Mini 1789: Puppy Mafia! (GAME OVER)

[Thestatusquo]

VOTE: DeathRowKitty

[Thestatusquo]

VOTE: Beeboy

I fucking hate bullshit gambits like this.

And, if you're are telling the truth, the power in masons lies mostly in them being unknown until BAM two confirmed townies. But I don't think you're telling the truth, I think you're doing the number one thing I hate about mafia games these days.

DIAF.

[Thestatusquo]

Hey, we have real things to talk about now.

Stop with the jokes. What do you think of what beeboy just did?

[Thestatusquo]

Do you typically play in games where scum don't have nightkills?

[Thestatusquo]

Are you being serious right now? Honest question.

[Thestatusquo]

Ok, so you're just an idiot.

[Thestatusquo]

No its not, and also I don't believe your claim.

[Thestatusquo]

What? How in the fresh fuck is that wifom?

Wifom is saying that someone would not take action X as scum because it is bad for scum which means that scum are then more likely to take action X because it makes people think they are not scum.

I've been playing mafia roughly 10 years longer than you. I suspect you're the one who has no idea what wifom is.

[Thestatusquo]

Like if you're going to be a condescending little prick, you could at the very least actually know what the thing you're talking about means.

[Thestatusquo]

Alright. Officially tuning you out for the rest of the game.

I don't want to waste mental energy trying to describe the like 4 levels on which the things you just said makes no sense, and its only going to get worse from here.

[Thestatusquo]

We're off to a great start.

Sweet game contribution!

How about you tell us what you think of:
Me
Beeboy
Fire

after the last 2 pages?

There are things here to discuss. I'm not just going to let you ignore them.

[Thestatusquo]

Did you really just call me out for lack of contribution when we're not even 24 hours in?

I don't care about your and Firebringer discussion. Discussing the definition of WIFOM is irrelevant. I liked your reaction to beeboy's claim.
I'm not sure I believe his claim. If he is telling the truth I do not agree with him claiming. I'd like to hear from DRK now.

No, I'm calling you out for posting in the thread without making a game related post when tons of game related stuff had just happened.

[Thestatusquo]

Sorry, we're not lynching dwlee. He is pretty obviously town.

[Thestatusquo]

what is the tsq case?

at least from my angle, his ISO reads more like badgering / tryna "hype people up" than actual energy + effort. I can't tell if I just don't rly feel comfortable with his general vibe or if I actually think he's scummy. hence, good wagon but he's not my top scumread atm.

but yeah, this dwlee wagon is trash and it's worth a closer look into the flow of things. gimme a sec

read all of my past town games. you'll find the exact same approach to RNG.

In fact, I even wrote an article about it, if you care to read it buried somewhere in the recesses of md.

[Thestatusquo]

RNG... Clearly I've been playing too much hearthstone tonight.

RVS is what I meant. Though fuck RNG too amirite.

[Thestatusquo]

Those posts by trivium are so town it hurts me physically, by the way.

[Thestatusquo]

read all of my past town games. you'll find the exact same approach to RNG.

In fact, I even wrote an article about it, if you care to read it buried somewhere in the recesses of md.

wholly unconvincing
liking this wagon more and more!!

"You're acting this way! I think it might be because you're scum!"
"No, actually I make a concerted effort to attack tiny things and get the conversation moving with over the top antics early in RVS, in fact I do it in all my town games and I've even written an article about it"
"UNCONVINCING! I IMAGINE IT IS INSTEAD BECAUSE YOU'RE SCUM."

Alright, you do you, fuckstick.

Anyway, back to things that matter.

The reason triviums posts are town is because of the way they're approaching the game. I don't see scum making those posts because I don't think scum would pick those particular points to talk about and then come to those conclusions. I don't agree with the things that trivium concludes, but the methodology behind making those posts is textbook town player.

[Thestatusquo]

read all of my past town games. you'll find the exact same approach to RNG.

In fact, I even wrote an article about it, if you care to read it buried somewhere in the recesses of md.

wholly unconvincing
liking this wagon more and more!!

"You're acting this way! I think it might be because you're scum!"
"No, actually I make a concerted effort to attack tiny things and get the conversation moving with over the top antics early in RVS, in fact I do it in all my town games and I've even written an article about it"
"UNCONVINCING! I IMAGINE IT IS INSTEAD BECAUSE YOU'RE SCUM."

Alright, you do you, fuckstick.

Anyway, back to things that matter.

The reason triviums posts are town is because of the way they're approaching the game. I don't see scum making those posts because I don't think scum would pick those particular points to talk about and then come to those conclusions. I don't agree with the things that trivium concludes, but the methodology behind making those posts is textbook town player.

