Mini 945: Mafia in Bawlmer - GAME OVER

[Cyberbob]

Con is firm, yadda yadda yadda.

[Cyberbob]

I hate timezones sometimes, all the American players are most active while I'm asleep so I always wake up to heaps of posts.

Vote: StrangerCoug

for the time being, I don't like his little "Well, the cop knows who not to investigate xD" line or the "so be extra careful, dramonic" line from the post in which he ended up... voting for dramonic. That's power role direction and coaching right there.

Regarding dramonic, unless Coug is lynched/killed and flips scum (in which case we'd have a definite link based on Coug's posting) I have no problems with letting him live or die on his own merits. I would not support letting him live until the endgame however.

[Cyberbob]

Why the hell would you be wanting to expose a powerrole?

Unvote, Vote: DiamondCrash

[Cyberbob]

And the motivation behind the theory aimed at exposing a powerrole?

[Cyberbob]

Discussion about what? Powerroles and who might have one? How does that help the town exactly?

[Cyberbob]

The xvart thing seems to me to be a bit of a nothing, if xvart or Chevre die and flip scum then

maybe

it'd be a point against the other one but until then I don't think there's much in it. Unfortunately there doesn't seem to be a whole lot else to talk about right now.

(I will note that a couple of the votes on Diamond feel kind of lazy and bandwagonish however; the speed with which the wagon has grown is a point of mild concern)

[Cyberbob]

Hm... I guess I can buy the newbie argument for something like that.

Unvote

to bring the wagon back from L-1, not too sure where to go right now but it'll probably be either Coug again or one of the more bandwagon-y votes on Diamond.

[Cyberbob]

It would be a lot easier to determine his experience level if search worked

I'm going by his regdate and his postcount, mostly. He's been here just over 2 and a half months and (as of this post) has 131 posts in games. That might be enough for one, possibly two games; that's still newbie-level IMO.

Don't get me wrong, I'm certainly not letting him completely off the hook forever. I just feel like there are enough alternatives right now to warrant letting him live for today at least.

[Cyberbob]

Oh, speaking of alternatives:

Vote: Sidekick

By the time she made her vote the content of her post had been said in one form or another multiple times, and there was no attempt to add anything other than a couple of short sentences and a push for a roleclaim on Page 3 of a game. Yeah, nah.

[Cyberbob]

Yeah, nah. I might cop some flak for unvoting DC but I didn't do any of the things that you are under suspicion for to a far greater extent than simply not wanting to lynch him.

[Cyberbob]

Do you think that the DiamondCrash thing is failtown or scum?
Can you list the two players you're most suspicious of and why?
How would you describe your mafia playstyle?

1) Leaning failtown. In the absence of anything else on him I think there are better lynch targets for today.
2) - Sidekick, for the reasons I outlined in my post (his vote on DC was really ridiculously lazy)
- StrangerCoug, for his weirdness w/r/t dramonic early on
3) Highly variable from game to game, but usually tending cautious whether I'm scum or town. I don't do crazy aggressiveness very well most of the times I've experimented with it.

[Cyberbob]

All DiamondCrash said in his defense is basically that he's a newbie. Cyberbob is giving him undue leniency in my opinion.

Scum. I'm not letting somebody who fished for

my role

off the hook as easily as others are.

Taking things personally much?

--------------------------------------------------

I can't make much of most of the rest of Page 5, you guys are abusing quotes horribly and it's impossible to read.

Don't have too much else to say at this point except that Sidekick needs more votes. I'll try to figure out just what is being said on Page 5 and post my response in the meantime.

[Cyberbob]

(preferably Cyberbob since he seems most adamant in support of DC)

Adamant? Support? Yeah, nah. I have in no way let DC totally off the hook; the only reason I haven't gone back to him from Sidekick is because of his push for a claim (as Dizzle pointed out) so early (yes, Page 3 is early for talk of hammering and pushes for claims). The speed with which the wagon formed is also a concern for what should be obvious reasons.

