Open 432: Robo's PYP (Game Over)

[absta101]

VOTE: Slandaar
For not voting anyone.

[absta101]

So we learn more about what kind of motivations you have. Not voting denies us that information.

[absta101]

So we learn more about what kind of motivations you have. Not voting denies us that information.

So, your motivations are to vote conf town?

What is more useful, my first post or a 'I vote x because lolz' Which shows motivation more clearly?

1. I vote people I find suspicious.
2. I believe that in general a post containing a vote is more useful in finding out about what the person is after. Though I won't deny that your post has somehow achieved the same purpose.

Let me ask you something before I elaborate. What was the purpose behind your first post?

[absta101]

Absta do you agree I am conf town because I posted first in thread?

If you do not understand why I made my post, why did you vote me for not voting and not in relation to my reasoning?

1. No.
2. I need an actual answer to my question.

[absta101]

In fact it does matter. Your answer will influence my decision to either keep my vote or remove it. I'll leave this conversation at that until I get your answer.

[absta101]

So, why do you need me to explain anything for you to consider unvoting?

In the off chance that you were actually being serious about being conf town because you were first. After reviewing the setup, being first would most likely suggest the opposite alignment.
I was suspicious of you because you

were

the first.

Anyway, you seem very genuine so far.

unvote

Likewise.
VOTE: Shamrock

[absta101]

@James

You certainly seemed like you were trying hard to make something out of nothing

It's the first 2 pages, of course i'm going to exaggerate.

Not to mention how you initially voted Slandaar because he didn't make a vote. Now you unvote him for reasons totally unrelated...

I voted him for:
1. Not voting because I thought (not voting) would prolong our time in the RVS stage.
Then after reviewing the setup...

2. The opposite of what he said in his first post seemed more likely therefore making me slightly suspicious.
--
Now taking into account that his post lead us out of RVS anyway, my reason no. 1 doesn't hold up.
----

@Star

So you don't find posts without votes useful?

This question...
I do find them useful. Just because I found votes "more useful" doesn't mean I find posts without them useless.
Events have proven me wrong in that a post with no vote can be just as effective.

How can he be confirmed town with no actions to prove that he actually is confirmed town?

I learn all my tells from the games i've played, I guess you can call me naive. Code didn't exactly help.
----

@Everyone

Noraa seemed scummy due to the Ate but i've changed my mind after reading her latest post.

You can now continue gossiping over how much of a silly woman I am.

Yeah, this is projection which tells me that she's a bit insecure (aren't we all). This explains why she seemed upset after people started looking her way. It also strongly indicates that she is being genuine and therefore town.
Noraa has became an easy target for scum. I'll have to look at the two voting her but i'm sure there's at least one scum in them. Scum would definitely take advantage of her personality type.

Sciggat needs to be more involved. It seems like he's taken the back seat after he unvoted Slandar which is scummy. I realise he isn't the only one, Code needs to gtf in here as well. Hell, some people haven't even posted once

(can we get some prods/replacements out please)

.
The difference is that Sciggat

is

here and not posting content or scumhunting.

Shamrock I need you to give an opinion of the first page, specifically the "main events".

Rach you haven't given us anything. Stop using Elmo as an excuse.
----

@Noraa

There's no need to replace out. Just stick by what you feel and you'll be alright.

[absta101]

@Scigatt

if she is scum, I'd guess Slandaar or Starbuck as one of her partners.

Why Slandaar?
----

@Monthy

Whether it's scum behaviour to draw us away from a different conflict or an

over emotional town

, I don't know

I agree with the general idea of the bolded.

[absta101]

@Scigatt

So you'd have her stay in this game in her current state? Where scum could take advantage of her?

1. I believe scum won't take advantage of her anymore. Psychology has basically proven her town.
Ate is either genuine (town) or faked (scum). I've explained why the former is more likely.
2. If she wants to improve she's going to have to hold off on quitting.

if she is scum, I'd guess Slandaar or Starbuck as one of her partners.

This is something i'm going to remember for the future. Right now it's a null tell at best but generally I find naming scum teams like this is scummy. It sends town in directions that make little sense.
IGMEOY.
----

@Sawyer

What about the set up makes him being town less likely?

Considering his post got us out of RVS almost immediately (Shamrock being the only one to stay in it) my earlier suspicion doesn't hold up. If I have to explain, I will, but I don't think it's relevant.

His initial post confirms nothing one way or the other and there's nothing to base any assumption off of.

Okay, maybe it is relevant for me to explain.
After I reviewed the setup I came to a conclusion that scum are more likely to post within the first group of people. If you look back to page 1, the Mod tells us that scum are active day zero. This indicates that they would be ready to play before any of us townies were (if that makes sense). I believe it's likely that at least two scum (if not all) are in first two pages of this game.
Assuming Noraa is town, there is a high density of scum within Slandaar, Scigatt, Code, me, Shamrock... I just stumbled across post #13.
In post #13 the Mod sent out a mass prod on the rest of the players. I highly doubt scum would need a prod, they've been active before this game openly started.

This theory is kinda crazy. Hopefully some of the ideas make sense.

[absta101]

Slandaar check out Open 408 I screwed up and forgot that there were 3 scum instead of 2, and I messed up on the count for L-1 because I was mainly in Newbie games at that point. (Rach half) Also, if you want to see how I did as scum in this same set up check out Open 397 which was modded by Elmo, and Glow, T and P, and I were the scum. Also, 2/13 chance of being scum instead of 3/13 chance still sounds to me as a mixup by a townie not by a scum.

Way to avoid my question though Slandaar.....

This is getting pretty stupid now. You've yet to do any scumhunting. You're the second most scummy player.

[absta101]

Shamrock why are you voting me exactly?

[absta101]

@Elmo

Little more vocal here then you got in 430.

Your vote here is very opportunistic. You're attacking me for a null tell.
A different alignment is not the only possible cause for a different playstyle. Factors like your role and how interested you are in the game play an equally large part. The fact that you only "assumed" a different alignment makes you look desperate to pin me as scum.

Also:
1. Go check my other games, i'm almost always the most active.
2. I replaced into 430 for the sole purpose of helping the Mod out, he needed quite a few replacements. I did NOT join it because of the setup.

And even then My votes torn between you and Noraaa right now.

Unless you disagree with what's been said about Noraa-town (why haven't you mentioned this?), your accusation against her is evidence of you not thoroughly reading the game. This means it's possible that you're scum and that you still find her to be an easy target which fits your profile of an opportunistic scum.

VOTE: Panda
Panda is definitely scum.

[absta101]

(inb4youshoutOMGUS)

[absta101]

@Panda

HA! Funny there. Really I was making an observation. Did I read Noraaa's wall of joy no. I skimmed it.

You wanted to vote Noraa even though you haven't read her posts properly. If you actually had any incentive to find scum you would have at least asked us why we think she is "town" to see if you disagree or not.

Your an idiot if you think I would make my vote that fucking obvious 4 pages in.

You're an idiot if you think this kind of defence will cover up your mistakes. (WIFOM...)

I have a very small list of town/scum atm. You already know what side your on.

That makes you look even more scummy from my perspective. I know i'm town for a fact and I have a town read on Noraa. The top of your list is me/Noraa...
Who else is on your list?

Is this why you're defending Noraaa? Buddying already 4 pages in?

Okay, what could (and probably would) have happened had I not defended her. She would have either replaced out or gotten lynched even though she's obv town.
Now, because I defended her with (IMO) sufficient evidence to prove her town she will draw the NK thus fulfilling her wish of not being part of the game which increases her usefulness. She also narrows down the scum pool without getting lynched making it easier to find scum D1. I can see why she's still a target for scum.

