Open 399: Faith Plus 1 (Day Seven)

[Psyche]

NO ONE TREATS SELF META SERIOUSLY.

[Psyche]

Om...*grasps Om by his hands and looks deeply/intensely in his eyes*...I love you. Not romantically, but not platonically, either. I love you sexually. Would you pleease come join me in my Hawt Two-Person Voting Bloc of Sexy Boy Love so that we, together, can rid the world of totally unsexy scumhood?

I don't think I can wait any longer to declare you feelings for you. Your youthful energetic boisterity...*dramatically looks away*...is just tooo cute.

[Psyche]

OMFG MATT IS SOOOOO TOWN. I don't know where the doubt came from. PLEASE JOIN OUR ORGY.

And...eh? Oh, sure Om, that's great. Wait. No. Do you not know the definition of "sexy love"? Marriage and babies are gross.

[Psyche]

So from here's it's just simple counting and a bit of faith in myself.

5 players left,
1 conf town,
2 basically town.

And two outcasts who will only see a sexy love orgy in hell. Or the end game. Depending on our luck.

We lynch one now, and we either win or we wait. Some dies at night and it's still 2 v 1. We lynch the presumed alternative and win.

As you can see, guys, today is not about finding the last scum, but narrowing it down to 2.

[Psyche]

I guess I should try and read kondi...

[Psyche]

Yeah. Unbearable.
So! Om. Matt. Who shall we eliminte today? Kondi or BK?

[Psyche]

I'm going to bed. Super tired. Don't do anything drastic. Like vote within the bloc.

[Psyche]

I've waited for this day for a long time. But I do want Matt to weigh in before the peer pressure is set.

[Psyche]

Narrow it to 2.

[Psyche]

I'm not posting again until kondi talks. Boycott ftw.

Matt, you really need to give me a good reason to think Om would bus ALL of his scumbuds.

[Psyche]

Okay, no one's lynching anyone until we can get a 3-person agreement on the 2 scummiest players in the game.

[Psyche]

(And I have to be in that 3.)

[Psyche]

We all agree that Matt is town?

[Psyche]

No.

[Psyche]

Om's wagoning is scummier and he is the worst possible thing that can happen to endgame.

I was thinking a lot about lylo and I think that scum won't kill Psyche tonight because if the last mafia doesn't get his kill through he will have to get 3 misvotes to cause a mislynch in endgame. It'll be easier for scum to target me or Kondi, most likely kondi, and then leave me and Om with Psyche in the final three. I think that if Om is scum and this happens, Om won't have much trouble getting a mislynch on me, winning the game.

Om is also too aggressive in pushing through quicklynches.

Vote: Om

I do not support a BK lynch going into lylo.

Matt, your reasons just aren't very good. Om does these things. He's always a bit lite on analysis and self-regulation, but he does his best to play his niche in the game.

[Psyche]

Psyche hates me.

I'm extremely suspicious of your pwnage.

[Psyche]

Sure. And you've been a null tell throughout the game.

[Psyche]

You know, our agreement that Matt is town basically labels him as an NK option. I don't want to discuss that a lot, but I want it discussed a lot tomorrow if the game goes a certain way.

No talking about this post. >.<

[Psyche]

I don't see why Om is not obviously town. Kondi, could you tell me why? With passsion?

[Psyche]

I guess I'll read kondi.

[Psyche]

GUYSGUYSGUYSGUYSGUYSGUYSGUYS. I PROPOSE A VENMAR/TROLLIE/KONDI SCUMTEAM. TROLLIE'S CASE ON KONDI LOOKED LIKE A BLANTANT BUS. HOWEVER I AM STILL NOT THAT CONFIDENT IN KONDI SCUM UNLESS WE GET A TROLLIE SCUMFLIP.
GUNNY I SAY YOU SHOULD INVESTIGATE EITHER ONE OF KONDI OR TROLLIE.

He followed this with a pretty detailed analysis that probably motivated shotty to do his scan. 1357 to 1360 are MUCH more impressive than this quoted post. I probably am going to end up being obliged to quote it, won't I?

Next post, then. He basically laid out the next days lynch of scum. If that doesn't equal town, I don't know what does. Do you really think Om decided to bus that hard?

