Mini 1221: Vegas Mafia (Over!)

[Maruchan]

Link is very good. Has been from the first game of his I read on-site.

Anyways, /confirm

Hi Link, Hey Hellhound. Nice to see you two.

Holy shit, I come home expecting a nice relaxing day of reading 1-2 new posts and find out I am inned for a game I completely forgot about and its already 2 pages deep! Let me read some of the blocks already posted and I will get back to you guys later tonight with my thoughts. Let me just figure out what games I am in, update my wiki, and keep my tabs set up nice and easily.

Expect to see a post from me in an hour or two.

[Maruchan]

Okay MUCH better. I just updated my wiki page, and completely effed with the order of it to better reflect how I have my tabs set up. I also minimized my tabs and grouped them in firefox 4's cool new grouping thing so I can actually SEE the games I am in.

Now to do analysis's. Starting with Ninja, then Vegas

[Maruchan]

M'kay. I just finished a read and analyze on my first game of the night I had to read and analyze. Your turn starts in about 5 minutes.

[Maruchan]

I honestly think this Demon vs. Ryuu is town on town. I don't think that between the interaction with them there is any scumieness whatsoever, and they are both grasping at straws so that they don't look to be backing down, because backing down just because someone else wants you to is a scummier read than grasping at straws.

I also think though that Demon's interactions with link appear to be AtEing. Possibly Empking's interaction with Link too, but I honestly think he was just saying he agreed with everything Link was saying. Which still isn't always a smart idea.

@Link, i don't know what it is but your play style this game seems MUCH different than the two other games I have to compare it to. I'm thinking you're either scum here, or I have been totally mis-reading you for the past week.

FoS: Maru

- Buddying.

I have links to every game I have ever played in on-site. Go to any game on that list that isn't still in-queue, ISO me, and read my first post. I start out EVERY GAME by saying hi to people I recognize. Before you FoS me for it, FoS the people in this game that did it on Page 1 also. I am doing the exact same things they are, the only difference is I didn't make it in time for page 1.

You know what's worse? You also inned for a game that is 4 pages deep. And guess who else is in it? Take your time getting settled in, we can wait.

Both of these games either didn't exist or were locked in confirmation when I last looked, before I left Chicago to head back home. Its surprising how quickly they jumped out of the gates on my two-hour drive. I think I am settled in pretty well now, I have read without skimming, and paid attention to both now, so I don't think my performance was affected. The perks of having no live.

I wouldn't call it buddying yet. We'll see if he keeps it up. Really just seems like his meta from what I've seen of him though.

This is true, you can check it if you want. I have links in my wiki.

On the side, the longer Maruchan posts fluff, the longer I want him dead, too.

I am sorry, I just got home from Chicago after spending 2 and a half hours driving there for a party and then driving back, all on 5 hours of sleep last night. And when I get home I have 20 mafiascum tabs to sort through and figure out which games are which, then find I have PMs pertaining to games I completely forgot I had /inned for in the queues. My first post was to confirm, say hi to the people I recognized, and to tell you guys I WOULD be joining into the game, as soon as I had my feet under me. My second was posted in 2 games, to let you know I had my feet under me and was beginning the catch-up read. I wanted you to be sure I meant to keep my promise from my first post.

[Maruchan]

FoS: Maru

- Buddying.

I have links to every game I have ever played in on-site. Go to any game on that list that isn't still in-queue, ISO me, and read my first post. I start out EVERY GAME by saying hi to people I recognize. Before you FoS me for it, FoS the people in this game that did it on Page 1 also. I am doing the exact same things they are, the only difference is I didn't make it in time for page 1.

I don't remember other players complimenting and sucking up to people.

why did I compliment and suck up, BEFORE you FOSed me for buddying.

I said Hi to two people.

[Maruchan]

EBWOP: Where*

[Maruchan]

but I'm glad to be back playing with empking, DJ and DH again. We've had good games in the past, certainly Donner party and Iowa mafia come to mind

No "Good to see Maruchan" again? Are you guys really that upset with me for that game?

ah well.

Anyways I am just on for like 2 minutes before I head to sleep or I would actually respond to all the important stuff thats been said. I will get to that in the morning.

[Maruchan]

Link is very good. Has been from the first game of his I read on-site.

oh you're right. Sorry, I forgot about that.

When I originally posted I had seen a discussion going on about Link being really good and wondering if he was an alt. I was merely adding my input to this discussion, as I thought it was game-related. I had only skimmed at this point, rather than read through the whole game.

is annoying in that it's the second maru post where he promises content. having played with maru briefly before, i remember more macro images than content, but I'm hoping to be pleasantly surprised :p

That was the funnest game of mafia I have ever played, excluding the 12-second Skype Game

DH

like all the time here
you're seeing the needle rather than the haystack here Empking

This Empking. I was merely making 1 quick comment, when other players have been doing it loads.

I'd like empking to talk about Maru's analysis as well as his buddying though

Me too.

technically, we shared no interactions because as as soon as i turned up I hammered (whoops)

but good to see you again and no hard feelings

You may not have seen much of me, but I have been keeping tabs on that game still. So I've seen quite a bit of you.

I always claim at L-2, and I'm a vanilla townie.

VOTE: DH Learn new meta, as apparently your current one sucks.

'm not speaking again in this game until people start questioning both Timeater's fucking case

Yeah, here's one, and another and you guessed it, another here where I had an aggressive, scumhunting attitude and HEY, look at that, I flipped town but was lynched by a bunch of people with heads up their asses making cases like "you made "compliments"" and "here's why I think he's scum, but he's NOT to answer my very obviously laid out, timed and calculated case", which was made by obvious fucking scum and something that you guys can't comprehend.

Cheers.

That didn't last long.

I disagree on this point. I think someone willing to back down when they realize they are wrong is far more town than grasping at straws to maintain the facade of inconsistency.

To each his own. Do you agree that it could be town-on-town and thats what they were thinking though?

I'm inclined to disagree. At best, my play is evolving. But then, those are the results of playing in 4 games at the same time for a relatively new player. I play the same way that I always do all the time because my playstyle is completely independent of my role.

Fair enough. Up until 30 minutes ago I was in 6 games with a seventh in queue, now only 5 with a 6th in queue. I would agree, I play the same way as either town or scum.

I skimmed it because I have an RA meeting in 2 minutes, and I'm on my phone.

RA? as in Rheumatoid Arthritis? or?

Maruchan, Zdenek, and The Tick:

What are your thoughts on Link? What are your reads on him?

-cry. Did you not read my short wall? I feel his playstyle is different this game than the other two I am in with him, so I am wary of him. Whether that means he is town here and scum there or scum here and town there is yet to be seen.

That post of TS' tells me bnothing.

You're posts tell me even less than nothing. In fact most of your posts tell me you are actively reading the game, but have nothing to say about it. Why?

Personally, I wouldn't mind. But thats me.

I'm 50/50 on the 24 hour d1 lynch.

@DemonHunter

PLEASE for the love of god type ="NAME" after [quote when you quote multiple people. You may have a photographic memory, but I don't.

Fixing to replace out of this shit if pRo ScUmMeR **>tImEaTeR<** dA kInG feels like it, since he's the better player!!!

Rather than replace out when called bad, prove him wrong.

[Maruchan]

I find it hilariously ironic that Maru is lecturing DH how to use quote tags but quotes Tqistedspoon and DemonHtbrid in his last post

but in all seriousness your vote on DH is terribad. If I recall correctly you said you thought DH and Ryu was "Town vs Town"
This contradiction/backpedalliing as noted, and you give very little reasoning behind your DH vote. It really just looks like sheeping or voting him solely for his VT claim the way your wall is set out
VOTE: Maru

re-read my cases. I said the DH vs Ryu based solely on THEIR interaction with each other was possible town-town. I then went on to call DH's interactions with OTHER players, scummy.

Also, I am lecturing him on not putting anything in the "" in his quotes. I at least put SOMETHING, and you can understand my references even if I typoed them.

If I was jumping the bandwaggon, don't you think I would have done so without having first called it town-town, and also while it was still at L-2 or L-1, before everyone unvoted? If I was scum trying to jump a bandwaggon, why would I have called him possible town FIRST, when that would obviously draw more attention to myself? Seems counter-productive really.

[Maruchan]

So, its Timeater, Maru and ryuu. Cool.

You didn't give a reason for your vote at all, Maru.

Yes, I did. I didn't like your forced claim. And you call it your meta, well thats why I said if this is true, you need new meta.

So everyone that is voting you si scum now? Ok. ThHats totally an un-breakable concept.

[Maruchan]

Demon you've asked for a replacement now. That means you are no longer permitted to spot here. Kindly, get the fuck out of our game. Or tell us your whole asking for a replacement was a bluff, in which case. -.-

@TS, I think timeater is a bit more antagonistic than he had to have been, but over-all I see why he had to do it. people DO have different levels of playing experience, whether DH or timeater is better or worse is of no concern to me, but he was over-reading faulty cases thinking they were scum-WIFOMed, before changing his mind to decide they were face value and that he thought they were crappy. At which point he unvoted, and TRIED to avoid being rude to DH, but was forced to say it due to other players.

[Maruchan]

DEMON IF YOU ARE ASKING FOR A REPLACEMENT YOU ARE NOT PERMITTED TO POST HERE ANY MORE. GET THE FUCK OUT

[/u]

sorry for the swearing and the bolding and the super sizing, I felt I had to stoop to everyone else's level to be understood.

[Maruchan]

i have no beef with him or timeater whatsoever. I just think THEIR fight needs to stop. Now.

[Maruchan]

Hikari -
@Link - sorry it was irresistable, won't happen again though!

I srs loled @ this

[Maruchan]

I gotta wonder what the distate for being called "Hikari" is about. Is it one of those SN's where you lost a dare and had to use it?

Link beat me to it, but I was about to say to check his Wiki

[Maruchan]

I wasn't defending why my vote wasn't bandwagoning, I was defending why I wasn't scum. If I was scum, I WOULD be wanting to bandwagon, and if I was wanting to bandwagon on the biggest bandwagon, why would I have first made it seem like I didn't want to join that bandwagon.

I was saying the DH vs ryuu, neither of them seemed scummy, DURING THAT ARGUMENT. since then, DH has gotten scummy with the continuous AtE, the claim when it was not necessary to claim, nor warranted, nor a good time to for that matter, all because it was his meta. The extreme hostility that came when his claim didn't exonerate him.

THOSE are why I am lynching him, and I already explained that I didn't see him scummy in the first argument, but then started to later. thats the "contradiction" you mentioned about my analysis post. at FIRST, he wasn't acting scummy, and I would have banked that whole fight as town versus town. But then he started slipping up and acting scummy.

[Maruchan]

I was saying the DH vs ryuu, neither of them seemed scummy, DURING THAT ARGUMENT.

since then, DH has gotten scummy with the continuous AtE, the claim when it was not necessary to claim, nor warranted, nor a good time to for that matter, all because it was his meta. The extreme hostility that came when his claim didn't exonerate him.

I fully understand that. The reason it's scummy is because you explained that instead of explaining why DH was scummy.

huh?

[Maruchan]

Now see, if I had JUST been called out for the DH vote, I would have JUST defended my vote and why DH is scummy. But I was called out for the DH vote AND voted on. I found the more pressing matter is to prove my innocence, because of the vote on me. And it would also effectively explain my vote on DH at the same time.

Defending why DH is scummy (when other have already said why), would have explained my vote on him, but wouldn't have gotten the vote off of me. I chose the path that I believed would take care of BOTH.

If you don't want to defend my non-scummyness, don't call me scum basically.

