Mini Normal 2012: Tropical Mafia [Endgame]

[Mumble]

Hi. Looks like I missed RVS due to the weekend.

Shame.

[Mumble]

VOTE: Shoshin

[Mumble]

VOTE: Shoshin

Were you caught up at the time of this vote?

Yes.

[Mumble]

you know I really hate when people do stuff like that. sometimes people are busy irl, telling people to "do stuff" isn't really being helpful and it kind of pisses me off.

Agree.

Plus, I am doing stuff. Sorry if you don't care for/understand what I am doing.

[Mumble]

I aint out here berating y'all. I posted a readslist and was explaining that I'm nullreading several people cuz they haven't done stuff yet.

No. You said "do stuff" which is a command.

If you were explaining that you were nullreading several people "cuz they haven't done stuff yet" you would have said "Null. Hasn't done much yet."

[Mumble]

I haven't seen any questions aimed at me in the last few pages, so here's my prodge:

I getting a vibe from texcat that she'll be easier to sort as the game goes forward and more substantial info comes up. Nullreading her for now.
I think BBT should reveal his townread. Since the only posters between 64 and 71 are me, bacy and Invisibility, I'm guessing it's bacy, but it would be nice to get official confirmation.

Lynchplan:
VOTE: Invisibility
2. havingfitz
3. Shoshin
4. Gustavo

Interesting. Why Invisibility?

[Mumble]

He's not providing clear arguments for his reads. His "what?" trilogy (151 153 155) is probably the best example, along with the (19 23 28) trio early on.

So why naked vote him (essentially doing what you are scum reading him for) instead of asking him to clarify?

Because I see an alternative reason for your vote...

[Mumble]

Wait...what? You were already voting him. Why did you vote the same slot again?

[Mumble]

Um...I'm not new? The re-vote is ridiculous and confusing (especially since I'm having a time differentiating you and Gustavo).

However, you didn't answer my question about clarification, and instead try to throw shade on me for a really weak reason.

VOTE: Garuga

[Mumble]

By "him", I was referring to Invis, not you.

I got that. The following sentence was referring to my posting.

[Mumble]

So, assuming the entirety of that was directed at Invisibility (unclear, but I'll assume), I agree with the points he made on you at the time. You feel like you're scum reading him because he voted you.

[Mumble]

I think my vote is better served here for the moment.

VOTE: TheRampage

[Mumble]

That was an infinitely dumb move if true. Town PRs (which you are despite your statement) should never claim absent L-1 and intent (sans some specific situations).

I read your ISO, and it was not good. Maybe work on that.

Have you played in the Newbie Queue yet?

[Mumble]

Curious.

Why?

[Mumble]

Summarize your D1 points. I don't see how his refusal to hammer Rampage while pushing another read is scum oriented. Looking at his ISO, I don't see anything to assume he knew Rampage would flip town and that seems presumptuous.

p-edit

Why is JJD the scummiest to you?

p-p-edit

ffs. Why are you talking about fitz now?

[Mumble]

Absolutely not. You're bouncing. You answer.

[Mumble]

VOTE: Shosin

Now answer my fucking questions.

[Mumble]

To the fuckard above me...You denied me any ability to fully play by hammering early. I didn't get a chance to do anything because the day ended early due to BBT's incessant pushing and your naked hammer. I've not implied that I think Invis is town...I asked why you think he was scum given your naked opening vote. I jumped on Rampage because we hadn't had a wagon at that point, and wagons are good (absent dumbasses who will end the day early with them).

I would and will vote you if you decide not to answer for your scumminess...yes. You were voting for Invis, but pushing Fitz...why? Answer that. You are now voting me because I scum read and voted you.

You are obv scumming at this point. Enjoy trying to push me.

[Mumble]

Invisibility, join me on Mumble!

you were literally voting me a few posts ago what

While pushing Fitz as scum.

