Mini 2017: Encore Mafia - Now Without Cults [Endgame]

[BNL]

VOTE: Ms Marangal

Let’s lynch obvscum this time

[BNL]

Also do you guys think it’ll be a good idea to list all roles you ever had? I’m not sure how useful this will be though.

[BNL]

I proposed it because I deduced that it won't help scum as they can easily collate the list of all such roles at Night. I believe they would be hardworking enough to generate that list.

But if you're against it then fine with me.

[BNL]

VOTE: Ms Marangal
Let’s lynch obvscum this time

Town.

There's no way you're getting a townread off the first post in the game, especially an RVS vote.

Also do you guys think it’ll be a good idea to list all roles you ever had? I’m not sure how useful this will be though.

I proposed it because I deduced that it won't help scum as they can easily collate the list of all such roles at Night. I believe they would be hardworking enough to generate that list.

But if you're against it then fine with me.

I'd fully expect scum to collect such a list but I don't see any point in helping them with that or doing the work for them. If anyone has a role that would benefit from knowing everyone else's potential role then they should collect the list themselves.

Also, since this is

probably

a PR heavy game, I'd like to request that

no one crumb their role

, scum will spot it and they WILL kill you for it. Anyone who feels like their role is useless should feel free to drop a fake crumb though if they want to bite a night kill . But of course, don't be so obvious about it that it's

too

obvious.

Also, if anyone is a neighbouriser, I want in :3

Finally, VOTE: Srceenplay, I'll get you this time

I think I have generated enough wifom in this post. This final line in of itself furthers that wifom.

I agree with the first paragraph.

I disagree with the second paragraph. I agree this is likely to be role madness, but this means crumbs are not as useful for scum as everyone is a role so PR wise it doesn't matter much who they kill.

I want to be in a neighbourhood as well :3


Also I'll end off by saying that Awoo is giving me lynchbait feels.

[BNL]

Also do you guys think it’ll be a good idea to list all roles you ever had? I’m not sure how useful this will be though.

Part of the reason I suggested this is because I was thinking of certain roles that would be better if the rolepool of everyone is known. For example, Role Cop is almost a Cop this game. Though I am aware that because some players have hundreds of games it'll be difficult to generate that list and therefore it does help scum.

[BNL]

There's no way you're getting a townread off the first post in the game, especially an RVS vote.

Have we really not played together before?
You would not be making this post if we had ever played together, but I could have SWORN we've played together; I've seen you around a whole fuckload, yet this is something you absolutely should know about me if you have literally any experience with me.

Iirc the only game I had with you under any of your accounts was on the fallout shelter. I was town, you were scum. You lurked D1, I got lynched D1, and then someone got a guilty on you N1.

Are you confusing me with someone else? I haven't been on Mafiascum between Feb 2017 and May 2018.

[BNL]

To clarify I feel like Awoo gives me the same vibes as new players in general. Everything they say comes off as scummy. However they are just town who doesn't know how to game properly (sorry no offense). This is what I mean by lynchbait.

[BNL]

Do mods no longer PM people when the game starts? I had to iso to see if this game started cause i got my role PM few days ago

Also this is probably town as they have a long wait before getting their role PM and the game actually starting. Whereas scum get pregame chat. It could be faked by scum but I'm not feeling it.

[BNL]

I'm here too! Thoughts on the game?

[BNL]

Are you confusing me with someone else? I haven't been on Mafiascum between Feb 2017 and May 2018.

I've been on mafiascum for much longer than that.

I was there when you were first around in 2015, and I've been around since you've been back; I could have sworn you'd encountered me at some point.

Not as players in a game; you reviewed my Normal.

[BNL]

Game is not progressing. Going to switch to my strongest scumread now.

UNVOTE: Ms Marangal
VOTE: mastina

[BNL]

Hard read: Everyone voting for me is mafia

Not impossible. I find all-scum wagons quite plausible early Day 1, and you seem like you'd be an easy vote to make.

[BNL]

That said, I want to go here first:
UNVOTE: mastina
VOTE: mutantdelve

He has some decently sized posts but I don't see scumhunting in his iso.

[BNL]

Updated read: everyone but kokichi voting for me is mafia

Hard read: Everyone voting for me is mafia

Is 84 a correction to 79, or did 82 change your read on Kokichi?

[BNL]

Zzz

This game is way too slow. How many lurkers do we have?

I can see the mylo vote, but I wanna pressure mutantdelve first. Vote mutant with me?

[BNL]

Town leaning him?

[BNL]

Hi Esp. Glad to see you won’t be lurking.

You think my post was scummy?

[BNL]

BNL: He's laying the whole "I'm engaged with the game!" a little thick, isn't he? I'll chalk it up to being back from a long hiatus

Yeah, pretty much. I'm kinda overexcited about playing my first forum Mafia game in 1.5 years.

Wanna talk to me so I can sort you better and vice versa?

[BNL]

Okay.

I'm null on you, your posts didn't really strike me either may. Maybe very slightly leaning town.

Do you want to say anything that could change that?

[BNL]

hmm

Actually you can be town for now

[BNL]

Yo Mylo

Some people are voting you. What do you have to say about that?

[BNL]

Yeah I think EP is town.

