Mini Normal 2196 - Game Over
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Dannflor he/himSurvivor
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Dannflor he/himSurvivor
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Dannflor he/himSurvivor
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Dannflor he/himSurvivor
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Dannflor he/himSurvivor
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Dannflor he/himSurvivor
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Dannflor he/himSurvivor
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Dannflor he/himSurvivorhe/him
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I mean I understand it's not the most convincing coming from the slot who is being wagoned and who hasn't even read everything yet
but the fact that there's no even like... side discussions going on, or even people asking me questions or telling me to look out for certain things as I catch up just makes it feel like everyone is complacent with the game state
and that's not the best sign-
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Dannflor he/himSurvivor
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Dannflor he/himSurvivorhe/him
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quick impressions up through page 13
I think the interactions with entrapta are probably town indicative for april? The progression from maybe scum to town to back to scum after the replace out feels very natural. And I did get the sense April was genuinely trying to sort the slot. They reacted surprisingly mellow towards the early vote on them which I think is town indicative as well? Not a super strong read here as I don't think the slot has done much else alignment indicative for them. The IC claim is obviously fake but that's par for the course for april
HypSoc's #290 I thought was scummy at first but after dwelling on it for a bit I think I've come around to the opposite opinion. It felt like the type of post scum makes to get analysis out there that really isn't all that useful in the end, especially because taking April's IC claim seriously is dubious at best. But I don't expect HypSoc to know that necessarily and spending *so* much time analyzing it leans towards transparent town that latched onto something rather than scum trying to appear useful. I have to say I didn't like their "your slot has been the most suspected so far" post on my replacing in though because it like... absolves all responsibility off of them and like prods me in a super passive way. HypSoc, I'm interested in how you've been reading my slot/my predecessors and what you think of the people wagoning me. From your ISO it's hard to tell what stance you have exactly on me.-
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Dannflor he/himSurvivorhe/him
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unfortunately if this is all there is I'm not sure that it's at all scum indicative for DGBIn post 661, Klick wrote:DGB is a viable wagon and its basically done nothing but say we should flip you.-
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Dannflor he/himSurvivor
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Dannflor he/himSurvivorhe/him
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btw I'm willing to bet most people on my wagon are town, I might prove myself wrong with that as I gather more reads, but in situations where a townie is widely scum read and run up with little to no resistance, it's not because scum are actively campaigning for the elimination, but because town are and scum don't want to get in the way. I'd look for scum more in the slots that are either soft defending me or that are open to my wagon but voting/pushing elsewhere, with maybe like 1 scum on my wagon at its peak. I've just been looking at the VCs and I see scummy slots like Mini vote parked on bugspray while I'm being run up and I don't think that's a coincidence. The lack of counter wagon also probably points towards scum just lying low and not really doing anything. After all, with the game state as it appears to be idk why they'd have to do anything. and leading the charge of a town wagon D1 and taking the cred damage for doing so is really only something I could see a scum player with the caliber of April doing (not that I think April is scum here)-
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Dannflor he/himSurvivorhe/him
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I don't think clidd is noticeably trying to drive any agenda by obviously not cohering exactly to his reads list
I mean he's obviously trying to fish for reactions or do *something* that he thinks will help solve the game
this feels like a case of getting side tracked by a townie doing outrageous things (my favorite nsg quote)
clidd, why are you townreading mini?-
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Dannflor he/himSurvivor
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Dannflor he/himSurvivor
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Dannflor he/himSurvivorhe/him
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town reading HypoSoc is probably premature, I need a lot more from them