So do you want to prove me wrong here then?

Just go check my finished town games.
Open 411, Newbie 1225 (first game), etc.
Dark used that to suggest I was SK. I turned out to be town. How does it suggest i'm an anti-role this game?

My vote will stay on you Panda.
----

@Starbuck

How many games has that been?

I've played quite a few. Do you want a specific count or something? (It's hard to remember them all.)

1. Why would you think this?

I only knew of pressure waggons as a way to get out of the RVS. Not voting slows that process down.

2. why did it make you slightly suspicious?

"2. The opposite of what he said in his first post seemed more likely"

I've explained it to Sawyer in detail.

You're coming off as a bit paranoid/desperate to me.

[absta101]

@Starbuck

How so?

Most of your questions seem forced and pointless.

I'm curious as to what you have learned.

That's too much work, i'm not going to try to remember everything.
Look at it this way. Everything I display here represents what i've learned.

And now, what do you think?

Dude...
Now I think that posts without votes are just as useful.

Why would "pressure wagons" be the only way to get out of RVS?

Because that's all I knew.

These questions are pointless. From now i'm only going to answer questions that are actually important.
----

@Panda

Elmo is playing very consistently for Elmo and well every game someone thinks he is scum for it.

I think Elmo used this excuse in my most recent game when he was SK. This doesn't convince me he's town for obvious reasons.
Rach your play here looks a lot like your scum play. You always stay in the background, taking part in little to no scumhunting.
----

@Everyone

Noraa stop defending yourself and scumhunt. You're starting too make me question my read on you.

Kyle what do you think of everyone else?

[absta101]

Okay seriously, this is the last time i'm talking for Noraa. Even after I help her (and us) out she still doesn't participate in anything other than talking about herself. I'm moving her down to a null-leaning town read.
----

Starbuck

is now one of my strong scum reads. (After evaluation)

1.

Noraa is a somewhat strong town read to her yet she's still voting her.
She says that she was voting for pressure and that she really finds Noraa to be town (post #69) which to me is total bs. The beginnings of post #58 and especially post #68 were obviously trying to convince everyone that Noraa is scum.
Starbuck would have unvoted in post #72 if she was voting for pressure.

2.

Her questions to me are way awkward and forced generally leading in no direction that could determine my alignment.

3.

When reading her ISO I noticed that her posts have way less content when she's attempting to "scumhunt" than when she's arguing with Noraa.

If I wasn't voting Panda right now i'd be voting her.
----

@Nat

I might be missing something though, because I don't understand what her genuineness has to do with her alignment. Can someone (besides noraa) explain why scum have to fake whatever she is angry about?

In terms of Ate scum almost always fake it.
Most of you are accusing her of being scum because she reacted strongly for something so little. I agree that that could be a sign of scum getting frightened or upset when people get too close. However, i've explained my theory (with evidence) of why she acted out like that and frankly I don't want to repeat myself.

What's your opinion on the theory of there being a large scum density in the first couple of pages?

[absta101]

Wow, you guys posted a lot.
I'll do this in two parts, I have to run.

Part 1

@Starbuck

Why are my questions pointless? I'm wondering if you have grown as a player

You're asking me questions that have nothing to do with finding out my alignment. This is one of the reasons I find you scummy.

I have a hard time believing that given how many games that you may have played that the only way you've known how to get out of RVS are pressure votes.

There's two ways, pressure votes and whatever Slandaar did.
What else is there that you think I should know?

How are you going to deem which questions are "actually important"?

Experience and logic.

That's not a particularly town attitude.

Yes it is. I'm pointing out that your questions aren't leading anywhere productive.

I kept my vote on her until she came back and I had a chance to read her new posts. I posted before I went to class last night (which started at 5 and ended around 8:45) and after class, I went directly to karaoke. Now, I'm working on catching up on what I missed.

1. Why? You acknowledged in post #72 that your "pressure vote" was useless at that point.
2. Nice attempt at a defence, seems legit.
--

Examples

First off massive appeals to emotion in those last three posts from noraaa. Holy hell.

This is post #58.
You clearly weren't talking to Noraa with this sentence. It definitely looks like you're trying to convince people to find your "town read" scummy.

So I've read the massive post by noraaa and for the sake of my own sanity, I'm not going to dissect that one, but I do have some replies... She refuses to give examples and show what she talking about because she didn't name names in the first place.

This is post #69.
This one isn't as bad as #58 but you're still talking in a manner that attempts to convince everyone that Noraa is scummy.
--

Also, noraaa's situation was something that I wanted to investigate and for the record, who else did investigate it?

I don't fully undestand what you're asking me here.
----

@Kyle

The case against Panda is flawed simply because it's weak.

It isn't weak at all.
Panda has shown opportunism amongst other things Slandaar brings up.

As for noraaa, you expect me to dismiss her because she's a "silly woman"?

Yes! Her Ate is fully explained by her projection (a defence mechanism) so basically all you have on her is the lack of scumhunting. I'll point you over to Panda.
----
Part 2 later...

[absta101]

Part 2

Good to see some fresh replacements.

@Nat

I'm disappointed in your lack of aggressiveness. It indicates a change in your role this game.
+Town points to Code for spotting this. sloppy on my part tbh, we were all in the same game (Code, Dark, Nat, Elmo), I should've noticed.
----

@Starbuck

Votes can be used for pressure purposes as well.

Generally you don't pressure your town reads unless you're hoping they make a mistake.

I didn't start really feeling that she could be town until later on.

You said she was a town read > mentioned that your pressure attempt was kinda useless > still kept your vote on her. I'll ask again, why didn't you unvote in post #72?

You can't automatically jump to her being town. I feel that she is town, but that doesn't mean that her reaction didn't come from scum either.

When someone displays that they are genuine subconsciously, I will definitely assume town. Unless you think Noraa faked insecurity?

To deny or refuse to answer is scummy.

How is it? You're a scum read to me. Why should I help you convince everyone that you're scumhunting?
Your reasons for voting me are weak and scummy. I've also noticed how easily threatened you are, that's not an attribute that town has.

Because, as I said, it was staying there (useless or not) until she came back with answers.

BUT YOUR VOTE SHOULDN'T BE ON YOUR TOWN READS!

She could've have answered without the extra pressure from you.

Why do you lean towards scummy rather than anti-town?

Because you're clearly not anti-town. Noraa is anti-town.

Who else took the time to go through her posts thoroughly and investigate it? Quite a number of people expressed that they would have nothing to do with her walls, so I bit the bullet and went through it all to see just what she was talking about.

Is that supposed to mean you're town. She was an easy target, your devoted attention to her doesn't convince me that you're town at all.
I've read all her posts hence my conclusive town read on her. Does this convince you i'm town?
----

@Scigatt

Can you quote Shamrock when you reply to him next time, it makes it easier to read.
----

@Code

Absta your vote on Shamrock 30 - why?

He didn't comment on the "main discussion" which suggested he wanted to keep to himself.

Ryan says he didn't see the PM

Who's Ryan?
--
Why did you move from Panda?
----

@Panda

I also would be happy to provide links showing this is typical of Elmo's play as town. As well as mine.

Thank you for removing any suspicions I had that you could be town. People who go out of their way to say that they're the "good guys" usually aren't.

I think Elmo indicated his displeasure with it already in previous posts. He usually gets most irritated when he sees that town is on the wrong path when he is town. Then the snarky side comes out in him.

Nice defence.

Oh and how about we not lynch the hydra today? I'm sure we can throw rocks and hit more scum that way

You're nowhere close to being useful. You haven't even said anything to me since your shitty vote.
----

@Everyone

I prefer a Panda lynch but i'm not against a Monty lynch though he hasn't posted enough yet so it's effectively a PL. Shamrock I will look closer at Scigatt, I think your points on him were decent.

