Open 559:Diffusion of Power - Game Over!

[insanity018]

VOTE: U SUX

Cannibals cannot be trusted.

[insanity018]

^Theelkspeaks did not OMGUS.

I'm more interested in how theelk comments on how discussion about self votes is useless and puts town behind. Yet, he is the one who started to discuss the self vote.

[insanity018]

Victor feels a bit off atm. I don't like Salamence either. 27, 42 appear like posting for the sake of posting and don't help town catch scum.

Fos: Salamence

Oh and if anyone was wondering I don't care about the self vote. It doesn't prove anything.

Why should we be wondering?

If theelkspeaks is scum, so is Shaded Melee. Discuss.

~Titus

Predicting scumteams already?

~tn5421

Hydra miscommunication or scum slip?

[insanity018]

Thank you for responding. However, you misunderstood what I was enquiring about. I found it odd that Tn was questioning something you had previously said. This looks to me like either:

1) Him asking you about whether it is good idea to be predicting scumteams so early. Thus, communication within the hydra.

2) Scumslip because of the suggestion that predicting scumteams so early is scummy. Yet, town Tn would have no reason to suspect anything that Titus is doing. (Am I making any sense here?) Basically, it looked like Tn could be scum trying to spread accusations around and forgot Titus is also himself.

Apart from that weird blip, I've been liking Burning Crystal so far.

[insanity018]

Actually,

VOTE: Salamence

L-2

[insanity018]

got to be scum in one of the people who voted for sala after he self-voted, so that's [Victor, insanity, doctor].

added to the FoS and the staggered time between that and vote, I'd say insanity is a good spot at the moment.

VOTE: insanity

Out of those: Scum Doctor > Victor >.................................insanity

I don't like how Doctor came in and put someone at L-1 while completely sheeping stuff that other people had said before.

I used Fos because I didn't want to put Salamence at L-2 yet. Then, when I came back on site and replied to Burning Crystal, I thought about how Salamence was already voting for himself so there could be no chance of a self hammer occurring.

[insanity018]

Do not misrepresent me, U SUX. At no stage have I tried to 'get something started' on BC. They are a town read. All I did was point out something that I found slightly odd and explained the two ways that I interpreted it.

U SUX

Sal is town because of #18 (has an opinion he sticks to), #46 (sticks to unpopular opinion) and #60 (again providing analysis with clear reasons) and #105 (clear explanation). Sal is not a player of many words.

I don't really agree with you about these posts being particularly town (or scummy for that matter). I like 180 though.

If Salamence is town, I think that one of Victor/Doctor is likely scum and

UNVOTE: VOTE: Victor

definitely seems off to me.

@ShadedMelee, thoughts on the game would be highly appreciated.

[insanity018]

Insanity what changed your mind about Salamence?

I'm still not particularly convinced that Salemence is town. My main issue with him was how his first couple of posts was essentially fluffy posting for the sake of being actively posting. Then, when he was under pressure, he was focused solely on defending himself as opposed to actually trying to scum hunt. I didn't like the self-vote because it was a waste of a vote that could have been on a scum read.

My read shifted due to liking 180. I thought I saw some original thought and attempts to scumhunt, particularly in regards to coming up with reads on Victor and I. Reading back just now, I'm not so sure anymore. That analysis only really covers people on his wagon. Recent posts 225 and 270 is going back to the fluff I don't like though :-\

I kinda agree with (I think it was?) Burning Crystal that if Salamence is town, he's easy lynchbait. Since, Victor and Doctor's votes on that wagon make me feel uncomfortable, I don't think I want to lynch Salamence at this time.

If Salamence is town, I think that one of Victor/Doctor is likely scum and

UNVOTE: VOTE: Victor

definitely seems off to me.

@ShadedMelee, thoughts on the game would be highly appreciated.

I guess it's not surprising that you pick the other 2 to target from the 3 I pointed out. why are they scum and you aren't?

As I said in 117, I do not like how Doctor came in with no previous game relevant content and then sheeps to make the wagon L-1.