[Mumble]

Invisibility, join me on Mumble!

you were literally voting me a few posts ago what

So what? I'm voting Mumble now and you should join.

So what? Because, as scum you are just trying to secure a town mislynch.

[Mumble]

im kinda feeling shoshin as town tbh, will post more thoughts in the morning though

Looking forward to it given their votes versus thoughts today.

[Mumble]

Like...literally, nothing you quoted was a defense for Invis, nor does it state that I have a townread on Invis.

Could you go back an explain why you vote Invis while pushing Fitz? I'm keen on understanding that. You know...cuz that's how you opened the day unprompted.

[Mumble]

I didn't push HF. I raised concerns about his play.

Bullshit:

HF's failure to reevaluate anything, as well as his non-opposition to the Rampage lynch while never actually taking much of a position about Rampage, worries me. I also think Garuga's death makes a lot of sense from a scum HF perspective (Garuga scumread him, after all).

[Mumble]

You are calling him scum while voting another slot.

[Mumble]

You are calling him scum while voting another slot.

Do you think there's only one scum in the game?

No, but I think it's odd to push one while voting someone else. That is, if you don't know who they are.

[Mumble]

I didn't push HF. I raised concerns about his play.

Also, are you saying that you didn't push HF?

Just want to confirm that.

[Mumble]

No, but I think it's odd to push one while voting someone else. That is, if you don't know who they are.

I wasn't pushing HF, unless by "push" you mean "raising concerns about a player." I brought up an issue with his play about which I wanted feedback, that's all. It's how I go about refining reads. But even if I were pushing multiple players, there's nothing "odd" about that when you know there's multiple scum. I'm usually pretty happy if my 2nd strongest scumread is the lynch.

The issue is the timing. You opened up with a naked vote on Invis (meaning no reasoning attached, though when pressed you provided one), but gave reasoning for a scum read on Fitz (without a vote). That's a push.

From what I can see, you voted me because of my scumread on you (and have yet to answer my initial questions).

Could you answer my initial questions?

[Mumble]

I think I like a BBT/Invisibility scumteam right now.

Gonna reread everything tomorrow at work before deciding what lynch to push.

Like, I could see scum!BBT based on his end of day play yesterday (and the start of today), but why are you doing it off associatives at this point? Your going to have to give something more than you think he's bussing.

[Mumble]

I think Shoshin is town fwiw.

Why?

[Mumble]

Mumble, before I answer any more of your questions, why don't you tell us your thoughts on the game?

Good luck with that.

Get bent.

[Mumble]

Invisibility, join me on Mumble!

you were literally voting me a few posts ago what

While pushing Fitz as scum.

I really dislike this, I push people all the time while voting someone else. And I hate when people tell me how to use my vote. Just because I'm voting someone doesn't even mean I think they're scum, it's usually to see their reaction to being voted. It helps me read them, and there's a lot of times I'll think someone else is scummier but I want to get the reaction from my vote before I move it.

And I'm not saying this is what Shoshin was doing, but I can see myself doing it pretty easy. I just don't like the push from Mumble.

You don't ever like anything that I do in any game whatsoever.

What you are saying is you don't like what I was pushing because you act a certain way, but Shoshin may or may not act that way meaning what I pushed could be valid, but you still don't like it because of the way you play. Yeah...ok.

It's bad that he was pushing Invis/Me/Fitz and then immediately asking Invis to get on my wagon.

[Mumble]

But Mumble feels attacked? And then votes Garuga? I'm having trouble picturing a townie interpret 311 as an attack.

Then read 314 to see I thought the post was directed at me, not Invis, and then stop trying to shade me for made up reasons.

[Mumble]

It's a fine lynch but I'm sticking with Mumble for the moment. Why do you prefer Invisibility?

So both Invis and I are scum?

[Mumble]

Jodaxq can be town.

[Mumble]

Hope everyone (in the US) had a good Memorial Day. Back later.