About implosion, I don’t know. He has been mirroring a lot of my thoughts in his posts, which I like, but because he has me as his strongest townread, I am paranoid that he could be buddying me.

Pine’s play is really underwhelming right now. I’m not sure what he’s thinking with his recent posts, but I’ll give him some time.

[BNL]

Yes just say it

[BNL]

Ok. Same as Awoo then.
Do you have any thoughts on who is town and who is scum though?

[BNL]

I'll be looking forward to it then.

Mylo gave me the same newbie vibes as Awoo did, but I'm more cautious of him.

[BNL]

Hmm. I still can’t sort you.

UNVOTE: mutantdevle
VOTE: Myloninja13

[BNL]

No need. Instead, answer me

I think I'm going to sheep BUL here lol

VOTE: mastina

What exactly did you sheep me about?

[BNL]

I don’t think that’s a good reason for a vote

[BNL]

That's fair, but it's better than my personal alternative of no vote.

I see. So you’re the kind that doesn’t like RVS. Then this makes a lot of sense.

[BNL]

Also before I forget happy birthday Wisdom!

[BNL]

Implosion, how did you go from Mylo going from Designated Lynch to "hard time getting a solid read on"?

I agree with the mutantdevle vote. Other than the mentioned awkward 138, many of his comments are related to addressing points at him. He seems more interested in self defense than scum hunting.

UNVOTE: Myloninja
VOTE: mutantdevle

[BNL]

Pine is probably town, and is likely not mutant's partner

[BNL]

The real answer is that calling him a Designated Lynch™ was never really especially serious or meaningful.

Acceptable response

[BNL]

I agree with the mutantdevle vote. Other than the mentioned awkward 138, many of his comments are related to addressing points at him. He seems more interested in self defense than scum hunting.

"Maybe mutant has a reason to not be scum hunting but instead of asking him that reason I'm just going to opportunistically vote for him and paint him as scum for it."

All of my posts that addressed points against me at the time of your post were simply questioning things about me rather than defending myself against them. I don't so how that makes up 'many of my comments' or is particularly defensive.

And ofc I'm going to seem more interested in self-defence than scum hunting when I've done literally no scum hunting at all...

Give me a good reason I should believe you’re town if you refuse to scum hunt

[BNL]

Actually I will provide an alternative question.
How are you going to help town win if you don’t hunt for scum?

[BNL]

Not really seeing the Pine wagon.
Mastina what do you think of Pine?

[BNL]

Implosion so how did you get mutantdevle town?

[BNL]

I think with mastina talking about her role so much, I think it’s best to leave sorting her to another Day.

Pedit: good luck on your whatever!

[BNL]

BulletNLynchproof:

So here's why I called this guy powerscum:
too reasonable & agreeable, slow to action and fast to back off. What did awoo mean by this? well:
6 and 9 suggest something meaningless, immediately backs off facing slightest opposition. Not saying this never comes from town but the purpose behind these posts reminds me of the whole "trying to appear town" thing. Trying to appear reasonable, you know? This is further backed by 20 more useless(? idk im vt xD) setup spec but then calls me lynchbait, has also proceeded to never vote for me in the game, for some reason backs up calling me lynchbait while (also spewing me as town?) in 28.
Translator's note: spewing means "when mafia has perfect information and calls someone town/mafia too easily because they know already".
What I'm trying to say here is, he's soft defending me suspiciously, when he probably shouldn't be. It gives the mental image of the "brian skies mafia" who is super reasonable about everything and hard to lynch, and sometimes stays off town lynches on scummy townies just to be right about it and appear really intellectual (LOL) but you know what I mean.

AND FUCK THIS POST 80 this is what set me off the deep end. Here is an artists depction of this scenario:

duhhhhh i think everyone voting for me is scum btw i eat glue and paint chips and idk how to play mafia

Hmmm... interesting. The young master has quite the plausible and not impossible theory. *sips champagne* *contemplates* Hm.... indeed. Let us encourage this truly intelligent thought to flourish.

Does anyone else see a problem here? See how this fits into the intellectual powerscum idea? Yeah. I might eat glue, but I can also win the game.

ok whos next on the list...

I never thought you were scum. I made it clear that I was town reading you, and by "lynchbait" I meant mislynch bait, which is that I thought that if you were to keep up that kind of posting you'd probably get wrongly lynched, based on your first posts having the same feel as other mislynch baits I've played with before.

Wrt 80, I said it was not implausible that all 3 scum were voting you because again, experience. I've often seen only-scum wagons on town early game before. Then again, those were micros, so I don't know if the same happens in games of this size.

[BNL]

After Awoo's post I don't know what to think. I just hate people who say they are obvious town.

Awoo is now a null for me.

[BNL]

And WRT Awoo, BNL seems like an awfully weird choice for him to make if he is scum looking for a counterwagon. Only vote there was Espeonage who isn't exactly at the front of the game's zeitgeist at the moment, with a decent number of people calling him town. I don't think scum-Awoo would think the wagon has a significant chance of forming, unless it's a really odd bus. If he's scum it was just a move to gain towncred and I don't think that's the move that scum looking for towncred is especially likely to make.

Unvote

VOTE: BNL

But you don't scumread me.