You are misrepresenting both the points for a DC lynch and a Sidekick lynch; this is exemplified in your pithy little pre-emptive answers to "dem dum cop outs". I like how you try and paint me as "adamant" in "support" of DC when you are far moreso on both counts with Sidekick.

[Cyberbob]

Cool story bro.

[Cyberbob]

Yeah okay that claim is incredibly unbelievable. For one thing most roleblockers I've seen have been scum, but also: like Macavity said, why would he have named SC as a Cop previously if he was worried about blocking him as a Doctor? That's not a contradiction that can be handwaved away by being a newbie, that's something that is iffy no matter what one's experience level is. I wouldn't really have objected to a hammer before but I definitely don't object now.

Page 3 is

not

early, at all. Furthermore, he had just put someone at -1; the general procedure is to ask for a claim, correct? In fact, I would ask a claim of DC for as long as he is at -1. The speed with which his wagon formed is a standard town reaction to his post, and my only regret over it was that I was not around to see it to its totality.

- The Page 3-being-early-or-not is something we're going to have to agree to disagree on because I absolutely do think that it is too early to be putting people at L-1 and asking for claims.
- The speed with which a wagon forms is always a concern, and his went from zero to hero in less than a page (IIRC).

I like how you don't give any real reactions. I don't care one lick about Sidekick. I care solely about getting DC deaded as quickly as humanly possible.

Lynches on a single-day basis are a zero sum game. Everyone is defending people to a degree by stating that a certain player is "the scummiest and needs to die" because that would imply that they would

not

want someone else to be lynched. That's not worded at all well but you hopefully see what I mean.

[Cyberbob]

Now that we have a DiamondCrash flip, Cyberbob is very suspicious for his interactions with him. I'd like to hear his thoughts.

Not really sure how to defend myself against this one except to point out that being wrong does not always imply anything other than simply being wrong.

I believed DC's newbie thing primarily because I know what I was like when I had his amount of experience (though I did start playing on a forum where the quality of play was considerably lower); sometimes newbies just want to feel like they're doing some hardhitting analysis and don't stop to think about whether or not that analysis might be a good idea. I still wouldn't be at all surprised to find out after the game that that is in fact what happened, even with him having been scum.

His claim was an altogether different story, of course. That was classic newbscum (you could argue that the role thing was as well but my gut still tells me that it was just plain old newbie play).

--------------------------------

I'm still suspicious of Sidekick/Ythan but I'm going to a) see how Ythan answers the points against him and b) go back and read DC's thoughts on people.

[Cyberbob]

Re: (a) - What are the points against Sidekick that Ythan can answer for?

I'm leaving the manner of his response entirely up to him but I do want

a

response. Thanks for the coaching lesson though!

FOS: MacavityLock

[Cyberbob]

I am well aware of that, but like I said - I still want some kind of a reaction. I despise the trend of letting replacements off the hook for actions their predecessors took just because they can't read their minds. Actions stay with the playerslot for the duration of the game as far as I'm concerned, no matter how many people end up filling it.

[Cyberbob]

So, you can find fault with his answers no matter what.

I think it's kind of significant that you leapt straight to this particular assumption rather than considering the fact that all I wanted to see was

how

he would go about dealing with such a tough question (this is something I have said before, mind). I think he did quite a nice job of it, all things considered, and I agree with a number of the other things he's said.

I've been procrastinating about reading back over people's behaviours towards DC, but I've got some time for it now so I might as well.

[Cyberbob]

That's why I asked you the question first, rather than accusing straight away. The fact that you attacked me for said question, and didn't actually respond to my question is why I feel more confident in my read that this wasn't on the up and up.

What question did I attack you for, exactly? Oh, you mean the one that included an easy out for him in case he was having trouble finding a way to answer my question? Is that the one you're talking about?

