Open 542: Pick Your Power X/Y (Game Over)

[Nachomamma8]

Prod dodging this shit for now.

[Nachomamma8]

I don't have much time on my hands right now, but I feel guilty about forgetting about this game yesterday so am doing special catchup for you guys and you guys alone right now!

[Nachomamma8]

Townblock: TrueOgre, Jmo, CTD, Pisskop, Celebloki

Guaranteed at most 1 scum in that group.

If CTD is scum, I think there's a possibility that there's two scum in the group; I've followed a couple of PYP games for Team Mafia and I've always wanted to double up on numbers as scum and think that he'd be willing to take the power role hit in order for the strong point of defense. You too, maybe, but your opening seems town as hell and wouldn't have you pegged as that aggressive as scum.

Thank god I'm not a PR, eh?

You.

vote: DrCirno

Her consecutive numbers theory was good town conspiracy thinking. Yeah, number theory points are likely to be wrong, but it's clearly coming from a town place.

VOTE: hermy

Best sole post ever

I think that Hermy posts have been genuine as fuck and am not interested in voting that.

Reads-wise, I'm comfortable with strong townreads on CTD, Brian, Hermy.
I don't understand the TierShift wagon but Tier doesn't seem particularly townie, so I don't mind it.

Didn't like Celebloki's opening; coming in and dropping a pressure vote on the biggest wagon without making any effort at all to understand it and attacking lurkers didn't sit quite right.

Vote: Celebloki

[Nachomamma8]

Since when is attacking lurkers a bad thing, Scum lurk to fly under the radar. At the very least lurking is Anti-Town because it means you're not contributing or scum hunting. And I do understand the TierShift wagon, he did a complete 180 on the town-block and then went after triton for a pretty weak reason.

It's oh so easy to attack a lurker.
"There might be truth in scum not doubling up" --> "scum didn't double up" is a 180? Since when? It seems like a fairly natural progression of thought to me.

Also to everyone else not on the Tiershift wagon, what is it that is making you think TS is being town right now? Especially Nacho. "Yeah I don't mind the wagon".

I don't mind the wagon, but I don't like the wagon either.

His strong town reads are myself, Brian Skies and Hermy, the first three people on the TierShift wagon, so he should be all over that shit. But he's very meh about it. Very disconcerting.

A good-looking wagon doesn't always hit scum, CTD. What's wrong with my push on Cele?

Curious coming from you.

Why is that?

[Nachomamma8]

As well thought out as '4s townblock'. Not much of a block if one is scum, is it?

It's not a pure block, but it's a huge piece of information.

It looks rather arbitrary and perfunctory. And you didn't really assess whether the TierShift wagon was or wasn't likely to hit scum, your position was decidedly on the fence.

I'm still on the fence, and I still don't see any reason why I shouldn't be.

You know exactly what I mean. Alas, hypocrisy is not a scum-tell on this site.

I come down harder on lurkers as scum because a very basic strategy as scum is to outpost the competition. Effort = town is the hardest fallacy to get over, wouldn't you agree?
Celebloki came into the game as a lurker himself, sheeped general townblock sentiment and didn't make any waves there, Tiershift wagon, pisskop scummiest of the 4s. I'm not quite sure he could have made a safer entrance or focused on easier targets.

Sense of unease at voting Celebloki also in 4's when pisskop is becoming the centre of attention.

I don't like the push on pisskop; he seems decently genuine so far and I like his choice of target in Bulbazak: Bulbazak is probably a high priority scum target/extremely valuable to scum, so pushing him early despite either alignment is a pretty good sign (why push someone you're just going to kill during the night? why catch the attention of a cop/jailkeeper/vig?). I hold the "one scum max" in the 4 block in my considerations for scumteams, but it probably won't affect my considerations greatly. People are easier to read when pressured a bit, and I want scum in that 4 block to be under pressure, since if we nail him early, we get a fuckton of pseudo-confirmed town. Why ignore them completely?

[Nachomamma8]

some distraction DrCirno made.

Distraction? Why are distractions scummy?

[Nachomamma8]

My V/LA also went into full force after I sent in my number for the drawing. I was actually very disappointed that I was unable to participate in the main mechanic of the game.

Why the hell would you ever say this?

[Nachomamma8]

Why wouldn't I? You're trying to clear Pisskop on a faulty premise, and I've explained why it's faulty. It's also interesting that those arguing such a premise have to take the stance that I'm automatically town, which is making me uncomfortable concerning their motivations.

You do realize that nothing you said here actually disproved the premise, right?

[Nachomamma8]

This is where you explain why exactly you arrived at a jmo town read and how your interactions with him contributed to that. Your interactions basically amount to you correcting him on an obviously flawed argument. This is not "scumhunting in a different way", this is you engaging in safe arguments, pulling a town read out of your hat and calling that scumhunting.

I think it was him being insistent, not on a dumb or easy viewpoint, but on a completely ridiculous one. I don't think scum would do that and he felt like he was genuinely having that thought.

I'm not entirely sure where I stand on bulba vs pisskop/geraintm, let's see how that unfolds.

I think that nacho has been lazy. His case on celebloki is worse than bad, it's a guy from the 4s plus he has only got like 400 posts. He doesn't seem too scummy and nacho seems to be going for the easy targets, while calling out celebloki for doing so.

VOTE: nachomamma8

"It's from a guy from the 4s" - Why does this matter at all?
"He only has like 400 posts" - Why does this matter at all?

[Nachomamma8]

I know this is the pot calling the kettle black but we really do have a lot of lurkers/inactive players here. Specifically hermy and SXTLHGaiden.

I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around pisskop's posting. Can he really come off this scummy all the time?

Since I've been just as bad over the holiday weekend I'll get back into the game with my current reads and then move from there into more in depth analysis.
Bulbazak (5) - Leaning town on him
SXTLHGaiden (6) - No read, not posted enough
TierShift (8) - Leaning scum for reasons I stated before
DrCirno (13) - Leaning Town
geraintm (1) - Leaning town
Hermy (1) - No opinion, got pretty pissy with DrCirno though
uctriton00 (2) - Null because I find Nacho scummy
Nachomamma8 (2) - Scummy, attacking me while doing the exact thing he claims I'm doing

Seeing as how I find pisskop incredibly scummy that leaves me to believe the rest of the block below are town. I could be wrong but as I stated in previous posts I feel it would be better to pursue scum elsewhere for Day 1. This doesn't mean I give everyone that's not pisskop below a free pass though.
True Ogre (4)
jmo16mla (4)
CrashTextDummie (4)
Brian Skies (4)
pisskop (4)
Celebloki (4)

[Nachomamma8]

I think TierShift isn't voting me, which is a great feeling because when you make a case on someone, then they vote you, and then find someone else to vote instead, it just adds fuel to my gut.

