In post 425, RC most awesomest wrote:VOTE: hiraki
If you're town ask the mod for spoilers and don't call me scum ever again.
Open 723: Purgatory! (Hell Phase 3)
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Hiraki - Thanks for continuing to replace into games. it's a great service to the site. Sorry you replaced into a losing position, even if you won the game.
NM - Once gain I dont understand how df you survive day one in any game, but you successfully hit the nail on the head through almost the entire game so well played.
RC - I'm unsure how much of your AtE and overbearing posturing was due to your personality and you literally felt every attack was a personal one against you and turned your game into !feelings, and how much of it was scum posturing, but this is the sitemeta that is why I haven't played a game in years, and am rethinking playing the one I am inned to right now. It has become site meta that "play to win" is more important than "play to have fun". These two should not be mutually exclusive, but they have become so. Playing to win as a bad guy means personal attacks, vendettas, lying about everything ,raging, etc. and it isn't just you, it's a large number of players. That isn't a game. That's a stress inducing mental gymnastics. For both the perpetrator and the receiver. If your play WASNT just scum!manipulation, then you are as hurt mentally and emotionally by it as much as others, because you didn't seem to have a fun game. Any single player playing to their wincon should not negate the rest of the players having fun. This is a game, not a competition to see who can win the most games or have the best win percentage as town or as scum. If players want that, go play comp on epicmafia. Dont turn every game into a personal issue because it will help you win.
ruru - i enjoyed your martyr posting, and appreciate you're sticking around.
everyone else - I hope you had fun!ShowReturning to modding after a nearly two year hiatus!
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I don't understand how it doesn't seem personal to you when someone is basically saying that you shouldnt be allowed to play the game because you're good as scum but you would understand it if you had lived it.
I should have just replaced out.2019 stats: Town WR 76.7%, overall WR 81.667%, 1 scum defeat involving a major mod error in lylo vs 8 scum wins.- Mathdino
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wait LOL
i had nothing to do with this setup's creation or executionIn post 25, RC most awesomest wrote:remind me to never play an open setup again
ever since the arrival of mathdino they've become awful- AP
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GG.
@Maruchan: Thank you for modding
@ruru/teacher: Thank you for making the correct choice
@N_M: Lynching Alch with me would've end the game sooner
Oh, and..
@ruru: Ireallydidn't notice Hiraki got lynched already. I was 1 page behind and didn't even notice that I was, so wasn't aware of any posts on the page where he got lynched.
You wanna know something even fannier? I wasn't keeping taps on the vote count for the first lynch of the game either.Now go join 728 before it's full.Lots of familiar faces alreadyYEAH BABY YEAH!
Oh, behave- Maruchan
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Secret alt? People advocated policy lynched me for quite some time after some blunders I madeShowReturning to modding after a nearly two year hiatus!
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Knock it off. You're still to blame. In fact, would you share with the class how the Hawaii Volcano erupted?In post 605, Mathdino wrote:wait LOL
i had nothing to do with this setup's creation or executionIn post 25, RC most awesomest wrote:remind me to never play an open setup again
ever since the arrival of mathdino they've become awfulYEAH BABY YEAH!
Oh, behave- Mathdino
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probably something to do with toxic fumes and hot air- Hiraki
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In other words.. a dinosaur farted!In post 609, Mathdino wrote:probably something to do with toxic fumes and hot airYEAH BABY YEAH!
Oh, behave- brassherald
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How dare you not get involved in making these setups. It's all your fault.In post 605, Mathdino wrote:wait LOL
i had nothing to do with this setup's creation or executionIn post 25, RC most awesomest wrote:remind me to never play an open setup again
ever since the arrival of mathdino they've become awful
Also when you are involved, it is also all your fault. Everything is terrible forever because of you./sI've only made one good post, and don't you dare accuse me of doing it again.- ruru
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I'm really sorry you felt that wayIn post 598, RadiantCowbells wrote:I just stopped wanting to play the game when someone I had never played with started advocating policy lynching me D1.
