Unstable Mafia - Game Over

[RCEnigma]

Almost50 replaces good

Should've joined with AP, but I'll play it as A50.

If anyone knows I was joining it's AP. Hmmm.

[RCEnigma]

Hi Vedith I'm RCE and I'm reading.

[RCEnigma]

Dark. Which ties niceline into my first read!

A50! Probably town, this should scare every other townie as much as it scares me.

Overkill probably town 51 is especially good for the wrong reasons and reasons that might not even be real. Worm wasn't at L-2 at any point btw.

Demonlord, probably scum.

Teacher is here. Creature is him. Vedith is also him.

Trying to decide if Temporal is just gullible at the moment...I may test it later.

[RCEnigma]

I'm n0 watcher and no one visited Worm.

Lol.

Shadow in the night, Vedith the voyeur. Kinda hot.

[RCEnigma]

Why lynch Vedith after we lynch the worm this could be a perfect mafia victory.

I can see Scum Overkill doing this 100% though. If it weren't for those damn town posts.

[RCEnigma]

Why are you so sure?

The claim is so forced it looks like a square peg jammed in a round hole. Not only that but the rest of your ISO doesn't fit.

You believe Overkill?

I'm inclined to believe it especially after Vedith's outrageous roleclaim.

This is some pretty strong wordage for this early in the game. Vedith's roleclaim being 'outrageous' in particular. Are you sure night 0 mechanics don't exist? No I would think not if you believed Overkills claim initially. Do you have information that undermines his claim? That's what Vedith's counterclaim to Overkill would have meant.

What made Overkills claim better? Or more believable rather.

For the record I wouldn't believe either claim but that's not the point.

[RCEnigma]

Vedith's claim of n0 Watcher looks like it was made up on the spot to discredit Overkill's n0 Cop claim. Not only am I not inclined to believe Vedith, I think Vedith is scum trying to paint Overkill in a bad light. Overkill would be a viable wagon if Vedith's roleclaim turns out to be true.

Why are you taking Overkills claim at face value? I like that Vedith discredited it. It shouldn't be credible in the first place.

[RCEnigma]

A50! Probably town, this should scare every other

townie

scum as much as it scares me.

You got mixed up. Your role is red. How do I know you might ask. Easy. I got the "good" role PM, so yours must be the "bad" one.

Ahhh yeah I remember you said you got that silent mafia day vig in scumchat, whatever that is.

[RCEnigma]

No more townreads for A50 he's reached his quota.

[RCEnigma]

i was ridiculing the fact that your posts are shit

To what purpose? Why won't you tell him what was wrong (from your PoV) instead? Why would anyone want to "ridicule" someone's posts that weren't even directed at them?

because the dude was getting scum read by open claimed cop and was playing bad

Next person that says overkill is cop is getting deathtunneled.

Also this 1v1 is pretty useless and looks more and more like scum theater the longer it lasts.

[RCEnigma]

You almost had me on board with a no lynch. But I'm a man of my word do VOTE: Vedith

Demon is a better vote but my hands are tied.

[RCEnigma]

Deal, you are my vote now. So vote demon and all is well.

[RCEnigma]

I can think of at least 8 ways to kill a worm.

[RCEnigma]

I can think of at least 8 ways to kill a worm.

I can think of 3:

1- Dipping it in alcohol
2- Locking it in a can after blowing cigarette smokes in it
3- Sinking it in certain sticky liquids

That's why drinking, smoking and having lots of sex is GOOD for your health.

On a serious note though, do you think it a good idea to out a VT role, gave Worm target it (and die), and then scum shoot the new PR? I mean, IF this role is for real them he played it in the worst possible way EVER.

I agree with all of these.

I was going to agree that having a VT claim would be terrible but I think we can use it. Idk what this super power entails but we can validate worms claim resulting in his death and at worst we'd have an IC out of it.

[RCEnigma]

VOTE: DemonLord

It's ok that you're voting me. I'm siding with overki11, so I was probably gonna vote you anyways.

vote:vedith

Overkill isn't going after Vedith so why would you have to take sides in a nonexistent 1v1?

[RCEnigma]

Also consider Vedith's vote on you as my own.

[RCEnigma]

at worst we'd have an IC out of it.

Im new to the bastard side of things, but I could see a scum recruiter too. Part of why Im not engaging in his game, but trying to get Worm engaged in ours.

That outs himself does it not? He's claimed death on recruitment.

