Open 407: Masons and Monks (Game Over!)

[BK201]

VOTE: kodin

[BK201]

BK201, what do you think of lane?

townish so far

Initial reads are that kondi and paul are scum of some kind, and probably not on the same team since it seems like a bad move to both sheep back to back like that. I'll leave my vote on Kondi.

[BK201]

Kondi I don't even know what to say to that. did you not read it while also thinking this was a mini or what? what happened?

[BK201]

this game can wait till tomorrow. I have another game with deadline in 2 days and not alot of RL time right now

I kind of believe kondi, at least looks better than paul.
UNVOTE:
VOTE: paul

[BK201]

Chrimi is town.

[BK201]

Chronos, Kondi admitted he didn't actually read the case and it was pressure. I voted him for sheeping a bad case. Paul did sheep a bad case though.

[BK201]

you know you can replace out if you must, right?

[BK201]

Spoiler:

mmm, yeah typo not sarcasm sorry. should've read "doesn't" not "does".

UNVOTE:
VOTE: elmo

elmo seemed pretty eager to get started, even complained about being ninja'ed with first post. now seems to be absent in this thread. i'm switching my vote on the suspicion of lurking and in an effort to start something because i can also understand if he hasn't said anything for lack of content

ALSO, YOU SEEM PRETTY EAGER TO OVER EXPLAIN YOURSELF.
Paranoid?

Dazzy, sorry to answer someone else's question, but paranoia is generally a sign of scum. They have much more to be worried about, and badly feigned scumhunting often ends up looking like paranoia. While I don't think the typo business is really very scummy(he could just as easily be a lazy ass not taking the game seriously), his attitude towards that doesn't really mesh with his paranoia and defensiveness, and THAT is scummy.

vote: lane

You're basing his attitude towards something that doesn't matter (and in this post you imply you agree the typo business doesn't matter) to the rest of his attitude and that supposedly isn't sheeping a bad case?

[BK201]

It can't be sheeping a bad case if he is voting for reasons outside of the ones presented in the bad case.

It's based on the same thing. lane's attitude towards the typo.

[BK201]

@Whiskers, what are your thoughts on kondi and paul?

[BK201]

prod dodge, sorry guys

[BK201]

@Whiskers, It was either a pointless scum-bluff, or just straight up anti-town play. I don't see how chrimi basically saying I'm not doing this game vote me guys is a scum move, don't even think anybody was voting him before that, so I don't see the point of scum-AtE there. So the only thing it could be was anti-town play.

[BK201]

There's 2 masons and 2 monks. But even if they claim that it doesn't clear them from the other faction.
It's not like we don't have time.

It does clear one of them from being non-town though...don't see a reason for the masons and monks not to out each other.

Anyways, paul hasn't changed my opinion on him but I'm getting an odd vibe from elmo. A paul lynch would be great, but I would also like an elmo lynch.
UNVOTE:
VOTE: Elmo

[BK201]

actually I won't be able to be on much till Monday so keeping my vote on paul makes more sense.
UNVOTE:
VOTE: Paul

[BK201]

@Mod

Is there any way we can get a 24-48 hr extension due to finals week for (I assume) most of us?

[BK201]

Haha alright. I'm VT.
I would much rather lynch paul...it is pretty clear he is only reactive scum.

[BK201]

I'll make sure to change to whiskers before deadline if paul doesn't get lynched. whiskers is pretty null, but either way its better chances for us.

[BK201]

Is that Timeeater's meta as a certain alignment?
anyways here's my vote
VOTE: Whiskers

[BK201]

Kondi you provided reasons in 399(think that was the number)
what's up?

[BK201]

Psyche has a good point. Extension seems deserved considering Chrimi's slot hurting the team.

[BK201]

should be obvious how an empty slot hurts the team.

If we can get an extension there are 2-3 much better lynches than Whiskers.

[BK201]

UNVOTE:
back down to L-2.

@Mod

Can we get an extension due to Chrimi replacing out? We need a player there.

[BK201]

Yes you did. Also, you never lie as town or scum? That is also a lie.

[Preedit]
How will that prevent crap in the future? When I flip town-aligned monk, it won't even give you a named townie, just someone to be even more suspicious of.

And, BK, being a VT (as he claims) will switch his vote to himself to cause a lynch. In a normal situation, that's what I would do. /quote] Lynching yourself is only helpful to scum and vengeful townies.

[BK201]

and assuming you are monk, your partner can not be a werewolve so that helps.

[BK201]

You're not at L-1 anymore, anyways if we don't get the extension I want a no-lynch today. I know I've seen some %s that show lynching day 1 is better than not lynching, but if you have a strong town read on the only option due to deadline, no-lynch makes more sense.
VOTE: Paul
If you don't think we can make this happen, no-lynch is the second best realistic option.

