Mini Normal 2169 : random facts, game over !

[Iconeum]

Taylor unvoting sounds less like a partner trying to bail out in the last minutes of bussing (which is a very very very rare thing to happen, you need to have too much courage to unvote your partner on L-1), and more like she wants to distance herself of shelly wagon even though she voted him it's been more than an entire week by now.

Look I've tried my best but I can't understand a world where it's town!Taylor.

so what exactly is the scum benefit here to bail out of L-1 on a town wagon? considering the counterwagon is yourself?

[Iconeum]

*from taylor pov i mean

[Iconeum]

bunno, ur trying to divert a lot of attention away from shellyc without trying to dismantle the actual points there are on shellyc

what do you think of the case?

[Iconeum]

yeah you have been reading a different game i think

there has been barely any progression in noraa's reads throughout the game, and whatever reads noraa did come up with had to be dragged out of noraa by request of multiple people asking reads multiple times, and even then noraa barely touched on more then 2-3 slots in total.

and while recent evidence does suggest that's actually not scum!indicative for noraa, it doesn't mean your reads can be off like i said

[Iconeum]

Oh with all due respect shut up

excuse me?

[Iconeum]

If you can't see how Taylor is scummier than shelly I think it might be on you more than me

where the fuck am i defending a town!taylor? was it me voting there?

[Iconeum]

bunno, ur trying to divert a lot of attention away from shellyc without trying to dismantle the actual points there are on shellyc

what do you think of the case?

Oh with all due respect shut up

If you can't see how Taylor is scummier than shelly I think it might be on you more than me

I can be wrong and if it's the case I'll apologize, but comparing Taylor's ISO to Shelly/Noraa is pure hyperbole/rethoric.

It's so bad that you look at Shelly/Noraa's ISO and try to say "look, they did this, it looks scummy right?", while Taylor you just zoom out and question yourself "ok but like, what have you been doing at all for an entire week?"

i'm calling you out because you are scumreading a slot for *reason x*, while another slot is doing *reason x* times ten, but you land a townread there

yeah that bothers me a bit

[Iconeum]

tell me to shut up one more time

[Iconeum]

[Iconeum]

yeah sure you just tunnel in on 1 slot

i'll try to be the townie here and try to look at the bigger picture

[Iconeum]

I talked about shelly with Menalque already, look at my ISO as well. I'm not going to repeat myself over and over.

You say I'm trying to divert attention from shelly, but all I feel is that

people/you

are using shelly/noraa to divert attention away from Taylor

You just had thought "noraa" looked town but still shades her and says I'm diverting attention from them.

Stop the rethoric, I'm pushing my Taylor read, I'm confident on it, Shelly looks like Noraa to me, meh wagons, and you just turned around your opinion on Noraa in the last page.

Diverting attention from other wagons is just a consequence of pushing another wagon, it should only be obvious.

It may be I'm partner with whoever you want me to be, but it may be town that is trying to elim his scum read.

The only way you can discern from the two is to engage with my case on Taylor but you just try to compare it to shelly/Noraa and out yourself of voting Taylor.

It's not fun and you're back to null, nullscum if Taylor is mafia.

you didn't touch on why shellyc isn't scum, or on the actual points brought out against shellyc. You only went 'taylor is scum->wagons arent s/s so shellyc prob town'

which is fine btw

but i just asked the simple question of adressing the points there are against shellyc - which you apparently are hell bent on ignoring

I only just got on the shellyc wagon, and i'm the one calling so much attention ONTO the counterwagon that is taylor
don't give me that misrepping crap about taking attention away from your precious little wagon

[Iconeum]

it's very much possible you are right about your case on taylor, and that shellyc is town

that would point towards someone in like (menal/GP/??) being scum on shellyc wagon to counter the push

do you think it's that scummy/strange of me to try and sort you so that I can make a better informed decision today and on next days?

instead you go full defensive mode because you are asked to look/comment on something?

nice play bruh

[Iconeum]

I don't like to use past games but I tunneled FlavorLeaf/Kuribo for entire 3 in-game days in TM 2020 and it turns out I was right, while the one screaming "yeah but you're too tunneled" was just letting scum slip.

'i was right in this one game so i must be right here'

[Iconeum]

you didn't touch on why shellyc isn't scum

, or on the actual points brought out against shellyc. You only went 'taylor is scum->wagons arent s/s so shellyc prob town'

No, I just talked it out with menalque.

You haven't been reading this game/my iso carefully.

you didn't

you only voted and started pushing taylor since yesterday IIRC
the engagement you had with menal was fluff IIRC (about speeling and gramaar)
there was no discussion about taylor

i could be wrong but, point me at a general set of posts/pages?

