Mini Normal 2128: Normal Mafia - Game Over!

[TheTrollie]

I don't recall my thought process at the end of day 1 other than I thought (think, maybe?) I caught scum in the mala slot

[TheTrollie]

VOTE: no lynch

Would love to swap that for Drew if Gera u wanna join me there?

[TheTrollie]

I don't recall my thought process at the end of day 1 other than I thought (think, maybe?) I caught scum in the mala slot

what did you think of the espresso slot?

what did you think of my slot?

I relly didn't want to even try to read you D1. After the big blowup with whoever it was that you got into d1, which I thought was going way too far I just decided you were probtown or at the very least not someone I should think about until later in the game bc too much of the meat of your posting was about an interaction that I didn't think was worth investing in.

EJ i dont recall thinking much about except that I don't think I loved his level of contribution. I may be confusing him with titus. I know there were at least 2 ppl who I was upset with for their contribution level and Bambi was 1 of the 2. Think the other was EJ maybe...

trollie since you want to work with germa in voting drew.

What can you say has lead you to the conclusion that gera is town?

so, 2 things here:
(1) I want to work with gera on the drew vote not necessarily because I have a strong town read on him, but because he is the only other player that has expressed sincere interest in voting that way, and I think Drew is scum.
(2) that said, I also do think Gera has been solidly town for the past few days. Basically ever since I put him on a list with mala and idanny (i think that was my list...), I've started finding it really hard to read him as scum. And at that point I looked back on the gera posts that had bothered me and I decided there wasn't actually much there to scumread him on

This is a bit off topic, but the more I think about this the more I realize how confident I am in this drew read:
VOTE: drew

What do I need to do to convince ppl this is the right call?

[TheTrollie]

Also to save me looking for it. Can someone post what the 2 neghbourhoods are including all dead members

allo's hood was
CSF/Drew added N1
Mala added N2
Me added N3 (allo died so that ended this)

BB was
MT targeted N1(but died so no PT access)
Bambi N2 (but BB died so that was the end of that)

[TheTrollie]

bob really gets me wondering if he's scum every time he tells me how crazy i'd have to be to think he's scum.

but ppl, it's drew. I'm really quite certain.

I'm gonna go grab my case from yesterday and post it again here.

[TheTrollie]

see - just when i was thinking it was bob and not drew he does this...

my logic on the iD Lynch still stands - no way Bambi, drew, me and bob could have all been town if iD was town. I think we can narrow down to bambi and drew even - why would neither of Bambi or drew have left open the opportunity to swing onto my wagon and Lynch me instead?

Bambi is town (from my claim), so Drew is probscum (spare a bob/mala team cuz im leaning town on gera)?

Other issues with Drew

(1) iDanys argument that drew was trying to steal credit for mavs now makes him def look scummy since id was legit town
(2)

this is important

I join the PT yesterday and soft claim / say I know Bambi is town since she was neighborized. Drew press me on the PT to make the case in the game thread. Then Drew votes for me in the game thread. Thats where I freaked out both in game and on the PT bc I thought he put me on L-1. But still, why the fuck would drew vote me in the game thread immediately after learning that I am claiming PR with intel in the PT. I pushed him on that in the PT and he said basically “I did it bc I think ur scum and ur at L-1 and havent been hammered yet I wonder why” which he also said in the game thread. That really looks bad. He’s making the case and pushing a Lynch on someone he’s just learned in a PT is a PR with intel that hasn’t been posted in the game thread. Not good.

drew/bob is my gut rn

I'm rereading the Neighborhood. One of Allo's posts mentioned that Bambi knew who BB had left a note for (which she acknowledged she did) and that if Allo ended up dead, that either mala or Bambi would be the likely killers.

Neither mala nor trollie have posted in there since.

I would like to know why.

This post rubbed me the wrong way. And at first I thought I was just reacting to the fact that drew was lightly tossing some skepticism my way but I think its because it fits into this pattern of behavior where Drew's description of what happened and then what actually happened is inconsistent when it comes to the PT.

I haven't posted in the PT since we fucked up the idanny lynch mainly because (a) now that we've outed ourselves here the PT isnt as useful (b) I am decently confident at least one of mala/drew is scum and (c) drew and mala are super inactive on it.

This notion that I stopped posting in the PT since allo was killed is utter bs. Allo neighborized me the night he died. I didn't get a chance to post until after then and then I quickly became the most active person in the PT within the first few irl days after having been included. It's not me who has been very quiet there, its actually mala/drew.