[Maruchan]

Now see, if I had JUST been called out for the DH vote, I would have JUST defended my vote and why DH is scummy. But I was called out for the DH vote AND voted on. I found the more pressing matter is to prove my innocence, because of the vote on me. And it would also effectively explain my vote on DH at the same time.

Defending why DH is scummy (when other have already said why), would have explained my vote on him, but wouldn't have gotten the vote off of me. I chose the path that I believed would take care of BOTH.

If you don't want to defend my non-scummyness, don't call me scum basically.

The problem with this is that town has little to no reason to argue their innocence over a suspicious player's guilt. Town knows that they are innocent, so they don't have to hide their guilt. Mafia have to blend in, so they have to keep suspicion off themselves.

A single vote honestly isn't much of a threat when there are 12 players alive. Being defensive from a single vote placed on you is going to raise a few eyebrows.

No but town are good at sheeping, so single vote can lead to multiple votes rather fast. Rather recently I went from being at L-3 to being lynched while I slept, and I sleep LONG hours, so I like to nip things in the bud so as to not wake up to surprises.

[Maruchan]

UNVOTE: [/unvpte]
NOT vote Timeater, I just think that ank is being more pro-town than DH ever was (yes, by attacking me)

[Maruchan]

WOW FAIL MUCH UNVOTE:

[Maruchan]

I haven't agreed with him on this argument so far, but with that last line, he does have a point.

[Maruchan]

Could you change this into a sentence please.

I think its perfectly readable and understandable as is. what are you having difficulties with?

[Maruchan]

I dunno...to unvote a guy based on you suddenly thinking he's just a shitty townsman? Where they do that at?

If your read on someone changes from scum to town (shitty or not) on someone of course you unvote. I have little doubt that Timeater thinks or knows that DH isn't mafia, but he needs to come back and explain how his read changed more clearly. His "inner realization" explanation is too vague for me to tell if he's being genuine or not.

He already explained it, and it led to a page-long capswar, and DH replacing out. -.-

[Maruchan]

Could you change this into a sentence please.

I think its perfectly readable and understandable as is. what are you having difficulties with?

Are you telling us to not vote Timeater? What does that NOT Timeater have to do with ank?

I was saying I wasn't going to vote timeater.

[Maruchan]

If you are town, town shouldn't have to try to be innocent, scum have to do that.

Yeah. Obviously you haven't read any of my games have you. I ALWAYS have to prove my innocence, more-so as town, when I am actually innocent.

[Maruchan]

Did you not read the part where I said it did both things?

[Maruchan]

Twistedspoon of all people should know I ALWAYS have to prove my innocence, especially when I am town. My 1 finished game I was scum and endgamed for the win, the two times I have been lynched, one by twistedspoon, I was vanilla townie, and lynched for being the "scummiest player in the game". Its all on my wiki if you want links.

[Maruchan]

Twistedspoon of all people should know I ALWAYS have to prove my innocence, especially when I am town. My 1 finished game I was scum and endgamed for the win, the two times I have been lynched, one by twistedspoon, I was vanilla townie, and lynched for being the "scummiest player in the game". Its all on my wiki if you want links.

Appeal to twistedspoon?

No not really. just pointing out you should at least see some truth in my statement.

[Maruchan]

vig: Maruchan

Are you a Day Vig? Did you really just Vig a townie like that!? Is that even a thing? I've heard about it in another game, but I don't really know if it exists.

According to this it is within the bounds of a normal game to allow Day-Vigs. Whether or not there IS one however we will have to wait and see.

Zdenek, congrats on killing a vanilla townie. You are pro.


Anyways, this'll be my last post before I head out to PT so I'll be back in like 4 hours.

[Maruchan]

well it is the

Random

voting stage

reasons aren't neccessary in RVS

Not necessary, no, but they are still used a lot.

Link: "Are you a Day Vig? Did you really just Vig a townie like that!? Is that even a thing? I've heard about it in another game, but I don't really know if it exists."

You know he's a townie? Wow.

Vote: Link

Yeah, cause he's like obvtown as hell. I'm in 3 games with him and I'm noticing like no variations. Seems unlikely he's scum in all three.

-shifty eyes-

LOL NO I JOKE!

lol I just had to do that I'm sorry. XD

[Maruchan]

well it is the

Random

voting stage

reasons aren't neccessary in RVS

Not necessary, no, but they are still used a lot.

Link: "Are you a Day Vig? Did you really just Vig a townie like that!? Is that even a thing? I've heard about it in another game, but I don't really know if it exists."

You know he's a townie? Wow.

Vote: Link

Yeah, cause he's like obvtown as hell. I'm in 3 games with him and I'm noticing like no variations. Seems unlikely he's scum in all three.

Using on-going games(especially ones in which you have not seen his flip) are moot points to use.

then so is using past games, as meta is meta is meta. Meta is the same if you've finished or if its ongoing. Meta is the same if you flipped or not. Meta is Meta is Meta. If you EVER use Meta as a tell in any game whatsoever, then you're calling it a moot point right now.

[Maruchan]

@Zdenek: If you are DayVig, does using your power end the day?

I doubt it. That would be detrimental to town. Usually any form of day-power doesn't end the day. The only thing that ends the day besides a lynch is a modkill on a townie.

[Maruchan]

Mod, please delete the other two posts. I had a tag fail twice. :/

No Offense Mod, I love you and all (wait who is modding this game again? Gah I forget), but deleting posts due to mistakes, is 10X worse than leaving the mistakes, or fixing the mistakes for him. It leaves a gap in continuity

I read Link's reply which quoted a non existent post and for like 5 minutes I was thinking to myself "What the fuck is going on here?!?!?"

[quote-"Zdenek"]Well Maruchan is probably town and I wish he hadn't claimed.[/quote]
I thought I could take your claim at face value, and therefore expected my role to flip any minute anyways. Sorry for prematurely claiming, but you have to admit its not 100% my fault.

Frankly, it looks like in game communication between scum buddies.

Except, when I Was scum my mod told me that day-communications between scum in any form of code were EXPRESSLY not allowed, and in order for them to make this code, they would have had to talk about it in the QT, where the mod would have told them it wasn't allowed? Does that make sense?

[Maruchan]

DAMN IT. I didn't mean to hit submit yet! I was going to read through the next two pages and keep adding to it! >:(

[Maruchan]

e probably went V/LA to reduce the heat on him, as was said, then when it wasn't working anymore he decided to start posting here from his Wii or at least making typos to make it seem like such.

Yes rather than scumhunting and gets reads off the game, lets try at second guess whether a persons V/LA and typos from a Wii are all true or some gambit to gain a free-card to lurk. -.-
(that was sarcasm btw)

@Hellhound1: If Timeater is scum, why are you not voting for him?

VOTE: Timeater
Tada.

Voting on Demand. Just, wow. No I'm not saying you're scum, but doing something to PLEASE someone rather than doing it for yourself is just. No.

Donjohnson, Mysterio, The Tick, Hahonryuu, Maruchan: What page is it?

I think Eleven or twelve? Not 100% sure. Just got back from the 5 hours of PTing and making about 100 phone calls of "Hi this is Future Sailor Chester, is so ans so available? "Hi I am the local United States Navy Representative for Waukesha County, and I have been discussing with other students in the area some programs that would benefit them, and was curious if you'd like to talk about some opportunities that would effect you now and in your future" "Oh you're not interested, Thank you for you're time." that I was talking about, so when I left it was page 9 or 10.

oh and VOTE: Timeater I just want some pressure on him for a lil bit.

[Maruchan]

I'm not going to put timeater at L-1, but if by tomorrow night he has not posted some decent content I will gladly put my vote there. He is no longer on V/LA(for whatever reason) so posting in the next 24 hours should not be a problem for him.

Also, no one else vote for him just yet, he's at L-2.

What this guy said.

Let's leave him at L-2 until he says something, so that the mafia can't play the -hammers- "Oops that was a happer? my bad" card.

[Maruchan]

My Face if he just doesn't talk for 2-3 days so as to procrastinate the lynch.

XD

[Maruchan]

We eagerly await your analysis

[Maruchan]

Mod, please delete the other two posts. I had a tag fail twice. :/

No Offense Mod, I love you and all (wait who is modding this game again? Gah I forget), but deleting posts due to mistakes, is 10X worse than leaving the mistakes, or fixing the mistakes for him. It leaves a gap in continuity

Right, i'll keep that in mind for later i didn't realise it would do much difference. Thanks!

NP!

[Maruchan]

Except, when I Was scum my mod told me that day-communications between scum in any form of code were EXPRESSLY not allowed, and in order for them to make this code, they would have had to talk about it in the QT, where the mod would have told them it wasn't allowed? Does that make sense?

I am not saying that it is a code. My point is that Timeater is suggesting that DH and I are connected by alignment, which essentially means that he thinks we are scum or town together. On top of that, he said that he thinks that DH is town. If he was town, and thought that he figured out a mason pair, he would have kept his mouth shut. He didn't. So he is scum making sure to let his buddy know what he noticed.

Oh, I Didn't even think of that. Good point.

Loppy doesn't say much, but he spotted the same thing as me when it came down to MaruMaru.

Agreed, I want all input (especially from the lynchee) before we lynch him.

thoughts on everyone. btw this will very likely be a wall. err, get used to it >_>. it's habit of mine.

I love walls, but I don't have the time to read this thoroughly now. I will when I get him from Senior Registration.

[Maruchan]

the second quote is messed up. I guess it didn't copy what it was supposed to copy.

Supposed to say

Timeater is on L-2. I won't be voting him yet due to me not wanting any quickhammers today before Ryu, DJ and Mysterio have caught up

[Maruchan]

Otherwise, there are (by my count) 3 people who are willing to vote Timeater at this point, so a claim wouldn't be out of the question.

agreed

thirded

[Maruchan]

don't call me lazy. unless you have read the entire thread and have the game figured out then you are no better than me. whatevz bro. questions aren't difficult to come up with. don't blame your failure on me. for a town win, players have to work together. you guys have someone wrung up to L-2 and have generated 13 pages of content. good job. if you have no questions for me, then

consider my vote on timeeater, get a claim and move on.

[]/i] if others have questions, i'll answer. otherwise i will hopefully see you tomorrow and we can discuss more then.

@Dj: why aren't you playing as well as you did in mathamathia?

like i said, you guys racked up a good number of pages quick. i play well when i need to. i don't think i am not playing well atm, i am just playing different. i was extremely engaged in that game from the start if memory serves, mainly due to my familiarity with the player list and my enthusiasm for my role. not saying i am not enthusiastic about my role for this game, but the initial dh meltdown turned me off and i would rather just move the game along. a lynch, an nk, however many night actions we have, etc. if i am alive tomorrow, i will have much more info with which to reread the thread and produce analysis. right now i feel like i'd just be wasting time, of which i don't have huge chunks. i'll try to read up a bit here, because obviously you guys don't want to do things my way, but i can't make any promises.

vote: maruchan

in the meantime, why are we voting maru? i notice you answered my question 6 or 7 pages ago, but can you elaborate on the case?

underlined/italicized for emphasis.

Just curious, how does this work "Pretend my vote is on timeater as I wait for him to claim, but wait I'm voting Maruchan."

[Maruchan]

[/i] tag failed.

[Maruchan]

Ender: yes, yes i know its the mod. I was just going down the name list and i had a question for him. about your name. reference to the Ender series of books<game, shadow, etc>? or something else? or is it not even a reference and you are just the "ender"?

Yes, it's to do with the series of books.

you are now my favorite mod, because that is my favorite series of books and he is my favorite author of all time.

