Open 792: Masons and Monks GAME OVER

[innocentvillager]

hello

[innocentvillager]

I’m only replacing in because I know so much of the plist which is crazy

[innocentvillager]

A50 town.

Nah

Do you think they're scum, or do you disagree with the townreads, and why?

UNVOTE: Innocentvillager

this is a good unvote, Dunn always knows I’m town and I always know Dunn is town

[innocentvillager]

I am ALWAYS town NS, you know that, even when you’re town and just want to clown me

The fact that you had to ask that was scummy

[innocentvillager]

I can’t remember the last time I rolled scum

In seriousness scum can fake scumhunting in this setup right because they don’t actually know the other faction? I feel like reading through who is genuinely scumhunting is way harder no? Sorry I’ve never played in this kind of multi faction setup

Pedit: Nah not yet

[innocentvillager]

so what things do we look for even? with no flips it’s hard to get like partner associations or feel like there’s ever an agenda to save their faction buddies

[innocentvillager]

I feel like anyone who doesn’t look like they’re scumhunting is probably town

[innocentvillager]

I feel like that kind of attitude is part of why the game is dead. Too few people are interested in pushing non-contributors.

well if that’s been happening this whole game then ignoreeeee meeeeee

[innocentvillager]

hi agarose

[innocentvillager]

I feel like that kind of attitude is part of why the game is dead. Too few people are interested in pushing non-contributors.

note to self here that scum!dave’s partner is probably not inactive at this point intime

[innocentvillager]

hm i will catch up at some point

but my slot is town aligned, just wanted to make sure everyone was aware of this important point so you don't confuse me for scum

[innocentvillager]

if i were scum i would probably push kittens here huehuehue ive done it before and id do it again

[innocentvillager]

Spoiler: I'm kind of caught up ish

First.

first is always town

Did I step in a time ripple and go to 2016 with this playerlist?

literally explains why i know so many of you and why I wanted to replace in so bad

VOTE: elements

scummy vote

Worry worry not cause I'm with you

Tbh this is going to sound dumb.
But I have pretty deep meta on how MariaR enters games and I think she is town here.

It's not worth overly explaining tbh.

this is townie

I’m town as well!

But I’m sure we got a scumbutt in our click again.

this is townie too, scum doesn't openwolf admit that often especially multiball when scum doesn't know everyone else is town

VOTE: hayasaka
Newb scum response to being voted

tldr: It was interesting because I have 0 idea how to analyze it.

yeah this slot is town

Cakez Buldge Hayasaka town.

'But why'

Not answering.

seems townie

I am looking back right now and that post was an incredible stretch.
I do think your vote was the worst, but half that post was me thinking this game has gone on for 48 hours and not 24 which does change how I read it.

townie backoff

yeah i don't see how anyone scumreads Hayasaka here reading the rest of this page

Ya okay I'll bite

vote: davesaz

townie vote

Will catch up later promise

Liking agar rn

town

I agree with the dunn townread too

i don't at this point

A50 is town though probably

None of your posts look like shit posts to me

Multiball is tricky because I have to ignore his read but also think about the circumstances surrounding it since the key difference is scum really want to survive. His read on me is easily real which is a bit awkward. Social tells won't work on a game with players who have 4+ years of experience.

I fully agree that first post I made in regards to agar was shit, I admitted to that pretty early on, before agar stated issues with my other posts. But it's multi-ball so his push on me being potentially being real isn't that surprising to me.

Although I will admit his posts regarding me "reaching" could be a valid take I look at some other arguments he is making and it kind of gives me a bit of a pause on how legitimate his push on me is. The 2 quotes below feel more scummy then wrong like he is trying to win a debate not solve the game..

good posting, i can get behind agar scum

So you DO know why each and every vote was placed on her. You just don't like the wagon/reasons. Why didn't you say something like "I don't like the wagon on Hayasaka" pr "This wagon is suspicious"... etc.?

good

It's explicitly bad for town to shit post,

Okay boomer

It’s the job of the accuser to do the research. My point is baseless claims are good ways for scum to hide behind unless called out upon. This “you go find it you’re still scum” doesn’t show town trying to divine my alignment.

VOTE: almost50

weird vote

See? I agree with that entire post

He’s town

weird

Agar feels very similar to his intro in mini 2146 we played together a month ago.

