as i would like them to be, especially MrBump who i am having second thoughts on. Regardless, at the moment i feel like Snake is the scummiest player right, and on that note,

Vote: Snake

[Venmar]

First, what is your opinion on my reasoning for voting MrBump?

Hmm, i think i asked you a question regarding MrBump... right here: and you still haven't answered.

I'm not sure if Kondi is making friends with me due to the fact it's scum wanting to become close with town or if it's a town with a role that wants to become close with another townie. >.> Also what makes me wonder is saying claiming someone is town just because of something someone posted really early on the thread. That's sort of a really early read and it makes me think like he knows something that everyone else does. -__- Though I think that would be too obvious for a scum to do that, but then again if they TALKED prior to the start of the Day makes me wonder if its part of a plan after all.

Sigh, sadly my posting might be a bit not as much as I planned. I had to emergency replace someone off another site and they don't like super short posts like here and they have to be huge and long and actually concrete or else it's considered scum. Though the deadlines are much shorter there then here so during the silence nights there I can actually focus here during that time period. They had me replace on the Starting of D6 and I have to go read through almost 1,600 posts to figure out who I think may be scum and why. >.>

I don't see why you made the giant fluff paragraph about your off-site game. Nobody was saying you are not posting enough, at ease. Premature defenses like these don't flow smoothly with me, but honestly this is hardly a reason to be suspicious.

@Kondi

- Can you explain to me why would we want to lynch MrBump? Right now all i see is assumptions and accusations that MrBump is making accusations but not actually directing them / addressing them. Also something about scummeta and townmeta. Would you be so kind and clear this up to me?

So, why are you voting for him? Like i said, all i can see is what i posted above. Is it because he hasn't shown scum and town meta or what?

Also

, i would like to note that only 2 people, Thomith and Snake have made a big deal out of my pressure that i put on Snake and Trollie. Hmmm? Only makes me want lynch them both more. I don't think it is a coincidence that the two "scummy" players right now have both rosen up to argue the same point, coincidentally with a two scum game.

Kondi, convince me with the case on MrBump, right now i am leaning for either a Thomith or Snake lynch.

[Venmar]

Hmm. Being extremely cautious is not necessarily a scumtell, IN MY EYES. What you are suggesting though is that if MrBump is scum, than his cautious approach on Thomith is WIFOM. Either he is scum trying to distance or scum being cautious on town as not to not appear pushy or such.

Kondi, do you believe MrBump is still the best target? Your last read post says that Thomith or Trollie are better targets because you think they check out more for scum teams, meaning they are scummy.

[Venmar]

Kondi is a cool guy. I like him, but respectively weary of him, he is good and i heard he is an even better scum player.

[Venmar]

I would like to say that i have intent to hammer as well.

@TheTrollie

- Does this make me scummy?

[Venmar]

Hmmm, Kondi in that post are you saying you want MrBump hammered already?

[Venmar]

Ugh, this is a unfortunate turn of events, i am going to withhold my tendency to hammer MrBump and wait for Trollies replacement to post his/her reads on this game. I would like more feedback on this matter and Snake is offering none, simply randomly switching his vote on to MrBump, does not explain it, and has been lurking ever since. Currently i feel pretty good about a Snake/XX scum team, but i am going to wait for the reads of the replacement.

[Venmar]

I was completely fine with a hammer until Trollie announced replacement.

Could you expand on this? Is it because you want his replacement's feedback, don't want to inconvenience the replacement, or what?

[Venmar]

Chime in with what? I'm town nothing more to say, although I would point out if you do lynch me you will put us at a disadvantage.

Are you soft claiming a power role? I don't mean to sound like i am role fishing but this is what this post is implying in my eyes. Snake, you seem to fail to defend your actions correctly and reserve to defend yourself with this? Oh, that is SO not scummy. Rather than not being helpful or just giving up, how about you help us, especially if you are a PR. Really, letting us lynch you without you putting up a defense is telling me that you are not all that devoted to help town, and thus making you scummy.