[BK201]

and thanks for clearing up my read on you

[BK201]

no-lynch isn't as bad as you think is, at least not in this case. and maybe elmo will grace us with his presence.

[BK201]

super long night phase is going to kill the interest in this game.

[BK201]

CC gained 4 votes already?

That means all but one town voted for CC in succession. I doubt that is the case. More likely there is at least one scum on his wagon, and at the very least if CC is scum then its opposing scum on his wagon. 4/5 town doing that right out of the gate is hard to believe considering lack of case on CC.

[BK201]

I miscounted, still 3/5 town doing that isn't super likely given lack of case.

[BK201]

VOTE: A Modest Proposal

[BK201]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Papi Bear

[BK201]

^ obv scum

I'll take that as a joke given your lack of vote on me. Testing the waters?

VOTE: BK

Expected as much.

Vote: Lane

Isn't it 50/50 he's scum?

Alright so 1 of 2 monks/masons has a random(?) chance of being scum. Is it 50/50?

[BK201]

I think I just figured out one of the scum teams.

Alchemist is scum for leaping on Jackal for being a Monk. Guess who wants Monks dead? Werewolves do. B/c Monks 100% can not be Werewolves, so once the other team is wiped out, the Monk(s) would then be confirmed town.

But what really made me notice this was the fact that Whiskers was killed by Werewolves! I didn't think about it until a moment ago but why the hell was Whiskers killed? He had 3 or 4 votes on him all day. They obviously killed him b/c he was a Monk. Alchemist wants to get Jackal lynched so they can spend their NK somewhere else xD

Interestingly enough this Monk focus is also the attempted counter-wagon to his partner Papi-Bear. If not well, there's another scumteam, but the counter-wagon makes more sense.

With this pathetic activity I won't bother starting a new wagon, but keep this in mind for tomorrow.

[BK201]

Fine. I give up.

VOTE: Jackal711

@mod: If not lynched by the time you read this please find a replacement. I'm done with this game. Sorry.

I'll take that as a confession.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Jackal

[BK201]

I'm not looking for a response to this comment but I can not for the life of me figure out why AModestProposal was killed.

VOTE: BK

I'd rather get the mafia than a werewolf right now.

Looking at his one post (obviously not an asset to us), its likely wolves were aiming to kill mafia. This makes perfect sense when you consider my theory on alchemist wanting to lynch the monk for being the monk, b/c he can not be a wolf.

Dazzy probably is jackal's partner, good catch there.

CC+BK for wolves
(dat wifomy post from BK, dat whiskers interaction from CC)

Elmo cant be. If you are, well, fuck you man and I cant read for shit.

Alchemist, its really not wifom, its common sense what a scum team would do, kill confirmed towns. Your goal is to kill the other scum team as well, and when you do the monks/masons would be confirmed town depending on who's alive.
Dazzy is probably the mafia.
Alchemist and Papi are probably the wolves.

[BK201]

I think I just figured out one of the scum teams.

Alchemist is scum for leaping on Jackal for being a Monk. Guess who wants Monks dead? Werewolves do. B/c Monks 100% can not be Werewolves, so once the other team is wiped out, the Monk(s) would then be confirmed town.

But what really made me notice this was the fact that Whiskers was killed by Werewolves! I didn't think about it until a moment ago but why the hell was Whiskers killed? He had 3 or 4 votes on him all day. They obviously killed him b/c he was a Monk. Alchemist wants to get Jackal lynched so they can spend their NK somewhere else xD

Interestingly enough this Monk focus is also the attempted counter-wagon to his partner Papi-Bear. If not well, there's another scumteam, but the counter-wagon makes more sense.

With this pathetic activity I won't bother starting a new wagon, but keep this in mind for tomorrow.

All of this still stands. Alchemist is almost certain not the be mafia, so he didn't know what jackal was. He just wanted to lynch the monk. And today, after Elmo voted Papi-Bear in a "nothings changed" fashion, Alchemist made sure to redirect. He is right that taking out the last mafia is better for us, but its also better for him as with less people and still 2 wolves there is more chance for the mafia to hit one of them.

[BK201]

We herpderp and lynch town today, it becomes 3v3 (2 werewolves 1 mafa 2nks). three things can happen here by my reckoning. lets assume 1 maf kills town and 1 maf kills maf. it'd be 2v2 or 2v1v1 - both of these are unwinnable situations for the town (day breaks 4 people lynch a maf, maf kills, 1town1scum gg). maf kills 2 towns, gg mafia draw together. mafia cross kill each each other, making it 3v1 - which would be the best outcome giving an ML before lylo.

