Mini 1591: PFs Flavorless Normal (Game Over)

Drew-Sta · Post Post #6 (isolation #0) » Thu Jul 24, 2014 1:17 pm

Ahhh, Princess Reinoe - we meet again. Have you cleaned the sand out of your vagina?

VOTE: Princess Reinoe

Drew-Sta · Post Post #15 (isolation #1) » Thu Jul 24, 2014 1:37 pm

In post 13, reinoe wrote:
Drew-Sta wrote:Ahhh, Princess Reinoe - we meet again. Have you cleaned the sand out of your vagina?

VOTE: Princess Reinoe

Too much effort so I had a transplant instead.

VOTE: farside22

Drew-Sta · Post Post #34 (isolation #2) » Thu Jul 24, 2014 4:16 pm

/serious post re the gross comment vote, happy for the mod to remove it if it has offended. I do apologise if it has too. I sometimes don't know my offensiveness via forum. /end serious post.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #37 (isolation #3) » Thu Jul 24, 2014 4:22 pm

@ Farside. The guys been on the site for 3 years. How is he an eager puppy with a new toy?

He does read like he's on the spectrum though (that's not an insult, BTW, and is an observation based on his posting style - I have a friend who plays on another site who is on the spectrum and posts in a similar way) which means how he presents is going to be different to how we would assume a player would.

This isn't a defence of his poor questioning either; more his interaction.

Also, glad it didn't offend

Drew-Sta · Post Post #40 (isolation #4) » Thu Jul 24, 2014 4:34 pm

lol, Reino, just lol.

Skrew, is English your second language? I'm trying to pinpoint why your posting style is so weird.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #43 (isolation #5) » Thu Jul 24, 2014 4:52 pm

In post 41, SleepyKrew wrote:Nope.
I hope you can figure out what's wrong with me before the end of the game, Dr. Drew

I don't think there's anything wrong with you. But you're definitely an alternative style to what I thought.

eyecwutudidthar re Dr Drew, BTW

Drew-Sta · Post Post #51 (isolation #6) » Thu Jul 24, 2014 7:09 pm

@Mod - V/LA until the 28th of July.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #225 (isolation #7) » Sun Jul 27, 2014 12:46 am

@ Dessew

Spoiler:

@ Cooldog

Spoiler:

@ Konowa

Spoiler:

VOTE: Konowa - Reasoning in spoilers.

@ Red Coyote

Spoiler:

@ Skrew

Spoiler:

@ Cyberbob

Spoiler:

@ IAI

Spoiler:

@ Goofy

Spoiler:

Drew-Sta · Post Post #226 (isolation #8) » Sun Jul 27, 2014 12:49 am

Also, just because I can:

Drew-Sta · Post Post #258 (isolation #9) » Sun Jul 27, 2014 12:36 pm

In post 227, Goofyd00d wrote:The 4 you had made? why include spoilers if you arent including quotes? Ain't nobody got time for dat.

Walls seem to upset people, I've noticed, so I try to be considerate and put spoilers in them. Also, I put post numbers in there. Are you so lazy as to not click on them?

You wrote in 202:

In this post Drew jumps to the conclusion that a normal expression is some areas of the US is actually a comment on someones amount of mafia played. Could be a partner jumping to a defense overly eager to help, or just someone who doesn't get that this is an expression.

Drew is trying hard to be well liked and not offend anyone, something someone who only provides useful town content(a townie) wouldn't need to do.

Although its a scum lean, its a 4 post scum lean and I won't support a wagon on someone on V/LA if their return date falls inside the day's time limit.

I've bolded the bit that I don't understand. What do you mean? Is it even in reference to me?

In post 230, SleepyKrew wrote:UNVOTE:
VOTE: Drew

Idiot.

In post 238, RedCoyote wrote:
Drew 225 wrote:

[...]

don't be a dick

[...]

And you're being a dick

[...]

Reinoe's being a dick

[...]

I honestly thought he was on the spectrum of autism or something with his first few posts. He's actually on the spectrum of 'how to be an annoying cock'

[...]

Another dick! Great work. Did you know I'm an Aussie and your silly American commentary means jack shit to me?

Talk about tryhard.

Sure. Tryhard.

In post 238, RedCoyote wrote:In other words, everyone that suspected you is a scummy dick? This post strikes me as fake.

Nope. Did you read my view on things?

Main suspects are the jump on a V/LA by RedCoyote and Konowa TBH - they aren't scum hunting, really, and I think were hoping to get a wagon on me for what I consider very little reasoning. Reinoe's being a dick (ruv u bro) but I so far don't think he's scummy. Dessew is... interesting. Attempting to scum hunt though. Farside is town. Obv town actually. You are... null leaning mafia based on 191. It just doesn't read right, but I am not sure why so I'm not keen to let it colour my view of you. SK is a warped mofo - I honestly thought he was on the spectrum of autism or something with his first few posts. He's actually on the spectrum of 'how to be an annoying cock', it seems. The rest are null leaning different ways but I have to keep some cards to myself. And I'm drunk!

The last little bit should indicate my desire to call those who are obviously not reading things well male genitalia.

To make it easy for you:

Scum - RedCoyote, Konowa
Leans - IAI for 191

They were my scum reads. SK is not mafia, as far as I can see. Annoying, but then I suppose I am for the rest of you too. Farside is obv town, Reinoe is null leaning town, Dessew is interesting. I haven't got a solid read yet.

In post 238, RedCoyote wrote:
The offensive overtures don't really comfort me that he's at all interested in finding scum, but moreso interested in his image. His Konowa vote in particular sullies the wagon on Konowa and has me thinking that Konowa is town. I mean, he kind of has a blanket scumread on several people here (Dessew, CD, Goofy myself, SK, reinoe and IAI), but he chooses Konowa to vote?
The only people he seems comfortable calling a townread is farside, which is absurd. I don't have a problem with a town or scumread on farside, but you'd be hard pressed to sway me in either direction to the extreme.

This is a blatant lie. Find and QUOTE me where I have said Cyberdog is mafia, or Goofy, or Dessew, or Reinoe, or SK. You can't. Its not there. Its clear misrepresentation, actually. And you know it.

Secondly, why is it absurd to call farside town? You just had a massive dig at me for my scum reads then have a massive dig at me for my town reads? Exactly what the fuck am I allowed to say?

You're doing an excellent job of character-assassinating me.

In post 238, RedCoyote wrote:
Goofy 227 wrote:The 4 you had made? why include spoilers if you arent including quotes? Ain't nobody got time for dat.

This. The posting style wasn't scummy, but it was annoying.

Gut is telling me Drew, reinoe and one of pops/farside/Dessew. Drew and reinoe are the best wagons today.

People need to read this and weight up EXACTLY how Reinoe, myself and pops / farside / Dessew link. I believe RC is mafia, and Konowa is his team mate. Its either or for me today.

In post 249, Dessew wrote:
Drew: I'd like to hear how I'm '... interesting.'

Your first post is an interesting gambit. I'm trying to work out why you'd do that. Intent is important.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #261 (isolation #10) » Sun Jul 27, 2014 1:09 pm

In post 260, Goofyd00d wrote:Drew, the 4 post scum read was me getting a scum read on you from the 4 posts you had made at the time. You only had 4 posts so that's not alot to scum read someone off of, which is why I didn't pursue at the time.

I'm not saying all 4 were scummy, just based on their combined content.

What content? I feel like you've misunderstood or misread me. Please be specific and I can walk you through it.

Its frustrating I have to prove myself like this but Konowa and RC have done a good job of fucking me over while I've been on V/LA. Mud sticks, yo.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #278 (isolation #11) » Sun Jul 27, 2014 4:48 pm

@Skrew

Also, voting/pressuring someone on V/LA isn't the great sin some people are making it out to be. Especially when the V/LA is so short. Super especially when the person still posts during it.

Any wagon on a V/LA is sus. I'm posting because it ends today and I'm ready to post. The tag will drop off soon. Remember - I'm ahead of you guys time wise.

@Goofy

I can't make it any more clear man, I don't understand what you aren't understanding.

In not one of your posts (and I ISO'd you to be sure) have you explained why those four posts are suspect. The only post I can tell of yours that goes halfway to giving me an idea about it is 202, where you write:

In this post Drew jumps to the conclusion that a normal expression is some areas of the US is actually a comment on someones amount of mafia played. Could be a partner jumping to a defense overly eager to help, or just someone who doesn't get that this is an expression.

Drew is trying hard to be well liked and not offend anyone, something someone who only provides useful town content(a townie) wouldn't need to do.

This is it, and this has nothing to do with 4 posts (as it all comes from basically one).

Now, unless you can actually articulate which posts (give me the post #'s too) are somehow scummy when connected, exactly what am I to draw from your comment? Or how am I even to respond? You say you can't explain it any better blah blah - if that is as good as you can get in explaining things, then we'll have a problem all game.

@RC

I don't understand your level of negativity, and I think you're trying to rile people up.

Some of it is me trying to get a reaction (which I find tends to give an indication to alignment), some is due to me being drunk when writing it, some is me just being frustrated that people like you draw spurious reasons from innocuous posts then completely misrepresent me.

Someone is an idiot for voting another player on D1?

No. Someone is an idiot when they change their vote more than they change their underwear in a week and without good reason.

You ever consider that maybe SK is trying to scumhunt? Do you think calling him an idiot will give him a better opinion of you?

I don't care for his opinion of me. I care that he isn't reading the game properly IMHO. Sure, he may be scumhunting, but he isn't showing the analysis of someone conducting scumhunting. He is, in fact, simply appearing like he's not lurking by posting dribble.

Also, in regards to your SK comment. Scum caught for the wrong reasons much?

lol. Riiiiiiiiiiiiiight.

How to push the edge of an envelope on your incredibly thin argument.

I don't know, when you flip someone off or call them a dick... I tend to think those aren't exactly "townreads", lol.

So basically, you interpreted my calling them a dick as a scum read. Y/N?

Call me crazy, but it doesn't seem like you respect their opinions very much. Also, given that you're scumreading me while calling me a dick, it stands to reason that when you call someone a dick, you're effectively calling them scum.

Incorrect. Your assumption. Not truth. The fact I clearly state my reads and you've completely misrepresented me in them is very much on show. Now you're retreating behind the veil of 'I'm offended and its your fault'.

But I'm guessing calling someone a dick or an "annoying cock" is just your way of showing affection? If that's the case, I retract my point.

Actually, Aussie's traditionally drag people down in their interaction. Its a cultural trait. The 'in that case, I retract my point' is a clear identification that you're retreating away as you know you've been called out on your fabrication.

In any case, I'm glad I actually got you to state your scumreads unequivocally, because all I got out of 225 was a lot of bravado, whining, mean-spiritedness and very little substance.

You got out of me my scumreads? I posted them very, very clearly. You have not pressured me into giving them, and in fact I was the one to identify to you that I have done them.

