In post 1478, ika wrote:Day 1: mafia lynch
night one: sk (non-bp) and other scum cross shoot
day 2: town wins
That could happen, definitely. However, every 10:2:1 has a soft spot for events like that. And it's really hard to balance a 9:3:1 in my opinion.
By the way, other setups have weak points too. Eg the classic Matrix-6 has this: Setup is Mafia Roleblocker, Town Cop, Town Doctor; Roleblocker gets lynched on Day1; Follow the Cop from Day2.
In post 1481, vettrock wrote:If the serial killer is investigation immune, The only possibly guilty for the cop is the goon, which pretty much removes most of the power of the power role, and the second power role only protects the first, so its power is limited as well.
Yeah, Setup (2) and (12) are low-powered by nature. It wouldn't be worth to make them even lower.
In post 1484, ika wrote:
sk should be able to chose between being BP or II each night not an all game thing
And that is a great idea. Let's examine it (without the Strongman ability). Keep in mind that the SK doesn't know which Setup is on.
(12) – SK can play either pro-town and go for being Bulletproof or moderately scummy and trigger a fake investigation. The latter one is risky because there's a Godfather too. And after the first shot Mafia knows who the SK is. Both of them are useful but not overpowered.
(2) – Similar to (12), however being Investigate Immune is useless at Even Nights. Roleblocker is a threat the SK can't deal with but still can WIFOM-ize it via a No Kill (...after it has become clear that the Setup is (2)...) Being Bulletproof is more useful in this Setup, but II is not entirely useless. None of the abilities are overpowered.
(7) – By being Investigate Immune can avoid the Tracker, whereas the JOAT is a nasty surprise (although everything is 1-shot there). Nothing against the Jailkeeper, but Jailkeeping doesn't confirms anything in itself. Being II seems to be a bit more useful, however Bulletproof is not useless. Again, nothing is overpowered.
Losing the Strongman is a pain in (2), because of the chance of getting Roleblocked. However, this is compensated more or less with the free choice of II/BP. In (7) the game gets slower because the Jailkeeper can stop the SK-kill too. I think this is compensated fully with the free choice. Also, slowing down the kills in a 9:3:1 is a very good thing, I suppose.
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Also, check the Discussion page of the wiki,
Matrix_14 too!
LamaFluff had problems with (2), (4), (9), (11) and (14). We stopped the discussion partly because of the start of the game, partly because of the Setup contest. What's your opinion about his concerns and my answers?
Also, mind my last question about "alignment-unconfirmable" PRs!
(If anyone's interested in: LamaFluff wrote me that Matrix 14 was the 4th in the Contest. The weakest point was Originality and that's true; Matrix 14 is not about Originality at all. ^_^)