Then you followed up with even more of the same in Post 189. Nice defence bro.

Vote: MacavityLock

Also, do you really think that post 183 "answers for questions posed to Sidekick"?

I think it does a good enough job of explaining why Sidekick might conceivably have made those posts without getting all overdefensive about it.

[Cyberbob]

After all, scum never buddy up to townies. That is not an event that has ever occurred once in the history of mafia.

[Cyberbob]

I'm calling Cyberbob out on his loaded question.

You are not nearly as smart or incisive as you think you are. All I wanted was

some

kind of a reaction to the points against Sidekick. I have said this many times now. You took "I just want a reaction" to mean "HEH ANSWER THIS UNANSWERABLE QUESTION SO I CAN GRILL YOU BITCH" and ran with it. It's dumb, you're dumb.

[Cyberbob]

Ad hom only works if the characteristic being brought up is irrelevant to the topic at hand (intelligence is highly relevant). It does make for a good excuse to avoid commenting on anything else though, I agree.

[Cyberbob]

Also, I do hate to bring meta up (especially on myself) but if you knew anything about me you'd know that insults and whatnot are a massive nulltell.

[Cyberbob]

Works for me, I guess.

[Cyberbob]

Agreed.

Did you see my response, or haven't you read that far yet?

[Cyberbob]

Fair enough, it's not something I can push too hard as I don't have anything to back it up.

Just like Ythill! Macavity I expect some strong moves against SC for asking such an obviously loaded question.

[Cyberbob]

Huh? SC hasn't posted since yesterday.

So? You should be stamping out all "loaded questions" regardless of when they were asked!!!!

Do you possibly mean me? I ask because this has happened before.

Yes, sorry

[Cyberbob]

The question:

Now that we have a DiamondCrash flip, Cyberbob is very suspicious for his interactions with him. I'd like to hear his thoughts.

There's no way I can answer that without having to totally rely on people simply believing what I say. It's just as "loaded" (going by your logic) as the question I asked of Ythill.

[Cyberbob]

Dammit, I have no idea how I managed to do it again.

I fail to see how it's actually loaded by the way, if someone acted weirdly in relation to a person that turned out to be scum I think it's absolutely valid to question them on the reasons for their behaviour the next day. They probably can't back their responses up with anything objective but that doesn't mean they can't still be extremely informative.

[Cyberbob]

Did you catch the part yesterday wherein I caught flak for unvoting DC because he'd claimed newbieness over his role speculation? That in conjunction with the flip is why SC asked me that question.

[Cyberbob]

Well my specific wording was "explain the points against him" so I can see where ML might get that from. Either way I still don't see it as a loaded question.

[Cyberbob]

Pretty sure that was sarcasm on bob's part

Yup.

I want more posting out of Apayah, Netopalis, dramonic, Dizzle and xvart. There is a whole lot of lurking going on in this game.

[Cyberbob]

(yes I know Dizzle posted last, but I want

more

)

[Cyberbob]

At the moment I do not think today is the right day to lynch dramonic, though I really do want more content from him (along with like half the other players in the game, to be fair).

[Cyberbob]

At this stage the largest discussion that has taken place today has been my argument with Macavity. That's kind of depressing (yes I know I said I'd do that reread of people's behaviour towards DC and yes I will get around to it ).

[Cyberbob]

Our interpretations may differ, that's fine. But how was I twisting anything?

Every single bit of "logic" that went into your "interpretation" of my question as a loaded one was some serious twisting of my actual intentions - which were clear and obvious to everyone else except you. "hurf im so smert i can totaly see thr00 ur liez scum!!11 NO DONT ATTACK ME ON THIS IT'S OMGUS AND SUBJECTIVE *votes Chevre in an ironic twist*" is just crap no matter how you slice it.

[Cyberbob]

also coaching vs buddying, you tried to split some pretty fine hairs there and deservedly got shut down for it

[Cyberbob]

This inactivity is getting a mite ridiculous. Today's deadline is in four days and over half the players are practically AWOL.