Mod VC please.

[absta101]

Quick reply:

@Dark

@absta

: Is there anything about this game that you feels differs from the other games you're playing or have played, based on your perspective?

This is role fishing. Code, Elmo, Nat, you see this right?
You get to be one of my slight scum reads.

[absta101]

@Starbuck

He doesn't deem it important enough to answer.

I'm not going to help scum.
Your trying to turn this (which is scummy on Dark's part) on me which is stupidly scummy.
----

@Dark

If by role fishing you mean scum hunting, then yes, you are absolutely right.

Role fishing supports the exact opposite alignment, something you seem to be doing just fine.

Now, this is a radically different playing style. He comes in as a replacement and BOOM; long constructive posts about why certain people are scum.

Ehh, no. I got caught on my first full day. If anyone reads my ISO there, they will see that my play is very different. Nice try though.

Also, he seems incredibly focussed on getting support in the game.
For example, the most recent example when I asked him the question recently, see above. His answer was simply:
"This is role fishing. Code, Elmo, Nat, you see this right?"

Think about why I asked them three only.
Hint: They know that you know my town play so they'll see that you're role fishing. Why else would I ask Elmo, he "thinks" i'm scum.

I wanted to see how absta reacted to a question to which the answer could show whether he was scum or not. I don't see why you think that's a bad thing?

Because the answer would either suggest i'm a PR or narrow down the "PR pool" for scum.

We'll see how it plays out. For now my vote stays.

The only way it could "play out" is if I claim or get lynched. That's why this sentence of yours is scummy as it gives you an excuse to keep your vote just for the sake of it.
----

@Brandi

Which is anti-town at best.
Scumplay at worst.

I disagree. Scum are after the town PRs. Role fishing is a viable tactic.
----

@Panda

Slaandar has done nothing since the last post about setup speculation...Pretty funny isn't it?

Good point.
Obviosly Slaandar is not a town read anymore.
--
Elmo that was a terrible reaction to Shamrock...

Brandi yes my other head gets rather rough around the edges when he plays mafia.

Nice defence Rach.
----

@Code

Monty needs to die.

You said you was voting for pressure. Would you seriously lynch him if he doesn't post more?
----

@Sawyer

I'm pretty torn between Panda and BK (Scigatt), but given that BK has nothing more to say about Scigatts case, I'll be voting based off what Scigatt left us with, which was an unsatisfying defense.

How would you expect BK to answer for Scigatt?

[absta101]

Quick reply:
The Panda waggon is dangerously low.

@Slaandar
You're going to have to elaborate.

[absta101]

@Slandaar

So you admit that you are indeed role fishing.

I wanted to see how absta reacted to a question to which the answer could show whether he was scum or not. I don't see why you think that's a bad thing?

This isn't scum hunting. The only scum game i've got is completely different to my play here. The only thing he could "find out" is if i'm VT or not which is rolefishing.
----

@Elmo

>_> I was going to get to this but Ive been falling asleep a lot lately..And I have a big matter to attend to

That's why you're a hydra.
----

@Nat

You asked why Noraa is town, I told you. Why are you still trying to lynch her? What makes her SO scummy?

[absta101]

@Slandaar

We could be here all day arguing our different opinions on Dark so i'll give him the benefit of the doubt.
You're plan concerning Panda is sound.
UNVOTE:

[absta101]

Actually shouldn't Panda claim if he's going to get vigged?

[absta101]

@Panda

Who are your scum reads?

[absta101]

PS. If you think I'm scum just go ahead and lynch me out of this game. Or let the vig off me during the night.

Possible slip? Kind of sounds like he knows there's a Vig...

*Looks at set up again*

Yeah, I dont think "insider information" is possible unless you're either Scum or cheating...

This is terrible and vote worthy.
VOTE: Sawyer
If you were town you would have voted him right there.

Sawyer calls Panda scum but does not vote him. Why?
Panda calls Starbuck scum for not voting but ignores Sawyer. Why?

And then we get post #335, attacking someone who voted Panda. This makes little sense from a town perspective considering you called Panda scum (unless you thought Brandi was bussing him which you didn't state.)

No, I don't think he should. If he's scum he'd have way to many ways to get out of being lynched/NKed. And he actually insisted a Vig kill him.
Hopefully he wouldn't do that if he were a PR.

Panda has to claim before we vig him.
1. Panda asked for the vig to kill him as a reaction test so you can't say he isn't a PR.
2. You show uncertainty with the word "hopefully" yet you still want him vigged. If you wanted to keep the PRs alive you would not risk having him not claim.

Scum motivation:

If Panda is a PR he will likely not die after claiming so having him not claim and vigged is more advantageous to scum.

In the exact same post:

I disagree. I'd say he actually helped town given the reactions he got (I agree with all of his reads on those posts BTW).

1. You disagree that what Panda did was scummy yet you still want him vigged.
2. You agree with Panda's read on Starbuck which means you think you're scum yourself. You did exactly what Starbuck did.

Notes:

- It's obvious that Sawyer is planning to get two mislynches. One from Panda and one from Brandi.
- Sawyer only agrees with Panda's reads because he, for unknown reasons, called him town for post #315. Point 2 proves that he wasn't paying attention to the other reads.
- Sawyer still hasn't voted Panda or Brandi even though he was the first to accuse them both. He instead leaves his sheep vote on BK, a case made by Shamrock.

I see no reason for that unless you can point out a fallacy in what Slandaar proposed.

What Slandaar proposed could get a PR killed with no resistance if Panda doesn't claim. Something Slandaar did not demand.

Slandaars right about Brandi's case. It's only valid if there is a Vig and Pandas town.

Thus Brandi is scum, why are you STILL not voting her.

[absta101]

I didn't call him scum.

post #272.

2. It's mafia. People tend to be uncertain in a game like this.

1. In every game i've played in, an organised death never goes through without a claim.
2. I said "If you wanted to keep the PRs alive you would not risk having him not claim."
What's your response?

1. What he did could've been a mistake by scum or a gambit by town. It's impossible to know and that's the most effective way to find out.

1. You would vig a null read?
2. Obviously we don't fucking know for sure, which do you believe?

2. Starbucks wording made the post scummy.

No. Her post is basically the same as yours in terms of how scummy it is.

I'm voting BK, but I want to mislynch Panda and Brandi? Misrep #4 and you're also implying that you know they will be mislynches.

- You want Panda vigged.
- "My vote is on who I think is mostly likely to be scum. Brandi is certainly moving on up though."
Your leaving yourself open to vote Brandi.

Why they're mislynches:

1. I had a town read on Noraa AKA Brandi.
2. Your a scum read.
3. My scum read doesn't want Panda to claim. If Panda was scum you would let him claim, it could draw out a PR or we could believe him.

Yeah. A sheep vote and a case made by Shamrock. Never mind the fact that I was investigating Scigatt since before Shamrock even began his own line of questioning. Add to that how Shamrock also referenced my own questioning in his case.

My bad. I confused Scigaat with Shamrock in the brackets. I thought you was giving credit to Shamrock. This quote didn't help:
"but given that BK has nothing more to say about Scigatts case".
*It's Shamrock's case on scigatt.

The only claim he should make is if he's an IC. That's the only claim that would matter. If he's anything else, PR or otherwise, he should keep it to himself.

1. Why should he keep it to himself?
2. Why didn't you say this before?

[absta101]

Quick reply:

In, 328, Absta has a pretty poor reason for unvoting. What does the differing opinions with ONE player have to do with anything? Giving him the benefit of the doubt- sounds like something scum would say to try and appear reasonable.