[RCEnigma]

Now you're making me paranoid...

[RCEnigma]

On a serious note though, do you think it a good idea to out a VT role, gave Worm target it (and die), and then scum shoot the new PR? I mean, IF this role is for real them he played it in the worst possible way EVER.

MR 49 THAT"S WHY ALL VTs MUST CLAIM!! SCUM WASTES NKs TARGETTING AT VT GROUP TRYING TO GET SUPERVT!! FREES UP OTHER PRs!!

No that's not how this works.

[RCEnigma]

Ahh is that what teacher meant? I think work is genuine but I thought teacher was hinting that work could be scum recruiter not that scum would have a recruiter to counter him.

[RCEnigma]

Literally no one is pushing to Lynch worm....wut?

[RCEnigma]

temporal is keep butting his head onto me like laboon headbutting on the Red Line. Whenever I want to vote on him, however, 0verk1ll comes in doing absolutely nothing making me not want to vote laboon

Dunno what any of this even means.

[RCEnigma]

I was wary of Teacher bringing up our newbie game, I figured when I repped in Scum!Teacher would try and pocket me.....but damnit I'm gonna be pocketed. Starting to think Lich could be town.

Demon can go, if you guys could start voting at anytime that would be nice. His busywork isn't even busywork he's literally coasting and goading town arguments imo.

[RCEnigma]

Almost50, overkill, Teacher, Creature would be a strong town block, lean on lich. Worm doesn't matter, no one touches Volxen today though I suspect he could be scum.

Roster, Vedith, dt are all meh slots and demon is obvscum.

[RCEnigma]

and a weird back off from thunderdoming with me. why wagon a lurker?

Is scum less likely to lurk? Is there town content in his posts? If not what's the point of defending him?

[RCEnigma]

No, I meant you were jumping on me because you're scum.

Pignash, what are you talking about?

Demonlord, I meant that you probably meant that you were the one being jumped on.

...what just happened here?

[RCEnigma]

No, I meant you were jumping on me because you're scum.

Pignash, what are you talking about?

Demonlord, I meant that you probably meant that you were the one being jumped on.

...what just happened here?

TIME to CHECK IP ADRESSES!!

The madman!

[RCEnigma]

Almost50, overkill, Teacher, Creature would be a strong town block, lean on lich. Worm doesn't matter, no one touches Volxen today though I suspect he could be scum.

Roster, Vedith, dt are all meh slots and demon is obvscum.

I get the pocketing paranoia, but think we just analyze alike. This list near mimics mine, including on players I hadnt commented on as much (Almost). I think the day we start to read different is the day I will suspect you. On which note, the major difference in our reads is 0verki11. I dont think it is a day 1 candidate, but neither do I have it anywhere near a townblock. Want to sell me on that?

I don't think Overkill is incompetent, as a result he sorts himself out going forward. I don't want to get deeper into it than that. I think he's very capable of this play as scum but in the event he is, then he's digging a hole that will be tough to get out of later if town finds each other.

If Overkill is scum either A.) This hasn't happened yet or B.) His noose is tightening. I'm willing to give the benefit of the doubt since he isn't trying to disrupt townreads as of yet.

[RCEnigma]

@Mod: I don't want to be RCengine anymore

haha whoops. fixing it now

[RCEnigma]

Don't make me make you lynchable.

[RCEnigma]

He must be super town already.

[RCEnigma]

I will say if there's a deep wolf in that town block it's probably Almost but I wouldn't be worried about it yet.









IM WATCHING YOU

[RCEnigma]

Is this lynchable range yet?

[RCEnigma]

I'll give the sub a chance I guess.

[RCEnigma]

This is a townie looking wagon that I will gladly hammer.

[RCEnigma]

Volxen has slight scum equity but I will attack anyone that pushes his Lynch today. Fisticuffs.

[RCEnigma]

Roster, Vedith, dt are all meh slots and demon is obvscum.

How could I possibly be a meh slot when I didn't even post? IDK, feels a bit like trying to embellish your scumhunting.

Well what would you have called it?

[RCEnigma]

I get the pocketing paranoia, but think we just analyze alike. This list near mimics mine, including on players I hadnt commented on as much (Almost). I think the day we start to read different is the day I will suspect you. On which note, the major difference in our reads is 0verki11. I dont think it is a day 1 candidate, but neither do I have it anywhere near a townblock. Want to sell me on that?