[Mumble]

I don't understand why everyone is so hesitant to vote Mumble... I laid out exactly why he's scum here... His response to 311 isn't a natural reading of Garuga's post; it shows that Mumble's interacting with town (i.e. Garuga) with a defensive mindset, as if Garuga is after him when Garuga indicated no such thing.

But Mumble feels attacked? And then votes Garuga? I'm having trouble picturing a townie interpret 311 as an attack.

Then read 316 to see I thought the post was directed at me, not Invis, and then stop trying to shade me for made up reasons.

Hi.

You want to keep ignoring my response? Makes it easier for you to push me, right.

(note: the original pointed to 314, when I meant to point to 316. I've edited it here)

[Mumble]

Is that bias indicative of alignment? Yes, because it's a bias that comes exclusively from a scum perspective. While scum would've known that Garuga was after them because scum would've known that Garuga was town, town wouldn't have had any reason to believe Garuga was after them unless they strongly believed that Garuga was scum (and Mumble didn't strongly believe Garuga was scum because he immediately changed his vote after Garuga clarified his meaning).

ffs

We were three days into D1, I didn't have a strong read on anyone. I started engaging with Garuga, and thought that he took Rampage up to be a competing wagon with Invis which is why I originally started questioning him. Realized he was already on the wagon which is why I asked why he voted again. He then made a post that I interpreted as push on me for a very weak reason so voted Garuga. After clarification, I had no reason to keep pushing him, wanted a real wagon since we hadn't had one yet in the day (hence "better served) so voted Rampage.

You aren't as smart as you think you are. Your cognitive science is junk. You are possibly being bad town; but, more likely, are scum grasping to push my lynch.

Stop posting walls of junk. Stop tunneling for bad reasons. Stop crapping up the game.

[Mumble]

And, with that, I'm done with you.

[Mumble]

Not Voting (6): Havo, Jodaxq, texcat, JarJarDrinks, bacy, havingfitz

Hi.

Can this group do something (preferably vote Shoshin)?

Particularly interested in texcat playing or replacing out since she's pretty much prod dodged this entire game.

[Mumble]

I meant with your vote, but yeah...fair enough. Ya got me.

[Mumble]

There's clearly scum in this group of Mumble/Invisibility/JJD/Gustavo, though obviously not all of them, so I dunno. I'd like to lynch within that group, it's just a matter of figuring out who the scum is.

Why is it clear that scum is in that group of 4 players specifically? Is this just your 4 biggest scumreads?

It's those who are voting her or openly disagreed with her cognitive science nonsense.

[Mumble]

L O FUCKING L

[Mumble]

In my town pool for now.

[Mumble]

75% confidence level. We have similar town reads and he is the counterwagon to you, who I think is scum.

[Mumble]

75% confidence is basically random? Fucking lol. Why am I even interacting with you?

[Mumble]

Between Texcat or BBT. Leaning BBT.

[Mumble]

Shoshin push on me this game feels almost identical to Shoshin on Byron in Scientific mafia.

[Mumble]

Between Texcat or BBT. Leaning BBT.

These reads feel kind of random. Feel like explaining em?

Yeah, sure. Wait until I get to a computer though.

[Mumble]

I actually like Mumble's reads on Tex and BBT. They're probably wrong, but they make sense given his internal logic.

He defended BBT earlier.

wut? When?

[Mumble]

How is that a defense when I said I could see scumBBT?

[Mumble]

^
I'm down to lynch this if not Shoshin.

[Mumble]

I was fed information.

I thought you had it too. If you were town, I think you would have the same information as me. But you don't seem to.

I just checked the Wiki and there is no normal role that would allow both you and Shoshin to be fed information at the same time.

[Mumble]

BBT said he was the recipient of information that he thinks Shoshin should have as well. Friendly Neighbor wouldn't do that, and there are no modifiers that would give it the ability to do so.

