MINI 1721 — ✌ — GAME OVER

[Davsto]

VOTE: VeeGee

For not confirming yet.

[Davsto]

VOTE: Metal Sonic because

BEES!

I don't beelieve it.

[Davsto]

marquis wouldnt be so cruel to put us on different teams ...

there we go fro99er and sonic are scum game solved gg guys i win

[Davsto]

[Davsto]

VOTE: Metal Sonic

Town has no reason to claim scum.

Please tell me this isn't a serious vote.

[Davsto]

I'm just gonna wait for an answer to my question.

Hey, I'm polite.

(the question was "HEY LAYLA, WAS THAT A SERIOUS VOTE?" if you hadn't gathered.)

[Davsto]

My vote is 100% serious.

hey, how you Bin?

haha

Anyway, Layla confirmed that they were serious with that vote so I would have voted them had 5 more pages not happened since then

why are you guys so active.

I sorta skimread it but it ended with everyone townreading each other basically (that's what I saw); the amount of people doing this makes it mainly town, but I haven't seen any complaints about it, which makes me think that there's a (probably no more than singular, if any) scum in it. Usually there's at least one person (often scum) who's gone "woah why are you townreading people so early" to cast doubt on the town bloc because they're scared of townies allying with each other and this hasn't happened so there's a slight chance there may be scum on there.

I am fully aware that by saying this that makes me said town bloc detractor but I don't really care, the point was in my head so I might as well get it out there.

Looking at VeeGee's (lack of) posts, I'm happy with my RVS becoming semi-serious.

[Davsto]

ok I'm about to do something so not bins the world is going to shrivel in fear

I'm already shriveling.

[Davsto]

Me after seeing that post wall:



Shriveling so much D:

[Davsto]

I also didn't really pay attention to Layla's table of text before because I was on my tablet so half the lines didn't show so I didn't realise I was asked a question.

I am no longer scumreading you after the 5 pages or so that happened because the only thing I was scumreading you for was voting someone for making a joke and I feel your play since then has largely offset that.

[Davsto]

Try "this guy is scum cuz RC said so."

that has a way higher hit rate than "this guy is scum cuz Ricastle said so"

How's this for a hit rate?

A Simple Plan is scum cuz I said so.
Bins is scum cuz I said so.
Davsto is scum cuz I said so.
Draynth is scum cuz I said so.
Fro99er is scum cuz I said so.
Layla is scum cuz I said so.
Luna Fox is scum cuz I said so.
Metal Sonic is scum cuz I said so.
Not_Mafia is scum cuz I said so.
RadiantCowbells is scum cuz I said so.
VeeGee is scum cuz I said so.

I'm starting to get a feeling that you've missed one of the scum there.

[Davsto]

There's a difference between arguing hypotheticals and just plain stupidity.

What you are doing falls into the latter.

Please stop, Ricastle.

[Davsto]

Alright, I like that suggestion.

VOTE: Ricastle

How does that work?

[Davsto]

What if there was an infinite shot multiple action per night reviver that reflexively self targeted and thus it was impossible to kill people?

You kill the mod, obviously.

[Davsto]

Eh, not bad. You're going to need some reasons though.

Eh, I have none, just wanted to get in a snarky response.

UNVOTE:

[Davsto]

Looking at VeeGee's (lack of) posts, I'm happy with my RVS becoming semi-serious.

v
VeeGee doesn't post.
Unvotes to make a snark post at Ricastle then never revotes?
Forgot about his own read?

Vote: Davsto

Okay so you're scumreading me because I forgot about a vote on someone who hasn't posted in yonks? And that's all you have to go on? Ew.

VOTE: VeeGee thanks for the reminder though.

[Davsto]

Now are you going to tell me why did you forget you had a scumread?

Because when someone has made a single post a day and a half ago and you're in a fair few other games it can be hard to keep track of.

[Davsto]

A little off on Ricastle. It's early game so I don't have anything strong though.

[Davsto]

Annie

are you okay?

[Davsto]

What did he flip?

coins

[Davsto]

That is the fastest replacement I've ever seen. Woo.

[Davsto]

Alright, so I've been thinking this through.

