Mini 567 - iPick - Game Over: The Stunning Conclusion

[Kison]

Yeah, request prodding after just over 24 hours on the last minute replacement into a 50 page game. You are a very considerate fellow, Lawrence!

Anyway, this game's confusing, but I've made a list of the roleclaims I've seen so far. This is what I've come up with :

1) Kison - None?
2) Xtoxm - Doctor (Napolean's Dynamite)
3) Adel - Doctor (Lord Voldemort)
4) Rogueben - Vigilante (Link)
5) shaft.ed - Triforce
6) Lawrencelot - One-Shot Governor

A few thoughts :

Unless someone else claims the kill on Vollkan, I don't see how Xtoxm could be scum alongside him, given that, well, I've never exactly seen scum kill their own partner at fucking night. Lawrence also used his governor ability. I've only ever seen that as a scum role once, and it worked differently. It's also possible that RB had a lynch immunity and that Lawrence claimed Governor as a cover.

I also notice Paradoxombie claimed that he'd die if he ever hit scum. Basically, such a role is a brilliant half/half protection/investigative tool with the ultimate penalty of death. Cleared Shafted N1. Since he flipped town, I'm banking on believing him, obviously. I am not ruling out that he suicided last night.

I am bothered by the Doctor triplets. Two, maybe, but three? Of the three, one obviously is dead, the other has claimed a scum kill, but I see nothing of the sort to help clear Adel. If I'm missing something, please point it out.

Roleclaiming is not exactly something I am very happy to see that I'm being forced into, but at LyLo and the claim-hungry growing, it may be impossible for me to avoid. However, I'm not going to roleclaim without precaution : My role PM indicates there's an alternative win condition for scum given that certain things happen. I may or may not know what that is. I may or may not know the level of completion, and I may or may not know if it's still possible to achieve. Point being, claiming

could

result in a premature game-end & town loss, regardless of our lynch successes. Given

that

warning, do you(primarily SHAFT.ED) want me to claim?

Correct any of my potentially horribly wrong conclusions. I've not read the entirety of this game, but I'm obviously wanted to get things moving so I am posting this now.

[Kison]

Some of us have these things called... real life responsibilities. Sadly, I am one of those people. I'm not stalling. Stalling does not benefit me, does not benefit you, does not benefit anyone. I've had trouble getting to my other games as well. You're just going to have to d-d-d-d-deal with it if I'm a little slow, Mufasa!

I am the "third"

Triforce

. *heavenly choirs sing* I see absolutely no reason to claim which one, as the only person who I feel should know can presumably figure that out without my help. Unless said person demands I state which one, I'm not going to. Sorry.

I was told I was a Mystery role. My predecessor targeted Shaft.ed during Night One. The result was interesting to say the least. I received four doubly linked arrows linking shaft'ed's name to other players. Like this :

- shaft.ed <--> Paradoxombie
- shaft.ed <--> Rogueben
- shaft.ed <--> Vollkan
- shaft.ed <--> Xyzzy

For Night Two, I had to choose my target mainly on a whim. I chose Lawrencelot. Again, I received arrows, but this time I only received two :

- Lawrencelot <--> Adel
- Lawrencelot <--> Hasdgfas

At first this didn't make sense. But as part of me making that claim list I noticed similarities between claimed/presumed night actions & the names linking to shaft.ed. Primarily : the PR's & paradoxombie, all linking back him. This would basically make me a Watcher, except, Rogueben claims that he he tried to Vig off Paradoxombie... So either he's lying, or I am completely wrong about what this shit means.

Also, if I'm right, then this is also very bad news for Adel, because she claims she protected SHAFT.ED but my arrows link her to Lawrencelot.

So why not just claim right off the bat? Because, like I said, there's a huge downside to the information I provided. The only reason I even considered revealing my role is because of what Paradoxombie said about Shaft.ed. This is a very big coin toss from my perspective.

Shafted - Do you know anything about the alternate win condition? Yes or no would work. There's a reason for my asking.