Think BBT just needs to explain, because all he's doing right now is causing confusion.

[Mumble]

I disagree unless Mumble is also scum, because otherwise BBT could have stuck on Mumble with me instead of going for Invisibility.

You don't think I'm scum anymore?

[Mumble]

Shoshin is trying to explain that at start of Day I was pushing Mumbles with her. After asking her if she wanted to work with me.

Despite agreeing to do this, I then switched over to Invisibility on my own accord. Why does scum!BBT push town!Mumbles and then move onto scum!Invisibility for no reason? Hence Shoshin saying it only makes sense if Mumble is scum as well.

I find that I'm in a really strange position here - I'm hard town reading Shoshin but something isn't right. I want more people to weigh in with their opinions.

You need to explain what info you received to think Shoshin is scum, and why you waited until Invis was at L-1 to bring it up.

[Mumble]

Um...by explaining how what you received made you 95% sure Shoshin is scum. You've created a state of chaos, and town you should want to remedy that.

[Mumble]

Redirected? Bus drove? Role blocked?

Redirect/Bus drove are not normal.

Role blocked is possible.

[Mumble]

Either way, you shouldn't ever rely on what happens at night. I use roles as corroboration for behaviors, but never against.

You should usually rely on a probable guilty.

Mafia is a game of probabilities, no?

[Mumble]

But if scum had a roleblocker, why not block the claimed PR and try to hit another with the nk?

[Mumble]

Redirect is not possible in a normal game.

[Mumble]

All I know is I didn't receive a fruit and I'm town as fuck.

No, you're not.

BBT getting roleblocked makes a lot of sense with an Invisibility/Mumble team.

No, it doesn't. Why would scum with a RB roleblock an unknown slot versus a known PR? Makes no sense.

More likely, you are caught scum scrambling.

[Mumble]

Is it possible BBT was Jailkept?

It's possible. That would make more sense than scum blocking him.

[Mumble]

Now, what are the odds we have a JK and the JK chose BBT?

I'm not sure how to determine that.

[Mumble]

Why would scum with a RB roleblock an unknown slot versus a known PR?

The obvious reason is because they were killing the known PR.

That's a bad reason. They can keep a known PR useless while PR hunting elsewhere. That's Mafia 101.

We're lynching Shoshin today.

[Mumble]

BBT is probably a scum PR that his action blocked.

Why?

[Mumble]

When scum have a roleblocker and know there's a PR, they could roleblock the PR or they could kill the PR. I don't see why Mumble's ruling out the latter option.

Probability.

As I said, it's Mafia 101 with a RB to neutralize a PR and PR hunt elsewhere. I already said that. You are intentionally ignoring me.

It makes no sense to roleblock an unknown slot when you have a known slot. Do you disagree with that? If so, what is the benefit to doing so?

[Mumble]

Because he's scum for sure and it looks like hes trying to out a power roll "Golly Gee why would scum block me?"

If he's scum, he's made himself an easy lynch. Why is he scum for sure?

[Mumble]

Why are we lynching Invis over Shoshin?

[Mumble]

Probability.

As I said, it's Mafia 101 with a RB to neutralize a PR and PR hunt elsewhere. I already said that. You are intentionally ignoring me.

It makes no sense to roleblock an unknown slot when you have a known slot. Do you disagree with that? If so, what is the benefit to doing so?

Just because you say something is "mafia 101" doesn't mean it is or that it's the likely choices mafia made in this game.

It makes sense to roleblock an unknown slot when you kill the known slot, which is what the mafia did. Why are you ignoring the fact that mafia killed Garuga?

There is no benefit to killing a slot that you can neutralize while killing elsewhere. None. Maybe on your homesite they may do that, but a quality player here will not. It is standard advice that was given in the Newbie queue when Matrix 6 was the setup.

I'm not participating in your tunneling anymore. You did this with me, and now you are doing it with the RB scenario. Fuck off.

