Mini 1501: We're On A Boat! (END?! results inside)

[Kazekirimaru]

VOTE: Brian Skies

Wagons, biznitch.

[Kazekirimaru]

Not sure how to feel about miller claim.

Seen it legit before; seen it used as a scum gambit before.

[Kazekirimaru]

Yup.

Miller claims are absolutely null and wifom.

The fuck they are.

[Kazekirimaru]

You express yourself rather unsure about the miller claim, but yet are so adamant about them not being null tells in your next post. Then surely you have more of an opinion on the miller claim besides 'I dunno,' especially with the potential of the growing wagon.

Idk about HIS miller claim. But miller claims in general are not null. Apples and oranges.

I'm pretty alright with the aeronaut vote right meow

Unvote

VOTE: Aeronaut

[Kazekirimaru]

Bad excuses are bad and you should feel bad.

We got a live one, here.

[Kazekirimaru]

You do realize there is barely any pressure on you at all, right? Why are you defending so hard?

[Kazekirimaru]

Lulz. How do you bork up like that on accident?

[Kazekirimaru]

Like, you're segueing quotes together that don't belong together. I understand you made a mistake, but what were you doing to make that mistake possible?

[Kazekirimaru]

I suppose the quote borking is null.

Tryhard defending is not.

[Kazekirimaru]

fferyllt is town. I feel good about that one.

I'm pretty sold on Brian Skies's claim at this point.

CDB looks alright.

Aero needs rope.

The rest of you idk.

[Kazekirimaru]

Those of you still on Brian's wagon, why? Is it because you don't believe the claim, or some other reason?

[Kazekirimaru]

Nevermind CDB is nullish until I can ascertain why they're still on the aforementioned wagon.

[Kazekirimaru]

I liked CDB during the miller claim stuff but I'm withholding townread until I get some insights of afterwords, like why they still have their vote on Brian(if it's just chilling there because CDB hasn't checked in or something, then all the better.) I guess null leaning town would be the best way to put it.

[Kazekirimaru]

Because you make me uncomfortable.

Not sure what to make of it.

[Kazekirimaru]

You calling yourself obvtown isn't exactly comforting.

[Kazekirimaru]

The only reason I'd call you town thusfar would be for pegging Aero with a vote.

And even given that I'm not ruling you out just yet.

[Kazekirimaru]

So, Spyre, how do you propose we approach the situation?

[Kazekirimaru]

Bah. Replace outs are null. Hm.

Still not sure on ns. He's too involved. He generally doesn't get srs bsnz this point in the game unless he's scum. Also his content isn't consistent with either his town or scum meta. D:

[Kazekirimaru]

Baka.

[Kazekirimaru]

It was mainly other players' actions that sold it for me, if that makes sense.

I'm pretty sure Aero is scum. He's my #1 scumread.

Aero jumped on Brian's miller claim ez pz. I simply don't feel like this is a bus attempt, but a scum jumping for an easy mislynch.

I'll admit others' opinions helped solidify my own. I do tend to take the crowd's opinion into consideration in situations I'm not familiar with. I've never played with a miller in game before.

But yeah, them's the breaks.

[Kazekirimaru]

Remind me why, again?

[Kazekirimaru]

VOTE: Maestro

Seems like a good place to let my vote hang out.

[Kazekirimaru]

lol. I'm totes scum for wanting to hear more from Maestro. Mhmm.

You caught me.

[Kazekirimaru]

^ Sarcasm b t dubs

[Kazekirimaru]

You should join me on this glorious wagon, then. <3

[Kazekirimaru]

@Plum, Read my ISO and you'll see my reasoning for disagreeing with ns in 32/believing the miller claim.

Unless you already did that and still find me scummy, in which case whatevs

bro

miss

PEDIT: @SleepyKrew, I honestly don't remember my line of thinking at that time. I'm still working out the kinks here and there. I feel like I had a good reason at the time of saying that but I just don't recall v.v

But do tell me the scum motivation in me moving off the largest wagon to vote a lurker, kthx.

