Mini Normal 2298 - Game Over!

[Morning Tweet]

Sleeping, mostly

[Morning Tweet]

I have arrived.

I skimmed the game a little last night when i took the slot on a spur-of-the-moment decision. but i havent read otherwise

Don't you dare kill me yet

I just accepted going out to eat with my SO. Sorry

We got big things coming though

[Morning Tweet]

UNVOTE:

Did I really take that long to arrive? Damn my bad

Why is Cephrir hyping me up so damn much???

[Morning Tweet]

I didnt even see a post by ballpoint, ever, and it appeared the slot just vanished for a very long time then replaced from prodding out ... but i feel like Cephrir and Andantte want to stop my ears from flickign befroe tyhey even get starting ...

so like, what'd the writing utensil do that was so bad early on as to not want to hear the replacement?

It seems like you think ballpoint's reaction to getting run up could have been done by scum. ATE gets mentioned by some1 but i dont really see it other than maybe these few

Spoiler:

fuck this apathetic attitude that's hanging in the air
its killing the mood and is anti-town, a terrible combination

WTF

VOTE: bob

why the fuck was nobody but fire concerned about the fact that we basically quickhammered 2 days into the game
and why was bob more concerned about my alignment rather than the quickhammer itself

Cephrir why are you tryin to strike me down b4 i get here

Felt like self righteous annoyance that it shouldn't have happened and dumbie townies are being dumbie.

why can't scum have this exact emotion? because i entirely agree with this aside from the conclusion

This is mostly what i found about your opinion on ballpoint

[Morning Tweet]

just throughout the gameday I think

spat with nsg doesn't happen when he is scum

townreads on std and ceph are super thin but also likely correct and sound

ethel's reaction to being wagoned unfortunately may denounce noobscum so fber prob town also for association

I'm not sure how Ethels strange belief (728) about d1 being random excludes newbscum. I would like to challenge Ethel on having reads yet also calling D1 random like Andante does 742

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I'm going out to eat do NOT lay another vote on me without a warning first. NM will kill me and he will not show remorse. Allow me to get a word in, at least b

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Could I get a fasttrack as to why ballpoint is scum other than being indignant/angry for kind of no reason about not being heard. I can see that being read as awkward and contrived

i still need to see why I have so many "scum replacement is still scum replacement" sentiments!! That's when you have a slam dunk case, not circumstantial only!

[Morning Tweet]

i waant to see MT forming reads of other people instead of what looks like arguing over why ballpoint was scumread?

my intent behind asking for the fast track was to understand why Cephrir seemed so sure (and gimli and andante) BPP is scum so sure to the point where Ceph would say "I think Morning is just going to come in and be towny either way" among other disclaimers.

From my understanding, BPP responded strangely angerly and self righteously under pressure and complained of "not being heard". Cephrir has reasserted now (824) this was the primary issue, so I know I'm not missing anything. I think Brian Skies explanation was reasonable (relating to the bob wagon). Cephrirs seems more guty But I guess it is possible Cephrir sees this as a particularly strong case for whatever reason. I get that this isn't the most useful thing to be doing, i'm going to start The Descent now

[Morning Tweet]

Marquis 37 obv town possibly

Lightly townread Elpis 94

Elpis and Marquis coicidentally have a very good page 8

Norwe I thought was being too unserious for too long but i dont feel like i have much there and he did make a good comment on Bob's read of Brian pg 8. I'm probably off

Bob saying the first wagon is morel ikely to land on town doesnt make any sense when Brian hadn't said anything that feels functionally equivalent to picking a name at random. First *serious* wagon would make more sense than *first wagon who happens to get multiple votes*.

Cephrir and Norwe mention Bobs 'moonlogic' is towny, bob usually gives the appearance of being moon logicky IMO and that didnt seem out of the usual.

NSG calling the thread almost entirely void of content beyond personality reads is a hell of a mood. I think she approaches D1 a lot the same way I do. I wouldnt go so far as to say i expect the game to be painful though. I'm really curious what "too informed to speculate" means.