I feel like this is the same dunn town intro I’ve seen in minis 2153 and 2148.

Shockingly I have to agree with I’m liking Dunn!fortown

town

Let's hope it picks up after everyone gets night killed

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Malakittens

Let's fucking do this.

Woo!
I like this energy!
VOTE: malakittens

townish

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Malakittens

Let's fucking do this.

not townish

interesting

townish

Let's hope it picks up after everyone gets night killed

Very odd thing to say. What are you thinking here?

many thIngs.
it's A multiball gaMe so it's highly likely there will be two kills night one. thAt is what i mean when i said "everyone". i was just using hyperbole to indicate the mulTiple pOssible kills at night
after people have been killed it Will no longer be day one either and I don't like day oNe because nothing has happened at the start and so there's not anything to go off. I also have a habit of being lynched day one which is another reason I don't like it.
i am incredibly bad at day one analysis and don't think it helps me at all personally so i want it to end and for us to get some flips on the board to look at.

townish

not science wagon is pretty terrible and probably scum led

I agree with the pretty terrible part but doubt it's scum led.

i disagree with terrible but tr this

not science wagon is pretty terrible and probably scum led

If you say so

VOTE: SirCakez

i think this is okay

A50 town.

agree and think this slot might be town too

I'd like a little more help in my crusade against people who refuse to talk about anything useful to the game.

What IS useful in a game like this? (Serious question)

Wagoning people, and in particular big wagons, to see what happens.

VOTE: Malakittens
Guess I'd better take my own advice, time's ticking.

Oh yes because time is really ticking with 9 days left in day 1.

:eyeroll:

This is :badposting:

Town should have some semblance of urgency and waiting until deadline for wagons to form leads to bad wagons on town players.

baffled as to why nobody is voting with me, even if elements is town

What was your reason? I think I know, but want to hear it from you.

elements hasn't had a single worthy post but hasn't done anything scummy to the point of being usable in a case. ie he's been trolling. granted by his volition he is bad at d1 play so maybe that's nai, but my point stands. I'm surprised nobody else cares to put pressure on a slot that seems to me like all it needs is a bit of serious pressure to crack.

Because they wanna attack LHF.

And this is not anything that convinces me this wagon is misguided.

---

Notscience is not impressing me.
Disagree strongly with the take that A50 is town but I also would just love to yeet the spam posting to 2016.

Lots of lurking fucks here. Would love more from {Dunn/Dram/N_M/Haya}, lack of content in this game is :sadfaec:

ehhh not a huge fan of this

Hayasaka has requested replacement,

I don't like this. Hayasaka never replaced out before. (Yet again, she never has rolled SCUM before)

Just keeping it as side-note for now

town

Hayasaka has requested replacement, I will be offering the slot to one party who expressed some interest before posting to the Replacement Request

ik ik im sad too but hopefully im ok enough for you dunn

unfortunately i don't see everyone's TR on you

[innocentvillager]

{Haya}
{Mala}
{A50, Xayah, Elements}
{dram, dave}
{Bulge, Dunn, NM}

null

{SirCakez, NS}
{AGar}

VOTE: AGar

[innocentvillager]

i definitely oppose mala wagon today

[innocentvillager]

You know I’m going to ask you to elaborate on what’s weird about my posting.

yeah i know

[innocentvillager]

I also disagree with your townread on mala

yes im aware of this too

but your strongest scumreads are her main pushers- is one of these two coloring the other?

they're not unrelated if that's what you're asking

[innocentvillager]

Do you think town-mala would let scum-me get away with pushing her?

Town-mala doesn’t even let town-me get away with pushing her.

oh shit you're right, town-mala would never let scum-you get away with pushing her, I fucked up

[innocentvillager]

im trying to wrap my head around why you asked me that because i don't know what you possibly could've expected me to respond or realize

[innocentvillager]

i think the mala push is easy and lazy and even in multiball scum doesn't really care who goes d1

[innocentvillager]

NS, I don't really think you're scum

[innocentvillager]

This is a wild take.

agar's partner is probably lurky or he's town

[innocentvillager]

viewtopic.php?f=83&t=83872

NS if i skim dual ISO this game will it help me read you and Bulge

[innocentvillager]

ur right i should probably downgrade that slot a tier or something

[innocentvillager]

V/LA until Tuesday afternoon US time

ik i just joined but ehh

[innocentvillager]

I’m not joking when I say haya is obvtown tho

[innocentvillager]

as long as I kind of try I can push NS’s town!IV buttons

[innocentvillager]

NS, Dunn is town because his entrance was similar to that one game you played? you don’t think this entrance comes from scum!Dunn?