If everyone could have one flip right now what would it be?

backflip

[Davsto]

but in all seriousness VeeGee because it's nice to get lurkers out of the way early so they don't screw over lylo.

[Davsto]

Layla: very slight scum lean, I'm not really liking their push on the MS wagon, but beyond that, the play has been pretty good.
Not_Mafia: slight scum lean Has sort of not done anything at all. the reason this is scummier than veegee is because veegee made less posts so it looks more like straight up flaking.
VOTE: LaylaVOTE:

Comparing these two reads briefly, why did you vote Layla over Not_Mafia?

[Davsto]

2. Scum loves joking for towncred because it appeals to town in positive way and it's one of the easiest way to get townread. How many games have you played?

Okay im a stop you right here.

My latest game is Mystery Mansion Mafia, it's finished now so I can talk about it.

In the game, the two people who joked about being "confirmed scum" and "confirmed town" were Town, and the person who really seriously voted on that? Scum.

I'm of the belief that literally anything that is a joke is a joke and is null.

[Davsto]

Yimmy, you still haven't explained why in 425 you sell Not_Mafia as being the scummiest but vote Layla. Please do.

[Davsto]

Why did you keep pushing for metal sonics lynch?
I sort of sorted them in order, but when I moved that down from null, I put it below Layla cause that was easier

...what? This makes no sense and I'm pretty sure it isn't actually an answer.

My question is why Not_Mafia is "A slight scumlean" while Layla is a "very slight scumlean" but the latter is who you vote for?

[Davsto]

Oops, sorry.

We going for Not_Mafia because..?

I'm willing because VeeGee (who I'm still not liking) went for a "nulltown" read on them which is.... yeh, but I'm unsure if it's okay to put at L-1 yet. Is it a good idea to get this first lynch out of the way so that we can concentrate on the second?

[Davsto]

okay so I read through N_M's ISO and there's basically nothing there and what's there is crap.

VOTE: Not_Mafia

This is L-1, right? Claim.

[Davsto]

why didn't he iso me before when he asked why I was the leading wagon

because it was 7:40 AM and I needed to get ready for school.

[Davsto]

I needed to get ready for school.

My mental image of Davsto has been destroyed :< (I guess i could have checked his profile)

Do I want to know your mental image of me?

[Davsto]

Me? Old? Guess I'm gonna have to prove I'm immature.

Bums.

*cue laughter*

[Davsto]

And that is why looking at the "Pronoun" bit is a clever idea

But 99% of the time my mental image of a player is their avatar, if it's human. Even if it's ridiculous. Slandaar is one I note clearly as having a mental image of exactly his avatar, and even with alts I tend to see their different alts as being them.

I'm a goddamn fool.

[Davsto]

Not_Mafia, since you're claiming town, have you got some sort of final reads list to give and help us with?

[Davsto]

Bella before you die It's been fun! <3

Um, "before she dies"?

[Davsto]

You say it like it's happening soon.

This game has two lynches per game day and we still have ~8 days left.

[Davsto]

Yeh, I figured.

Also, tiny bit of setup spec, there's probably gonna be a role power balance in favour of Scum due to double lynch, a mechanic which largely favours town, in my opinion.

[Davsto]

Aww man, I went to sleep literally just before the vig shot went to me (around 11:35 last night, Davsto-shot was at 11:45). I was looking forwards to doing a "last will and testament" sorta thing.

Anyway, I'll give an ISO of VeeGee when I get back from school in ~12 hours, see what I get.

[Davsto]

Hoooommeeeee

I'll ISO VeeGee in a couple of hours when I have enough free time to concentrate without panicking so I can actually pay attention.

Can still post, though.

[Davsto]

'kay so I read through the VeeGee ISO (kinda skimmy but whatever) and I was expecting some sort of series of obvious scumposts but honestly I don't see it.

Can someone explain?

[Davsto]

I also note that you're no match for the supreme scumhunting of Radiant C. Owbellheimer, the supreme hunter of the allied townforces in Mafiaville.

You mean the same person that just got a VT lynched?

Okay so now I'm starting to see where everyone's coming from with VeeGee.