232 by Elpis - Exactly, it's an RVS wagon, it is equal to random the guy had 1 post at the time

NSG is genuinely somewhat suspicious although I get where she's coming from as town with regards to the game being unapproachable. I feel like she might be taking it too far though

246 by Norwe - Because StD voted Elpis? I'm waiting to hear the reasoning for that because it was right after my townread formed

NSG meant uninformed :(

247 and on by NSG - I agree there isnt much content but you don't have to act like it!! Pretendddd
The bit about "expecting the way she is posting to further her own wagon" feeeeeels genuine enough i knooww that feeling.
NSG, you feel too hopeless for page 10. there could so many great things coming that couldnt be predicted

She continues to say she hasnt had a single opinion worth remembering Oof.

Ultimately thats probably townish


267 by norwe thru 270 by FB - Dragons can look really towny. But i guess i concur that it's usually later not like up front


277 by bob / 278 by FB - Bob is mostly pointing things out

297, marquis - I dont think there's been an overwhelming amount of noise. This is like, maybe a bit above average.

FB getting annoyed with NSG getting annoyed felt towny (page 13)

330 - Torn between NSG leaning into the antitown angle because FB literally laid it out there for her because she's being indignant town about it -- oorrrr, its also possible NSG just doesnt really get into the game at all as scum, sure.

FB's freakout on BPP getting run up mmmmmm Fire's trying this game now. I think he's moderately towny

349 by bob - That is... a fairly observant post, actually. About why would NSG want BPP quickhammered if she has no reads on anyone as far as he can tell

353 by NSG - Not sure if town NSG feels trolled by the game, tone-wise it feels somewhat genuine. But Fire makes a good point and its what i was just saying that it's like, weirdly early to feel this hopeless about a game! It always, ALWAYS heats up and it's weird NSG leans into the antitown angle so hard.

I'm inclined to believe NM saying NSG wouldnt be using the "i hate this game" angle as scum. But I can see logically why FB cannot see why NSG give s up on the game that early.

380 and on by BPP -- Ohhhh so this is what BPP was freaking out about? Well to be fair, you did almost kill him/me. Plus, thread apathy was being discussed although im not sure i would apply it to much of anyone besides NSG

I don't know Brian well enough to read into the "I would lol if NM lolhammers this" after he places Ballpoint on X-2 for NSG X-1.

395 by Brian - You're the one who voted him to X-2 in the first place! But yes you did unvote. I think Ceph and Brian are being way unreasonable about BPP's reaction here. BPP got a little ranty and vague in his complaints but it was totally justified to be like "Wtf brian" at least a little bit EVEN IF you unvoted

I like Elpis's response

Ethel just seems like they're having trouble getting into the game which is expected enough if they have 2 games of experience

I agree with Norwe that NSG is harder to read this way (Even she recognizes she'll get heat) but i kiind of lean the town option

Std calling Elpis mafia that looks like they're fitting in saying that's where his guts at and thats it.... I guess that's kind of towny justification lol

StD unvoting after Elpis responds also, mm

I kind of like the way Cephrir is interacting with NSG on 19 it seems coming from a real place

492 by Ethel - I actually really like this kind of thinking. NSG is engaging too much with the game for someone who would not like playing as scum -- i.e., i think she's engaging a lot because she knows she's right. That was actually super insightful

496 by FB - Norwe feels sliiiightly lacking, like there's something just a bit off this game. I expected, a liiiittle bit more gameplay and less joke. Maybe. I guess he has the strong read of finding NSG being purposefully NAI scummy, which is fair enough although i think i disagree

500 by Norwe the second time norwe comments on the game being stagnant But NORWeeeee what are you doing about that.
I genuinely think 502 by Norwe was kind of towny

508 by Gimli - I was thinking that with regards to Marquis and I think FB's later posts on NSG were espeically real looking

Agree with everything Gimli said (FB/Elpis/Marquis town) except calling the Andante/Bob wagon ass. There is no such thing as an ass bob wagon. You have to enter the realm of moon logic in order to approach bob, and once you've done that you can't even really go back. There are no concepts such as slam dunk wagons versus ass ones in the moon logic realm

519 by Andante - How is Cephrir calling NSG hating the game scummy an odd take, when we're talking about someone who doesnt like scum
520 Totally missing what andante is talking about here

523 - I'm not sure what Andante is wsaying here.