[Iconeum]

ico I don't understand your logic

many people don't

[Iconeum]

that would point towards someone in like (menal/GP/??)

menal was one of the first people to try pushing taylor

how do they have partner equity more than say, datisi that's been soft-defending/diverting from taylor wagon since the game start?

ico I don't understand your logic

I can see mena + taylor but not one of my first picks on pairing at all.

let's agree to not bait me anymore ok

now, this post is important on D2 pending on who flips what, for post-flip/Association analysis and it's hard to answer this today

[Iconeum]

The point isn't I'm right on thisit's that my tunneling isn't necessarily badI probably always tunnel my SRs, it's how I work. Sometimes I'm right, sometimes I'm wrong, it's life. But don't try to say my read is bad because I'm tunneling.

you are missing my point

i don't say -and i have never said nor suggested - that you are wrong

i simply asked you to refute the points that were brought out on shellyc but you went full defensive

tunnels can be correct - i've been there a lot before

i don't think ur scum this game - and i think that you are in fact certain about what ur saying. but that doesn't stop me from pointing out what looks like logical fallacies

[Iconeum]

i am actually focusing on catching one scum at a time, but what i'm saying is that my reads don't make a *ton* of sense because of reasons said before

that is also why i was pushing you around a bit

and guess what - one of the main ways i form reads is by bumping heads with players

[Iconeum]

username, alonzo, BM and noraa should probably start giving opinions on the 2 wagons and vote on either one to try and consolidate something

[Iconeum]

ico where are you at on noraa because your reads seem to be flip flopping like hell can you tell me where you're at here

my stance on noraa is, and always has been, very clear

if you read my posts, you should have no problem understanding where and how exactly i'm reading the slot

you say flip flopping, i say it has evolved over the course of the game

'flip flopping like hell' -> over the course of this game i had a towny vibe, a scumread, and then based on most recent posts, a townread

[Iconeum]

20 pages

n o

p r o b l e m

[Iconeum]

Its Thursday. I don't want to reread until Saturday. It'll take too many hours bc I haven't been paying any attention to this game.

do you understand the concept of a deadline?

[Iconeum]

after which i will say, "hey Ico, let's consolidate!"

[Iconeum]

VOTE: BM
VOTE: BM

u deserve the lim more than anyone else here.

...if this is really all you're gonna do all game, i'm legit ok with policy elimming you today. like, what would you have done if i actually voted you?

i'm getting bad BM vibes here

[Iconeum]

but also bad noraa vibes so lol

[Iconeum]

i'll just call it a bad fight and leave it at that

[Iconeum]

the second best option would be Taylor but WHY would we do that when shelly has already claimed and has not gotten any townier

the whole point of getting a claim is being able to make a judgement on whether you believe it.

i asked for a claim
i got a claim
i was happy that the claim was good enough to buy her another day

that's the game buddy

more scum vibes

you got a claim that was good enough to buy another day?? it was a VT!! claim??

which possible claim would you have considered *not* good enough? Open wolf claim?

[Iconeum]

funnily enough, with as hard as BM is fighting this shellyc wagon, i'm feeling like we caught 2 of em

[Iconeum]

where the fuck are all of the other players rn who don't make me want to smash my face against my desk

all of Menalq AtE doesn't sound faked, and it's pro town in my book

you don't know how happy that makes me dude

[Iconeum]

now if datisi can obvtown as well, I can die in peace

[Iconeum]

(joke, i don't scumread you)

[Iconeum]

i'd better be reading a consolidated wagon before i reach p 75 here boyzzzz

[Iconeum]

if menalque is really gonna railroad town into a defeat, that's on him

ur the fucker who's fucking this gamestate up

fucking stop it

[Iconeum]

half the time scum are in your null reads

in datisi's case, closer to 100% even

[Iconeum]

But shelly's play style is just like that. I haven't see anything AI for her yet

ok, i believe you believe this

BUT WHY DOES THAT NOT PING YOU??

a player who's not giving you townvibes should be pinging you like crazy, ESPECIALLY if you apparently know that player so well

[Iconeum]

and you do not need to be rereading the game for that to be a thing

[Iconeum]

Case on Teacher

ISO'd teacher.

Scumlean. Little output, and what's there is largely spam and fluff. Mainly focussed on easy stuff he can commentate on from the fringes without getting involved i.e. is it good to claim, should i get an avi, sometimes pointing out potential logical failings/inconsistencies without really getting excited. Frugal with the vote. Awkward jokes. Is TvS on me v Noraa, but not willing to drive an elim on either. he has suspicions, but reasoning is weak for a seemingly smart dude. picks off the LHF but doesnt do anything with it. Doesn't really seem like legit solving as his fundamental opinions don't change. claims to think I'm scum but sheeps me on Ico. No scumhunting passion. Starts with Taylor as an easy target, never diverts and jumps on as 3rd vote when taylor wagon gets momentum.

teacher scum-flip means:

Datisi and Menalque are both town (because he seemed genuinely worried about them townbinning each other)
Ico town - teacher's nominal legit townread

Vote: teacher

bad case, do not agree

might revisit tomorrow if needed

won't vote there today

[Iconeum]

case on teacher is literally nonexistent it's just "teacher!scum provides a decent amount of information" when their interaction actually shows otherwise and like. they're a light scumlean if anything

townreading menal very hard rn i don't see this amount of lynch effort coming from scum trying to lynch a townie

maybe it's the mother of all busses?