[innocentvillager]

Did you really quote your predecessor THRICE and tried to manufacture a read on them??

do you find me scummy for that or something?

[innocentvillager]

yeah NS idt I am vibing with your reads this game much

[innocentvillager]

i obviously know who I replaced and I’m obviously hindsight biased but me commenting how obvtown my pred was based on that is scummy why?

[innocentvillager]

ill help you out, for something to be scummy it has to be more likely to come from scum!me than town!me

[innocentvillager]

wow i believe that was a true ninja

[innocentvillager]

Mala/notmaf/dram/????

Is that too easy?

I'm town for a start

Huh?? You may all laugh at me (now or postgame if I'm wrong) but this post is actually AI and it says N_M is indeed a townie. Scum!N_M never gives a shit about being SR'd! (And neither does Town!N_M tbh, but it's so odd he decided to intervene here it is town indicative of him).

i kind of buy this lol

[innocentvillager]

well there you go that wasn't so hard lol

[innocentvillager]

ik i was kind of wrong last game (i don't think i ever had you as town just townlean mostly but self serving bias etc etc) but i do think you're town this game lol

[innocentvillager]

NS why am I town

[innocentvillager]

Something something level of engagement something

how are you so confident i am incapable of faking "level of engagement" as scum

[innocentvillager]

VOTE: SirCakez this vote seems more fun

[innocentvillager]

i can see those posts coming from town just as easily? don't get why that's a scumtell

[innocentvillager]

nobody can even explain the reason for their vote other than A50's OMGUS so it seems pretty crap to me

yeah tbh i can't LOL

[innocentvillager]

IV what do you think of the constituents of the wagons?

my readslist hasn't really changed so that's kinda how i feel about them

[innocentvillager]

Bulge, is NS scum

[innocentvillager]

iv are you leaning tvt for dave/dram or what are your thoughts there

i can't really read either of them idk, seem pretty nully

i really don't have any strong reads this game, literally mala is my strongest read and she's a normal townread

[innocentvillager]

multiball is really confusing my reads i think

[innocentvillager]

why

I don’t understand how anyone really has a strong scumread here

I think it’s easier to find reasons to townread people but scum doesn’t really have as much motivation to force bad pushes

[innocentvillager]

ehh I’ve never been one to really find anything super AI in wars

could it be TvT sure could it be TvS sure S1 v S2 sure, idk man, Part of the problem with these kinds of interactions is there’s some amount of ego and personal desire to “win the debate” as either alignment that really muddies this kind of stuff

maybe we need to let it develop though, there could be stuff to be gained from how this continues

[innocentvillager]

I wasn’t really saying your read was strong btw that was more of a separate aside I guess

But like why do you think dram looks worse here, and does that make you think this is likely to be SvT

[innocentvillager]

you mean Dave’s posts instead of drams points? Actually I’m not sure if that’s what you mean

[innocentvillager]

yeah town side of null is like null at this point lol I just don’t know man

I do think the cakez slot is kind of boring and I very much dislike boring slots in general

[innocentvillager]

Both made by scum faking apathy?

This is the gist of it, yes.

Neither of those are posts completely detached in a "hey I'll get to this soon," manner. Both of them comment on something game related but are a) severely fucking lacking and b) don't actually provide anything besides noise.

so as I see it dram has been not doing much all game, AGar called him out on it in kind of a snarky way, dram got a little ticked off and he pulls a 180, forcing a case on Dave

But it’s not really about Dave, it’s about AGar

I believe the emotional reaction is genuine regardless of dram’s alignment, I don’t believe it’s scum motivated

[innocentvillager]

I almost don’t know if scum openwolfs like that in general

Scum force bad cases to push, to drive an elimination

This is written as if he is upset more at agar for calling him out than trying to push dave, there is nothing survivalistic motivated about this

In fact I am inclined to call this reaction townie for dram

[innocentvillager]

I am hesitant to give out a strong townread because I can see scum!dram ignoring his wincon here to spit back at agar

It’s also more problematic in multiball because scum!dram can actually genuinely believe Dave is scum and confbias on him, and I believe he genuinely is confbiased on dave

although this is a matter of primary and secondary motivations so still townpoints

[innocentvillager]

This game feels like a big clique experience.

yeah I get it, I don’t want it to feel like that, I like engaging players that I know and that’s like 90% of the reason I replaced in?