Lynch this pls.

[Mumble]

HOLY SHIT YOU ARE DUMB!!!!

[Mumble]

The point of the Newbie queue is to teach site meta and how to play in this site. I suggest you go join a game.

[Mumble]

Yep. It is.

P-edit

Site meta does not change every game. Please just stop.

[Mumble]

What JJD says makes sense.

BBT: Why did you target a top town read?

[Mumble]

ffs...if you don’t think you were blocked why are you not voting your guilty?

[Mumble]

Hmm...

[Mumble]

until you realize that maybe you had it right at first and that your irrational paranoia and doubts got the better of you, and so you go back to your original plan of lynching scum.

As of his last post, he still believes he has a guilty on you.

It makes no sense not to vote someone you think you have a guilty on.

I need BBT to explain that.

[Mumble]

BBT claimed Loyal Fruit Vendor and claims to have given Shoshin fruit which Shoshin says she didn't receive.

[Mumble]

Invisibility got run up to L-1 and claimed VT.

[Mumble]

I wasn't very active D1 since it ended fairly quickly. He was pretty loud about pushing TheRampage which ended up flipping town iirc.

[Mumble]

You just town read Invisibility a few pages back, so why are you back on him?

[Mumble]

Why would BB fake claim something and his partner is the one to out him??

tbf Shoshin is hard defending BBT, and is pushing hard that scum blocked him. I could see a world where both are scum.

[Mumble]

But, I don't get why BBT would fake claim to move off Invis and on to Shoshin just to move right back on Invis.

[Mumble]

Fuck off Shoshin.

[Mumble]

VOTE: Shoshin

[Mumble]

On top of everything else, this:

Invis, are you seriously town? What the fuck?

was a horrible post.

[Mumble]

UNVOTE:

What are your thoughts, then? I'm pretty keen on lynching this before they wall up the place again.

[Mumble]

I'm not a fan of the "slow down," btw.

[Mumble]

VOTE: Shoshin

Don't see why she needs to come off L-2.

What are your thoughts on potential associations, tex? You have been largely absent sans vote parking on two town lynches.

[Mumble]

Same goes to Havo and Fitz (while you voted Shoshin D1, you unvoted when the wagon started to grow), and bacy.

[Mumble]

We haven't seen anything but town flips. I'm not sure what good associations are going to do is at this point.

Then why unvote? What do you think Shoshin is going to say to change your mind?

[Mumble]

Scum is in Shoshin, at least one lurker slot (possibly two)...maybe Dredd.

[Mumble]

Why wouldn't that have come out D2?

[Mumble]

Ok. But, Shoshin lynch goes through once everyone has had a chance to post.

That said, you stated that you wanted to hear from Shoshin. What did/do you want to hear?

[Mumble]

No. You said you wanted to hear from Shoshin specifically. After my unvote dropping to L-2.

I do want to hear from Shoshin

This was a specific statement.

It wasn't a "yeah sure, let's hear from Shoshin...can't hurt" or "Shoshin may reveal her teammates." You stated that you wanted to hear from Shoshin, specifically.

[Mumble]

JJD's my only town read at this point, based on the absurdity of his theories. I don't think scum would have been pushing a lynch on BBT.

Judge, is there some reason I shouldn't be town reading you? lol...

Um...

[Mumble]

It looks like everyone has shown up, and we're not going to get any forward progress until we have a scumflip...can we just lynch Shoshin now?

[Mumble]

No...you're are trying to muddy up the gamestate. That's why I want your lynch sooner rather than later.

[Mumble]

I don’t remember you asking me this before but yes I am an alt, I quit a few years ago for “reasons”. I came back to give it another go but not having positive experiences this far.

Shame. I like playing with you.

[Mumble]

Yeah your stance seems off to me and it wasn’t even a quick lynch. When people are calling for the day to end, that’s not q quick lynch. And using the timing of somebody’s v/la is just low. People can’t control when they are busy.