[Kazekirimaru]

But do tell me the scum motivation in me moving off the largest wagon to vote a lurker, kthx.

You're jumpy, Aero momentum was slowing down, and you saw two recent votes for Maestro. What's the

town

motivation of a third pressure vote in quick succession?

Pressure on a lurker. I thought that much was obvious.

Kaz - I see 'Miller claims aren't just null and WIFOM, even though I'm not sure about this one yet and I've seen this both from legit Town and gambiting scum'. Which fair enough? No bloody textual clue from as to why you believe the claim at the point you said you do, really.

Kay.

SK's got me figured out, gaiz

Hey you. Play the fucking game or leave.

@SpyreX: Hey. If you're so intent on finding scum, why are you taking a passive position? You should be asking questions and pressuring reads. I don't understand your approach.

[Kazekirimaru]

I don't see how it hurts.

Simple as that, really.

[Kazekirimaru]

Because it doesn't feel right that Miller claims should be null when they make so many waves. It's stated with an intent of something, it's just not always for the same reason.

That it does nothing is your opinion.

It probably is a lot less effective as a pressure tool now that you're DISCUSSING IT.

[Kazekirimaru]

I don't care.

[Kazekirimaru]

It means nothing now that we've discussed the voting at-length anyway.

[Kazekirimaru]

It means nothing now that we've discussed the voting at-length anyway.

IT DIDN'T MEAN ANYTHING ANYWAY
okay you admit that your vote is useless now
Do something
Anything

Nah. I like my vote where it is.

I still want to hear from him and I want my vote there when I do.

[Kazekirimaru]

You're a derp. Just be quiet.

[Kazekirimaru]

"I'm not contributing anything and don't want you to either"

Kay.

Just want to hear Maestro make a decent post. The bickering lately is just pointless dribble to me.

[Kazekirimaru]

Though how hard you're trying to make me unvote him is interesting.

Hm.

[Kazekirimaru]

By doing anything but keeping my vote on Maestro.

[Kazekirimaru]

By doing anything but keeping my vote on Maestro.

It's possible to provide content without moving your shit vote

You need to calm down.

The game is at a lull, I've contributed and scumhunted more that the majority of you.

If you ask me, my vote on him is not unfounded. I'd love to see him talk. Hell, I'd prefer it if he were L-1 so I could get some good reactions. Alas, all the reactions I'm getting are from you, and that's okay too.

But despite you flailing your arms around and crying at me for having my vote on a lurker, I suppose I have to agree my vote really does nothing right now since Maestro isn't responding.

Unvote

@CTD: I understand wanting to vote Brian, but why Smudger?

[Kazekirimaru]

lol you're confident. Poor misguided thing.

[Kazekirimaru]

Aero's not going anywhere right now, Sleepy. He's still very likely scum, but right now their wagon's stagnating and I'm looking elsewhere for reads.

It's not that hard to understand.

I prefer Kaze for short by the way, folks. I mean, just saying. ._.

@CDT: kk, I'll ISO him.

[Kazekirimaru]

You trolling little plebeian.

[Kazekirimaru]

notscience what are your thoughts right now?

[Kazekirimaru]

Kaze, do you not realize that I replaced Aero?
"looking elsewhere" oh boy I can't wait

...

oh.

uhm.

I need to reread the game.

[Kazekirimaru]

Shut up. v.v I'm under a lot of RL duress right now.

i know i know no excuses.

Anyway SleepyKrew looks a lot better now that I realize where they're coming from. I generally reset my reads to null for replacements so Sleepy looks town.

[Kazekirimaru]

I think I'm going to

VOTE: Garmr

All they're really done is berate ns this game.

Sup, Garmr?

[Kazekirimaru]

Why would Aero replacing out nullify his actions?
How do I look town now but didn't before you realized I replaced Aero?