<3,

O' Mystical Triforce Kison

[Kison]

I never considered the tracker/watcher blend. If you targeted Roguebenny, then that makes sense. Also, Lawrence, regardless of when you roleclaim, if Adel doesn't die as a result of the self vote and you know she's lying as per my results, you need to state that at the very least.

I'd also like everyone to post their thoughts on who gave me which post restrictions D1 and where cicero's came from.

Obviously Vollkan was one of the people who gave you a PR yesterday. Since you received two, the other would have to be either Xyzzy or Paradoxombie. Probably the former. I have no idea where mine came from. All I know is that you didn't give it to me unless you're some kind of supercool surreptitious PR giving thief with double targeting capabilities. Also is possible it came from me except Lawrence did not receive one when I targeted him last night unless he is masking it very cleverly.

[Kison]

Adel, it depends on what's

convincing

you.

Shaft.ed : Yes, the win condition I spoke of is still very much valid as far as I can tell.

[Kison]

Lawrencelot : I don't really understand why you want me to go into the scum win condition when I've made it rather clear that doing so will cause more harm than good. Do I have an ability to prevent it? Maybe. Do the pegs have something to do with it? Maybe. Sorry but the reward of potentially confirming me as Town is not good enough of a reason for me to go into it any more than I have. Confirming me will do us good with lynch statistics, but all is for absolutely nothing if scum accomplish their

alternate

win condition. We have six players, presumably two scum. We lynch one and go to night with five, enough players to again bring the sun up with another shot in Lynch of Lose. Lynching me and tossing the dice on a blocked kill or dead scum overnight is a safer bet from where I stand.

The PR on me yesterday was not faked as I was notified of it upon replacing in. Cicero had to produce outrageous lies about Guardian. Where it came from, I don't know.

Shafted : I don't really see the

point

of me voting Adel, but whatever. Do you want me to vote and immediately unvote or keep it there? Lemme know.

<3,

Kison.

[Kison]

God DAMMIT Shafted.

[Kison]

*sigh*

Still want me voting Adel while you are still here?

[Kison]

No, worst case is we fucking lose because you told me to vote Adel. If I get a penalty vote then it will take two votes to lynch me once you're dead. You were player #6. When you die, we will go down to five. That changes the lynch requirement.

[Kison]

My posts in other games have been brief this morning, my toxic friend. I had to leave earlier but am here now. I'm writing up a post as I type this. Unvote me ASAP.

<3,

Triforce of Townieness

[Kison]

I'm wording what I say very carefully.

[Kison]

*refrains from smacking Xtoxm with sharp object*

[Kison]

First, I didn't mean to flip out on Shaft.ed last night, but his death changes a lot of things and puts us in a very bad position. On the good side, his death has now confirmed Lawrencelot. Since Xtoxm also has the plausible deniability form his kill on Vollkan, that leaves Rogueben and Adel from my perspective. Since this means Rogueben is not a Vigilante, it means we cannot win if we mislynch today. Which means, if you guys really are threatening to lynch me if I don't tell you about the alternate scum win condition, that getting into it is by demand is now the lesser of two evils.

Doesn't mean I'm telling you what it is. I'm confirming that telling you does not give any advantage, but I will answer Lawrencelot's questions.

Previously, my perspective was that Lawrencelot could be scum with Adel, and possibly Rogueben with one of the two. This left the door open that he was truly a Vigilante and could keep us going another day if he hit someone accurately. Also the possibility of Xtoxm protecting someone tonight with five players(since we had six before), meant we could also come up with an additional day in the game. This is now impossible, which is why I flipped out last night when Shaft.ed broke his PR(<3).

does the alternate win condition have something to do with the pegs?

No. It has nothing to do with the pegs as far as I can tell.

do you have an ability to prevent this from happening?

I do not have an ability designed to prevent this win condition from being fulfilled. I may or may not be able to trigger/prevent it indirectly. Confirming which will not help you. So, whatever it is you're looking for, I'm afraid I don't have it. Sorry.