Screw it, I think you and Kon are both scum, but how bleedingly obvious your misrepresentation is makes me want to change.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: RedCoyote

It isn't. It's absurd to say that she's obvious town and your only townread. It would be just as absurd to say that she's obvious scum and someone's only scumread. The reason I say this is because she's had very little presence in this game relatively speaking.

Except, she isn't my only townread. Again, you are ACTUALLY NOT READING MY POSTS OR DELIBERATELY MISREPRESENTING ME:

Reinoe's being a dick (ruv u bro) but
I so far don't think he's scummy
.

SK is
not mafia
, as far as I can see.

So in fact, I have 3 town reads. Do you want to try this again where you claim something but in fact it is just 100% incorrect?

I realize this is intended to be rhetorical, but I'll take the opportunity to tell you anyway. Maybe try treating people with respect? Maybe consider that someone that is scumreading you doesn't necessarily have to be scum? Maybe someone that votes you isn't an "idiot" or a "dick", but someone that's trying to scumhunt?

Hey, I'll take it into consideration but the fact its gotten on your nerves only but noone else means I'm obviously not offensive to the rest of the game. And again, you're wrong. I am trying to scumhunt. Just because you don't like my methods =/= no scumhunting.

I would contend that you're doing it to yourself, friend. I'm just trying to figure out if you'd act this way as scum or town.

Rubbish. You do know what 'character assassination' is, right?

a slandering attack, esp.
intended to damage the reputation
of a public or political figure.

That would be you. I can't assassinate myself. I can reflect poorly on myself, but I can't complete the above act.

Where the link is? Maybe try looking at a vote count, lol.

By that argument you and Kono are scum.

In all seriousness, I'm obviously not calling the entire scumteam on page 10, D1. I'm saying, as it stands right now, those are my predictions. I strongly doubt that that will be the actual scumteam makeup, but I want my scumreads on the record as of right now.

Except thats not what you said here:

238

Because it's not particularly strong in light of what's been presented against Drew and reinoe.

Gut is telling me Drew, reinoe and one of pops/farside/Dessew. Drew and reinoe are the best wagons today.

Are you or are you not calling Reinoe, myself and one of the 'three' the scum team? Y/N answer.

I've seen very little substance behind the Konowa wagon. The fact that my biggest scumreads are on it is worrisome. Given how hard you and pops are pushing it (especially pops) makes me even more skiddish.

Again, are you not reading what has been written on Konowa?

Drew-Sta · Post Post #279 (isolation #12) » Sun Jul 27, 2014 4:49 pm

Actually, just realised that jumping of Kon draws away from the wagon. I'll back myself in what I feel is the scum team and go back onto Kon. I believe both are scum and both deserve the vote though.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Kon

Drew-Sta · Post Post #282 (isolation #13) » Sun Jul 27, 2014 5:14 pm

In post 280, Goofyd00d wrote:I will try to say this once again, when I made a read for you, you only had 4 posts. One was scummy, none were immediately town, so the sum of the 4 were scum, not all 4 are suspect. You only posted 4 posts at the time.

You only posted 4 posts at the time.

You only posted 4 posts at the time.

You only posted 4 posts at the time.

Ok, I get it. My bad there. I completely missed your point.

In post 281, Goofyd00d wrote:
In post 278, Drew-Sta wrote:@Skrew

Someone is an idiot for voting another player on D1?

No. Someone is an idiot when they change their vote more than they change their underwear in a week and without good reason.

In post 279, Drew-Sta wrote:Actually, just realised that jumping of Kon draws away from the wagon. I'll back myself in what I feel is the scum team and go back onto Kon. I believe both are scum and both deserve the vote though.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Kon

I know, I know. Hilariously ironic. It wasn't lost on me

Drew-Sta · Post Post #283 (isolation #14) » Sun Jul 27, 2014 5:15 pm

In my defence, I only changed it from one scum read to the next, then back to my original scum read. That counts, right? RIGHT?!?

Drew-Sta · Post Post #286 (isolation #15) » Sun Jul 27, 2014 5:39 pm

Skrewloose, you're beginning to grow on me

Drew-Sta · Post Post #308 (isolation #16) » Sun Jul 27, 2014 11:03 pm

In post 288, SleepyKrew wrote:
In post 284, SleepyKrew wrote:
In post 275, SleepyKrew wrote:Holy shit
Drop everything
VOTE: reinoe
He got caught in a contradiction and tried to justify it with bullshit. Let's go.

I'm just gonna death tunnel this
For the rest of this day I will only answer questions about reinoe's contradiction and subsequent bullshit.
That way I don't have to keep pretending to pay attention

DREW. GOOFY.
Do you guys not see it?

Yes, I do. Null-mafia now. I still think RC and Kon are more obvious.

In post 301, Cyberbob wrote:I'd like RC to respond in some way to my vote on him, preferably with some explanation of why he made that "this game is hard to follow :sadface:" post which is a time-honoured scum tell.

I'd like Dessew and Drew (and
nobody else
) to explain their Konowa votes again since as far as I can tell they're both using the same reasoning as pops.

In post 225, Drew-Sta wrote:@ Cyberbob

94 - I have two votes with zero case evidence and chatter on it. SK and Reinoe both sit on 3 at that point too. The focus was not explicitly on SK as you are implying.

True, but I was more narrowly discussing how everyone had been reacting to the SK/reinoe thing. There was obviously discussion of other things that were happening at the time but pretty much anytime someone talked about SK or reinoe it followed the script I described.

Not the same. My reasoning is here firstly:

Why the issue with my 37? Secondly, what was wrong with my Reinoe vote? It was RVS. He and I had a game a while back which was the context for my comment. What is your issue?

210 - You vote me, but then get sus on the person who votes me for equally spurious reasoning? i.e. the same fucking reasoning as you?

Also, care to answer 74, or are you just going to conveniently miss that one too?

RC's jump onto me when I was V/LA and his refusal to get off it seemed like a calculated move from them both.

Then Kon claim's he'd support an RC wagon in 213 seems like an attempt to distance.

He's also disappeared too, and he hasn't been prodded either - so either he's mafia getting some leniency, or he's town playing poorly.

Right now, my major read is on RC. I really, REALLY think he's mafia.

I'm very keen to flip flop onto him. In fact, I'm going to be a hypocrite again and do it because I believe in it and conviction is important in this game:

UNVOTE:
VOTE: RedCoyote

I think there's enough material there for people to see why, and for people to make their own judgement. And yes, Goofy, I know what I'm doing

Drew-Sta · Post Post #323 (isolation #17) » Mon Jul 28, 2014 2:01 pm

In post 320, reinoe wrote:
SleepyKrew wrote:I'm giving RC leeway for that post because he said he was dealing with out of game stuff, and lying about that sort of thing would be against the spirit of the game. Want to try getting the reinoe wagon going again?

Cyberbob wrote:Maybe. I want to hear from RC first.

"Hey, scumreads, help me vote my scumreads!!!" This interaction seems awkward to me. Besides the blatant and unsubtle attempt to form a counterwagon to Konowa.

PokerFace wrote:
Day 1 Vote Count:

Konowa (4) - farside22, popsofctown, Dessew, reinoe
Drew-Sta (2) - Konowa, RedCoyote
RedCoyote (2) - Cyberbob, Drew-Sta
<-----

reinoe (2) - SleepyKrew, CooLDoG
SleepyKrew (1) - Goofyd00d
CooLDoG (1) - I Am Innocent

Not voting (0) - No one

with 12 alive its 7 to lynch

Drew-Sta · Post Post #325 (isolation #18) » Mon Jul 28, 2014 2:43 pm

Yes, yes I do.

I'm agreeing with the wagon on Konowa (which Reinoe is pushing), but suggesting my read on RC is stronger and I have more confidence in it. If we get close to end of day and Konowa wagon is still going, I'll happily change vote back and lynch him. However, I think it is important for each player to stick to their strongest read until that point.

The problem is that just because you're on the wagon I agree with, doesn't mean your reasoning is

right

to be on that wagon. This is what Reinoe is suggesting - that you're either bussing or distancing (or both).

Skrew keeping off RC (or not following through with his thoughts on it) for what I consider insufficient reasons is, in my mind, not pro-town. If the guy is mafia, vote for him. If he isn't then don't.

Intent is the key, Cyberbob.

Why

are you on a wagon.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #328 (isolation #19) » Mon Jul 28, 2014 3:05 pm

In post 326, Cyberbob wrote:Yeah, nah. If the only reason you have to suspect me of doing much the same thing as you is your gut (or more accurately, reinoe's gut) then you should just say so. If you have other reasons, if you'd like to take a stab at arguing against my stated reasons for voting for RC, then you should do that instead. Trying to be vaguely intimidating only works if you're willing to back it up with an actual argument.

I didn't say I suspected you. I don't. I am suggesting that I see the point of what Reinoe is doing. His method is correct, his target in you is not. His target in Skrew, on the other hand, has merit.

He's got you pegged as a team IMHO. I don't think he's right, but he's at least arguing logically, despite being flawed.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #329 (isolation #20) » Mon Jul 28, 2014 3:07 pm

In post 327, Cyberbob wrote:Your thoughts about Skrew's behaviour towards the RC wagon
might
have some potential but only if you're willing to follow through on them. If you're going to accuse someone of being scummy for acting in a way that is similar to how you are acting you can't just handwave the contradiction away with "well I'm obv town and my gut says he's scum", it doesn't work like that. Nobody is obvtown, especially not on D1, you can't sit back and expect people to take your word for it.

PS: Dessew's whole thing with trying to make a case for pops being town is remarkably stupid. Not only is it far too early in the game to be making those kinds of calls, you're also painting a target on that person's back for scum to nightkill.

Neg town isn't necessarily scummy. Neg town is, in my view, acting in a way that is not in towns best interests. Again, intent is important. You can be neg town but town (which is usually the player making a mistake), or you can be neg town and scum (which is scum making a play for a mislynch).

Reinoe is, IMHO, misguided. But he's not, in his argument, being neg town. He's raising valid points especially for Skrew that should be dealt with properly, not dismissed because of his personality.

Think about it.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #331 (isolation #21) » Mon Jul 28, 2014 3:22 pm

His last point was the one I found valid, hence my pic. The interaction did feel forced, and Skrew's reluctance to pressure RC due to out of game issues, is odd and suspicious.

That's what I'm validating.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #349 (isolation #22) » Mon Jul 28, 2014 4:50 pm

In post 334, Cyberbob wrote:Why would you even want to make a town case on someone to begin with?

This is not an ok post to make. PoE, as Reinoe has said, is a valid form of scum hunting. Reducing the pool of suspects from X to Y is valid.

In post 335, Cyberbob wrote:It's OK to make a case for scum that early because that's kind of what town are supposed to do, nobody said it was ideal but you make do with what you've got. There is never (that I can think of) a time where it's a town imperative to be trying to make a "town case".

A 'town case' is as easy as calling someone 'obv town'; if you are picking on Reinoe doing it, why aren't you picking on me? Or everyone else doing it?