I unvoted Panda not Dark. I haven't voted Dark at all this game.

[absta101]

^@DeasVail

[absta101]

Absta: Why hasn't your theory about scum posting earlier at the start been influencing your reads?

Who says it hasn't?

[absta101]

@Sawyer

1. This isn't "every game".

I don't think you see this from a town POV. Killing a possible PR without a claim is unacceptable.

2. I'd guess he's town. But other people don't agree and I understand why, so him getting vigged would be the best thing if possible.

The only people who are okay with killing town are scum. Considering he's your town read, you fit the profile.

Can you post your reads on everyone please. I've got an alternate theory concerning you.
----

@Everyone

- Is there anyone other than Sawyer that's okay with killing Panda without a claim?
I strongly suggest we force a claim from him.
----

@Starbuck

- About that catch-up...

[absta101]

You can't push for a lynch on someone without providing a case of your own that doesn't parrot what someone else said without being viewed as scummy. We have 19 pages of information. There's plenty to make a case out of, if you tried.

Not true. Again, you're looking scummy.

[absta101]

Again, you're looking scummy.

When it comes to you, when am I not? I thought you were ignoring me.

I don't ignore anyone.
Is there any questions I haven't answered from you?

[absta101]

-Probably the most scummy thing: The way he responds to Absta's suspicion despite saying things like, "This post was almost not even worth responding to..." at the start of 379 seem like scum trying to sound like they don't really care when they actually do.

That doesn't count because i've done it this game as well. As long as he answers the questions I don't care.

[absta101]

@Starbuck

- I answered all your questions. I don't see your problem.
For the record, Sawyer agreed about what I said about your questions.

Also can you quote what you're referring to.
----

@Deas

I don't remember where I said it. I had a look through my ISO but I couldn't find it.

[absta101]

Thanks Sawyer. My read on you will be determined later.
----

@BK

- Your vote is where it is simply for survival. My case on Sawyer was made awhile ago yet you only supported it as soon as Shamrock voted you. Explain:
- Why Sawyer

suddenly

became the best lynch.
- Why you dropped him for your strongest scum read Deas considering they were both on two votes.
- Why you were okay with joining the waggon that your strongest scum read was on.
VOTE: BK

[absta101]

1. I know you're wrong.
2. I know that the idea of that scum team is new and that you have little confidence in it.

[absta101]

Quick reply:

I think it's evident that Starbuck is in deep confirmation bias.

[absta101]

@Deas

- Look to post #503 for the quotes I was referring to.

@Starbuck

- Thanks for the quotes.
----

@Everyone

-

There's 4 people that are suspicious:

Panda

- Post #417 is scummy WIFOM. It implies that "if there's a JK, I can't be scum"

Brandi

- Post #415 shows scum WIFOM. It's backed up by the fact that her reaction to the JK claim is somewhat late and weak.
- Post #520 was sent 6 minutes after post #519. Does it really take 6 mins to quote the claim and type "Jesus christ"? The pause can be explained by Brandi trying to come up with a "suitable reaction".
- Post #295 shows that you don't think Nat is scum so why are you voting her now? AFAIK nothings changed.

Slandaar

- Votes BK for unknown reasons. Why did you vote him?
- Unvotes BK (His strongest scum read) after a PR claim that has the lowest chance of being CCd.
Now in my case I have an actual clear reason why BK is most likely town. What's yours?

Natalie

- Lack of aggression compared to her town games.
- For someone who's been tunnelling all day you moved your vote over to BK quite easily.
--
My vote goes down after the explanations.
UNVOTE:
----
I'm leaning town on BK because his claim explains his want for survival.
His claim could be scum wanting to put heavy suspicion on Brandi and Panda. Sawyer explains this in more detail.

I've got another interesting theory that i'll share tomorrow if Brandi turns out to be town (Assuming BK gets Nkd).

[absta101]

Quick reply:

Guys we'll discuss BK's claim tomorrow. I'm certain that tomorrow I can narrow down the scum suspects further.

[absta101]

IMO
if BK is legit
narrow down the playerlist
(BEFORE REPLACEMENTS- OBV)
and pick out the players that are noob/dumb enough to accept a jailkeeper

This is why I wanted to narrow it down. Your way doesn't work and it's scummy.
- How the fuck can you clear everyone that replaced in, their slot could still have been the one to choose JK.
----

@BK

How confident are you of your tell?

[absta101]

@BK

- You have my support.
VOTE: Nat

[absta101]

My vote on Nat is just sheeping BK. My vote on Panda is way more productive.

Vote: Panda

@Panda

- All my previous points still stand. Add the fact that you and Brandi mentioned JK before anyone else and you're looking more scummy than ever.

[absta101]

@Slandaar

@Panda

- All my previous points still stand. Add the fact that you and Brandi mentioned JK before anyone else and you're looking more scummy than ever.

Trying to justify his vote on Panda to Panda.

I feel it

Absta/Natalie scumteam

This is what happens when you attempt to find the scum team instead of just one at a time. It turns into something that isn't even about looking for scum, causing you to get deep in confirmation bias. You're just trying to boost your own ego by proving to everyone that you can catch all the scum at once.

There's something that doesn't make much sense from a town perspective on your part. If you think i'm scum, considering the unlimited time we have until a replacement joins, why are you not securing my lynch? absta scum is in a way more dangerous position (to town) than scum Nat.

I had a look through your ISO, didn't find much on Nat other than the scum team "guesses" yet you want her lynched. I noticed you've set it up so that if Nat flips scum I look scummy as fuck due to your scum team "guess" being more "likely".
Now why would scum Slandaar want my death? That can be explained by the meta work provided by Dark. (Thanks Dark. /sarcsm). Dark provided evidence that suggests i'm not a VT in this game.

A Natalie flip will be fruitful. But before that, Slandaar explain why i'm scum.
--

I honestly think this is black and white

IF Panda is scum there is a JK
Otherwise he is town

I really don't see Pandascum with no JK in the setup.

Fixed for truth.
----

@Panda

I was just reading thru my iso and Absta's does anyone notice he really only votes my slot? And pretty much acts like he has other suspects but seems to "afraid" to move his vote so "if" they flip

scum

1. That's complete bullshit. I've voted you, Sawyer, BK and close to voting Starbuck.
2. You've voted me and Shamrock. Both votes looking opportunistic.
3. Afraid they flip scum? Don't you mean town? You can't call me scum and say i'm afraid my suspects will flip scum.
- Firstly, I'd know what they'll flip.
- Second, scum have to worry about the consequences of mislynching town. If they lynch their partner nobody will be upset.
----

@Everyone

TL:DR
Slandaar's actions suggests he knows Natalie's alignment.
Panda is scum that has provided:
- Nothing of use.
- Opportunistic votes.
- Scummy WIFOM.
- etc.

[absta101]

@Slandaar

that was one majorly scummy softclaim to try and defend yourself.

Not a softclaim. I was showing scum incentive on your part quite clearly with "Why would scum Slandaar do this?". Your desperation is becoming more apparent.

You are scum because you are pretending to not understand why I think you are scum.

Wow, this is so pathetic.
1. This implies that i've only just turned into a scum read to you in which case explain post #492 (ISO post #32)
2. Answer my question. Why do you think i'm scum?

[absta101]

Maybe I've been misunderstood.

If I find a replacement for Kyle within the game day, I'll give an extension. I will simply replace overnight if I don't get one by deadline.

Dude.
----
VOTE: Nat
Lynch it please.

[absta101]

UNVOTE:
Not finished with Slandaar yet.
----

@Slandaar

Why does Sland want to lynch Natalie over Me?

I was answering the obvious question people would ask.