I don’t remember you asking me this before but yes I am an alt, I quit a few years ago for “reasons”. I came back to give it another go but not having positive experiences this far.

I said vote parking then going V/LA. Why vote and then go V/LA?
Anything inside of 10 days on this site is a quick lynch.

Doesn't quick lynch refer to the speed of the actual wagon to lynch, and not the number of days that have passed? That's my understanding.

btw...mod is king of pagetopping. I may venture to change that.

[Mumble]

mod is king of pagetopping.

ebwop: Queen (sorry)

[Mumble]

Then go ahead and vote.

[Mumble]

I want my thoughts out there first

After I post tomorrow, we'll lynch. Like I said, no rush.

You're posting now, so...

Like I said, waiting does no good.

It allows scum to plan and create. So...yeah. Let's wait.

[Mumble]

Leaning Havo or Dredd right now.

[Mumble]

Invisibility, join me on Mumble!

you were literally voting me a few posts ago what

While pushing Fitz as scum.

I really dislike this, I push people all the time while voting someone else. And I hate when people tell me how to use my vote. Just because I'm voting someone doesn't even mean I think they're scum, it's usually to see their reaction to being voted. It helps me read them, and there's a lot of times I'll think someone else is scummier but I want to get the reaction from my vote before I move it.

And I'm not saying this is what Shoshin was doing, but I can see myself doing it pretty easy. I just don't like the push from Mumble.

I'm a scumread.

I
I woulnd't argue against a Mumble lynch either. Mumble is always a difficult read for me.

I'm a scumread

I'm leaning town on Mumble and my Shoshin read went from Almost Hard town on Day 1 to not so much throughout the day 2.

Why did I change to a townread?

All I know is I didn't receive a fruit and I'm town as fuck.

No, you're not.

BBT getting roleblocked makes a lot of sense with an Invisibility/Mumble team.

No, it doesn't. Why would scum with a RB roleblock an unknown slot versus a known PR? Makes no sense.

More likely, you are caught scum scrambling.

Is it possible BBT was Jailkept?

Why ask me this specifically, and not that BBT was Roleblocked?

VOTE: Havo

Havo's probably scum based on his response to BBT's claim as well as his overall lack of engagement with the game.

I'm not going to hold this against you, I want that noted so when I vote you no one can say it's an OMGUS vote.

And sure, go ahead and tell us who's the scum team. But even by some crazy chance you flip town, I'm not going to put a lot of stock in it.

It's looking like Mumble was right all along. I town read you early but it was based mainly on gut, your Day 2 was bad and only got worse the longer it went.

But just for giggles, can you explain how my response to BBT's claim means I'm scum?

Still pushing the scum!Shoshin...meaning I'm still town.

No...you're are trying to muddy up the gamestate. That's why I want your lynch sooner rather than later.

I don't disagree with this.

VOTE: ShoShin

Still agreeing with me.

So, why am I now scum and not town who was wrong? BBT was town who hardpushed two town slots as scum.

Explain your swap on me, and why I am now scum.

[Mumble]

Bacy isn't confirmed, but is likely town.

[Mumble]

Is it time for a mass claim?

This is blatant PR hunting IMHO.

Uh.... dude, it’s most likely LYLO.

You need to answer my questions. A "reaction test" is not an answer. There is no way you do not have an opinion on my slot at this point, and to continue to claim so (after a town read yesterday) in LyLo is a scumclaim.

Answer my questions in your next post, or I will vote you and see what happens.

[Mumble]

Is it time for a mass claim?

This is blatant PR hunting IMHO.

Uh.... dude, it’s most likely LYLO.

You need to answer my questions. A "reaction test" is not an answer. There is no way you do not have an opinion on my slot at this point, and to continue to claim so (after a town read yesterday) in LyLo is a scumclaim.

Answer my questions in your next post, or I will vote you and see what happens.