[Iconeum]

in game answer is what i already said + god forbid i tried to use my vote as an additional way to read shelly

out of game answer is out of some sorta principle? like what you're doing is not helping anyone and it's making the game not pleasant and i don't wanna bow down to it?

like i'm not saying BM isn't appearing provocative at times but like

so many pedits, @mena

ah it's all good brotha, just a bit of ego-posting on both sides. it does mean if teacher flips scum, especially scum PR, i'd look at Menal tomorrow after all.

you'd see menal attacking your teacher wagon this hard as a reasonable thing for scum to do to defend a scum PR? it feels like if teacher is scum and menal is scum then menal would be using one of a thousand subtler ways to break up the teacher wagon than this blatant and all out fight among you two

pedit: we're not elimming shelly because she claimed vt but it looks very suspiciously like both you and ico are trying to run up as many wagons as possible and rolefish, which is looking quite icky to me
who's like "oh they claimed vt we're not elimming them today" like what the hell that's blatant rolefishing

I do not know how to read you, GP

in the first part you are the voice of reason, correctly seeing what scum!menal could/would be doing and how it's town!AI for him

in the second part tho, you are misrepping me out of the game. I'm running up wagons? Where? I've put Shellyc on L-1 and that's fucking it lol

i'm rolefishing? fuck offffff

[Iconeum]

oh daddy

[Iconeum]

we're not liming her BECAUSE she claimed VT

we're liming her because VT wasn't a good enough reason to NOT lim her after how scummy she'd been up to that point

^^ this and bm your deflection isn't helping the case that you and shelly are not scum together

calling the scumteam today: {shelly/ico/bm}. this is my most viable scumteam right now and the weird flip flopping and posturing that both ico and bm have been doing with regards to the shelly wagon make me really strongly think that they are all working together

me flip flopping (which i'm not even doing that much) is EXTREMELY town!AI for me btw

[Iconeum]

I don't agree with this scum team. Im fairly certain there is a scum within {shelly, ico} however they are never scum together.

more scumpings from noraa…

you were already confident on shellyc not being scum (solid null apparently?), and that it didn't do anything AI let alone give you scumpings

so when you say (shellyc/Ico) you mean me

and if you were town, you'd have no problem just saying i'm the scum there

[Iconeum]

Im fairly certain there is a scum within {shelly, ico}

if you're fairly certain there's scum in (shelly, icon) then why aren't you voting icon if you don't think shelly is scum????

and if you do think shelly has a good chance of being scum in that pairing, WHY WON'T YOU VOTE HER WITH ME

yeah

menalque is town

and noraa is regaining the scumpoints

[Iconeum]

noraa: 'there is scum in shellyc/ico'
also noraa: 'im not voting shellyc, you have no reason to justify your scumread there other then playstyle'


how is this a towny thought process?

and why is noraa not trying to sort in the bracket SHE IS CONFIDENT IS SCUM IN? Even with a wrong shellyc flip, it would give her valuable information about me, to have a solid Day 2.

But no

[Iconeum]

Ico isn't getting clowned today obviously and I'm not positive shelly is the scum in that pool

then why the fuck do you put us in a bracket as 'fairly certain 1 scum in these 2 slots'??

[Iconeum]

surely if you are "fairly certain" that there's scum in there, and we flip shelly today and she's town, then that means you have achieved a high level of certainty on icon!scum, no? so how are you losing here exactly?

we haven't mindmelded much in the past

feels good

[Iconeum]

Last ten pages was just Mena tunneling shelly for ??? reasons, Golden boy sheeping this for ??? reasons, BM coming in and provoking everyone for ??? reasons, Datisi nicely telling everyone to stfu, and me just being here

you seem to like the word 'tunnel' a lot

i don't think it means what you think it means

[Iconeum]

is anybody else really excited for another 10 pages tomorrow of

was BM vs Menal S v T?

i wouldn't mind if all of us got together on a campfire

A CAMPFIRE THAT IS BURNING NORAA

MUAHAHAHHAA

sorry 'ill go get my coffee now

[Iconeum]

VOTE: noraa

VOTE: noraa

VOTE: noora

i'm a fucking psychic

VOTE: noraa

[Iconeum]

HEY GP LOOK

I FLIP FLOPPED AGAIN

BETTER USE THAT TO KEEP SCUMREADING ME

[Iconeum]

The switch is absolute bs ngl. u can't make me vote shelly so you vote me instead. stupidest reasoning I ever heard

orrrr

hot take

he switched because

ur bleeding scum again

[Iconeum]

at this point it's just "poor play" not "being a newbie" and i don't like it at all

poor play could be used to describe the early play from noraa

at this point it's straight up scum with not giving reads, having illogical conclusions, forced reads etc

[Iconeum]

Noraas agreed to read up and give us her best attempt to define the alignment indicative stuff. Let's judge her on those reads.

Noora that post should be your priority as it could be your legacy to the game.

eh fine, we back to doing teacher then?

VOTE: teacher

we had a good thing going on!!

[Iconeum]

i've never been so happy to announce my weekend vla

[Iconeum]

in a couple hours my vote is gonna stick wherever it is at that point

[Iconeum]

VOTE: shellyc

[Iconeum]

but i'm the one rolefishing lol

[Iconeum]

BM i think you had a good thing going with menal for a minute there - when you alligned on noraa

it felt like there was common ground, and the game felt less divided and less shitfest :p

anyway for me to persuade you into this again?