Vote : Rogueben

Adel, please help me lynch your scumbuddy. Town, please get the hell off my wagon? Seriously, out of the three players who lack plausible deniability,

I am the only one who has proven that my role is what it claims to be.

[Kison]

Xtoxm, you are not one of the three players I'm talking about.

I'm talking about myself, Adel, and Rogueben. All three of us lack plausible deniability. You don't, because you are the only person who claims to have killed Vollkan. You being scum is therefore extremely unlikely.

[Kison]

Lawrence : Why do you think I am scum?

Also, simply because someone claims to control the pegs does not mean they do. And sadly we can't confirm it until

after

we lynch.

[Kison]

Killing the Triforce of Power? Blasphemy. Blasphemy. Blasphemy.

Get Rogueben tomorrow. He HAS to be the final scum.

[Kison]

Kison is here. 99.9% certain that Rogueben is scum. Standby.

[Kison]

I think it's pretty obvious that Rogueben is lying about his Vigilante role. He claimed a kill N1 and that kill mysteriously failed. His N2 kill landed on the doc who claimed he'd die if he targeted scum during the night. Lawrencelot told him to Vig me off last night. I know for a fact he didn't.

My Target : Rogueben.
Results :

- Rogueben <--> Lawrencelot
- Rogueben <--> Lawrencelot

I presume this means both Lawrence & Rogueben targeted the other. So. Chewbacca. Want to explain this?

I targeted Paradox last night, he doesn't appear dead though. I don't know whether that means I was blocked, redirected or protected or what.

Just letting you know I targetted hasdgfas last night. I know that may throw a spanner in the works a little.

RB: Yes, lynch Adel, and if she's scum, kill Kison. If Adel is town, kill Kison too if you can. I hope Kison has no special bus driver role or something like that.

[Kison]

Gone till Monday! May or may not be able to post before then.

[Kison]

I see the new posts and read a couple while I was away, on an undersized laptop. However, I'm too tired even to find the strength to be make smartass remarks . Nothing I've glanced over has really convinced me of anything, but, Rogueben, you did say something about checking with Guardian about something. What'd that yield?

I will have a response tomorrow. This is a quickie. I'm tired. Someone shoot me with some sleeping drugs. Thanks.

[Kison]

Kison - Why are you not voting for RB? Seriously...You know he's scum...

Because, Xtoxm, this game

doesn't make sense

. I left a .1% window that he is not scum, and I'm a very cautious type of guy. Discussion does not hurt. His insistence that he targeted me only makes me more certain, however. For one, I am alive yet I have no self protecting ability that I am aware of and you have not stated that you protected me. Secondly, I see two arrows linking him to a player he claims not to have targeted. And judging by Lawrencelot's reaction, my results contradict what Rogueben is claiming. Convenient for a guy who has failed to provide us a unique dead body 3 days in a row when he is supposedly

forced

to kill.

The only solution I can think of is that Kison targeted you and Xtoxm protected you. This prevented you from dying and also provided Kison with the result that you targeted me.

Are you implying that my ability is triggered on the same person I "kill"? Because if that's the case then how would I have gotten my previous two results without my target dying? I don't get it.

I think Kison is scum with an ability, yes. The other scum so far have both had abilities so I think it is likely that Kison has an ability too.

We know Vollkan had a Post Restricting ability, as his name was "PR Giver". My results indicate that Rogueben targeted Lawrencelot last night. I suppose it's possible from the perspective of of the others that I could have figured the results out even had I targeted Lawrencelot. However, that is not what happened nor do I see the point. Again, I targeted Lawrencelot on the same night I replaced in and he neither died nor received a PR, so I'm not sure how they could have come from me even if I HAD targeted him.

Kison

is the

special

scum win still a threat? If not, could you tell me of it?

Yes, it's still possible to pull off.

Kison

would your

answer

be the same as

Rogueben's

if I ask you the same as him?