[BNL]

I can see Wisdom town by his votes regarding the Awoo wagon.
I'm also starting to sense mutantdevle town, especially 209

UNVOTE: mutantdevle
VOTE: implosion

Not a fan of how he joined my wagon. Glad to see you've stopped buddying me, though.

pedit: Only when conveyed seriously. I'm not going to rant in this game why I hate such players.

[BNL]

You just had me as strongest town. I didn't like how you suddenly flipped on me, especially in the post where you said "BNL is not a bad counterwagon"

[BNL]

Also I don't think reckless wagon hopping is scummy. I didn't think your vote on me was scummy, your read flip was.

[BNL]

While talking about this though, why did you vote a lot of your null/scum reads, but you did not vote mutantdevle even though you were clearly thinking that he was scummy?

[BNL]

Oops I forgot about 237. It was awkward. But I definitely think the read flip sucks much more.

[BNL]

Then again,
UNVOTE: implosion
VOTE: Kokichi Oma
I liked your responses. I feel like Kokichi is falling under my radar.

[BNL]

It's more like I don't have a townread on you despite you having the largest post count (other than myself).

[BNL]

Woah, why is BNL being wagoned? He's like my only strong townread here lol.

I feel this is town from mylo. I feel that this is what town would post when they were half not following then return.

Though I must must say this is partially based on the fact that I know I’m town.

[BNL]

yo, BNL, I never said you scumread me, read carefully. I didn't like the way you called me town.

Since when did I say that you said that I scumread you?

(Sorry, confusing question, I know)

[BNL]

It's more like I don't have a townread on you despite you having the largest post count (other than myself).

Ok. So the point of voting me over trying to engage with me is?

I could do either. Both ways are acceptable ways of trying to get a better read on you. I chose to vote you because I felt like it.

[BNL]

Things to consider when I feel like it (You can try this too!)

- look at mastina votes
- respond to BNL, call his reply scummy, show your work in a well structured argument

Ugh, wow, this post is so scummy. Like it shows that Awoo has already decided to scumread me rather than actually continuing to read me.

But I'm hesitant to actually see this as scummy simply because I know a lot of people play bad like this as town.

[BNL]

I could vote BNL

I think you clearly scumread me. Why aren't you voting me already?

@Wisdom same question

[BNL]

He's my obligatory "Strong player" townread.

Without really intending to, I generally find an experienced player who is townish, and just sheep them until I have any idea on what to do. This game, it's BNL!

Hey mylo, my play has already stopped being strong.

Also my vote has moved off mastina long long ago.

I feel like asking a question here but I can't think of one. Anyway, I would like a response to this.

[BNL]

Town {Errantparabola, implosion, mutantdevle}
Nulltown {Kokichi Oma, Myloninja13}
Null {Espeonage, Pine, Wisdom, Ms Marangal, the worst}
Nullscum {Awoo}
Not including mastina on this list because I think lynching her today is not a good idea.

Too many unreadable people for my liking. Come on, lurkers!

UNVOTE: Kokichi Oma
VOTE: Awoo

[BNL]

Hi Wisdom. I can't read you. Talk to me?

[BNL]

Woah, why is BNL being wagoned? He's like my only strong townread here lol.

I feel this is town from mylo. I feel that this is what town would post when they were half not following then return.

Though I must must say this is partially based on the fact that I know I’m town.

Why wouldn't scum post it?

I guess I'll start by taking the initiative by answering your previous question. Idk it was a gut read. His interaction with the worst later made it go down for him a little though.

[BNL]

Wisdom, talk to me, please?

[BNL]

Oh hey Mara. Also good to talk to you because I can't sort you.

Why the scum read on Errant?

[BNL]

Why do people not want to engage me

[BNL]

Wrt 80, I said it was not implausible that all 3 scum were voting you because again, experience. I've often seen only-scum wagons on town early game before. Then again, those were micros, so I don't know if the same happens in games of this size.

Awoo, address this please?

Implosion, too.

[BNL]

He already claimed VT, and that he hasn't played any role other than VT and Mafia Goon.

He isn't immune to nightkills, just that scum won't kill him because he claimed VT.

[BNL]

I never had a scumread on you. You went up to null town because I liked your interaction with the worst.

And yes, I have switched to Awoo, because he has became my strongest scumread. Not that I have a strong scumread on him, but I don’t have a strong scumread on anyone else.

[BNL]

Also why weren’t you voting me earlier?

[BNL]

UNVOTE: Awoo

Okay, AWOL just typed out a one hour response to my post. I don't think scum would do that.

But Awoo, I do want to clear out some misconceptions with you

[BNL]

Sorry Awoo not AWOL. My phone auto corrected that.

[BNL]

Lynchbait = scummy but town. I had the impression you thought I meant lynchbait = scummy and town.

And I thought I made it clear I was town reading you early game.

[BNL]

To be fair I agree with you that my voting patterns regarding Awoo have been scummy. But I don't stop doing things that I believe are scummy because I believe it's helping the town.

It wasn't backpedaling though, Awoo's giant wall post is pretty town.

[BNL]

I kinda like the Worst from his posts. Why were people discussing wagoning Worst?

[BNL]

Mastina's posts also don't sit well with me.

She went into hiding for a while, and when she came back there were no change in her reads. I also find it funny how she calls Mylo out for white knighting me and not driving the wagon off me when I see that she's doing the same thing.