[Davsto]

I don't townread Ricastle.

Dav is scum and is the only thing I'm voting today.

Oh shit RC has gone into tunnel mode. Might want to make a better choice for who to do it on, though. Like, you know, scum?

[Davsto]

I don't townread Ricastle.

Dav is scum and is the only thing I'm voting today.

Oh shit RC has gone into tunnel mode. Might want to make a better choice for who to do it on, though. Like, you know, scum?

Why the taunting?

Who is scum and why? You're not really helping town with that post, you know.

Because I know how RC tunnels and fighting it is frankly not worth it.

Who is scum?

Well maybe VeeGee, feeling a bit off on Layla.

PEdit: oh jesus christ add Luna to that list for that godawful vote

[Davsto]

UNVOTE:

Setting up for an opportunistic vote on a dueling wagon, are you?

[Davsto]

VOTE: Davsto

Luna is town

Wow, it sounds like different people can't have different opinions.

[Davsto]

I don't townread Ricastle.

Dav is scum and is the only thing I'm voting today.

Oh shit RC has gone into tunnel mode. Might want to make a better choice for who to do it on, though. Like, you know, scum?

12/10 Reaction
VOTE: Davsto

but like

this isn't a reason

this is just saying "oh you did a reaction to a post VOTE ON YOU because you're the biggest wagon atm, i don't want to stay on veegee any more because the popularity of that side of the potential 1v1 has died down"

[Davsto]

Go look at every Davsto vote in this game. Not a single one had sound reasoning at the time of the vote

Look at all the votes on me.

Not a single one had sound reasoning at the time of the vote.

[Davsto]

Go look at every Davsto vote in this game. Not a single one had sound reasoning at the time of the vote

Look at all the votes on me.

Not a single one had sound reasoning at the time of the vote.

We're all scum!

From your logic, yes.

If someone not explaining their vote = them being scum, then why fixate on me over all of the others who have done so?

[Davsto]

Wow, now basic logical reasoning is a scumtell? Man, you really are tunneling.

[Davsto]

Well, maybe, as a townie I have problems with seeing people's inconsistency.

Scum is sitting at the sidelines right now rubbing their hands in glee, because you're doing all their work for them in getting me lynched.


PEdit: I said something that made sense and you said "scumtell". How is that not leaning on tunneling?

[Davsto]

I see you saying "it's a common scumtell!"

I'd like to see you explain why.

[Davsto]

Not a single one had sound reasoning at the time of the vote.

Says the guy who just essentially OMGUS FoS'd me, and i had reasoning, it was in the same post as my vote.

You say "bad reaction". That's not a reason. A reason would be explaining

why

it was a bad reaction. Don't be accusing me of not giving reasons.

[Davsto]

Scum is sitting at the sidelines right now rubbing their hands in glee, because you're doing all their work for them in getting me lynched.

And frankly, if that really is the case that's fine. Because that means Layla is scum.

Layla is leaning towards scum. That NM hammer and - I know this is reaching back - that voting on someone for the joke scumclaim was naff.

Seriously, I hate it when people seriously vote on people for making a joke. Leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

[Davsto]

I see you saying "it's a common scumtell!"

I'd like to see you explain why.

I already explained why.

It's a common scumtell because you, as scum, have to resist yourself from saying it?

[Davsto]

Not a single one had sound reasoning at the time of the vote.

Says the guy who just essentially OMGUS FoS'd me, and i had reasoning, it was in the same post as my vote.

You say "bad reaction". That's not a reason. A reason would be explaining

why

it was a bad reaction.

Don't be accusing me of not giving reasons.

oh jesus christ add Luna to that list for that godawful vote

Lol.

Okay, thanks for pointing that out.

I dislike that vote since it was jumping from the one biggest wagon (VeeGee) to the other (me), with little reasoning.

Now, since I actually gave reasoning when it was pointed out instead of just avoiding the question, explain why you voted me.

[Davsto]

Would ya look at all those posts that came while I was making my post
UNVOTE: RadiantCowbells
Since I'm unsure of how many votes there are I'm just go na say
INTENT TO VOTE/HAMMER

what in the waht what what what wat what?