[Venmar]

I really do not like soft claims, either you claim or you don't claim. -_-

Going to have to agree because now if Snake isn't scum the mafia will make a note of his soft claim post and he will get a target painted on his back. Don't drop clues that you have a power role unless you feel like you have a reason to.

[Venmar]

Erm, I think you'll find the scum would already know who the town members are, therefore weare all NK'D targets? Dumb logic if ever I heard it.

Lynch, Lynch him now!!

[Venmar]

[Venmar]

Lynch Snake for soft claiming but not wanting to claim after being found out. Scummy Scummyty Scum Scum!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Idk, there is not much to contribute when no one is talking.

@Thomith

- What are your reads. Speak them now mortal.

[Venmar]

@ everyone: What are your reads and why? (better question)

No, direct questions draw people out, generalized questions don't and people can ignore them because later the chances of being pushed for ignoring these questions is not as prominent. Further more, some us have already given our reads, like me, while others haven't, including you MalaKittens.

So.

@Mala

- What are your reads as well?

[Venmar]

@Mod - Can we please have a vote count?

Also, we need more talking to be done here, the game is really slowing down.

[Venmar]

@Snake

- What are your reads? You have contributed very little to the game other than your scummy posts.

[Venmar]

Hmmm, way too much lurking going on and nobody has the balls to speak up from the looks of it..

@Mod - When are we getting our replacement for TheTrollie, and can we have a vote count please?

I am okay with someone hammering Snake, he hasn't been talking and hasn't responded to my questions directed at him. He is lurking at the very least and seems to just disappear from the radar without saying anything. Kondi and Mala at least posted their V/LA. If anyone wants my reasons for why Snake is scummy, let me know but this game needs some work and progress, and nobody really has the determination to keep playing from the looks of it.

[Venmar]

you and mala are together because neither of you really outweigh the other as i am quite unsure about both of you, but think at least one of you is scum.

ProTip: Vote Snake.

[Venmar]

Chime in with what? I'm town nothing more to say, although I would point out if you do lynch me you will put us at a disadvantage.

This is Snake "Defending himself".

So.

ProTip: Vote Snake.

[Venmar]

Thomith you might as well do what you have to do. I was trying to draw the NK as I'm VT. i was hoping that we could hit scum on the lynchand then they'd target me on the soft claim, but that's all messed up now.

I do still think Bump is scum though.

And you expected doing this would save you from being lynched...how...?

You chose the wrong time to deploy this "strategy" and you only have yourself to blame for it backfiring on you. You can always hope we catch scum today but you not contributing to the main discussion, refusing to post your reads, not explaining your votes well enough, and ignoring everyone else is just outright scummy. The only time you ever show up is when people get closer to lynching you, so honestly i doubt you are town or you would have been much more helpful.

You tried to execute your plan without actually doing so, so congratulations. You say you wanted to lynch scum today and make the second kill you, but you haven't ACTUALLY helped us catch this scum for the lynch so you're plan is total BS. Were you hoping we would do all the work?

Anybody going to hammer?

[Venmar]

Ughh.

Unvote

- I need to wait for Kondi and everyone else to get opinions down. After a second thought i want to wait before we rashly lynch Snake.

[Venmar]

Why do you always need to wait for Kondi? >.>

If you haven't noticed this Snake vote has been almost completely fueled by me, and no one else is really interested in contributing much serious thoughts. There are some comments there and there, but not much. I want to wait for at least Kondi or some other players and get opinions down on this Snake wagon before we proceed with the lynching, because really a wagon with the ideas of one isn't exactly a good one.

[Venmar]

Here temporarily, nothing has really changed, but I'll look over stuff more clearly when I'm home.

- So what's up? Reads? Opinions? I am on the edge of hammering and not hammering, but i want more feedback before doing so.

[Venmar]

Vote: MalaKittens

[Venmar]

I'm reaction testing you. You have posted quite some fluff lately and such, i though it was about time to make you talk. Your response also makes no sense, you aren't going to be lynched today so what you just said makes no sense.