We lynch a werewolf today, it becomes 4v1v1 (1 maf, 1 wolf, 2nks). here there is a chance mafgroups can cross kill each other and we automatically win, unlike the above. if not, the situation is 2v1v1 (unwinnable for town maf draw-victory) or 3v1. (very winnable for town).

We lynch a mafia today, it becomes 4v2 (2 werewolves 1nk). we will move into 5man lylo with 2 wolves and 3 town. Not as attractive as a 3v1 situation but more solid

Lynching a wolf is the best option, even by your own description. Do you guys not see that too?

[BK201]

VOTE: Alchemist

[BK201]

chance to auto-win, chance at 3v1.
there is the chance we auto-lose but 5man lylo doesnt sound very promising either. In 2 other circumstances we have a better chance than the 5man lylo.

[BK201]

BK, there's something I don't understand about your reasoning. why does wolf-alchemist prefer to lynch jackal and NK someone else? Why couldn't he just...lynch someone else and NK Jackal? I don't see how it makes any difference whatsoever.

b/c the lynch is something he has to appear to be helping town with, and using the flawed monk logic was apparently (part of) his strategy. where as the NK obviously much easier to do, thus why he would want to spend his NK elsewhere if he can get the monk lynched.

[BK201]

Not sure, but I think its safe to say he's not a wolf. Don't see why you two would bus right here.

[BK201]

Vote: Lane

Isn't it 50/50 he's scum?

Monks and masons have the same chance of being scum as anyone else in the game.

[BK201]

you were right about jackal afterwords, but that was your logic for voting.

[BK201]

pedit: its the truth? I dont see your big hangup. that wasn't my "logic" at all. i had a scumread on lane since day 1. I was trying to reinspire interest on him. my logic for voting was his his semantic/sentence structure read "HEY LOOK AT ME IM NOOBSCUM AS FUCK"

your vote was 540, your first "NOOBSCUM" reply was 547. So like I said it was afterwords that you found a reason other than monk-hunting to lynch him.

[BK201]

I didn't ISO that far back, and just realized you're timeater, thought you just replaced him. You had prior suspicions of lane/jackal, but the monk-hunting was all that was presented with your vote, that plus the Whiskers NK is interesting. If this was a 1-scumteam game I would say you're probably town. I still think you're a werewolf.

[BK201]

@Max, you're basically right. and at this point I pretty much can't unsee alchemist as a wolf. the other 2 scum are probably in dazzy/papi/elmo.

[BK201]

if scum aim to kill town instead of each other it can easily result in a scum-draw, which is against their win-con technically.

[BK201]

I didn't run the numbers, I thought there would be one more day for town. Killed CC to further frame Dazzy, planned on lynching alchemist and NKing the other wolf.

[BK201]

mafia QT
http://www.quicktopic.com/47/H/eacchkJQy2Yn

[BK201]

Your modding was good. The end-game flavor text was really nice.

[BK201]

I prefer 2 day night phases too.

[BK201]

I thought Maxwell was town tbh. Alchemist was obv-wolf though.

[BK201]

I think I just figured out one of the scum teams.

Alchemist is scum for leaping on Jackal for being a Monk. Guess who wants Monks dead? Werewolves do. B/c Monks 100% can not be Werewolves, so once the other team is wiped out, the Monk(s) would then be confirmed town.

But what really made me notice this was the fact that Whiskers was killed by Werewolves! I didn't think about it until a moment ago but why the hell was Whiskers killed? He had 3 or 4 votes on him all day. They obviously killed him b/c he was a Monk. Alchemist wants to get Jackal lynched so they can spend their NK somewhere else xD

Interestingly enough this Monk focus is also the attempted counter-wagon to his partner Papi-Bear. If not well, there's another scumteam, but the counter-wagon makes more sense.

With this pathetic activity I won't bother starting a new wagon, but keep this in mind for tomorrow.

@ wolves, Was this post pretty accurate?

[BK201]

I think what I thought was the game would still go on if it was 2 wolves 1 mafia 1 town. If I had not been a dummy I would have killed you, but I was preoccupied with just getting you lynched tomorrow for all the stuff I said + the quickhammer on papi.

[BK201]

why did you guys kill Whiskers then?

[BK201]

surprised nobody called me as mafia after lane/jackal surrendered.

[BK201]

Lol forgot the masons mattered. Good call then.

[BK201]

I thought it was a good game, wish my partner didn't surrender b/c he wasn't even close to being lynched though.

[BK201]

I was seriously going to get Alchemist lynched haha. (at least in my mind)
Its all good though, learned a lot this game.