Not even mentioning the idea would be an insult to your scum game though honestly
In post 602, Maruchan wrote:NM - Once gain I dont understand how df you survive day one in any game
I guess UglyDuck being too scummy to policy lynch anyone d1 probably helped
Also people have said NM is readable, lolhammers are whatever in mountainous, and there were a couple of things later that made me think he was town although I really have no idea if they were valid reads or just luck
Okay, so I actually have a lot of thoughts on thisIt has become site meta that "play to win" is more important than "play to have fun". These two should not be mutually exclusive, but they have become so. Playing to win as a bad guy means personal attacks, vendettas, lying about everything ,raging, etc. and it isn't just you, it's a large number of players. That isn't a game. That's a stress inducing
So I read RC's post and it made me want to stop playing the game and then I slept on it and I got over it, in large part because it could have just been him playing to win (apparently not actually the case, but still)
I've been flamed much worse outside of mafia and generally don't really care that much, the only reason I cared is that I actually really look up to RC's play so being flamed by him in particular felt pretty bad
Personally I do believe in playing to win. If I don't do something because I'm personally uncomfortable with it then I really think that's me being a suboptimal mafia player, not me being a morally awesome person. Like I'm pretty sure there are a lot of optimal scum plays for example that rely on yelling at people and making them feel terrible until they do what's asked, which is not at all my personality. I mean, I can be individually super toxic but in most situations more cold than hot and specifically trying to command groups of people to do things does not come naturally at all to me. If it came naturally to me, I would probably be trying to use it to my advantage in game.
I don't think it's unique to scum play either. The only thing that even caused me to be more assertive in my games here was seeing the town rolecard and actually realizing that yes, I could be ruining the game for the experienced players and playing awful, but also I don't know their alignment so I have to try anyway. I didn't even understand this feeling in my first game on site which is probably why I was so obvious scum.
I normally would never be that assertive talking to players whom I know are like 20 times better / more experienced than I am at a game if I know they're on my team. I think me being stubborn newb town d1 in 721 is another example of playing to win, possibly at the expense of everyone else's fun (hi Md) if it turns out I'm actually just throwing.
Policy lynching RC, had I actually done it, would also be an example of playing to win at other people's expense. It's not very nice if it actually prevents RC from playing mafia because someone does it every game, and if people notice it decreases his scum winrate from 95% to 0%, it's pretty likely to catch on. The "ethical" thing is to lynch the least charismatic poster like usual d1 so that people aren't punished for being good at the game.
I hate lying like 100 times more than I hate yelling insults at people, but this is a game where scum at the very least are supposed to behave unethically, like being pretty much required to lie, and anyone can roll scum, so I feel like it's pretty much expected that people are going to do what they think it takes to win the game, even if it's not a nice thing to do.
In any case this post is getting way too long. While "what should be acceptable site meta" isn't really my concern, I really, really, don't want people WKing me out of game over this in particular and it would be super hypocritical for me to say nothing here. I have no idea where the line is supposed to be drawn when one of the rules of the game is that you play to your wincon.
Feel free to WK me in game though- ruru
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In post 606, AP wrote:@Maruchan: Thank you for moddingThanks Maruchan!- ruru
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In post 606, AP wrote:@ruru: Ireallydidn't notice Hiraki got lynched already. I was 1 page behind and didn't even notice that I was, so wasn't aware of any posts on the page where he got lynched.
You wanna know something even fannier? I wasn't keeping taps on the vote count for the first lynch of the game either.Now go join 728 before it's full.Lots of familiar faces already
We really need to stop erroneously scumreading each other sometime
Although I feel like you towntold pretty hard later on so it worked out anyway- Not_Mafia
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I just scroll past RC AtE and wait for him to calm downAlso, what is NM doing? Worst play I’ve ever seen.I can't remember the last N_M post that wasn't bland, unimaginative and lame. Some shitposters are at least somewhat funny. You are the epitomy of the type of poster that nobody would miss if you were to suddenly disappear. You never add anything of value.I'm guessing you haven't read the game and probably never will? Why even sign up to play?- ruru
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Miss phrased that. Lying is expected. Lying about mod communications pointlessly, lying about personal opinions of people, lying about emotions etc is what I meantIn post 613, ruru wrote:
I'm really sorry you felt that wayIn post 598, RadiantCowbells wrote:I just stopped wanting to play the game when someone I had never played with started advocating policy lynching me D1.