It's just how I play. It has nothing to do with the replace in general. I choose to read people as players and not slots. It works out.

You looked like you were just chainsawing the people voting Maestro before.

But now that I see you jumped in and voted me from the get-go it looks better. Your reads don't look so contrived given the circumstance. You look like you're genuinely trying to find scum.

[Kazekirimaru]

Ouch. Nice discredit. And with such little provocation, too!

This vote feels nice.

[Kazekirimaru]

@ kazekirimaru
Lol and you pretty much being jumping on every wagon since the start of the game. The only time you voted someone who wasn't on wagon is when they are voting your scum buddy. Please be less obvious. Theroy 1 kaze and NS are scum buddies.

Is there a reason you keep trying to discredit me now that my vote's on you? Are you really that nervous with

two

votes on your wagon? You're being very reactive and that's not a good thing. If you were town you'd not be OMGUSing so bad, methinks.

If you really thought I were "obvious" scum, you'd vote me. Instead you'd rather throw stones from the safety of your fence.

(Bonus style points if Garmr votes me after this post.)

[Kazekirimaru]

- Because all they've done since I voted them is react to me voting them.

- Yes. Yes. It's a matter of circumstance.

[Kazekirimaru]

I wonldn't mind Garmr defending so hard if it weren't for the situation and means. He immediately goes to calling me scum for voting him, thus creating the illusion of absolutes(he is SCUM because he voted meeeee) and I wouldn't mind the defense so much if it weren't for the fact that that is ALL he's doing is defending. He's completely reactive.

[Kazekirimaru]

Eh, what?

[Kazekirimaru]

Oh, you jumped the gun. Okay.

[Kazekirimaru]

You didn't wait for me to finish~

So, your laughter is unwarranted.

But I think you're slowly sinking into conf bias anyway, so eh.

[Kazekirimaru]

Uhm, okay.

[Kazekirimaru]

lol no

[Kazekirimaru]

Hm.

Can't tell if there's scum on my wagon yet.

Well, at a grand total of two posts, YYR isn't exactly contributing...

[Kazekirimaru]

Uhh...? I don't like to self-meta analyze. That's kinda silly.

I guess any of them really cause I'm generally an aggressive scumhunter.

[Kazekirimaru]

You're annoying.

[Kazekirimaru]

But hey feel free to tunnel on one instance of my play and not even pretend the rest exists.

[Kazekirimaru]

Whatever, bro. You're wrong and you need to stop conf biasing.

[Kazekirimaru]

If you meta me you'll find that I make a very similar first post in every game I play. Where things go from there is entirely dependent on the playerlist and the game itself. I poke around and ask questions for the first few pages of a game. I don't put a vote down quickly.

If anyone besides me cares, this checks out. Thanks for having such an organized wiki page.

Bahhhhhhh.

I WISH I could just call you scum and brush you off. But scum wouldn't confirm townies like this.

[Kazekirimaru]

You don't give off scummy vibes to me. You're scumhunting and townhunting. You feel town, albeit misguided currently.

[Kazekirimaru]

Kay. So, you're insinuating that I'm acting illogical this game.

Alright.

[Kazekirimaru]

Or perhaps you're saying I'm not playing thoughtful enough?

Is this a caution or an accusation?

[Kazekirimaru]

(Bonus style points if Garmr votes me after this post.)

VOTE: Kazekirimaru

Good job. I knew you wouldn't let me down!

[Kazekirimaru]

But yeah if Garmr were OMGUSing any harder he'd be driving up here and slapping me in the face with his dick.

My goodness.

[Kazekirimaru]

Do people really even consider OMGUS a scumtell anymore (/again)?

Read some recent games and come to your own conclusions?

[Kazekirimaru]

What the fuck good is my answer when I'm the one calling it a scum tell? A. My answer is obvious and B. My answer is biased.