I've read some of teacher's posts in other games before which makes me question this, but I've been getting this vibe that he is so overly focused on meta-stuff that it's distracting from scumhunting. Don't like it.

If there's anyone I'm confident in being able to read by end of day it's teacher, and vice versa. But what if we're the scum team......?


*Xfiles intensifies*

[RCEnigma]

To add to that I came in with the same meta mindset to counter Teachers. The game was and is kind of stagnant. At that point the only discussion point was Overkills n0 red check claim, why? It's beyond me I don't have the answers. So I have to develop a read on him somehow and don't mind him doing the same in respect to my slot.

Pagely reminder that A50 could be scum or he could not be, just throwing that out there.

[RCEnigma]

Worm curtain lol

[RCEnigma]

....there's scum in my town block....I can feel it.

[RCEnigma]

3- REC voting Vedith is kinds annoying. You know it ain't gonna happen today with this players list. Get off the vanity wagon and vote one of the two main candidates, or find a third candidate who can be lynched today and give a good case on why they're worthy of the lynch

I'm purposely not on the wagon, there aren't enough votes and I'll leave it at that. Demons wagon only built when I started it, DT defending demon and moving into a townread on his replace in is ehhh annoying. I won't say fishy yet. I don't think Rabbi's replace in was all too townie but I'm obliged to give him a fighting chance.

I fully intend to vote rabbi today and I'm hesitant to mount a case against both demon and lich. I kind of think he's flustered townie.

[RCEnigma]

....there's scum in my town block....I can feel it.

Why are you getting minor scum vibes from me? Because of the question I asked of Creature? I thought it was a fair question.

It may be activity related, or a change in playstyle which is fair my style has shifted since my initial games. It just isn't the same town!Volxen I recognize from newbies. So not necessarily a read based on motivations but more on meta. I don't know how you play as scum admittedly.

[RCEnigma]

To expand on 481

There are a fair amount of slots inside and outside of the block I proposed that are either echoing that listor agreeing with it. The only opposition to it was Teacher picking at the overkill read but it wasn't a slot he was voting or pressuring for what it's worth.

I just feel given the players I put in that town block that scum can't afford to spew all of them if they are town. It's borderline gamethrowing, that grouping would roflstomp the scumteam.

So since there is no effort to break that town block up it makes sense to me that there would be a deep wolf within that grouping.

Disclaimer* I don't want to disturb that block for today and will continue to treat my townreads as I've claimed them. But I don't want to be townspewed just to die in the night and not have that out there beforehand.

[RCEnigma]

UNVOTE: my beautiful wagon q.q

[RCEnigma]

-When the recipient of the wagon is V/LA and there's no real reason to lynch them.

I won't say there is no reason to Lynch them but a wagon on a V/la is counterintuitive and a poor use of time. It's always something you can come back to.

[RCEnigma]

RCE I'll reevaluate but seems consensus town and he's a fairly easy read

What is that's prompting the need to re evaluate now? What was your initial evaluation?

If you could explain your roster vote as well and why specifically you picked him out of your pool of 5-6 slots that were vote worthy. 3 you said you read fairly well, what are your impressions on those 3 slots?

[RCEnigma]

All this bold is probably important.

[RCEnigma]

votes 0verk1ll for this post? why not vote him when he was saying weird shit like "just kill lich i am cop". The logic lich used to scum read me applies more to 0verk1ll. I think lich was just self conscious of voting 0verk1ll before. I think he was low key scared that 0verk1ll was a real cop taht had scan on him and was afraid to vote him until he voted someone else (me) once

This logic only works if you think worm is also scum.

[RCEnigma]

If worm is town then why would Scum!Lich ever be worried about overkill, who claimed a red check on someone Lich knows isn't scum?

[RCEnigma]

So then you don't think Lich was afraid overkill was going to scan him. So why is his vote on overkill scummy then?

[RCEnigma]

Because it's literally the reason you gave for it being a scummy vote.

[RCEnigma]

What do you think of roster?

[RCEnigma]

Because it's literally the reason you gave for it being a scummy vote.

read the whole thing. that is 1 part of many other scum points he has against him. and i want your detailed thought on all of the points i've made.

Yeah I'm not doing that, I've read it and I'll keep it in mind.

If the theory he thinks overkill is cop doesn't hold up. Why do you think he decided you were the scum pushing him and not overkill?

[RCEnigma]

It's the only part I was really interested in. If you don't have an answer for it you don't have an answer for it.