[Psyche]

I dislike doing this. But this sequence of posts clears Om for me...

So here are all the comments between Trollie and Venmar. I'll expand on why I quoted them in my next post, just wanna get this out here right now.

It basically can prevent mislynches and greatly hinders the mafia by making their vote less powerful.

yeah but at the same time it seems to me like if you think the ppl in the bloc are town, and everyone does, they wont get voted for anyway...idk still seems dumb to me...

Making a random list of most likely random people is just kind of weird to me, as some of those

could be your scum buddies.

could be your scum buddies? are you implying you know kondi (or someone else in there) is scum?

Ok, here are my quick reads:

Town

- Venmar

( Im town )

- Morton

( Hasn't given off a single mafia vibe for me. This isn't much but his play seems more townish than scummish. )

- Psyche

( Doesn't strike me as a scummy player. His absence at first seemed like lurking, but he has returned with plenty of decent and good content )

- Mattp

( He has been doing a lot of scum hunting lately and has been pressuring others greatly. Looks very townish to me. Regardless of how hard he is trying to tunnel me.. )

Neutral / Null

- DmrShotgun

( I am very null about shotgun. I can't seem to decide if his claim is legit or not. Until someone can help me decide if his claim can be trusted or not, i will stay null about him. Seeing shotgun wasn't REALLY pressured into claiming, his claim is a bit harder to believe. )

- Kassadin

( Very unreadable for me. I can lean town but he hasn't been posting enough nor giving much content in his posts. This makes him hard to read for ME. So i am neutral with Kass. )

- Om Nom

( Seems very energetic with his posting. Not sure if this is a hyper mafia or just a energetic personality. Semi-tunneling into Dark also seems kind of weary. But none of this really makes me suspicious enough of him to list him as mafia. So i am null here.. )

- Vijay

( Seems to be trying to scum hunt some people. Though i don't agree with some things, his posts are generally well spirited and fairly pro-town. However i am not sure if i can list him as a Townie just yet, nor mafia. )

Possible Mafia or Scum

- Darkling

( His post about saying lurkers are scummy so early in the game just set off plenty of alarms in my head. Compared with my post about Psyche, his is much worse. I only tried to pressure Psyche into talking, Dark outright said he was scummy for lurking. )

- BK-201

( I cant decide, but he seems to ignore or forget about questions aimed at him and it kind of makes him look like a scum trying to avoid further suspicion. I cant really say though, but out of all others BK seems to be more scummier than those below and most of the above. Further more, his justification for why Kondi could be a bad town is very insulting. I don't think current behavior should be based off of play records. Its easy for others to say your a bad town simply for not playing the game before. Im calling you out scummy just for that. However, in my previous off site game BK played somewhat well as a cop, but from my experience BK does not lie unless he is scum. For the time being, sticking with a possible scum read. )

Limbo ( Not sure if Mafia or Townie )

- Kondi

( You know, i am leaning scum just for the bloc at the beginning of the game, but at the same time i kind of believe him that it could have been a bait trying to arouse reactions from others. His further activity in this game has been promising, so i doubt he is mafia because making that bloc would have been a fairly dumb mafia move. Seeing as Kondi doesn't strike me as a bad player, i doubt that it was scum mistake. )

- Trollie

( His large disapproval of the Voting Bloc is very edgy for me. I think he could be a scum trying to prevent us townies from forming a bloc, which could actually help us get scum. Naturally, i feel like mafia members would try and prevent blocs to stop the town from organizing themselves to beat the mafia. Then again his suspicions for a bloc seem somewhat solid, as mafia members sneaking into blocs is always a possibility. I have a very un decided opinion on Trollie. )

- Chrimi

( In post 480, he exactly quotes " Neither of you claim,

we don't want scum knowing who another of my faith healer is

." Tell me what you guys think of what he said here. He could be saying he is a faith healer or just talking to the town in general. Him asking for the faith healer(s) is kind of a scum move in my opinion, as at this point the faith healers definitely should not claim ANYTHING regarding their role. This, coupled with my weird gut feeling on Chrimi and what others have said, i cannot decide if he is Town or Maf. )

Well there's my reads on people. Nothing is set in stone, and i am more than happy to answer any questions aimed at me.