I cannot tell what Andante is saying. That Ethel post was a banger. And their argument with Ceph/STD doesnt make any sense

563 - Voting NM to generate pressure to get him to talk.. haha

565 by Brian - That was pretty observant. I think it's another indicator of Elpis being town, though. When you assume all the "obviously towny" players are town and the majority consensus suspicions are the most likely targets, i tend to fall into that thinking a lot more as tow

Gimli's town probably, a good balance of good takes and some not just quite right. At least with regards to the BPP bob thing

586 by NM - Why does NM bother to point that out at all as scum? I read it as slightly towny because he didn't need to give that bit of insight into NSG. Maybe an easy fake meta read / TMI Sure. I'm terrible at reading the cow

629 - I agree NM is making a lotta sense

673 - I dont like ethel placing me to X-2 at a joke at this point

FB's reaction to STD voting Ethel i think is particualrly towny pg 28

697 - This is the crutch of what i dont get about Ceph's read on BPP -- i dont see how BPP's anger strongly implies scum. At best i think its lightly towny but i could see it being sort of awkward. But now that I have proper context it felt totally justified to me (with regards to the X-1, not the "Why am i not being heard??" bit which came out of left field)

716 by Marquis - i agree i think std and fire and gimli are acting in good faith at least

740/741 by Ceph - I think you have a valid reason to suspect Ethel i'd ALMOSt go so far as to say that Ethel's behavior is suspicious.

I think Ether feeling the need to give reasons to why they make each vote when they believe that D1 is random is a bit odd
I might go as far as 492 might be TMI on NSG!town while also wanting to keep the NSG suspicion going. Ethel isn't explicitly calling NSG town (she confirms this in 749) although that post was a SUPER banger reason for NSG being town actually. Or maybe it just spurred me into thinking up some fictional reason that i've convinced came from ether, but still.

Meh I'm not really sure about that though. Ether clearly doesn't know what to do with their vote. It could be for innocent reasons too

page 32 cephrir you are COMICALLY convinced it's me (but we went over that)

812 by Cephrir - Most wouldn't say that about my scum game. In fact I'm not even sure if that applies to me at all. I eat elimination for breakfast

819 by Brian - I'm not convinced it wasnt Andante

Spoiler: verdict

Let me start to put this together

strong town

Marquis


Elpis


Firebringer

probably town

northsidegal

leaning town but i think that this has a wolf at least

Gimli(GuyInFreezer)
Brian Skies
Cephrir

Light town meaning i dont townread as hard as the above tier but simultaneously am less paranoid of these slots

Ethel
Save The Dragons

Unsure

NorwegianboyEE
Andante(bob3141)
Not_Mafia(Alisae) *


Oh god. We're nowhere!!!

Boom baaaby

[Morning Tweet]

Short version:

I'm reasonably convinced of Marquis and Elpis' innocence.

I'm 99% on Firebringer

I ultimately think that NSG is town, but only mostly. Think of this as an 80

I think most of Gimli, Brian, and Cephrir is town. But I wouldn't be surprised with probably one scum.

I think Dragons is actually town probably. That read list kind of doesnt really portray that well.

I also kind of changed my tune on Ethel and forgot to update that. She's definitely more unsure. Out of Andante/bob, NM, Norwe, and Ethel, I wouldn't really know.