[Maruchan]

M'kay after reading tim's wall, Meh. I still find you're one of the more scummy players in the game, and seeing as you're claiming VT, being wrong wouldn't be TERRIBLE. Yes it would be bad, but it could be much worse. I wouldn't mind keeping you on the chopping block with a VT claim, because honestly, all of us VTs are expendable, and give the town info, when we flip. However I would also support a The Tick lynch either, as he posts very infrequently, and has played the good 'ol classic scum tactic of "Hold my vote until I see a good place to put it without drawing suspicion, while also helpign get an innocent townie lynched".


Basically: Yes timeater's recent post has made him LESS scummy, but has not erased him from my mind as scum overall. I would still be in favor of a lynch on him, and in the chances I am wrong about him being scum, doing a nice re-read given the information to check out his interactions.

Pedt: ninj'ad, will read it and reply shortly

[Maruchan]

I'm not expecting you to just spend every bit of free time you have on mafia. I sure don't.

I do.

speaking of zdenek's vig thing...perhaps no one got to it in my wall < come on guys, dont tell me i did all that for nothing> but AM curious as to what the rest of you think on my thoughts of it being unnecessarily risky. what if a PR was a target? if the PR claimed because they thought they were going to die then he exposed a PR to the mafia and we gain nothing from it really. even with how it turned out, at best we ended up gaining/losing nothing. maybe there is something I missed so, I ask again, what others think about the plan? am I just crazy/overly cautious/reading too much into it? or am I right?

I do agree it was a bit over-kill (not just cuz I was the one that thought I was dead. -.-), but I think it would have been a terribly unlikely move for scum to do. Why play a gambit to FIND scum, when you are scum so you know THEY aren't, and bring unwanted attention to yourself. So as much as I dislike him for (pretending to) killing me, I don't find it as in any way shape or form scum-motivated.

[Maruchan]

VCA?

[Maruchan]

vote count analysis.

sorry im an idiot, the Common Terms Page should really have that listed.

[Maruchan]

I agree @ the not buying it, DJ, what made you flip so drastically on timeater's alignment? First you're ready to lynch him and be done with it, and then 1 post of his later, he is likely-town.

michaeljacksonpopcorn.swf

I LOL'ed

[Maruchan]

not to say that he is 100% town, but in my experience, day 1 scum lynches claim other roles besides vanilla more often than not. by that logic, he is more likely town than scum. make sense?

VT Scum Lynch D1:
http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 9#p3274219
http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 3#p2893343
http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 2#p2882432
http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 0#p2788810
http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 4#p2797084
http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 5#p3074215 <claimed VT AFTER being vigged
http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 5#p3072105


Non-VT Scum Lynch D1:
http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 4#p2909984
http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 7#p2968567


How could they lynch him without getting a claim first?!?!?!?
http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 6#p2845506
He actually claimed scum and selfvoted. nice.
http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 6#p2841996


Thats roughly 45 games worth of Scum Lynched D1 claims. I think I don't need to find more.

[Maruchan]

(Yes I did just go and read through 45 games worth of deaths just to prove a point. This is why I have no life)

[Maruchan]

Tick, why are you witholding your vote? Are you not aware that
1) the vote is the town's strongest and only weapon, so we should use it (even if you don't think the player is scummy a little pressure can do wonders)
2) we are considerably far into the game and you should be able to have a read worthy of a vote
3) witholding votes is commonly seen in scum playing it safe or not wanting to be caught by VCA

This is my ISO from a previous game (it's not over yet, but I died N1)

http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... er_sort=Go

Some dude called me out on witholding my vote there too (ISO 10)

I'll tell you what I told him: I save my votes till I'm 100% sure somebody's scum.

I want to say that even though you are dead, you still technically aren't allowed to discuss ongoing games in this manner. Could be wrong.

Link is correct.

[Maruchan]

I haven't mentioned anything of relevance for a while. I'm trying to take a break from heavy research today, cause I'm sort of tired today. Expect a legitimate post tomorrow when I wake up.

I honestly didn't even read the part of this post that wasn't directed toward me.

It's not of immediate consequence.

Oh, good. Well, I'm getting off tonight. I really hope shit doesn't blow up tonight, cause I'm tired and I doubt why stamina will be much higher tomorrow.

You can blame me for wearing him out. Sorry guys.

[Maruchan]

you guys got through a nice 2 pages

anyways

Maruchan's meta-searching efforts are impressive although, not beyond scum so my vote remains for now. I have seen very clever and pro-town looking scum in my time who make big efforts to appear pro-town.
An example is http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 5#p3183795 where the efforts of the mafioso in making a vote chart gave me a very strong town read on the player in question, until she revealed that she did it in all games alignment-regardless, which dissapointed me a little.

Flea's response is rather dissapointing as he's still managed to avoid telling me any of his scumreads whatsoever. Imho, I don't know hoe Flea can ever be certain of who is scm anyways, so it looks like he'd never vote

Thanks for linking me to that. much more organized way of doing something I was attempting to do.

[Maruchan]

VOTE COUNT 4:
Zdenek -
Mysterio -
Don_johnson - Nintendoaddict,
Hellhound -
Timeater - Link, Zdenek, Hellhound, Maruchan, Ankamius, Empking
Link (sorry) -
Hahonryuu -
Nintendoaddict -
Empking - Hahonryuu
Twistedspoon -
The Tick -
Maruchan - Tspoon,
Ankamius - Don_johnson

Not Voting - Mysterio, The Tick, Timeater

Seven votes required for the lynch.

Day 1 ends 23:57 4th of september GMT

No more magikarp pictures, please

Woh something happened here. Matt isn't that close to lynch, and alot of votes were on hiplop

[Maruchan]

VOTE COUNT 4:
Zdenek -
Mysterio -
Don_johnson - Nintendoaddict,
Hellhound -
Timeater - Link, Zdenek, Hellhound, Maruchan, Ankamius, Empking
Link (sorry) -
Hahonryuu -
Nintendoaddict -
Empking - Hahonryuu
Twistedspoon -
The Tick -
Maruchan - Tspoon,
Ankamius - Don_johnson

Not Voting - Mysterio, The Tick, Timeater

Seven votes required for the lynch.

Day 1 ends 23:57 4th of september GMT

No more magikarp pictures, please

Woh something happened here. Matt isn't that close to lynch, and alot of votes were on hiplop

Firstly, who the hell is Matt and Hiplop? There's noone (from what i understand) called the former and the latter on this mafia game. Also, i have rechecked the whole Timeater (assuming that Timeater might possibly be called Matt) votes (on him) and they're correct. I think you have got the wrong game...

I'm an idiot ignore me. I mixed this game up with the one right next to it because they started at the same time, have a few of the same players, are about the same length, and I was tired at 4 in the morn

[Maruchan]

VOTE COUNT 4:
Zdenek -
Mysterio -
Don_johnson - Nintendoaddict,
Hellhound -
Timeater - Link, Zdenek, Hellhound, Maruchan, Ankamius, Empking
Link (sorry) -
Hahonryuu -
Nintendoaddict -
Empking - Hahonryuu
Twistedspoon -
The Tick -
Maruchan - Tspoon,
Ankamius - Don_johnson

Not Voting - Mysterio, The Tick, Timeater

Seven votes required for the lynch.

Day 1 ends 23:57 4th of september GMT

No more magikarp pictures, please

Woh something happened here. Matt isn't that close to lynch, and alot of votes were on hiplop

Firstly, who the hell is Matt and Hiplop? There's noone (from what i understand) called the former and the latter on this mafia game. Also, i have rechecked the whole Timeater (assuming that Timeater might possibly be called Matt) votes (on him) and they're correct. I think you have got the wrong game...

I'm an idiot ignore me. I mixed this game up with the one right next to it because they started at the same time, have a few of the same players, are about the same length, and I was tired at 4 in the morn

But that still doesn't explain what the hell happened there. matt and hiplop aren't even on that list.

that is explained by the tired part. my vision was blury. I don't have too incredibly awesome of vision anyways, and when I am tired it was worse. somehow I saw timeater as projectmatt. And I couldn't find hiplop.

[Maruchan]

also something that recently came to mind <maybe im thinking about it too much>, what if they are both scum and they planned on doing that so maru could "claim" and have us all believe he's town because he claimed town under pressure of death, thus we auto assume town <to an extent at least>...but problem being that, for me at least, it worked and I don't wanna lynch maru. but that's nothing but an after thought atm with so little to go on..

long story short its good that at least I'm not the only one questioning the Vig. on some level at least. same with empkings lack of doing...anything. openly at least. good to know my brain isn't completely useless in a game of mafia.

Impossible. He may have planned to do it as scum or town for whatever reason, I don't really care, but collaboration between the two of us is impossible.

There was no N0, scum-talk phase of this game. The thread opened at 5:20, we all received role PMs between 5:20 and 5:45, and at 5:45 he opened confirmation, in-thread. There would have been no time for the scum to plan anything together pre-game, no matter who you suspect the scum-team of being.

[Maruchan]

also something that recently came to mind <maybe im thinking about it too much>, what if they are both scum and they planned on doing that so maru could "claim" and have us all believe he's town because he claimed town under pressure of death, thus we auto assume town <to an extent at least>...but problem being that, for me at least, it worked and I don't wanna lynch maru. but that's nothing but an after thought atm with so little to go on..

long story short its good that at least I'm not the only one questioning the Vig. on some level at least. same with empkings lack of doing...anything. openly at least. good to know my brain isn't completely useless in a game of mafia.

Impossible. He may have planned to do it as scum or town for whatever reason, I don't really care, but collaboration between the two of us is impossible.

There was no N0, scum-talk phase of this game. The thread opened at 5:20, we all received role PMs between 5:20 and 5:45, and at 5:45 he opened confirmation, in-thread. There would have been no time for the scum to plan anything together pre-game, no matter who you suspect the scum-team of being.

Quicktopic could have been open prior to PMs, he could have sent scum PMs first, and discussion might have been open during in-thread confirmation since it was the confirmation phase. If what you say is true, I count about 37 minutes that could have contained discussion.

Lets not play outguess the mod m'kay? The quicktopic COULD have been made before the game totally correct. But guess what, scum get the quicktopic link, in their role PMs. Role PMs (for me at least, maybe yours is different. Since you say you think the QT was already opened when game started, maybe you got a role PM an hour before the game started so you could see the QT?) were sent out AFTER the game started. IE: even if QT was made before game started, scum didn't know about it till after game started.

The Day officially started at 5:57. I got my role PM at about 5:30 ish. So yes, scum could have talked for 27 minutes. Which I find is TOTALLY long enough for them to come up with an elaborate day-vig the scum-partner scheme, WHEN THEY COULDN'T EVEN GUARANTEE THE SCUM PARTNER WAS GOING TO LOOK SCUMMY.

I mean lets start being realistic guys? Stop being paranoid (Link), and be realistic.

[Maruchan]

I'm not being paranoid, I'm just looking at all possibilities. Denying them is dumb. I'm not even accusing anyone, I'm simply stating that you saying that it is impossible that Mafia talked before the game is an outright fallacy.

Okay, let me rephrase: Highly, extremely almost-guaranteed, 99.999% unlikely that the mafia planned anything before the day started.

[Maruchan]

I'm not going to be as blunt about it, but what Link said.

Me and him are wallers. We love our walls, and its how we play. when people say stuff to us, we feel every individual piece of it that needs a reply, deserves to have that reply read to....