In post 337, Cyberbob wrote:All three of those reasons are cool and good but here's an even better reason to keep your towntells to yourself unless you have very good reason not to:

In post 327, Cyberbob wrote:you're also painting a target on that person's back for scum to nightkill.

Scum are motivated to kill town players that they feel they stand less of a chance to get mislynches on. "Confirmed town" players are also more likely to have their opinions be given a fair hearing, which makes it harder for scum to undermine them.

Preventing a mislynch is a valid reason for creating a town case.

In post 341, SleepyKrew wrote:
In post 331, Drew-Sta wrote:Skrew's reluctance to pressure RC due to out of game issues, is odd and suspicious.

But don't you
dare
vote Drew while he's on V/LA.

Red Coyote is not on V/LA - if he needed V/LA to sort out his issues, then sure - but he is not, so does not get the same exemption. Use your head, that was a stupid thing to say and completely illogical - you are using an apples and oranges comparison.

In post 341, SleepyKrew wrote:Was I scumreading RC before his "this is hard to follow because of skrew and reinoe" post? You guys are talking as if I did, but I don't think I did. That post seemed contrived to excuse a lack of engagement. He justified it with real life issues, and I'm going to believe him. He then re-engaged with the game. Hence, no more scumread.

Anyway I'll do that reinoe thing before bed.

You were withholding analysis on RC (and still are, IIRC), that was my problem. IRL issues does not negate the slot being analysed.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #353 (isolation #23) » Mon Jul 28, 2014 5:00 pm

Just because a series of 'old heads' consider it an invalid approach doesn't mean it is.

Declaring 8 from 10 people as town and then lynching the 9 / 10 person is, in my view, as legitimate as finding the 9 / 10 and voting for them. That you're so stubborn on this is frustrating but I'll accept is part of this community (the view, not your stubbornness).

Drew-Sta · Post Post #369 (isolation #24) » Mon Jul 28, 2014 5:48 pm

In post 354, Cyberbob wrote:
In post 353, Drew-Sta wrote:Just because a series of 'old heads' consider it an invalid approach doesn't mean it is.

Declaring 8 from 10 people as town and then lynching the 9 / 10 person is, in my view, as legitimate as finding the 9 / 10 and voting for them. That you're so stubborn on this is frustrating but I'll accept is part of this community (the view, not your stubbornness).

That's fine. Still not getting drawn back into it.

I'm ok with letting it go to sleep from here.

In post 355, Cyberbob wrote:What are your thoughts on reinoe's most recent transgression?

He's not playing the game I would, and I honestly can't see his point at stages, but I'm not convinced he's scum yet. He may prove this for me, but he hasn't yet. Read his LotR game. You see much of the same behaviour there and it makes me consider its 'just a Reinoe' thing. Ergo my 'Princess Reinoe' comment

In post 356, Goofyd00d wrote:Before I say this allow me to clarify, I'm not defending the slot Reinoe is playing, nor am I defending any other play.

If I were scum I would have been careful enough to not make that mistake. I believe if Reinoe has no other mafia experience they may be new enough to not think about the WIFOM that this would provide in order to do it on purpose.

Once again don't get me wrong, I'm scum leaning Reinoe for his play between my read dump and now, but I want legitimate reasons to bury him.

Agree.

In post 357, Cyberbob wrote:
In post 356, Goofyd00d wrote:If I were scum I would have been careful enough to not make that mistake.

"Too scummy to be scum" isn't actually a thing, sorry.

Also agree, but I don't think that's what Goofy's point is.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #372 (isolation #25) » Mon Jul 28, 2014 5:54 pm

Go have a VB Cyberbob. You silly Victorian's and that crazily poor beer

Drew-Sta · Post Post #373 (isolation #26) » Mon Jul 28, 2014 5:54 pm

In post 371, SleepyKrew wrote:
In post 369, Drew-Sta wrote:Read his LotR game. You see much of the same behaviour there and it makes me consider its 'just a Reinoe' thing.

Haven't and probably won't read the game; just pointing out that reinoe has already proclaimed trying to meta him to be useless.

Meta is always slippery, but personality is not.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #378 (isolation #27) » Mon Jul 28, 2014 6:04 pm

In post 374, Cyberbob wrote:
In post 372, Drew-Sta wrote:Go have a VB Cyberbob. You silly Victorian's and that crazily poor beer

I'll submit myself to the horror of a VB if you vote reinoe

I'm almost tempted to put you through the awful reality of doing so. Will you take a picture and post it up?

Drew-Sta · Post Post #384 (isolation #28) » Mon Jul 28, 2014 6:12 pm

In post 382, SleepyKrew wrote:Drew have you commented on my new reinoe thing? If so please quote. If not, WHY NOT

381? Skrewloose, you just wrote it mate.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #387 (isolation #29) » Mon Jul 28, 2014 6:27 pm

In post 380, Cyberbob wrote:
In post 378, Drew-Sta wrote:
In post 374, Cyberbob wrote:
In post 372, Drew-Sta wrote:Go have a VB Cyberbob. You silly Victorian's and that crazily poor beer

I'll submit myself to the horror of a VB if you vote reinoe

I'm almost tempted to put you through the awful reality of doing so. Will you take a picture and post it up?

Mmm as committed as I am to the grand old game of Mafia I don't think I'm quite that committed when push comes to shove.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #392 (isolation #30) » Mon Jul 28, 2014 6:32 pm

In post 386, SleepyKrew wrote:
In post 384, Drew-Sta wrote:
In post 382, SleepyKrew wrote:Drew have you commented on my new reinoe thing? If so please quote. If not, WHY NOT

381? Skrewloose, you just wrote it mate.

291 and those related to it before and after

I'm honestly reading 96 as him asking 3 people a question about 3 people.

I don't see where he has made the post 'I have divided you all into groups' but I may be missing something.

I think you're tunneling, and I think you've got confbias (and Cyberbob too ATM). I'm going to look stupid / implicated if Reinoe

is

mafia, but I suspect he is not.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #396 (isolation #31) » Mon Jul 28, 2014 6:34 pm

In post 391, Cyberbob wrote:Defending yourself is pro-town. Town players want to avoid town lynches, therefore if you are town then you can only help the town by defending yourself. Or at the very least you should be going back and reading as much as you can and trying to find new things to mention that have been missed by others to aid the town in future days.

Yeah, see here is where you're being inconsistent. He defends himself, and he's considered 'defensive and not scumhunting'. Yet you're accusing him of not scumhunting while applying pressure and expecting a defense. Its a vicious cycle that traps and ensnares.

It is also inconsistent with your 'town read' idea - what does it matter if he proves himself 'town' if we're not 'town hunting?'

I think your and Skrew are approaching this wrong; for Reinoe at least.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #397 (isolation #32) » Mon Jul 28, 2014 6:35 pm

In post 394, Cyberbob wrote:
In post 392, Drew-Sta wrote:I think you're tunneling, and I think you've got confbias (and Cyberbob too ATM).

No.

In post 392, Drew-Sta wrote:I'm going to look stupid / implicated if Reinoe
is
mafia,

Implicated? Probably not. Stupid? Definitely.

A Victard calling me stupid - now there's irony

In post 395, SleepyKrew wrote:
In post 392, Drew-Sta wrote:I'm honestly reading 96 as him asking 3 people a question about 3 people.

Then you're reading it wrong according to reinoe himself.
I don't remember reinoe ever saying something like "I have divided you all into groups" or anyone mentioning it?
Also of course I'm tunneling. I outright said I was. You know I said this.

I know you're tunneling. I'm suggesting your tunneling is the issue.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #411 (isolation #33) » Mon Jul 28, 2014 6:49 pm

In post 398, Cyberbob wrote:Village idiots overthinking things is the most frustrating thing, I swear.

Ouch!

C'mon mate, you've seen how I'm playing this game. You know I'm not a VI. Like I've said - if Reinoe does something I specifically think is scum-like, I'd most definitely help lynch him. But the fact is I don't think he has curled his argument so much that he's blatantly contradicted himself. He's definitely not gone about it in a pro-town way, but he's not mafia in my mind.

In post 400, SleepyKrew wrote:wtf

In post 397, Drew-Sta wrote:
In post 395, SleepyKrew wrote:
In post 392, Drew-Sta wrote:I'm honestly reading 96 as him asking 3 people a question about 3 people.

Then you're reading it wrong according to reinoe himself.
I don't remember reinoe ever saying something like "I have divided you all into groups" or anyone mentioning it?
Also of course I'm tunneling. I outright said I was. You know I said this.

I know you're tunneling. I'm suggesting your tunneling is the issue.

Could you address the top 2 lines in my post? I care more about those (because I'm tunneling).

This is answered by:

In post 402, reinoe wrote:
In post 395, SleepyKrew wrote:
In post 392, Drew-Sta wrote:I'm honestly reading 96 as him asking 3 people a question about 3 people.

Then you're reading it wrong according to reinoe himself.

Drew is correct and you are wrong. Btw, is "you are wrong" something you hear all the time in your life? All this confirmation bias you've got building up inside you can't be healthy. Take a walk outside. I know you're a lego piece but that doesn't mean you can't loosen up.

...this.

In post 401, Cyberbob wrote:Drew, if you truly believe tunnelling is going on then it's on you to offer up something better. That's - here's that term again! - the pro-town thing to do. Make your case.

No. I'm not responsible for your view of the world and I'm not going to get so completely wrapped up in defending someone that I have to enter your tunnel and show you how to look at it right. Not to mention, if you haven't been swayed by what I've said, then its confbias at work.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #412 (isolation #34) » Mon Jul 28, 2014 6:51 pm

In post 409, Cyberbob wrote:
In post 406, reinoe wrote:
In post 194, reinoe wrote:
In post 102, SleepyKrew wrote:
In post 96, reinoe wrote:Hey cooldog, farside, and red coyote, how many scum in here...

[konowa, sleepykrew, cyberbob]

What is this supposed to accomplish?

It allows me to cross reference some players to see if they have the same scum reads as I do. If I'm way off then I should re-asses. If multiple players have the same scumreads as I do then it let's me know I'm on the right track.

You can find out more about how to play mafia here.

SleepyKrew, seriously, pay attention.

I would have thought that in light of recent events you might have found it within yourself to stop trying to be condescending about other people paying attention?

C'mon mate, you just called me a VI. Ease up now, you're entering hypocrite territory.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #420 (isolation #35) » Mon Jul 28, 2014 7:00 pm

Are you seriously taking anything reinoe says to me seriously at this point? Do I really need to quote where he said that was a list of scumreads? Because if I do, then SOMEONE hasn't been paying attention

So basically nothing the guy says is right, not even his defence, and in fact you asking me for an answer is you seeking confbias?

Drew-Sta · Post Post #422 (isolation #36) » Mon Jul 28, 2014 7:03 pm

Unfortunately, yes you are responsible for promoting the cases you agree with and arguing against the cases you disagree with right up until the game ends or you die. That's - you guessed it! - how a town works. Throwing up your hands, writing off all opinions contrary to your own as confirmation bias and calling it a day is about as good a method of handing the game to the scum as I've ever seen.