don't particularly like April not being around, nor their self vote in #520. It doesn't feel borne out of emotion nor out of driving a point/read home like I'd expect from town!April but meh
but can be explained by April simply being disengaged from this game-
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Dannflor he/himSurvivor
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Dannflor he/himSurvivor
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Dannflor he/himSurvivorhe/him
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geriantm can you explain further what you mean here? Are you scum reading Klick for this? Town reading me? I'm having trouble getting a grasp on what your stances are in this game because a lot of your posts feel like just straight up observationsIn post 676, geraintm wrote:Dannflor has come in and done their best to look townie, but they've got nothing to work with. Klick does seem really eager to spread their votes around though.-
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Dannflor he/himSurvivorhe/him
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bugspray has the type of tone that I just have a really hard time not reading as towny
posts like #566 feels like the type of very simple/flippant justification that town is more likely to throw out there on a whim than scum. granted I don't know bugspray at all as a player but I'm pocketed
something like
[bugspray, clidd]
[alice, dgb, Klick]
[gretchen, rlotus]
[amelie]
[mini, geraintm]
this is a very loose approximation of where I'm at right now. April excluded until I get a chance to properly interact with her. I'm sort of in a weird position where I think a lot of the people currently pushing my slot are town and scum lie somewhere in the people defending me. However, I'm thinking the slots that have been hard defending more lean more towards town [rlotus, klick] for example while scum is *most likely* to lie in slots that are either soft defending me or not taking a strong stance either way, for example [mini, geraintm]
VOTE: geraintm-
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Dannflor he/himSurvivorhe/him
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also while I feel this is true, I'm not getting the sense that everyone just has reasons to be townIn post 676, geraintm wrote:no one to me feels like they are obvious scum
there are a number of slots that I'm quite simply just luke-warm on and it's disappointing to me that no major wagons have been built on them to try and change that fact today-
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Dannflor he/himSurvivor
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Dannflor he/himSurvivor
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Dannflor he/himSurvivorhe/him
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I mean the speculating based on replace out is kinda dubious from a playing mafia as ethically as possible standpointIn post 709, Gretchen wrote:
what do you mean?In post 695, Dannflor wrote:gretchen #594 is gross but that might mean town
but it also feels like the type of reachy argument town goes for more often than not
idk maybe I believe too much in the good of people that mafia would stray away from using angle shooting arguments like that, or that people wouldn't argue like that if they didn't really believe in it-
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Dannflor he/himSurvivorhe/him
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In post 706, bugspray wrote:gerain sr on klick makes sense but could come from either perspective
I would wagon both of these slots but I'd wait on MM until they get a replacement I guessIn post 707, bugspray wrote:mm also looks scummy-
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Dannflor he/himSurvivorhe/him
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would flipping my slot reveal anything particularly for you?In post 711, HypoSoc wrote:
I am not reading your slot as particularly scummy, but I am willing to flip your slot based on what it would reveal for others. I never was on that wagon.In post 662, Dannflor wrote:HypSoc, I'm interested in how you've been reading my slot/my predecessors and what you think of the people wagoning me. From your ISO it's hard to tell what stance you have exactly on me.
That comment was in response to you crickets, because action WAS waiting on you. I was trying to give you an immediate summary so we could move on, rather than wait for 25 pages of analysis.
what are your strongest stances/reads in the game right now?-
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Dannflor he/himSurvivorhe/him
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Can you walk me through why my scum flip means MM is more likely to be scum?In post 715, HypoSoc wrote:
The two questions are related.In post 714, Dannflor wrote:would flipping my slot reveal anything particularly for you?
what are your strongest stances/reads in the game right now?
MiniMegabyte is my strongest scum read, and if your slot is scum, that would confirm it even more. I would rather vote of MM directly (which I am), but because most discussion has been on your slot, it would be informative. Nor have I gotten the impression that your slot is particularly important, if it turns out you are town, based on how the other players in your slot have reacted.