SORRY FOR STOPPING MID POST MY ALARM JUST WENT OFF

SUITS IS ON

BE BACK I NAN HOUR

[Maruchan]

I'm reading Timeaters #325 and #327 as major town-tells, his geninuity and suggestion of wanting to fake claim to stick it to the game although wrong and very stupid read as town. As does the fact he's attempting to push Zdenek someone that has had no traction for lynching previously. Mafia that know there's a good chance they get lynched will either A) Fake claim a PR or B) Push elsewhere hardcore, he's done neither. I'm very much of the opinion that his wagon is highly scum motivated so I'll focus on reading and looking into that later as well.

@Link and Mauchan -

That's unfortunate, I was hoping you'd cut down on the walls but now I'll have to

skip them

spend more time focusing on them.

At the threat of looking scummy (again),

Unvote: Timeater; Vote: The Tick

I already agreed with your A, which is why I posted earlier saying he seemed more-town, but not enough to save him than he did before the claim/vote. However, I didn't even notice or consider your B which is completely true. And I feel stupid for missing it. In most my games (this one included), I push the "Scum hold their votes till they see a good wagon" game-theory playstyle. And yet, I didn't notice Timeater was doing the exact OPPOSITE of that. Thank you for pointing out to me a potentially harmful fallacy in my case.

And as I also stated after the VT claim, The Tick is now my prime-scum (then runner-up) candidate.

[Maruchan]

Vote: The Tick

I really should learn to read the thread's new posts ENTIRELY before I reply to the first one. Now my vote just looks like a sheep.

[Maruchan]

ISO me you'll find it.

[Maruchan]

So same as Twistedspoon pretty much. Read what's addressed to him.

I don't believe your comment at twistedspoon addressed any of the reason I believe you are scum.

im getting spooked reading this mini, TS is so good for a younger player (if his bio is true)

No offense, but please don't use ages to determine what you think relative player quality will be. I am relatively young compared to most of the site I believe, but I would still consider myself a

Decent

Player. Albeit, I have my not-so-good days/games, but so does everyone.

Even now maru

knowing that the scum didn't get to use their QT in post #413

is incredibly scummy and I don't see how everyone missed it

I expanded why I thought it would be impossible. I didn't say I KNEW they didn't, I just automatically assumed people with different timezones, and with different lives and schedules would find it hard to collaborate in a 30-minutes window, with no prior-warning that they would get this window.

I find it scummy that you automatically agree with me in the bolded part. That seems extremely close to being an admission to scum having not been able to read it.

Hell, I would love it if you could elaborate into why you believe he's scum despite his scumhunting thus far, his reaction to the vig-shot and his research and effort put in looking up claims information.

I thank you for this, however I really dislike it when people defend me. You didn't know this so I can't fault you, but I would prefer you didn't for future reference. It just opens up a can of worms I don't want opened. If you guys don't understand this, I would gladly explain further.

Regfan, I don't see how the premise that I play well as scum (in your opinion) makes me scummier

The fact that you are good as scum doesn't make you scummy, the fact that when you posted about your past games and experience you conveniently left out that you were an exceptional scum player does however seem SLIGHTLY (not much just slightly) scummy.

however what you don't know is that I have been nominated for 2 scummies

so touché

I don't see how this has any relevance to this game either in- or out-of-context.

Read Below

it is really misrepresenting when you provide a scummy I have been nominated for as scum, but not the one where I was town (and played better imho). Granted you probably didn't know (or expect me) to have a second one as town, but that fills the rest of the picture

Nevermind, I did not see where a past scummy for scum player was brought up, so I was uninformed. If someone is using a scummy nomination for scum player as a scum read, then your linking to nomination for town player is completely justified. Why didn't I delete it? I like people to know my thoughts on things that I plan on sharing, whether or not they stay relevant. Helps paint a fuller picture of my thought process.

i think this is a really important sequence of posts and should be talked about more

I have no objection to discussing anyone anything thinks is relevant, what would you like to be talked about? Ask me something respond to something I said. You start and I'll follow you're train of thought.

I clarify the shit out of things, because I llke to make it clear what the hell I'm doing.

QFT

2) the vig gambit. It could have been faked though the "well done for killing a VT thing." I'd know I'd have said it. However the fact that he still contributes and is (somewhat) pro-town after the gambit but before the resolution and doesn't dwell too much on being opportunistic or m

You seem to have stopped mid-thought, please clarify the rest of it for me?

3) research is always pro-town, but in this case it helped to save himself, not scumhunt. Thus he would have had a vested interest to be pro-town even as scum

I don't see how it had anything to do with saving me. I wasn't being questioned or provoked or even argued with at that point. I did the research solely to show that VT scum claims are very very common, which had nothing to do with me. If you could point out WHAT this was saving me from/HOW it saved me, I would be willing to agree that it is no longer pro-town, and rather pro-self.

3) post #223 is a very poor self defence and appeal to myself. Just because he was lynched in a previous game as a VT does not mean he is VT this game

I will give you that one, and agree that 1 game does not a pattern make. But it wasn't just one game I was lynched in as VT, that just happened to be the one you were there for. Trust me. within two months I will have a pattern for being lynched early-on as VT.

This is incredibly suspect. Why and how town Maru would know this is beyond me. A scumslip if ever I saw one

I already expanded this, please go read it. And refer to my earlier post about your almost-deeming-to-agree that there was no scum talk, even while calling me scummy for saying there probably was none.

Bonus conclusion for Regfan: Doesn't this remind you of my play from royal mafia? Playing scummily and posting fluff but saved by one moment of brilliance (in this case Maru's vig gambit response). If you didn't put it past me why are you doing so to Maru?

Glaring AtE, and using HIS meta to say that MY Meta would be similar is fucky as fuck argument.

3) There wasn't votes on him for him to be "Likely to be lynched" therefore he wasn't reading through the research to defend himself but rather to attain information and a conclusion on Timeaters claim which is incredibly town motivated.

Ah, I see someone else already pointed this out for me, in which case I refer you to further up in this quote wall. No offense of course.

Yeah DH replacing out meesed me up because I was focusing on him.

Didn't see DH's claim.

Mind explaining this please Empking?

Wow. I didn't even notice that. VERY nice catch there.

I'd like it to be noted that if Tick flips town (lol), Amkamius will receive my eye on him.

I apologize for the length of this quote wall, as will be explained the reasoning for it below as a C+P I am pasting everywhere, for continuity's sake:

@Everyone, I am sorry for my lack of activity the past 48 hours. Yesterday my recruiter had me making phone calls and stapling business cards to pamphlets all day, and today we had a huge DEP-BBQ/Picnic event, and I just got home after waking up 12 hours ago for it. For future reference: This is the RARE exception to my activity, not the norm. I doubt I will have such a long absence from the thread again all game.

[Maruchan]

It may not be optimal play, but I HATE to see OTHER people not defend themselves, so I fill I should live the same way. If I defend myself, I can only blame myself for things going the wrong way for me. If others defend me, they may not fully state what I think, or they misrepresent me, which will haunt me for future posts in cases against me. Or it is buddying scum trying to make me look guilty.

[Maruchan]

I'd like it to be noted that if Tick flips town (lol), Amkamius will receive my eye on him.

The Tick has been increasingly scummy for a lot of the game.

yes but you didn't say that in the post for which you voted him

[Maruchan]

DAT QUICK HAMMER!

Twilight has begun.

Let us speculate the events of the day

[Maruchan]

That was interesting..... And quick.

[Maruchan]

Analysis coming in a lil bit after I do some ISO's

[Maruchan]

what was?

the night phase

[Maruchan]

M'kay I re-read the page or so before the lynch and then ISO'd some people.

I think Empking was killed by the SK/Vig, as he wasn't particularly dangerous to the scum in any way shape or form (the reason I say or SK, is SK would gain some town-cred by killing who town wants killed. makes a vig fakeclaim easier. don't rule this out)

anyways, here is my reaction to my reading:

Vote: nintendo

I think this is our best bet for hitting scum, as explained below:

Due to a Day 1 lynch on scum, I find it EXTREMELY likely that at least one of those voting for him is scum hoping for +towncred due to bussing. Why? How else better to get town cred than to be on the Day one wagon into scumville? And of the people on the wagon, the votes most likely to be scum-bussing are those at the beginning or those towards the end. Why? Scum would either try to get town cred by beginning the bus on a partner, due to this would get them the most town-cred, OR, scum tend to hold their vote off till they see a useful wagon (like I pointed out The Tick was doing), then hop that wagon. If that wagon happens to be a scum buddy, so be it. Nintendoaddict was the Hammer on this particular wagon, and lets read his hammer post:

Screw it.

Vote: The Tick.

No explanation as to his vote, so I ISO'd him to see if maybe he explained his vote earlier on. Get this: The ONLY time nintendoaddict has quoted, or said anything at all about The Tick, all game, WAS TO COMMENT ABOUT PAST GAMES.

So he has avoided saying anything at all (good OR bad) about Tick all game, till he decides to throw in a hammer, without explaining his hammer.

I'm also going to go back alter and ISO some of the other not voting for TIck to see if any of them appear to be buddying/deferring to Tick's arguments or seem to ignore Tick at all. I would guess a 3-person scum team, with a possible third-party alignment also. Considering two peopel died last night, I would say the likliehood of an SK. However, sicne one was empking, I would be willing to believe vig.

On another note, I ISO'd last nights victim, which was relatively easy with only 17 posts, and I find it intersting that nintendo was the second-scummiest player in every one of her reads.

She died because nintendo was feeling unsafe? Or to frame nintendo? Combined with the fact that regfan found nintendo THAT SCUMMY all-game, the fact that mafia were already down one, and the WOW hammer, I think it more likely that regfan died to save nintendo's skin rather than to frame nintendo. I could be wrong however, so I would like to leave this up to discussion.

He was also willing to be the hammer on the timeater wagon earlier in the day, when he hadn't really been stating that he saw timeater as scummy. It just seemed like he was trying to offer to help town with whatever wagon town wanted more than he was trying to hammer someone he thought was scum.

His post #343, is where i first start seeing some actual pro-town interaction from him, but it is after being called scummy from a few other pro-town players, so overall its a null-tell for me whether this increased activity of scumhunting is because he IS town or because he wants to APPEAR town. He continues to build pro-town cases for a few more posts before declining into his early-game habit of just answering direct attacks at him or statements posed at him and such, but that is again a null tell, I do much the same during most of the end of my Day 1's too.

Over-all, the hammer, the flip, the night death, and the re-read I find nintendo the most scummy out of anyone else in the game. I invite you all to prove me wrong however, as doing so increases activity which is good for town.

[Maruchan]

No.

No guarantee at a doc, no guarantee SK won't fakeclaim vig. Overall I find that the chances of a vig claim being BAD outweigh the chances of a vigclaim being GOOD, so I would prefer to not have a vigclaim.

[Maruchan]

@Maru: Do you believe a scummer would kill someone D1 who lists them as one of their top scumspects?

I have seen it happen, so it is possible, although not always the case.

At your comment about killing off the best players, that is a reasonable assumption too, I just wasn't sure when I was making my case if reg would be classified as one of the best players. If anything, I would have expected me or you to die last night, due to the amount of town-cred currently attributed to us.

Also, please point out how Tick's ISO points to surescumLink, I am not seeing the connection myself.

Explain your comment about "Gurgi-esq"? I don't quite understand it.

[Maruchan]

I eagerly await your post of tomorrow then Timeater

[Maruchan]

First, I'd like to say that I do not support a vig-claim. X-shot or not, they have the ability to kill someone, and used properly that could go a long way. This is all even assuming that the second NK was a vig and not an SK so we really shouldn't even try to figure out how many killing roles town may or may not have as it will get us nowhere.

anyways, here is my reaction to my reading:

Vote: nintendo

I think this is our best bet for hitting scum, as explained below:

Due to a Day 1 lynch on scum, I find it EXTREMELY likely that at least one of those voting for him is scum hoping for +towncred due to bussing.