'Scum Sland would want to lynch me because he would think I am a PR but he wants to lynch Natalie over me!'

Wtf is this?
Stop trying to simplify what i'm saying, just respond.

See for me to be scum wanting to lynch Absta, this argument only makes sense if I were actually trying to lynch him yet Absta himself uses the argument that I am trying to lynch Natalie over him as a scumtell.

1. If Nat flips scum you get massive town cred and I look very scummy because of your prediction. That's when you lynch me.
2. I've never called it a scumtell.

How can both trying to lynch Absta and trying to lynch someone over Absta be a scumtell?

Twisting what I say doesn't help.
1. Setting up lynches is scummy and that's what you're doing.
2. Lynching Nat, who's your partner in this case, is all a part of getting me lynched and you town cred.

[absta101]

VOTE: Natalie

[absta101]

Quick reply:

Things of interest:
- BK surviving.
- The Vig not killing Panda.
- Slandaar dying.
- etc.

Sorry gotta run.

[absta101]

Sorry people, school's started. I'll try my best to post but if my activity sucks i'll replace out.

[absta101]

@Starbuck

&

@DV

What do you think of this?

Sawyer, I care enough for the basis of scum-hunting, but I don't care to convince you of anything- because I don't think you are town and I don't think you are worth the effort.

----

@Sawyer

My alternate theory about you was wrong therefore you're back to being an option for me.
Btw, I still want an answer to why you were okay with killing Panda without a claim.
----

@Everyone

- If anything, Brandi looks worse coming out of that exchange.
I'm very interested in what Starbuck will say.

[absta101]

@Brandi

IMO everyone that was on the Nat wagon -was- town. Not confirmed, no, but certainly town-ish.

This doesn't seem like it's coming from town. There's also post #691 which seems forced.
Considering how awkward your reaction to the JK claim was and how you initially voted Nat with no apparent reason makes you a suspect.
The Nat lynch was happening, your effort to try to rule out bussing is terrible and suspicious.

Correct me if i'm wrong.
- You gave Nat a VI read for tunnelling you.
- BK calls Nat scum for tunnelling.
- You sheep BK, a JK claim that's "unbelievable", in lynching Nat for tunnelling.
----

@Panda

Both you and Brandi mentioned a JK before one claimed. Of course you have a "town read" on her.

[absta101]

I'm in way too many goddamned games right now, seriously. I made a slight error in judgment when I signed up for so many at once.

I guess I don't really have any strong opinions one way or another, so I can just

vote: Sawyer

.

Both you and Shamrock are looking great. /sarcasm
----

@Brandi

- Your explanation is backed up with a pathetic excuse.
- You threaten to change your town read on me.
Keep going. You're doing great at convincing me you're town.

Please point me to where you explained yourself.

[absta101]

@Brandi

I wasn't threatening anything- I was merely stating a fact.

No you wasn't, you indirectly threatened to change your town read on me. That doesn't come from a town position.

But since you asked, once again- things I addressed that you ignored:

How is that an explanation?
Wow... I think that's probably the worst "explanation" i've seen ever. I didn't ignore it, I just didn't know you considered that to be an explanation worth sharing.

and another time you tried to blatantly misrepresent me and I corrected, but you ignored:

I misunderstood, that's all...
----

@Sawyer

The alternate theory was that you were the Vig and that Panda wouldn't have died without a claim.
I expect Vigs to kill their strongest scum reads but w/e.
----

@Shamrock

Wtf? Brandi became "progressively more scummy toward the end of Day 1"? Brandi joined BK in starting a wagon on scum at the end of D1.

That's 2 now who've tried to promote the idea that scum didn't buss Nat.
This quote is terrible and looks like a fake reaction.

I think a Sawyer scumflip would indeed be very damning to absta. However, after looking over absta's ISO, he's already looking pretty scummy on his own. First he starts voting (busing) Natalie when he sees the wagon building on her, but he doesn't give reasoning, he's just "sheeping BK".

1. Why is a Sawyer scum flip bad for me?
2. I look scummy for "joining BK in starting a waggon on scum at the end of D1". Good to know.
3. You're scummy for saying you were willing to lynch Nat but never actually voting her.

he uses a weak excuse to take his vote off his partner and put it on a town target instead.

Why was that a weak excuse?
--
After a look through Shamrock's ISO, specifically the parts near the end of D1 through D2, i've noticed a few scummy things:
- Hard push on Panda, calling him obvscum yet a complete turnaround today. Shamrock's "belief" was that Panda and Nat were a team.
- Trying to put suspicion on me for voting Nat whilst calling Brandi town for doing the exact same thing.
- Post #628 is an obvious fake reaction.

He said he was waiting for a claim, why would he have lynched without one?
Wasn't one of my main arguments against Sawyer scum that he wanted Panda killed without a claim?

VOTE: Shamrock
You're going to get lynched today for sure.
----
I migh do a part 2 soon.

[absta101]

More support on the Shamrock waggon please.

[absta101]

The speed at which my waggon developed is highly suspicious. Wtf was that?

I'll reply fully later.

[absta101]

I won't be claiming just yet. I highly doubt i'll be lynched today.
Waggons that build up that fast are nearly always on town.
----

@Starbuck

Because she told Sawyer that he's not worth the effort, like you told me that I'm not because you think I'm scum but haven't voted me once? And still aren't!

That's the best part! Your whole reaction to me was triggered by the fact that you thought I was voting you. Your whole suspicion on me is based on something

Brandi has also just recently done

, yet you don't find her scummy for it like you did me. How can you explain that? Your read on me is fake and you know it.

I think it comes down to whether or not she completely ignores him. In the case of you and me, I may think you can be scum but I'm not going to ignore you or refuse to answer any questions that you may have.

Are you implying that i've ignored you?
Why am I scum for just saying "i'm not going to answer anymore bs questions from scum" and Brandi still town for

actually ignoring someone's question(s)?

Now, absta, you were the one who was going on about how noraaa (now Brandi) was going to be an easy target for scum (Post 61). You sure have changed your tone about that slot.

You think that's a scum tell?
I'm well aware of what I said.
(Hint: Brandi =/= Noraa, in terms of personality)

And as I said on Day 1, town would not ignore anything, even from those they consider to be scummy.

Therefore Brandi is a scum read to you. Thank you.

We all know there is scum mixed in on Nat's lynch and that's what we are here to figure out. That blanket statement definitely has stuck in my craw.

Wtf do you mean with this? Is she scum, town or null for that statement?
----

@Shamrock

Absta's lack of response to my #771 (re: his waffling on busing Natalie) suggests to me that I am on the right track.

I probably just missed it. I'll look back and reply in a different post.
I don't know why you would need my response considering you were confident enough to put me on L-2. Anything I say probably won't change your mind.
----

@DV

Why did you wait until you thought it was relevant to explain your theory about scum posting first?

- I'll have to look back. I remember not feeling confident with that theory.
- Do you think revealing it when I thought it not to be relevant the better thing to do?

Q: How did your read on Starbuck change throughout Day 1?

My response to this will probably take awhile. I'll try to fit it in in my next post. Remind me if I forget.
----

@Panda

Anything else aside maybe Starbuck getting rope. I like it.

Can you rephrase this please.
You'd like a lynch of anyone but Starbuck? Why?
----
More votes on Shamrock!

[absta101]

SUP ABSTA

Nothing much other than scum manipulating town to lynch me. You?

[absta101]

Quick reply:

It'd be really cool for you to respond to my points against you too

I was going to... Your first and second points will be addressed later.

Your third point makes sense but unfortunately you're wrong. Nat has way more experience as scum than me (i've yet to play mafia), she would be coaching me were I her partner.
----

@DV

Absta's wagon picked up so fast (5 votes all within 6 posts), that I'm pretty sure he's probably town.