I don't know what the fuck this means.

but the 400 posts does matter, I'd say it definitely makes him an easier target.

He's played enough games to know how to navigate around a mafia game right now; also note that I'm not attacking him for "bad" moves or "bad" logic; I'm attacking him for being scummy.

(as I begrudgingly admit he is right when I called him out)

I'm not reading uct's case on TierShift now, but I might later!

[Nachomamma8]

ain't that the truth

[Nachomamma8]

Ignore that terrible last post from me with the quotes; I'll just get to my reads so far:

@Nacho = null
No more town card because I misread what he wrote earlier in the game. Why didn't anyone correct me?

@Celebloki = Town
I actually have a town read on Celebloki, although it's dressed in OMGUR (an acronym I invented to explain confirmation bias). He agrees with me, and he finds Nacho scummy. I would find Nacho scummy too if TS flipped scum, due to association.

@Bulba = Null
I'm null on you right now; what was the Nacho line of questioning for? I want to know the motivation behind the questioning / what you were looking for / what the answer to your question would do for you. It will help me get a read on you.

@CTD = town
This is also an OMGUR, because I basically agree with the 4s theory he supports, and I don't see scum wanting to help show a town block. In addition, was the leader of the TS wagon in my opinion. I also liked the questioning of DrCirno.

@DrCirno = null
I am seriously not sure on Dr Cirno right now. The way she talks (the "lolz" attitude she seems to have) is very hard to read. At first you want to say scum play all straight faced and methodical and wouldn't be so fluffy. Then the WIFOM hits and now I'm stuck.

@Pisskop = leaning scum
Here it comes again; me using experience! Pisskop seems to be talking like how I talked when I was scum. It's different from how I read DrCirno's way of talking.

@TierShift = scum
Already well explained.

I don't have any more time tonight to do more reading of the game but that's where I am so far.

What specifically has Celebloki said that you agree with?

[Nachomamma8]

Nobody thinks its odd that he has to resort to kids cartoons in an effort to discredit 'confirmed scum'?

Is bulbi always this way in his games?

I don't think that childrens cartoons are particularly scummy or alignment indicative.

[Nachomamma8]

True Ogre not reading to the point of detecting subtleties. But seems like voting DrCirno is an idle vote if I don't have time to pressure him.

Time to wagon Nachomamma. More support here, more results with more votes.
VOTE: Nachomamma8

pisskop is good lynch for today but has posted many times already.

Bulbazak, have you played town with Nachomamma before? Does he seem town to you?

I don't understand this post at all.
Are you saying you vote for cirom is wasted because you no longer believe them scum?
You think pisskop is a good lynch.
But you join in the votes on nacho because why???

I don't get this at all.

What is so hard to understand?
I change my vote because DrCirno not posting much and I am unable to ask questions of DrCirno to find out if he is Truly scum because I do not have much time until a day or two from now.
Nachomamma I vote because he will do better posting if he is town or scum and has votes on him because he is not a player who wants to die. I want a better read than what I have, which is not liking a vote he made at the time he made it, I think.

Yes I think pisskop is a good lynch. He's not talking much sense to me and he is ignoring my questions. Then he says I buddy a town read.

Nachomamma - Not all distraction is scummy but True Ogre had only two posts and DrCirno criticise language. If I not vote you, why is Celebloki a better vote?

Why is how many posts you had relevant to DrCirno expressing distaste of your language?

If you're currently reading Celebloki as town, you're seeing something that I'm not. What is it? If you can answer that, I'm more than happy to tell you where you're going wrong.

[Nachomamma8]

Nobody thinks its odd that he has to resort to kids cartoons in an effort to discredit 'confirmed scum'?

Is bulbi always this way in his games?

I don't think that childrens cartoons are particularly scummy or alignment indicative.

thats not what I said. If Im so scummt why is ge trying so hard to shut down conversation? Hes not arguing.

Bulba always argues; I don't think this particular exchange is any sort of exception.

[Nachomamma8]

Your message said I haven't posted in three days:p

Anyways, post.

Why are you having so much trouble getting into the game?

[Nachomamma8]

Bulba, a question that has been bugging me for a while: How do you think the PR draft worked?

Well, I'm sure you're pretty familiar with how the draft order was decided. If not, look at the opening posts. After that, everybody just sent in their preference of PR, with those at the top of the pick getting preference. I imagine if there was a conflict, the mod would have those not with priority choose again. Seeing that he placed a deadline to send these in, anybody not sending in a PR request within that time would either be given VT, giving preference to those who did pick, or be given a role randomly from the left overs. I'm not going to tell you which one it is.

So in my mind, based on the wiki, the PR selection seemed to act more like a silent auction than an actual draft. Everyone "bids" for a role, the person with the highest pick gets it. So it is over in a single round.
I assume that if any roles were not bid on by anyone, they wouldn't be in this game.

From the wiki (i reread it to make sure i wasn't crazy): "As such, in the event multiple players select the same role (or the same "slot"), the player highest in the draft order wins the role, whilst the others remain Vanilla."

Cool post, zero content. What are your thoughts on the game?

[Nachomamma8]

There is some poor posting going on in this game. We are missing a player whose replacement hasn't arrived, CTD has gone AWOL and he was leading a lot of discussion and brianskies is just not posting here whilst posting elsewhere.

This game would probably suck less if more people were voting who I'm voting.

[Nachomamma8]

Bulba, a question that has been bugging me for a while: How do you think the PR draft worked?

Well, I'm sure you're pretty familiar with how the draft order was decided. If not, look at the opening posts. After that, everybody just sent in their preference of PR, with those at the top of the pick getting preference. I imagine if there was a conflict, the mod would have those not with priority choose again. Seeing that he placed a deadline to send these in, anybody not sending in a PR request within that time would either be given VT, giving preference to those who did pick, or be given a role randomly from the left overs. I'm not going to tell you which one it is.