My read of Victor is influenced by gut but mostly please ISO Victor. He is not scumhunting at all.

elk has made 6 posts, doc has made 8. looks to me like you are going after easy targets. the only one who has made as little is insanity, so I guess you could aim the same thing at me, but Insanity (and doc, Victor) jumped on the sala lynch so they strike me as the best targets.

Sorry everyone for the fairly low post count so far. This game has been moving quickly overnight for me.

This is getting kinda ridiculous: I'm crossing my fingers and for once all the V.I.'s are scum instead of red herring town.

^Definitely this

[insanity018]

Shaded's 278 is pretty bad.

@Shaded,

Why did you call out Burning Crystal for sheeping when they have frequently expressed a scum read on you?

Why didn't you call out reinoe?

[insanity018]

What is "bad" on 278?

It looks like an attempt to derail into going after Young & Beautiful. Yet, you don't vote for them or state that they are a becoming a scum read.

[insanity018]

Yes, the points about Y & B are definitely true. It's just the way they were brought up kinda as a distraction which I didn't like.

[insanity018]

What is your opinion of ShadedMelee?

[insanity018]

[quote="In post 350,

Doctorr's posting isn't perfect but perfect isn't what we are looking for Day 1. We look for effort, openness, transparency and consistency. Doctorr seems to have those a hell of a lot more than Victor who refuses to commit to anything.

~Titus[/quote]

What do you think of the fact that Doctorr has been mostly sheeping popular opinions?

[insanity018]

Doctorr's posting isn't perfect but perfect isn't what we are looking for Day 1. We look for effort, openness, transparency and consistency. Doctorr seems to have those a hell of a lot more than Victor who refuses to commit to anything.

~Titus

What do you think of the fact that Doctorr has been mostly sheeping popular opinions?

Fixed formatting.

[insanity018]

I agree with bjc about Doctorr. @BC/Titus, I don't think that sheeping shows a lot of effort or transparency

[insanity018]

@bjc, explain why Victor is obvtown.

And probably because people have different scum reads to you.

p-edit:

UNVOTE: Victor because L-1

I support wagoning Doctorr

[insanity018]

Both Victor and Doctorr look like scum to me.

But true, I'm not confident that they're scum together.

[insanity018]

I can't be bothered to read so I'm just going to ask a question to everyone.

If you had a cop shot tonight, who would you cop?

Answers on a postcard. I'll be back in at some point to see if people answered.

Again, no solid reads just trying to fish out who is a threat to his team by asking who they would cop considering all towns are a cop or a doctor.

^I didn't even think of this.

VOTE: Victor

This is L-1

[insanity018]

Hmm, the second line in #109 kinda makes me think that U SUX is not partners with Salamence.

[insanity018]

in fact, the more I think about it, the more scummy that is. or just plain stupid. we have people who haven't posted who might have N1 information?

^THIS

[insanity018]

I know I just said Salamence isn't scum with U SUX but.......??????

[insanity018]

And you are not conftown Sala,

[insanity018]

Where did Y&B think bjc wanted to kill BoroPhil?

I will read over Hershey.

VOTE: Doctorr

[insanity018]

Am I missing something? Why are we trying to quick lynch?

[insanity018]

No one told me either :-/

I agree that Hershey could be scum. ISO'ing her, she looks very (too?) concerned about Y & B's case on USUX 193 and 199. I'm also not fond of her string of prod dodges at the end of day 1. 111 looks good at first sight but is actually extremely hedgey.

At the same time, I see evidence of scum hunting and I liked the stance she took in 114.

So, she could go either way for me. I'd rather see Doctorr lynched.

@Salamence, are you just sheeping bjc or do you actually think Hershey is scum? If so, why?

[insanity018]

I had Hershey as a null at best and was trying to figure out why she had been put at L-1 in under 12 hours. Normally, this would suggest to me that the wagon was scum motivated but I have town reads on 2 of the players (bjc, BC) and the others are claimed cops.

@Hershey, I think you should fully claim.

[insanity018]

I lost sight of him and went with the flow/got complacent. Who gives a shit?

This is a lie. You were the first one to put down a vote on Hershey.

I think that there is a good chance that at least one of bjc and Salamence is scum. Of the two, I still think that Salamence is more likely.