Oh yes, I forgot to say, but I'm pretty sure this has very little to do with alignment.

What makes you say this?

[absta101]

Part 2:

My promised responses.
----

@Shamrock

- I just looked at post #771. There's nothing there for me to respond to and it was aimed at DV not me.
I'll remind you that you're using your "interpretation of my behaviour" to conclude that i'm scum. Just because something might make sense from scum POV (your interpretation hardly does) doesn't mean it's actually from scum's POV.
----

@DV

- Starbuck was my second most strongest scum read whilst I was voting Panda. She became less important to me throughout the day when all the shit going on with Sawyer, Panda and BK started.
Also, I dislike bringing up old cases because it's hard to remember if the suspect's response was good enough.

Absta: I don't know what would've been better, but I thought town would bring it up whenever they thought to and not worry about whether it was relevant.

People always hold theories back. My theory, if everyone followed it, could have either won us the game or lost us the game (depending on if I was right/wrong). I was waiting for D2 had I lived.
----

@Reck

-

Point 1:

Look to my response to DV's question about my Starbuck read. (up there ^)
-

Point 2:

Null tell.
My defence to this will sound like WIFOM, i'd rather not confuse everyone. Unless you insist?
----

@Everyone

- Can someone tell me why Shamrock is town?

[absta101]

@DV

Why would you ask that? Do what you think is right.
----
I'll reply fully later.

[absta101]

This town...

Remind me if I miss anything.
----

@Shamrock

Please explain how my interpretation of your voting/unvoting Natalie does not make sense from scum POV.

I said it "hardly makes sense".
The Nat waggon was the only thing happening (i'm sure everyone knew that). I highly doubt scum would jump off and on the waggon.

I could just as easily argue that newb scum would stay on the waggon to avoid drawing attention to themselves and that what I did was therefore a town action. (i.e. your calling me scum for a null tell).
----
VOTE: DV

[absta101]

Panda what do you guys think of Sawyer

I think he be scum. Also why is Absta not dead?

~Elmo

If you turn out to be town, i'm never going to join a game with you ever again.

[absta101]

@DV

Why would you ask that? Do what you think is right.
----
I'll reply fully later.

Why should I do what I think is right if you're town?

Assuming that what you think is right, is voting me. There's a chance that I could be scum (from your POV), so doing what you think is right would be a town action.
- Town would not ask for other people to persuade them into voting someone because they know thet that would leave them vulnerable to scum manipulation.
- Scum would ask to be "persuaded" into voting someone if they felt uncomfortable just jumping on that person's waggon.

If that is the case, wouldn't your response be something along the lines of "I'm town. Don't vote for me."?

No. A response like that is pointless as it could come from both town or scum.
Personally, I believe that someone who says they're the "good guy" most likely aren't.

[absta101]

No. A response like that is pointless as it could come from both town or scum.

So does this mean that you are putting thought into whether your actions look particularly town or not?

Yes I am.
A good townie should try his best to not look scummy.
----

@BK

I've played with him once.

[absta101]

@Sawyer

- What happened to Panda's read on you/DV after you brought that up?

[absta101]

@Shamrock

You're probably the only one who wants to end the day prematurely. I still have questions that need to be answered by Sawyer and Panda.
Look back to Day 1.

[absta101]

VOTE: Sawyer

[absta101]

Wow wtf is wrong with you people?
You want to lynch me because I moved my vote?
----

@BK

I was waiting for the "please".
http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=22900
----

@Starbuck

After thinking about it some more, I'm not sure why I swayed away from absta.

Vote: absta101

L-1

After thinking about it? This is scummy.

[absta101]

Quick reply:

Absta have you ever been mislynched as town?
if so could you please provide some games where this has happened?

I don't think so other than one game. I normally live to the end.
I'll look for it.
----
Full response later.

[absta101]

What happened to all the other waggons?

[absta101]

This town is so fucked up and blind. DV (and maybe Brandi) are the only sane people here.
Pro tip: Get off my waggon.
----

@Starbuck

Something else that bothers me is that absta went all out whiteknighting the noraaa/Brandi slot on Day 1 when noraaa had her "breakdown". Brandi was all well and good to lynch him earlier today, but now, all of a sudden, he's a town read? Something is not right.

- Promoting these "associative tells" without a scum flip of me or Brandi is just your way of trying to make my lynch look even better. This is scummy.
- Why is my whiteknighting of Noraa suspicious? My reasoning was sound.
Again, trying to make my lynch look "good/informative".
--
Your jump on my waggon coupled with this is scummy and vote worthy.
VOTE: Starbuck
----

@Brandi

- I'm not avoiding anything. I was busy studying.
Support me on Starbuck waggon please.
----
Out of the 10 players alive, we've had three claims. One JK (BK), two VT (Brandi, Starbuck).
A lynch of Starbuck would be the best thing we could do today.

[absta101]

???????

What happened to your scumreads on me and DV?

1. Try putting yourself in my shoes. I don't have the time or the support to vote you.
2. My DV read was weak and my vote was for pressure. His reactions weren't scummy (as far as I can remember.)
*That rhymed slightly.

[absta101]

Vox support my waggon on Starbuck.

[absta101]

I'll be back around 4pm GMT time tomorrow. Don't lynch me while i'm away please.

[absta101]

@Brandi

- Here you go.
(The first game I got misslynched. It was a short 10 page game.)
----

@Starbuck

- I don't have time to debate now. Respond to my other point for now. The one where I said you're casting suspicion on me using a null tell.

[absta101]

So nothing I've done today has been scummy enough to be worth attacking, but I'm still a strong scumread for you regardless. Okayyyyyy........

What? Wtf are you talking about?

[absta101]

@Starbuck

- I still want that response.
--

I backed off earlier because I was concerned about the rush onto your lynch, but I never called you town or said that my suspicion diminished.

Your "concern" would suggest that your confidence on your read of me was lessened after I got put to L-1 so quickly. Your lack of confidence would explain why you "backed off" my waggon.

However, the defence you've brought up says the opposite. Apparently your suspicion/confidence was not affected. It doesn't make sense that you were concerned and your suspicion on me stayed the same at the same time. If your so called suspicion on me stayed the same, why would you ever get concerned of me getting lynched at any speed (You would be satisfied)?

The answer:
You know i'm town. saying that you're "concerned" about the speed (

whilst still staying on the waggon

) is a way of preparing for my pro-town flip.

[absta101]

@Starbuck

@Starbuck

- I don't have time to debate now. Respond to my other point for now. The one where I said you're casting suspicion on me using a null tell.

----

On top of noraaa's flip out, absta was white knighting her very very hard

Ha! LMFAO!
You're such a pathetic scum.
Buddying Noraa is a dumb theory. I stopped a very likely lynch of a "scummy" townie*. In a world where whiteknighting is anything but a null-tell, that would be evidence of confident scum at best.

Considering:
1. I've yet to play mafia.
2. I had heat early Day 1.
The chances of absta newb-scum stopping the Noraa lynch is 0.

*My read on Noraa early Day 1.

[absta101]

You can't keep leaning on the noob mafia excuse, absta. That in itself is scummy.

I'm glad you've realised your theory makes no sense.
--

Give us your defence. Stop stalling.

----

@Everyone

For those who are town and on my lynch, good job at letting the scum manipulate you.

Perfect example of an attempt at manipulation.

[absta101]

FFs Starbuck you're pissing me off. Stop avoiding me. RESPOND TO THE THINGS I BRING UP ON YOU!
----

You are voting for me because you can't seem to take the fact that I could possibly be town into the fold.

Just self-vote already. What kind of defence is this?