Win condition, in my own words : I win with the Town. The Town is also known as Things That Don't Make Sense Town. We win if one of two things happens : all scum of any sort are eliminated, or if some other condition causes Town to win.

My role PM does not go into any alternate Town win condition, but that does allude to the possibility of one existing.

Vote : Rogueben

If Xtoxm or Lawrence is scum, then I'm suing.

[Kison]

Where the hell did that come from?

[Kison]

Why's Rogueben getting two votes for one?

[Kison]

Yes, Xtoxm, my lengthy, observant posts indicate I haven't been paying attention to anything. No, I was just GONE for the weekend. I miss things. So do you.

[Kison]

"Funeral arrangements have been made for Rogueben."

I'm guessing that is it. Thanks for the help, Xtoxm!

[Kison]

Yeh but I find it hard to believe you've missed this theme that's been consistent throughout the

entire

game.

Dude, I have been in this game for a grand total of two weeks. Give me a break.

[Kison]

Whatever, brosef. Next time you miss something I'll be sure to be a wench about it.

[Kison]

Yes, I committed SUCH a sin by failing to draw the link between what Guardian said yesterday and Rogueben receiving two votes today. Did you know that Lawrencelot failed to draw that line as well when he voted Rogueben earlier today? No? Maybe you should give him a hug as well.

Summary : Quit being retarded.

[Kison]

Yes. I said this in post 1449.

[Kison]

And no, scummypoo, I'm not telling you what it is.

[Kison]

Whatever Tox-Tox. I'm so incompetent because I'm surprised at a subtle game mechanic. Good thinking there, stud.

Lawrencelot - I recall the following, but I may have missed some. Someone else confirm/correct these.

~~Day One~~
None?

~~Day Two~~
Shafted - Nibbler Comments
Shafted - Haiku
Cicero - Outrageous lies about Guardian

~~Day Three~~
Shafted - Nibbler Comments (continuation)

~~Day Four~~
Lawrencelot - Current

[Kison]

Aims as in night targets? Claimed night targets only or including my own results?

[Kison]

~~Night One~~
Xtoxm -> Vollkan
Lawrencelot -> Vollkan
Shaft.ed -> Rogueben
Adel -> Cicero/Kison
Rogueben -> Paradoxombie
Xyzzy -> Shaft.ed
Kison -> Shaft.ed
Paradoxombie -> Shaft.ed
NabakovNabakov -> <No Claim?>
Vollkan -> <No Claim?>
hasdgfas -> <No Claim?>

~~Night Two~~
Xtoxm -> Shaft.ed
Lawrencelot -> Adel
Shaft.ed -> hasdgfas
Adel -> Shaft.ed
Rogueben -> hasdgfas
Kison -> Lawrencelot
Hasdgfas - <No Claim?>
Paradoxombie - <No Claim?>

~~Night Three~~
Rogueben -> Kison
Xtoxm -> Lawrencelot
Kison -> Rogueben
Lawrencelot -> Rogueben

[Kison]

Those are claimed night actions only.

[Kison]

Assuming the PR's were triggered the night before they first appeared, this would be the triggered times for the four we've seen so far :

~~Night One~~
Shafted - Nibbler Comments
Shafted - Haiku
Cicero - Outrageous lies about Guardian

~~Night Three~~
Lawrencelot - Current

[Kison]

I have no clue about the pegs.

And I'm pretty sure those would be Night One - the one which came right after Day One. Didn't those 3 PR's show up during Day Two?

[Kison]

It's not been at all subtle, it's been quite obvious throughout the game, as well as discussed on D1, if you read it.

Dude, I have been in this game for a grand total of two weeks. Give me a break.

Like I said, Toxic boy, I missed that mechanic, and it was not obvious to me. If you think I'm a horrible, incompetent player because of that, then your insult has been heard. But let's move on. You made your point. I made mine.

[Kison]

That's not what I was doing at all. I'm not trying to insult. I think you are more scum for it. And now you are trying to twist it.

