Open 526: Lock, Stock and Nine Smoking Barrels (GAME OVER!~)

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I think this is still something that should be considered.

fwiw, i don't think i've

ever

gone into NK WIFOM as scum. ever. it's something i avoid doing, among other things that are likely to induce paranoia about me when i'm scum.

plus if i actually were scum, killing off jacob here seems like a rather dumb move for me. i was like the only person he called town?

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like, even when i've set up kills for the express purpose of inducing paranoia about the night kill, i have always let someone else talk about it first. it's just how i've always done things as scum. i suppose you could argue that there's a first time for everything, but really, this is more of a town tell for me than anything. just sayin'.

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KX's "name the team" query is a good one

good for what exactly?

i'm not naming a team.

i will, however, say that TSO and beast are the two people i feel most confident are town.

maybe you, but i'm nowhere near as certain about you. i want to call TIP town, but i'm getting paranoid about him because of the way he was more than happy to do nothing but sheep me onto GM yesterday then come out today like it was obviously a bad move and immediately votes TSO.

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god that's a bad response. you're scum, aren't you? rofl

it's not self-meta. i was pointing out something you could actually check and verify if you wanted to (although i'm pretty sure you still haven't actually meta'd me properly, so i doubt you'd even do that).

the tl;dr of it is that if i were scum this game, this would be the first scum game i've ever gone into NK WIFOM. of my like... 20 or 30 scum games on this site.

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you put no scumpartners in your read list?

haha, i missed this post before, but this wouldn't surprise me at all

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your play this game is nothing like any other play I have ever seen from you.

ok. but you have very limited experience with me, so that doesn't really say much.

I feel like you are trying to hard to convince us you wouldn't WIFOM kill

that's not what i'm saying at all.

look, my scum play is strategic. if i make a strategic kill, and i sometimes do that, i don't talk about it or draw attention to it. that's just how i play as scum. you could check any scum QT i've ever played in to see the mentality i have as scum. i assess the risks and rewards of everything very carefully as scum, and i neve talk (or haven't ever talked) about NK WIFOM as scum because it's risky to draw attention to it as scum.

if you want a more recent example of what i'm talking about, you can check out the scum QT in Death's Diner, particularly the reasons for the kill on RA, and then check the game thread and notice i mention nothing about the NK, not even after someone brought it up in the exact manner i wanted it to be brought up.

so when KX points out i might be scum making a strategic move talking about the NK, i pointed out that's not how i play as scum. or at least that's not how i've ever played as scum before, so either i'm trying something new this game, or me talking about the NK is a town tell.

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Town tells can't be decided personally though. Yes you can argue it isn't a scum tell to talk about it but argueing it is a town tell just seems weird and out of place.

are you... actually retarded? i'll break it down into easy parts for you, you can tell me which part/s you think are wrong.

(1) it's something i haven't done as scum before, but i do as town
(2) this is verifiable for anyone that wants to check
(3) it completely counteracts the methodical way i approach the game as scum to talk about the night kill, as evidenced by any scum QT i've ever been in
(4) either this is the first game i've done it as scum for whatever reason, orrrrrrrr it's more likely a town tell

anyway not going to be around really until the weekend

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prodge. maybe reading tomorrow

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tip

are you actually scum?

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A bus?

if tip is town, bob probably is scum, so i could see this

at this point i'm thinking kx+nic+one of bob/tip is most likely team here

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that would also explain the quickhammer on gm before anyone could change their mind and lynch nic yesterday

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actually hm

i'm starting to get paranoid about the possibility of a yabba+bob+KX team

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tip, who's scum if tso is town?

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quickhammer probably isn't the right term but we had time to the deadline, i had just voted nic and expressed interest in a nic lynch and you quickly came in and hammered gm, with no prior mention of either wanting to or finding gm scummy or anything, really.

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TSO isn't Town

ok. but i'm not lynching TSO. so who's scum with him, then?

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i'm trying to figure out why your reads are so different from mine if you're actually town.

talk about why you're so convinced TSO is scum

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also weren't you saying yabba was town a page ago?

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Why are people voting yabba he's as confirmed as it gets

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Not having the same reads means we're different alignments?

no, but it means you're seeing things completely different from me, so if you aren't scum i want to figure out why

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like, if you're town, then either i'm very wrong or you're very wrong or we're both partially wrong

your scum reads right now are essentially my town reads (yabba i'm a bit iffy on and i see reasons to believe he could be scum, but meh) so either i'm really, really bad with my reads right now or you are

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You weren't voting gm. I don't think anyone on the wagon had expressed willingness to switch.

Also, did you accidentally say quickhammer because you were considering quickhammering Nic?

god that's such a bad post

(1) i didn't say i was voting GM, and nobody was able to express willingness because you came in and quickly hammered before anyone could
(2) i explained what i meant by quickhammer, but this whole second line from you makes no sense. it looks like you're calling me scum and nic town but you're still fine with keeping your vote on nic.

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The situation around Nic hadn't changed one bit when you changed your vote. There was no recent case on Nic and he hadn't said anything game-changing.

after being absent for

THE ENTIRE DAY PHASE

nic came into the thread and put a vote down on GM out of the blue

this caused me to unvote and reconsider things, and it should have caused others to do so, too

one of the reasons nobody had talked about nic was that he wasn't fucking there. out of sight, out of mind, etc. same reason nobody talked about jacob.