[RCEnigma]

rce, who are you going to vote?

Scum, probably. Why?

[RCEnigma]

RCE I'll reevaluate but seems consensus town and he's a fairly easy read

What is that's prompting the need to re evaluate now? What was your initial evaluation?

If you could explain your roster vote as well and why specifically you picked him out of your pool of 5-6 slots that were vote worthy. 3 you said you read fairly well, what are your impressions on those 3 slots?

[RCEnigma]

So since there is no effort to break that town block up it makes sense to me that there would be a deep wolf within that grouping.

But see 454 and 540. I think there is an effort to break it up somewhat. Nobody pushed either player for their reasoning behind the reads, and I had asked already.

Possibly. I think I'm having trouble at the moment since the game has started to revolve around slots I'm not necessarily interacting with so it's hard for me to judge. I will have to clear my head and re evaluate at some point.

[RCEnigma]

which slots are you feeling the games revolving around and you're not super engaged with/interested in?

I know this isnt to me, but the last one was, and RCE captured my own feelings pretty well.

I feel like the game RN is centering on 0verki11, Litch, and DT - none of whom I have strong vibes on and so none of whom I can make much of the interactions.....

Overkill is to a lesser extent but the two way tunnel isn't something I really care about when both sides are scum reading each other for the same things they themselves are doing. Then in DT's case can't truly defend a singular point in his case with supporting logic. So they are emotional reads imo and that's fine but not what I want to focus on.

Pignash's wagon I'm again not interested in since it doesn't generate any discussion, if deadline was around the corner sure but w/e.

I've requoted the questions I had for you rabbi if you wouldn't mind responding to them.

[RCEnigma]

No thank you. Think I'm back to my original place VOTE: Rabbi

[RCEnigma]

I think the way he held onto the notion that overkill was cop and Vedith was faking a watcher check for as long as he did was townie as silly as it was.

His switch onto Overkill when his checks changed seemed innocent. Seems like a newb town Aha moment. I don't know how much experience he actually has just calling it as I see it.

Regurgitating my town block made me feel warm and fuzzy.

I didn't really lean that way originally but Teacher unknowingly swayed me. Teacher called Lich probtown pretty early and I was kind of wondering why but decided not to bring it up. I'd have to go back to find the string of posts Lich made soon after that but I could kind of see it. I don't recall why at the time.

[RCEnigma]

I am disappointed in a lot of my town block for jumping on the pig wagon over the weekend.

[RCEnigma]

I said never Lynch Volxen today, but he's probably scum too.

[RCEnigma]

I like the worms heart, it's wrong but in a good way.

[RCEnigma]

RCE trying to shade my case as if mine is as remotely empty as Lich's is is kind of funny

They are both bad. If you think I'm shading you both so be it.

[RCEnigma]

And that information is?

[RCEnigma]

I'm the only vote on you and it doesn't have anything to do with a scumslip. Vague claims don't do much to sway me either.

[RCEnigma]

Question avoidance, entrance was very minimalistic. Besides the short interaction with Vedith which resulted in quick confrontation (which you then shied away from) most of your iso revolves around TL without really reaching a conclusion on how your prodding him has influenced a read either way. I think Roster was a lowhanging fruit that's fringe town independent of Pigs alignment and pushing him given the content already available is lazy at best.

Upon repping in there was a shift in focus sparked by A50 and it's left a sour taste in my mouth since then.
.if your information is only relevant after flipping then why would you be a bad candidate for a Lynch?

[RCEnigma]

So what's the point of starting a wagon on someone who is not even here to respond to the wagon against him? And if you really are wanting to start a wagon against him, why wait for Vedith to vote for him before placing your own vote?

This site's meta sucks in more than one way of late. First: Players lack the ability to

comprehend

what they read.

I said I didn't want to be on a vanity wagon. I didn't want to be voting anyone alone. I needed a serious wagon. Got it yet?

Second: The misconception that VLA players are untouchable.

You CAN vote a player who is lurking or even declared VLA. You just shouldn't LYNCH them before they claim. It is becoming a fad for scum to get away with prod dodging and declaring VLA for whatever reason (be it legit or fake) because people go like "they're not here, so let's lynch someone who is posting". Those who ARE posting will be sorted out. Thise who are not are avoiding the spotlight, and AGAIN: I don't care whether this particular VLA is legit. I can't tell. But then if we give immunity to everyone who doesn't post we should all be signing up to games and then declaring VLA if we receive a red role PM and cruise to endgame with that.