I've written off the chance of a mala/drew team based on a few interactions in the PT. I was pretty sure about them not being a team together but I need to re-read those interactions and see if they could have been fabricated/bussing.

and re-thinking the allo kill, at the time I thought it wasn't very enlightening because I think it was obvious that he was the other mason, but now a flip or two later the only scum team that would have not had confirmation of allo's role would have been bob/gera.

Bob/gera isn't feeling like a very likely team for a bunch of other reasons, so that does bring me back to the idea that at least one of mala/drew has to be scum.

[TheTrollie]

VOTE: no lynch
I'm not letting you off the hook, just realizing this is going to take a bit cuz i dont have ppl on my side here.

few things I made note of from ur last few posts drew that I wanted to dicuss:

- I think at least one (prob just 1) of you/mala are scum. the PT becomes less interesting to me if this group knows about it, and there is a scum player in that group. in that case, the only thing private about the PT is that it's hidden from some town, but not any scum. So talking in there, under my assumption that one of you are scum, doesn't benefit town. Also I tried to be very active in the PT from when I first entered but no one wanted to play with me much there. more the former of the two things though. i dont think activity in the PT is helpful to town atm

- Oh also, while i'm on the topic of the PT. i still think its messed up that you decided to push me in the game thread as soon as you knew I was softclaiming a PR in the PT.

-neither gera or bob are in a neighborhood. That means the only remaining possible team that would have had no access to any PT confirming who the masons were is a gera/bob team. Oh, actually I guess hypothetically I would also be in that group since I only got neighborized that night. but my point still stands that a gera/bob/mav team would not have been 100% on allo, and since i think that team is already pretty unlikely, I'm just filing this in as another reason I don't beleive that to be the team.

- the neighborizer death not being necessarily smart for you is a good point. that said, once BB flipped, if you can kill the other mason you sorta have to as scum. Your point that the fact that allo died the night i was neighborized is silly. that cant suggest anything to you.

how about this...do you agree that there is scum in you/me/mala?
Mala, do you agree there is scum in you/me/drew?

I've got a few reasons I believe the above, but the easiest is that a gera/bob team doesnt make sense to me.

Wondering if we can get somewhere with this convo on that.

[TheTrollie]

i almost just voted drew again bc i really want to do that today. im not gonna because i know there's not alignment on that but just...we should really be lynching him

[TheTrollie]

bc gera prefs no lynch > drew lynch and i pref drew lynch > no lynch

[TheTrollie]

literally think about the fact that i'm sittin pretty at l-2 when it takes 4 to lynch and there are 2 scum left in the game.

Mala is the only one (i think?) other than the two on me who have expressed any interest in voting me

why would i be sitting at L-2 still if scum isnt on my wagon?

[TheTrollie]

what do i need to do, bambi, to convince you ur wrong on me?

[TheTrollie]

why do u not believe my claim outright? id like to know so I can clear that up

[TheTrollie]

also, if i am town, so is bambi, so it makes either me scum or drew scum according to ur logic

[TheTrollie]

ur right except its way weeker than a cop bc u dont get a result

i cant stop a NK bc i cant stop visitations to town

i can only use my role to prevent the neighborizer from hitting up scum, and the odds i targeted the same person and then found out were low

[TheTrollie]

maybe bc....

You.

Are.

Scum?

[TheTrollie]

im trying to lynch you

[TheTrollie]

unclear

[TheTrollie]

gera is town.

Bob, I see what you are saying - I really do, but I don't see gera pushing so hard against an easy lynch target right now as scum.

The ONLY scum strategy given gera's behavior would be for him to be pushing the NO LYNCH wagon hard, NKing me tonight, and using that to ensure the he isnt lynched tomorrow but that someone else (most likely drew) is.

literally there is no other scum motivation I can think of for why gera would be pushing so hard for no lynch.

u dont even need to know I am town to get that:

gera-town/trollie-town: makes sense for gera to stick to his townread on trollie and push for a No Lynch to take a try at decreasing uncertainty
gera-town/trollie-scum: ^same thing, gera wouldn't know I was scum, his behavior would check out
gera-scum/trollie-scum: I guess you could conceivably believe this is all some major bussing ploy. but I find it hard to believe that if we were the scum team, our strategy here would be to push nolynch hard instead of trying to gain consensus elsewhere.

gera-scum/trollie town: Trollie is on L-2 during mylo and 1 of the 2 scum is pressing firmly that no-way, no-how will they join the trollie wagon. only 2 ways out:
(a) gera hopes that someone else today joins drew on me and then quick hammers me. he can't vote me before the hammer and maintain this read.
(b) if he doesn't get the chance to hammer today because we no lynch (or lynch elsewhere), kill me tonight, confirming me and bambi as town but also being unlikely to face scrutiny tomorrow and being able to direct attention elsewhere.