[Morning Tweet]

I'm going out to eat do NOT lay another vote on me without a warning first. NM will kill me and he will not show remorse. Allow me to get a word in, at least b

this is a scum post lmao just like can we get back to this

Disagree im speaking facts there, i correctly analyze NM as a cold-blooded killer and react to the threat as soon as possible (in the form of begging and pleaing for time)

[Morning Tweet]

VOTE: Andante

[Morning Tweet]

Not bad (for probable scum, but I guess I'll try to chill on that)

Thanks, I take these

I've got sum scum games for u

viewtopic.php?t=90462&user_select%5B%5D=28527 - I was scum in this game and got shot in the face after the first day. It's recent, but i didnt replace.

viewtopic.php?t=83046&user_select%5B%5D=28527 - This is three years old. I dont talk like that. But I replaced into this game as scum and was pretty thorough on the catchup

viewtopic.php?t=85649&user_select%5B%5D=28527 - this game is fucking embarrassing but I was *trying* so it's probably still a good reference. I also replaced I'm pretty sure.

Hmm. Not a great selection. I was a cult leader in this very recent game, but i dont really treat 3p quite like scum and i dont think anyone really does. And i didnt get around to collecting a partner before the game got cut short
viewtopic.php?t=90611&user_select%5B%5D=28527

This is very pretty and definitely makes me want to vote you a lot less. That doesn't make it non-zero, but I'm impressed and I don't really think a scum slot would townread literally everyone while they're one of the biggest wagons. That'd be maybe bad I think?

You've described my M.O.

I find that I usually only scumread in larger games or games that have progressed further. I agree with NSG that the majority of content today is NAI (EXCEPT for "Genuine" posts which town always make and scum can only imitate which i get sounds like reading with more words but its different to me).

For example, if I were scum on the first day, my primary goal is just to blend in. I can bend and shift however I need to in order to avoid suspicion. I dont have to make any reads which might cause someone to OMGUS me or otherwise cause attention, and so on... all I have to do is focus 100% of my brainpower into making something that seems "real".

But like, come third day, the game is much more complicated. Scum has FORCED choices that they have to make if they want to win the game (if they're losing). Or, if scum is winning, you can TRY to figure out *how* they're winning. They're obviously going to be playing different from the losing town. So many things

Seems a bit strange to me that you would give up MT scumread so easily.

i'm not giving up i just recognize that i'm going to lose support after the amount of effort she just put in

so i'll be back in a couple days, probably

Yeah but that just seems like a weird mindset to have. You apparently scumread MT just as much as previously, but then you unvote not because you felt their post was townie, but just because it's "unpopular"?
Like you're more worried about your image pushing an "unpopular scumread" than the actual fact that you believe the slot is scum.

Norwe, have you never switched wagons because your choice was unpopular? I do that more often than I don't do that. This is a stretch. This objection feels paper thin. The way Cephrir reacted to my post (I'll get you later tweety bird) felt fairly genuine to me

I also agreed with Gimlis assessment 849

That leaves Brian, I suspect Brian for feeling towny in a game where most feel towny, but also I suspect this:

Ballpoint, if you're so distraught over the potential quickhammer, then why are you focusing your attention on the two players that unvoted the wagon (one of whom had nothing to do with the plan to quickhammer) instead of the players who were actually calling for your quick elimination?

I object, THat is not how that works! You almost let NM lolhammer (Granted you did the X-2 while NSG did the X-1, but a few posts passed before you unvoted)

But yes I kind of see how BPP latched on to the two unvoters rather than the people who started it which is a bit illogical considering the angle he was coming in at. Although I suspect both of you coincidentally

[Morning Tweet]

VOTE: NM

It's not NSG/Enchant

[Morning Tweet]

Why is it NSG now that she's not here what changed

Clearly NSG was not having fun which granted is something she does as scum but she also seemed independently just very irritated which caused her to get irritated with other players,, it was unfortunate but not unexpected

[Morning Tweet]

NM is verifiably different from every other game ive ever played with NM his posts are too good

I would also support further investigation into ethel

[Morning Tweet]

she replaces out as scum all the time.
Her excuses for not having fun were thin to say the least, and when we gave her space she didn't adjust to actually play.
She is scum.