Not even mentioning the idea would be an insult to your scum game though honestly
In post 602, Maruchan wrote:NM - Once gain I dont understand how df you survive day one in any game
I guess UglyDuck being too scummy to policy lynch anyone d1 probably helped
Also people have said NM is readable, lolhammers are whatever in mountainous, and there were a couple of things later that made me think he was town although I really have no idea if they were valid reads or just luck
Okay, so I actually have a lot of thoughts on thisIt has become site meta that "play to win" is more important than "play to have fun". These two should not be mutually exclusive, but they have become so. Playing to win as a bad guy means personal attacks, vendettas, lying about everything ,raging, etc. and it isn't just you, it's a large number of players. That isn't a game. That's a stress inducing
So I read RC's post and it made me want to stop playing the game and then I slept on it and I got over it, in large part because it could have just been him playing to win (apparently not actually the case, but still)
I've been flamed much worse outside of mafia and generally don't really care that much, the only reason I cared is that I actually really look up to RC's play so being flamed by him in particular felt pretty bad
Personally I do believe in playing to win. If I don't do something because I'm personally uncomfortable with it then I really think that's me being a suboptimal mafia player, not me being a morally awesome person. Like I'm pretty sure there are a lot of optimal scum plays for example that rely on yelling at people and making them feel terrible until they do what's asked, which is not at all my personality. I mean, I can be individually super toxic but in most situations more cold than hot and specifically trying to command groups of people to do things does not come naturally at all to me. If it came naturally to me, I would probably be trying to use it to my advantage in game.
I don't think it's unique to scum play either. The only thing that even caused me to be more assertive in my games here was seeing the town rolecard and actually realizing that yes, I could be ruining the game for the experienced players and playing awful, but also I don't know their alignment so I have to try anyway. I didn't even understand this feeling in my first game on site which is probably why I was so obvious scum.
I normally would never be that assertive talking to players whom I know are like 20 times better / more experienced than I am at a game if I know they're on my team. I think me being stubborn newb town d1 in 721 is another example of playing to win, possibly at the expense of everyone else's fun (hi Md) if it turns out I'm actually just throwing.
Policy lynching RC, had I actually done it, would also be an example of playing to win at other people's expense. It's not very nice if it actually prevents RC from playing mafia because someone does it every game, and if people notice it decreases his scum winrate from 95% to 0%, it's pretty likely to catch on. The "ethical" thing is to lynch the least charismatic poster like usual d1 so that people aren't punished for being good at the game.
I hate lying like 100 times more than I hate yelling insults at people, but this is a game where scum at the very least are supposed to behave unethically, like being pretty much required to lie, and anyone can roll scum, so I feel like it's pretty much expected that people are going to do what they think it takes to win the game, even if it's not a nice thing to do.
In any case this post is getting way too long. While "what should be acceptable site meta" isn't really my concern, I really, really, don't want people WKing me out of game over this in particular and it would be super hypocritical for me to say nothing here. I have no idea where the line is supposed to be drawn when one of the rules of the game is that you play to your wincon.
Feel free to WK me in game thoughShowReturning to modding after a nearly two year hiatus!
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I think his comment had to do with how people try to mathematically break Open setups.In post 605, Mathdino wrote:wait LOL
i had nothing to do with this setup's creation or executionIn post 25, RC most awesomest wrote:remind me to never play an open setup again
ever since the arrival of mathdino they've become awful- Alchemist21
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I wish I knew how. I'm not sure I could reliably read him.In post 613, ruru wrote:Also people have said NM is readable- RadiantCowbells
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I am town far more often than I am scum and the town equity I add when I'm left alone is very high. It's not to your advantage to policy lynch me every game regardless of how it feels to you.
I'm not playing with you again but I hold nothing against you out of game. I'm not tracking hydra w/l regardless because I don't want to feel obligated to meticulously micromanage my partners as scum.
But I have no desire to play with someone with your attitude and I don't feel like I should have to.2019 stats: Town WR 76.7%, overall WR 81.667%, 1 scum defeat involving a major mod error in lylo vs 8 scum wins.- Scummies
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