To explain about shotty: You say he changed his story about the voting block. I see it as he revealed information. At first before he knew it was fake he said it would help town. After he found out it was fake he said he assumed it was made to help town by lynching kass. I don't see any conflicting information there.

thank you. this is the first time anyone has given an alternate reason for his behavior...

not sure if shot is telling the truth but seems likely…not worth killing the cop if he is so I’ll drop it for now (idk his play style, but role claiming at this point seems pretty silly. I know he apologized, but, for people who have played with him before: is that role claim out of character?)

Reads

Town:

Om

Vij

MattP

leaning town

Kondi

– I see a lot of scumhunting, he’s been going after multiple people and has follow-up questions to a lot of people’s interactions.

Kass

– I don’t know anthing about him, but you guys have made good points for why he’s probably town in this game due to the way he is posting compared to how he usually posts.

Null

Shot

– claim of dr. moves him to null. I still don’t like how aggressive he was against me when he wasn’t doing anything to answer my questions about him.

Psyche

Dark

Venmar

– his posts are very wishy washy but at the same time he is generally encouraging scum-hunting. I just wish he encouraged it less and did it more. Also his response to Matt’s attack is very weird—he thinks matt is talking about psyche. He’s probably fine but I want to keep watching him.

leaning scum

Morton

– bad vibe…he attacks me for not scum hunting based on a post that was clearly me being a smart-ass
Chrimi – the role fishing was scummy, but he was trying to deal with a pretty tough situation (finding a way to save our potential cop) so I’m not ready to pull the trigger on this yet.

Scum

BK

– spends a lot of the game trying to get us off the scumhunting path and onto Kass. After claiming he will replace out if we do not lynch kass he changes his vote to shot because of a scumslip. He is very much against anyone else voting for someone other than kass if they feel someone is scummy, however.


On another note I am sorry for flipping you off Om, that was wrong of me. However, I was trying, in my own ass-holish way, to get you and others to focus more on THIS game and less on the out-of-game discussion. Didn’t mean to piss you off.

^ Shot claimed cop.. not dr. Are you actually reading the thread or is this a mistake?

Could you possible explain why you think Dark is null, and why is Om town?

Shot – claim of dr. moves him to null. I still don’t like how aggressive he was against me when he wasn’t doing anything to answer my questions about him.

Sorry..didn’t mean to make that confusing..i meant claim of dr (drmyshot) not claim of dr (doctor role)

Will post my reasons on dark and om when I get a chance. Likely later tonight unless I decide to procrastinate more before then.

@Trollie

You have the time to read over the whole thread to make a vote count but not to explain your reads on Om and Dark?

@venmar: can you explain your change of hart on kondi?

agh...now i dont know what to do. I don't like what I'm seeing from either of these guys:

@Trollie's case: Notice that vijay ALSO mentioned the FH's CCing in his post. That's why I unvoted, not because Kassadin could be investigated.

this is a non-answer. it gets rid of one of the three position swaps at the very best. worse though, is that i find it to be

yet another

instance of backtracking. you did not mean FH CCing when you unvoted.

By the way, MattP townslipped.

Hmmmm.. XD just kidding.

1 for 1 is always good imo, even if we lose our cop. But seriously, this claiming. *sigh* might as well say it, I'm a Faith Healer as well.

All other FHs should claim now.

We aren't PLing today guys. Let shotgun sort that out for us. Once Kass is conftown/scum we can let scum nightkill him or we can lynch him.

Good call, vijay. UNVOTE:

only valid interp is that you are saying good point on the kass thing. (a) why would u be saying "good call" to the line "all other FHs should claim now." (b) you go from that directly into unvoting so it stands to reason that you are talking about his point on kass

now you are backtracking again saying that you never changed your mind because you wanted to wait for shot to investigate. That is not in line with what i see here.

@kondi: also, you didn't answer: what made your read on me change?

but, at the same time:

I had a unsure read. I can't call him town nor mafia because i am unsure!! How hard is this to understand..