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like nic literally had 4 posts D2 prior to coming in and putting GM at L-1 a short while before the end of the day phase

how the fuck does that not set off alarm bells for anyone but me?

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(and 2 of those posts were promises to catch up, the other 2 were contentless posts)

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what is the tso case then?

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i could make up a nic case but it would basically be lurk + useless + poe so i dunno what you're expecting in terms of a nic case

and considering the nic case seems a bit stronger than "i don't like tso" i don't see what the problem is

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you should ask tso if he ever jokily called tip scum

you should tell me why you think that matters or form an opinion on it yourself

do you think that's scummy? if so, why weren't you trying to lynch tso? why were you voting with him today?

and if you don't think that's scummy, what was the point of mentioning this?

No I don't think there's a case for me as scum.

cases are overrated

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no, not really. i had you as town early, but i'm wrong about at least one of my early town reads so there's that

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and the only team i really see making sense if you're town is like... yabba, bob, kx?

i need to do some reading but i've been putting it off because this game is draining

i'm nowhere near as confident in any of my reads as i should be

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let me put some proper work into reading this game

i'm not sure how useful a VCA will be in this game but i wanna look through votecounts after i wake up anyway and go through some ISOs

in the mean time, you can start by telling me why you think i'm wrong about TSO

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i didn't get around to this yesterday because site down and i'm busy til tomorrow afternoon so will be reading then

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NicCage's lynch is not the hard part right now.

pretty much this

it's not about the nic lynch

it's about figuring out who else is scum if he's scum

i'm fairly sure nic is scum, and the KX vote is probably distancing, but whatever

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Nic = not scum
TSO = scum
See how easy that was?

let's say i ignore you, we lynch nic today and he is scum

is tso still scum then or?ii

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Which one is correct?

i assume after he answers that question you're going to tell us what the point of it is, right?

because i don't see what you're hoping to gain either way from his answer

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the day is going to end itself soon anyway and you're not really doing a whole lot to push your preferred lynch, or talk about why TSO is more likely scum than nic

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btw i forget, are you reading KX as town?

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also, really, if a hammer hasn't happened in the next 24 hours or so (give or take a little, it shouldn't take that long for scum to co-ordinate with day talk) then either nic is scum or two of {yabba, TSO, beast} are scum

i'm going to assume you think it's the latter

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There's a case on TSO

i keep asking about this

what is it?

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why don't you give a few short reasons you think TSO is scum

also i think i've already talked about why i think nic is scum. outside of what yabba just mentioned, he's been a generally useless lurker since some point at the end of D1 and i'm partially PoEing him atm

if i'm right about tso and beast and you're town, the only way nic is town is if it's bob, kx and yabba. which isn't impossible but meh

if it makes you feel better i'll properly ISO TSO, beast, yabba and nic after sleep and talk through my reads on them, but unless a wagon swings onto, say, KX or you convince me i'm wrong about TSO i probably won't be voting there today

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@tip,

let's just say for arguments sake you convinced me that nic is town, but i don't want to touch TSO today and i think your arguments for TSO being scum look shit

who would you be willing to lynch?

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also what did you think looked town about KX early on?

because so far he's been doing kinda what i do as scum, which is planting seeds of paranoia without trying to actively push the ideas he's talking about

he's been very non-committal and wishy-washy for most of the game. he asked for meta stuff on me but then did really nothing with it except verify i was telling the truth in one game he apparently looked at and left it at that without follow-up.

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Nic is scum. KX is quite probably scum as well.

RT, you think NC is scum SO VOTE HIM

mm, yeah, the thing i'm still paranoid about is a KX-bob-yabba team

at this point i'm thinking it's most likely KX-bob-nic or KX-bob-yabba so whatever

Vote: nic

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Unvote

here's the thing nic, if you're actually town, then either KX+bob+someone on your wagon already is scum (which would explain the lack of quickhammer because KX hasn't been around to quickhammer) or you're scum

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and if it's KX+bob+someone already on your wagon, then you're fucked anyway unless you convince someone on your wagon you're town and you're not doing a very good job of that

the reason i voted you is because i think you're more likely scum than yabba at this point

but really, i'd be fine with a KX wagon if it could swing that way instead

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also, i got the distinct feeling that bob only wants KX prodded so they could perform a quickhammer

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just looking back at it, it seems odd since bob's not really mentioned KX at all and i don't understand why he cares enough to ask varsoon to prod him

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TSO would you lynch KX today?

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Vote: KX

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actually to be perfectly honest, i don't even really mind if this drags out to a no lynch.

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see, i actually buy that nic

could

be town here and the reason he hasn't been hammered yet is because KX hasn't been online yet to co-ordinate a quick-hammer.

i'll be around til the deadline to make a decision either way if nic isn't hammered in the mean time

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and you clearly don't have the entire scum team pegged if you're still unsure about me

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or not, depending on whether i feel like seeing a no lynch

assuming no one else hammers

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were you actually town

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If you let this go to NL you confirm both yourself and NC as scum

you should see how much i care

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yeah, no

trust me if i actually were scum with nic, i'd have bussed the fuck out him a long time ago and milked it for all the town cred it was worth