I want everyone who isn't currently voting for someone to rectify this. We need

something

that's going to kickstart discussion.

[Cyberbob]

I noticed that as well... I'll send him a PM.

[Cyberbob]

Alright, so I PMed Konowa around the time of my last post but he hasn't opened it yet... I'll try Amished.

[Cyberbob]

I'm often not quite sure whether it's the right time to hammer or not. Usually I will wait until everyone else (or most of them at least) has had time to chime in before I do so because in the past I've quite often drawn fire for hammering too early and stifling discussion.

[Cyberbob]

Wait. Why are we lynching MacavityLock again? Did I miss something?

From what I can tell, most of the votes he's picked up have been from people who didn't like the way in which he went after me before about the question I put to Ythan.

[Cyberbob]

I'm happy to be corrected on that point Macavity, it's hardly a major one.

[Cyberbob]

We're at 29 hours from deadline, I don't normally like to mention deadlines this early but I think it's worth pointing it out in this case (for what should be obvious reasons: even with this increased activity we're still going nowhere).

I've tried reading through DC's posts to get an idea of his reactions to other people but apart from some weak sparring with Ophanim/JDodge he really didn't talk to anyone other than me. He did, however, make an interesting post about Chevre here.

Looking at Chevre's posts, he went after DC a bit early on and it looks like he was advocating a dramonic lynch earlier rather than later. More recently he's been very wishy-washy about the argument between Macavity and I - until he wasn't and voted Macavity because he's his "biggest suspect at the moment". Now he's backed off Macavity and is claiming that his vote was just a pressure vote? Er...

I bet I can predict what his response to this is going to be, but

Unvote, Vote: Chevre

[Cyberbob]

Is it chainsaw time already?

[Cyberbob]

No, Dizzle's.

[Cyberbob]

Are you saying that I'm defending Chevre by attacking xvart?

Bingo! If Chevre flips scum you can be sure that I will be looking very hard at you indeed tomorrow.

Nevermind the fact that I was already attacking xvart

There are other people on the wagon than him and scum do bus each other. At this point you are pushing a wagon that it not going to come to fruition today.

but don't you find anything suspicious about xvart following your vote with no original reason listed anywhere?

No, not really. Chevre hasn't posted a whole lot; my post covered pretty much all of it. Some words from xvart would have been nice but sometimes there literally just isn't anything else to add (without being accused of parroting, a fun little catch-22 indeed).

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

We have about 1 hour and 40 minutes until deadline. The following people are effectively voting No Lynch at this point:

MacavityLock (2): Ythan, lukepukeduke
xvart (2): Dizzle, StrangerCoug

[Cyberbob]

Claims are overrated.

[Cyberbob]

I can see why scum would kill a claimed miller and I can see why a vig would kill a claimed miller, so I'm not comfortable with saying what happened with any degree of confidence.

Dizzle: I explained my reasoning for switching to Chevre in the post that also contained my initial vote for him (here). The clincher was his rather blatant inconsistency in wavering between his vote for ML being on his "biggest suspect" or simply being a pressure vote. As far as the indefinites thing goes I thought it was "interesting" simply because it was an absolute nothing - certainly not worthy of an attack like DC's.

I don't understand your point about the Chevre wagon. What focus/blame was there to shift?

[Cyberbob]

I saw that post, thanks, it just seems weird that you would suddenly switch to voting

with

the dude you'd been harassing all day. Did you no longer suspect ML? Do you no longer suspect ML?

One thing you'll find out about me if you play more games with me is that I'm quite a stream-of-consciousness kind of player. I found Chevre's inconsistency blatant enough to basically override most of the reasons I have/had to vote for ML.

The insinuation was that you knew Chevre would flip town so you preemptively tried to shift the focus to players who supposedly weren't doing their duty by avoiding a NL.