(a) "I had an unsure read" -- re-read the posts matt quoted. you called kondi "clearly not scum," and "leaning scum" that is not an unsure read.
(b) you did call him town AND mafia so i dont get why your response is you can't call him town nor mafia
(c) very defensive -- "how hard is this to understand"

eh...now i dont know which to pick...

how many votes is that on ven?

i'm pretty convinced by all of this "turtle" nonsense

UNVOTE: kondi
VOTE: venmar

no one else thinks venmar's BK comment deserves discussion?

Alright, so this is why I think they are scum together. First of all, they rarely mention each other, which strikes me as them trying not to be tied together in case one of them flips scum.

Making a random list of most likely random people is just kind of weird to me, as some of those

could be your scum buddies.

could be your scum buddies? are you implying you know kondi (or someone else in there) is scum?

This is a really weak attack from Trollie, it looks like a weak bus to me. Also the mention of kondi specifically instead of someone else leads me to think he's also the other scumbuddy.

Ok, here are my quick reads:

- Trollie

( His large disapproval of the Voting Bloc is very edgy for me. I think he could be a scum trying to prevent us townies from forming a bloc, which could actually help us get scum. Naturally, i feel like mafia members would try and prevent blocs to stop the town from organizing themselves to beat the mafia. Then again his suspicions for a bloc seem somewhat solid, as mafia members sneaking into blocs is always a possibility. I have a very un decided opinion on Trollie. )

Notice how in his reads he leaves Trollie as a null read? I think this is because he doesn't want to have a strong opinion on his buddy in case he flips scum. He can't hard defend or it will look bad, and he can't tunnel a lot, otherwise it will also look bad. Also the only reason he has for putting him as null is based on the voting block discussion which happened like 200-400 posts before this one.

Reads

Null

Venmar

– his posts are very wishy washy but at the same time he is generally encouraging scum-hunting. I just wish he encouraged it less and did it more. Also his response to Matt’s attack is very weird—he thinks matt is talking about psyche. He’s probably fine but I want to keep watching him.

Notice how Trollie also lists Venmar as a null read? This was filled with weak attacks and waffles. He brings up some reasonably decent points against Venmar but never pursues them and doesn't try to find out more.

More coming.

^ Shot claimed cop.. not dr. Are you actually reading the thread or is this a mistake?

Could you possible explain why you think Dark is null, and why is Om town?

Shot – claim of dr. moves him to null. I still don’t like how aggressive he was against me when he wasn’t doing anything to answer my questions about him.

Sorry..didn’t mean to make that confusing..i meant claim of dr (drmyshot) not claim of dr (doctor role)

Will post my reasons on dark and om when I get a chance. Likely later tonight unless I decide to procrastinate more before then.

Here he just asks Venmar a few questions, nothing too informative and nothing too damning. I think he's trying to test the waters here. Also he never addresses his concerns with Venmar from his reads list.

but, at the same time:

I had a unsure read. I can't call him town nor mafia because i am unsure!! How hard is this to understand..

(a) "I had an unsure read" -- re-read the posts matt quoted. you called kondi "clearly not scum," and "leaning scum" that is not an unsure read.
(b) you did call him town AND mafia so i dont get why your response is you can't call him town nor mafia
(c) very defensive -- "how hard is this to understand"

eh...now i dont know which to pick...

Yet another weak bussing attack on Venmar. No pursuing of this afterwards, no questions to get more information. Nothing at all.

how many votes is that on ven?

Hey look, suddenly he's concerned with the wagon on Ven. I think he's worried that Ven will get lynched.

i'm pretty convinced by all of this "turtle" nonsense

UNVOTE: kondi
VOTE: venmar

The most blatant wagon jump ever. This just reeks of bussing. No real reason to jump on his wagon, no case to go with it, nothing but a bad "reason" and a vote.

no one else thinks venmar's BK comment deserves discussion?

Again with the random suspicion. The closest thing he had before this in relation to thinking Ven-scum was the vote on him and a few bussing attacks.

tl;dr
Ven and Trollie are scumbuddies together because:
~They rarely mention each other so they can keep the connection low.
~The only real comments between them consist of random, weak bussing attempts with no follow up for any information.
~They both kept each other as null reads originally so they could avoid having a strong opinion on each other.
~Trollie randomly started suspecting Venmar for no apparent reason, no case to go with his vote, and no strong or damning attacks or attempts to get information from Ven to try and discern his alignment.