[Iconeum]

wHy, iS 10O% rAndOm lyNcH

[Iconeum]

BM, listen

i don't necesarilly think teacher is town, but i think he is a bad flip because there hasn't been a lot of flow around his slot, if you know what I mean? not a lot of players have defended/pushed there, nor given opinions

noraa/shellyc have been dead hot, and are giving a TON of post-flip information on top of them being good to great flips aside from that

[Iconeum]

going forward into Day 2, I think we are in a much better position with 1 of noraa/shellyc out and nothing is stopping you from pushing your teacher case with everyone here to do their thing around it

it would be amazing if this town could get together first and settle something that is going to be settled anyway

[Iconeum]

and if you are the N1, i promise i'll push teacher myself and have menal do the same lol

[Iconeum]

can you see the sheer amount of fear scum would have if you and menalque were actually working together?

[Iconeum]

wow fk you. let me know when you've crawled out of menalque's pocket - i'll be out here fucking everything up

i think ur both town

[Iconeum]

wHy, iS 10O% rAndOm lyNcH

actually read the game ffs. you cuss me out for shit but you aint even trying

it was a trolling reference to GP :p

i read and understand your case on him no worries

[Iconeum]

can you see the sheer amount of fear scum would have if you and menalque were actually working together?

man all i see from you and others is a lot of bitching and whining in defence of teacher.

who has done nothing to warrant such a defence.

and isnt even defending himself.

You can see why I might think he is scum being carried?

you realize we can't all be scum 'defending' teacher right?

and i'm not defending teacher per sé, rather pushing the thought that he is a suboptimal flip today for reasons i just stated

[Iconeum]

my scumpings on you came from a place where you seem to be defending against a shellyc flip - much like you are scumreading/somewhat/ people who are against you trying to flip teacher

[Iconeum]

if everyone here doesn't wanna cooperate with others, or try to establish some sense of towncore to work from

i'm done

VOTE: noraa

[Iconeum]

have fun trying to get a flip

any flip

[Iconeum]

precisely, but i already have a good sense of who might be if he flips scum. as noted earlier - mafia is about more than just what is on the surface, it's about looking deeper.

i believe that *you* are certain teacher is a good flip, but that doesn't make it so for the rest of us

i'd always shoot noraa if i had a gun here

but all the townies who were/are pushing shellyc are gonna be left with little after a teacher flip - unless it literally flip scum

what do you think will happen if teacher flips town?

[Iconeum]

doesnt everyone agree the day is much more informative now, than if we ended it 20 pages ago?

yes i think so too

[Iconeum]

i think the day is only a success if we manage to get some townblock going on

even over flipping a scum

[Iconeum]

have fun trying to get a flip

any flip

i mean nothing screams "trying to find a consensus" harder than choosing not to vote for ANY of the 3 major wagons.

wdym?

[Iconeum]

BM, give me some quick shotgun names of your townreads?

[Iconeum]

daddy gimme them reads plz

[Iconeum]

i think we'll probably look at shelly and noora again tomorrow.

yes and i don't think the gamestate is in a place where we will necesarilly be looking at teacher tomorrow?

that's why i think it's better to sort in shellyc and noora now, because it will come back on our plates tomorrow anyway

[Iconeum]

2? AT MOST 2?

shellyc (5) : Menalque ; Datisi ; TheGoldenParadox ; bob3141 ; Iconeum Exe-2

and this is where taylor dropped off, so you think there's at most 2 townies in menal/datisi/GP/bob/Ico/taylor?

[Iconeum]

i had a dream this thread got to 150 pages, all three of mena, BM, and noraa got force-replaced, and then noraa's replacement got quickhammered

so uhhh glad that hasn't happened

[Iconeum]

y u voting teacher?

[Iconeum]

ico, you'll be around during the weekend to at least change vote if needed, right?

[Iconeum]

considering we just got a wagon there going, with like 3.5 days left, this is kinda dumb

i don't have 3.5 days left

[Iconeum]

actually… lemme count?

[Iconeum]

huh

actually i will be here on monday and deadline is still a couple hours from then at this time monday

[Iconeum]

so yeah i'll switch votes then if needed

[Iconeum]

and that gives me time to read the catchup reads post from noraa by then

[Iconeum]

plenty of time to get this beauty over a 100

[Iconeum]

pedit: true but i also still hope this doesn't go to deadline

hey don't look at me i was ready to end this days ago

[Iconeum]

*stares at BM*

[Iconeum]

do you think it's usefull for me to vote teacher?

[Iconeum]

the vla of weekends is upon me

[Iconeum]

daddy no

[Iconeum]

i'm still scumreading shelly

Datisi claims to be scum reading shelly. But datisi also uses her vote to actively support the counter wagon to shelly which is the best way to disperse a wagon. Datisi claims to be town this game, but datisi has also claimed to be town in other games where she was scum. Who is datisi really? Can we really trust someone with a proven record of lying.

Vote Shelly today, and don't believe her lies!