At the same time I actually agree with her points on Mylo, and I don't think trying to wagon mastina is a good idea today.

[BNL]

implosion did likely as a reaction test to get me to wake up
otherwise I think we all g naow

There is still EP's vote

[BNL]

I'm getting quite annoyed because Awoo/Mylo/KO are being extremely volatile for me now. It's like I keep seeing alternating town/scum posts from them.

[BNL]

I also sometimes feel like I have too many townreads, then I realise how many lurkers there are in the game.

VOTE: Espeonage

[BNL]

I think my new desire might be a wagon on the worst???

Wrt 80, I said it was not implausible that all 3 scum were voting you because again, experience. I've often seen only-scum wagons on town early game before. Then again, those were micros, so I don't know if the same happens in games of this size.

Awoo, address this please?

Implosion, too.

I mean, this is a logically sound thing to say but it doesn't really address why it's a more sensible thing to do as scum. And if you are thinking of multiple specific games where you've seen this, I actually wouldn't mind links to votecounts from those games because I'm sort of skeptical that this is something that you've seen often enough to establish as a pattern (it's something I can believe but am initially skeptical of).

Newbie 1651 Catboi and All Alone on Annadog
Micro 642 Farside and Lane on Map Wolf

Those were the only two games I had in mind when I said that

[BNL]

KO I think you asked me a question somewhere, can you bring it up for me?

[BNL]

Huh. I thought I clearly remembered you asking me a question somewhere

[BNL]

I never had a scumread on you. You went up to null town because I liked your interaction with the worst.

which interactions did you like and what did you like abt them?

Ah it was Worst's question.

Actually I don't quite remember anymore. I thought KO entrancing Worst looked quite towny, but it seems that I've been swayed by the pictures.

[BNL]

worst, you're doing an awful lot of what feels like testing out the waters to see what vote you can get to stick before committing to giving any material reads. You're asking a lot of questions in a lot of different directions and it doesn't feel like you're following up with any of them or listening to any of the answers/adjusting your reads based on them.

Care to dissuade me of this incorrect notion?

I disagree with this statement. Some of the questions weren't followed up because they weren't answered in the first place.

[BNL]

Mastina's posts also don't sit well with me.

She went into hiding for a while, and when she came back there were no change in her reads. I also find it funny how she calls Mylo out for white knighting me and not driving the wagon off me when I see that she's doing the same thing.

At the same time I actually agree with her points on Mylo, and I don't think trying to wagon mastina is a good idea today.

that sounds a lot like mastina
she's not remotely easy to read, but there are some people on this list who can probably do an ok job of it (Pine jumps to mind, allowing they're not literally scum together).

That will be a problem because Pine is currently being unreadable.

There is still EP's vote

did you dislike EP's vote on me? why?

No opinion. I just wanted to point out that some people are still voting you.

[BNL]

You just had me as strongest town. I didn't like how you suddenly flipped on me, especially in the post where you said "BNL is not a bad counterwagon"

okay, in what world is doing a 180 something that's scummy?
answer: no world.
people gotta stop scumreading that.

This is the last thing I want to reply to for now.
Doing a 180 by itself is not scummy. I thought that 237 was a weird and misleading place for a vote change. Another reason I suspected this is because early game I have been talking about paranoia of Implosion buddying me, and it may have prompted scum!implosion to stop townreading me.

But Implosion is town so whatever.

[BNL]

I will end off by explaining my Espeonage vote.

I just think that him voteparking me at the start of the game and the fact that a wagon appeared on me in the middle of the game are somehow connected.

[BNL]

Espe wagon is fine.

But Implosion is town ^{[citation needed]} so whatever.

I feel like the way Implosion has been interacting with the game has been feeling quite town. For example, the part where he briefly voted me I liked his way of questioning me.

Plus he has been speaking my mind with a lot of his posts.

[BNL]

Guys no posts for 19 hours? Seriously?

[BNL]

I'm not really impressed by Esp's response.
But I do agree that the wagon formed really unusually.

UNVOTE: Espeonage
VOTE: Myloninja13

[BNL]

Mastina's posts also don't sit well with me.

She went into hiding for a while

Yeah you don't know me so I'll give you a pass on this, but.

Never make this accusation again.

It has NO place in a mafia game.

I know that lurking is NAI. The lurking part was combined with the next part.

there were no change in her reads.

...But there were?

Really? Iirc your first page reads were Awoo Mylo KO scum. Your latest reads stayed the same. Correct me if I'm wrong about this.

I also find it funny how she calls Mylo out for white knighting me and not driving the wagon off me when I see that she's doing the same thing.

Except I

have

been trying to drive the wagon off of you?

Like.

Calling the wagon the literal worst wagon I've ever seen in my entire mafia career is a little hard to top, in terms of trying to drive the wagon elsewhere.

Hmm? I guess this is a perception issue then.

[BNL]

Implosion, I understand Espeonage's case on you, but it is complete trash. He is saying that your 400 contradicts your 422, because you said that you were ignoring the previous posts in the thread and yet you still were forcing Espeonage to read.

Didn't like how Mara "I need flips to proceed", but KO's intent to hammer pinged me hard as I don't recall him stating a scumread on Esp. Really awkward.
Let's not end the Day before hearing what Pine has to say, please.