Let's take a look at the Tick wagon at lynch:

The Tick

-Tspoon, Maruchan,

Regfan

, Timeater, Link, Ankamius, Nintendoaddict1 (L-0!)
I see your name on that list, too.

Why? How else better to get town cred than to be on the Day one wagon into scumville? And of the people on the wagon, the votes most likely to be scum-bussing are those at the beginning or those towards the end.

Hold, on, back that up... let's look at the lynch wagon again...

The Tick

-Tspoon,

Maruchan

,

Regfan

, Timeater, Link, Ankamius, Nintendoaddict1 (L-0!)
You were the second vote on him. If the votes at the

beginning

and the end are scummy, then you are scummy by your own logic.

Why? Scum would either try to get town cred by beginning the bus on a partner, due to this would get them the most town-cred,

Which is exactly what you did. Huh.

OR, scum tend to hold their vote off till they see a useful wagon (like I pointed out The Tick was doing), then hop that wagon. If that wagon happens to be a scum buddy, so be it. Nintendoaddict was the Hammer on this particular wagon, and lets read his hammer post:

Screw it.

Vote: The Tick.

No explanation as to his vote, so I ISO'd him to see if maybe he explained his vote earlier on. Get this: The ONLY time nintendoaddict has quoted, or said anything at all about The Tick, all game, WAS TO COMMENT ABOUT PAST GAMES.

I was talking about The Tick's reasoning behind a logic he believed to be sound. He said he was wrong about it before, twice in one game, so I said that would make the logic not sound anymore.

So he has avoided saying anything at all (good OR bad) about Tick all game, till he decides to throw in a hammer, without explaining his hammer.

I did say that his logic was not sound. So I

did

mention him, in fact, it was negative because I was pointing out a flaw in his so called 'logic'.

On another note, I ISO'd last nights victim, which was relatively easy with only 17 posts, and I find it intersting that nintendo was the second-scummiest player in every one of her reads.

She died because nintendo was feeling unsafe? Or to frame nintendo? Combined with the fact that regfan found nintendo THAT SCUMMY all-game, the fact that mafia were already down one, and the WOW hammer, I think it more likely that regfan died to save nintendo's skin rather than to frame nintendo. I could be wrong however, so I would like to leave this up to discussion.

You think scum would be that stupid? Even if I was scum and wanted to do that, do you really believe my partner(s) would approve of it?

He was also willing to be the hammer on the timeater wagon earlier in the day, when he hadn't really been stating that he saw timeater as scummy. It just

seemed

like he was trying to offer to help town with whatever wagon town wanted more than he was trying to hammer someone he thought was scum.

First of all, if it seems like something to you, it can seem radically different to someone else, so that's all based on your perspective of what happened.
Second, I did talk about how I thought timeater was scummy for the whole V/LA-but-not-really-V/LA thing. Also, I never said I would hammer timeater, I? said I would vote for him. Get your facts straight, else they are not facts.

1. OMGUS sumor. I was buildign a case on what I think looks scummy, and ratehr than refute it you come back and attack me as beign scum? Ok. Nice OMGUSing.
2. You're right I was one of the first or last few votes, and I still stick by what I say. the first few or last few votes usually hold at least one scum. If this puts me in the scumlight for pointing it out, so be it. It needed to be pointed out. On a side note, my vote was actually the THRID, but someone unvoted, if I remember correctly.
3. Please lets not get into the "Do you REALLY think scum would.....?" discussion. I am a lover of WIFOM and WIFOM my ass off when I am scum. By all of your reactions to my assumption that nintendo might have killed the person attacking him, HECK, NEXT TIME I AM SCUM I WILL DO JUST THAT! It seems do work as a defense for why I am not scum (because why would scum ever kill the person attacking them), than it is actually considered. Opening up this door is like asking for a barrel full of WIFOM. My first game on-site, the night kill was analyzed as being a "they targeted him because he suspected scum" kill, due to a players insistence that "I rarely see scum WIFOM kill N1", when the scumteam WIFOM killed N1. NEVER SAY IT WONT HAPPEN, BECAUSE THATS WHEN IT WILL START HAPPENING.
4. You still haven't explained your hammer on him, kaithnxbaigurl.

[Maruchan]

1. OMGUS sumor. I was buildign a case on what I think looks scummy, and ratehr than refute it you come back and attack me as beign scum? Ok. Nice OMGUSing.
2. You're right I was one of the first or last few votes, and I still stick by what I say. the first few or last few votes usually hold at least one scum. If this puts me in the scumlight for pointing it out, so be it. It needed to be pointed out. On a side note, my vote was actually the THRID, but someone unvoted, if I remember correctly.
3. Please lets not get into the "Do you REALLY think scum would.....?" discussion. I am a lover of WIFOM and WIFOM my ass off when I am scum. By all of your reactions to my assumption that nintendo might have killed the person attacking him, HECK, NEXT TIME I AM SCUM I WILL DO JUST THAT! It seems do work as a defense for why I am not scum (because why would scum ever kill the person attacking them), than it is actually considered. Opening up this door is like asking for a barrel full of WIFOM. My first game on-site, the night kill was analyzed as being a "they targeted him because he suspected scum" kill, due to a players insistence that "I rarely see scum WIFOM kill N1", when the scumteam WIFOM killed N1. NEVER SAY IT WONT HAPPEN, BECAUSE THATS WHEN IT WILL START HAPPENING.
4. You still haven't explained your hammer on him, kaithnxbaigurl.

1. How am I OMGUSing? My vote is on TS.
2. Third vote is =/= early.
3. In that case the whole "Nintendo hammered and Regfan is dead" thing is completely WIFOM.
4. Yes, I have.

Actually, I hammered because I thought he was scum. And I was right.

1. While calling me scum and heavily FOSing me.
2. That was my point.
3. And the fact that nobody wants to believe it possible that someone would kill someone suspecting them makes the chances of it being true even more and more as an awesome WIFOM kill.
4. Yes, that makes for a nice explanation, after he is dead and WE all know he is scum. But you only ever mentioned him once before your hammer, so I see no pattern of you thinking he is scum.

[Maruchan]

I'm here, trying to formulate whats brewing in my mind into coherency. The Link thing is not an easy sell.

You shouldn't be attempting to sell us on anything, rather you should be attempting to SHOW us the almost-obvious.

[Maruchan]

if tim is scum, maru is probably scum too, but not positive.

ok, kind of where i jumped in now, so i'm pretty happy with:

vote: timeater

Does this mean that if he is town, then I am town? -.- I don 't see how you place me with him when I was calling for his lynch for most of the day, until someone pointed out something I was missing, at which point I went onto my next-highest scumread, but that's your opinion not mine.

[Maruchan]

lol. I orchestrated the Tick wagon. I called him scum after his FIRST FUCKING POST. I was CONSTANTLY ON HIM. If you really think I would bus my partner like that D1 under the pretense that I felt I had to because of the VT claim, - lol.

You call it a bus pattern because of what Maruchan posted earlier. Which is pattently UNTRUE btw. Only morons would push their scumpartners so hard D1 then never got off their shit when push comes to shove. If anything, the most prominent PATTERN is that of the late-bussing scum, not this strange fantasy you seem to be pushing.

Still putting together my thoughts on why I think Link is scum.

@TS - Nintendo, Ank, and DJ now to some extent, but its weak.

Uhm, dats what I said? I said either the first votes or last votes on the wagon, and called the last votes on yesterdays wagon the scum. So, you're agreeing with me... while calling me wrong?

[Maruchan]

Oh I see, Yeah my comment was about VCA's in general. The first few votes part is usually seen in later days, while the last few is usually seen in early days. Hence my case on nintendo.

[Maruchan]

w.o.w.

get a room, you two.

seriously, is noone else seeing this?

seeing what?

[Maruchan]

seriously thinking the forum is out to get me

leave for work, everything is dandy. come home from work to find a locked thread -_-

but thats ok, i have another game im playing. "*next day* off to work...and come home to a locked thread. curse you! i blame maru and empking. those are the only two things the games share clearly they are bad luck.

anyway, wow. looks like i have some catching up to do.

its ok, I blame myself often too. Someone else made a comment about "When did this become a marathon game" and I blamed myself for that. XD

On another not I laughed my ass off that I caused both of your games to go to night-phase

[Maruchan]

you said this:

Why? How else better to get town cred than to be on the Day one wagon into scumville? And of the people on the wagon, the votes most likely to be scum-bussing are those at the beginning or those towards the end.

now you've changed your statement to this:

Yeah my comment was about VCA's in general. The first few votes part is usually seen in later days, while the last few is usually seen in early days. Hence my case on nintendo.

you are simultaneously trying to bolster your case against nintendo while detracting from the case against tim. but you see:

You're right I was one of the first or last few votes, and I still stick by what I say. the first few or last few votes usually hold at least one scum. If this puts me in the scumlight for pointing it out, so be it. It needed to be pointed out. On a side note, my vote was actually the THRID, but someone unvoted, if I remember correctly.

^^ here you are maintaining the belief that the last few or the first few votes can contain scum. there is no clarification here to you meaning "in general", or to you differentiating between early days or late day wagons. i.e. you are full of shit.

you didn't "mean in general" and you weren't differentiating between days.

you are funny. such a HUGE backtrack. and to just play dumb. thats icing on the cake.

hey link and spoon, right now my list reads:

maru and tim = scum

everyone else= town

one of you bitches may be an sk, but whatevz, with both scum caught we should have no problem figuring that one out.

I am getting REALLY sick of learning that there is a certified shrink in every one of my games that can see inside my head to know what I am thinking. I think we need to be notified pre-game if any players are certified shrinks.

[Maruchan]

i'm not a shrink genius. and you fail to address where i prove that you backtracked. you know, the part where you say "herp derp, i meant late wagon votes in early days and early wagon votes in late days" after you twice reference the fact that you said this in between:

You're right I was one of the first or last few votes, and I still stick by what I say. the first few or last few votes usually hold at least one scum. If this puts me in the scumlight for pointing it out, so be it.

there is no reason for you to be in the spotlight if you were differentiating between early days and late days, and yet you make it painstakingly clear that you are not afraid to be in the spotlight if your earlier proposed theory holds true. seriously, you are caught scum.

would anyone like to defend maru or timeater? please feel free.

does anyone want to explain my post 565 and tell me that maru is not hugely backtracking? cause i'm all ears.

he's also pandering to the vig/sk, btw. by buddying the vig/sk, one is less likely to get shot in the night. but whatevz, i can't win this game all by myself. i need you guys to chime in and tell me if i'm crazy. i have clearly pointed out a giant backtrack made by maru, a connection between maru and tim, a connection between tim and tick, etc. etc. and maru's defense so far has been to play dumb and post ad hom.

p-edit: tim has joined the ad hom attack. nicely done. right on queue.

I didn't care if I was put in the spotlight because I didn't feel that the early-votes on this wagon were scum.
I honestly thought the early-game late votes, late-game early votes point was common knowledge so I didn't think to clarify it until someone else asked me why I didn't say this.

I assumed you were smarter enough to know that part, sorry that I was wrong.

And how the fuck am I buddying the vig/sk? I was asked if I Wanted them to claim and why. I answered these questions. if you don't want me to answer honestly, DONT ASK ME THE DAMN QUESTION.