This ad paid for by the Shelly Is Scum Let's Just Flip Her Campaign

VOTE: shellyc

VOTE: shellyc

VOTE: shellyc

This gif is paid for by the Pocketing Menalque Campaign

[Iconeum]

i really really wanna say something that i can't and it's frustrating me

also 1991 is genuinely pissing me off and i'd appreciate it if you didn't

1991 was hilarious

[Iconeum]

incidentally, this game is fucked

I think that I have like 1 solid TR which is alonzo, and that's never a good sign

Could be worse, mines noraaararaaaaaraaaa

[Iconeum]

I'm happier about where you're voting

I'm still going to have some pretty major doubts if shelly flips scum but you're not as bad as BM in that case so *shrug*

noraaaaaa has partner equity as well, if you remember the whole 'certainly scum in ico + shellyc' ordeal

datisi probtown in my book

[Iconeum]

noraa: 'shellyc hasn't done anything AI'
also noraa 'fairly sure scum in ico + shellyc'
also also noraa: 'i'm not voting shellyc, prob town'

[Iconeum]

spicy take: the team is shelly/noraa/teacher and we're all fucking idiots

actually, if that's the team then we're all fucking geniouses who are fighting over which scum to flip first

[Iconeum]

VOTE: shelley

i fucking swear to god i'm flipping you tomorrow if you actually hammered before scumoraa gave it's readlist

[Iconeum]

I think everyone else thought the same as well.

i didn't

[Iconeum]

I don't think it was ever as clear as scum! TS = town BM, but that vig theory makes a bit of sense

if there is a vig, then why haven't we had more double kills?

and if there is a vig, i think it should claim sooner then later

[Iconeum]

idk but I remember being like holy fuck I was right BM is scum. And it was literally one of my most confident reads that I'd ever had. I was so convinced TaylorvBM was TvS that I couldn't believe it myself cuz trust me when I say im normally not confident in my reads ... like ever.

BM faking/gambiting that phoney guilty isn't scum!indicative, it's town indicative

and there's an outside chance there was some kind of interference?

[Iconeum]

Honestly im sorry this isnt that important and shit but like im literally having such a hard time believing scum willingly wasted a nk on BM that im willing to believe just about any theory my fried ass brain can think of rn.

while i disagree that BM was scum for his claim, I do believe scum might just not opt to kill there because of the pressure that would be on BM, and for the fact that BM was a huge interfering factor in town cohesion so… yeah

odd

[Iconeum]

Btw Bob's activity in the thread sure skyrocketed after a lil pressure was placed there

which is what happens when pressure is put on people

it sparks action

it's also NAI

[Iconeum]

UNVOTE:

Intent to switch to teacher after the next VC

can we like, talk, first?

i'd love to have this day and actually do stuff, instead of waking up to a 'New Day' and also 'New Night' kind of Pm

[Iconeum]

uhhhhh wtf
scum would have to be legit stupid to kill bm out of fear when its very clear he would've been the lim of today.
ok but I must put out there that if that really was scum's nk, yeah uh sorry for calling y'all stupid and that must not sound hot ... having a newb call u stupid rip

bm claimed cop

bm flipped (a kind of) cop

what's stupid about scum killing a claimed cop?

[Iconeum]

how can you be that certain bm is a scum kill?

why tf would vig shoot me day 1?

i keep feeling the need to respond to you

why certain? because there isn't any evidence of a vig
->no second kill N1
->no second kill N2
->BM CLAIMED A COP, AND GOT MURDERED FOR IT, it's really not that hard

if i had a vig shot N1, i'd have shot you faster then my dog eats a bone (and that's saying something)

so all these points don't really make me feel scum!TGP

[Iconeum]

ico work with me where you at here on teacher and noraa

noraa is, as much as i have thoughts about this slot, probably town.

I need more time to solve between you and teacher

[Iconeum]

with 1 misflip before lylo, is this claim day?

[Iconeum]

why is the 1v1 between teacher and TGP a thing again?

[Iconeum]

VOTE: Taylor

LaL tomorrow

LaL tomorrow

what does this mean?

Eliminate all liars

Alonzo, what was up with this? You seemed informed about what taylor was gonna flip here

[Iconeum]

wow and if teacher was scum do u really think he'd be so dumb as to claim a scum role?

can you like

just

stop talking

please

[Iconeum]

it's early morning and i'm reading and ur just…

i really wanna put this nicely

ehm

wrong about a lot of stuff and need to reread this game when it's done and learn from it

[Iconeum]

hm idk I just feel like vts are ... pretty rare

you really need to stop talking

you already admitted you are a newb

this just proves it

people with a LOT more experience are telling you what a normal setup is (3-4 town power, rest vt) and you instantly push back saying 'dude no vts are super rare'

[Iconeum]

deathtunneling is generally done by town. its not poor town play, its townie fire

wait

[Iconeum]

ctrl + F 'tunnel' in noraa iso

i don't know how noraa thinks tunneling is a townie trait, when she scumread BM hard for it

Spoiler:

BM light tunneling on page three is not a good look either.

I dont have any finished TOWNGAMES. However I do have 2 finished scumgames and am currently in 5 games. If you wish to take offense to my reads, then do as you please I dont particularly care ^^

BM is basically only focusing on me and ngl that strikes me as pretty scummy considering I'm prolly one of the newest players in general in this game and I definitely strike most people as LHF first impression. Tunneling this early into the game is just a huge scumtell imo.

VOTE: Battle Mage

All Datisi did was vote without giving a reason. Thats at most a little antitown/scummy. I dont see why I am expected to SR him after slightly Fosing him over that. Bm on the other hand I do find scummy. The tunneling is definitely not a good look imo. Whoever said that I should find both Datisi and BM scummy, I dont see why encouraging OMGUSing is a good thing...