I've promoted my case for why I don't think he's scum, but you're wanting me to pour more effort into it?

Let me ask you something - will anything short of a flip convince you he's town?

Drew-Sta · Post Post #425 (isolation #37) » Mon Jul 28, 2014 7:18 pm

In post 423, SleepyKrew wrote:
In post 420, Drew-Sta wrote:So basically nothing the guy says is right, not even his defence, and in fact you asking me for an answer is you seeking confbias?
Actually his defense can be okay in this instance because he has now explicitly said that those three were scumreads (meaning I was right and you were wrong neener neener neener).
I wouldn't really need to seek confbias if I wanted it? I'm trying to get you to see the light.

... huh?

In post 424, reinoe wrote:

In post 392, Drew-Sta wrote:I'm honestly reading 96 as him asking 3 people a question about 3 people.

Yes that's exactly what happened. SleepyKrew at this point has to be feigning ignorance.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #427 (isolation #38) » Mon Jul 28, 2014 7:36 pm

In post 426, SleepyKrew wrote:Okay Drew let's try this from the beginning.
Do you, Drew-Sta, believe that reinoe was calling Konowa, myself, and Cyberbob scum in post 96? Yes or no?

In post 392, Drew-Sta wrote:
In post 386, SleepyKrew wrote:
In post 384, Drew-Sta wrote:
In post 382, SleepyKrew wrote:Drew have you commented on my new reinoe thing? If so please quote. If not, WHY NOT

381? Skrewloose, you just wrote it mate.

291 and those related to it before and after

I'm honestly reading 96 as him asking 3 people a question about 3 people.

I don't see where he has made the post 'I have divided you all into groups' but I may be missing something.

I think you're tunneling, and I think you've got confbias (and Cyberbob too ATM). I'm going to look stupid / implicated if Reinoe
is
mafia, but I suspect he is not.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #428 (isolation #39) » Mon Jul 28, 2014 7:36 pm

So no, to answer your question - I do not read 96 as him scum reading you.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #434 (isolation #40) » Mon Jul 28, 2014 7:47 pm

Let me just be clear, as I am really, really sick of reading walls. (esp after that)

You believe his claiming the three in brackets as scum reads (which I acknowledge he is saying) is contradictory because he has 6 scumreads, because the people in his first list were also scum reads?

Drew-Sta · Post Post #438 (isolation #41) » Mon Jul 28, 2014 7:56 pm

Right, so you have a problem that he has put 2 sets of 3 people into brackets, called them scumreads and you think this is a contradiction... why?

No, I am paying attention doofus - you're about as clear as mud in your explanations. If you worked harder at being understood when you wrote shit you'd get a lot further in life

Drew-Sta · Post Post #443 (isolation #42) » Mon Jul 28, 2014 7:59 pm

In post 439, SleepyKrew wrote:
In post 428, Drew-Sta wrote:So no, to answer your question - I do not read 96 as him scum reading you.

okay

434 - Between you and Reinoe you're fucking with my head. Stop it. Ninja-posting at work with you two is difficult enough without the facepalms you're making me do.

In post 440, SleepyKrew wrote:
In post 431, SleepyKrew wrote:Now Drew go back and reread 291 and 381 and either vote for reinoe or tell me why I'm wrong.

Have you done this? Do this.

Yes. I still think you're stretching / reading too much into it.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #446 (isolation #43) » Mon Jul 28, 2014 8:03 pm

In post 442, reinoe wrote:
In post 436, SleepyKrew wrote:
In post 434, Drew-Sta wrote:You believe his claiming the three in brackets as scum reads (which I acknowledge he is saying) is contradictory because he has 6 scumreads, because the people in his first list were also scum reads?

No, he later made another set of brackets with three new names. When I say six scumreads, I mean the six names he's put into brackets. I also contend that him saying post 96 was scumreads is him retroactively trying to justify sheeping farside onto Konowa .

Yo, I explicitely called the first three scumreads in post 194. I voted konowa in 201. How can I retro-actively do something in the future?

Drew-Sta · Post Post #449 (isolation #44) » Mon Jul 28, 2014 8:05 pm

In post 445, SleepyKrew wrote:jesus christ Drew
I said tell me why I'm wrong if you disagree and you aren't even trying
What are you linking to 434 for? If you were paying attention and reading everything, you'd have no problem understanding what's been going on.

The problem is I'm struggling to see how you're even making sense Skrewball.

I think you're seeing something that isn't there. I can't explain it any better so I'm going to take a break. I want to hear from others as I feel like I'm bashing my head against a brick wall with you right now.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #511 (isolation #45) » Tue Jul 29, 2014 5:51 pm

loldefuckinglol. If that isn't obvs about RC then I don't know what is...

@mod - Please PM me if I am breaching R10. Happy to completely tone it down if you feel I'm out of line.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #526 (isolation #46) » Wed Jul 30, 2014 1:14 am

@ Cooldog

Spoiler:

@ goofy

Spoiler:

@Skrew

484 - Agree.

@RC

Spoiler:

Drew-Sta · Post Post #528 (isolation #47) » Wed Jul 30, 2014 1:27 am

Not sure on CD to be honest. Need to go ISO but its late and I'm prone to fucking things up at this time of the night.

Re your second question - its no different to a newbie sheeping the IC due to his position. Reinoe has a meta on farside and is acting on that basis. The issue is why.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #661 (isolation #48) » Thu Jul 31, 2014 8:14 pm

Prod dodge. Busy at work. Will post sometime in the next 5 hours.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #763 (isolation #49) » Sun Aug 03, 2014 12:47 am

Post comign.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #764 (isolation #50) » Sun Aug 03, 2014 1:32 am

@Cooldog

BUt this isn't how you portrayed the strength of your scum reads. You built up a very elaborate case on RC. You voted him. I've read your case and I don't find it particularly persuasive, but what ever. Now after making this huge case you feel content to just drop it and move to a bigger wagon. I don't think that someone who put that much effort into something would just get up and walk away from it just based on a vote count like you did. Especially this far away from deadline.

Err, I'm still voting RC and think my case is good?

Even so, if evidence came to light that I should change as I am wrong, isn't it in the best interests for town for me to change?

Not to mention, look at who is prodding for me - RC, Kon, Goofy are all pushing for me as a lynch. Look at their cases. A lot of it is built up off nothing posts. Look at

their

intent. You will have to if you lynch me as I will flip town.

Because you are doing the work of someone else when we are trying to figure out if he is scum or not. You are basically letting him sit back and post shit instead of anything else. You are interfering with the town's interrogation. Secondly the reason why you think town cases are good is pretty damn stupid in my honest opinion. You are literally giving away the only secret information you have to the scum. You are using a tactic that has been empirically proven to fail (this was discovered years ago, btw). And to compound it all, you are wrong on reino.

So... I should not defend anyone? I should let all lynches go through undefended no matter how bad I think they are?

That seems more scummy in mind mind. Also, you may dislike the reasons but they're my reason and my intent in it is not scummy despite you trying to make it look like it.

Re Reinoe - how do you know? You seem way too sure of his alignment pre flip.

2) You are probably scum because pretty much the only reason I could see to defend reinoe at this point is if he was your buddy.

And you've not read my post nor looked at my history. I have no reason to defend him except that its a shit lynch option and people know it. If it wasn't a shit lynch, Reinoe would be hanging now.

3) Meta is bullshit. I'm not looking up your other games because in all likelihood the reason why you brought it up is because this is the time that you drew scum and your self-constructed "defending other people" meta is starting to pay off now that you drew scum.

Riiiiight.

Dessew:

Everyone forgets about Goofy. I'll do this in the next post (in an hour or so.)

He's getting my attention due to some things posted by him. I thought your analysis was good on him. His response to it wasn't convincing and seemed very 'scan for my name' given he pops in and out.

Also, why the vote on me? Please validate your argument and not just sheep Goofy's posts.

@Goofy

Now in post 329 you claimed Reinoe not to be neg-town, here you say he's not pro-town, he may not have blatantly contradicted himself, but you have.

That's a blatant contradiction?

Reinoe is, IMHO, misguided.
But he's not, in his argument, being neg town
. He's raising valid points especially for Skrew that should be dealt with properly, not dismissed because of his personality.

He's definitely not gone about it in a pro-town way, but he's not mafia in my mind.

The former is talking about his argument. The latter is talking about his style. Another misrepresentation. Reinoe's signature comes to the fore - you're fabricating to make a scum read and it is obvious. You and RC buddies, eh?

What is your read on him, actually?

@RC

This is straight WIFOM. Why not acknowledge that?

Its meta, actually. Nice little misrep there. Also, WIFOM =/= scummy even if I was doing it, so what's your point?

I'll decide how to form my own read of you, thank you very much. I don't need you self-selecting your own meta to put yourself in the best possible light.

Selective reasoning and bias.

Also, your play completely contradicts your play at the start of this game when you put on a big show of being concerned that you may have offended farside by daring to utter the word "vagina". This inconsistance is damning.

I'm an emotional guy who plays with his heart on his sleeve. So sue me. Are you deliberately trying to get personal / continue to character assassinate me?

Also, my style may fluctuate, but my argument has been bang on each time. I'm also 2-0 up in our little 'RC says something and completely misreps me' game - 3-0 if you include this post

Shall we keep playing?

It's hard for me to take someone that goes around calling me a dick or a cock, what have you, seriously when they raise the charge of character assassination. I'm giving you my impression of your attitude. You can take it or leave it. I don't expect you to agree with it.

Seriously, get over it princess. If you're going to use the name calling as some sort of 'Oh my GOSH HE'S A BAD MAN WHO MUST BE MAFIA' approach, then own up to that.

Here is my point - exactly WHAT does the impression of my attitude mean in relation to my written words when I form an argument? You're AtE / AtF with regards to me, and you're attempting to make me appear like the bad guy. Are you seriously going to play this angle?

You asked me where was the connection between you and reinoe as though there was nothing whatsoever that would put you two together. I said that you were both voting Konowa. I assume that's what this argument was referring to.

I am suggesting you are using an argument and analysis that is equally valid for me as it is for you in terms of who we should lynch - my question is, why is your argument better when it is essentially the same as mine by your reasoning but with different targets (according to you)?

I don't know where you're even going with this anymore. All I did was give out my scumreads at the moment and you and reinoe (and farside, too, later in the game) jumped on me for trying to call the whole scumteam. The point is so asinine that I'm upset with having to even "2+2=4" thing for you. It makes me think you're just throwing whatever at me until you think something sticks. It's also a waste of time to continually have to rebutt these little, nonsensical points and it drains me mentally to have to do so, which you may very well be trying to use to your advantage.

Nom, you've been found out and called out and now you're backpedaling by claiming my argument is wrong.

You claim a defense of Reinoe is scummy. I'm claiming it isn't. Your above quote is you throwing your hands up and walking away going 'I don't know anymore!'.

Because reasonable townies don't get frightened over having one or two votes on them on D1. Paranoid townies do. Scum sometimes do.

So I might be a paranoid townie, yet you want to lynch me?