You never made

that

clear. And since I think this is an absurd thing to base my alignment on considering the fact that I am

not

a consistent player in this game, would have to wade through 50 pages(1,250 posts) thoroughly in the short time I've been here, I think you are looking far too deep into this subject. So yes, I interpreted it as an insult because I don't quite understand why you are so bent on this. It was a very simple, ultimately harmless, mistake in a very COMPLEX game, and one that Lawrencelot, proven Townie, also made. So no, this does not indicate that I am scum. Contrary to what you also said previously, I have been paying very close attention to this game, which is evident by the posts I have made so far.

But I don't know what you'd have me say. The game is up to you and Lawrencelot. If you truly think I am scum because I missed the origin of Rogueben's double vote(which has absolutely no benefit to me as scum over me as town), then have a go at it. I can't really convince you of the idiocy of what you're suggesting beyond what I already have.

[Kison]

Ok, apologies if you thought I was insulting you, that was not my intention.

It's fine. I wasn't exactly shedding tears anyway.

And yes, it is ultimatley harmless, but it shows that you weren't paying attention to when Law did it.

No. Xtoxm, that's not true. I did catch Rogueben's two-for-one vote when Lawrencelot did it. What I did not catch was the CAUSE of the double vote. In other words, I knew Rogueben was receiving two votes per voter(or whatever) but I hadn't attributed it to Guardian's comment about Rogueben's "funeral arrangements" the previous day. I thought that had to do with the proceeding Night and dismissed it from that point on.

[Kison]

What does your quote prove? I knew that Adel received two votes. But I did not know it was a consistent theme as you suggested. It happened once. When Guardian made the Rogueben comment, I did not know the same thing would happen.

So again. What does that prove?

[Kison]

"It happened once

by that time since I replaced in

"

[Kison]

I spot a wrong thing here. What is in bold does not have to be true, as he did not know I had a thing that needs an aim. Or did he?

I'm not sure how this twists your entire perspective of my alignment. Again, I am going to point to the fact that I targeted you with my mystery role during Night Two, right after I replaced in. Did you receive a PR Day Three? No, you did not. Did I

actually

target you Night Two? Yes, I did. How do we know this? Because the results I provided were accurate, prior to you ever claiming a night targeting ability.

So again, I am going to ask, what has twisted your perspective of my alignment?

The alternate win condition : I guess I have no choice. I'm tired of explaining the lack of benefit of my your knowing this. But the game's out of my hands. Your call, my doing.

The win condition is a series of targeting or "aims" as Lawrencelot likes to call it. This makes sense given my role. I previously said I did not have a role specifically designed to prevent this condition from being met. This is true. My role allows me to obtain some insight as to the progress of this condition, but I am largely left in the dark and am forced to rely on the information given by others. However, I do have a part to play in this condition, which would somewhat allow for the prevention of this condition being met, but it's easily overridden by the actions of others(and has been). This'll make sense in a moment.

The condition in my own words has two parts to it :

1) Link must target each aspect of the Triforce
2) One aspect of the Triforce must target Link.

This has been completed in part as far as I can tell. Shaft.ed targeted Rogueben N1, according to both my results and what he has claimed. This completed the controllable aspect of this condition. Rogueben's results, as far as he claims, indicate he has targeted only me. However, I know this to be false at least in light of Night Three. His other two results are said to have hit two non Triforce members, but again, I cannot trust this especially given that I know he is scum.

Courage -> Link

Wisdom -> Courage

Power -> Courage

Power -> Link

*Link -> Power

I targeted him last night because I knew that our side of the condition had already been met. My targeting him should not affect the outcome.

This is why I was initially reluctant to roleclaim. If any Triforce/Link was scum, my results and/or knowledge of the condition gives insight into the level of completion of this condition. Guess what? Ding! Ding! Ding! It did. Guess what else? This doesn't help us, just like I said. This is especially bothering given that around the time Rogueben initially claimed Link, Xyzzy and Shafted hinted at having knowledge of Link.