So in my mind, based on the wiki, the PR selection seemed to act more like a silent auction than an actual draft. Everyone "bids" for a role, the person with the highest pick gets it. So it is over in a single round.
I assume that if any roles were not bid on by anyone, they wouldn't be in this game.

From the wiki (i reread it to make sure i wasn't crazy): "As such, in the event multiple players select the same role (or the same "slot"), the player highest in the draft order wins the role, whilst the others remain Vanilla."

Cool post, zero content. What are your thoughts on the game?

right now it is "people didn't read the wiki during pregame"

And that's it? I can't say I'm exactly blown away.

[Nachomamma8]

What specifically has Celebloki said that you agree with?

"then went after triton for a pretty weak reason."

Mostly that; he finds TS's attempt to vote me weak, and I assume it means he thinks I'm scummy.

"This doesn't mean I give everyone that's not pisskop below a free pass though." (regarding 4s)

This is a good thing to say, but WIFOM, any alignment, and anyone with a peanut brain, could say that. I just like hearing it said out loud so the rest of the game is reminded that nobody in mafia is clear unless you get proof.

To be honest it's not the greatest of town reads when I realize that he did only speak 6 times.

I find people following along on my line of thinking a town tell when it happens while my thought processes are unfolding and haven't been dropped in thread quite yet. When someone is lurking a bit and always seems to be a couple of steps behind, it doesn't give me quite the same warm fuzzy feeling.

[Nachomamma8]

@tiershift, actually, good point. point me to his valid talking points so I might refute them.

You're right, he hasn't offered many points against you. Which makes it all the worse that you are reacting so awkwardly defensively and OMGUSing and all.

This point is meh city.

[Nachomamma8]

@Brian:

Sure, occasionally townies go with the flow and are incredibly safe for no real reason (and especially with so many options to push for scum elsewhere, this isn't the type of game where people look town everywhere and it's difficult to scrape up scum suspects as a result), but currently smart money's on "no, this isn't coming from a town mindset". I'm not sure how long I will stay on Celebloki wagon. I've been thinking about Bulbazak weirdness lately; what do you think of him claiming that he didn't get his bid? I think it's actually pretty scummy considering that it's less likely to be a gambit since it was brought up as a refutation against a pisskop town point, and I can't see him outing not having a role as the first pick slot since scum should be expecting him to have cop or jailkeeper, which are roles that scream "kill me" regardless of who holds them and he's certainly played more than enough games to know that.

[Nachomamma8]

@tiershift, actually, good point. point me to his valid talking points so I might refute them.

You're right, he hasn't offered many points against you. Which makes it all the worse that you are reacting so awkwardly defensively and OMGUSing and all.

This point is meh city.

Pisskop is being overly defensive y/n

Being overly defensive is a shitty tell y

[Nachomamma8]

I don't understand your town case on Tier, pisskop.

[Nachomamma8]

Brian, I don't think the pisskop/geriantim distancing from each other bit has any merit.

[Nachomamma8]

@brian - but they don't create pressure as I know you are happy joining a new wagon as soon as it forms. I am not going to join you in a wagon, it would make me look even worse than you.
What am I meant to do now, I say I think you are scummy, and you just go "yeah, that is just the way I play, deal with it"

I don't think he's demonstrated being happy jumping on whatever forms. Is his following me onto Celebloki your only proof for that..

[Nachomamma8]

The second part, I meant in that sorta way you did, just joining in to make nacho happy way.

It was the more deliberate dodging of prods which caused me to notice. There are clearly worse lurkers in the game as two have. Been replaced. It is more your play style of lurking and when you do join in, the way you joined in with nachos vote. I really, really disliked it.

You really, really disliked it because you have an inerrant hate for prod dodges? That seems fairly arbitrary and not really an indicator of scum.

[Nachomamma8]

My temporary low commitment is failing me
Somebody just tell me who to vote with a townie-looking sentence and I'll follow.

I'll read up eventually

Sheep me until you're caught up.

[Nachomamma8]

prod dodge

[Nachomamma8]

hey guys i have some crazy information to drop on the thread

[Nachomamma8]

it's really crazy, so don't freak out

[Nachomamma8]

1) I was neighborized last night ( )
2) I'm not scum ( )
3) Gaiden probably is ( )

Vote: Gaiden

[Nachomamma8]

don't think about it too much
too much
too much
too mouch

[Nachomamma8]

PICK YOUR PROD DODGE

[Nachomamma8]

why is that?

[Nachomamma8]

i have established several times that I have absolutely no time during the weekdays and end up spam posting during the weekends
as a result, the content that I post in this game is pretty much going to be prod dodges until I hit that sacred weekend
knowing that, why is prod dodging on the weekdays like I established I would do earlier unacceptable?
because it shouldn't be?

[Nachomamma8]

Brian replaced out and all we got was Notscience?

[Nachomamma8]

Bulbazak (5) --> claimed VT
SXTLHGaiden (6) ---> ???
TierShift (8) ---> ???
DrCirno (13) ---> killed

so in the wonderfulness that is pick your power, scum is either going to a) kill people who are threats to them during day play, or b) PR hunt. I don't know if any of you think that DrCirno was killed based on being a threat day play wise, but if you do, you're probably smoking crack. That means they were PR hunting, meaning that they are basically going down the draft list. Cirno was surpassed by two different players as the kill, and it's probably because one of the two people between Bulbazak and Cirno are scum (since only one could be blocked). I don't remember a single thing Gaiden's posted this game so he seems like a fucking fine place to start.

[Nachomamma8]

nope bulbi hates me more. and I always wonder why scum would coast that obviously. Id take bulbi.

what?

[Nachomamma8]

Im thinking Gaidens lurking and empty posts are too obvious of a tell for him to be scum. I still would like lynch bulba.

too obvious to be scum?
what does that even mean?

[Nachomamma8]

Nacho, what is your read on Tier?

my read on Tier is that Tier is townier than Gaiden

[Nachomamma8]

then let's lynch gaiden today

[Nachomamma8]

@Nacho: What did you think of Tier trying to use deadline play as reasons for a lynch?

i didn't read it but not bad at all

[Nachomamma8]

find actual scum?

[Nachomamma8]

or continue trolling, whichever works best

[Nachomamma8]

i could lynch that too

[Nachomamma8]

i could lynch a lot of things

[Nachomamma8]

but let's start with gaiden

[Nachomamma8]

i don't understand why anyone follows me but i love it

[Nachomamma8]

hey bulbazak why aren't you making any pushes buddy?