So like, that isn't a HORRIBLE strategy, but its sorta the ONLY scum strategy here. What do you think? is there another strat I'm not thinking? Do you have reason to believe that is what is happening here?

[TheTrollie]

ok fuck. duh.

No Lynch (2) - geraintm, TheTrollie
TheTrollie (2) - Drew-Sta, Bambi Jay

Not voting (2) - Malakittens, bob3141

--
I'm telling you I am town. We can discuss that. I know you don't have confirmation on that but to the townies out there, let's have a discussion about what I can possibly do to help solidify that read for you
That means Bambi is town.
--

Mala/Bob cannot both be scum because if so I would be dead. In fact, there cannot be 2 scum in mala/bob/gerain. There can only be 1 in that group.

That means that the other scum is in Bambi/Drew.

Bambi is town.

VOTE: drew

If I am town Drew MUST be scum. There is no other way around that right?

Please tell me what I have to do to convice you I am town.

[TheTrollie]

Here's all the cards on the table about how i've played this game:

I got my Role PM, I had no idea the strategic way to use it. I even did some research on the wiki to see if there were any strategy tips for a disloyal rolestopper (there werent).

I thought long and hard about it and I decided that I could really fuck up town if I targeted scum and we had a cop or vig in the game. So my early game strat was target town.

After Molla claimed mason, I suspected Allo was the other mason given his "allo is town" post early in the game. So, that was my obvious N1 visit to see if I could dig into my hypothesis a bit.

D2, BB full claimed Mason neighborizer, said he targeted MT, and that he'd target bambi that night to prove it. With some confidence that bambi may be the target of a night action then, I targeted bambi.

D3, in my second post (first one with content, #851) I ask if a neighborize gets resolved before a kill. BB had died so I wanted to know. If he did target bambi, and if bambi wasn't neighborized - as long as the kill resolved last, it meant my rolestop meant she was scum. But if the kill resolved first, Bambi not being in the neighborhood meant jack shit.

I got that answered and at this point, I thought (a) I had a result and (b) that there was one, HUGE neighborhood that was maybe not pro-town which is why i pushed for the neighborhood to maybe out themselves. Knowing that if they did, we could trace back to find out bambi's alignment.

What I totally, totally missed during all of this was bambi's post #937 where she claimed to have been neighborized. I only found that post the next day when I was neighborized and figured out how the neighborhoods worked, because Allo had posted something like "according to bambi's post she knows that I am the other mason bc bb told her." I RUSHED to ISO bambi and I made a whole big deal out of this on the PT where I quotted that post and announced that this was huge news bc it means I had some intel.

I thought for a while if it's possible that bambi would bluff. But then I realized scum-bambi had no way of being sure the she was neighborized, so posting that would have been a huge gambit that wasn't worth taking unless she was actually in the neighborhood.

So, I decided bambi was neighborized, and she therefore was town.

I soft posted this in the PT. and that is when Drew directed me to post in the GAME THREAD why i thought Mala was scum, but post only in the PT why I was so certain that bambi was town. Then he voted me in the Game thread before I responded to his pr fishing scheme.

That's literally where my head was from D1 to D3. I hope it helps you solidify your read of me as town, and therefore realize that the logic in my post above leaves no option but scum-drew.

[TheTrollie]

wanna self vote and get this over with then?

[TheTrollie]

thank u bambi

here...we...go...

2 town are now on drew. either I fucked up and this game is over by the time we wake up, or we caught ourselves a great big scumball!

[TheTrollie]

anyone voting drew should unvote.

let me ask anyone scum reading drew or malla. What do you think of mavs progression on allomancer and his questions regarding that slot.



To me it looks liek someone who doesnt know allomancer is a mason but is digging. The next night allo dies. The very nigth after mav is digging as to why mala town reads allomancer and yet scum reads germa.

He would of known both masons were neighbourizers.


If it was a plant, then well played mav. But to me it prety clear to me that although mav thought he knew who the mason was. He didnt know 100% for sure.


This to me makes me think mala and drew are sure town

this is really bad logic.

my logic is rock solid.

and drew's reaction to it was so, so scummy

[TheTrollie]

drew just continually posting letters to himself after we cracked this game open:

"Dear scum..."

Come on, he's obvscum.

[TheTrollie]

Guys, I really don't care any more. Can we just vote me or vote trollie? I want to end this game so I can get some closure in my life on what has been a train wreck of a game for me.

wanna self vote and get this over with then?