In reality it is unlikely that this condition will be met. This requires Rogueben to have targeted Xyzzy during Night One and Shafted during Night Two. It's just as likely he tried hitting Shafted Night One and never had the opportunity to try for Xyzzy. But that doesn't matter. This information does

absolutely nothing

to benefit us aside from giving a heads up, yet that's too obvious of a play. Why give me insight of a win condition when I could prevent it from revealing it? Imagine if I'd revealed this yesterday, or better yet, Cicero on Day Two. No gain. Only loss.

So have a go at it. I'd still like Lawrencelot to actually think through what I said earlier.

[Kison]

Kison targets Lawrencelot N2.
Kison provides accurate results D3.
Lawrencelot does not receive PR D3.
Lawrencelot does not die N2.

Kison claims he targeted Rogueben N3.
Rogueben does not receive PR D4.
Lawrencelot receives PR D4.
In order for Kison to give PR to Lawrencelot as scum, he would have to have the ability to PR, kill, & watch/track.

Rogueben failed his N1 kill.
Rogueben failed to provide a unique kill N2, implying the possibility of failure.
Rogueben failed his N3 kill.
Rogueben's claimed target contradicts that of Kison's results.

My role is proven not only to be valid, but not to be accompanied by post restrictions. Rogueben's role has failed three times out of three so far. I don't really know how much clearer this can be. He's scum.

[Kison]

Night Two : Xtoxm -> Shaft.ed

Shafted received a PR during Day Two, not Day Three. So I don't think it was you, Xtoxm.

[Kison]

And I think you're scum because you refused to vote Adel yesterday, when it was clear she was scum.

If you "knew" I was scum because of this then why did you think it was Rogueben earlier? This is behavioral. I didn't vote Adel yesterday when Shaft.ed asked me to because of the penalty I thought it would present. Again this relates to the "themed" penalty vote I didn't quite get. When Shaft.ed messed up his post restriction and was about to die, he had just asked me to vote Adel. However, we were in LyLo. My expectation was that the lynch requirement would be dropped down to three because we had six players. After Shafted died, one would think it would go down to 3 to lynch because we had five players. It didn't, so ultimately it didn't matter.

I believe this is because you are scum and with the knowledge that you were going to be vigged, your only chance was to try and get RB lynched.

Yeah? Then why did my "scumbuddy" Adel try to get YOU lynched? This is inconsistent with the goal you think I had.

RB knew that the scumpair was (from his point of view, assuming town) you and Adel. He was consistent throughout of being willing to vote either of you. Despite his little pisstake on me being scum.

Bullshit. He was trying to gun for

you

on top of us despite clearly contradictory evidence suggesting you are Town.

So that's why I find it hard to see Kison being town, despite all he's claimed.

You mean all that I've proven? My role : proven. I couldn't possibly know what I do without having what I say I do. This doesn't prove I'm Town. But it proves I am not giving post restrictions. It proves I do have the ability I claim. And topping this off with Rogueben's behavior and lack of evidence to back what he has claimed HE has, I think you can make your own judgement on this one, as you had before.

[Kison]

Also, it's also very feasable that a scum was told this alternate win condition. Sounds kinda right, y'know.

Probably. The simple fact is that I don't know and was not going to risk making the wrong, unbeneficial move of revealing the information.

[Kison]

In case you didn't understand the first part of what I said :

~~6 players. 4 to lynch.~~
Shaft.ed asks Kison to vote Adel.
Kison asks for clarification.
Shaft.ed provides clarification. Messes up his PR and is about to die.
Kison realizes that voting Adel would give him a penalty vote.

Shafted dies.
~~5 players, 4 to lynch~~

In typical mafia, it should be 5 players, 3 to lynch. This is what I expected. With a penalty vote on me and two scum roaming around, this would allow them to force a lynch on me and win the game.

[Kison]

Yes it does matter. Think about it for a minute.

5 players. 3 to lynch.

Kison votes Adel.
Kison receives 1 self vote.
Adel votes Kison.
Rogueben votes Kison.

Kison is lynched.
Game goes to night.

Town loses. Game over.