[Davsto]

UNVOTE:

Setting up for an opportunistic vote on a dueling wagon, are you?

No, I'm unvoting because RC admitted that they didn't actually think I was scum.

So... you were voting them because they scumread you and only because of that?

[Davsto]

I started making the post like 769 and for some dumb reason I didn't get the ninja warning
And I'm really dumb and suck at specifying that the posts made inbetween made me want to lynch Davsto

But RC is like a bajillion miles away and there are no votes on him apart from yours so what

[Davsto]

Now, since I actually gave reasoning when it was pointed out instead of just avoiding the question, explain why you voted me.

I already did

I've looked through your ISO and seen no reason other than "I think it was a scummy reaction".

[Davsto]

That's not even slightly accurate. My response was merely a sarcatic comment that RC is tunneling. In what way is it deflecting?

[Davsto]

Might want to make a better choice for who to do it on, though.

^
This part.

That's just my typical sarcasm.

[Davsto]

I don't townread Ricastle.

Dav is scum and is the only thing I'm voting today.

Did you even ever give a reason?
Oh shit RC has gone into tunnel mode. Might want to make a better choice for who to do it on, though. Like, you know, scum?

I mean, if you don't defend nobody has any reason to not jump on your wagon

This post he quoted.... isn't the one I made.

I don't townread Ricastle.

Dav is scum and is the only thing I'm voting today.

Oh shit RC has gone into tunnel mode. Might want to make a better choice for who to do it on, though. Like, you know, scum?

This is the post I made.

Where has the "Did you even ever give a reason" come from? Can't find it in my ISO. Not even sure what to make of it, it just stuck out to me as I read.

[Davsto]

Yeh, can't find that phrase in anyone's ISO. I'm just really confused D:

[Davsto]

All this entire line is unfakeable and provides nothing new to the table, if you were scum you wouldn't say "i'm not town" nor "i'm scum", and obviously regardless of alignment you wouldn't want to be tunneled, but instead of providing reasons for not be tunneled you leave it at that, like we're supposed to take your word at face value, that's why you're deflecting instead of telling ppl "plz dont tunnel me i town" or smth.

Have you ever seen RC tunnel?

In one game, he fakeclaimed a role to get someone lynched who turned out to be town, and didn't even touch on anyone for the entire day. Fighting RC's tunnel is not worth the effort.

[Davsto]

Quoting bbcode mistakes. That was my response to radiantcowbells post

Right, thanks for the clarification~

[Davsto]

But you still wouldn't want people jumping on your wagon. That's half the reasoj people defend, so you don't get more people on your wagon

You say this like I haven't been defending myself.

[Davsto]

Hopefully Simple will get replaced, he isn't really making any posts. Making it really hard to read him.

[Davsto]

Grave stupidity

Now that's just mean. :c

[Davsto]

Hey Dave! We were just... Talking about you! Where'd you come from!

I'm always here.

always

[Davsto]

Can all the people not on the Davsto wagon say why they're opposed to it?

Because it's on Town, obviously.

[Davsto]

Plot twist!
VOTE: Layla

I'm intrigued.

Reasons, please?

[Davsto]

Plot twist!
VOTE: Layla

I'm intrigued.

Reasons, please?

I think Giffy is scum.

...

...

you

know

what I mean.

An actual

reason

for Giffy being scum.

Man, do people not understand how to explain things with reasoning?

[Davsto]

Fair enough.

Luna is basically town for trying to go for a counterwagon to the main wagon (which I know is on town and, at this rate, you will know soon), and actually realising she did wrong and correcting her vote rather than standing by it and then suddenly backpedaling when her inconsistency is pointed out.

[Davsto]

Neat L-1 declaration there.

Since my hammer is inevitable since you're all seeming to be too close-minded to go for anyone else, I'm gonna quickly collaborate a final reads list.

Please wait for that before hammering, thanks.