Also I have no idea what Awoo is doing at this point.

[BNL]

BNL have you played with or witnessed the almighty mastina in action before now?

As in previous games? Nope. I have only played a game where she was scum on the fallout shelter.

[BNL]

Why intent to hammer but after he's off L-1 you didn't vote him?

[BNL]

Why intent to hammer but after he's off L-1 you didn't vote him?

Cause I thought the worst would revote then I fell asleep

I gladly would for asking questions that have obvious answers

Tell me how the answer to that question was obvious?

[BNL]

UNVOTE: Myloninja
VOTE: Kokichi Oma
That intent to hammer was super awkward. Also he has been throwing shade everywhere without giving any townreads.

If it comes down to it, I think I'm more inclined to vote Awoo than Espeonage. I'm reading them as leaning scum from their posts, but the quickwagon on Esp worries me. If someone can talk me out of quickwagon arguments I can vote there too. However, I believe 4 days is still sufficient time to build a wagon.

[BNL]

FTR I think that KO scum ties into Espe scum for the intent. It has the "scum trying to gain towncred" feel.

[BNL]

Ms Marangal not much here. interacted with BNL in 198, so we can read into that after we FLIP THAT SUCKA TODAY.

I was rereading Awoo iso when this caught my eye, because 198 wasn't an interaction of Mara with me. Awoo, care to clarify on this?

I just went to skim some Awoo Isos from other games, but it was inconclusive as I've never seen Awoo post in a game like he is posting here.

[BNL]

Awoo post in a game like he is posting here

To clarify, by these posts I mean Awoo's last four posts. It's him describing what is happening in the game while also squeezing in "BNL is scum" into his post. I generally see these hard tunnels as scummy but I know some players are just bad like this and I've been proven wrong before.

[BNL]

Actually sure
UNVOTE: Kokichi Oma
VOTE: Awoo

[BNL]

Awoo I am going to have to agree with Wisdom implosion and the worst about you. I don’t see you say anything that helps the game if you are town.

Like, I don’t see you pushing your strongest scumread, I don’t see you trying to find scum elsewhere, and I don’t see you defending yourself even. All I see is you reacting to pressure.

[BNL]

I think Awoo is just trolling you guys now. I think it's town and I was wrong earlier. :/

You are going to have to do some explaining here because I don’t see what you mean by trolling.

[BNL]

@Awoo

Why can’t scum townread you?

[BNL]

I'm too tired to make in depth thoughts right now, but I'll leave this here:

I liked Awoo's 602 which shows willingness to cooperate with town, and I want to see Awoo's updated reads to make a conclusion of him.

I am pretty terrified of flashwagoning at this stage of the game. If we are creating extra wagons I'd prefer Kokichi Oma, but I also support a Wisdom wagon as I do not townread him.

[BNL]

Worst who do you want to lynch instead?

[BNL]

I still want to lynch Awoo.

But at this point I'm really tempted to flashwagon someone like Kokichi or Mylo.

[BNL]

@BNL what's your take on Awoo's read readjustment post?

Actually I don't quite remember anymore. I had issues with some of the reads, especially the read on Espe considering how it is so predicated on the VT thing.

I feel like I'm getting tired at this point, and despite being so close to deadline I think a flashwagon is the best way to proceed with the game. Is there anyone you'd like to flashwagon?

[BNL]

It's like because the game is so near deadline but the game is stalled it could be an indication that all major wagons are on town.
My preferred is Kokichi, or Mylo for him responding to his name but not actually doing anything.

[BNL]

I'm a Town police.

viewtopic.php?p=8686672#p8686672

[BNL]

What it does:

I choose a person on Day 1. I choose Cop or Vig on Day 2, and the action processes on Night 2.

My action is confirmable on Night 2.

[BNL]

Not voting Espeonage until he comes back, or until its very close to deadline, as I'll be there until deadline.

Any suggestions on who I should cop/vig?

[BNL]

Just a note that I won't necessarily be shooting in who you suggest because I will need to maintain a level of uncertainty of who I shoot.

[BNL]

Esp you have a high chance of getting lynched here so I need your final reads.

Also Tw, Awoo was someone in my target pool so I would need your input on why I should not target him

[BNL]

OK the above post is really bad.
VOTE: Espeonage

L-2

pEdit: @693

[BNL]

Also I'm not sure how my role got twisted but it's a Cop or Vig. Not necessarily Cop.

[BNL]

^Thats L-1

I like this lynch but please don't hammer without intent because I can't change my target after the lynch

[BNL]

^Thats L-1

I like this lynch but please don't hammer without intent because I can't change my target after the lynch

Good job Kokichi

[BNL]

I'm not scumreading implosion at all

[BNL]

In my first and only game with Wisdom he was scummy and had a large wagon on him and was also applying pressure hard as implosion described, but he was obvtown in the neighbourhood with me.

I definitely see a lack of it this game, but I'm not willing to call it scummy off one game of meta and a 1.5 year gap.

[BNL]

Wisdom dying is definitely weird.
Either way he died, it makes me want to suspect Implosion more.

And in retrospect KO’s hammer was a blessing because I was going to switch to target Wisdom

[BNL]

VOTE: Kokichi Oma

All his talking about hammering Espeonage feels like a grab for towncred, considering how little he has talked about Esp.