Right, so basically you're making shit up because you've already got me in your head as someone suspicious. That's a fallacy, you know.

[Cyberbob]

And I'm putting it to you that you only see it as "redirecting attention" rather than "trying to light a fire under people in order to avoid No Lynch" because you read that post with me already as a suspicious person in your mind.

[Cyberbob]

I can assure you that I am not panicking.

[Cyberbob]

Man I totally had a valid scenario thought out in my head at the time but now I've forgotten it. I'll get back to you on that one.

[Cyberbob]

Oh come on people, that's a ridiculous amount of time for this game to be inactive. Time to get the posting juices flowing again: I propose a lukepukeduke wagon.

Vote: lukepukeduke

As for your question xvart: I can't quite put my finger on what I had in mind so I'll cede the point.

[Cyberbob]

Vote: Netopalis

[Cyberbob]

(I dislike scattergun approaches to scumhunting and I especially dislike the way he acknowledged that he's coasting through the game on the 23rd of April but still has yet to do anything about it)

[Cyberbob]

Nothing in the last however many posts has changed my mind about Netopalis. I think he is trying to buddy up to me and apply pressure to ML (a player with whom I have previously butted heads) in the hopes that I will suddenly "like" him and jump onto ML.

[Cyberbob]

This argument is boring and I'm not really feeling a Netopalis lynch anymore.

Unvote

I was just about to vote SC here based on the whole nokill scenario but I took a quick peek at his posting history and it turns out that he was the one that DC labelled as a cop way back early in the game. I really don't think that scum would try and rolefish their buddies like that, not even newbie scum like DC.

I'm pretty down with a Dizzle lynch, though I'm wary of a possible bus from xvart (only because the waters are muddied enough such that bussing isn't a particularly dangerous option).

Vote: Dizzle

[Cyberbob]

CyberBob - Why would you be down with lynching me? Do you no longer feel Neto is attempting to buddy you up?

I'm voting for you because I didn't like your exchange with Netopalis one bit; his reasons for being inactive are believable (especially if he was inactive sitewide rather than just in this one game) and there isn't a whole lot else to fall back on. I'd be up for lynching you because I feel like you're reaching pretty terribly against him on top of the other things that have been brought up about you.

[Cyberbob]

Yes. A buddying call is almost always a fair bit more nebulous than a reaching call, and this case is no exception.

[Cyberbob]

I'm bored. People need to lay some votes down or at least get more proactive in pursuing their reads, scum have absolutely every motivation to make things as slow and boring as possible and the best counter to this is to make it not slow and not boring

[Cyberbob]

Why do I get the feeling that this is going to end in a No Lynch?

[Cyberbob]

It was by a vig, and that vig was me. I also killed dramonic back on Night 2.

[Cyberbob]

(I'm not actually a vanilla vig, I can only kill people on even-numbered nights)

[Cyberbob]

Sure. Bob could be claiming vig falsely, when the kill was actually the mafia's factional kill which he used.

Playing your hand a bit too hard there bro.

Vote: Netopalis

[Cyberbob]

for Cyberbob to be correct requires the extremely unlikely event of the Mafia missing three kills in a row.

Nope, just the one of the mafia missing their kill on Nights 2 and 4. Which is not completely out of the question given that Ythan is both a protector and a roleblocker.

Are you sure you're feeling OK? That was quite the error - sure you're not getting a bit desperate at all?

Unvote

[Cyberbob]

We basically have a 2/3 chance to hit scum if we were to completely blindly lynch one of ML, Netopalis or SC. I like those odds, and I wouldn't mind betting that it's a Neto-SC scumteam; ML doesn't like my claim either, but he makes the same points I probably would in his shoes whereas Netopalis has been working the sly insinuation angle while SC has been fairly frothing at the mouth.