Unvote

[Venmar]

OoOooOzing.

Mattp is playing now..? Oh man, i don't know about this..

[Venmar]

I want to hammer Snake SO BAD, but hearing Mattp out is important.

[Venmar]

Kondi, could you please unvote for now? I don't trust Thomith enough to know that he won't just randomly hammer Snake. I want to hear out Mattp before we do any hammering or things of such sort.

[Venmar]

I'm town.

[Venmar]

Both your townreads are based off of townslips that aren't townslips :/

Work with me on Mala. If she flips town my vote it yours all round.

- Problem is that if she flips town we will be at LyLo tomorrow. Not much of a vote gain for just 1 day, and kind of bad if Kondi is actually scum. Then again, i know you Mattp, you're a good player, so your read could be reliable depending if we can trust you to be town.

[Venmar]

I think i figured out how Mattp plays. Be an asshole.

It's fine, but if Mattp pisses me off again i will replace out.

[Venmar]

Hahahah.

Dafuq.

[Venmar]

*sigh*

You're overreacting. I am sorry Mattp that i offended you, and you are drawing total bullshit conclusions regarding that replacement was a strategy.

I apologize, but i didn't say i will replace out because you called me scum, i said i will replace out because of how you play, not that you accused me. I see what you mean though, and i am sincerely sorry if i have offended you.

We either put this aside because i can see you are getting emotional over one thing i said and we can play as if i never said that, or i can replace for your better being. Which one is it?

[Venmar]

Sure. I am not scum though.

Vote: Venmar

[Venmar]

@Everyone
- Lynch me

[Venmar]

Sure.

Hoopla, i apologize for all that happened in the last few posts, i take full responsibility for the actions that happened. If it makes things better, please penalize me in some fashion, i do feel bad now. Either way, i am sorry if i offended you Mattp, but that is not how i ever meant anything, even if it looks like it.

In advance, i also apologize to the game.

Unvote: Venmar

Please Replace Me Hoopla

[Venmar]

Fine.

Dont Replace Me

[Venmar]

Tomorrow is going to be a LyLo if you lynch me my friend. ( Given scum make a kill at night. )

I am not even going to defend myself because defending from Mattp is impossible at this stage.

[Venmar]

Why not.

[Venmar]

I don't believe them.

[Venmar]

Because this just might not work out for you.

[Venmar]

Why thank you.

Now try harder.

[Venmar]

No i haven't. You wish i did though.

[Venmar]

No i don't.

[Venmar]

Vote: Snake

[Venmar]

Yay VOTE: Snake

- I love you, lets make Alien Babies like the one at the end of Prometheus.

[Venmar]

Actually no, that is just creepy to say.

[Venmar]

I am town.

I didn't claim anything.

Try harder.

[Venmar]

When i flip town you will never hear the end of it.

[Venmar]

Kondi isn't a bad player, stop being an ass by the way.

[Venmar]

Kondi's town reads are much more accurate than your scum reads. So i trust Kondi more.

This is probably a town vs town debate, so let's just hush and wait for Hoopy.

[Venmar]

Because your scum reads on me have been 100% wrong in every game we have played in. O399 did not count because we were teammates.

You may be good at reading other people, but not me. Kondi is able to read me better than you, so i trust him.

[Venmar]

Thomith, unvote right now before i cut you. You know this is LyLo?

[Venmar]

You blew it for him too.

Are we speedlynching now?

[Venmar]

I am not a Cop.

[Venmar]

In case it wasn't obvious and to confirm it
I am the cop.

- And you obviously got a scum tell on MrBump?

[Venmar]

* Scum Result i mean.