[Maruchan]

And also at your case as to, I am scum, because timeater is scum, because tick was scum, I point you to http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 8#p3357218 where I was clearly voting timeater. If we had been scumteam and I was bussing, I started voting him and keeping on his case, even when others were trying to say he was town. like others have said, I didn't jump his BW due to it being a last chance, I was on him from the beginning, which is stupid if he was my scum partner.

Bus one partner till I see something I didn't notice then switch to bussing the other partner? seriously?

[Maruchan]

meh whatever. You can twist my words all yo uwant and whatnot. but thats usually a scum move. soooo.

[Maruchan]

Do I think Tim is town. I think he is more likely town than he is scum, yes.

[Maruchan]

Thats because it wasn't a giant backtrack, so I have nothing to say to your implying it was

[Maruchan]

@Tim, you'd be assuming correctly. He's taking one case of mid-wording and blowing it up X10. but whatever. I've already claimed so you all have all the info about me you need

[Maruchan]

[quote="hahonryuu"]worst case scenario they confirm a town in the eyes of everyone and create a decent NK target. or, back to my potential theory before, of them "confirming" town on a mafia partner[quote]
back to my point of, when did they plan this elaborate gambit?

[Maruchan]

effed up the / in my quote tags dang it

[Maruchan]

No I understand, the WIFOMability of it, everyone was all "scum would never do that" makes it the perfect thing for scum to do

[Maruchan]

I don't want to get into it. I suggested we don't do it. then people kept bringing it up. So I replied to comments about it even though I suggested we dont bring it up. yes.

[Maruchan]

I SUGGESTED we don't.

I didn't say "no matter what I am ignoring everyone who brings it up. If other peopel continue to post it after I ask them not to, it would be hurtful to town info to not reply to them.

[Maruchan]

Not wantign to get into it, and refusing to get into it when others bring it up are two different things. nice try though.

[Maruchan]

Because someone else forced me to, by bringing it up, and ignoring them is more harmful to the game than pointless WIFOM logic

[Maruchan]

Oh don't I love that argument.

I explained why I did it, if you don;t like my explanation, too bad.

[Maruchan]

OMGUS sumor

[Maruchan]

OI did, I made a nice little case on you, then answered every stupid pointless quote attack you threw at me, then got voted on and pointed out that it was an OMGUS

[Maruchan]

You didn't find me scummy or inconsistent whatsoever. Til I voted you. then you butthurt make a case on me, then don;t even VOTE me. Then you nitpick my wording. Then you vote me.

Yes I think that is sufficiently OMGUSY

[Maruchan]

Make you a deal Tim, we can trust you and lynch Link, but if he flips town, you're getting lynched 100% no matter what.

deal?

If you are confident enough in his scummieness to put your own neck on the line, then I don't see the harm.


(inb4 "what if its a bus though?!?!!!one!!!!!1!!!11!!!!!!one!!!!eleven", yes because the scum is totally stupid enough to attempt a double-bus when only 3-4 scum in-game to make it 1v like 7 townies, with a SK/Vig on the lose? lolno)

[Maruchan]

I was being sarcastic but wow you really don't like Link do you?

[Maruchan]

I believe he isn't posting,
because he told us he wouldn't be posting till tomorrow or the next day.

I COULD BE WRONG THOUGH

[Maruchan]

A: 100% sure he is scum, willign to bet his life on it

ten posts happen

B: HE IS 100% TOWN I KNOW IT





uhm?

[Maruchan]

Timeater I am getting a little off-put about your play. combined with my early-game scum read on you, I'm really getting kind of wary of you here. First you call link confirmTowned, then you call him confirmScumed, then you ask me to vote Hellhound with you, go for a short un-realted back and forth with nintendo, then vote for him?

Could you either stick to a case, or explain better all your flip flops when you do flip flop? Its really getting confusing.

[Maruchan]

Nintendo is surely scum. Maruchan, please list your reads on a sliding scale as Link requested.

I planned on it. Patience my friend patience. I just got home from the navy meeting and am a bit worn out and hungry. Give me a little while before I have to actually use my brain please.

[Maruchan]

It takes the bigger man to NOT have the last word nintendo. If the discussion has turned into a game of "no-u" then end it.

[Maruchan]

Wow hellhound was almost hammered? Dang.

First I would like the mod to clarify if it is 10 or 11 to lynch

THEN hellhound should claim before anyone hammers him. Always good policy.

[Maruchan]

Wow hellhound was almost hammered? Dang.

First I would like the mod to clarify if it is 10 or 11 to lynch

THEN hellhound should claim before anyone hammers him. Always good policy.

What TS said. Also, he totally claimed already.

wow the one post I skimmed is his claim.

and is two rods ling.

lol.

And I still want the mod to clarify. There might be a weird role mechanic in play that actually causes us to only need 5 to lynch. trust me on this. wait for mods ruling.

[Maruchan]

Oh this is a Normal? I thought all my Mini's except Lil Sicily were Themes. Mah Bad.

[Maruchan]

Oh this is a Normal? I thought all my Mini's except Lil Sicily were Themes. Mah Bad.

No. Theme games go in Coney Island and Theme Park sub-forums. And they always use pre-existing settings, to my knowledge. Such as Pokemon, My Little Pony, or Dexter.

I don't check what sub-forum I am in

[Maruchan]

i looked into my crystal ball and saw you murdering good townspeople one by one in the night.

I still would like a reason, cause that wasn't one.

^^

If your changing your votes, give legit game-related reasons please

[Maruchan]

it increases the mod workload. mod then has to click on every spoiler to be sure rules are not broken. its a good rule.

nintendo, first part of my post was not directed at you. so whatevz. i don't believe your claim, but i'd rather not lynch without a counterclaim.

unvote

anyonez?

No offense, but this is SLIGHTLY scummy.


Why in fucks name would a doctor CC a scum-claiming-doctor?

[Maruchan]

really? massclaim? This'll be only the second time I've done it on forum-mafia, and the first time this early.

but if thats what everyone wants.

[Maruchan]

it increases the mod workload. mod then has to click on every spoiler to be sure rules are not broken. its a good rule.

nintendo, first part of my post was not directed at you. so whatevz. i don't believe your claim, but i'd rather not lynch without a counterclaim.

unvote

anyonez?

No offense, but this is SLIGHTLY scummy.


Why in fucks name would a doctor CC a scum-claiming-doctor?

to getz the scum lynched. i thought that was obvious. no way i'm lynching an uncounterclaimed doc. and no, a vt should not cc the doc. in case you hadn't noticed, we've had a scum lynch, so a doc cc to nail scum #2 makes even more sense than if we hadn't already lynched scum.

and no, mass claim is stupid.

tim and maru, welcome back to the top of my scum list.

vote: timeater

or maru. take your pick. jeez.

I don't know the intricacies of when massclaim is a viable option. I was OK with massclaim because, hey, IVE ALREADY CLAIMED. So I personally had nothing to lose from it.

Sorry that you don't like that I am not experienced enough yet to know when massclaim is good or bad.

[Maruchan]

Plain and simple, there's no reason to lynch a PR that has not been counter-claimed in this situation. Nothing to be gained. I might be able to whip up a plan to make him useful. That's kind of my specialty, actually. Also, seems like a fairly legit claim. What scum really claims Doctor? There's so many more PRs that people actually give a fuck about and wouldn't just straight-out lynch.

UGH

Lets PLEASSSSE not get into "Would scum REALLLLLLLLLYYYY o this?!?" territory?

This is WIFOM mcshananigans gone crazy territory.

Nintendo claimed doc. Many people no longer want to lynch him without a CC.

I think if nintendo was scum, that would be a decent fakeclaim. Apparently you care enough about a doc to not lynch him right?

what's to say there aren't 2 docs and the other one not counterclaiming because he fells it's possible that there are 2?

if you're trying to say something, come out and say it, because I have a feeling you might die tonight now.

[Maruchan]

I think it's possible to prove Nintendo's claim; but that would require the vig to claim and out himself...

If the vig outed himself and declared a target to kill tonight, and nintendo promised to protect the same target then no kill should occur on that player

that would prove nintendo to be the doc

If a kill did occur then nintendo's claim would be false

what do we think of this method? I agree it's risky, but it's the only way to confirm him

but den mafioso kill dat vig.

[Maruchan]

so confused.

but whatever.

What if nintendo ISN'T the doctor, but the doctor doesn't want an innocent townie to die, so he protects him?

so many things could go wrong about your idea.

[Maruchan]

@Mod: Does a doctor protect from ALL kills, or just from ONE kill?

Vig/Scum both shoot person in attempt to make the doctor look guilty.

[Maruchan]

its alctually mod's decision as to whether docs protect from one or all. Different mods do it differently.

And i mean if say BobJoe is the doctor (random name just for the point i'm making), not nintendo, and you guys decide to kill JaneDoe. BobJoe protects JaneDoe so that an innocent person doesn't die, but now you think nintendo is the doctor.

[Maruchan]

Plain and simple, there's no reason to lynch a PR that has not been counter-claimed in this situation. Nothing to be gained. I might be able to whip up a plan to make him useful. That's kind of my specialty, actually. Also, seems like a fairly legit claim.

What scum really claims Doctor?

There's so many more PRs that people actually give a fuck about and wouldn't just straight-out lynch.

UGH

Lets PLEASSSSE not get into "Would scum REALLLLLLLLLYYYY o this?!?" territory?

This is WIFOM mcshananigans gone crazy territory.

Nintendo claimed doc. Many people no longer want to lynch him without a CC.

I think if nintendo was scum, that would be a decent fakeclaim. Apparently you care enough about a doc to not lynch him right?

I never suggested scum wouldn't do that, so please don't put words in my mouth.

My whole thing is looking at shit from multiple angles. Do you honestly believe I'm going to overlook the possibility that the claim is fake? I'm just saying that given the claim, I'm more inclined to believe it. A fake Doc claim is hard, because we can direct his protection at night and then even if he isn't the Doc, Mafia cant kill that person or he's outted as a fake. Yes, he could claim to be roleblocked, which isn't totally unlikely considering I'd be kind of surprised if there were no hookers in Vegas, so it just means that if we should take out a roleblocker, he has no excuses anymore.

For now I'd say the best bet is to just direct his protections. If they die, we can take it to indicate that either he is a liar or they have a roleblocker, either of which is useful information. If a roleblocker flips after that, we can infer he is probably town. If not, we can infer that he is probably scum. It's no guarantee, but it's the safest plan I can think of. Either way though, the death is not indicative of his alignment and it can actually hinder the Mafia if he is legit or if he isn't, so it seems like a solid plan. Any objections?

[Maruchan]

What he said

[Maruchan]

Oh yeah,

Unvote

js

[Maruchan]

Those weren't the fist letters of the lines, they weren't even the first letters of a

sentence

I haven't read hte rest of your post but I am abotu to.

Vote: Nintendo

That is an EXACTLY quote of his FIRST POST IN THE GAME (which I went back and checked. and yeah, they are the first letters of a line), so your attempt to discredit the truth makes you scummy as fuckin fuck.

[Maruchan]

IT WAS THE FIRST 3 LETTERS OF THE FIRST 3 LINES

READ THE POST

http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 9#p3346379

No it wasn't, you should go read it. The first three letters of the first three lines spell 'DoD'

Are you fucking blind?

http://www.diigo.com/item/image/1c74l/itae

[Maruchan]

See? I can change what a post looks like too. Only cosmetically on my end, I'm not actually changing the information.

I'm actually using firefox, si I can't do your nifty little google chrom trick.

care to explain how I see doc?