We’re also just on the most in general? I like talking live about my thoughts when the opportunity is there because I like having conversations, if someone else happened to be online/posting at the same time that I didn’t really know I’d like to think I’d be willing to engage them in a similar-ish way

Sorry if it bores you/you dislike playing in games with this dynamic

[innocentvillager]

InnocentVillager Hayasaka - If there weren't a join date to prove it wrong, I'd swear this is a new player. Seems rather lost and inconsistent. I had no meta on predecessor despite her apparently being well known to others in the player list. Feels a little suspicious.

This is kind of just my play style, I’m very open on where I’m confused/don’t have an opinion, I am pretty much word vomit with no filter especially when I’m town (I think?) as I don’t take notes anywhere else, I get that this means people might think I have less credibility for my “bounciness” but I also don’t like having reads when I don’t feel like there should be one, id rather not have a read than have a misguided one

[innocentvillager]

I think we’re on the same page as far as having no real gut scumreads though? That part has been a bit challenging for me, admittedly I don’t have experience with multi ball at all I think

[innocentvillager]

Fully from memory, in player list order. Gaps are for separating 1-liners from more extensive impressions, not for read grouping:

Almost50 - I think he's town based on a meta factor that I'm unwilling to let him know what it is
AGar - Seems to have opinions which are reasonable based on things in the thread

Malakittens - Claims to have RL balance issue, which is something I wouldn't doubt. Seems to be more in touch and less catching up than RL balance issues would imply. If she's unwilling / unable to push someone that she normally would via meta that could be a sign that she's scum with nothing to push. I don't know her meta well enough to know what she would push.

dramonic - Focus within the thread is a little narrow, but it fits what I know about his meta. Don't remember if I have seen him as scum and not inclined to go digging just yet.

The Bulge - Conversations seem to be town motivated
SirCakez - Extremely typical meta wise. Bad early takes don't make him scum by themselves. I'll need to read again with more context.
notscience - Conversations seem to be town motivated
Elements - I don't know if scum!Elements has the chops to be so brazenly clueless. Fits with meta, don't know if I have seen a scum game.

Xayah - Falling far below expectations but I can't remember if she has given a RL in this game. Perhaps a bit suspicious?
davesaz - Pretty obviously town if I don't mind saying so myself
Dunnstral - Very standard for meta, very unreadable, very null
InnocentVillager

Hayasaka

- If there weren't a join date to prove it wrong, I'd swear this is a new player. Seems rather lost and inconsistent. I had no meta on predecessor despite her apparently being well known to others in the player list. Feels a little suspicious.

Not_Mafia - Very standard for meta, perhaps slightly under performing. In someone with more mainstream meta I'd scum read this pretty hard.

One general comment trend that I'll go along with, there isn't enough overt scumminess in this game. It leaves me with no genuine gut scum reads and that's not good.

Is there actually an opinion in here?

do you find anything scummy about this readslist? im not sure if that's what you're implying or not

[innocentvillager]

idk, i don't know dave's meta

some people just tend to focus a lot on meta? are you saying you find it scummy because you think he's just using meta to posture without actual opinions/analysis?

[innocentvillager]

@xayah you dont have to answer obviously because you've said you wouldn't but if you care to it would be interesting to know why you think cakez is town.

[innocentvillager]

I agree with part of what you're saying. I may have failed to get across the point that I don't (and never) question statements about RL. I'm often highly affected by RL myself and get offended if someone doesn't take my comments about RL at face value.

I think it's still valid to comment about what people with RL conflicts do when they are here. There have been times when people made such comments about my posting and I had to step back from thinking it was a comment about RL and realize it was about the content.

So, for the record that part of my thoughts about Mala are about the content when she's here. She seems aware about what's going on but unusually quiet regarding doing anything about it.

100% agree with first two lines.