[BNL]

@Implosion
Why is Pine scum and not null?

[BNL]

I really dislike the above post. I find that tunnels through more than one day are scummy.

Its Day 2, you surely have better reads now. Have you actually read the game?

[BNL]

Kokichi please claim

[BNL]

UNVOTE: Kokichi

[BNL]

Ok so I thought about this but I believe there is no disadvantage by saying this:

I am targeting Kokichi. Don't lynch him today, then I will kill him tonight and,

-If he's scum, good
-If he's town, he can kill someone else

[BNL]

Ok so I thought about this but I believe there is no disadvantage by saying this:

I am targeting Kokichi. Don't lynch him today, then I will kill him tonight and,

-If he's scum, good
-If he's town, he can kill someone else

Can you PM and ask? I don't think a vig shot works with my role just lynching.

What do you mean just lynching?

[BNL]

VOTE: Kokichi

Awoo, get a hobby that isn't located halfway up my ass.

I have already said that I am going to vig Kokichi tonight and I cannot change my shot so please unvote.

[BNL]

VOTE: Pine

Someone please Doc me tonight

[BNL]

I feel a need to point out that if I'm killed my kill fails. It happened in the game I got my role from.

Also I change my mind about Pine. He's probably a bad lynch.
UNVOTE: Pine
VOTE: implosion

[BNL]

Pine is town because I've realised what has been going on.

With Kokichi and Pine out, you and Mylo are my strongest scumreads.

Scumread on implosion is based on Wisdom death and EOD wagons.

[BNL]

we should probably just like lynch the scum

But I can’t shoot anyone other than Kokichi.

[BNL]

Kokichi's actions after the tracker claim and my claim are pretty obvious scum. Since many players are in favour of it I'll reconsider lynching him over me shooting him.

Also,
UNVOTE: implosion
Inclined to believe his claim for now.

[BNL]

Actually Koki can you do us a favour and list all Mafia roles you have ever been?

[BNL]

Tbh I'm not considering town!Koki anymore, as the way he is acting now is basically what Esp did yesterday.

Still would like to shoot Koki to confirm myself as town, but I do see concern with potential scum roleblocker.

I feel like a list of Mafia roles for all players would be very useful here

VOTE: Myloninja13
Kind of conservative vote because I don't want to out another unclaimed. Will resent to vote Kokichi if other players still want it however.

[BNL]

Also Mylo having been PGO means that targeting him to test ascetic is NOT a good idea.

[BNL]

Game has been stalling. I’ll let Mastina and Ms Marangal get back into the thread.

Otherwise I’ll be voting Kokichi, just to get the day over with.

[BNL]

Hey, BnL. If youre JKd is your kill blocked do you know? Or does it still go through since its a day action?

Intent to start EnP when thats answered

Mod said that my role is being processed as a Night action (which is different from the game I got it from).

So presumably yes.

[BNL]

Implosion what do you think of Mastina?

[BNL]

Implosion what do you think of Mastina?

By this I mean, is Mastina bad town or scum to you?

[BNL]

Will post some thoughts on implosion vs Mastina later but I’ll say this now: There were things I liked and disliked from both of them, and things I agreed with and disagreed with as well. Will explain them when I make my proper post later

[BNL]

Will post some thoughts on implosion vs Mastina later but I’ll say this now: There were things I liked and disliked from both of them, and things I agreed with and disagreed with as well. Will explain them when I make my proper post later

Ok so I won't be quoting everything, I'll just be making notes as I read the thread.

Implosion not voting Kokichi is null, as many people have decided that optimal play is for me to vig Koki.

I also had the reaction to try looking for more potentially breadcrumbed claims by Implosion, but of course that'll be impossible.

I'd disagree that implo/Esp interactions can't be scum/scum. The VCA was really telling. The wagon shift at EOD from Esp->BNL->Esp was really weird and made no sense, and I thought scum were the ones who consistently stayed on a single wagon, which points to implo/Mylo.

I am not confirmed town yet. I will be only when (and if) my kill goes through tonight.

Implosion not understand the third investigative (the inno on Awoo that mastina received) seemed like playing dumb to me, but I've actually done a similar thing as town before.

Also 970 was terrible. Quite gut, but I think many other players would have felt it as well. Good way to explain it is that it's a slight shade throw at mastina.



I think I can vote implosion, but I'll think a bit more.

[BNL]

Also I remember that I once said Pine was town for reasons I didn’t want to mention, but I’ve realised this was wrong.

[BNL]

Also Mastina, why would scum!implosion prematurely claim?

[BNL]

Also 970 was terrible. Quite gut, but I think many other players would have felt it as well. Good way to explain it is that it's a slight shade throw at mastina.

I dont consider that scummy.

So I'm assuming with all the claims, heads are gonna roll tonight. I dont want to lynch kokichi because he said he'd do something. I also dont really want to lynch implosion anymore. (But I do think that he's the best positioned after a Wisdom NK and I also think he hasn't been towny today and I agree that Espe was a SUPER plausible bus)

I'm a willing vote on mutant, mylo, pine, or mastina.
If forced to choose I'd choose implosion over kokichi

1. Why is your reasoning against lynching Kokichi something other than "because BNL is shooting him tonight"?
2. Why don't you want to lynch implosion?