Is Menalque the only person that saw those pushes on me as far far far too aggressive? Especially for 7 pages into the fucking game?

If yes, idk what to say about this playerlist anymore. Y'all can just lim me so I dont have to suffer thru a game with such a clear obvscum that just tunnels and tunnels the shit out of LHF Noraa.

Im feeling a slight lean town lean on golden, as if golden was partnered with either of bm or noraa i just dont think he would come in and push the fresh idea that they are just scum getting in early bussing.

Especially after choosing to vote for the one with the largest wagon. Of the two players he has stated as being svs. And not only that but a fourth vote on the first wagon. An ice breaker often done by town.

Golden is a townlean because he isn't scum with Noraa? eh, I don't know man, needs a re-think. Noraa and me is either T v S, or T v T. In either case, scum benefit from pushing the S v S agenda to guarantee at least 1 mislynch, if not two.

Golden is a townlean because he isn't scum with Noraa? eh, I don't know man, needs a re-think. Noraa and me is either T v S, or T v T. In either case, scum benefit from pushing the S v S agenda to guarantee at least 1 mislynch, if not two


I'm leaning towards it being tvt. My gut keeps telling me that noraa is just a fellow townie who has made a bad early push. Certainly the possibility that its tvs as noraas push was rather scummy. But the fact she didn't try and back track on her push on you. Even when she was asked why she thought it was scummy rather than just anti-town. She continued to push a set of reads on you that ultimately stemmed from that flawed premises.

I dont agree with this. I can definitely see why people would SR my tunneling however it was far less aggressive than BM's tunneling. And tunneling that hard in the first ten damn pages is not something town would do bc town know literally nothing about the setup and are lost asf before some flips. I could see scum doing it but I can't see town doing that. I dont see how my logic is flawed. Tunneling that aggressively is definitely a scumtell.

[Iconeum]

Noraa why didn't you townread BM? He deathtunneled you (according to yourself), so why did you scumread him if you consider it a town trait?

[Iconeum]

I think scum messed with his night actions

it was already claimed why BM faked the guilty

nobody messed with anything

[Iconeum]

massclaim needs to continue before i say something else

[Iconeum]

mena goes before me

[Iconeum]

alonzo high levels of town ping on the last couple pages btw

the way he is handling noraa is screaming town to me

noraa is... i don't know. I think she's just town, that isn't making any sense. The takes are so wild, I don't think scum would fake those.

[Iconeum]

noraa, if we wanna win this

there is gonna come a point at which we are gonna have to work together

reread my interactions with you and tell me straight you think that i'm scum trying to manipulate you?

[Iconeum]

noraa is... i don't know. I think she's just town, that isn't making any sense. The takes are so wild, I don't think scum would fake those.

[Iconeum]

n1 AND n2 no double kill

[Iconeum]

ico telling noraa she's wrong on a lot of things when he was saying "there was no double kill on n1 therefore we don't have a vig" is hilarious

you think the logical conclusion to a N1+N2 single kill is 'omg there must be a vig' just because exebait got killed and scum wouldn't do that?

[Iconeum]

hm. my issue with that is that BM after yesterday looked like both a perfect execution bait and a perfect vig shot and i don't get why any scum here would choose to like, shoot BM

you mean apart from the fact that HE CLAIMED COP?

[Iconeum]

i was talking about your "vig shoots noraa n1" line

i didn't say that

i said 'if I were a vig'

tho i believe someone else (TGP?) mentioned 'a' vig would prolly shoot nora N1

[Iconeum]

this is EXACTLY why I called out that IF there is actually a vig, it needs to claim sooner rather then later

am i sure there is no vig? no
and if there is a vig, they should claim

it's important

[Iconeum]

in what world do scum see BM claim cop with a guilty on a VT and assume that he is actually a cop

you mean apart from the fact that HE CLAIMED COP?

you mean a claimed cop whose guilty fucking flipped green? like even in the worst case scenario for scum, if BM came out today saying "haha guys i know the person i claimed to have a guilty on yesterday was town, but today i have a REAL real guilty, follow me!!", tell me you wouldn't just instahang him on the spot? and like even if that worst case scenario happens, we're in 7p lylo the next day so lol

pedit: that.

my first thought when i saw the green flip: 'damn, BM is conftown'

[Iconeum]

assuming there is a vig tho, without a single shred of credible evidence, is laughable

if you truly have to believe there is a vig just because a NK doesn't make a ton of sense TO YOU, it's just bad

[Iconeum]

(yet not entirely impossible, let us continue massclaim and find out!)