[Nachomamma8]

why not gaiden?

[Nachomamma8]

do you think he's townie?

[Nachomamma8]

because if not sheep me and hammer
fuck cases, fuck logic

[Nachomamma8]

i was gone on deadline, probably at work
i don't know what happened on deadline but i don't really care a whole lot

[Nachomamma8]

triton, the nacho deadline is ending soon
you're gonna meet coast city soon

[Nachomamma8]

I don't want to lynch gaiden. I have finally seen nacho's reasoning and I don't get it. I don't get nacho. We've had to wait a whole week and this is all we've had...?

everyone else gets it!
it also may just be charisma or join date or some shit like that carrying me

[Nachomamma8]

wait until he gets back
but when he does you should hammer him because he's scummy as hell and lurky as hell

i mean, you've seen gaiden play, right?
this isn't town gaiden.

[Nachomamma8]

wait until he gets back
but when he does you should hammer him because he's scummy as hell and lurky as hell

i mean, you've seen gaiden play, right?
this isn't town gaiden.

1509

link?

[Nachomamma8]

Everyone else can read jmos iso? I promise its short and unsatisfying.

that's how i'd describe gaiden's ISO!

[Nachomamma8]

also, if our man of the hour today doesn't show up, i would highly recommend an intent to hammer and a request for him to claim

[Nachomamma8]

NOTSCIENCE HAMMER GAIDEN PLEASE

[Nachomamma8]

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE

[Nachomamma8]

VOTE: Gaiden

YOLOSWAGFORJESUS

<3

[Nachomamma8]

well then i suppose i will sell this product to someone else

[Nachomamma8]

:[ Not my experience with him. But I don't think its a scumtell. Its null.

where was i hostile to yesiree?

[Nachomamma8]

wow such hostility

wowowowow

:[ Not my experience with him. But I don't think its a scumtell. Its null.

[Nachomamma8]

You are correct, Nacho. No hostility. You buying CTD-scum?

it's a possibility, but not a strong one

[Nachomamma8]

why not use his power as scum?

[Nachomamma8]

uct's posting is extremely enjoyable
yesiree's push on jmo isn't bad at all even though it isn't better than the current gaiden push

[Nachomamma8]

if this turns into havingfitz again i am going to cry

amen, brother
luckily, it doesn't look like it will.

[Nachomamma8]

what the fuck is going on???

[Nachomamma8]

1) I was neighborized last night ( )
2) I'm not scum ( )
3) Gaiden probably is ( )

Vote: Gaiden

I'm not feeling Gaiden-scum anymore. I forgive his fake hammer attempt. I liked his 866 and 972.

but he needs to get his ass back in the game and post in the fucking thread

What about those two posts did you like? I'm not really going to go back and read them right now, but I can tell you that there probably isn't anything even mildly interesting in there.

[Nachomamma8]

I don't think the readlist is fabricated in the sense that he pulled it off of thin air.

I also don't have any problem with the scum-admission trollzingz, given Nacho's loluscum case and people just sheeping Nacho.

The scum team, in Nacho's eyes, somehow has an IQ, I dunno, below 30, that it's simply incapable of forming the thought of skipping players down the draft list to kill.

What are you implying?

His case on Gaiden-scum is based on the scum team having a collective IQ below 30.

Why don't you think the reads list is fabricated? What parts of his play show him building up to or working towards those reads? What parts of those reads show any significant thought process whatsoever?

What does people following me onto Gaiden have to do with Gaiden claiming scum?

And why does my point towards Gaiden-scum require scum to have the below 30 IQ?

[Nachomamma8]

You have to realize that it's not just about comparing whose ISO looks worse than the other. And the fact that jmo's "better looking iso" should not exempt him from being the lynch candidate. The logic in trying to decide who is scummier in that fashion is flawed in and of itself.

Towns don't always have the best looking ISO. And it's easy to maintain a above-average appearance as scum, especially given the lurkers and replacements in this particular game.

Does triton not realise some people can look good as scum? Some people might actually be good at this game and not make obvious screw ups

"some people look good as scum and some people look bad as town" - what is the point of this argument and why has it been brought up twice in an attempt to derail the Gaiden wagon? "guys, I know he looks scummy, but sometimes town look like that".

[Nachomamma8]

Heres my thoughts on gaiden

-maybe town. i perfer another lynch today.
-msybe jailkeeper. jailkeper may be alluring but it weaksauce in a game this large. endgame is better. I would take it over tracker in this game tho.

-this suspenseful reveal is not towney nor is it scummy.

why do you think Gaiden could be town?

[Nachomamma8]

JK'd triton.
I chose JK over tracker since i figured it'd be more fun.

And JK over cop because...?

[Nachomamma8]

She's Tammy.

[Nachomamma8]

Nacho…

…you're scum hère aren't you

How much of the game have you read?

[Nachomamma8]

How did you expect me to react?

[Nachomamma8]

I'm not exactly as transparently town as you are when people call me scum, you know.

[Nachomamma8]

idk…to tell me I was wrong if I was..to tell me I'm dumb if I am because of most people on this site I should be able to get a decent read on you?

to if you were scum to try to be manipulative?

idk what i expected really.

I'm not exactly as transparently town as you are when people call me scum, you know.

who is >-<

I dunno but not me

[Nachomamma8]

but nacho why aren't you giving me a hard time for not reading the game yet?

Why would I?

[Nachomamma8]

Why do you think I scumread you in Too Many Heads? Lurking?

[Nachomamma8]

What gave you the townread on Tier?

[Nachomamma8]

I'm sure there were a myriad of reasons. I think both of us were pretty obvious that game.

Why should I read you as town here? Who should I read as scum? What should I look out for when i read the game?

Bulbazack? He seems scummy or am I on crack?

I think all of these things will become wonderfully clear when you read and I'm more excited to hear them coming from your mouth as opposed to hearing them come from my mouth.

[Nachomamma8]

do you have any doubts as to my alignment nacho???

Not really. The question was more curiosity than anything.

[Nachomamma8]

I see you Gaiden

[Nachomamma8]

And how do you feel as a dead person? Do you feel... scummy?

[Nachomamma8]

So you're not pissed about being lynched for absolutely no reason?