Firstly, I was not frightened. I actually think your vote on me in VLA was telling - you constructed a case from nothing and have been locked into it now.

Secondly, why was my response frightened? That's a misrep - angry, maybe, but frightened is purely in your imagination.

I like how you immediately assume I am trying to misrepresent you. Confirmation bias.

Convenient. Either you didn't read my post well or you're backtracking. Which one?

Reads:

RC, Goofy scummy, Kon / Beck still a FoS.

Cooldog is a dud too.

Dessew, I like. Farside, I like. Skrew is growing on me properly. Reinoe still town in my mind. IAI null.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #765 (isolation #51) » Sun Aug 03, 2014 1:32 am

Also, excuse the wall and any errors grammar or otherwise.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #785 (isolation #52) » Sun Aug 03, 2014 12:23 pm

In post 780, Dessew wrote:@RC: I don't recall calling Goofy scum. But you're right, that post wasn't the bestest ever, indeed, I just wanted to see if there was any useful information, appearently, there wasn't.
@RC&Drew: there are lots of cases going on and the one on Drew is the best, imo, the most convincing, at least. I'll make my ow case on him. I might reread the whole reinoe stuff with an open mind, though. My problem with the reinoe-wagon is that he
implicitely
called the first bracket scum and didn't the second one.
@Drew: defending others is fine, as long as you don't put answers into their mouths and don't do it with BS.

Be very, very explicit as to what part of the arguments against me (seeing as there's only one making them against me and two (you included) attempting to sheep this). I want post numbers and quotes. Otherwise, all I can say is you're not reading it well.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #826 (isolation #53) » Mon Aug 04, 2014 11:07 am

Drew-Sta · Post Post #827 (isolation #54) » Mon Aug 04, 2014 11:16 am

In post 805, Dessew wrote:I started to make a case on Drew, but I got tangled up. Here are the bits of Goofy's 656 I find good, anyway:

In post 656, Goofyd00d wrote:I would quote #225 here but it has been requested that noone does that again. So I will simply state that ad hominen has no place in forum mafia. In live mafia where things can get heated some can be excusable, but in forum mafia it just means that you can't think of anything real to discredit arguments so you have to belittle people to get it done instead.

Spoiler: In post 325 we see Drew trying to convince people to stop using votes to pressure information out of people, very early in day 1, with noone above 4 votes. Basically no more active scum hunting with votes yo
In post 325, Drew-Sta wrote:Yes, yes I do.

I'm agreeing with the wagon on Konowa (which Reinoe is pushing), but suggesting my read on RC is stronger and I have more confidence in it. If we get close to end of day and Konowa wagon is still going, I'll happily change vote back and lynch him. However,
I think it is important for each player to stick to their strongest read until that point.

The problem is that just because you're on the wagon I agree with, doesn't mean your reasoning is
right
to be on that wagon. This is what Reinoe is suggesting - that you're either bussing or distancing (or both).

Skrew keeping off RC (or not following through with his thoughts on it) for what I consider insufficient reasons is, in my mind, not pro-town. If the guy is mafia, vote for him. If he isn't then don't.

Intent is the key, Cyberbob.
Why
are you on a wagon.

Spoiler: Here in post 329 We see Drew slip in a defense for Reinoe into a response to a post that did not pertain to Reinoe, seems he may be trying to be more discreet with his defense here
In post 329, Drew-Sta wrote:
In post 327, Cyberbob wrote:Your thoughts about Skrew's behaviour towards the RC wagon
might
have some potential but only if you're willing to follow through on them. If you're going to accuse someone of being scummy for acting in a way that is similar to how you are acting you can't just handwave the contradiction away with "well I'm obv town and my gut says he's scum", it doesn't work like that. Nobody is obvtown, especially not on D1, you can't sit back and expect people to take your word for it.

PS: Dessew's whole thing with trying to make a case for pops being town is remarkably stupid. Not only is it far too early in the game to be making those kinds of calls, you're also painting a target on that person's back for scum to nightkill.

Neg town isn't necessarily scummy. Neg town is, in my view, acting in a way that is not in towns best interests. Again, intent is important. You can be neg town but town (which is usually the player making a mistake), or you can be neg town and scum (which is scum making a play for a mislynch).

Reinoe is, IMHO, misguided. But he's not, in his argument, being neg town. He's raising valid points especially for Skrew that should be dealt with properly, not dismissed because of his personality.

Think about it.

As I was reading posts, I found this:

In post 99, Cyberbob wrote:The only scenario where it would make sense that Drewscum would verbally cheer on SK's wagon while voting for you is if you are town and SK is his buddy.

Where did Drew 'verbally cheer on SK's wagon'?

I didn't cheer on SK wagon. Also, I ask that you to point out exactly what about the argument at me is compelling, and you've basically sheeped Goofy.

Also, those Goofy quotes are a complete misrep of me. And you know it.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #828 (isolation #55) » Mon Aug 04, 2014 11:18 am

In post 798, popsofctown wrote:
Vote: Drew-sta

It's nearing deadline, so I need to vote for a viable lynch, and I have a pretty strong town feel on reinoe. So Drew is my favorite of the other leading wagons. The original case for him itself never clicked for me, but he seems to go about defending himself in a scummy way, occasionally with some condescension that could "yes but that's not why silly" scum defense.

I would vote cooldog if I had to, he's null for me. I would prefer the Drew lynch. The plus is that in one or two people's eyes a Drew scumflip would vindicate reinoe and get them onboard with my thinking on that.

Did anyone have any questions for me I missed? I'm ready to see something flip at this phase of the game, really.

So you don't like the case against me but you'll vote me because... you didn't like my defense?

Really?

Drew-Sta · Post Post #829 (isolation #56) » Mon Aug 04, 2014 11:20 am

Seriously, there's some very easily misled town in this game.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #830 (isolation #57) » Mon Aug 04, 2014 11:22 am

Dessew town I think
RC scum or dumb
Reinoe town
Goofy scum
IAI town
Farside town
Cooldog neg town / likely scum
Skrew town

Drew-Sta · Post Post #836 (isolation #58) » Mon Aug 04, 2014 1:47 pm

Also, Beck = scum too based on my read on Kon.

vote:drew
If he flips scum we lynch dessew. Drew/dessew scum team where drew decided to defend reinoe for town points. Seems legit.

You want to give some evidence for that? Like, anything?

In post 831, I Am Innocent wrote:
In post 829, Drew-Sta wrote:Seriously, there's some very easily misled town in this game.

Who are you referring to? And how are you so sure they are misled town vs. scum???

Pops seems townish, but I could be mistaken. RC is, as I say, dumb or scum - one of the two. I'm banking on the latter, not the former. But if he's the former - there's no emoticon to express my frustration.

Dessew's vote on me is just a sheeping of Goofy. Given Goofy is not even voting me, it shows a lack of critical analysis to it all, and a lack of analysis on Goofy.

In post 833, popsofctown wrote:Cooldog feels like a weak lynch. Beck would be a better lynch just standing on Konowa's post record alone. Would enough people go for that?

Why is Cooldog a weak lynch? Especially in light of me?

Drew-Sta · Post Post #837 (isolation #59) » Mon Aug 04, 2014 1:50 pm

Seriously, are people reading this?

vote:drew
If he flips scum we lynch dessew. Drew/dessew scum team where drew decided to defend reinoe for town points. Seems legit.

In post 816, RedCoyote wrote:
I'm happy to lynch Drew, but if reinoe is strongly against it, I'll give him some leadership capital here

Why? What because he was wagoned? That isn't a valid reason.

Also, farside as a darkhorse scum person for asking a bunch of red-herring questions.

Votes me, but claims the wagon on me is poor. WTF?

Drew-Sta · Post Post #839 (isolation #60) » Mon Aug 04, 2014 2:00 pm

I need to reevaluate CD. I'll have a crack and come back with something.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #842 (isolation #61) » Mon Aug 04, 2014 3:15 pm

In post 840, farside22 wrote:
In post 837, Drew-Sta wrote:Seriously, are people reading this?

vote:drew
If he flips scum we lynch dessew. Drew/dessew scum team where drew decided to defend reinoe for town points. Seems legit.

In post 816, RedCoyote wrote:
I'm happy to lynch Drew, but if reinoe is strongly against it, I'll give him some leadership capital here

Why? What because he was wagoned? That isn't a valid reason.

Also, farside as a darkhorse scum person for asking a bunch of red-herring questions.

Votes me, but claims the wagon on me is poor. WTF?

Cd is talking about Renoie in this sentence.

Ok, I misunderstood.

In post 841, popsofctown wrote:
In post 834, farside22 wrote:
In post 833, popsofctown wrote:Cooldog feels like a weak lynch. Beck would be a better lynch just standing on Konowa's post record alone. Would enough people go for that?

Why does it seem weak? I mean you had him as null. I'm just waiting for a what do you see/think?
Also you have a town read on Renoie. Do you think scum was on that wagon?

These are actually related. I don't assume scum is on any big town-targetted wagon by default, and in reinoe's case in particular I don't think it's damning to have attacked reinoe. Cooldog is among those posters whose line of thought seemed wrong, but internally consistent and understandable.
Multiple actors seemed to shift focus to/from Drew, so that seems like an informative lynch. Cooldog was never that popular and just kinda slowly bubbled to a consensus lynch, it doesn't seem that informative.

Konowa lynch would be very informative for similar reasons, and a good deal more likely to flip scum.

There's a frustratingly long list of lynches I'd prefer to cooldog: Skrew, RC, IAI, goofy.
Drew actually has a poor standing on that list, and sorry @Drew that my vote is parked there, but you have a high viability.
If we could pull together an improved flashwagon on one of these other guys that'd be kinda great, I'd love you long time. Maybe I deserve a little credit
worthy of sheepability
for being ahead of things on reinoe town, neh? (Is "neh" a word they use in Ender's Game? I think I remember it being a really cool Orson Scott Card word)

Again, as this is irritating me - WHY?

Drew-Sta · Post Post #844 (isolation #62) » Mon Aug 04, 2014 3:24 pm

In post 843, Beck wrote:Can someone tell me what's in the black box? Also please don't use those out of respect for phone posters.

Maybe I deserve a little credit worthy of sheepability for being ahead of things on reinoe town, neh?

Drew-Sta · Post Post #846 (isolation #63) » Mon Aug 04, 2014 3:57 pm

Who, pops? No, I don't think so at all. If Reinoe gets lynched its all Skrewloose's effort IMHO.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #856 (isolation #64) » Mon Aug 04, 2014 7:32 pm

Given I've asked you quite a few times for legitimate analysis on me, it is entirely hypocritical of you, Goofy, to ask me for analysis on what you've said.

Have you read 764 or 526?

I will do more on your posts when I am out of work.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #857 (isolation #65) » Mon Aug 04, 2014 7:34 pm

I take back this:

Given I've asked you quite a few times for legitimate analysis on me, it is entirely hypocritical of you, Goofy, to ask me for analysis on what you've said.

I was posting, thinking of another thread. My apologies.