Why? How? Explain yourself.

Which part?

[Thestatusquo]

Because you don't look like you're evaluating other players posts through the lens of "ok, what can I attack."

I think there's a fundamental difference in the way that town players and scum players approach rvs, which manifests itself in two ways. First, I believe that arguments that arise out of RVS are easily readable through the lens of "is this player attempting to discover alignment" or "is this player attempting to win the argument" town players tend to do the former, scum the latter. Second, I think that scum posts tend to try to keep the day random as long as possible, whereas town tend to jump right in and try to dig as far into what little information they have. This one is a little less reliable than the former for finding scum players because town players tend to play like crap and enjoy being random and posting meaningless injokey crap that mires the thread down in randomness for pages and pages and allows the scum get away with doing the same, but its pretty good as a way to see which players are approaching the early game in a town way. I think your post fits these two patterns pretty well, so I'm pretty confident in you as town.

I hope that explains it a little better.

[Thestatusquo]

Even this exchange with me screams "what is TSQ's alignment, I'd really like to knowwwww!"

[Thestatusquo]

Not sure yet. There is something off with beeboy and DRK. I'm not sure what yet, but I could buy a scenario where they are scum, a scenario where they are town and a scenario where one is scum and one is town (which would make me angry if that were true.)

I think firebringers posts, few though they are, sucked.

Also there was a whole bunch of stuff the last few pages I need to go back and reread because I'm pretty sure there was stuff there that I didn't like, but I'm unfamiliar with most of the player list so I can't remember names while writing this post. Will probably have a more in depth list of thoughts up tomorrow.

For right now I'm pretty content with a beeboy vote. I've disagreed with almost every actual they've taken this game, and while that might not necessarily make them scum, it makes them a pretty nice place to park a vote while I digest things.

[Thestatusquo]

*action, not actual.

[Thestatusquo]

i don't know if I expect that gambit from beeboy. Anything you didnt like about drk?
Feels like typical fire tbh
Thoughts on heat?

they haven't disowned yet.

Has heat done literally anything this game?

[Thestatusquo]

...

[Thestatusquo]

I think its not great? I also don't think its too far out of line with what idiots do on this site all the time.

Is that outside the norm of typical heat town play?

[Thestatusquo]

Tsq I think we're just talking about two separate things here, and I don't rly appreciate the misrep.

No, actually I make a concerted effort to attack tiny things and get the conversation moving with over the top antics early in RVS

So you ... never do that in your scum games? You never try to play to your town meta when you're scum like uh I don't know everybody? Like why am I supposed to think that playing to an established town meta is supposed to make you town in

this game

especially when you're so deliciously self-aware?

because that makes it at the very least null? Like even if I could get out of something that is a motiviation thing, not an action thing by perfectly faking my motivation and the outcomes those motivations create, it still wouldn't be a reason to find me scummy, because at most it would be null?

Try to keep up please.

[Thestatusquo]

oh yeah and my point was NOT that you were nitpicking or being an ass, but that on my early ISO read I think David Byrne describes it best: "you're talking a lot, but you're not saying anything!"

are you even reading my posts?

[Thestatusquo]

I think shea and I have a similar playstyle. That is pleasing to me

How? What? and Why?

idk he just feels similar to my playstyle. Like the way his reads are formed and it's cool seeing someone else with a similar playstyle.

Yeah, I think the reason why heat is playing the way he is is because the guy appears to be playing like five games at once.

What does 5 games have to do with it?
I am playing above 10 right now.

I havent counted but I am in more than 5 I believe

it's because 90% of people on this site play like absolute fucking morons, so its a shock to find someone else that doesn't.

[Thestatusquo]

because that makes it at the very least null? Like even if I could get out of something that is a motiviation thing, not an action thing by perfectly faking my motivation and the outcomes those motivations create, it still wouldn't be a reason to find me scummy, because at most it would be null?

Try to keep up please.

So you admit that reference to your meta is completely null (which I agree with), but you used it in an attempt to establish yourself as town.

*SNIP*

No, I was using it as a defense against you suggesting those actions came from Scum TSQ. There's a huge difference between using meta as a defense against an attack (you say you think this is likely to come from scum but I typically do it as town so your reason for thinking I'm scummy is invalid.) and using meta as a means of clearing oneself (I do this as town so therefore I am town in this game.)

I did the former, not the latter.