Salamence: I cannot see the town motivation in faking that innocent on bjc. Particularly when bjc was a constant null to scum read for him during Day 1. So, with this in mind, it makes no sense for town Salamence to do a complete 180 between days 1 and 2 and start sheeping bjc's reads.

Bjc: I'm uneasy about the way he is setting up lynches.

Lynch pool:Salamence/Doctorr/bjc

[insanity018]

I can't believe Salamence replaced out.

@Prof Fridays, why do you think your predecessor decided to fake his result?

Prof Fridays choosing the two other people who have wagons on them to scum read is quite uninspiring.

Salamence and Doctorr were both voting each other so either they're both bussing or I'm wrong about one of them.

I'm more confident that Sala was scum.

VOTE: Prof Fridays

Yeahhhhhh I'm gonna have to get on the computer to show why this post is dumb.

Do enlighten me.

I was wondering if there was even less scum motivation in claiming then un-claiming, but of course the motivation is to put the pressure back on bjc.

The scum motivation is also that Burning Crystal appeared to have caught onto the fact that Salamence could be faking (post 528). Unclaiming would make Salamence seem more like trolling/gambiting town than caught scum.

[insanity018]

My apologies, I missed where you said you had only read the first few pages.

I still think your predecessor was scum though.

[insanity018]

I even bolded it for you.

@Prof Fridays, why do you think your predecessor decided to fake his result?

[insanity018]

Borophil, scum who thought they were caught and didn't want to answer questions about what their motivations were

[insanity018]

I CAN understand, however, replacing out because you can't stand arguing with a brick wall (titus). Oh boy can I side with that!

Funny this. Because you're also being such a brick wall about Salamence being town.

Tell me, why would town-Salamence fake an innocent on you and then sheep you, when he was

scumreading

you on Day 1 ??!!

[insanity018]

And I will say that the push on Elk does, at least right now, seem scum-manipulated. Or should I say the reluctance to lynch Doctor.

vote: elk

Explain.

[insanity018]

@Mod, Prof Fridays replaced Salamence

Opps. Copy/Paste fail. Ill fix the votecount. Hopefully I didn't miss it anywhere else?
-Micc

[insanity018]

Prof Fridays claimed a role that acts on Night 4 in 612 and 616

[insanity018]

Prof Fridays

claimed

crumbed

a role that acts on Night 4 in 612 and 616

[insanity018]

Actually yes I did think his crumbs hinted more towards cop.

Holding back from commenting further until massclaim is over.

@Prof Fridays, what does STAT stand for?

[insanity018]

STAT, an abbreviation of the Latin statim, meaning "immediately"

All these weird/new terms.
What is the use of it etc.? I R confused

Thanks.

Which terms are confusing you?

[insanity018]

I am also a Cop.

Will be back after work.

[insanity018]

Doctorr, please fully claim.

[insanity018]

And really, bjc, I would highly appreciate it if you start giving a fuck.

[insanity018]

Why did you choose to investigate him?

[insanity018]

Eurgh, I was going to post earlier today but my phone kept logging me out ...

*sigh* Doctorr's claim is both convenient yet believable which isn't particularly helpful.

Prof Friday's 713 makes me a tad uneasy. It reminds me of something I said in my last scum game.

BoroPhil already expressed his thoughts and concluded me/Docthorr scum, it seems to me, and his stance changed suddenly when I claimed Night 4 Doc, and on that basis, he has nothing to stand on.

In what way did Borophil's read change?

---

Hmm, I just realised something. Borophil keeps forgetting/missing stuff relating to people's claims. Is that something scum is more likely or less likely to do?

[insanity018]

I am a Night 5 Cop.

Bjc needs to protect me tonight (yes, even if you think I'm an idiot).

[insanity018]

Can one of you take your vote off please? You're making me nervous.

Post incoming.

[insanity018]

Thanks. I just need to finish eating.

[insanity018]

Burning Crystal is 99% confirmed town. (I can elaborate why if necessary?)

I am confirmed town. (Not necessarily from the Night 4 doctor claims since there are 2 of them but because it was crumbed by theelkspeaks in 607).

Sigh, bjc is likely town.