[Maruchan]

i typed "white mage" into the search engine of the wiki. nothing came up. this ain't a theme game. nice try.

vote: nintendo

i am peering into my crystal ball and i think nintendo may be an sk. if he flips scum, then tim and ts are town. if he flips sk, then hell if i know. either way though, he's a good lynch and ts is probtown who will draw the nk. if we have an investigative role, they might get another shot. but whatevz. hang this biotch.

p-edit: maru's voting reason is weak, sk flip puts maru back on the scumdar for sure.

Sorry I hadn't read the White Mage claim by the time I voted.

If you notice by what I am quoting, I was replying as-I-read.

With the White Mage claim, and the fact this is a Mini NORMAL, I am inclined to believe Nintendo is an SK or other third party or scum.

[Maruchan]

that doesn't "prove" anything other than that the role

may

exist.

can we lynch maru instead? i'm tired of the back and forth. nintendo should have claimed white mage when he claimed. backtracking like he did is uber scummy. i agree that his scumminess in this game looks to be more from playstyle, but there is no huge reason for us to have a "white mage". it doesn't fit.

if you think he's town, then we need to find the mafia roleblocker, because without that role, this game is broken. i am fine lynching maru. but whatevz.

trust me here Time; nintendo isn't stupid enough to claim an unheard of role in this situation. No scum makes roles up.

yes they do. all the time. in fact, it may be a role he's seen on another site and didn't even realize wasn't commonplace here. the claim is bullshit and your constant defense is only going to lead to your lynch in the event that nintendo flips town. so knock this shit off and hammer if you are town doc.

Could you point to your case on me instead?

[Maruchan]

maru: you've already admitted to playing scummy. don't be silly.

...
I did?

Would you mind pointing me as to where? I don't remember saying that

[Maruchan]

Ender beat me to the punch.

Tim, the setup passed both Normalcy and Balance quotas when examined by the Normal Review Board, AND when submitting your setup to them, you are supposed to submit every roel PM, and your first posts of the game including all rules. If they OKed the game without telling him he needed to warn of a custom role, then it is OK.

Who are we to second-guess the review board.

Now, onto TS's accusations, what would I have had to gain from Don's death? That he suspected BOTH me AND you? Lolno?

Vote: Twistedspoon

.
-Claimed Doc, when we already have a double-doc.
-Tried to say that there is a CONFIRMED FREAKIN ROLEBLOCKER. Or yakno, maybe scum and vig targeted same person? Scum NKed? Vig NKed? Many possibilities. Honestly, a scum NK would be perfect for twistedspoon, it gives "Viability" to his claim.

I think Don died because Don was pushing for a SPEED TS LYNCH IF NINTENDO FLIPS TOWN. Guess what, I like his advice.


SPEED TS LYNCH GO GO GO GO GO GO GO GO GO GO GO

[Maruchan]

You all know I am a VT. You all know TS is scum/doctor.

Keep claims a comin

[Maruchan]

@maru:

so why would I claim doc after a doc already claimed if I wasn't one? that's just asking for a lynch after the original doc flipped town?

IT MAKES NO SENSE

"Why would....do....? Makes no sense!"

WIFOMY WIFOMIGN WIFOM MC WIFOMERSHOM WIFOM

[Maruchan]

Link me to a game where mafia breadcrumb

WIFOMY WIFOMIGN WIFOM MC WIFOMERSHOM WIFOM

[Maruchan]

no point making a farewell post. I expect maruchan to pop his head in again, quote whatever I write and type wifom in caps several times.

i legit lol'd

[Maruchan]

Timeater quit fucking around and just tell us why you think he is scummy?

Quit with this padding around the bush bullshit.

[Maruchan]

TS; grow some balls and put up a fight. We can still win this. One messy mislynch isn't gonna cost us this.

scumteamclaim?

[Maruchan]

Maru is probably scum too.

Wait now.

I am scum, for asking your reason why somebody is a Serial Killer?


uhm dude.

SCUM DONT KNOW WHO THE SERIAL KILLER IS.

And they are just as much against the serial killer as the town is.

So me defending an "obvious serial killer" is a null tell.

However if you'd like to call Link SCUM< then yes you can say I am scum for asking you to provide reasons as to his scummienes.

Good try though

[Maruchan]

Tim. You do realize you were wrong yesterday. right?

[Maruchan]

DUN DU NDUN

[Maruchan]

then y u here bro?

[Maruchan]

BRAINFLASH!

zdenek+viggambit+multiplenightkills+none lastnight=ZDENEK POSSIBLE FERSRS VIG?!?!?

[Maruchan]

I didn't say it tbh. Twistedspoon said it.

He said if there is a vig its zdenek (or you).

I was just trying to see if anyone had actually read twistedspoon's posts.

[Maruchan]

If I was scum, I would be thoroughly confused right now.

I just tried to do a light-read of the interestingness of Tar's last weird-ass game last summer (something or other #4). Holy fucking shit, I can't think straight now.

[Maruchan]

PS if TS is scum I'll never post on MS again

This honestly sounds like two birds with one stone to me.I'm not sure if I'd be more surprised if you kept your word here or if you didn't.

Lol i was thinking the same thing. XD

[Maruchan]

I liek that plan, lets get twistedspoon first

[Maruchan]

Zdenek, care to explain your read?

You're wrong, 2 of those people im pretty sure are town (being me and HL), i think you might be bussing on TS.

I've actually been thinking of that possibility myself and if you should flip town and had planned to come after him if TS and you had flipped town. If you are right, then by my math, his plan guarantees a scum win. A clever plan, but it shall not work.

I was really trying to keep this under my hat, but I can see the endgame in sight, so I'll just have to claim. I'm the Odd Night Vig. First kill was on Empking because I thought it would be too hard to find him as scum and I knew he wouldn't be very useful even if he flipped town. My current theory is TS is a Mafia Doc to make up for the fact that we have a White Mage and a Vig and Zdenek is a Roleblocker to help stop both of those things.

Trust me on this one and go with a Zdenek lynch today and I'll Vig TS today for what I believe should be game. If Zdenek and TS flip town, you are welcome to lynch myself and hellhound, because I can almost hear Zdenek calling us scum right now.

UNVOTE: Twistedspoon, VOTE: Zdenek

so if you are a town odd-night vig, why did you get upset with me for trying to call attention to zdenek (who you think is scum)?

If he IS town and a VT, him being killed by mafia would have helped save you Link, and if he is scum, then me calling attention to him is not bad at all.

[Maruchan]

IGMEOY

[Maruchan]

zdenek, lets not split up our bandwaggons now. -.-

[Maruchan]

That quote says nothing. I just had a suspicion you were scum at the time, but I wasn't sure, so you were still useful as a tool to distract scum from lynching me. I've claimed now, so I have no qualms lynching you now. I had to make you think that I didn't suspect you too, in case you were Roleblocker.

I just had a suspicion you were scum at the time, but I wasn't sure, so you were still useful as a tool to distract scum from lynching me.

but I wasn't sure, so you were still useful as a tool to distract scum from lynching me.

so you were still useful as a tool to distract scum from lynching me.

tool to distract scum from lynching me.

scum from lynching me.

from lynching me.

lynching me.

lynching

[Maruchan]

I've seen other people use the method, and it more DRAMATIC.

[Maruchan]

unfortunately, nobody CC's Link.

Vote: zdenek

[Maruchan]

Well that was interesting

[Maruchan]

O.o

Glad I refresh all my games on a regular basis. How the fuck did we start this day 48 hours early?

(Going back to read the above wall)

[Maruchan]

hellhound might be lurkscum but at this point I doubt it

there is a whole bunch of analysis i could do but at this point it'd just be ignore because of how I acted earlier in the game

nocase isn't scum
im not scum
ts isnt scum

so basically you're insinuating Me/HL scumteam?

[Maruchan]

I already explained this, but I'll do so again. I thought for certain that Zdenek was scu8m, based on his own actions. For starters, I didn't like where his votes had been for the previous days. Day 1 he didn't vote Tick and Day 2 he voted nintendoaddict. Then Day 3 he voted you, which seemed like bussing to me. This post was the last straw. It wasn't that he wanted to lynch me, it was the certainty with which he stated that we'd win if we did it, when if any two of those people weren't scum, we'd actually lose. He left no room for contingency or chance for any other scum, he just stated that doing that meant we would win. From there, as I stated before, he attempted to discredit me rather than convince me he was town. His Vig ploy earlier also seemed like he was setting up to claim Vig at some point to me, which I knew was impossible.

Uhm.

No Offense.

But you did the exact same thing, guaranteeing a win if we lynched Scum RB zdenek, and you'd vig scum TS.

sooo

[Maruchan]

I would like to lynch Mar today actually

Wait for nocase

I wish you would start explaining your reads, you never have all game, and they've flip flopped like fuck

[Maruchan]

1. What about me?
2. What the fuck was that flip out on Link?
3. Uhm?

[Maruchan]

I wish people (nocase, timeater) knew how to explain their scumreads

[Maruchan]

Actually there is reason to lynch SK while scum remain and you're deflection from that point makes me wary of you.

With an SK alive, thats two kills a night, and SKs are usually night-kill immune, so they HAVE to be lynched. The fact that both scum AND town WANT them lynched simply makes it easier to get votes to lynch them.

No particular reason to lynch SK when scum live? You've got to be kidding me.

As I have recently learned from the dead QT of Ender's Game

(MOD EDIT: Ender's game meaning the book, not me)

, scum =/= mafioso. scum=anti-town role. SK=antitown rule. By the basic laws of mathematics, sk=scum.

[Maruchan]

I disagree. Unless the SK victory condition is within range, he has as much potential to help. SK and town both want scum dead. SK just wants town dead too.

I believe every game is unique, but from what games I know of and from off-site experience the SK goal is to be the LAST alive, this means killing both mafioso and town, emphasis on the mafioso. Mafia can win with SK alive when town cannot, therefore it is within the mafia's best interest to get rid of it fast.

Example of an SK PM I have had in the past

Dap

Welcome, Maruchan.

You are

Dap

, the

Overprotective Teacher

. You’re the faculty member in charge of dealing with the launchies, the newest arrivals to Battle School. During recent months, the school seems to have gone completely crazy; students are physically assaulting each other in bathrooms and hallways, and Colonel Graff and Major Anderson have done nothing about it. The environment has become too dangerous for these children, even if they are geniuses. But you can save them! You can use your status as a teacher to

ice

one student every night, sending them back home to Earth, never to return to Battle School.

Additionally, if any students attempt to investigate you to discover who you are, their attempt will be unsuccessful.

Because you are taking matters into your own hands, none of the other faculty would approve.You are working alone in this endeavor.

You win when no students remain in Battle School, and you still remain at the School.

The game thread is here.

Please confirm via PM stating your role name and alignment. If you have questions about your role, please don’t hesitate to ask.

To clarify, you are a Serial Killer. You have one kill per night, and any investigations used on you will fail.

On Night One, your predecessor iced Lord Chronos.

Please let me know if you have any questions.

Although you are correct that this particular SK was not night-kill immune, two other games I am in or have read through have had night-kill immune SKs. I believe it is more common for them to be nightkill immune than to not? Although I could be wrong.

The "No students" btw means everyone. I was the ONLY adult-role in the game, so therefore I had to kill scum and town to win. And like I said, from this standpoint, scum are more in-danger from me than town, as they are higher priority to get rid of. Town win condition requires all non-town to be dead, SK win condition requires all non-SK to be dead, and mafia win condition requires JUST town to be dead. Therefore the SK is the first priority for the mafia, and a high priority for the town too, since it gets rid of one more kill per night.