I bought her being irritated with you TBH even though it clearly seemed like you weren't trying to do that

But, I guess. I didn't see wherei t was coming from. But i don't usually question *why* too much because someone can have emotions for any reason.

It's true that she never adjusted to play once the heat once on me and Ethel

Actually I'm doing a complete 180 (again) I just reread the end of NSG's ISO and her posts with Marquis. Does NSG reeeeaalllly feign frustration with every fucking slot in the game as a way of covering her frustration with playing scum then replace out as scum??

[Morning Tweet]

I still dont think it's NSG towngames are wildly inconsistent

[Morning Tweet]

That's fair

[Morning Tweet]

That leaves Brian, I suspect Brian for feeling towny in a game where most feel towny

How is this even a thing? Damned if I do seem townie, damned if I don't?

Ballpoint, if you're so distraught over the potential quickhammer, then why are you focusing your attention on the two players that unvoted the wagon (one of whom had nothing to do with the plan to quickhammer) instead of the players who were actually calling for your quick elimination?

I object, THat is not how that works! You almost let NM lolhammer (Granted you did the X-2 while NSG did the X-1, but a few posts passed before you unvoted)

But yes I kind of see how BPP latched on to the two unvoters rather than the people who started it which is a bit illogical considering the angle he was coming in at. Although I suspect both of you coincidentally

You are misunderstanding the intent of that post. I wasn't trying to exonerate myself and Bob. I was telling/questioning BPP's severely misguided push against Bob, to which BPP never actually responded.

I arbitrarily decided one of cephrir/gimli/you is probably scum an I decided it was most likely you. Think of it like rule of three but I just used it on myself

No, what i meant was you seemed towny for whatever reason i dont remeber but i have the least concrete reasoning for it. So you're like teetering on the edge. I think this game has an unusually high number of good players so maybe thats why there are a lot of towny individuals here.

Plus when you put BPP to X-2 for a period of time then said "why you coming for me" it felt a bit manipulative. But you're right that there was something severly misguided about immediately gunning for you and bob, the two people which had unvoted.

[Morning Tweet]

Enchant you havent done anything yet!

[Morning Tweet]

Why are you surprised people are scumreading you if they found NSG scummy. Why are you disappointeda nd most of all why are you finding it hilarious

Cauz its not really a read of you. is this really a case of everyone is terrible at reading enchant or is this a case of enchant hasnt done anything to change anyones minds

At worst Brian said your entrance was scummy for copying NM

[Morning Tweet]

I'm not sure how Ethels strange belief (728) about d1 being random excludes newbscum. I would like to challenge Ethel on having reads yet also calling D1 random like Andante does 742

Just because I think the first vote is

mostly

random (which I'm happy to change my mind about when my experiences support that) does not mean that I don't have my own opinions about this game - I just don't think they're very meaningful yet. I still mention them sometimes, both to try and explain my own votes since I feel like that's expected of me, and because I still wanna play the game after all. Anyways - I think if Morning Tweet was scum, it would seem better for her to just vote me instead of Andante (at least it seemed like that to me at the time I saw that vote), so... UNVOTE:

I don't think the first, D1 elimination is random. I think that's what we're referring to. The votes at the start of the day are but not much past that

That's fair enough with regards to your opinions not feeling meaningful when ur starting out. you'll come to see any opinion can potentially be meaningful in the context of trying to determine who is town and who is scum. Maybe. Or maybe I tell myself that to post more

I considered doing that but ultimately i dont think youre my first target. I dont have many first targets though

I took you not knowing what to do with your vote (439, 673) as scummy the other day... maybe not, something about your comment about my vote. You believe as scum I might have been motivated to vote you since you're the largest wagon, so if you are scum I would think you might be more careful with your votes as to not vote the largest wagon repeatedly? Perhaps you would keep your vote off of the table rather to not attract attention rather than sheep wagons? That might be a bit of a stretch but im townleaning that

[Morning Tweet]

That was wellplayed esp by Elpis i was snowed there

Wait why'd i get merced so quickly?