[Thestatusquo]

still pretty happy killing beeboy tbqh

[Thestatusquo]

I'm not angling towards a beeboy lynch. I am voting him and stating my intention to lynch him. I don't think either he or you is telling the truth. If you think I know better than to lynch a mason day one (a dubious statement at best because it implies that beeboy is somehow magically confirmed) then your statement that I would somehow be attempting to lynch a mason day 1 as scum when I would have knowledge of whether the player was telling the truth makes even less sense.

My actions only make sense through a disbelief of the claim. Which, by the way, is how I feel.


Your weasel words are noted, by the way. "Angling" "meandering"? Could you be any more transparent in your well poisoning?

[Thestatusquo]

falling behind a little in all of my games right now. My apologies. I'll try to get caught up today.

[Thestatusquo]

The more I think about it, there are way more permutations of beeboy-drk play that involve scum drk than involve scum beeboy. I'll break that down in a bit but I just wanted to throw that out there.

Plus, beeboys play doesn't read that scummy to me. It reads like town joke gambitty. DRKs response to the whole thing, though, is opportunistic and scummy. Especially in the way that they describe other peoples actions.

[Thestatusquo]

I'm here, failing at my responsibilities. :/

I will try to catch up.

[Thestatusquo]

Of course I would consider hammering. If the game is slowing down as much as it is, might as well kick it along. I do what I want with my vote, and questioning me about it seems like something maf would do to look town. It's too easy of a target, but still doesn't really do anything if I answer. But, looking at heat's ISO, I've realized that that entire wagon hangs on like, one or two things that I don't even think are scummy.

Questioning someones vote is something mafia do?

What? Isn't questioning people's votes like the entire point of the game?

[Thestatusquo]

VOTE: DeathRowKitty

beeboy's play seems more and more bizarre. Still don't believe his claim. Do believe that he is town messing around. Which leads me to the question of why is DRK enabling it.

[Thestatusquo]

good thing I don't give a damn about your opinion on my votes then!

[Thestatusquo]

you didn't ask me why, you didn't make an argument against the vote, you simply proclaimed that it was terrible.

If you want to have a discussion about the vote I'm more than happy to have one, but you're going to have to give more specific criticism than "x vote is terrible."

[Thestatusquo]

beeboy is town. so is dunnstral. also slight townread on TSQ

DRK is questionable

Is there a why for literally any of this?

Also, I don't like the sequence of:

Heat puts dwlee to L-1 flippantly.
Dwlee attacks heat hard for it.
Heat stops mentioning Dwlee like at all.

Looks a lot like scum distancing. I'd be sure to look at one of them if the other flips scum ever.

[Thestatusquo]

Also, I don't like the sequence of:

Heat puts dwlee to L-1 flippantly.
Dwlee attacks heat hard for it.
Heat stops mentioning Dwlee like at all.

Looks a lot like scum distancing. I'd be sure to look at one of them if the other flips scum ever.

Do you not think that Heat would have voted whoever voted him if it hadn't been dwlee?

It's possible? Mafia is a game of percentages. I think there is a decent percentage chance that this is scum distancing.

Just like I think theres a decent percentage chance you're scum.

Could either or both of those things be wrong? Sure. No one can claim to have 100% certainty in a game of mafia, but similarly I don't believe in coincidences, and I think that one of the things that sets apart scum play early on instead of town play is the differences between being truly random and trying to appear random. That means looking for anomalies like that one is often fruitful, especially after we can read it in the light of one of them flipping.

Is that too meandering for you or...?

[Thestatusquo]

Also, I don't like the sequence of:

Heat puts dwlee to L-1 flippantly.
Dwlee attacks heat hard for it.
Heat stops mentioning Dwlee like at all.

Looks a lot like scum distancing. I'd be sure to look at one of them if the other flips scum ever.

Do you not think that Heat would have voted whoever voted him if it hadn't been dwlee?

It's possible? Mafia is a game of percentages. I think there is a decent percentage chance that this is scum distancing.

It's weird because you've expressed a read of null (or maybe slight town?) on Heat's behavior around the L-1 situation and a read of pretty obviously town on dwlee. How do you go from there to looking at the interactions of these players and thinking it looks like scum distancing?

it literally just occurred to me as I was reading heats latest "reads" post.

[Thestatusquo]

Also, reading the actions of players individually often gives a different perspective from viewing how they interact with each other?

[Thestatusquo]

I think so? I would have to re-evaluate if heat flipped scum. though.

[Thestatusquo]

This line of questioning feels so town too.

:/

[Thestatusquo]

VOTE: unvote

[Thestatusquo]

has zulfy done anything meaningful all game? Jw.

[Thestatusquo]

What is the point you are making?

[Thestatusquo]

I'm never going to be able to read Zulfy this game.