[BNL]

I pretty much agree that implosions “Night 2 vig” shade throw was really bad.

Waiting for EP to answer my questions before I vote implosion.

[BNL]

Also with a flipped Goon and Awoo having been only Goon as Mafia means Awoo is probably town even without the investivagtive.

[BNL]

Because I am vigging Kokichi tonight, and I can’t change who I shoot.

Like I get that Kokichi was acting obvious scum after the guilty and vig was claimed against him, and in fact I believe it is common knowledge that Koki is scum at this point, but lynching him is not the right play today.

[BNL]

^^As much as I’m seeing, Kokichi looks like he’s trolling right now. Can’t blame him because it’s his best play when there is a guilty against him but he’s not being lynched due to my vig.

^Thats up to you. Do you have any suggestions for an alternative lynch?

[BNL]

UNVOTE: Myloninja
VOTE: implosion

[BNL]

bnl is really building up to an implosion vote, huh?

1. Why is your reasoning against lynching Kokichi something other than "because BNL is shooting him tonight"?

okay then it's that. that's my reasoning

2. Why don't you want to lynch implosion?

because he's my friend and did some things that made me trust in him again but also i'd be fine with lynching implosion i guess

UGH

okay so

all of the ROLE related INFORMATION (there is way too much) is this:

Awoo: If scum, is goon
BnL: dude that committed to shooting Kokichi on D3
implosion: backup vig
Kokichi: gets to kill someone tonight if BnL shoots
mastina: who the fuck knows
worst: tracker or something

so like, we dont actually have any vigs? is all this right?

I was actually about to vote implosion right there, but I paused for a moment because your recent posts there read as scummy to me, for your reasoning against voting Kokichi is nothing related to whatever’s been discussed in thread and I found that scummy.

Which is why I pushed for a clarification. And your reply made so little sense that it sounds like your playstyle and I decided it was null.

[BNL]

Can we not talk about town!Koki at all?

This is not how town reacts to a faklse guilty against them.

And frankly I just see it as Koki posting minimally now simply because he knows he’s doomed and doesn’t want anything he said to be used as partner hunting material.

[BNL]

Read the points, I think the benefits of having only one scum alive outweigh having an extra vig shot and confirming myself as town.

UNVOTE: implosion

Intent to hammer Kokichi

I want mastina's thoughts on this before I hammer

[BNL]

Mafia may not perform a factional nightkill in addition to any other active abilities. This will be standardized

Mastina in the rules it is confirmed that scum cannot both action and kill in the same night.

[BNL]

Mafia may not perform a factional nightkill in addition to any other active abilities. This will be standardized

Mastina in the rules it is confirmed that scum cannot both action and kill in the same night.

Mastina I need you to read this

[BNL]

What do you think about the point that having one scum left makes them much more vulnerable to Tracker?

[BNL]

Wait actually since implosion claimed backup vig (not active) means that he is vulnerable to Tracker if he is scum

[BNL]

One thing you have missed is that if Kokichi is town and lynched he can vengekill someone on his wagon.

Not that I think he can flip town at all, just something I think you are missing from your analysis.

[BNL]

*sigh*
I’m now undecided again. There is still a little time left to deadline and I hope I can make my decision my then.

This has got to be one of the most awkward Days in the existence of MafiaScum.

[BNL]

So I’m going to make a compilation of stuff:

Benefits to vigging Kokichi Oma:
Extra kill
I confirm myself as town

Benefits to lynching Kokichi Oma:
Scum is limited to one action per Night
The worst can confirm people as town/scum


Now I’m thinking that the extra kill is not as valuable as I thought it was, because I am skeptical of another protective/vig existing in the game, and because the vig brings us to evens it doesn’t actually increase the number of town aligned kills at all.

Based on this, I’m actually inclined to lynch Kokichi Oma here. Let me reread stuff and the arguments again

[BNL]

Actually the tracker point only works for the next Night, so the last points for each category are pretty much the same, but

I definitely see the the first point of each in favour of lynching

[BNL]

VOTE: Kokichi Oma

Sorry Mastina, I think your analysis is off

[BNL]

Let's not massclaim for now. Unless we have a town roleblocker.

[BNL]

not doing anything til Awoo explains dat vote

Pretty sure he thinks that scum forgot to submit an action, and Mara fits that bill.

Awoo is mechanically cleared btw, because 2 Goon + 1 Encryptor vs Town is likely not balanced.

[BNL]

Okay so my reads have been godawful this game

Pine what was this about?

[BNL]

Actually there was a guilty on Kokichi, but half of us didn’t want to lynch him because I had what was essentially a delayed vig on Kokichi. Eventually we got round to lynching him because mutant and implosion made good points on why we should lynch scum immediately rather than letting one live even for just one night.

[BNL]

Awoo VT
Mylo VT
Implosion Backup Vig
The worst Tracker, who tracked Kokichi to Wisdom

[BNL]

Why did you vote implosion yesterday?

[BNL]

Mastina why are you saying that we have only one unclaimed PR left? We still have five unclaimed players.

I eventually plan to go over why I had a random townread on Pine on Day 2 and why I retracted it, but I still feel that now is an inappropriate time.

Also waiting for Marangal's replacement, I think they have nice things in store for us.