[Davsto]

Ankamius - Meh, gonna go scumlean on this one. Unvotes VeeGee, says I'm "probably scum" but doesn't actually vote. Sounds like scum pushing for a lynch but, when the VCA comes, being able to look back and go "well I didn't lynch Davsto".
Bellaphant - What do you think?
Bins - Townlean.
Yimmy - Null.
Fro99er - Not a damn clue.
Layla - Mehhhh, gonna go for a slight gut scumread.
Luna Fox - So townie it hurts
Metal Sonic - scumlean. Going for a vanity wagon by voting VeeGee, but not actually pushing it. Seems like a way to go "well I'm town because I voted against the wagon on town".
RC - Meh, something seems off here, but not sure if it's in a scummy way. Null.
Ricastle - Says a lot, but a lot of what is said is saying oddly little. Scumlean, very very slight.
VeeGee - Scumlean. 100% just sitting there and letting the wagon on me grow.

PEdit - didn't mean the comment in a scummy way, it's just irritating.

[Davsto]

I'll claim when someone states intent. Rather not get it out prematurely.

[Davsto]

Davsto why haven't you pushed any of your scumreads hard?

Because I'm pretty sure I'm at the point here where making a push will make people just ignore it and stuff.

If I had to vote someone, it'd probably be... Metal Sonic.

[Davsto]

Vanilla Townie.

Bang Bang Anka's silver hammer came down, upon my head,
Clang Clang Anka's silver hammer made sure that I was dead.

[Davsto]

Kay so Metal Sonic is who'd I thought I'd vote for and then I remember that Ank replaced ASP and he bugged me too.

OH COME ON! I was literally posting AS YOU SENT THE F***ING PROD

God FML...

I'll be on some other time. I'm really [censored] frustrated about that [censored] prod.

Okay this, this reads as the fakest thing I've ever seen. It doesn't look like town annoyed that they got prodded, it feels like Scum!Plan realised he was lurking, hoped to make a post before prodding deadline before it was drawn attention to him lurking, and then faking annoyance afterwards. This doesn't read even slightly as real.

UNVOTE: VeeGee

I concur that Davsto is likely scum. I'll abstain from voting for the moment so I don't get herpaderp behind tomorrow.

So I'm likely scum and he was abstaining from voting so he isn't behind, but is fine with hammering while he's behind?

UNVOTE: VeeGee

I concur that Davsto is likely scum. I'll abstain from voting for the moment so I don't get herpaderp behind tomorrow.

Hold up

GIF is in this game?

That changes everything. He's number one priority to read now.

GIF is town.

Back to our scheduled whatever else we were doing before this.

This just feels off.

What else is happening? My head's not in the game enough to be comfortable ending the day yet.

Intent, Davsto.

Again, this feels like quite a change in heart for a few hours.

PEdit - the Metal Sonic thing is more speculation than anything. I kinda want to vote him but now I've had a look at ASP/Ank's ISO I'm changing my mind.

VOTE: Ankamius

[Davsto]

inb4 getting scumread for changing my mind.

[Davsto]

Can all the people not on the Davsto wagon say why they're opposed to it?

@Ricastle why are you pointing out the paranoia?
Because it's on Town, obviously.

Nobody bas any reason to think as such.

Please be careful where you put stuff in quotes. That @Ricastle question looks like it's something I've said when it wasn't, it both confuses people and makes it hard for the recipient of the question to notice it.

[Davsto]

Davsto + Fro99er scumteam is what I'm going to work with right now. Those associations are horrendous and the fact that Fro99er immediately jumped on me for being willing to end the day before 'fully catching up' when I gave no indication whatsoever that I was waiting to fully catch up while Davsto immediately ran with it to fake a scumread on me is telling.

VOTE: Davsto

You might want to come up with some reads that aren't associatives based on the (incorrect) presumption that I am scum, otherwise you're gonna have a tough time finding scum.

[Davsto]

Beautiful final posts

Well played scum! I'd say well played town too but frankly that would be a lie.

[Davsto]

Yeh, RC gamethrew at the end there on lylo.

[Davsto]

Statements like that are why people get blacklisted. Don't be a sore loser. You're trying to act like you're the bigger person but really you just come off as bitter.

[Davsto]

That was @RC, by the way.