@Shea
The only other time I played with you, you counterclaimed our cop as VT with the goal of making sure you got lynched over him. That game was basically forever ago, but you've barely played since then and afaict you still subscribe to more or less the same theory. You've even cited an article you wrote years ago in this very game. Where did that pragmatic approach go? Even if you think that beeboy and I are scum fakeclaiming masons, why would you want to sort it out via the day 1 lynch? Also, help me read Zulfy, please?

Wanted to touch on this briefly: your impression of how much I've played is hilariously amazingly wrong.

I'd also be interested in knowing what game that was.

[Thestatusquo]

I'll tell you what. I'll do so as soon as you do literally anything to help find scum.

[Thestatusquo]

If you think I am not scumhunting then why are you not voting me?

Because my experience with you on the rest of the site implies that you are perfectly capable of being a non-contributing zero regardless of alignment.

[Thestatusquo]

actually, you know what. Fuck it. This game is doing nothing. Lets wagon zulfy for a while.

VOTE: zulfy

[Thestatusquo]

What the hell beeboy. I leave for a second..... Now I'm questioning BOTH OF THE MASON CLAIMS. Zulfy hasn't contributed jack, TSQ seems to be tunneling him for it, and everyone else seems to have gone INSANE. I am actually questioning if I'm the only town and this is a troll game.

What the fuck kind of definition of tunneling do you have?

[Thestatusquo]

So who do we lynch?

Zulfy/Firebringer

I like the cut of your gib.

[Thestatusquo]

By the way I am of the belief that we have a serial killer

why?

[Thestatusquo]

If Trivium's hammer comes from town he deserves to be lynched anyway.
I fail to see what you guys are missing here.

A lot of it has to do with the fact that I still think one of the two of you/drk is scum. I'm more leaning towards drk and you gambiting, but that's like a 65-35% thing. Still, I'm disinclined to be lead by you, almost regardless of the direction you're pushing.

Also I don't typically do "should be lynched anyway because they're bad town" lynches. Though its often an argument I have made when I am scum.

:/

[Thestatusquo]

Because of the night kills

I guess it's possible a vigilante killed dwlee...

thats what I thought.

VOTE: dunnstral

[Thestatusquo]

Talking about a SK when there is no reason to assume one and being the first one to comment on a possible sk is a decent scum tell in my experience.

Either of being the SK or of being mafia who are talking about a second kill they don't have information about. The fact that you specifically called out one of the players, dwlee, and not the other that was NKed means you are making an assumption about which the mafia killed and which the other role killed, which kind of implies that you have information the rest of us do not.

aka its a scum slip. Please die now.

[Thestatusquo]

I was the first one to comment on it actually

I wouldn't mind a dunn lynch tbh.

Don't worry, I didn't miss that.

But you didn't call out a specific player (the slip), you also did so for the purposes of saying that both kills made little sense from a pro town perspective. Both of those things mean I'm far more concerned with dunn right now.

[Thestatusquo]

...I realize why it could be seen as scummy but not every little thing is indication of scum. You really think trivium decided to quicklynch ZULFY as mafia? No. This is more newbie town/derpderp than anything else

Yes. Rules are rules. Why are you so confident that Triv is town? Anything that says too scum to scum doesn't count.

Couldn't be because he knows who the scum are...

Oh wait he already slipped and revealed he knows which kill the mafia kill was on soooooo.

[Thestatusquo]

TSQ answer my question please I even requoted it

to be honest I would have to go back and reread because I didn't find your play yesterday particularly memorable.

[Thestatusquo]

FB/dunnstral scumteam anyone?

I don't understand the connection? I think dunn makes a lot more sense paired with trivium tbh.

[Thestatusquo]

Scum slips happen literally all the time? I made one in the last game I played as scum, for instance.

Its pretty easy to make a post which is based on information you know without even realizing it.

[Thestatusquo]

The mafia kill was on either dwlee or KTS.

We don't know which one. You made a post suggesting you thought that Dwlee was killed by a SK. You later amended this to suggest that it could "also be a vig you guess." This suggests you have some reason to believe that the mafia kill was on KTS and not on Dwlee.

I can't think of any reason that would be true that doesn't involve you being a scum.

[Thestatusquo]

Just because I don't believe the things you say doesn't mean I'm ignoring you.

You're caught scum though, so its really just a courtesy that I'm replying to you at all.

[Thestatusquo]

FFS CAN WE LYNCH THE PERSON WHO BASICALLY CLAIMED SCUM.

The fuck is wrong with you people.

[Thestatusquo]

modkill for insolance incoming...

[Thestatusquo]

You missed a scumslip wtf. You even talked about it without talking about the relevant part, which is that dunn revealed he had information as to which kill was a mafia kill.