[absta101]

I'm tired of lazy people jumping on whatever wagon they think will get a lynch and be allowed to do so without a case and thus without being called out.

WHAT THE FUCKING SHIT!?
1. You asked for Reck to replace in.
2. You didn't say shit when Vox jumped on my waggon.
----

@Vox

- Starbuck's a female.

[absta101]

Vox wtf? Do you even realise what you're doing? We have 2 days.

@Mod: Requesting extension for Vox to catch up

[absta101]

Why should I trust a spy?

Wasn't you paying attention during "meet the spy"?
Trust the spy. Don't make the same mistake as the dumb soldier.

[absta101]

Why should I trust a spy?

Wasn't you paying attention during "meet the spy"?
Trust the spy. Don't make the same mistake as the dumb soldier.

completely off topic from the game I know but I wonder how much avatars influence other's subconscious reads in the game.

I've been thinking of changing my avatar for this reason. I think it does slightly.
----

@Starbuck

- I pointed you to it already.
----

@Rach

- Elmo's crazy.

[absta101]

Starbuck went into hypodefensive mode because he's scum btw.

No, I went into defensive mode because that's what I do when I'm a VT and about to be lynched.

That's what you do regardless.
Clearly your "defensive mode" isn't genuine.

[absta101]

I was literally just thinking last night, "Man, I wonder if I'd suspect absta101 so much if he wasn't the fucking Spy from TF2..." because just looking at your posts, I get a scumvibe from them with that dude beside them.

The best thing I could do is get a MLP avatar.

[absta101]

@Starbuck

- Post

#1031

--
Re: The fact that you're actively conscious of it

now

means it isn't genuine.
--

I may have not said anything, but I did note it to myself.

What?
OMFG! LYNCH IT!!!

[absta101]

Starbuck is NOT SCUM and this lynch is stupid.

I want to lynch absta but I'd lynch DV as a compromise

lol, good joke.
----
Starbuck, what was that about Reck having good instinct?

[absta101]

Respond to my points.

[absta101]

Again. I'll be back around 4pm GMT. Don't lynch me while i'm away please.

[absta101]

I'm not ignoring you because I do feel that ignoring your scumread is scummy, but I don't really know what you want. You keep saying you want responses and I've given plenty this afternoon. Are you just upset because you aren't getting the responses that you want so you can twist them into what you want them to be?

that actually made me lol.
Keep going.

P.S. Look at the first quote in the post I pointed you to.

[absta101]

Post #984. The first two points?

[absta101]

RESPOND TO DEM FFS!

[absta101]

Wait theres more!

[absta101]

Nvm, respond to dem first.

[absta101]

Please respond to the points.

[absta101]

Anyway 4pm GMT.

[absta101]

DV please! These guys are f***ing crazy.

1. Starbuck
2. Panda, Shamrock.
3. DV, Vox, Brandi.

[absta101]

DV vote Starbuck.
----

@Starbuck

- I know you're scum for a fact. You keep dodging my attack, pretending you don't understand.

[absta101]

Is it a good idea for absta to claim?

A claim from me at this point is just stupid. Another reason why Starbuck's lynch > mine.

[absta101]

@Starbuck

- Basically you've been trying to throw suspicion on me with just about anything. That's scummy. Things like calling me out on "whiteknighting", bringing up "associative tells" between me and Brandi, etc. All null tells.
The scum motivation is clear. You want to manipulate town into thinking my lynch is more fruitful than it is.

Recently you mentioned that i've avoided L-1 twice.
1. How is that even remotely scummy?
2. Either i'm experienced scum or scum is failing at pushing my lynch. You can't ignore the fact that i've never played mafia. If you were town, you would at least entertain the possibility that i'm not capable of doing that.

[absta101]

Then what's your theory?
It doesn't change the fact that that doesn't indicate i'm scum in the slightest. Backing up my accusation on Starbuck.

[absta101]

My theory is that you're scum.

So basically your case on Starbuck is that you don't like her attacks on you?

Are you asking me or telling me? It's quite obvious you have little confidence in your theory and your vote on me. That's scummy considering how hard you've pushed my lynch.
----
Starbuck, terrible defence.
Remind me of your "case" please.

[absta101]

Starbuck isn't flipping town.

DV lynch her please.

[absta101]

HMMM YOU SAY THAT LIKE YOU KNOW THINGS YOU SHOULDN'T HMMMM

And this confirms you as her partner. This is you setting up suspicion on me because you know Starbuck will flip scum.

[absta101]

That's a lynch.

Starbuck what was your alignment?

[absta101]

I don't believe Starbuck is town. This is a way of confusing town whilst the mod is away.

[absta101]

In any case, if absta truly is town, I probably won't ever play with him again if this truly is his town play because its shitty as hell.

You look scummy as fuck and I stand by my reads. You're just embarrassed both you and Nat got lynched in the first 2 days.

@Mod: Surely direct insults like this aren't allowed.

[absta101]

I have nothing to be embarrassed about because I'm not scum. I also didn't insult you. I didn't say you were a shitty person. I just said that I have reasons to not play with you again.

Maybe you should take that as constructive criticism and look into your own play if you really are town.

LOL. "Constructive criticism", calling my town play shit is constructive?

[absta101]

If you are truly town, it's rather crappy. I'm not gonna lie.

I'm blunt. It comes from spending eight years in the Navy.

W/e. You're insulting my town play to boost your own self-esteem. You fail to realise that there's more than one way for someone to be considered a "good townie".

I like it how you keep saying "if you are truly town" as if it makes your act look anymore believable.

[absta101]

@Starbuck

- Basically you've been trying to throw suspicion on me with just about anything. That's scummy. Things like calling me out on "whiteknighting", bringing up "associative tells" between me and Brandi, etc. All null tells.
The scum motivation is clear. You want to manipulate town into thinking my lynch is more fruitful than it is.

Recently you mentioned that i've avoided L-1 twice.
- How is that even remotely scummy?

@Starbuck

- Questions like "why did you lynch me", as if I could do something like that with just MY vote, makes it look like you were treating all this like a competition between you and me. I hope you realise it takes more than one person to lynch someone.

Why would I carry on about being town all the way after being lynched if I am not? Wouldn't it be stupid to do so if I was indeed scum?

No, it would be perfect for scum-you. You'd have wasted the time we have to discuss what to do next before the Mod locks the thread.

Starbucktown = Abstascum.

Explain this logic.

[absta101]

One of the two of us is scum and its not me.

Explain.

[absta101]

This is one of the reasons you got caught. You accuse me with no logic to back you up.

[absta101]

absta stop

flailing

, we will lynch you tomorrow if you aren't vigged tonight, it's fine.

----
I won't be lynched tomorrow, i'm confident of that.

[absta101]

Just accept the fact that with my flip as town, you will be caught.

That makes zero sense.

[absta101]

Naw, I think you're scum over Abs.
Shamrock is the biggest scumbag but no love for that lynch

Shamrock will be dealt with tomorrow.

[absta101]

Be back later.

[absta101]

@Rach

Naw, I think you're scum over Abs.
Shamrock is the biggest scumbag but no love for that lynch

Shamrock will be dealt with tomorrow.

???? And he was dealt with by being shot. And that seems to nail it on Absta pretty firmly.

Wow... You're either scum or in DEEP confirmation bias.
Stop talking about what Elmo thinks. You've been tunnelling me hard all game.
----

@Everyone

- Np that I got outed. I'm basically a VT now anyway.

DarkLight:

Killed for role fishing me hard.

Shamrock:

Strong scum read but no support.
----

@Starbuck (#Shoutout)

- This should answer your suspicions on why I didn't claim.

[absta101]

Absta, what is the play for today?