[Davsto]

I think you're forgetting how much effort was made, specifically by Ank and Gorkington, to deliberately antagonize me over my Luna scumread.

Two players thought your scumread was wrong and were suspicious of you for it.

That's literally part of the game.

You losing the game for your entire goddamn team because of it isn't "cool", it doesn't make you "right", or the "better person", it makes you a pain to play with. I'm not sure if I want to play with you again because I am worried about playing with a player that will lose the game for the entire team because they threw a tantrum.

[Davsto]

I mean, it wasn't even like you had a fancy case with strong reasoning, I see a single post with actual reasons and the rest are "luna is scum because luna is scum". Getting annoyed at people for not taking your word as gospel when you haven't provided anything other than a line of basic reasoning would be silly even if you were an Innocent Child or something. Expecting people to do it when they don't know your alignment is pathetic.

However, getting annoyed about it is one thing. That's fair enough. It can be frustrating. I know the feeling - see my pushes on Titus and Vyse in Legends of the Hidden Temple II, which were ignored. But actively losing the game because of it is just bad. It's not your job to "punish town for playing bad", it's your job to win, gdi.

What you do (or at least I would do) in that situation is keep pushing Luna. Provide reasoning. Go into the next day going "right, now I've proved myself right twice, maybe listen to me?" Maybe even look for any of the other two scum and find reasons for them! Don't just park your vote on a player at the start of lylo, with barely any discussion, and let the game lose itself.

[Davsto]

She was overly agreeable with my scum reads and I could see people maneuvering around to indirectly start pushing me because of my push on her.

Both of these things make me want to lynch someone, but considering that all of the people maneuvering around it besides Bins were town it's not exactly going to sway you, was it?

That's how I play, Akn. Very few of the tells I use are ones that I can just throw down in a post and explain to people and have them believe they're alignment indicative at all.

For example,

Hmm going through your ISO, that makes sense, ok

Unvote

was tantamount to a scumclaim in my eyes, but I'm not expecting anyone to see why I'd scumread that. Am I correct?

Thing is, though, if you say stuff like this people are, quite simply, more likely to follow you.

Someone who has provided one line of reasoning for a player and is otherwise just voting them and going "they're scum they're scum".
Someone who has provided several reasons for someone being scum, all fairly accurate and perceptive.

I know which one I'd sheep and agree after discussion, and I know which I'd shut down as being tunnely and inaccurate and potentially scummy until they gave more reasons.

[Davsto]

Thing is, i already knew RC wasnt ever gonna be sheeped onto me because he never explained his scumread, so i never felt threatened by him.

Thank you Luna, for putting what I was trying to say in several posts into a single post that still conveys more.

[Davsto]

Oh I knew this would come up

You being right or wrong has jack shit to do with it. Don't be a smug bastard. "I played wrong, I didn't convince anyone about my scumread and gave no reasons and had a go at them because they didn't listen BUT I WAS RIGHT SO OBVIOUSLY IT'S THEIR FAULT".

[Davsto]

That comparison only works if you were discredited for being right. You were discredited for not wanting to convince people that you were right.

guys stop putting things better than me

[Davsto]

"I didn't want to convince others I was right because they thought I was wrong"

???????????

[Davsto]

Like, that is basically what you said; surely people thinking you're wrong should give you more of a motive to convince them you're right?

[Davsto]

There's thinking I was wrong and actively trying to discredit my entire playstyle.

I can handle people not believing me, but people attacking me because they don't believe me is something else.

Yeh okay, I see you're too stubborn and have a stunning lack of self-awareness, so I'm out. Not playing anymore games with you. I'd apologise, but I honestly don't feel bad.

PEdit nuuuuu fro99er please stay ily

[Davsto]

I have to say. I was Mason here just like refraction and while my reads weren't right, at least I played better here in terms of not being a general dumbass.

Heh, don't worry, some games are like that.

Some games you nail every scum and get spot-on reads, some games you fuckup and don't get a single scumread right. It's the way it goes.

[Davsto]

RC, the fact that your entire argument basically hinges on you being right on Luna should really show how bad an argument it is.

This is my last word on the whole thing, by the way.

ta-ra