Leaving Borophil, Doctorr, Prof Fridays.

I have reasons to scumread both Salamence/Prof Fridays and Doctorr. Yet, I think that they are probably not scum together. (based on sheep votings of each other.)

Which would mean that Borophil has to be the final scum. Could it be that simple? Then, I would prefer to vote Borophil today.

I'll be having a closer look at each of their ISOs either today or tomorrow.

--
@BC/Titus, Explain both of these please?

That probably means I die but oh freaking well.

Given BoroPhil's play today, I'm strongly leaning towards bjc and you as the scumteam with an outside shot of Doctorr. Of course, I haven't ruled out BP though given his lurktastic start.

~Titus

Well that voting just confirmed that Insanity's town...

~Titus

[insanity018]

Eugh. And now I'm sending myself in circles. 478479 don't seem likely for scum-scum.

[insanity018]

Which interactions make you think Borophil is town? I suppose maybe 108 and 116?

I kinda disagree with you about the second point. Their paranoia about me seems more likely to come from town since scum would be more accepting that whatever claims a town player makes is true.

[insanity018]

That seems like wifom.

What do you make of Prof Fridays recommending that I check him then?

[insanity018]

@BC, so you think that if bjc is scum, Prof Fridays would be his partner?

Do you think Prof Fridays is more or less likely to be scum if bjc is actually town?

--
@Borophil, in your last reads list, you listed Doctorr and Prof Fridays to be the scummiest. Do you think that they are scum together?

[insanity018]

Hershey, Doc, and BC all die and I'm pretty sure it's game over. I need to read D1 real quick to confirm.

Bjc, why did you think that this was the case?

I do believe that BoroPhil is likely town from the interactions with known scum. However, the most prudent course of action is to wait. Have you check someone and announce it. I would recommend checking bjc given the major reluctance to checking him. If you die, I'm voting bjc as there is no strongman.

Going back to this: Which interactions with U SUX make you think that BoroPhil is likely town? U SUX does address BoroPhil a few times but never really gives a read on him except to say 'null leaning town' in 170. Similarly, BoroPhil never listed a read on U SUX.

Votecount 1.15

VictorDeAngelo (7) : ShadedMelee, U SUX, BoroPhil, Docthorr, Burning Crystal, insanity018, reinoe

If Borophil and Doctorr are the scum team, all 3 scum were on the Day 1 mislynch?

[insanity018]

Victor wagon:

..........................BC, Insanity, SM, U SUX
BC unvotes..........Insanity, SM, U SUX

BC votes..............Insanity, SM, U SUX, BC

Boro votes...........Insanity, SM, U SUX, BC, Boro

BC unvotes..........Insanity, SM, U SUX, Boro
Doc votes............Insanity, SM, U SUX, Boro, Doc
BC votes.............Insanity, SM, U SUX, Boro, Doc, BC
I unvote + revote. SM, U SUX, Boro, Doc, BC, Insanity, reinoe

Hmm

[insanity018]

U SUX, Borophil, Doctorr did not vote right next to each other.

If they are the scum team, do you find it odd that none of them were on the Shaded wagon?

[insanity018]

Yeah, I'm good to hammer (soon).

I was hoping Doctorr would weigh in at some point but looks like that ain't happening.

[insanity018]

VOTE: No lynch

[insanity018]

Indeed, which is why I think it's a stunt. Scum knew if insanity died, I'd lynch bjc in a heartbeat... so the person they try to kill is insanity? Nope. I don't really buy this.

If scum thought that bjc might gambit and protect you, that could be why they tried to shoot me.

Prof Fridays is not guilty.

[insanity018]

^Conclusion: fuckery everywhere.

Insanity confirmed for being a reasonable player.

Prof/Sal confirmed for town, unfortunately now I have a hard time proving that Boro/Doc are confscum. Although I'm not sure how genuine BC feels anymore. How do you feel about me, Insanity?

I feel conflicted.

I'm going to think this through tomorrow when I'm not dead tired.

In the mean time, Prof Fridays, remind me what made you so sure that bjc is town?

[insanity018]

I'm thinking that it's probably not bjc & Doc.