Regarding Mala I think I see what you're saying? I usually skim over some pages to get a vague sense of what's going on but I haven't like "read the whole thread" per say which usually doesnt make me feel good about pushing stuff so I'll post impressions or respond to stuff that sticks out

I get why you think that might be scummy but I don't believe it is AI necessarily

[innocentvillager]

If a player is being down you murder him with the fury of a thousand suns game after game until he stops being stupid or quits

lmfao

guess i should quit

[innocentvillager]

i mean your personal views on meta aside i still think you're just reaching with your scum!dave narrative because I don't necessarily see anything AI about using meta on players you know as an avenue to read them

regardless of if it's the correct thing to do or not, or if players should/shouldn't be encouraged for being dumb because "that's just their (town)meta"

pedit: thnk u i will reevaluate

[innocentvillager]

Plus if his read is right (and you believe it to be so) he's the person on top of the 'you should kill' list for w/e scum team isn't on it

im sorry, i don't understand english can you rephrase this or you can keep lurking w/e all good

[innocentvillager]

Ele/Mala/NM/Dramonic seem to be the only people I'd vote d1 here

Strong agree

i don't think i want any of these people d1

[innocentvillager]

lol we are really not vibing huh

i don't see any problem with them, null

[innocentvillager]

as dumb as this is going to sound ive never seen troll scum spam "I'm town" so apathetically, granted i don't think ive played with many people as trolly as NM but still something to consider

[innocentvillager]

I can ask right? If he doesn't want to explain it whatever

Just because I don't have a concrete reason for voting you doesn't mean I can't ask other people if they want to share their opinions? idk what you want from me

and yeah id rather not elim NM d1

[innocentvillager]

Tell me why you shouldn't be invited to be our first departure.

Dunnstral - Very standard for meta, very unreadable, very null

because of this

[innocentvillager]

oops, guess i ruined it

[innocentvillager]

V/LA until Monday

sorry this should be my last V/LA for a while

will still try to post ~every day or so

[innocentvillager]

Re:notmaf.

He had the same entrance when he replaced in to mini 2153 (that post with all the colors and stuff) and the very first thought that went through my head was “this could be scum circumventing something they already did as town.” But I didn’t say anything because I wanted to see what he did before I started conf biasing.

But there’s none of the aggression. He doesn’t feel notmafia enough but on further evaluation I don’t get why he would not feel notmafia enough because he actually would have to scumhunt

Mmmm

so you’re saying because this is multiball it’s null not scummy on further reflection?

[innocentvillager]

imo that constitutes it not really being scummy, especially if your only basis for the scumread is a one game town meta

for a troll player like nm I feel like he’s just going to do whatever he feels like as either alignment

[innocentvillager]

can someone explain why AGar is town

[innocentvillager]

2) I think it's opportunistic that you're think IV is scum. I'm not talking about your SC read.

i don't understand the whole opportunistic thing on me or why he's scumreading "me for being me"

[innocentvillager]

I got the same thought tbh

[innocentvillager]

oh no the mala ate is here

[innocentvillager]

I think Dave is town? Or his partners AGar lol

[innocentvillager]

actually wait no I doubt they’re partners

Okay I think I see where you’re coming from with that first post? It’s an interesting nuanced take and interesting takes are *generally* townie but fakeable

The bottom two are definitely fakeable and personality indicative more than AI

[innocentvillager]

ummm are you sure NS

[innocentvillager]

if you keep citing that one game you played with her... well let’s just say I will not be impressed lol

[innocentvillager]

I think mala is town Ns

[innocentvillager]

idk why you jumped to the conclusion that mala elim me now was a scumclaim

Kind of weird tbh

[innocentvillager]

VOTE: notscience

[innocentvillager]

idk why you jumped to the conclusion that mala elim me now was a scumclaim

Kind of weird tbh

Clown me for it I’m not in the mood

this seems really dramatic and pings me the wrong way especially when there's no wagon on you

it's like you purposely want me to townread you or something for being standoffish

[innocentvillager]

VOTE: Not Mafia

i will go here for d1 but i think i want to revisit NS later

[innocentvillager]

im also not in the mood to get in a fight with anyone especially NS whatever

[innocentvillager]

I might be back like just before deadline but I am super swamped with RL until then and I’m not going to check in again until then, sorry

I’m on NM bc there’s no one better really at this point and it actually could be a scumslot, at worst it’s null

[innocentvillager]

NS <3 sorry man I snapped too I’ll think about our interaction later if it’s necessarily but it probably wasn’t AI like I thought