[Venmar]

Hmm, i am just going to speculate here. Based on these findings, the last scum is either Kondi or Mattp, because i know i am town, and Thomith is most likely the Cop. ( This is all assuming Thomith IS the cop, and Bump is a scum. )

Now, i am leaning Mattp scum because Kondi has been correct with his town reads on me and MalaKitten, as well as his scum read on MrBump. Now i am trying to decide if Kondi could be scum who was making town reads on people he obviously knew were town and started to buss Bump hard, or he is just a town player with a good read on people this game. Although, reflecting to his town play in 0399, his town and scum reads were less accurate than they are here, which could hint scum intelligence in this game, but we also have to consider the size and people in this game. This is also where my suspicion of him as a good scum player come in, and i can't really figure out which side Kondi is coming from. Right now he has a 50% chance of being scum.

As for Mattp... yeah idk. I kind of felt like the argument me and him had right before Day 1 ended was a Town vs Town conflict, but since Bump is most likely scum and Thomith is most likely the cop, i am starting to rethink my analysis. Looking back at O399, his little debate seemed to be similar to the one he had with Om, but then again i might be wrong. I will need to reread this thread again because me getting a read on Mattp is pretty hard due to how abrasively and aggressively plays.

This is from my point of view and i know this is right given that Thomith is cop with a guilty result. From Mattp's point of view the scum is either me or Kondi, and from Kondi's point of view the scum is either me or Mattp.

This is speculation, and we need to wait for MrBump first of course.

[Venmar]

That's why i said i said " but we also have to consider the size and people in this game "....

You're right though.

[Venmar]

Way to make this difficult...

AAGHH

[Venmar]

Kondi, don't you dare hammer.

PEdit: -.-

[Venmar]

Mattp is so bad with getting reads on me. Not even going to lie.

[Venmar]

Lol...

I blame Kondi.

[Venmar]

I am confused. Legit.

[Venmar]

Lol, did Mattp just own Kondi or something?

[Venmar]

You know, Mattps playstyle is very aggresive, stubborn, and annoying, but i must say it is effective.

Still, I can see i will be the deciding factor tomorrow given we just lynched scum and Thomith will get shot..

[Venmar]

...I hate you, Matt. -_-

- Just reading over the thread, is this Kondi spiting Mattp for figuring him out?

[Venmar]

I doubt Thomith will be kept alive, he will clear someone tomorrow or find scum, too risky.

For example, if Kondi kills Mattp and Thomith cops me, Kondi loses, same if Thomith cops Kondi, Kondi loses. Same thing happens with Mattp if he is scum and Kondi is town.

No, Thomith is dying.

[Venmar]

Am I to assume my defence was not up to snuff and that y'all picked up on the absolutely impossible situation I'd been put under

I have a wall to post after the game ends. Remind me.

- So you were scum?

[Venmar]

Hey Matt, you should try to set up the idea that me-scum is going to bring you and Thomith to LyLo. It will totally work, especially if Thomith is kept alive.

Thomith, just in case Matt decides to do this, investigate me.

- This plan suggests i get night killed. I don't like getting night killed.

[Venmar]

So what's going on? I am here.

[Venmar]

No.

[Venmar]

Someone's trying to do ninja voting and unvoting now?

[Venmar]

*Gives a five*

[Venmar]

Mattp. I have NO FUCKING idea which of you is scum. I know i am a VT, but idk which of you two is scum...

[Venmar]

I'm leaning Kondi scum right now.

[Venmar]

I'm Watching.

[Venmar]

And Matt's gone. Which means he's town.

- Yeah.

Vote: Kondi

[Venmar]

Good Game.

I still blame Kondi.

[Venmar]

Lol Mattp.

Funny because that was an instant scum sign to me.

[Venmar]

Really good decision

Never playing with venmar again can't read him for shit

- I told you, but NOO.

[Venmar]

What is that Mattp?

[Venmar]

Funny because all of night 2 i was reading into the thread and i came to the conclusion that Kondi is the scum, and day 3 i saw it instantly but Mattp decided to use his false read on me.

I'm also happy that my gut was against Kondi the whole game, thinking about Kondis scum play, but i usually put Kondi away as town due to reads and in thread behavior, but evidently in the thread i showed my suspicion of him and that was mostly due to my gut.

Good game nonetheless and well played by Kondi and Bump.