I still ask though - have you got a response to what I've said Goofy, in those two posts?

Drew-Sta · Post Post #873 (isolation #66) » Tue Aug 05, 2014 3:57 pm

@ Dessew

Tell me how they are, then.

Goofy posts:

Spoiler: "In post 325 we see Drew trying to convince people to stop using votes to pressure information out of people, very early in day 1, with noone above 4 votes. Basically no more active scum hunting with votes yo"

And cites 325, highlighting:

I think it is important for each player to stick to their strongest read until that point.

The context of the quote was what Cyberbob said in 324:

You guys realise that supporting wagons you agree with and arguing against wagons you disagree with is what town should be doing right

I was simply suggesting that people should stick with their biggest scum read and argue that case rather than switching over for lesser scum reads so early in the day.

Him saying 'Basically no more active scum hunting with votes yo' is inaccurate - I want scum hunting, and I want pressure through the use of applying votes, but simply flip flopping to other targets means no real pressure is ever built on one target.

He is suggesting I am anti-scum hunting - I am not. I want pressure built on players and then released if they are validated as town.

Goofy again posts:

"Here in post 329 We see Drew slip in a defense for Reinoe into a response to a post that did not pertain to Reinoe, seems he may be trying to be more discreet with his defense here"

... and cites 329.

The entire exchange is between Reinoe, SK, Cyberbob and I (320 - 349 roughly) - the post was about the topic of Reinoe and Cyberbob's interaction with him / Reinoe's thoughts on Cyberbob's behaviour.

There is no slip.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #874 (isolation #67) » Tue Aug 05, 2014 4:01 pm

In post 872, RedCoyote wrote:CD's claim and him throwing up his arms seemed a bit fake to me. Look, it's time to end this day, imo. Drew? Bob?

Are you asking myself / Bob to hop on the CoolDog wagon?

Drew-Sta · Post Post #876 (isolation #68) » Tue Aug 05, 2014 5:17 pm

In post 875, Goofyd00d wrote:I didn't mean slip as in a mistake, I mean you kind of attached it onto the end in a post with no other mention of them.

How is that a slip? Seems like you're squirming to get out of this.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #878 (isolation #69) » Tue Aug 05, 2014 5:54 pm

In post 877, Goofyd00d wrote:You slipped it in, as in snuck it in, as in squeaked it by. Its a figure of speech you are missing.

... yes, I slipped in text that everyone can read and is clearly on display and is written the same way as the line before.

Sorry Goofy, you're backpeddling now and claiming something that isn't there. Misrep.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #879 (isolation #70) » Tue Aug 05, 2014 5:56 pm

Not to mention, the ENTIRE exchange up to that point was basically a defence of Reinoe on multiple occasions.

Yes, yes... I slipped in the defence on Reinoe where noone would see it...

Drew-Sta · Post Post #884 (isolation #71) » Tue Aug 05, 2014 6:25 pm

In post 883, reinoe wrote:
In post 256, PokerFace wrote:
Day 1 Vote Count:

Konowa (5) - farside22, popsofctown, Dessew, reinoe, Drew-Sta
SleepyKrew (2) - Goofyd00d, CooLDoG
Drew-Sta (2) - Konowa, RedCoyote
CooLDoG (1) - I Am Innocent
RedCoyote (1) - Cyberbob
Drew-Sta (1) - SleepyKrew

Not voting (0) - No one

with 12 alive its 7 to lynch

Drew-Sta is v/la until 7/28/14
CooLDoG is v/la until 7/29/14

Deadline 8/7/14

(expired on 2014-08-07 20:00:00)

Do you think there were any scum on the Konowa wagon?

He'll say no.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #885 (isolation #72) » Tue Aug 05, 2014 6:26 pm

In post 881, Goofyd00d wrote:
In post 878, Drew-Sta wrote:
In post 877, Goofyd00d wrote:You slipped it in, as in snuck it in, as in squeaked it by. Its a figure of speech you are missing.

... yes, I slipped in text that everyone can read and is clearly on display and is written the same way as the line before.

Sorry Goofy, you're backpeddling now and claiming something that isn't there. Misrep.

Sorry bro, you are trying hard but I doubt you are convincing anyone. You put it in a post where it didn't belong. Others have said its a good point, live with it, own it.

Own what? Who else has said its a good point - pops and Des?

Drew-Sta · Post Post #964 (isolation #73) » Wed Aug 06, 2014 1:32 pm

In post 957, RedCoyote wrote:
Drew 874 wrote:Are you asking myself / Bob to hop on the CoolDog wagon?

Yes. We're at the end of the day and another wagon seemed illogical (case in point, the one on me...).

---

farside 887 wrote:I feel like this is the second time rc is push for end of day. I also thought he didn't like my case originally on CD.

This is my second time complaining about how long this day is taking, yes. We're at the point where it is needlessly long. We've forced 4 claims. What else do you want to do in the remaining ~26 hours?

Also, I never said your original case on CD was bad. CD said that. I didn't bother with it because I wanted reinoe dead. After reinoe claimed, I went back over it and saw that you made a couple of good points. Though, admittedly, it didn't blow me away. reinoe's point against him was the best I've seen so far.

---

pops 893 wrote:That is a startling lack of internal consistency. I don't know if there's enough hours left to lynch RC, tough.
My vote is certainly not parked anywhere better, so we can see if there is.

What lack of consistency? That post was made before reinoe claimed.

pops 893 wrote:People were actually posting a bit productively around that time

No, forcing Cyberbob/Drew to either hammer CD or push for another wagon would've been productive. You and farside threw that opportunity out the window. I will remember this.

---

Cyberbob 896 wrote:Brings to mind the earlier buddying vibes I was getting from him. As far as the call for the day to end, my heart understands just wanting to put this abortion of a day to bed but my head doesn't think that the reasoning against CD remotely warrants such an explicit fast lynch (this sentence is terrible but fuck it I can't be bothered rewriting it, hopefully people can read it).

Fast lynch? We have a day and change left. CD has claimed. No other wagon is gaining momentum. reinoe (our closest thing to being confirmed town on D1) is leading the lynch. How close to the wire do you want to cut it? I'm not opportunistically whipping votes; I'm prudently calling for a close to the day.

Also, in response to the buddying thing, I lumped you and Drew in that post. I could hardly be accused of "buddying" up to Drew.

---

IAI 906 wrote:I for one do not believe RC's claim. Bodyguard is an easy claim to fake for scum.

Of course you don't. You're scum. I also appreciate you running me up to L-1 without announcing it. Hoping for someone to hammer me without a claim or what?

You're only upset because I claimed a protective role before you had a chance to fake it at some point later on in the game under the guise of, "I was fishing for a doctor to throw the scum off!"

IAI 908 wrote:(Which reminds me, RC DID YOU LEAVE A CRUMB ANYWHERE?)

No, I didn't. I didn't anticipate surviving long in this game. I was hoping to keep reinoe alive for one night as well as cast major aspersions onto you going into tomorrow for your blantant fishing.

IAI 910 wrote:Your vote of Cooldog over Drew based on this comment from page 31 does not paint you in a great picture.

The only reason I am not voting Drew is because of reinoe. I've said this twice already. I'm also willing to concede that I'm possibly letting Drew's attitude influence me negatively.

---

Cyberbob 919 wrote:Saying something dumb and wrong just to try and spring some kind of AHA YOU'RE ROLEFISHING trap on someone when they point out that you are wrong is a questionable tactic at best I would have thought

What's ironic is IAI was the one originally rolefishing here. He has since accused both you and me of doing it.

---

pops 929 wrote:I don't think there's time for an IAI lynch though.

IAI is far and away the best lynch today, but I'm not a crazy person that tries to wagon as many people as possible with the hopes of one of them copping to being scum. The best D1 95% of the time is to lynch a non-PR claimed person that a large portion of the game agrees could be scum. Then the next day you analyze what happens overnight along with the wagons of yesterday (especially the lynch wagon). And you repeat that process until the game is over. I don't know where this idea came from that people can't compromise on D1, especially a 35+ page D1, and go at it the next day armed with tons of new information.

---

SK 949 wrote:This reads like setting up an RC mislynch to win the game. I need to double check but I'm pretty sure the numbers line up.

Agreed. Some combination of IAI, pops and the group of Dessew, Drew, CD or farside for me right now. Some of these people just want to have their cake and eat it, too. I still think farside is probably town, but there is something off about her this game and I absolutely hate her connection with IAI right now.

Btw, if I don't see a CD vote by the time I leave tonight, I'm moving to Drew. If I can be frank, I don't really trust this town to act reasonably. And it's not even just about forcing me to claim. I think we're really fragmented here (as indicated by SK/reinoe, Drew/myself, Goofy/Dessew, etc), and some of you may be forgetting the fundamentals of this being a team game. I can expand on this if anyone wants, but suffice it to reiterate that I don't really trust this town to act reasonably.

In post 963, Goofyd00d wrote:I'm still confident on the Drew wagon, just a quick ISO shows that his main defense is to call every little thing misrep. I was questioning myself after Rei's claim, but his attempt to misinterpret what I said about his defense in an irrelevant post followed by the attempt to discredit me when I tried to explain it more clearly just doesn't seem town. Also a quick run through of his posts shows that he leans on emoticons to attempt to drive his points home. Shouldn't need anything extra if your rebuttals were actually strong.

His defenses shouldn't need all the discrediting and emoticons if they were solid. It just doesn't ring right with me.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #965 (isolation #74) » Wed Aug 06, 2014 1:37 pm

Sorry, I did something there and it posted - not sure what happened. A few things to reply to.

In post 963, Goofyd00d wrote:I'm still confident on the Drew wagon, just a quick ISO shows that his main defense is to call every little thing misrep. I was questioning myself after Rei's claim, but his attempt to misinterpret what I said about his defense in an irrelevant post followed by the attempt to discredit me when I tried to explain it more clearly just doesn't seem town. Also a quick run through of his posts shows that he leans on emoticons to attempt to drive his points home. Shouldn't need anything extra if your rebuttals were actually strong.

His defenses shouldn't need all the discrediting and emoticons if they were solid. It just doesn't ring right with me.

You know what the funny thing is? I claim you have misrepresented me, and you do nothing to show me I'm wrong. Which means you can't be bothered following through, or... I'm right.

In post 957, RedCoyote wrote:
Drew 874 wrote:Are you asking myself / Bob to hop on the CoolDog wagon?

Yes. We're at the end of the day and another wagon seemed illogical (case in point, the one on me...).

The one on you wasn't illogical. But that's because I think you're scum

In post 957, RedCoyote wrote:Btw, if I don't see a CD vote by the time I leave tonight, I'm moving to Drew. If I can be frank, I don't really trust this town to act reasonably. And it's not even just about forcing me to claim. I think we're really fragmented here (as indicated by SK/reinoe, Drew/myself, Goofy/Dessew, etc),
and some of you may be forgetting the fundamentals of this being a team game. I can expand on this if anyone wants, but suffice it to reiterate that I don't really trust this town to act reasonably.