[Nachomamma8]

[Nachomamma8]

no time for today, will check in tomorrow
sorry tamm tamm!

[Nachomamma8]

Can we save Bulbazak for tomorrow and kill jmo today?

Vote: JMO

[Nachomamma8]

Throughout the night, I couldn't help but think nacho bussed him. He was in him from early in the day..

So?

[Nachomamma8]

¿ \o/ ?

doesn't the gaiden flip strike you as an odd? it's one of those times when a scum is lynched for seemingly no solid reason

Do you think I can't get scum lynched on bullshit when I'm town?
Because if you don't think I can, then you're not really that familiar with the way I operate.

[Nachomamma8]

Nacho, bulbi, utrit, still like CTD/Sir as town?

Yep!
I think he still hasn't had a scumgame yet and am currently too lazy to check but I'd be surprised if his first scumgame was so brazen and so good

[Nachomamma8]

Your scumread on nacho happened what, very early on in your appearance here, but then you go on, and on, and on, and on, about jmo.

You even had a jmo wagon that was, what, L-3? Even possibly then including me on it (you know you had me swinging, you could ******* see it when I broke down the jmo ISO and started seeing inaction in the second half). Why move off of a jmo wagon which is L-3 and move onto a Nacho one?

"My case on Nacho is his push on gaiden with a bullshit case"..... that makes no sense. This case on Nacho was made a long time ago, and was existent while you were still in the game. And yet, you put a wagon on jmo. Look at the post counts and timings (I can do it for you but you know what I'm talking about). You (or who was it) said something about it requiring an IQ of 30. But despite that, you create a jmo wagon.

And when the claim happens, that makes the Nacho case worse? You're going to have to ******* talk your way out of this one:

Nacho makes supposed IQ30 case against sixt --> yessiree forms jmo wagon --> sixt claims jail --> ???? --> yessiree goes to nacho

which reminds me, I don't think anyone who reacted significantly to Gaiden's claim explained why they did

[Nachomamma8]

Good?

Hes smattering shit along the walls! This is not mature town play.

I never called him mature, I called him town

[Nachomamma8]

when bulba isn't making cases that look completely contrived, he doesn't look as bad.

Did Bulba make a case that didn't look completely contrived today? If so, that might be a scumtell for him

[Nachomamma8]

lol

if you boil down Nacho's case on gaiden it's basically saying that gaiden didn't get nightkilled, which is built on a crapload of wifom

And also that he wasn't scumhunting even a little but and all of his posts look fake as fuck?

[Nachomamma8]

And I didn't remember town Gaiden looking that way? So yeah, bullshit, but not that much bullshit.

[Nachomamma8]

Throughout the night, I couldn't help but think nacho bussed him. He was in him from early in the day..

It was so early. So early that I spent the whole of yesterday accusing nacho of being scum for picking on gaiden for no reason. Did he have a reason?

I opened up day 2 and it didn't pan out as I expected at all. But I don't remember anyone being under pressure, there were like 3 or 4 votes going around. It makes no sense to me that nacho bussed his partner, and nacho didn't look at all to move his vote away once gaiden got close to actually being lynched.

Tammy, is it weird that I really really like being called town for the wrong reasons?

[Nachomamma8]

Vote Pisskop

I think you were trying to get role cop, and someone higher up stopped you. Yours is also the vote I like the least on the initial Gaiden wagon. I'm starting to think my initial reads may have been right on target.

Also, Nacho needs to get his butt in here. He still has some questions to answer.

P-edit: Pisskop said d1 that he tried to get UB, but couldn't.

Questions?

[Nachomamma8]

good. Im happier.

Now, Ger is likely to see my point, and Nacho/tammy/NS will too, hopefully.

yes yes, buddy as many people as you can

pathetic scum

This is not a very good accusation, you know.

[Nachomamma8]

Trying to catch up now. Forgive the whole batch of posts. I am not sure how I will approach this, I think I'll try going through everyone.

Not science first.

I have no idea. Just not enough content to go on. Could well be a lurking bad man

Nacho - yeah. I have reasons I want him to contribute. But he isn't going to till the weekend.
I have no idea what to think of him, I thought all yesterday he was awful, and it ended up that scum died. I can't see it being a bus, I think I said that already. But he needs to turn up.

Tammy - like the interaction with bulbazak, but basically waiting for him to properly read the game

Triton - seems to have lost the confidence he had yesterday when he was leading the investigation. His arguments seem to have more doubt than yesterday. Like really disliking parts of yessir and then letting him off for other things he did.
Can understand the change in style of posting.

Bjc - ok, the whole role thing is just awful. If town, deserves some sort of inspector clouseau (sp?) award.
I think I asked why he targeted me, was it because he thought I was scum or town and don't think he has answered. He did this yesterday, ignored a question I had of him

More to come

What are your reasons for wanting me to turn up?

[Nachomamma8]

That right there is anti-town in nature.

Why? Also why did you comment on this?

[Nachomamma8]

Ok good

[Nachomamma8]

Nacho I'm being a total lurkfuck why aren't you scumreading me

you're still walking on sunshine from brian

[Nachomamma8]

Plus your posting actually hasn't been scummy at all
Do you think you look scummy?

[Nachomamma8]

oh the yessirreee slot might not be scum. I'm liking some of ctd's posts more than i did before.

What do you think of CTD's replace out here?

[Nachomamma8]

Trying to catch up now. Forgive the whole batch of posts. I am not sure how I will approach this, I think I'll try going through everyone.

Not science first.

I have no idea. Just not enough content to go on. Could well be a lurking bad man

Nacho - yeah. I have reasons I want him to contribute. But he isn't going to till the weekend.
I have no idea what to think of him, I thought all yesterday he was awful, and it ended up that scum died. I can't see it being a bus, I think I said that already. But he needs to turn up.

Tammy - like the interaction with bulbazak, but basically waiting for him to properly read the game

Triton - seems to have lost the confidence he had yesterday when he was leading the investigation. His arguments seem to have more doubt than yesterday. Like really disliking parts of yessir and then letting him off for other things he did.
Can understand the change in style of posting.

Bjc - ok, the whole role thing is just awful. If town, deserves some sort of inspector clouseau (sp?) award.
I think I asked why he targeted me, was it because he thought I was scum or town and don't think he has answered. He did this yesterday, ignored a question I had of him

More to come

What are your reasons for wanting me to turn up?