I don’t do threats. Vote me. I dare you too.

VOTE: Havo

[Mumble]

UNVOTE:

[Mumble]

Answer my questions then.

[Mumble]

I mean, part of the problem with this game is that 4 out of the 7 alive players have been largely inactive this game. If there is more than one scum outside that group then we deserve a loss because we let each other tear us apart while scum sat silent.

Refusing to answer questions is part of the problem.

So, deal with rl, then come back and answer instead of viewing it as a thread (even though I already asked you without the threat).

[Mumble]

Still readable. Thank you.

Your thoughts on Texcat and Dredd?

[Mumble]

I'm like 95% sure that Shoshin is flipping scum here though.

Invisibilities posting around his lynch makes me think he is town.

VOTE: Invisibility

LOL. That's bloody messed up indeed! So, he has a guilty through his own action but is using someone else's posting to force a reversal on his read from 95% scum to town??

VOTE: BBT

P-edit: @BBT: What good are night actions then? You could -at least- try to figure out what happened, but you're ignoring the whole thing.

JJD and Dread works for me.

Now Vote Invisibility. Thanks.

Fine

VOTE: Invis

From my own PoV, if this flips Scum both BBT and Shoshin are less likely scum, but according to JarJar all 3 could be scum (so it doesn't mater which of them we lynch).

BBT claimed Loyal Fruit Vendor and claims to have given Shoshin fruit which Shoshin says she didn't receive.

So Shoshin is guilty or BBT got blocked. Which is more likely? Has BBT been solidly present on D1?

Doesn't even consider that BBT could be scum.

Did I really not say anything? Maybe I had the conversation in my head and not in thread?

Scum!BBT faking a guilty through a fruit vendor role is ridiculous. HE WOULD HAVE HAD TO PROVE HIS ROLE THE NEXT NIGHT OR GET LYNCHED.

So, it the ONLY way BBT could have been scum is WITH SHOSHIN. Now why would SHOSHIN DENY RECEIVING FRUIT in that situation? It implicated at least one of the two. No too bright a move either.

However, Shoshin could be scum with Town!BBT. Either that or BBT GOT ROLEBLOCKED.

If you can't go threw this very simple logic then I don't know what to say to you.

This series of posts concern me about Dredd.

[Mumble]

How do you see HF?

Quite possibly third scum. He's done fuck all this game. However, that also means less interactions to go off of. If we weren't in LyLo I would advocate to lynch him, but I don't think he should be lynched today.

[Mumble]

My issue is almost exclusively with his vote on BBT based on JJD's "case" then swap to Invis based on a simple request from BBT (a post later).

then why did u vote for BBT shortly after? Was my case that convincing ?

then why did u vote for BBT shortly after? Was my case that convincing ?

You do have a way of stating your cases, yes.

I left this out of my chain earlier. If the case was convincing, why did a simple request change his vote?

[Mumble]

Why? What information to get from that?

[Mumble]

Why do you think JarJar was the NK?

Could have been done because scum was scared that JarJar would have made a hard push on Dredd and been successful. Could have been because scum wanted to setup Dredd and have us believe my aforementioned statement. Could have been a random kill. Could have been for some other unknown reason.

I don't know why, and I don't see how speculating on it is helpful.

[Mumble]

Why do you think JarJar was the NK?

Also, answering a question with a question is annoying and sets it up so that you don't have to take a stance, so I'm giving you scumpoints for it.

[Mumble]

I obviously don't know why either, but I don't see the harm in speculating about it. And I get to see reactions to the speculation. While it's far from conclusive, I don't think we should ignore the bits of information that scum give us.

Then which one do you think is most likely, since you want to speculate?

[Mumble]

@Mumble: Let's talk about a hypothetical world where you and I are confirmed townies. Who are the 3 scums?