How is this so fucking difficult to see?

[Thestatusquo]

I'm at L-2 because I "scumslipped" It'll be interesting to see how everyone back peddles when I flip town

I'll own your lynch regardless of your flip.

You made a comment that suggests you have information you shouldn't have if town. That's as strong a scum tell as we get barring information role reveals. If you made it when town then so be it. Nothing in mafia is 100%.

[Thestatusquo]

I pushed one mislynch, you've pushed 3 now

Slips dropping everywhere.

It's day 2. There's no way to know that the players you're referring to as being "mislynched" are town unless...um... you already know who the town is.

Guys this is fucking blatant.

[Thestatusquo]

I pushed one mislynch, you've pushed 3 now

Slips dropping everywhere.

It's day 2. There's no way to know that the players you're referring to as being "mislynched" are town unless...um... you already know who the town is.

Guys this is fucking blatant.

So you agree that they're town?

VOTE: Dunnstral

Nice

Trivium stop talking I'm trying to convince everyone you're town

Your vote is still on town

I don't know even who you're referring to, but I do know there's no way to "push three mislynches" when theres only been one lynch, and expressing certainty of peoples alignments when they're not dead to the point of calling things mislynches is a HUGE fucking scumtell for me.

Pls die. Pls die two pages ago.

Feel free to claim, but I'm not NOT lynching you today.

[Thestatusquo]

Asking someone for a claim before you lynch them isn't role fishing.

It's asking for a claim before you lynch someone.

We are going to lynch you.

Claim.

[Thestatusquo]

You realize that this lynch could be the end of town?

I fail to see how that is remotely possible. Do you have some more information about the setup you'd like to share or something?

[Thestatusquo]

Also, like even if it is true, that is theoretically true of literally every lynch that can possibly happen on a given day. Saying it wrt your lynch in particular is disingenuous at best.

Like, its not a reason to not lynch you if I think you have the highest chance of being scum. And I think you have the highest chance of being scum by a country mile.

[Thestatusquo]

You have twice now made comments that scream "I have inside information that is not public." thats something that is a screaming tell of someone being scum.

Your last post is borderline doing that as well because you're ONCE AGAIN assuming with have an SK.

Like, IDGAF about the rest of your gameplay at that point because basically every fucking time I have seen someone make comments like the ones you have made that showcase the fact that you know things about alignments and setup that town couldn't possibly know, they have been scum.

I'm sorry to say your gameplay is irrelevant to me, even if I agreed with your assessment that the rest of your gameplay has been town. I don't by the way, but its also not worth talking about. Saying I haven't bothered to look at it is just as stupid as it is incorrect.

[Thestatusquo]

:/

I'm doing the classic stupid thing where I'm trying to convince scum that they're scum. I'll stop now. But like this is one of the most blatant "is clearly scum" cases I've ever seen in 10 years of playing this game.

[Thestatusquo]

^^^ literally the dumbest post I've ever read.

[Thestatusquo]

Sure, Dunn scumslipped twice. First by saying "I think Dwlee was killed by a SK." revealing that they knew that Dwlee was not the mafia factional kill. Then they claimed that someones reads were bad because they had pushed "3 mislynched" even though we've only had 1 lynch so far so saying that the other two pushed by that person were mislynches requires him to know that those players are town.

sooo we're lynching dunn, basically.

[Thestatusquo]

There's also been a lot of beeboy and trivium slap fighting. Firebringer being as fucking useless as usual and uhhh. Me screaming a lot.

[Thestatusquo]

Guys we are not NOT lynching the player who scum slipped not once but twice. Jesus fucking Christ. There's dumb town play and then there's looking filet Mignon on a silver platter and then taking a gigantic shit on it.

[Thestatusquo]

most of the town is either posting about how they're not reading or has their heads up their asses.

Anyway,

note to the game and the mod. I'm hosting ChicagoMeet this weekend, (fri-sun) so I my posting here will be very limited as a result. Please don't prod/replace me

[Thestatusquo]

Deadline will be extended due to the site downtime. I'll change the countdown later, as I have a kindergarten graduation to get to!

Congratulations on graduating from kindergarten! I knew you could do it

XD

I'm back guys. Chicago meet was great. Cuz of the downtime there's nothing to catch up on!

Dunn still obv scum.

[Thestatusquo]

Fly safe! Thanks for coming to the meet!

[Thestatusquo]

oh my FUCKING GOD.

VC analysis is not important when a player LITERALLY SCUM SLIPPED 2 TIMES.

For fucks sakes town.

[Thestatusquo]

You have base two statements that can only be made if you have information about who the scum are.