[Psyche]

Dear lord, Om you're slow. We already proposed that >.>

Oh. Ehhhhhhhrg.

[Psyche]

Okay. Om first. Redeeming factor lost.

[Psyche]

And our number two?

Lemme read BK's scum meta...

[Psyche]

Okay, then. Can we agree on BK and Om? No matter what, BK and Om?

[Psyche]

But I would like to know how Om stopping being obvious town made me obvious town.

The game calls for decisiveness. I've decided that you're town.

I also think it'd be cool to provide an incentive to scum to NK you. No, seriously, scum, I promise I won't protect Kondi.

[Psyche]

BK is MUCH more easygoing as town. He's like a happy little boy skipping down meadows as town.

[Psyche]

Nevermind. Jungle was just a good day.

[Psyche]

Well, that's that. I'm on the fence about Om and BK. That isn't a bad thing.

Depending on the NK, there is still room for read adaptation, but that's that.

I've decided to select Matt as my protect. Idc if I die. I've done enough.

[Psyche]

Well, I'm off to learn the science of moral intuition. Good luck, BK.

[Psyche]

You guys got me to think hard enough to think Om is scummier than BK and now you change your mind? -_-

I'm fine with both.

PEdit: We'll wait.

Whatever, if you guys agree that Om is scummy then I'm not scared about lylo. I'd prefer not to be the failtown that had to go to the last second to win it in such an easy round where it was 1 scum vs 9 town. I think BK is scummier than Om and have always thought that. His analysis is misreps and strawmans and I derive nothing useful from them.

Kondi, do you think his last analysis was helpful at all? It just looks like desperate scum pullling reads out of his ass to save himself.

After BK's little nip at me about me with my Kondi defense I would orgasm if he was lynched and I would enjoy his scummy blood all over my fingers so good

Psyche, Idc why you are saying that, maybe you are lying and actually plan to protect yourself, but I will not rest easy unless I know you are protecting yourself so please spare me the bullshit.

I'm rather concerned about my ability to stay active on the site in the future. My iPad's being taken away from me today. You're about as conf town as I am. You'll be okay.

[Psyche]

Psyche, just go 50-50 between you and Matt.

No.

[Psyche]

I don't feel like surviving. I'd rather the buck stop with you.

[Psyche]

For a while. >.>

[Psyche]

Meh.

[Psyche]

Meh because for some reason the second Faith Healer never CC'd me.

[Psyche]

HAHA I GET IT "PSYCHE!"

I irl facepalmed.

[Psyche]

Hm...

I don't want people to think that's the meaning of my username. >.<

[Psyche]

Perfect. Muahaha.

So I lied. We're not just going to systematically kill BK now.

[Psyche]

So! I get to play kingmaker. Time to milk this for all it is worth.

[Psyche]

I just wanted to make sure Kondi was the NK choice. >.>

[Psyche]

Idgaf he is scum and I will do anything in my power to convince you of that

BUT I KNEW IT I KNEW YOU WOULD PROTECT YOURSELF I KNEW YOU CARED THAT WAS A DIRTY TRICK

Where'd you get the idea that I protected myself?

[Psyche]

Oh, nvm. Kingmaker's the wrong word. lol.

[Psyche]

Before I choose who to kill, I'm going to finish my empirical study of relevant tells in this game.

[Psyche]

vote BK

I don't care if I'm wrong. I love Matt and his posts.

And I really don't know if I'll be free tomorrow.

[Psyche]

Ah. Even to the end, a total null read.

[Psyche]

I had to do it. Kondi had me WIFOMing. I had to do exactly what I would've done.

[Psyche]

The kill on me should have tipped you off, however.

I kinda tried to design your death.

But yeah. I have to go tomorrow. I had to end it quick.

[Psyche]

Compulsive null tell.

[Psyche]

You were super excited, too.

[Psyche]

But what did the gambit do, besides put us at great risk?

[Psyche]

/thinks

(Didn't it leave our PRs vulnerable, since no one knew who to protect?)

[Psyche]