[BNL]

EP I know you’ve unvoted, but Mastina is town because of the way they approached the unknown investigative.

On an unrelated note,
VOTE: Pine

[BNL]

Yeah Pine you should get back here soon

[BNL]

I've no qualms about hammering other than just waiting for Gamma to get into the game and a claim.

Case and point for implosion being scum, right here.

Wow good catch. Yeah that hammering thing comes off as really scummy.

[BNL]

UNVOTE: Pine
Don't want him hammered while he's gone

[BNL]

Gamma I'd like to see the rest of your catchup.

[BNL]

Ehhh why is gamma getting wagoned, I quite liked his catchup

[BNL]

Pine have you caught up?

[BNL]

Pine are you still scumreading Awoo?

[BNL]

Pine are you still scumreading Awoo?

[BNL]

Mastina I can understand a Mara townread, but not a Pine townread. Can you walk through that with me?

[BNL]

Mastina so your Pine townread is that Espeonage and Kokichi don’t seem to have been coached by scum!Pune right?

[BNL]

And Gamma's lurking here really doesn't inspire any confidence whatsoever. My lingering Mara townread was the reason I didn't really want that slot but Gamma's been gone for 2 days after giving basically the easiest kind of analysis in the world to give as scum. The post that I'd been townreading Mara off of is pretty mediocre too.

Gamma, claim.

Actually this reminds me, I was once scum with Gamma in a game, and we reached a point where we were about to lose. Gamma began to flake out of that game and requested replacement.

Gamma hasn’t posted in more than two days, so I’d see a prod there and hopefully see more from him.

[BNL]

Gamma if you haven't realised we are very near deadline

You are at L-1, you need to claim

[BNL]

Nah, let's at least wait for a claim first.

[BNL]

But I can do this:

Intent to hammer

That'll hopefully change his mind about not claiming

[BNL]

Well i mean the game is somewhere around

Kill
EP
implosion

Maybe but probably dont kill
mylo
Mastina

Dont kill
Awoo
BNL
Mutant
Pine



... yeah I don't really see a world where lynch outside of EP implosion today

I also have a conspiracy theory where we need to keep implosion alive (btw im not dying at night ever so I can reveal it later)

Yeah, pretty much this. I townread everyone other than EP and implosion at this point.

VOTE: implosion L-2

[BNL]

I don't know what you mean by "qualifies as a stalled gamestate". This game has had a tendency to stall out a lot since yesterday. I can't say a ton after being wrong on maragnal (though literally everyone in the game except mastina was advocating for gamma's death iirc), but I will reiterate... the reasons that have been given to call Pine town simply aren't very good.

Lol scum implosion gave up

Somebody hammer

[BNL]

I'm not scum and I'm not giving up. It's just fucking pointless to talk to mastina and I've made myself clear on my thoughts.

Implosion is that really all you’re going to say after I’ve asked for a hammer on you?

[BNL]

I mean you are about to be lynched here and I still don't see you pushing your top scumread strongly, which is what I would expect from most townies about to be mislynched.

In fact I think making any cases you have should be automatic for you and I don't see why you aren't already doing so yourself.

[BNL]

Did you ever make a scum case on Pine? I think your read on Pine was PoE.

Also why would feeling to be ignored dissuade you from making your case?

[BNL]

UNVOTE: implosion

I want EP and Pine to check in before we lynch

[BNL]

mastina I really didn't want a hammer when two people haven't posted yet. Unless you are really confident with implosion being scum, it'll be rude to end the day so fast.

[BNL]

Ok so I weighed the possible options and I think I still like this

VOTE: implosion
L-1

[BNL]

Suppose I flip town.

What are your thoughts from there between Pine/EP or others?

I’m not really sure. Probably EP first, because I’m finding his defence of you to be quite weird.

I’m still scumreading you the most though, with one of the reasons being, you seemed like posturing to vote Gmma yesterday.

[BNL]

I still think that implosion is scummier than Pine, but I am seeing his cases against Pine and after a night over it I can see EP as town. I also don’t remember why I townread Pine in the first place.

Still prefer implosion lynch but Pine is my next suspect.

[BNL]

I would also like to ask Mastina, who would you think is scum if implosion flips town? Or are you so confident on implosion being scum that you won’t bother scumhunting outside of implosion unless and until he flips town?

[BNL]

If tomorrow happens we definitely massclaim there

[BNL]

I guess thats fine too.

And dw mastina, we are getting an implosion lynch today <3

[BNL]

Huh?

[BNL]

^also my thoughts

[BNL]

Also I definitely don’t see the soft

[BNL]

Lollllllllllllllll

[BNL]

Let's have EP come in here and claim and say whatever before we lynch him

[BNL]

No one has to feel bad about losing this game, except for the obe who faked an inno on mastina.

[BNL]

Yeah called it Mastina. You took me out for that reason, or for my claim?

Neither.
I took you out because I thought mutant was hiding behind you and I wanted mutant dead for my narrative.

But didn't you already know that mutant was fakeclaiming when he claimed a hide behind you?

[BNL]

On Day 5 I also had suspicions of EP not being scum because a Pine kill would have been suicidal for him when everyone talked about an EP/implo/Pine lynchpool yesterday

[BNL]

But you guys hammered so fast I wasn't able to post it >_>

EP self voting didnt help with that either.