Re risking the end of the game: Yeah, I did and it was quite a tough decision not only to pull the trigger but also to pick xvart. Still, I figured that I had a pretty good chance at hitting scum and even if I didn't the small remaining playercount would give us a decent chance of Ythan preventing the mafia kill with his own role.

[Cyberbob]

Netopalis, then SC.

Are you asleep? Nobody's kill went off Night 3.

Given that that post would have been made at about 4am IIRC (give or take), I could very well have been.

[Cyberbob]

welp this town is fucked see ya round guys

[Cyberbob]

Darn you Ythan, why do you doubt my confidence?

Unvote

hahahahaha

[Cyberbob]

Darn you Ythan, why do you doubt my confidence?

Unvote

hahahahaha

???

It's funny watching scum try to go ~all in~ with a big push in lylo then suddenly have to backpedal when the town players don't like it

[Cyberbob]

You guys are hilarious. You could win the game for yourselves by lynching me now but you're too scared of what town players are left possibly turning on you. Why? You're practically guaranteed at least one of them voting with you the way discussion has been going.

Go on. Take a punt.

[Cyberbob]

Slip?

[Cyberbob]

Yeah I'm sure you did.

[Cyberbob]

My point was that it's gotten kind of boring to see the town so completely in scum's hands without anything actually being done with it. You could have won the game days ago if you guys weren't so weak-kneed.

[Cyberbob]

Given that I clearly made a distinction between the town and the people I was talking to, I don't really see how.

[Cyberbob]

My point was that it's gotten kind of boring to see the town so completely in scum's hands without anything actually being done with it. You could have won the game days ago if you guys weren't so weak-kneed.

[Cyberbob]

My point was that it's gotten kind of boring to see the town so completely in scum's hands without anything actually being done with it. You could have won the game days ago if you guys weren't so weak-kneed.

Did your eyes just skip over this post altogether, or...?

[Cyberbob]

Stupid internet, that first post wasn't there before.

[Cyberbob]

Cyberbob, why you no answer me question?

What question?

Given that I clearly made a distinction between the town and the people I was talking to, I don't really see how.

Apparently, if at least three of the four of us other than you misunderstood it, the distinction wasn't clear. I also agree with Netopalis that the original post makes no sense, and I think this is regardless of your alignment. If you are town, why do you want to hand the game to the scum, and if you are scum, why do you want to risk us finding your buddy in three-person LYLO?

I'm pretty much 100% resigned to the town losing is why. The only thing between me and a fairly quick lynching is apparently Ythan giving the go-ahead for people to start laying votes down. I just figure that it might as well be sooner rather than later because scum have the town wrapped so tightly around their fingers that the outcome is more or less inevitable.

[Cyberbob]

ok then guess ur rite ill fight and fight and fight!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Cyberbob]

FUCK YOU GUYS I WILL NOT GO QUIETLY INTO THAT GOOD NIGHT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

ITS ON NOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

best part? when the town loses I'll get blamed for it instead of the retards so completely falling for the scum's rhetoric

[Cyberbob]

When people stop doing it I'll stop saying it.

All three of SC, Neto and ML are pretty much a shoe-in for voting me as soon as you say it's OK for people to start voting - which is a lynch right there. There's town in there somewhere.

[Cyberbob]

wat

I was right on DC's case (IIRC I was the very first person on his wagon) until he claimed newbieness. Would you perhaps like to go back and check?

[Cyberbob]

Cyberbob, question I was referring to:

Cyberbob, from your perspective, is there any way that SC isn't scum? If not, why aren't you voting him?

Oh right, that question (I think I started to answer it a few days ago but got distracted or something).

Obviously there are almost always ways for someone not to be scum, but of the three of you I'd say he's most likely to be one half of the pair. Can't decide whether you or Neto are more likely to be the other half.

I'm not voting him for the same reason I haven't been lynched by you, him and Neto yet: Ythan.

[Cyberbob]

In that case, why did you suddenly vote Netopalis before Ythan called you out on it?

Because.