Havo/tex/fitz

[Mumble]

I'm inclined to believe Dredd, but I want to hear what others have to say.

texcat, why did you want to vote me prior to Dredd's claim?

[Mumble]

I'm going to need more than that. What specifically?

[Mumble]

With Dredd claiming, I want to do a full massclaim before decided where to vote. I would prefer to go last with Dredd deciding who goes first, but if someone wants to argue against that, I'm up for that discussion.

[Mumble]

I would argue that Bacy, as our closest to confirmed town, should decide on the order.

I'm fine with that too.

[Mumble]

I'm opposed to being at the front of the claims list.

[Mumble]

@Mumble....why are you town reading Bacy?

His receipt of fruit and lack of contradiction or counter.

why do you prefer that judge decides who goes first?

Because he was the first to claim today, and typically that's how popcorn works. Someone claims and then decides who is next.

[Mumble]

I was under the impression you should massclaim in LyLo.

I can see how it may not be beneficial here since you claimed with a guilty. But, I'm also a bit paranoid so maybe a massclaim will help support your claim.

[Mumble]

Or is it the day before Lylo when you are supposed to...

[Mumble]

Waiting on bacy to claim (and he needs a prod).

[Mumble]

Hi.

I'm Town Jailkeeper. I blocked BBT night 1 because I thought he was scum that would be making the kill. I blocked JarJar night 2 because I thought scum was going to kill off the wagon, and he was the towniest one of me/Gustavo/JarJar. I blocked bacy last night because I assumed scum would have killed the most confirmed town.

Given town roles, I'm going to assume 4 PRs is appropriate for the setup (even though we don't have a scum flip). Judge and I cannot be scum together because that would mean town would only have two PRs and I can't find a setup where that has happened, so tex trying to tie us together is bad.

VOTE: texcat

[Mumble]

I strongly thought she was scum, and I wasn't about to out myself just to say that I knew it wasn't a guilty.

Also, stop trying to paint me not saying anything as scummy:

I wouldn't have claimed, and I'm not positive it's correct now, but want to make sure everyone has a chance.

[Mumble]

Now I'm thinking I messed up.

[Mumble]

Now I'm thinking I messed up.

Yes you did. Quite a few times actually and for that I thank you. Couldn’t have asked for a better scum mate.

Yeah you could. texcat and havingfitz.

Thanks for "playing" you two.

[Mumble]

Parity cop isn't a whitelisted role. Under the new normal guidelines, there aren't any graylisted roles anymore - they can't be included in games.

I just assumed it was a version of a sane cop.

[Mumble]

Meh, congrats scum. I'm not surprised at all by who you are.

I think if Mumble hadn't played so bad town might have won, he pretty much lost us the game with his shit play on D2 and D3 and D4. It sucks that we mislynched Invis on D1 and D2 (sorry Invis) but that didn't mean we were doomed. By D3, I had strong townreads on Jar and relatively solid townreads on tex, fitz, and bacy (and would have felt better about this if I knew Mumble's claim) - I strongly suspected Havo, and had suspicions of Mumble (who probably could have turned my read around with his claim), Gustavo, and Judge. I don't think we were that far from figuring this out if people wouldn't have mislynched me - and that mislynch could have easily been avoided if Mumble hadn't been so dumb.

This game went from winnable to lost based entirely on Mumble's play. I hope he learns from his mistakes.

Fuck you.

If you hadn't been so derp tunnely on me I wouldn't have given you a second glance. We should have lynched you D2 and we would have been in a much better position. I still don't know why Invis was lynched, but you can't call that good town play. Did I make mistakes, sure. But to attribute this solely to me...Get off your fucking high horse, Shoshin.

[Mumble]

Fair enough, and I apologize if that came across too harshly as it was a kneejerk reaction to an insult. I don't appreciate being called out as the sole reason why town lost this game since there were many factors (which low activity town is one). I admitted I made mistakes and could have played better, but I don't think I did around Shoshin given my strong scum read.