I might be sick of it but I'm not handing you the win.

bob, lynch this VT. I'm ready to go.

He doesn't want to hand the win but he also is trying to convince bob to put him out of his misery?

Enjoy the night kill mafia. You’ve earned it.

talking to himself.

[TheTrollie]

they dont need to kill tonight to prevent a draw. We are the team in the hot seat because if they no NK, tomorrow we either lynch or have to live with a draw.

[TheTrollie]

dude ur not at L-1

[TheTrollie]

so....you are telling me that you think bambi and I are both scum and are trying to run up a mislynch on you by being 1&2 on your wagon?

[TheTrollie]

AND, that the D1-3 gameplay that I detailed in my post yesterday was all some elaborate ploy between the Bambi and Trollie scum team from the start of this game?

If you think that, i have to say, you should think we deserve this win. Because that is some truly insane scum strategy.

[TheTrollie]

I want to see a Mala post in thread before I move this game forward. I want people to see they have checked in since drew got to 2 votes

Sorry i been busy and i don’t even know what to post at this point

I made myself clear to why I want who I want to flip and why.

Trollie iMO helps me sort Bambi.
I already like Bob as a town read.

So idk what you want me to post that’s any different than what i posted before

sou want to vote me to find out bambi's alignment...

but voting me ends the game

so that isn't great logic

[TheTrollie]

i should say, voting me if i am town ends the game...so it doesnt make sense to want to vote me just to check up on what alignmment iam

[TheTrollie]

bob

come on

20% of someone being neighborized, but only 20% chance i target them. that means 4% of a cop result PLUS youd have to piece it together. its not like the next day I KNOW if it worked

ur just wrong

[TheTrollie]

wasnt a jailkeeper was a roleblocker

[TheTrollie]

IM NOT A COP BOB

jesus

[TheTrollie]

ok, so bob has lost it.

1) ur math is wrong:
there is a 1/12 chance I target someone N1.
There is a 2/11 chance that any 1 player got targeted by the neighborizer. but then I could have targeted the neighborizer so its really 2/12 N1 targets that would provide useful information later on in the game.

So that is 8% chance I target any one person and 16% chance that person was the target of the neighborizer night action.
= 1.3% chance that I target one of the two neighborizer targets

2) I AM NOT A COP
I DONT GET A RESULT
WHAT DONT YOU GET ABOUT THAT

mala...join this wagon?

[TheTrollie]

and to answer ur question - idk who drews scum partner is - i just know he is scum

[TheTrollie]

i'm talking to mala because i have literally zero understanding of what you are thinking right now

u are making no sense to me.

If you actually want to discuss this, I would appreciate a single post with a tl;dr version of what your case is.

[TheTrollie]

i think that was a hammer no?

[TheTrollie]

That was one crazy ass gambit bambi

also why wouldnt scum have nked me last night and near guaranteed bambi never got lynched?

[TheTrollie]

I just read the deat PT - you guys were reading me like a book. I just really would never have guessed bambi to gambit like that, and then if she did, to not NK me.

Mala I honestly never stopped believing that slot was scum. it was way too obvious from madoka and skell that it was a scum slot. Everyone convinced me I was just tunnel visioned but I literally couldnt shake the scumread off that slot all game.

Even in endgame - I thought there was NO WAY drew and mala would be scum together because if so, Mala would have said something in the scum PT to drew about Allo being the neighborizer, and then he would have realized he didnt have the neighborhood PT...but even then i was trying to concot some story about how they'd be partners.

the bambi thing got me all twisted.

wow.

[TheTrollie]

That was one crazy ass gambit bambi

also why wouldnt scum have nked me last night and near guaranteed bambi never got lynched?

that would confirm bambi as scum.

with town bambi and town trollie.

scum always kill bambi first.

As trollie confirms bambi but not the other way around

No bc if i flipped and confirmed my role, you would have NEVER second guessed that my read on Bambi was sound.

I just cannot for the life of me figure out how bambi has the guts to come out on D3 and say she was neighborized. That was whack.

[TheTrollie]

SC ur right - we should have no lynched.

I was all for that until I did the wagon math (based on faulty logic of bambis alignment)

[TheTrollie]

I was so far off it wasn’t funny.

Well done mala and Bambi.

Hey Trollie. Let’s have a beer and cry over how bad we were lol.

lol totes

[TheTrollie]

This game started in March

wow. that is long. i forgot that this is not normal.

im ready for my second game of quarantine. forgot how fun this game was. after 3 years gone, all i have to say is thanks to everyone for keeping me in until endgame