On the bolded I agree. The issue is I... don't have the strongest read on CD.

So I'm locked in a problem. On one hand, I want to work with town at this late stage since noone is keen to lynch RC. The other issue is I don't want a mislynch.

I will vote CD on the basis that we need information, and who is on what will give info for the next day.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: CoolDog

Drew-Sta · Post Post #968 (isolation #75) » Wed Aug 06, 2014 1:50 pm

You can effectively scumhunt even without pushing your biggest suspect, for instance if the people around are simply not interested in it (because they've got other cases to discuss.) You vote whom you want to lynch and you want to lynch scum (players you find scummy.) I don't see why one would be obliged to vote their No. 1 scumread.

I think you've hit a stylistic difference - I want people to know who I think is my most scummy person and so keep my vote locked onto them for that effect.

His suggestion that I was anti scumhunting with votes was, to be honest, just wrong.

Regardless, the post you were answering had very little to do with reinoe.

The context of it all was focussed on Reinoe. I stand by my comment although concede it is contextually dependent.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #970 (isolation #76) » Wed Aug 06, 2014 1:53 pm

In post 966, RedCoyote wrote:Drew, why did you not address my claim? No time like the present, my friend.

Claims are cheap and can be lies. Flips are not.

In post 967, Goofyd00d wrote:Actually I explained how it wasn't misrep, here we go again.

Where? On this I will genuinely claim I haven't seen it but accept I could have missed it.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #971 (isolation #77) » Wed Aug 06, 2014 1:53 pm

968 is at Dessew, BTW.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #972 (isolation #78) » Wed Aug 06, 2014 1:54 pm

In post 969, I Am Innocent wrote:
In post 957, RedCoyote wrote:
IAI 906 wrote:I for one do not believe RC's claim. Bodyguard is an easy claim to fake for scum.

Of course you don't. You're scum.
I also appreciate you running me up to L-1
without announcing it. Hoping for someone to hammer me without a claim or what?

Underline is a blatant lie. I would like you to link me to the five votes on you before mine...cause you won't find them.

Yep, agree.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #974 (isolation #79) » Wed Aug 06, 2014 2:04 pm

In post 973, I Am Innocent wrote:
In post 769, RedCoyote wrote:
IAI 689 wrote:RC/pops, what are your thoughts on cooldog and cyberbob? Would you vote either of them as a counter wagon to reinoe?

Absolutely not. I have them both as townreads. Drew is an acceptable counterwagon. I have offered reinoe a chance to join with me in voting him and I stand by that.

You dodged my earlier question. You say on Page 31 that you will "Absolutely not" vote cooldog. You have him as a "townread"...not lean town, but town read.

Then you vote him a few pages later.

What was so condemning that he went from an "Absolutely not" person to vote for, a complete "townread", to the wagon you hopped on?

Fuck it. If I am lynched, I get lynched. I agree with RC that the game is a team game and we have to work together, but he's simply looking to mislynch and I'm not going to be party to it.

UNVOTE: Cooldog
VOTE: RC

Drew-Sta · Post Post #979 (isolation #80) » Wed Aug 06, 2014 2:27 pm

In post 977, Goofyd00d wrote:
In post 967, Goofyd00d wrote:Actually I explained how it wasn't misrep, here we go again.

Where? On this I will genuinely claim I haven't seen it but accept I could have missed it.

Is this real? How could you miss it? You called it "squirming" and "back pedaling."[/quote]

That one?

Then no - you didn't really clear it up. You tried to justify it and failed IMHO.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #980 (isolation #81) » Wed Aug 06, 2014 2:29 pm

In post 976, RedCoyote wrote:
IAI 969 wrote:Underline is a blatant lie. I would like you to link me to the five votes on you before mine...cause you won't find them.

Err, L-2. I miscounted out of paranoia this morning.

Why paranoid? Clearly showing out here.

Lets get the wagon going peeps. Here's our man.

In post 976, RedCoyote wrote:
Drew 974 wrote:Fuck it. If I am lynched, I get lynched. I agree with RC that the game is a team game and we have to work together, but he's simply looking to mislynch and I'm not going to be party to it.

Let's do it then. I'm done with you, Drew. I'm trying very hard to bite my tongue and let reinoe take point today since I think he's town and I think he has had good points against CD, but I can't stand for this shit anymore. You and IAI are constantly trying to smear me with some uber aggressive gambit. You know the funny thing? I actually was ready to just let bygones be bygones and start fresh with you tomorrow after some flips. I wasn't as convinced of you as scum as I was earlier today. But you won't drop it, and trying to lynch an un-cc'd PR is scummy as shit.
I will gladly 1v1 you. I think you actually think this town will back you up, you arrogant Aussie.

UNVOTE: CooLDoG; VOTE: Drew-Sta

Now who's getting angry and calling people names and being mean

ATE and ATF right there people.

Jump on people. I am 100% positive he is scum. 100%.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #981 (isolation #82) » Wed Aug 06, 2014 2:29 pm

Goofy is his partner too, by my thinking.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #986 (isolation #83) » Wed Aug 06, 2014 2:37 pm

In post 984, RedCoyote wrote:You're not an arrogant Aussie?

You're not a hypocrite
?

In post 985, Goofyd00d wrote:
In post 981, Drew-Sta wrote:Goofy is his partner too, by my thinking.

Could this be any more from left field?

Nope. Not the way I'm reading it.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #989 (isolation #84) » Wed Aug 06, 2014 2:40 pm

In post 881, Goofyd00d wrote:
In post 878, Drew-Sta wrote:
In post 877, Goofyd00d wrote:You slipped it in, as in snuck it in, as in squeaked it by. Its a figure of speech you are missing.

... yes, I slipped in text that everyone can read and is clearly on display and is written the same way as the line before.

Sorry Goofy, you're backpeddling now and claiming something that isn't there. Misrep.

Sorry bro, you are trying hard but I doubt you are convincing anyone. You put it in a post where it didn't belong. Others have said its a good point, live with it, own it.

In post 982, Goofyd00d wrote:Then you are incorrect, there was nothing to "clear," you made something from a perfectly clear statement and you are trying to run with it.

In post 983, Goofyd00d wrote:Incorrect about saying I failed

I answered you question. The entire exchange was about Reinoe in most parts. You suggesting that somehow I've 'slipped' something in about Reinoe is ignoring the entire exchange and angling in at something so minutely that it appears to be what you want it to be when only framed in that way. Looked at in context and scope, it is not as you frame it.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #990 (isolation #85) » Wed Aug 06, 2014 2:42 pm

In post 987, farside22 wrote:Drew: you are at l1 and me. Scum pants cooldog who has you listed as scum but self voted, may vote you.

Yep. That may be the case.

UNVOTE: RC
VOTE: Cooldog

If people don't believe me about RC then we have no hope for this game.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #991 (isolation #86) » Wed Aug 06, 2014 2:43 pm

I also don't think CD is scum, FWIW. I'm doing this to prevent Goody and RC from mislynching me as I feel like the flip of CD will show them up more than it will show me.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #994 (isolation #87) » Wed Aug 06, 2014 2:53 pm

In post 992, PokerFace wrote:Are we actually going to have a 1000+ post day 1 in my normal

Sure why not

Drew-Sta · Post Post #995 (isolation #88) » Wed Aug 06, 2014 2:53 pm

Cooldog self voting is interesting. Scum move or exasperated town?

Drew-Sta · Post Post #1002 (isolation #89) » Wed Aug 06, 2014 3:19 pm

In post 996, farside22 wrote:
In post 991, Drew-Sta wrote:I also don't think CD is scum, FWIW. I'm doing this to prevent Goody and RC from mislynching me as I feel like the flip of CD will show them up more than it will show me.

I'm not sure how that is? If you think cd is town and he flips town, how does that help you?

It shows the RC flip for what it is - complete rubbish. That RC has flipped back onto me distances himself also from Cooldog. If I'm right, and I believe I am, they don't want to both be on the same lynch.

In post 998, RedCoyote wrote:
In post 992, PokerFace wrote:Are we actually going to have a 1000+ post day 1 in my normal

Even the mod is shaking his head at how crappy this town is...

Drew pushed his hand too far. I'm done with him. He's either scum with IAI or a completely liability as town. I have no interest in trying to work with him any longer.

Keep going champ. Love your work.

In post 997, farside22 wrote:
In post 995, Drew-Sta wrote:Cooldog self voting is interesting. Scum move or exasperated town?

Considering I pointed out the majority of the questions I asked that he called useless, but is me trying to get reads and his reaction is to self vote while calling people scum and if he believed you were scum he could vote and push that....I'm not seeing town reasoning.

You could ask someone not bias, but it would probably be called a pointless question.

He looks like he's given up. He also looks like he wasn't paying attention either.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #1003 (isolation #90) » Wed Aug 06, 2014 3:19 pm

In post 1001, I Am Innocent wrote:RC still avoiding my question for the record

Of course he is. He's caught.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #1006 (isolation #91) » Wed Aug 06, 2014 5:02 pm

Drew-Sta · Post Post #1008 (isolation #92) » Wed Aug 06, 2014 5:12 pm

Silly Victard.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #1010 (isolation #93) » Wed Aug 06, 2014 5:17 pm

touche'.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #1012 (isolation #94) » Wed Aug 06, 2014 5:29 pm

I suspected you were. The humour needed to be recognised though.

Care to actually form a post by post analysis on me for the sake of justifying your vote? You haven't, as far as your ISO is concerned.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #1014 (isolation #95) » Wed Aug 06, 2014 5:32 pm

Also, 418:

b) My other scum reads are RC and Goofy. Minor suspicion of a bunch more people for not posting enough for my liking, though I understand there are a number of V/LAs

In post 704, farside22 wrote:
Cyberbob: Who besides renioe do you have a scum read on?

Goofy.

I've made a number of cases against RC, but you've never really jumped on and stayed. I've also tried to form rebuttal to Goofy. You realise we hold the same reads, right?

Drew-Sta · Post Post #1015 (isolation #96) » Wed Aug 06, 2014 5:33 pm

In post 1013, Cyberbob wrote:Not particularly, no.

Care to give me anything on why? I can't see any valid reason in your ISO for your vote on me.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #1020 (isolation #97) » Wed Aug 06, 2014 5:45 pm

In post 1016, Cyberbob wrote:In no small part due to the fact that going through all your posts would take longer than we have left in the day, but also because I feel like I've already justified my vote on you pretty well. This is a strange line of defence.

Also please don't try and tell me we have the same read on RC when we do not.

Re RC, I mean we both read him as scum.

Re your vote: 901 is your vote, and your reason in 896 was this:

I would have been okay with the Drew wagon as well because quite frankly his defence of reinoe was terrible logically speaking - assuming that reinoe is in fact town it kind of seems like scum acting with foreknowledge of his alignment. That kind of case is difficult to follow through to a lynch on Day 1 though with the total lack of flip information.

So... defending someone is scummy?