Because I want to know what happened in the neighbourhood last night.
And yesterday you came in with a very interesting post on gaiden, I was curious how you were going to top it.

In the neighborhood last night, I ranted to GiF about how the voicemail lady always forwards my calls to an automatic voice messaging system even when I don't want her to. I mean, I know people aren't ignoring my calls (who would ignore a call from me???), so something must be keeping me from my friends. Hence, I think she's jealous of me and ends up blocking my calls so that she can try to guilt trip me with her voice (imagine dating the woman who does that voice and then having a bad breakup with her, like awkward rite???). It was a pretty good rant.

[Nachomamma8]

oh the yessirreee slot might not be scum. I'm liking some of ctd's posts more than i did before.

What do you think of CTD's replace out here?

Okay so now that I got there, I'm confused as to why you asked me this. He got prodded a bunch of times and so was replaced. His activity tends to be pretty spotty anyway sometimes, and during zach's game he was pretty busy so it's likely he just got busy? idk

I like that he started the wagon on Gaiden though. I mean sure distancing, but didn't seem that way.

He started this game and Zach's game with a similar energy, but that energy died out a lot quicker here than it did there.

[Nachomamma8]

Why is no one seeing gaiden trying to pin me as scummy? that doesnt seem like someone trying to set someone up?

Why should we see it that way?

[Nachomamma8]

Ugh. I hate playing with nacho. He is like designed as the player I would least like playing against.

Everyone falls for me in the end, Gera. You will be no exception.

[Nachomamma8]

i agree that bjc is generally a hell of a lot more laid back, underwhelming than i expected him to be
claiming weirdness strikes as town as shit, though: why do you think he would fake all of that as scum? unless you thought it was genuine confusion regardless of his alignment?

[Nachomamma8]

Speaking of, Bulbi Claimed he was Universal Backup and neighbored you. T/F?

True.

[Nachomamma8]

Nacho.

You have failed to do any one of the following three things. This makes me has a sad.

a.) Confirm that Bulba did neighborize you.

b.) Answer Bulba's question. Mostly this is me being self-absorbed and I really like hearing people call me TOWN.

c.)

(mostly the dancing thing is there because I hate being disappointed and being disappointed in three things feels better than two!)

I think that if Bulba didn't neighborize me there would be a much different reaction.
I don't remember Bulba's question.

[Nachomamma8]

Dr. Cirno wasn't a threat either, and if you would actually read, maybe you'd have seen my original point.:

But, if they were killing by number and pr hunting, why skip over my slot? My slot couldn't have been any more mislynchable than DrCirno especially since he wasn't doing much of anything. I suppose they could have jumped over my slot if they were hoping, TierShift would continue pushing Bulbazack

You are talking just to talk now. You should stop.

Maybe they thought lurking like crazy was a stronger PR tell.
Maybe they didn't want to be obviously PR hunting.
Maybe your slot actually was more mislynch able because a wagon formed there and lots of people thought Tier was scum.

[Nachomamma8]

An individual who habitually states things and doesnt think out tge consequences of those things.

You mean like someone asking for a masclaim, not actually going through what roles Re in the game...

Har har har.

I still want a massclaim. Only thing stopping me from pushing that is the potential redirector.

Who has the potential redirector other than Bulba in a Bulba-Nacho team?

[Nachomamma8]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: NACHOMAMMA8

This vote fell a little flat.

[Nachomamma8]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: NACHOMAMMA8

This vote fell a little flat.

Of course it felt flat, there was no feeling behind it.

you don't even feel a feeling of regret when you look into the smiling eyes?
because you should.

[Nachomamma8]

But I was hoping he'd say something more about jmo since that who last he said we should be voting.

wouldn't it be nice if jmo spoke for himself and actually showed up?
i think it would be.

[Nachomamma8]

i need a prod but i don't want one

[Nachomamma8]

i would appreciate not lynching bulbazak the first time i had a townread on him since maniacal mafia

[Nachomamma8]

i haven't read the past two pages

[Nachomamma8]

Bjc 6 hours ago, not science 9 days and so many posts in other games. Just like hundreds.
It was just a vote to prod him/mod into noticing his absence.
I didn't want anyone to forget they are still in the game

I think that's probably the moderator's responsibility and not yours at all. Who do you think is scum?

Nacho confirm this statement please.

Confirm, but I don't think anyone with a quarter of a brain or less would ever lie about something that I could very easily call him out on and cause instant death.

btw, Im very willing to lynch jmo now.

nacho, bjc are secondary.

You should probaby vote jmo, then.

Meh. Sometimes it's good to keep neighborhoods a secret, sometimes it's a disadvantage. In this setup, I'd say it ended up causing more trouble than it was worth.

I didn't see the reason to out an additional neighborhood when I thought that geriantim just didn't notice that DrCirno died. I was sort of hoping I could bait out a townier response with a good portion of ridiculousness (aka something along the line of "wow that's a fucking useless conversation, you're lying) but it ended up that he was getting at something else entirely and thus there wasn't a town slip to magnify in the first place. How do you think you would've reacted in my shoes?

Chooo Chooo!

Nacho, shut up and vote. because Italian Ice and Newbie 1473.

you need more charisma and you need to demonstrate yourself to be more right in this game (like I have)
maybe you should sheep me???

i would appreciate not lynching bulbazak the first time i had a townread on him since maniacal mafia

Also fucking weak sauce.

I think that bulbazak is finally finally town.
I don't think it gets any townier than a paranoid fit over that weird as hell ger situation, the rest is just normal bulba.
And you seem to agree with me, unless you already waffled that position into oblivion already.

but there's a small thing holding me back there.

?

This unwillingness to go bulb for some people is starting to worry me

you don't see why there's an unwillingness to go after him?

D1 morning = Cirno learns he is a neighborizer, PM has the neighborhood link
D1 day = Cirno can talk in the neighborhood all he wants, he's alone though
N1 night = Cirno submits "Nacho"
D2 morning = Cirno gets death PM; Nacho gets PM "welcome to this neighborhood" with the neighborhood link, Bulba gets PM "you are now a neighbor" but without link to topic
D2 day = neighborhood contains only Nacho
N2 night = Bulba submits "Nacho"
D3 day = Nacho gets PM "welcome to this neighborhood...again" with the neighborhood link. Bulba says "hey what's up, why did you not suspect Tier, blah blah blah"

cirno neighborized me and we talked N1
i'm not quite sure where you drew any of these conclusions, in all honesty

[Nachomamma8]

public service announcement: doesn't really matter if we no lynch today
we probably shouldn't, but am not as concerned with jailkeep dead

[Nachomamma8]

Bulbi is as town as Hana was Nacho.

you know i'm looking forward to my reads kicking yours to shit this game

[Nachomamma8]

i thought you called gaiden town

[Nachomamma8]

I was wrong. And you were right.