[Iconeum]

i don't really wanna go deeper into *why* i though that, because it doesn't really add to the discussion

but i agree that he would have been a perfect vig target, but a 50/50 scum target

it was still a cop claim, and a mailman as well so maybe he sent a message to a scum which granted them info on his role

idunno

there's possibilities

[Iconeum]

Alonzo

VT

TheGoldenParadox

VT

Iconeum
iamausername

VT

Datisi

VT

teacher
bob3141
Noraa

VT

Menalque

Me, teacher, bob and mena still to go

Teacher
bob
Mena
Ico

in this order i think

[Iconeum]

usefull? you know what woulda been usefull?

a day 2

[Iconeum]

Makes perfect sense with what I know

[Iconeum]

Can someone plz tell Nora's VT isn't rare

[Iconeum]

I'll claim to morrow when nit drunk

[Iconeum]

And After mena

[Iconeum]

Can someone plz tell Nora's VT isn't rare

ur gonna tell me there's like 6 vts day 3 and I'm supposed to believe that?
seriously wtf

Three too four town pr max in a normal

[Iconeum]

That's not even a discussion norra

[Iconeum]

This isn't Salem

[Iconeum]

The look on everyone's face when men claims neighbor with me is gonna be be gold

[Iconeum]

Hmmm

Ok

I full claim when sober

But the hood is a thing lol

[Iconeum]

sounds like stalling so that u can consult with ur scum buddies before u come in and claim vt like ur other scum buddy did.

We consulteer and agreed upon ascetic indecisive doctor neighbours

Hood with mena

[Iconeum]

Because of thé indecisive Mod im not claiming who i docced last night even tho mena knows

[Iconeum]

I'm literally not capable of faking a claim like this

Its legit

[Iconeum]

You ask ico to claim
and then u ask mena

seriously dude where are ur pt buddies?

You think I'm still scum noraa? That town are faking VT claims? Because otherwise you have to believe me by sheer lack of pr claims

[Iconeum]

Then where is town power?
Your own words

There can't be this many vt
Me and mena are pr

So are we scum?

[Iconeum]

And yeah the claim is legit lel

[Iconeum]

Surprise

[Iconeum]

List all vt claims and I can get a poe going

I'm really low on time and weekend vla and stuff

[Iconeum]

im confused. which parts were jokes and which parts weren't?

I really don't understand why you think my claims a joke

I'm full claimed

[Iconeum]

Wait so both u and ico dont know each others alignments but u have a pt?

You don't know what neighbor is but you 'know' that more then three vt isn't normal in a normal?

[Iconeum]

Wait so both u and ico dont know each others alignments but u have a pt?

Yep

[Iconeum]

Well yeah

Scum probably claimed vt

[Iconeum]

So how does claiming neighbor clear either of u if u dont know each others alignment...?

I claimed doctor

You saw that right?

[Iconeum]

So ico, who'd u save d1 and d2?

Unless a tracker wants to verify me I'm not claiming because of indecisive mod

[Iconeum]

And or doesn't provide info either way

[Iconeum]

Icon is noraa town or scum

Scummy town

[Iconeum]

Mena Ico Noraa iaaun town imo

[Iconeum]

Prof

Nora isn't being Flipper

You of datsi however

[Iconeum]

If we’re relatively happy that TGP is town

i'm not happy with this. i'd feel much better if Noraa and Alonzo were your locktowns from the VT pool, given that i'm clearly never going to be one of them.

Prof is definitely an acceptable execution, but i want to hear some parting thoughts from Ico before we end the day, since he's probably dying tonight.

rip that's honestly probably true. Ico please claim who you targeted day 1 and 2 since you will likely die tonight since doctor is a very important role

I really don't understand what you hope to learn from me claiming

Its only beneficial for scum so...?

[Iconeum]

I'll post later today

[Iconeum]

seems more like you are agreeing with the consensus. People have started to sus user a lot lately. Datisi and I are fat nulls-SRs on most people's reads. U call Datisi out for doing something u do more obviously. you give zero reason as to why I'm scum. ur just like aha Noraa is newbscum. Wow so helpful.

You're scum for bullshitting and flailing. this is obvious OMGUS here. Noraa is obvscum and no townie would ever get so over defensive of self.

I don't see it

I see scum pushing forlynchbai tho

[Iconeum]

VOTE: prof mafia

exe-1

[Iconeum]

I haven't read yet

I protected mena last night

[Iconeum]

@ico why did menal not claim his full role

He did not not reveal it to me

[Iconeum]

Mena forced me to make sure iaaun is the exe today

Literally his dying wish

[Iconeum]

Noraa++++ scum for that claim

[Iconeum]

why the fuck would you kill mena??? like
why
neighbours were basically IC after that scum flip

I reread some parts of the thread and I felt mena was scum.

Why did you never shoot me?

[Iconeum]

okay if anyone else has any fucking thing to claim they better do it now

otherwise i will trust noraa on the grounds that town power isn't enough otherwise

no. you will trust my claim bc if I was scum, I would not fucking claim like this and crumb the shittiest piece of shit yesterday. I literally near had a panic attack after I realized the thread locked. I was like FUCKFUCKFUCKFUCK imma get nightkilled.

Ur either scum or literally scum best friend

[Iconeum]

If anyone doesnt believe my claim, they must go read my only finished town game, Ancient Arthropods. I "suggested theories" of a JKer and I WAS THAT FUCKING JKER.
My play is the exact same. The shit crumbing is present in both. I AM A VIG

I'll check on Monday

You are also holster ING your shot

[Iconeum]

i think the most likely scenario here is that n2 kill was docced and n3 kill was mena

goddamn it noraa why didn't you claim yesterday

if I claimed yesterday I would've died today

Fuck off
Two neighbor claim and a doc outed

And you think scum were gonna kill you???