[Kison]

Because Lawrencelot requested that he hammer.

RB: Yes, lynch Adel, and if she's scum, kill Kison. If Adel is town, kill Kison too if you can. I hope Kison has no special bus driver role or something like that.

This was part of his plan to test Rogueben. It's perfect from my perspective. If Rogueben either refuses to hammer or vig me off, it's evidence he's backing down in fear of lynching. He passed the first test and failed the second. Were he to vig me off last night, it would leave no other suspects. Lo and behold, I am still alive in LyLo, and very much a suspect.

[Kison]

But first

Kison

needs to

explain

this and this:

2) One aspect of the Triforce must target Link.

Which one?

Any

. This is why it didn't matter that I targeted Rogueben after I saw that Shafted had.

targeted him last night because I knew that our side of the condition had already been met. My targeting him should not affect the outcome.

I do not get this. It should have?

Yes. See above. The requirement is that :

1) Link targets all three pieces of the Triforce.
2) ANY ONE aspect of the Triforce reciprocates that targeting.

Shaft.ed targeted Rogueben(AKA Link) before I had. Shaft.ed is part of the Triforce. Since he targeted Rogueben before me, he already completed the Triforce's end of the scum win condition.

This information does absolutely nothing to benefit us aside from giving a heads up, yet that's too obvious of a play.

Wrong. It helps me way more than those two lists, though that helped me too.

Ok. Well. I do not see how, but I guess I'll take your word for it. As long as we do not no-lynch we should be fine unless Rogueben can day-target and met the other conditions.

[Kison]

What is "pretty neat" about my night targets?

And Xyyzy just died before he got a chance to target him.

Huh? Do you not understand the condition? Rogueben would have to target Xyzzy. For all I know he already has.

[Kison]

What Four? You mean Xyzzy, Rogueben, and Shaft.ed? You DO realize I AM one of the Triforce, right? I don't know that I can target myself, so I'm not exactly sure how you think me being scum with this condition would work.

[Kison]

Missing something that big is unacceptable.

[Kison]

Rogueben's Tapdance



Rogueben, I admire your aura of calmness. But the points you're raising don't hold...

I have been thinking about this and the only explanation I can come up with is that Kison is telling the truth about the condition in every aspect except for the fact that I am scum.

The condition does not state that Link is scum. In fact, it doesn't really imply it other than the fact that your actions combined with those of the Triforce can allow for scum to win by default.

This means that scum win if I target all three members of the triforce and at least one of the triforce target me then scum will win.

Yes.

Actually thinking about that it also makes sense as to why Kison didn't want to say what it was. If he did then the condition would be voided because then I would make sure that it wasn't.

1) I am Town. I withheld this information because I not only do not know whether or not you know what this condition is, but because it will not prevent this condition from being met if you are scum. Narrowing down the scope to you being scum by default only reinforced the decision. My roleclaim benefited you because it gave you insight into not only who I was(Triforce) but my links from Night One on Shaft.ed.

2) If I was scum, then your claimed night targets would let me know that this condition ALREADY IS VOIDED. Think about it... These are your claimed night targets :

1) Rogueben -> Paradoxombie
2) Rogueben -> hasdgfas
3) Rogueben -> Kison

First, if I am scum, then I would know you are telling the truth about these targets because you'd have no reason to lie as Town. Secondly, Xyzzy was lynched Day Two. Since your previously claimed night targets did not mention him, then I, as scum, would know that this condition was already voided because he can no longer be targeted. The same goes for Shaft.ed after he was killed.

[Kison]

Xtoxm, I don't know if this is the case, but if you think my moments of sarcasm are what make me scummy, then I suggest you take a look at Mafia 69, where I was a pain in the neck, but Town to the T. Just the way I am. Can't help it.

[Kison]

Shaft.ed

knew of a town win: all three parts have to target Link on a night, and then town wins. He thought it was weird that

Xyzzy

did not know of this, and

Kison

does not know of it as well (so he says).

Kison

, can you

explain

this?