It happens, Im glad you caught him. When jmo flips, whos next? Im gunning bulbi.

my heart of hearts is beginning to whisper notscience

[Nachomamma8]

Nacho, do you honestly think that the entire scumteam is lurking?

why not?

[Nachomamma8]

wait can i stew it in my qt overnight?

[Nachomamma8]

can we make a party together bulbyzack?
i want to invite a girl even though girls have cooties and this one in particular is a little crazy

[Nachomamma8]

drunk at 10 in the morning?
i guess i shouldn't be surprised

[Nachomamma8]

if we can't make one big happy hang out crew we can maybe make a crew where we have separate QTs and tammy and i talk shit behind one another's backs

[Nachomamma8]

Ha I'm actually cooling down at the gym right now so high on endorphins a but not drunk yet

you don't work out

[Nachomamma8]

can we make a party together bulbyzack?
i want to invite a girl even though girls have cooties and this one in particular is a little crazy

We'll talk about it tonight. I do have a couple of concerns.

concerns? on tammy?

[Nachomamma8]

Jesus nacho. I dont want to have to lose just to get another chance to say I told you so.

competition is supposed to make each person better
in this case, you will be trying to get your preferred lynch against me, which will be good practice
pushing lynches tends to be your weak point which is why we didn't kill you in that 1 game where i won

[Nachomamma8]

AMERICA

[Nachomamma8]

I'm a vt who didn't get neighborizer because some dick took it

[Nachomamma8]

It's extraordinarily sad that jmo didn't get lynched yesterday because NS bought himself a pretty ridiculously large town ticket

[Nachomamma8]

Bulba said that he was gonna neighborize you although he had trepidations because he actually thought you would die during the night for some reason

[Nachomamma8]

It's extraordinarily sad that jmo didn't get lynched yesterday because NS bought himself a pretty ridiculously large town ticket

I don't get how one thing goes with the other?

I mean if we lyncher him yesterday we probably would've win by now

[Nachomamma8]

But then who did join the party?

Don't know.

[Nachomamma8]

public service announcement: doesn't really matter if we no lynch today
we probably shouldn't, but am not as concerned with jailkeep dead

It's extraordinarily sad that jmo didn't get lynched yesterday because NS bought himself a pretty ridiculously large town ticket

I forgot

[Nachomamma8]

I'm gonna be drunk soon! I have a 942 mile bus ride to Canada where I will have no internet

[Nachomamma8]

NACHO GOES TO CANADA
JMO GOES TO HELL

NACHO GOES TO CANADA
JMO
GOES TO HELL

Vote: jmo

[Nachomamma8]

Also, koppy? I think I win.

[Nachomamma8]

Have fun in not canada

[Nachomamma8]

I don't like nacho right now

Why?

Before you go, tell jmo why you're town?

Can you tell him why I'm town? Or have you completely lost your spark?

Wait. You didn't think I would die last night?

I did think you would die last night.

Fun story, this looks like your scum game to me.

How so?

So, I didn't actually get back to this tonight, but I will tomorrow.

Pretend the Canadian border patrol refused me entry to post.

canadians are not as nice as stereotypes suggest they should be

right now I think bulba is being as weird as ****

i agree that bulba's being weird as shit, but i think this means he's trapped in the dangerous cycle of paranoia and won't be coming back to the normal world for a while. i don't think it's scummy because it is so very clearly paranoia.

[Nachomamma8]

my short list is jmo.
and if jmo isn't the last scum, then my short list is bjc. as long as the town doesn't fall apart before then, we should be okay.

[Nachomamma8]

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... er_sort=Go

Bjc scum meta

[Nachomamma8]

...I'm still tossing around the idea it could be Nacho

It only takes a single vote to wipe away all of your tears and fears.

[Nachomamma8]

I ASKED WHY NACHO IS TOWN AND GOT CALLED SCUM FOR IT.

I doubt very seriously that this is why anyone suspects you.

Maybe Pisskop but he's knee deep in lostitville so.

He knows that.

[Nachomamma8]

When I was like "how so?", I was sort of hoping you could explain the similarities you were seeing.

[Nachomamma8]

Nacho is there a reason you ignored this game today?

I'm hoping that Notscience will stop lurkfucking and hammer jmo already

[Nachomamma8]

Nacho dammit if you're town come in here and make me feel it.

You can't feel how town I am until you waltz down here and take a step into my shoes and

Vote: jmo

You won't understand the blood sweat and tears that has gone into this game, the blood sweat and tears forged from a townie flame until you

Vote: jmo

please, please, please
just kill him and end this game
please please please please please please please please please

[Nachomamma8]

My main issue with Nacho!scum is why kill GiF? He knew he was a neighborizer and he's not all that dangerous to Nacho, so it couldn't be that. I guess the only thing is they would have known that Ger tried to get either rolecop or UB and failed, so one of the people ahead of Ger had it. They could have killed GiF to stick the UB with the neighborizer instead of something more dangerous like cop.

(&*&^&^%^%$%^$^&^*&*(*&)(&*(%^$%^#^%$*&I

Why would Nachoscum make any of those kills?
He probably wouldn't!

[Nachomamma8]

HALLELUJAH

[Nachomamma8]

thank the gods

[Nachomamma8]

you know of you weren't so transparent you could just hammer silently and then be like "oh I knew he was scum, I was just fucking around" later

[Nachomamma8]

Hey, nacho.

I need to talk to you.

ASAP.

we should look at this as a one shot chance and a one shot chance only because tomorrow is going to be hell if I'm still alive.

[Nachomamma8]

Nacho's been drunk!

[Nachomamma8]

How's your neighborhood going?

Quiet.

[Nachomamma8]

I didn't replace into those games and didn't have 18 pages to read to boot. So yeah. Its not surprising my content is lacking.

"I'm not posting in other games"
"oh, I'm inactive because I have 18 pages to read".