[Kazekirimaru]

@kaze It's not really Omgus when your being so scummy about it. Also your using OMGUS wrong because I do have reasons for voting you. A OMGUS vote is to describe outrage as the reason for why someone voted them I had valid reasons before i actually voted.

There's more to Mafia than just Wikipedia definitions. You're so adorable.

[Kazekirimaru]

It was less a serious question than a way of asking what if any relevant information you can find based merely on the fact that Garmr voted you back. You seem to be saying that in itself is an important, relevant fact in your case/stance against Garmr. Uh, really?

I keep getting ninja'd, but still - really?

His vote was clearly influenced by my prior vote on him. He was practically inactive until I voted him. Not only did he get offended, he all of a sudden pegged me as his #1 scumread after I voted him. Convenient, no? How are you not seeing this yourself? Uh, really?

You people blow my mind.

[Kazekirimaru]

Wait he said ns too.

So #1 or #2 either way.

[Kazekirimaru]

Woke up from a longer than expected nap. >_> Sorry about that. I'll focus once my head is clear.

Was your nap three days long? smh

[Kazekirimaru]

You don't even care about Garmr countering
smh

yeah pretty much

[Kazekirimaru]

That's...5 votes? L-2, right? Nice.

Bunch of sheep.

At least one scum on my wagon(obviously) maybe two.

I wish I weren't losing interest.

It seems like nobody wants to listen to me though...

[Kazekirimaru]

They're just opinions. Kaze opened RVS with a wagon vote, so I just assumed he likes wagons, especially since his play this game has supported it.

This is a good assumption.

He's the only vote on Garmr.

That is because Garmr is scum.

I like wagons, but I don't base my play around them. That would be silly and inflexible. I give votes where votes need givin'.

It's like you assumed my RVS behaviors would confirm me as town.

Confirm was the wrong word. But, it's a plus for them and a plus for you.

--

Hey hey, I see Maestro is a thing again.

Why isn't anyone else's throats being jumped down for that? I don't get it.

[Kazekirimaru]

- Smudger's ignorance of what a miller is supposed to be in #63 makes me think he's not scum with Brian either.

Ignorance is easily faked. Just throwing that out there.

After you goaded him about his suspicions of you without a vote, did maintaining his suspicions and voting you make a difference? Do you think that was alignment indicative?

Not the vote, necessarily. The fact that he started in on me after I voted him was clearly reactive. His vote was escalation.

[Kazekirimaru]

It's just really hard for me to imagine such chaotic play from a scum player.

His style has changed a lot since then, but his first scum game at MS was a well done, and pretty tight performance compared to what I'm seeing here.

So I can't be scum because my play here sucks.

Appreciate the scrutiny of my wagon but I feel a tad offended. D:

Oh well.

[Kazekirimaru]

lol I'm mentioned in almost every read.

I may suck at reading people but at least my existence and playstyle helps others get reads and scumhunt, amirite?

Just consider me a tool for your victory. <3

PEDIT: @Empire - Fair enough.

[Kazekirimaru]

Just dropping in to say that metaing me probably won't be very fruitful as I'm actively trying to change my town meta (which will also force me to change my scum meta) and I have no completed games since I've made this change

Go take a walk out the nearest upstairs window.

Seriously, I HATE this. I hate it when people say this. It's like an excuse to play as far from your townmeta/as close to your scummeta as you please. Get out.

Despite what you consciously change there will always be things you unconsciously do that can be meta'd. Telling people "lol don't try to meta me I'm changing up my shit" is just ridiculous.

kk sorry for the "T v T" Empire.

[Kazekirimaru]

Okay yes I should probably just commit suicide

I'm not serious. My goodness. I'd never genuinely wish death upon anybody. v.v

[Kazekirimaru]

Besides. Two stories? You'd probably just break your ankles. <3

[Kazekirimaru]

The SpyreX vote is stupid.