My issue is that nothing develops from this particular wagon in this particular game.

The slot is low activity to begin with, that's fine if you want to pursue lurkers. And I have no issue with it being the Lynch at the end of the day. However we are 6 days from deadline and all we've gotten from it is a pile of players voting to have a wagon mostly for the sake of it and a pile of players that think a vla wagon is bad.

Not much in the way of AI information regarding the wagon. The bulk of the content being generated is outside of the wagon and it's just serving as a centerpiece or a background even without much attention going to it. I don't like that.

Lynching lurkers is fine but don't use it as an excuse not to scumhunt.

[RCEnigma]

I didn't want to Lynch Volxen originally mostly for memes and his propensity to roll PR. However I feel he is an easy town read regardless of role and may be a factor in why he's largely absent from this game in particular while keeping up elsewhere. Though I do acknowledge he's also moderating I believe.

[RCEnigma]

RCE: First, it was just Vedith, me & teacher that voted pignash. teacher has since removed his vote and is now voting roster (I think).

Second: What exactly do you expect to get form any given wagon?

I got not one, but TWO things out of it (three if you count Vedith easily convinced to vote there, thus hinting they're not scum together). teacher voting and then leaving is inexplicable to me, but I have him down as town so I just don't understand the move and I won't pressure him about it. The most important thing is Rabbi coming out with this "I have info pignash is town". That bit doesn't go hand in hand with him placing pignash in his "to sort later" pile in 540. I mean, they're not masons -for instance- because if they were he would know that since the start. But it could be a fay action (say pignash is a friendly neighbor with the Day modifier, or Rabbi a Day Cop) or something like that. I am stating these though because I find them most unlikely too. pignash FN targeting Rabbi specifically is kind of a silly idea, and Rabbi opting to investigate pignash over -say- Worm is sillier.

So, I'm now trying to figure out what "info" Rabbi could have that he won't share until he flips that makes him think pignash is town, because unless he literally has "pignash is town" in his role PM I fail to see it, and THAT came as a direct result of the pignash wagon.

I assumed he was coming out with a n0 check. If it was a daycheck there are 3-4 better checks and that's not even opinion. But that information coming out doesn't make pignash's wagon good.

[RCEnigma]

I don't have a case for roster as town, he was just the first voice I recall rebuking the pignash's wagon that I recall. Which was in line with my thinking at the time.

[RCEnigma]

EBWOP

Can someone take the time to do an actual lich case? I just dont see it. And I dont want the one sentence tunnels, but tell me a specific post that shows scum motivation? All I remember is the early claim shenanigans and it picking up steam way to easy. I think Lich's response to the claims was organic, if silly, and I can see his own mentality thoughout.

I am feeling very uninspired by this gamestate. After re-ISOing, I am still happy with my townblock, but nullreading way too many slots for a pagecount in the 20s. I am off rabbi and pignash for the time being, so willing to pressure another slot I havent felt much on. VOTE: Roster

this is the second? or third? person saying they don't understand lich vote.

i've learned from a good town player that people who come into the thread and ask why the top wagon is being wagoned means scums tmi'ing a town top wagon and hoping to make themselves look townier once the town wagoned player flips.

VOTE: teacher

I think this is more reliable for slots that rep in the but I like the read.

[RCEnigma]

VOTE: Volxen feel like I've spent most of this day soft defending all my null slots lol.

[RCEnigma]

Hmm, the Mason claim doesn't confirm rabbi as town, it only confirms that he and pignash's are the same alignment.

[RCEnigma]

Not super town, most of my null circle is looking like town and I don't want to break my town block already. I have a good idea on who the scum in my block is but don't want to be hasty.

Also thought Volxens low activity was to dodge slots that can read him considering his activity elsewhere on site.

Can't speak for everyone else.

[RCEnigma]

Harsh dude.

[RCEnigma]

I would like to thank myself, without me I wouldn't be where I am today. Secondly I would like to thank everyone thanking me for this amazing win, you're all so very welcome.

Sorry to the scumteam the setup was a tough break but I thought you guys played pretty well. Without massclaim the puppeteer role gets a lot stronger.

[RCEnigma]

And the alt slip was super unfortunate.

[RCEnigma]

Night 1 was supposed to be Volxen but something about him being replaced and not added to the PT. So night 1 had no one in the pt except Temporal.