[Cyberbob]

...

No seriously, that's pretty much why. I really didn't like your response to my claim and felt like putting on a vote for the hell of it.

That's not going to save your life and you need to be more detailed. Hadn't Ythan knocked some sense into me, I'd jump right back on you.

Major HoS

.

Oh spare me. You were already jumping at the bit to jump back on me, remember? Rattling that sabre at me is just theatrics at this point.

[Cyberbob]

Good question, bad answer.

No you're right clearly I'm blatantly lying to cover up some massive scum conspiracy.

Town players are more likely to make spur of the moment votes than scum because scum are usually more worrried about potential backlash.

Also the pairing at this point is so obviously SC-Neto it hurts. Nice shot at a late bussing Neto but it won't save you now; next time you should try that sort of thing a bit earlier; you don't want to look like you're simply playing follow the leader (as you clearly are here with Ythan and my comment about theatrics).

[Cyberbob]

*shrug* We'll discuss it postgame, but the fact that I couldn't build a solid case on StrangerCoug and previously stated that Cyberbob was obviously town is wearing on me. I've been pretty well clueless most of the game.

lolllllllll

[Cyberbob]

By far my favorite scum-tell on him is FoS or HoS-ing a scum buddy with little reason to do so. I haven't seen that this game.

Have you tried looking?

That's not going to save your life and you need to be more detailed. Hadn't Ythan knocked some sense into me, I'd jump right back on you.

Major HoS

.

Oh spare me. You were already jumping at the bit to jump back on me, remember? Rattling that sabre at me is just theatrics at this point.

[Cyberbob]

Ugh, didn't see that scum buddy bit. Nevermind.

Could it simply be that he is aware of this meta?

[Cyberbob]

:} Did I catch ya?

No, I skim read things a fair bit; you would be really surprised at how often I've missed important things like that.

Yes, absolutely. To repeat,

I have brought up this FoS/HoS scum tell with him before (I caught him with it in the me-town, him-scum game), so it's perfectly likely that he specifically avoided that tell because I'm in this game. Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

tl;dr: My best scum tell on him didn't show up this game, but I have nothing to suggest that he's town either.

Yup, that's me skipping over things again. Sorry for the snark, should have paid more attention.

[Cyberbob]

Yeah I've never seen a jailkeeper that couldn't prevent mafia kills being used.

[Cyberbob]

Godfather. I'd put money on it given how much you're obviously relying on the investigation to clear you.

Plus the whole "hmm if I lie down and be as inoffensive and helpless as possible maybe they'll let me off" schtick you were trying on for size before.

[Cyberbob]

ML, what do you think of the extreme possibility that Netopalis is a Godfather?

[Cyberbob]

Also:

If we lynch SC today and I'm jailed tonight Neto will simply not make a kill in order to cast suspicion on me (a ploy which, coupled with his Godfather role and ML's previously-stated desire to see me dead, will most likely be successful). Count on it.

Any plan - ever - that relies on scum night actions happening in a certain way when you're giving them foreknowledge of how the town's actions will play out is intensely dumb. Sorry!

[Cyberbob]

I didn't get to hammer? Aw.

There's always Neto I guess.

[Cyberbob]

Why would he have a result on me? I was the one being jailed, remember?

I'm a little surprised that you were willing to expose yourself with that kill, to be honest. No matter, your behaviour over the last few days (realtime) has been really really really obviously scum.

Vote: Netopalis

[Cyberbob]

Dammit, going into that third day the thought of ML being scum was bouncing around in my head but I discarded it just because Neto had been so suspicious.

The one thing that I should have mentioned was the fact that there was no way Neto would have been stupid enough to make a kill if he was scum; the only person that might have had a reason to do so was ML.

Meh.

[Cyberbob]

Yet another game to bolster my application to the moral victory club.

Um, really? Your behaviour was some seriously scummy stuff from the beginning of Day 5 right up until the end.