That is the definition of a scum slip. They weren't even weak or slight. They were blatant and huge. I am not letting it go. You are scum. We are lynching you today.

[Thestatusquo]

Your statement that I am not helping the town only makes sense if you are town. Which you're not. I'm helping the town by not letting scum weasel out of being lynched after making two glaring scum slips.

[Thestatusquo]

Can you ignore that you scum fuck?

[Thestatusquo]

I'm perfectly capable of figuring out tomorrow tomorrow. As for today you're scum. Your flip will change all the information have.

[Thestatusquo]

Your flip will change all the information have.

How so? What will change from your point of view?

I don't know if you're mafia or sk. The slips are consistent with either. Also I could be wrong.

[Thestatusquo]

Quite a few things, actually. It would let me give more credence to your reads than I currently am. It would also make me look at players who have been parked on your wagon without doing anything to push it forward as well as players who have avoided it all together.

[Thestatusquo]

You have two times now refused to claim. You can't do that and then call people who are going to hammer you "quick lynching."

That's not how it works.

[Thestatusquo]

That's all well and good but you still can't refuse to claim and then admonish people for not waiting for your claim to l lynch you

[Thestatusquo]

Effort is not indicative of alignment trivium...

[Thestatusquo]

Also pretty happy with the following now, especially since you're not softing a cop with an innocent on triv which is what I thought you were doing.

[Thestatusquo]

Following... wagon. Weird autocorrect, phone.

[Thestatusquo]

How and when did that happen!

[Thestatusquo]

Chicago meet was not good for lower bodies. You might have broken your foot and penguin blew out her knee.

[Thestatusquo]

neither is explicitly normal, but neither is explicitly blacklisted either.

that means that the role would have to be the only non-explicitly whitelisted role/modifier in the game.

[Thestatusquo]

I don't know why a vengeful townie claim would be any more or less likely to be believed than a normal vt. If you would hammer a normal vt claim here you should hammer this IMO.

[Thestatusquo]

The mislynch comment being the second slip referring to.

[Thestatusquo]

I think the mods rule set should determine that, not your personal opinion.

Noting the full on counter wagon with the no justification from anyone but drk for tomorrow, but there's still no way were not lynching Dunn.

[Thestatusquo]

I think the fact that the wagon has gone nowhere for like 4 days and send to be on the verge of collapse because this town is fucking dumb is a reason for anyone to act like Dunn has. One again activity is not indicative of alignment and 'I'm resigned to my lynch here's a bunch of posts on the game' is way more likely to come from scum than town in my experience but what the fuck ever

[Thestatusquo]

Drk are you joking? Using the term mislynch to refer to people who are not yet flipped is a fucking classical scum slip....... as is attributing one of the kills to a specific faction when you have no way of knowing. Like the fact that you're trying to pretend that they aren't is pretty troubling to me. Is it possible they're just mistakes that mean nothing? Yes? But mafia is a game of probability and the fact that you can think of alternative reasons why someone says those things doesn't change the fact that most of the time when I see someone make comments like those it's because they failed at editing out their inside information.

You should know this. What the actual fuck.

[Thestatusquo]

95% of the mafia I play is under alts or f2f. I can't give you an ISO of my f2f games and I'm not going to out my alts just because you're being fucking stupid. I can try to remember specific examples from 6+ years ago but that's not going to yield much fruit. I am honestly just shocked that this is even a discussion point. Expect a md thread about this post game.

[Thestatusquo]

By the way DRK how far have you read? I claimed vengeful townie

I'm on page 45 and reading intermittently.

95% of the mafia I play is under alts or f2f. I can't give you an ISO of my f2f games and I'm not going to out my alts just because you're being fucking stupid. I can try to remember specific examples from 6+ years ago but that's not going to yield much fruit. I am honestly just shocked that this is even a discussion point. Expect a md thread about this post game.

The I honestly don't give half a shit about your

most of the time

reasoning. Put up or shut up.

I'm putting up by lynching this obv scum. If they're town I'll shut up.

[Thestatusquo]

I'm ready to claim. I think it should be obvious what I am based on my play/statements

[Thestatusquo]

I also prefer popcorn order.

I don't like beeboy going last.

[Thestatusquo]

Fine with genda going first tho.

[Thestatusquo]

I'm fine with a massclaim and with Trivium flipping town I believe Titus is scum.

I'm okayish with beeboy's order.

@Heat, that's a really weird post. If you think I am scum, then make a case.
Implying I'm scum because no one has been paying attention to me (which isn't really true, since several people have called me out) feels a bit strange.

I don't think its weird.