[Iconeum]

Not too much time

Yall gonna have to give me until Monday to do stuff

[Iconeum]

Noraa maybe town

[Iconeum]

Iaaun prob the exe

[Iconeum]

I docced tgp on night two so

[Iconeum]

Hmmm post game, if I find out I wanted to kill {ico, datisi, and mean} all of which are scum except the one I fucking killed, imma be greatly upset.

For immediately saying im scum but then 2 posts later saying im town, im honestly considering a ico/datisi/professor team rn

If you still believe I'm scum

Then town has what power?

Why did you not shoot me? You scum read. Me the entire game

What posts from mena made you scum read him?

[Iconeum]

I doubt scum are roleblocling you noraa

Ur a great asset to them If ur townlol

[Iconeum]

ICo self protects , noraa shoots ICO, Bob follows tgp?

No self protect

And there is a blocking role

[Iconeum]

like 1) why the fuck would a scum come out and be like lel ik there's only been 1 kill every day but u gotta believe I was the vig that killed them
and 2) im "universally TRed" anyways. everyone just thinks im bad town but still town. I dont have to claim to survive the day and thats the only reason I could see scum doing this :/

I believe you

But if you are vig then there is a scum blocker
You need me to be town according to your logic

[Iconeum]

so I think unless the scum team is literal galaxy brain, ico and golden actually have to be town upon rethinking. it doesn't make sense for them to no kill. town has no roleblocker so the kill being blocked is impossible. Scum killing mena with me I can believe but scum killing bm with me, I will die before I believe.

Ok

We kill username today

[Iconeum]

rawr!

[Iconeum]

ok my solve is pretty much username (exe today) and remaining scum in alonzo/datisi with a STRONG preference on alonzo

and yes, preference is the word i am using

[Iconeum]

if username is red, i would like noraa to shoot alonzo

if username is green, noraa holsters

[Iconeum]

that's the correct play, right?

there's an outside chance bob is scum but i don't think we win in that case so i'm not taking it into calculation

[Iconeum]

how likely is it we are being bamboozled by a fake vig claim here? no double kill on either available night seems fishy, but i'm really not scumreading noraa based on tone, trying to solveness, and generally sounding uninformed

[Iconeum]

Alonzo
TheGoldenParadox
Iconeum
iamausername
Datisi
bob3141
Noraa

with 7 alive, 1 red flip and a noraa red kill, we win
with 7 alive, 1 red flip and a noraa green kill, and a scum kill, we go to 3v1 where all town have to allign
with 7 alive, 1 green flip, noraa green kill, scum kill, we outright lose
with 7 alive, 1 green flip, noraa red kill, scum kill, we are also in 3v1 right?

i don't think noraa needs to holster in any scenario honestly

username red -> shoot alonzo
username green -> shoot datisi

more gut then anything else but it's how i see this game rn

early morning getting coffee and pouring more time into this later

[Iconeum]

i'm just preparing myself to get shot by noraa because she changed her mind and is going 'i'm vig therefore scum must have a doc'

[Iconeum]

Also while I was eating, I realized something.

So first off does anyone besides me think that a vig killed BM?
ik thats a strange thing to consider especially since we only had one kill day 1 but I mean lots of things could've happened. The vig could've been role blocked or maybe their role is like the "odd day" or "even day" type or whatever bs.
Honestly im sorry this isnt that important and shit but like im literally having such a hard time believing scum willingly wasted a nk on BM that im willing to believe just about any theory my fried ass brain can think of rn.

BUT onto the important part that I realized while I was eating. Is that if our vig killed BM, then the scums .... didnt kill last night? idk if im right but like ... in all my scum games I was told I was not allowed to ever do a "no kill"
so if this theory is right which idk how high the likelihood of it being true is, then that means the scum doing the kill was jailed or something happened to them.
yeah idk. sorry if that theory's absolute bs but im not willing to believe scum killed BM. On the other hand, I think if a scum was roleblocked or jailed or whatever, the town pr that did it will know who one of the scums are.
Anyways im choosing to believe this theory unless anyone else can provide one that's more convincing cuz this one's vibing hot with me rn.

nah noraa is town

[Iconeum]

i don't think bob is scum upon iso read

[Iconeum]

tpg town upon reread - reconfirming

i might have saved him from a kill actually - and it's entirely possible scum killed both bm and menal

[Iconeum]

and like

alonzo also reads as scum or strongly bussing teacher slot...

dats plz no

[Iconeum]

ok

at this point i'm willing to die upon the hill that is both scum in (username/datisi/alonzo) with dats and alonzo about equal and username is the very top

[Iconeum]

what's your solve, alonzo?

[Iconeum]

so your solve is...

one of bob/me and ??

and you can't understand a town!TGP's pov where you are scum by PoE alone?

[Iconeum]

or you think teh vig is lying?

[Iconeum]

and if you think a pr is lying, then which one?

[Iconeum]

if you believe noraa and tgp town, then you must believe my claim as well

so you think bob is lying? out of us 3, he's most likely to be faking yeah

but in any case, i think my solve is pretty close to being right

[Iconeum]

VOTE: iamausername

highly suggest shooting alonzo

[Iconeum]

*if you shoot at all