Unvote

VOTE: Empire

This one is better. As grandiose and impressive as his entrance is; it feels wrong to me at second glance. Miller claims...they draw attention. On their own they're null; but here they drew scrutiny faster than shouting "I'm Scum!" at the top of your lungs would ever be. Yet one of Empire's big reasons for voting SpyreX is because Spyre believed Miller claims aren't a shield. Well, they aren't. They may give you an excuse for returning guilty investigations, but in reading some games, Millers are basically a stigma. A Scarlet letter, if you will. There is no good advantage in claiming a Miller(This is my final muse on the subject of Millers.)

But, I digressed a bit. Despite all this, Empire still used his opinion to the contrary as a point to vote SpyreX. I don't like his reasoning. It looks like a mislynch push, and it seems to be working to an extent. I dislike it.

[Kazekirimaru]

What is a "town block/townbloc"? I've heard it used a couple times now but I can't find the term on the wiki. In context, it sounds like a group of townreads. Confirm?

[Kazekirimaru]

- You cannot honestly tell me a Miller claim is an advantage. There is nothing good about it, that's why people generally hate rolling it.

- Yeah, kinda. But it's the important point: the issue is with the reason he has a vote on someone. If I find flaw in voting reasoning, it feels good enough to me to throw a vote on them. Townies are supposed to be thorough when they profess to seriously vote someone. Scum however don't need to put as much thought into their votes. They know who scum is, they just need to mislynch town. So if a person like Empire makes a grand entrance, explains verbosely and at-length about their vote, and appears to have given thought to their selection - yet I still find their vote reasoning fundamentally flawed? It looks like posturing to me. Vote. You best believe I'm throwing it down.

[Kazekirimaru]

Fair enough. I'm totally willing to accept that Millers and advantages regarding them are subject to opinion greatly.

But a disagreement in said opinion shouldn't be a reason to vote someone.

That's the real point I'm making.

That and the latter point of my 487.

[Kazekirimaru]

I personally think a Kaze lynch is a rather poor idea.

[Kazekirimaru]

Spyre's neighborhood with notscience and the interactions regarding it are actually solidifying my townread on the former.

[Kazekirimaru]

Spyre's neighborhood with notscience and the interactions regarding it are actually solidifying my townread on the former.

I actually empathize with this to a degree. While I find aspects of it hair-raisingly asinine (Spyrex suggesting that a town/town neighborhood is "far more likely" than a town/scum neighborhood, Spyrex anticipating a fake neighbor claim), the manner of the claim did strike me as the first thing out of Spyrex's mouth that feels more likely to come from town than scum.

Indeed. From what I gather, Town generally tend to use 2-person neighborhoods as a scumhunting tool. A magnifying glass, if you will. It is expected that scum won't hold up as well in a 1v1 private environment. So this shows Spyre is attempting to get townreads and got one on ns somehow(though I don't see how really). Plus, I really don't see the scum motivation in Spyre crumbing and outing himself in order to justify his townread on ns. I feel if Spyre were scum, he'd have passively used the neighborhood to appease ns and nothing more. Everything about that claim and the interactions around it feels town.

[Kazekirimaru]

I have some business with Kaze, but I need Empire to post first.

I ponder what business that would be.

[Kazekirimaru]

Garmr

Confirmation bias is bad.

You need help <3

[Kazekirimaru]

I've a question

@the peeps in favor of a Brian lynch:

Do you want to lynch him because

You believe him to be scum faking miller

or

because you don't want to have a miller in lategame(perhaps even regardless of his alignment)?

[Kazekirimaru]

I'll pull up the links tomorrow when I'm more awake of the two games I mentioned where scum cruised to endgame on a miller claim despite "drawing scrutiny" in the beginning.

Please do. Thanks in advance.

[Kazekirimaru]

I request replacement.

I'm sorry, pitoli. RL is lame. Thanks for modding and thanks for having me.

[Kazekirimaru]

Good on you, Spyre.

And great game, pitoli. Thanks for modding!

Cheers to everyone else~

[Kazekirimaru]

Possible Godfather speculation burned this game to the rafters.