My strongest stance is believing Alice's claim. I take claims very seriously, and I've determined it's a believable one. I have also determined it is important to strongly and visibly show my support for this particular role claim, because players reactions to my declarations help inform my reads, and because player activity can influence night kills.-
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Dannflor he/himSurvivorhe/him
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idk if I'm getting the same impressions from the doubling downIn post 717, RLotus wrote:At first I got scum feeling from HypoSoc in the way he was trusting in April's claim, because I thought it was clear that it wasn't a serious claim. It was as if he is scum that knows April is town. Then, several other people seemed to be taking April's claim seriously, so maybe not out of the ordinary after all? He is now doubling down on believing the claim, so maybe it is just scum.-
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Dannflor he/himSurvivorhe/him
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HypoSoc, what would you say if I could point you to games of both alignments by April where she's fake claimed IC? The only reason I'm not taking it seriously is because I know the history of that player and they do things like fake claim IC often
It's funny because I'm also scum reading MM for soft defending me, but only because I think scum is more likely to not want to take responsibility for my flip-
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Dannflor he/himSurvivor
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Dannflor he/himSurvivorhe/him
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i would agreeIn post 727, April Ludgate wrote:if dannfloor is town, and i die at night, kill gretchen-
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Dannflor he/himSurvivorhe/him
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it's why people have tended to doubt it this gameIn post 726, HypoSoc wrote:
I would be very annoyed that that information wasn't presented days ago. I'd probably be tempted to policy eliminate April. But I still townread her, so, I'd be conflicted.In post 721, Dannflor wrote:HypoSoc, what would you say if I could point you to games of both alignments by April where she's fake claimed IC? The only reason I'm not taking it seriously is because I know the history of that player and they do things like fake claim IC often
it's not worth policying over. April is a good player and probably town... just has reasons for fake claiming as both alignments so it can't really be factored into a read of their slot-
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Dannflor he/himSurvivor
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Dannflor he/himSurvivor
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Dannflor he/himSurvivor
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Dannflor he/himSurvivorhe/him
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individually, sureIn post 737, Amélie wrote:Why is that unlikely?
One is Flavorleaf, extremely active and everyone thinks he is likely town for some unknown reason and the other two are people that barely talk.
but mafia are usually a little more self aware and don't all like to be clumped up in the same direction. at least more experienced teams (and particularly any team April would be a part of) would like work to not associate with each other so blatantly by all pushing one wagon that isn't even necessarily needed.-
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Dannflor he/himSurvivorhe/him
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why don't you want to playIn post 740, April Ludgate wrote:if i get nightkilled, awesome, i dont have to play-
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Dannflor he/himSurvivor
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Dannflor he/himSurvivorhe/him
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I have felt that I have a nebulous grasp on this game given I replaced in like 48 hours ago. I'm also not as careful with my vote as most people. I voted Alice because my most confident town read in Bugspray was voting there and wanted to start a wagon. and I didn't really have a better place to put it at the time.In post 748, geraintm wrote:@ Dann - i think i said earlier that i thought you had done the best you could replacing into the game considering the posistion you were in, but man...3 votes on one page on 3 different people looks bad. why must you do things like that?
you vote Rlotus for no obvious reason.
half an hour later you provide a reads list, rlotus is high in it and you vote someone else
half an hour later you vote for someone else who you had in your 2nd towniest tier?
Rlotus I originally felt fell into the camp of "people soft defending me and could be scum" but then I reread and don't feel bad about his posting
I dunno I'm generally a pretty self aware poster and if I wanted to fake consistency with my reads / votes I certainly could
it's not like voting rlotus or alice was some desperate gamble to keep me alive. I'm really just trying to generate information because from my pov there's so many inactive posters or people who are just determined to give me nothing and that makes it really hard to figure this game out-
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Dannflor he/himSurvivorhe/him
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I kinda already have if you've read my posts but I'll be more specific.