Like, what do you think he's doing if not making a case? The post basically reads "duppin has played in such a way as to fly under the radar and do nothing that makes waves...this is behavior consistent with scum play."

where everything after the ... is implied.

Are you really so thick that you can't read between the lines there?

[Thestatusquo]

What?

player A: Posts a case
player B: Wtf thats a weird post why wouldn't you just post a case on me.
player C: Um... That was a case wtf are you smoking?
Player B: It feels like he was posting a case hoping people would agree with it.

This is the part where I (player C in the above summary conversation, btw) informs you that this is the entire point of cases and given that there is a good chance we are in mylo its prudent for people to post what they think without voting.

[Thestatusquo]

reads a little bit like "caught for all the wrong reasons" imo

[Thestatusquo]

Also, you're posting 9 times more now in defense of yourself than you have in the rest of the days COMBINED which is not particularly town play.

[Thestatusquo]

I think its duppin and genda for sure, and then I think a third scum could be literally any of you. :/

I see heat as the most town.

[Thestatusquo]

Is there literally anyone who thinks genda is town?

[Thestatusquo]

Vote: genda

As I intimated in my first post about claiming today, I think its pretty obvious who I am. I've been basically softing vig the whole fucking game.

Vig shots were KTS and Triv.

Pls die.

[Thestatusquo]

Claim tracker I tracked Genda to the kill

Good. Now I know who the third scum is too.

[Thestatusquo]

Like there's no way you don't just fucking lead with that if that's true.

And you're saying our setup is tracker, JK, Vig 3 scum? Bulllllllshit.

[Thestatusquo]

So you just claimed you tracked someone to the kill and now you're saying that your role is not a tracker and then saying that the role you're having doesnt even have the ability you first claimed?

Fuck this noise. If I lose the game to this fucking bullshit of a fake claim I am going to rage so fucking hard.

[Thestatusquo]

No but its bs, because your role doesn't even rule out both genda and I telling the truth about having killed a person. You don't know that genda targeted who he is claiming to (the obvious vig shot and not the obvious night kill.)

Tracker gives you that information. Your role that you're claiming does not. In the world where you're telling the truth it is not ruled out that I am a vig who shot triv and genda is scum who shot DRK.

I don't think that distinction would be lost on town beeboy. I do think it would be lost on hastily fake claiming beeboy.

[Thestatusquo]

What? The player who was a sure lynch today because literally no one was town reading him has no reason to fake claim? Are you fucking high?

[Thestatusquo]

Because assuming the kill is from a specific faction is a tell that you know which faction killed whom?

[Thestatusquo]

Sorry TSQ I am trusting the guy who wasn't driving mislynches on the people who I have been calling town all game.

That's because you're gambiting scum. It's a good gambit, I'll grant you that though.

[Thestatusquo]

But the execution sucks.

1) you claimed the wrong role.
2) the role you claimed would have given you information to suggest I'm scum, but then you backtracked on that claim to a role that does not give you that information.
3) you ignored the fact that if you were actually the role you claim to be you wouldn't have been able to say I was scum there given the fact that both players could be telling the truth in that world.
4) You claim to think titus is town based on your role information when you couldn't possibly know that given the role claim you switched to either because in normal games scum can still be scum and take no action because the kill is factional.
5) this is the second and third time you've claimed this game.

Like this is just absolute fucking trash.

[Thestatusquo]

6) the setup your role implies is absurdly town slanted.
7) you think there's no reason for a player who was almost 100% going to be lynched today to fake claim but you somehow think theres a reason for me to fake claim despite the fact that if I were scum and this is mylo there is literally no reason for me to fake claim ever in that situation as scum.

Bull shit.

bullllllllshit.

[Thestatusquo]

Because my vig philosophy is two part. First, kill the people who are scum. I didn't have any very strong scum reads at the end of day one, so I didn't do that. Second, shoot the players at the margins who you are having a hard time reading. KTS was the second type. Triv was the first type.

[Thestatusquo]

You didn't have time to check your role pm? For the role that you have ostensibly had for days and days and have two supposed results from. Or you made it up, realized it was inconsistent, and then changed your claim. Once again. Occam's razor this, town.

What? 10:3 mountainous is balanced. You think 10:3 with 3 strong power roles is balanced? Are you joking?

[Thestatusquo]

So you remembered you had a result. Remembered that it was relevant. Remembered which players it was on. But didn't remember what the fuck it was?

k.

[Thestatusquo]

Your day one play is also super inconsistent with being a power role.

[Thestatusquo]

You didn't. You said that tracked genda to the kill. That is not even close to the same result as "genda performed a killing action."

and you reacted and pushed as if it were the former and not the latter.