[insanity018]

OH YOU MEAN LIKE HOW YOU SAID DOCTOR WAS REALLY SCUMMY BUT SWITCHED YOUR VOTE TO ELK JUST TO GET HIM TO TALK?

What are you referring to here? Borophil has not voted Doctorr until today.

[insanity018]

^ I like that.

It's what I've been thinking about as well.

[insanity018]

Do you think bjc is scum, Titus?

Also, what are you seeing here:

The switch to elk looks more damning to me but for a different reason.

I believe bjc is referring to 522(?) which was after Hershey lynch, not U SUX.

[insanity018]

I believe bjc is referring to

522

552

which was after Hershey lynch, not U SUX.

Lol me.

BC, I agree with you that bjc's hammer of elk completely sucked. At the same time, it does seem rather unnecessarily reckless for scum to do.

What do you think of the U SUX's strongish early bjc-town read such as in 29 and 218?

[insanity018]

^What do you think of bjc's play on Day 1 then?

Proper post incoming.

[insanity018]

^What do you think of bjc's play on Day 1 then?

Specifically referring to the fact he was hard pushing Doctorr towards the end.

[insanity018]

They seem like legitimate attempts at coming up with things to make bjc town. Scum have to have some legitimate reads to maintain their legitimacy as town.

Yeah that's kinda what I thought at the time too. (Admittedly that was before I investigated you.)

why are you still here then? if you are so obvtown and unlynchable why would scum leave you alone?

I can easily imagine reasons why scum would keep bjc-town alive.
- He has a tendency to recklessly do things that help scum (eg hammering elk)
- These said reckless things could tempt people to decided to lynch him.

And honestly, Borophil, I think you need to stop taking random pot shots at Salamence/Prof Fridays. Even where there was a decent wagon on them (Day 4), you did not vote there.

Conftown are harder to mislynch than obvious town..

That night 2 kill was pretty what the fuck...

Can you explain that?

It could possibly be pointing at bjc (Weak scum read of Shaded). But honestly, that kill was so left of centre, it also might have even been made to just confuse everybody or to bypass any docs.

[insanity018]

Which push are you paranoid of? Borophil or Doc?

[insanity018]

Doctorr....

[insanity018]

Chevlon's post is fluffy...

Also L-1

BC, thoughts?

[insanity018]

All you need to know is that the game is won.

This makes paranoia that it is bjc/Doc(Chevlon) go

[insanity018]

Eurgh.

Intent to hammer Borophil

Will be when I get home from work in approx 9 hours.

[insanity018]

BC/Titus, so your reservations are not that you think Borophil is town but because you would rather lynch his partner first right?

Problem is we have 2.5 days until deadline (so probably wont manage to be calm and collected.)

I had something about bjc's Elk hammer; let me go and look for it.

[insanity018]

This game hasn't been that long lol?

[insanity018]

bjc was town and lol-hammered Oka-Poka in Mini 1582 http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 9#p5973829 I'm fairly sure someone in the dead thread said that he's done it before too.

That said, he never expressed a town read on Oka in that game either.

[insanity018]

^ It will happen.

Someone ask for Chevlon to get prodded if he doesn't turn up in the next hour so we can try to get at least something more from them.

I'll be back after work again.

[insanity018]

VOTE: Borophil

*shuts eyes*

[insanity018]

After a long day of discussion everyone

finally

agrees that BoroPhil would be lynched.

finally

[insanity018]

Whatever; hammer me if you want, at this point what can I do lol.

Really pits against town. I understand why BJC would target Burning Crystal though; it was because it was the one person who could've changed the outcome and help town win in this one. Mad props to you BJC. I'm out = town loss. I dare you to lynch me.

You better not be town and have said that...

[insanity018]

Wait a sec - Chevlon, you didn't even vote bjc?

[insanity018]

VOTE: Chevlon

[insanity018]

*suspense*

[insanity018]

Woot

Thanks for modding Micc!

[insanity018]

Well, you took a long time to get lynched so you didn't do that badly

Next time, try to avoid looking too enthusiastic to jump onto L-1 and L-2 wagons (Salamence & Victor Day 1)