Half of his ISO isn't content, it's promising to provide content or remarking on things that really have no bearing on anyone's alignment in this game. They post vaguely about how they "don't like how quickly that wagon formed on Da Dude" with no further explanation. Why? What makes quick wagons bad? What makes Da Dude town? You would think a townie who thinks something like this would spend more energy defending the slot or elaborating on why the quickness of the wagon means bad. Later, they even say "go ahead and eliminate Da Dude I just won't be on the wagon." It kinda reads like blatant "I know the person being wagoned is town so I don't wanna be on it but also I don't care if it goes through." Which is a scum agenda.-
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Dannflor he/himSurvivorhe/him
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In post 484, MiniMegabyte wrote:
I dont like how quickly that wagon formed on Da DudeIn post 339, Not_Mafia wrote:
for referenceIn post 499, MiniMegabyte wrote:
Purely based on the wagon.In post 496, AliceK wrote:I am not sure what Mini wants to achieve here. His reads are very controversial. Why are you townreading entrapta/DaDude?
I find it really unlikely that scum would bus day one (I could be wrong but just my opinion) which leaves the wagon forming so quickly because scum found an opportunity for a wagon and jumped ahead with it.
If you all want to eliminate Da Dude go ahead but I won’t be on the wagon
quick wagons do not automatically mean there is scum on the wagon
town form quick wagons all the time because townies are impulsive and get distracted by shiny things
this is a weak defense of me designed more to make MM look good rather than actually defend me or sort anyone on the wagon-
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Dannflor he/himSurvivorhe/him
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what does this meanIn post 762, bugspray wrote:i believe dadude is town just from wagon dynamics-
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Dannflor he/himSurvivorhe/him
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DGB who are your strongest town readsIn post 750, DrippingGoofball wrote:Saying that your wagon is townie is... scummy.-
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Dannflor he/himSurvivor
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Dannflor he/himSurvivor
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Dannflor he/himSurvivor
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Dannflor he/himSurvivorhe/him
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why wouldn't town do this if a wagon on their other scum read was getting more tractionIn post 792, geraintm wrote:this feels like someone dropping from a wagon that wasnt going anywhere to one that was gettign traction. don't like this-
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Dannflor he/himSurvivorhe/him
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I actually really think clidd is town, where does this scum read stem from specifically?In post 798, Klick wrote:VOTE: Gretchen
I don't really have the motivation to show why clidd is scum more than I have atm and it seems clear that this isn't going anywhere
If Gretchen flips town it's worth looking at who said 'yeah clidd might be scum' and then didn't take up the chance to wagon him-
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Dannflor he/himSurvivorhe/him
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a secret: scum know this looks surface level opportunistic and are more likely to *over explain* their votes than not explain at allIn post 808, geraintm wrote:i always dislike people who move votes around with no explanation-
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Dannflor he/himSurvivorhe/him
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you are going to get scum read for 'incorrect' reasons in every single gameIn post 803, Gretchen wrote:but yeah, just so you know April, if you wanna know what killed my motivation and enthusiasm for this game, it was you saying that right at the start
you're not a new player, I feel like this should not be new to you
which is why this feels more like scum frustrated by being caught for the wrong reasons than town frustrated because they think town is scum reading them wrongly-
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Dannflor he/himSurvivorhe/him
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btw did you crumb this at any pointIn post 802, Gretchen wrote:eh. town novice detective.-
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Dannflor he/himSurvivor
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Dannflor he/himSurvivorhe/him
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I've seen/read clidd as scum and I personally feel like the difference is night and day hereIn post 814, Klick wrote:Tbh I'm used to reading clidd as really obviously town and reading this game I'm getting like zero towntells from him. (I've not played against him being scum before)
although I will admit he's maybe not as obviously town as he *can* be
but I also vaguely remember him saying that that sort of playstyle was exhausting for him so I've kinda been excusing him for that in my mind because of that-
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Dannflor he/himSurvivor
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Dannflor he/himSurvivorhe/him
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is it because of the claimIn post 827, Klick wrote:We're not voting Gretchen today that's dumb-
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Dannflor he/himSurvivor
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Dannflor he/himSurvivor
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Dannflor he/himSurvivorhe/him
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nopeIn post 858, geraintm wrote:have you ever played with me before? am i meant to fake hot takes and make pronouncements with 99% certainty?
but opinions about the game would be nice
remarking something feels off but not trying to extrapolate anything from that observation feels off-
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