In post 1018, SleepyKrew wrote:
In post 976, RedCoyote wrote:I say again (third time), this was before reinoe's claim. Do you not understand the significance of me voting a player that has claimed tracker? Did you expect me to keep voting him?

This doesn't explain voting for someone you said you absolutely wouldn't vote, instead of a different scumread.

Yep. He won't answer. He's hoping someone flips to me or we go to no lynch.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #1028 (isolation #98) » Wed Aug 06, 2014 6:19 pm

In post 1026, SleepyKrew wrote:Oh I'm probably too biased to judge whether people defended reinoe for good or bad reasons.
Hmmmmmm
I think a Drew flip might be more valuable, information-wise. But I'll sleep on it.

Its not. Its really, really not.

In post 1023, Cyberbob wrote:Imagine quoting a post saying that you did a certain thing for terrible reasons and using terrible logic and rebutting it with "ARE YOU SAYING THAT ANY TIME SOMEONE DOES THAT THING ITS SCUMMY"

In post 1027, SleepyKrew wrote:Though Drew, he's not saying you're scummy for defending him. He's saying you're scummy because you didn't have any logical reasons to defend him.

If Skrew is correct, Bob, then my logical reason for defending him is I don't think he's mafia and I think he was being characterised as scum as he's an easy mislynch. I should know - I have seen him in action before.

Skrew, for the love of all things - please, please PLEASE see through this case on me. I am not scum. I am so, so, so not scum. And I cannot emphasise that enough. Lynching me gets nowhere - everyone on my train goes 'Oh, he acted scummy - dumb lynch but whatevs'. I am absolutely positive that not lynching me will make it far harder for those on the CD train (me included, I realise) to justify their choice.

Either that or we lynch RC. But just not me.

Drew-Sta · Post Post #1037 (isolation #99) » Wed Aug 06, 2014 8:01 pm

In post 1029, SleepyKrew wrote:Drew have you claimed? Idr
Not lynching you will make it harder to justify a CD lynch?

Haven't claimed.

Those lynching CD will have a harder time defending their decision to do so than they will mislynching me.

Drew-Sta · Wed Aug 06, 2014 8:39 pm

In post 1038, Cyberbob wrote:
In post 1037, Drew-Sta wrote:Those lynching CD will have a harder time defending their decision to do so than they will mislynching me.

Are you really trying to twist the fact that there are better reasons for lynching you than CD into some kind of a defence? Seriously?

No, I'm saying we learn more with CD's lynch than we do with mine.

Drew-Sta · Wed Aug 06, 2014 8:59 pm

/sigh

Whatever. I am sick if arguing. Lynch me and get it over with. Try to remember what I said in D2

Drew-Sta · Wed Aug 06, 2014 9:31 pm

I'm going to enjoy watching the end of this game. People should learn to listen, and not be swayed by honey tongues.

UNVOTE: CD
VOTE: RC

Drew-Sta · Wed Aug 06, 2014 9:32 pm

In post 1045, Cyberbob wrote:
In post 991, Drew-Sta wrote:I also don't think CD is scum, FWIW. I'm doing this to prevent Goody and RC from mislynching me as I feel like the flip of CD will show them up more than it will show me.

Everyone look at this post.

As opposed to RC who didn't read CD as scum but voted anyway

Double standard much?

Drew-Sta · Thu Aug 07, 2014 1:10 am

In post 1071, Cyberbob wrote:Avoiding a NL is the only legitimate reason I can think of offhand to vote for a town read. Too bad that isn't what Drew is doing!

If people genuinely don't go back and reread the opinions and interactions with other players that dead people have had then the state of mafia is pretty fucked. I mean, what else do is there to do with flip information? There are all sorts of ways you can find scum by going back and looking at their attitudes towards wagons that ended up being on townies. The opinions of a dead townie might not necessarily be
correct
but they are literally the only opinions you can say with certainty that were formed in good faith.

I switch to avoid a NL and you call me scum. I switch to my main scum read, as you argue I should, and I'm scum / neg town.

I can't win in your equation. Every option has me as scum. Do you see the craziness of that?

Drew-Sta · Thu Aug 07, 2014 1:24 am

In post 965, Drew-Sta wrote:Sorry, I did something there and it posted - not sure what happened. A few things to reply to.

In post 963, Goofyd00d wrote:I'm still confident on the Drew wagon, just a quick ISO shows that his main defense is to call every little thing misrep. I was questioning myself after Rei's claim, but his attempt to misinterpret what I said about his defense in an irrelevant post followed by the attempt to discredit me when I tried to explain it more clearly just doesn't seem town. Also a quick run through of his posts shows that he leans on emoticons to attempt to drive his points home. Shouldn't need anything extra if your rebuttals were actually strong.

His defenses shouldn't need all the discrediting and emoticons if they were solid. It just doesn't ring right with me.

You know what the funny thing is? I claim you have misrepresented me, and you do nothing to show me I'm wrong. Which means you can't be bothered following through, or... I'm right.

In post 957, RedCoyote wrote:
Drew 874 wrote:Are you asking myself / Bob to hop on the CoolDog wagon?

Yes. We're at the end of the day and another wagon seemed illogical (case in point, the one on me...).

The one on you wasn't illogical. But that's because I think you're scum

In post 957, RedCoyote wrote:Btw, if I don't see a CD vote by the time I leave tonight, I'm moving to Drew. If I can be frank, I don't really trust this town to act reasonably. And it's not even just about forcing me to claim. I think we're really fragmented here (as indicated by SK/reinoe, Drew/myself, Goofy/Dessew, etc),
and some of you may be forgetting the fundamentals of this being a team game. I can expand on this if anyone wants, but suffice it to reiterate that I don't really trust this town to act reasonably.

On the bolded I agree. The issue is I... don't have the strongest read on CD.

So I'm locked in a problem. On one hand, I want to work with town at this late stage since noone is keen to lynch RC. The other issue is I don't want a mislynch.

I will vote CD on the basis that we need information, and who is on what will give info for the next day.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: CoolDog

Drew-Sta · Thu Aug 07, 2014 1:25 am

In post 1076, farside22 wrote:
In post 1074, Drew-Sta wrote:
In post 1071, Cyberbob wrote:Avoiding a NL is the only legitimate reason I can think of offhand to vote for a town read. Too bad that isn't what Drew is doing!

If people genuinely don't go back and reread the opinions and interactions with other players that dead people have had then the state of mafia is pretty fucked. I mean, what else do is there to do with flip information? There are all sorts of ways you can find scum by going back and looking at their attitudes towards wagons that ended up being on townies. The opinions of a dead townie might not necessarily be
correct
but they are literally the only opinions you can say with certainty that were formed in good faith.

I switch to avoid a NL and you call me scum. I switch to my main scum read, as you argue I should, and I'm scum / neg town.

I can't win in your equation. Every option has me as scum. Do you see the craziness of that?

Bob's point is you didn't say you were voting cool for deadline purposes. You were just voting him and saying he was a town read.

Ready last paragraph and what I bolded from RC. My intent was the change to work with town on the belief it is better to have a lynch than a no lynch.

Drew-Sta · Thu Aug 07, 2014 9:50 am

I am town vig.

Drew-Sta · Thu Aug 07, 2014 9:58 am

If we have a doctor and I manage to survive, I'd really love to be your target

Drew-Sta · Thu Aug 07, 2014 10:00 am

Oh wait, too late. Skrew hammered.

All shit aside, RC, Goofy are my focus. Cyberbob is also another.

Enjoy the game guys

Its been fun.

Drew-Sta · Thu Aug 07, 2014 10:01 am

Also, RC's 'He's a liability even if he's town' comment - if scum, no drama's. If you do turn out town, I expect a nice apology (but you're scum

)

Drew-Sta · Thu Aug 07, 2014 10:02 am

In post 1137, reinoe wrote:Sorry, Drew: you're lynched. Unless there's a governor out there...

Farewell sweet prince! I die knowing we had fun

Drew-Sta · Thu Aug 07, 2014 10:20 am

In post 1143, reinoe wrote:
In post 1124, PokerFace wrote:
Day 1 Vote Count:

Drew-Sta (6) - Dessew,
Goofyd00d, Cyberbob,
popsofctown,
RedCoyote, CooLDoG

CooLDoG (4) - reinoe, Beck, farside22, I Am Innocent
RedCoyote (1) - Drew-Sta

Not voting (1) -
SleepyKrew

with 12 alive its 7 to lynch

How odd that those five players who were on my wagon also find themselves on the Drew wagon. If Drew flips town, I wouldn't be surprised if all three scum are in there.

I seriously doubt its Reinoe. I also don't think its CD either but could be wrong. Of the other three - totally agree. Lynch them all and find out, starting with RC. I am almost 100% convinced his claim is utter bullshit.

Drew-Sta · Thu Aug 07, 2014 10:21 am

Sorry, Reinoe = Skrew

Drew-Sta · Thu Aug 07, 2014 11:17 am

In post 1131, SleepyKrew wrote:aaaaaaaaaah
I wish I could go back and reread things with a clear head but that just isn't going to happen before deadline.
VOTE: Drew
He's had plenty of time to claim. I don't get why farside wanted to give him more time. I think the chances of us not lynching were higher than the chances of CD getting lynched.
Goddamn this RC stuff is messing with my head. He's been avoiding the main point, which is he voted townreadCD instead of scumreadDrew. I think? idk anymore

You realise both bob and I are on the opposite side of the world? I'd say farside realised that and wanted to give me til I at least woke up.

Drew-Sta · Tue Sep 16, 2014 3:07 pm

So I picked Konowa and RC, and you guys managed to lynch me D1

Well played mafia - you did well.

Drew-Sta · Tue Sep 16, 2014 3:25 pm

Well played scum

I had 2 of you on D1, and ended up getting lynched!

Oh well.

Drew-Sta · Tue Sep 16, 2014 3:47 pm

I swear I thought it didn't post - my browser is fucked

Drew-Sta · Tue Sep 16, 2014 3:48 pm

In post 2352, Cyberbob wrote:I really wish I'd followed through with my initial feelings about RC way back when I was voting him for buddying me (and I think something else?) That's my chief regret from this game I suppose, I don't regret pushing IAI/reinoe/Drew at all.

So you don't regret mislynching / attempting to mislynch two town folk?

We need to play more games together!

Drew-Sta · Tue Sep 16, 2014 3:58 pm

And you too Reinoe. You and I as a scum team would be awesome!

Drew-Sta · Tue Sep 16, 2014 5:07 pm

In post 2379, Cyberbob wrote:At least it isn't as town, I guess it is useful for scum. I certainly didn't play this one very well in terms of scumhunting (I'm horribly out of practice, but I knew I would be and the only way to improve is by playing games) but I felt like you guys were being obnoxious to the point of being anti-town even if your reads turned out to be better.

You played the player, not the game then. But that's my opinion.

Scum have no reason to play like I played, nor Reinoe for that matter. It attracts too much attention.

Drew-Sta · Tue Sep 16, 2014 7:38 pm

Yeah, fair call re the playstyle.

The tard bit is a tad unfair.