As of now i'm looking at Panda as our best option.
- Attacking me with theories that make no sense.
- Tunnelling me all game.
- Saying things like "If not absta, then who?"

[absta101]

VOTE: Vox
Next time you replace in a game as scum. Think before you post. Terrible play.

[absta101]

I didn't shoot darklight, Code_X did.
I shot Shamrock because I thought he was scum and had no support for the lynch, AS I SAID.

PLEASE NOTE: Absta said deal with "tomorrow", not "tonight" - thank you.

Pathetic! Saying "tonight" is basically claiming.
Keep going.

[absta101]

HURR DURR AS SCUM I NEEDLESSLY OUT MYSELF TO LYNCH YOU? YEAH RIGHT BRO.

"Oh we can deal with him tomorrow" = via lynch
I waited to post so you'd take the bait and die.

You was waiting for me to take the bait? Since when was I your scum read?

[absta101]

How about WHY THE FUCK WOULD I CC AS SCUM

To WIFOM.

You're getting lynched today. You're so obvious.
--

LOL ABSTA I WAS VOTING YOU YESTERDAY

Thank you for confirming yourself as scum.

I've already decided to be on Shamrock or Starbuck's wagon.
I'm flipflopping on you.

This was in reply to me yesterday. Explain yourself.

Keep going.

[absta101]

[quote"Brandi"]I questioned the kill on Slandaar as I thought he was under a bit of scrutiny D1.[/quote]This was obvious.
- Killing Slandaar plants suspicion on absta.
- Slandaar was town leader.
- Plant suspicion on BK. ("JK doesn't exist")
- Plant suspicion on Panda. ("JK won't exist")
- Plant suspicion on Brandi. ("JK won't exist")

[absta101]

I questioned the kill on Slandaar as I thought he was under a bit of scrutiny D1.

This was obvious.
- Killing Slandaar plants suspicion on absta.
- Slandaar was town leader.
- Plant suspicion on BK. ("JK doesn't exist")
- Plant suspicion on Panda. ("JK won't exist")
- Plant suspicion on Brandi. ("JK won't exist")

[absta101]

So fucking vote me Brandi.
Just get on with it already.

If I can replace in and out scum with my CC and die in the process then let's go.

LOL. I'm down for this!

[absta101]

He's lying. He wouldn't give his life.

Bad move Vox.

[absta101]

I'm L-1.

Vox is L-3.

The lynch is between us two for sure but this isn't fair.
Reck and Panda unvote for now.

[absta101]

One of Reck or Panda is defo scum, otherwise i'd be dead already.

[absta101]

WTF! Brandi. Can't you see how scummy Vox is. You're allowing yourself to be manipulated.


Lynch Vox. Good game NO muthafucking REPLAY

[absta101]

OMFG! You're lynching Vig!

[absta101]

Look BACK TO DARKLIGHT! He WAS FUKING ROLEFISHING. I'VE BEEN HINTING PR ALL GAME!

[absta101]

You work out i'm the VIG.

Vox comes in and manipulates

You fucking lynch me?
OKAMRAZOR SAYS I'M VIG

[absta101]

Wait for sawyer and DV. FUUUUCKIN HELL!

[absta101]

FFS! I'm THE MUTHA FUKING VIG.
LOOK AT THE EVIDENCEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!

[absta101]

WTF is this town. Sawyer and DV needs to gtfo in here!

[absta101]

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 3#p4215413

Interesting. Okay.
I claim Doctor. I will protect Nost all the way through.

Taking into consideration the results of the mass claim. I highly advise a lynch of Techno.
If Techno scum lives. We loose. That's a fact.

Absta claimed Doc when he was VT. Newbie 1258

This proves what? NOTHING!
That's my worst game ever.

[absta101]

Brandi where do you stand?

[absta101]

Vox. I'm not VT. You know i'm Vig FFS.
(Btw, the mod won't allow you to self hammer as scum. You'll have to self vote right now.)
----
Rach stop trying to defame me.
----
I don't believe you guys appreciate the situation we're in.

[absta101]

lol
I'm obv town
come off it, srsly

ORLY?
You were scummy as hell yesterday near Absta's lynch
And it's happening again

Why are you obvtown beyond your own declaration of such?

Compare to absta who's brown-nosing you to make you vote me~

WTF IS THIS MUTHAFUKEN SHIT!?
This is making me sick!

Mod: Prod on Sawyer and DV please.

[absta101]

I'm going to sleep. No quicklynches whilst i'm gone please.

[absta101]

DV - How did Vox convince you?

[absta101]

You've been hinting at PR. This adds a little support to your claim, but it's not hard for scum to do, especially when your lynch has looked likely for a while now.

My lynch had never looked likely (in my eyes) until now. I didn't anticipate a CC.
Anyway, what do you say about the kills? Do you honestly believe that both the kills (Darklight and Shamrock) fit with my claim just by coincidence?

You claim vig after someone mentions the Shamrock thing. You have incentive to do this as scum.

You were going to be lynched

Not true. Town had no reason to lynch me other than me wanting Starbuck dead.

but my main problem is that scum could have easily just not claimed and killed you tonight, especially since AV was in little danger of being lynched.

No. There's still another PR left after me. Assuming the cop would've claimed by now had he existed, scum are left with either a Tracker or an IC to find. It would be better for them to attempt lynching the Vig and using their shot on finding the last PR. A lynch of me today will result in a massive advantage and maybe a win for scum.

Sure, by counterclaiming from his PoV it is probably guaranteeing your lynch

No. This town is just not thinking straight.

absta101:

- I have been hinting at being a PR for awhile.
- The kills make a lot of sense when you consider me as the vig
- etc.

Vox:

- WIFOM, "why would scum CC?"

I'm amazed at the fact that Vox has been able to convince you with just WIFOM.

[absta101]

I don't believe Starbuck is town. This is a way of confusing town whilst the mod is away.

You're going to be vigged.

I guess it's obvious why I didn't respond to this.

A question to think about. Why wasn't absta101 vigged if he was such obv scum?

[absta101]

Brandi, forget the breadcrumbs. What about the vig kills?
This is so fucking simple. Town will lose because they expect everything to be clever. (I'M NOT SCUM!!!!!!!!!!!)
----
Don't hammer i'm still talking with Brandi and DV.

[absta101]

BTW Why are you so frantic Absta? You should know that Vox is setting himself up to be lynched tomorrow if he is lying about his CC? Your freaking out about being lynched after both shots the vig had are done seems very scummy in itself.

I'm a possible conf town. When I die, scum will only have to worry about killing one more PR (a massive advantage). I think we'll lose this if Vox lives through the night.

[absta101]

Panda, hammer now. Anything else Absta has to say is pure WIFOM if you think he's scum.

This is scummy.

[absta101]

I was town. Good fucking job Rach.

[absta101]

Vox is the next lynch.

Brandi must also die.

[absta101]

LOL
Okay you keep telling yourself that

I can't believe you fucking won. How is this town SO FUCKING SHIT!

[absta101]

What is this wifom bullshit
You can admit it now absta

You've already won. There's no need for you to post, go lurk or something.

[absta101]

What did you only have 2 scum members? ._."

Wtf are you talking about?
You won at getting me lynched with a fucking CC.

[absta101]

Absta are you VT?

I hope you realise no one will believe your acting now. Just drop it.

[absta101]

godfuckingdammit

okay AV you're dead next

Just like that? You and Panda deserve to die for tunnelling me so hard.

[absta101]

GG Brandi and Panda.
Elmo's reads were spot on, gg to him.

Thanks Reck for replacing in.

And lastly, thanks to the mod and all the other players for an awesome game.

[absta101]

Elmo were your reads gut or what?