Because, as you keep trying to brush off, "genda performed a killing action" is not actually information which is a counterclaim. Which is what you're saying this is. Given that there is way more reason for scum genda to fakeclaim there than scum tsq the fact that you immediately "counterclaimed" with information that is not correct shows that you're trying to run up a lynch and not actually thinking about the implications of your role.

Which is a pretty good indication that you're scum number 3.

I will not be self hammering. If scum is going to get this bullshit fake claim mislynch to end the day they're going to earn every fucking vote.

[Thestatusquo]

*game, not day.

[Thestatusquo]

Those are real questions. I think the answer is that there is a slim chance you're town telling the truth about his role who does not realize that his information does not actually imply that I am scum.

What do you mean by bus your scum partner? We have had no scum flips. I honestly do not know who you're referring to when you say bus your scum partner.

I think its small but I want to lynch genda first and then you because you being scum is dependent on genda being scum and not the other way around.

[Thestatusquo]

your behavior doesn't match that interpretation much but there are parts of your behavior that don't match you being scum either.

Wifom aside, I think the most likely explanation is you're gambitting scum.

[Thestatusquo]

Hard bussing does not exist in your world beeboy?

[Thestatusquo]

That's why it's so puzzling that now that you've been given information that suggests that either your number one scum read is lying or someone who has been softing a role all game and is not your number one scum read is lying, when your number one scum read has all the incentive in the world to be fake claiming and I have absolutely none, you choose to believe that I'm the one lying and not your aforementioned number one scum read.

Actually your behavior matches exactly with a scum player who knows putting their vote on a buddy is free because that player won't be lynched.

You did not seriously push on him. You did not bring anyone along with you ever because you never made serious arguments against him. Your play is not inconsistent with being genda's buddy at all.

[Thestatusquo]

genda, I agree that my play day 2 was remarkably stupid.

[Thestatusquo]

I was tunneled. And saying things to get a player lynched. I think its been pointed out several times that neither of the slips I was accusing him of were actually slips.

[Thestatusquo]

right. I'm the one with the botched claim.

[Thestatusquo]

So you think that my play as scum was to find a player that no one was pushing, attack him hard as fuck for the entire day, insist on his lynch and his lynch alone and then hammer it repeatedly until it went through despite the fact that in this world, I as scum would know he was a townie?

K. Pls die.

[Thestatusquo]

That's play you could expect from scum shea on a scum partner. Not on a town player in a situation that clearly wasn't mylo.

[Thestatusquo]

titus wtf.

[Thestatusquo]

triv makes zero sense as a scum kill.

[Thestatusquo]

how does it makes sense to kill the second most lynch bait-y player as SK?

[Thestatusquo]

im leaning on TSQ being scum but i also feel like ive been tainted by RC so

im not sure yet

You honestly think my play this game makes sense as scum?

Read old games of mine if you must. That is not how I play scum. Like ever.

[Thestatusquo]

ex post facto. in order for me to have manipulated my meta I would have to change the way I've played mafia for 10 years just in case I happen to be called out on it in the anticipation of making this argument.

that would be an absurd thing for me to do, and greatly overestimates the amount of effort I put into mafia and how much I care about it.

[Thestatusquo]

wtf. I was the one who drove the first lynch?

you also still haven't answered my question. Why, when faced with the possibility that your biggest scum read was lying or I was lying did you decide that I was the one lying? It doesn't make any damn sense, especially since he had incentive to lie because otherwise he was assuredly the lynch today and scum me would have literally no incentive to counterclaim there.

[Thestatusquo]

I mean I just wanted Genda to claim first because I knew he preformed a kill he wasn't my biggest scum read.
I was convinced you where scum because of the Dunn lynch actually.

you literally said a page ago that you made no sense as scum because it would require you to be bussing genda because you've been so convinced he's scum this game.

titus I'll look up the posts in a bit.

[Thestatusquo]

omg how is that town weak when 3:10 is balanced at mountainous.

[Thestatusquo]

Because it's a baseline for balance?

[Thestatusquo]

can we lynch the obvious scum genda yet?

[Thestatusquo]

no u

[Thestatusquo]

the claim DOESN'T EVEN MAKE ME SCUM. ffs.

[Thestatusquo]

Let's just get on with this game, I doubt anything more is going to happen today and I've given my reads, so.

VOTE: TSQ

I believe Genda's claim more than yours, sorry if I'm wrong.

despite the fact that I have literally no reason to counter claim there as scum.

k...

[Thestatusquo]

vote:thestatusquo

[Thestatusquo]

I just can't understand how you could possibly vote duppin.