Read. Post.
Or, don't read. Post.

[Nachomamma8]

I contemplated troll hammering harder than I should have

[Nachomamma8]

Notscience, what did you think about Bulb's interactions with geriantim? They are the strongest reasons for town reading him, IMO.

[Nachomamma8]

Nacho, why aren't you voting Bjc? What about those questions I asked you earlier?

I'm not voting bjc because I haven't read as of late
And I um don't know your questions ATM but I will get to them soon!

[Nachomamma8]

ok bulba, talk up a storm
checking who burning_earth replaced!

[Nachomamma8]

pisskop. who was pretty town in his own right when he was alive.

[Nachomamma8]

You knew this would be difficult, as you knew I currently have limited access and am essentially V/LA.

[Nachomamma8]

I'm guessing Bulbazak continues to push me because of the bjc or Nacho declarations of yesterday.

[Nachomamma8]

Do I look town? Plz? PLEASE?

Not as town as UCT!

[Nachomamma8]

On d3, Ger slipped knowledge of the existence of my neighborhood with Nacho.

? Doesn't those in charge of the neighbourhood get to add someone new every night?
I read the rules http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Neighborizer and it said theneighbourizer gets to choose their neighbours. I assumed that whoever got picked the first nighties in the neighbourhood and then the second night someone else gets added.
The way you wrote that last line,have I misunderstood the role ?

This is his followup to his original "slip" shows that he assumed the new neighborizer (which he knew existed because of his universal backup bid) would be added to the neighborhood already created, which shows a lack of understanding as far as the workings of the neighborhood goes, which actually makes us less likely to be partners together (but shhhh we won't tell anyone about that).

I suspect Tammy wasn't killed on n3, because Nacho was hoping that I'd neighborize her and add her to the neighborhood. I refused to do so, even though I asked Saki and was told it was impossible, and I kept Nacho in the dark about who I was going to choose.

You think I didn't kill Tammy because I thought you would neighborize her? And I assumed that you would neighborize her even though your #10 strongly suggested that you weren't going to neighborize her...?

Don't start with me, Nacho. I announced in every game I could before I left on Friday that I was going to be V/LA until the 17th. You knew this. I was unable to announce in this game, because it was night. You then come in at a time that you know I'll be less likely to be active and answer and say that I should get in the thread and be incredibly active ("talk up a storm"), something you knew wasn't going to happen. Essentially, you took advantage of knowledge that hadn't been given in this game, except to LlamaFluff, and you used it as a way to try to paint me as scummy when I didn't come in and talk, thereby taking the heat off of you. That is scummy, Nacho, and incredibly low play.

And you thought my mighty plan was to tell you to talk and then watch you not talk because you were V/LA... and then what? I'd be able to get you magically lynched after that point because lurking for a few days is

so incredibly scummy

and you totally wouldn't be able to show up and announce you were V/LA before being prodded + replaced? You're a better player than this attack is showing. :/

[Nachomamma8]

PRODGE, easter

[Nachomamma8]

1) He assumed the new neighborizer would be added to the neighborhood already created, meaning that he thought you would have been added to Cirno's neighborhood. This clearly wasn't true, he would have been informed otherwise, hence less likely to be scum together. Let me also point out that if geriantim and I were scum together, he'd be a hell of a lot more careful about slipping privileged information in thread: do you really think that he was dumb enough to ask me about my new neighborhood first thing in the morning when he knew town wouldn't know about it? Or did you think he thought town might know about it, or...?

2) Which heavily implies you weren't going to neighborize her.

3) this is a horrible attack, can't respond without being excessively rude. If anyone else wants me to comment, I will.

[Nachomamma8]

Vote: Bulbazak

I guess some part of me was hoping that Bulbazak was town, even though he should have been clearly scum after putting pushing a scum slip on hold to push a mislynch and then pushing the scum slip again in LyLo. :/

I also had some stupid paranoia of "one of the 4s probably was scum", but that's been put to rest.

[Nachomamma8]

Nacho, question

Bulbazak (5) --> claimed VT
SXTLHGaiden (6) ---> ???
TierShift (8) ---> ???
DrCirno (13) ---> killed

so in the wonderfulness that is pick your power, scum is either going to a) kill people who are threats to them during day play, or b) PR hunt. I don't know if any of you think that DrCirno was killed based on being a threat day play wise, but if you do, you're probably smoking crack. That means they were PR hunting, meaning that they are basically going down the draft list. Cirno was surpassed by two different players as the kill, and it's probably because one of the two people between Bulbazak and Cirno are scum (since only one could be blocked). I don't remember a single thing Gaiden's posted this game so he seems like a fucking fine place to start.

So then we got Gaiden out of that.

Did you try to go after TierShift next?

Tammy replaced in and was incredibly town, so no.

[Nachomamma8]

I'm not certain whether he'd think to ask you such a question in the QT.

>.>
you don't think geriantm would think to ask me "oh you got neighborized" in the QT?
how would he know that i had another qt if i didn't say it in the neighborhood or he didn't ask me? do you think that i would just be like "oh, i got neighborized again" and geriantm would ask me to follow up in the thread because he didn't think to follow up in QT?

Furthermore, this allowed him to eventually out me, something that I would have never done as scum, but something I could see you orchestrating, especially since you'd know Pisskop would be all over that. To be honest, Ger's eventual reasoning looked coached to me, so I think he was trying to look pro-town by asking you and ended up getting in over his head, meaning you had to rescue him in the QT, which is where I suspect the idea of having him claim his attempted role came from, which outed me and put me on the defensive.

so... you think it was coached because it outed you.
you think it is coached for no other reason.

You also made it a point upon coming into the QT that night to talk about how town Tammy was. I think you were holding out for me to neighborize Tammy and for you to have access to her, even if tangentially. It must have really irked you when I kept that information to myself. It showed that I no longer trusted you, which explains why you didn't post in the QT after that. I'd imagine that if you were town, you'd be trying to get me to talk to you.

my general disengagement with this game explains why i didn't post in QTs
if your argument is that i wanted to be connected to tammy so i could manipulate her, the drcirno kill doesn't make sense because i was fed into the qt and could manipulate him to my leisure.
if your argument isn't that, i have no idea what you're talking about.

then what did you mean?

i meant you were my top suspect for the day and i wanted you to reanalyze the game