Xtoxm

, what do you think of this? This is also why I saved

Rogueben

, by the way.

From my perspective the answer is pretty obvious. You're saying the Town's win condition is that all 3 aspects of the Triforce target Link? Xyzzy and Shafted are Town. I know I am Town. That means we could have broken the game with a simple mass claim. But Xyzzy apparently didn't get the same info, and I have a huge disincentive for role claiming. Top that off with the fact that from my own perspective at least, Shaft.ed could have been scum trying to trigger a scum win condition. I'd be hesitant following his lead without knowing he was Town(which was not possible until Day Three).

[Kison]

But there's something probably not completely right with that idea...

The threat of roleblockers, which we wouldn't know whether or not exist by that time.

So you think the town win was true? There was a way for town to win, and for scum too? Why would the mod tell

Shaft.ed

to let

Rogueben

be his aim, while that is good for the scum win?

I don't know if it's true, Lawrencelot. Obviously I believe Shaft.ed was told of it. I was told of a scum condition. Could both be red herrings? I guess.

Your question : Why would Guardian give a mutually beneficial requirement?

1) I don't know
2) Maybe because it doesn't make sense
3) Maybe because it causes confusion and chaos
4) Maybe because the Triforce -> Link requirement is the easiest part of the scum condition to complete.

[Kison]

5) "I voted maximum bastardry." - xtoxm

[Kison]

Yes, it was great fun. I spent the first few days trying to figure out what the hell was going on. I think I even had a nightmare or three. It's been a great roller coaster ride. Fortunately I'm not scum, though I know that means nothing just yet.

Good game.

[Kison]

Vote : Lawrencelot

[Kison]

Just for the record I am officially confused.

[Kison]

He couldn't use any words with more than one syllable, except for one word, unless it was unvote/a player's name. Notice he italicized any multi-syllable words.

[Kison]

Shafted's best post was when he broke his PR and cursed Nibbler. Made me laugh.

[Kison]

I take it back. THIS was his best post :

I fucking hate my
fucking shit post restrictions
Nibbler has nice teeth

In all honesty though, you did great with that. That haiku PR in itself was 10 times worse than the one I gave to Lawrencelot, and you made it through an entire day without dying.

I'm a bit sad about the loss. I had my hopes way too high when RB was lynched. And the irony is I didn't expect the double vote to do me in. I expected that damn angel protection to be my loss. But oh well, just a game, and it was plenty fun.

Scum win condition : Lie. Obviously. Cicero had initially wanted to reverse the win condition in our PM. I was going to maintain this plan, but when I roleclaimed, I needed to prove that my ability was not just something I made up. This required claiming results from someone who not only was next to unlynchable, but would make the idea of not wanting to reveal the condition justified from my perspective as a Townie. Needless to say I messed that up, and didn't realize Xyzzy would have had to have been targeted for that to make sense. So I completely winged it when Lawrencelot forced it out of me, knowing I had to justify Cicero gunning for Xyzzy, not wanting to roleclaim, and my maintaining a no-reveal on the condition. So I made a condition that had less to do with the actions of the Triforce and more to do with the actions of Link. I was fairly certain I was going to get lynched when I posted that condition.

Regardless of the outcome, I had a lot of fun with this. I especially loved the Triforce/Link aspect of the game. Day 4 was a total roller coaster ride.

I had a nice long post mailed to myself that I was going to post w/ pictures , but Guardian locked the thread right after I finished it.

Lastly, balefiring Xtoxm back to '75 was enough to satisfy my bloodlust.

GG to all. Sorry team!

[Kison]

Lawrencelot :

1446 : forgot, someone
1472 : someone, question
1538 : target, explain

I

think

the one we missed was the first one.

[Kison]

Xtoxm was scary because he was unpredictable and way more aggressive than I anticipated. He was a piece of work to fend off.

(that's a good thing)

I had an attack of "mafia is stupid and meaningless".

And you survived this attack, riiight? Because Mafiascum will be less entertaining without you?