@Mod: IF you were to have an SK in this game, would you have made them night-kill immune? Feel free to state you refuse to answer this question

.[/quote]

[Maruchan]

TO CLARIFY: BY ENDERS GAME DEAD QT I MEANT THE DEAD QT OF THE MAFIA GAME NAMED "Ender's Game Mafia" NOT THE MAFIA GAME MODDED BY ENDER>

I legit lol'ed

[Maruchan]

Posting when I finish my work.

Waaaa. U hurt my feewings.


Now explain your reads and pull your tick tack edick out of your ass

[Maruchan]

@Maruchan

: You've seen me as a claimed PR before. You should understand how I operate by now. Question:
1. Do you believe that TS is the town Dc?

2. Why have you not cast a vote yet? Are you on the fence?

1, No. I have stated my opinion of TS since the begining of yesterday. hebscum.
2. You could say that. I am debating whether hellhound of timeater is his partner, and debating whether or not you're an SK.

[Maruchan]

quotefail

[Maruchan]

Where is nocase? I haven't heard from him in FOREVER. I want to hear his input.

[Maruchan]

because you're scum in real life.

And what is this supposed to mean?

[Maruchan]

it's only uncalled for because you don't know his offsite mafia enterprises.

i don't plan on explaining my reads right now. the primary reason is that i am lazy, apathetic, and weary. the secondary reason is that they are still coagulating.

oic, umad because I cheated when a cheater was trophyrunning, and then publicly posted the proof of cheating and self-deleted expecting an IP ban.


So basically, I being a small fish who never planned on trophy running, outted a BIG FISH willing to cheat for a trophy, and willingly took my punishment.

This makes me a bad person.

Isorry.


(Plus he totally threatened to blackmail me with it, and I don't like being blackmailed. Don't EVER cross me, you WILL lose in the end.)

[Maruchan]

Lets add insult to injury, DO you know MRCHEESETE0?

Played with silvermist and opoker a shitload?

Yeah?

dats was me before first selfdelete.

LULZ LULZ LULZ

[Maruchan]

Wait, you do know me from EM right? Thats what your whole "outside of MS mafia enterprises" implications you were throwin around? I didn't just bring a bunch of my past into the game for pointless reasons?

Either that or you're Amanda. She is the only person outside of EM who knows my Mafia-Websites Username.

And thanks for sayin I'm funny! Thats my goal in life. if I make other people smile/laugh, my life is complete.

[Maruchan]

@Timeater, on EM I knew a guy who was willing to cheat in order to gain the trophy (best player ofa 2-3 week period basically). I therefore commenced cheating with him, so as to have proof of chatlogs. He then blackmailed me.

I commenced posting said chatlogs, including my email address, in their full entirety, to the EpicMafia Forums.

I then self-deleted.

This was about a week after I found the amazing MafiaScum.

I periodically checked my topic on the forums, to see what others said (while not being logged in). A week later it had disappeared, said cheater I cheated with was permabanned, I checked ModLogs and so was my IP. I could no longer create accounts or log in with an account from my home computer (lolasifthatmattered. PHONE/SCHOOL/LIBRARY).

I then emigrated to MafiaScum, the lil Heaven on Earth.


peditninja: http://www.epicmafia.com

[Maruchan]

nocase you never answered my question. Are you from EM or Amanda?

[Maruchan]

rllinow?

Nah you're a troll from EM.

[Maruchan]

We have 5 confirmed vanilla townies. Dont give me any bullshit about me not being confirmed. I am fucking undisputed town. If you argue against that, its dumb and scummy. There are 2 other claimed Vanilla townies. One of them is scum. There are not seven vanilla townies in a setup with a strong doc. A guaranteed scum is selected between hellhound and maruchan.

UNVOTE

I extremely wish to policy lynch you just for fucking implying you are UBER TOWNZ SAYWUT?

[Maruchan]

Yes I read this, YOu are addressing Link here not me areyounot?

[Maruchan]

Also, what happened between those two posts:

I claimed Town Jailkeeper in one of the three games, and Link convinced himself I was scum from sayign I was confirmTOwn in it also, due to being Paranoid. (I don't blame him, paranoia is the way to win, as proved by townwin in said game)

[Maruchan]

let me get this straight. in a different game he fosed you. then he posted in this game implying that you were town in all three.

am i missing something?

No.

He thought me town in all three.

THen in the most prevalent of the three, he began to get suspicious of me.

He then got slightly-suspicious of Maruchan in all three.

I then flipped town in the one he got suspicious of me in.

After this IDK what his reads on me were in the other two.

(inb4 discussing ongoings: One is ended, and idk if I am still in the third with him or not?)

[Maruchan]

OH HOORAY

MORE TIM NOT EXPLAINING HIS WEAKASSSHIT AND SAYING ITS CUZ HE HAS A HUGEASS POST TO MAKE THAT HE FAILS TO MAKE.

[Maruchan]

OH HOORAY

MORE TIM NOT EXPLAINING HIS WEAKASSSHIT AND SAYING ITS CUZ HE HAS A HUGEASS POST TO MAKE THAT HE FAILS TO MAKE.

Maruchan, stop being an asshat. Whether you like it or not, Timeater is town and we're going to need him to get a win. All of us have to work together or scum will win.

I understand the work together part.

which is why I ask for explanations rather than

"DIS IS HOW IT IS IM RYTE YUR WRONG LETZGOBRO FOLLO DA LEADER" shit he is playing.

[Maruchan]

2. I don't see how you get that.

Either did I. but whatevs. I wrote it off as nocase trolling me.

[Maruchan]

OH HOORAY

MORE TIM NOT EXPLAINING HIS WEAKASSSHIT AND SAYING ITS CUZ HE HAS A HUGEASS POST TO MAKE THAT HE FAILS TO MAKE.

Maruchan, stop being an asshat. Whether you like it or not, Timeater is town and we're going to need him to get a win. All of us have to work together or scum will win.

I understand the work together part.

which is why I ask for explanations rather than

"DIS IS HOW IT IS IM RYTE YUR WRONG LETZGOBRO FOLLO DA LEADER" shit he is playing.

But you aren't doing it in a very polite way. There's really no reason to create animosity with fellow townies. We really can't afford a mislynch right now just because you want to take a shot at him. So let's all calm down and be reasonable. Maruchan, what are your current scum reads? Same question to hellhound.

I tried being polite and asking for the reads from him nicely. Multiple times i nfact.

Check my ISO.

He still refuses.

Scumreads are TS POSSIBLE you, but still IDK. And at this point I think it is rather beneficial to keep you alive even if you are SK, and not sure who TS's scumbuddy is. either tim or hellhound. both of which TS seems to have likelybussed. I want to say hellhound because tim would never be this fucking buddy up to TS, but I could be wrong. the ol wifom argument and whatnot.

[Maruchan]

TS you are going to have to throw aside your notions about DH/Ank/Case being town because of the D1 blow up. That could have happened to any alignment. Hell, it'd be quite good if it was scum just for those reasons.

Also, the animosity between nocase and maruchan in the last few pages reads as very fake and possibly set up to create a feeling of differing alignments. Also, Nocase's LOLBPCLAIM is very typical and very scummy.

THank you for actualyl explaining your vote (at least slightly)

Link, no matter what tonight, I think you need to test the bulletproof claim.

If he's town he had no reason to lie, if he's scum BAM. byebye


wait scratch that, if we tell you to go after him scum will also for a double-hit on him. UGH.

I hate that scum can see us talk but we cant see them. -.- being town is so hard.

[Maruchan]

You dont seem to understand that it is not the towns obligation to explain everything to the scum.

You do not seem to understand that is is the towns obligation to explain everything to the town.

[Maruchan]

ok, i'm not bulletproof. i'm vt. the lack of convo about it other than timeater's stuff is disappointing, although this solidifies my town read on him. let's get hikari for lying. not sure why everyone is ignoring that, either.

where did he lie exactly?

[Maruchan]

lynch me tomorrow. I like to wait for replies to questions kaithnx

[Maruchan]

No I don't have a problem with voting someone, as I DO now see nocase as getting quite scummy, what with lying about VT for "lulzreactionztstng", and then all the hopeless twisting of my words, but I wanted to see how he answered. I don't see how this is either trust. nor distrust in timeater.

Although I would have to agree with you know, whether or not you are SK, hellhound is unlikely scum due to TS bussing scum d1 AND d2 seems highly unlikely. I also agree with all your reasons as to why everyone else would be unlikely night targets.

Unfortunately I have come to the conclusion timeater is ubertowntrollextraordinaire. So he is unlikely scumpartner.

What is nocase at? since a votecount hasn't been posted lately, I don't want to make him L1 nor hammer without him answering where he "saw you lying"

[Maruchan]

lynch me tomorrow. I like to wait for replies to questions kaithnx

Responding with a challenge is scummy because of where the game is at. It is not a genuine and pro-town response to say "hey, lynch me leeewwlszz!" when we're probably in mylo. Second sentence is a case of disingenuousness and ultimately a pointless stance of "sticking to your principles" - this falls flat because we're utterly beyond any trivial bullshit you have to offer. "You like to do X" is a way of establishing any town reads players may have on you while attacking me. A scummy post.

I was basically telling you to fuck off and not tell me what to do in a trolly manner.

This post is interpreted as this:

I don't give a fuck about your opinion of me or what yo uthink, I won't vote nocase until he answers my question.



Don't like it? Deal with it.

[Maruchan]

Yes, I know he has points, but his gameplay of "fuck you you're scum i don't have to do anything for you" makes me react to him in manners I seem appropriate for the situation. AS has been demonstrated.

[Maruchan]

explain?

[Maruchan]

Explain better please? I still don't quite see it

[Maruchan]

You obviously understood his statement. how was that concern over mockery, and how is concern instead of mockery scumslip?

[Maruchan]

IM GONNA BLOW UP THE SCIENCE WING!!!!
wait not a science lab?

damn it!

I really want nocase to answer my question, of where did Link lie. But I have a feeling he'll avoid it just to prolong his death so

Vote:nocase

[Maruchan]

VOTE: Nocase

Even did vote tags.

[Maruchan]

Tim, thats how scum are. TS is a jerk cuz hebscum.

I'm tellin you man,

we lynch him tomorrow.

[Maruchan]

that's cool

hey maruchan, I've got a song I want to share with you
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sogKUx_q7ig

want to sing?

SURE BUT FIRST I YELL AT YOU FOR BEING THE FIRST PERSON TO SAY MYLO

GOS THAT WAS A FUCKIGN SCUMSLIP LIKE NO OTHER

JUST SRS

I'm still surprised you made it to endgame with me. I expected to bus your ass D2

[Maruchan]

Hikari Link, Timeater, I would like to dedicate this scum win to the two of you. None of this would have been possible if each of you had not fought on behalf of each ofthe scum. Timeater, without you TS would be dead. Link, without you I might be.

Thank you both of you.

ILUVYULONGTIME!♥

[Maruchan]

that's cool

hey maruchan, I've got a song I want to share with you
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sogKUx_q7ig

want to sing?

SURE BUT FIRST I YELL AT YOU FOR BEING THE FIRST PERSON TO SAY MYLO

GOS THAT WAS A FUCKIGN SCUMSLIP LIKE NO OTHER

JUST SRS

I'm still surprised you made it to endgame with me. I expected to bus your ass D2

?
it was Mylo
even HL knew that

and you were the one who pointed out that scum had no communication pre-game :/
That's a scumslip

It's only guaranteed mylo if you KNOW there isn't an SK. SK would have made it lylo (due to two night kills on town faction being possible)

[Maruchan]

I'm just glad they fucking fell for my LOLFAKETOWNIEREACTION VIGSHOT gambit.

God that worked like a gem.